Has anybody had a look at Zeitgeist 2 yet?

It's actual title is: "Zeitgeist 2 - Addendum", and can be easily watched at http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7065205277695921912

It may have also been titled something like: Zeitgiest 2 - the folly of capatilism, or, Zeitgeist 2 - the end of religion.

Whatever the title, it's an enjoyable outlook; the only thing that I need to have real faith in is humankind. And I do. I always have had.

What substantiates the work of the devil? Look at who created the concept of "the devil" and what their intentions are.

Snakeoil has always provided profits for the select few.

I hope that you find it spiritual.i

The only way to keep the geeks from attacking your spirituality is to keep out of debt (or to ensure that your debt is far lower than the mases).
You will always be a subject of contol if you let yourself be. You are better than that.

Hi amadd,

I had a look, it is a 2 hour clip !!!!!!!!!!
Would you be able to summerise this yourself please ??

Keeping out of debt is a good thing, a spiritual thing.
mankind is good, overall.

To judge whether things are "good" or "evil", I look at the result, then to the fruit it produces more long term. Amongst other things.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Oct 9^th, 2008 at 10:28pm:

Hi amadd, mankind is good, overall.

No way.

overall, mankind is very good.

this morning while walking to work, I was not robbed.
I did not even expect to be !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sprintcyclist wrote on Oct 9^th, 2008 at 10:28pm:

Hi amadd, I had a look, it is a 2 hour clip !!!!!!!!!! Would you be able to summerise this yourself please ?? Keeping out of debt is a good thing, a spiritual thing. mankind is good, overall. To judge whether things are "good" or "evil", I look at the result, then to the fruit it produces more long term. Amongst other things.

To see my point of view Sprint, you must watch the entire 2 hours.
Tihnk of it this way: You've expended a multitude of hours studying the Christian way with no other realistic path  for humanity except for war, division.. and derision.
If you were to accept that the athiests of this world are pining even more than you for a workable future for all, then would it ever supercede your religion?
I doubt it. Because religion controls people with their rhetoric of demons and devils. It's a total falsehood.

The real truth is that honest work will provide honest results.
The banking system has been a sham from the start.
Money is a human concept, as is religion.
Choose to relinqiish your spiritual self or not.
We all rely on it, and that's why I get so pissed off. We all rely on each other.

thanks for your thoughts

I often find athiests and myself think quite alike.
Trying not to be pendantic, but there is a WORLD of difference between spiritual and religious.
Most athiests and myself hope for the same thing here.

Yes, religion does want to control people.
the world is a MUCH better place for banks. But they are not compulsory.

You can get in huge trouble from the police for keeping cash over a certain amount at home.

That's OK Sprint..but it's my subject isn't it?
And it's quite obvious that you haven't taken the the time to even glance at what my subject is.
So why do you even bother to have a thread of your own?

You never put forward that poem when I posted a subject on spirituality and atheism Sprint.
Why should I believe you now? You're full of Shite.

amadd - I had a listen to a 3 minute version.

zeitgeist means "time spirit". The spirit of the times.
All problems are people problems

says banks, jails , police, advertising will be gone because they are irrelevant.

how/why do we reach this ?

Sprint, if you are going to be a moderator, then you should take a good hard look at all of your disciple threads.
So please ...just consider..that's all.

easel wrote on Oct 9^th, 2008 at 11:18pm:

You can get in huge trouble from the police for keeping cash over a certain amount at home.

Easel, the hardest currency that we can possess is that of precious metals.

It's always been rellied upon in hard times, and now is no exception.
The question is, are we in an extraordinary time when the reserve interest is no longer sustainable?

It's not for us (the plebs) to be able to read and predict patterns...otherwise we would not be the slaves.
For a successful capitalism...there must always be victims.
This is apparrent throughout histiry.

The question is; how do we take back ciontrol?

Amadd wrote on Oct 10^th, 2008 at 1:00am:

easel wrote on Oct 9th, 2008 at 11:18pm: You can get in huge trouble from the police for keeping cash over a certain amount at home. Easel, the hardest currency that we can possess is that of precious metals. It's always been rellied upon in hard times, and now is no exception. The question is, are we in an extraordinary time when the reserve interest is no longer sustainable? It's not for us (the plebs) to be able to read and predict patterns...otherwise we would not be the slaves. For a successful capitalism...there must always be victims. This is apparrent throughout histiry. The question is; how do we take back ciontrol?

Yes a chunk of iron ore to the temple is no picnic..a $50 note just doesnt cut it by comparison.

Im going to take a look at your link when I have a spare hour or so  maddy..dont be mean to me ok..Im a bit fragile today   :-/?

To see my point of view Sprint, you must watch the entire 2 hours.

;D

You can get in huge trouble from the police for keeping cash over a certain amount at home.

Can you give an example of someone who has, who isn;t a drug dealer?

freediver wrote on Oct 10^th, 2008 at 11:11am:

To see my point of view Sprint, you must watch the entire 2 hours. ;D You can get in huge trouble from the police for keeping cash over a certain amount at home. Can you give an example of someone who has, who isn;t a drug dealer?

may i interject FD...ok thanks..

Little old ladies/pensioner..who do not trust banks keep cash at home..

Mostly those who do not trust banks. Banks are the biggest theives of all.

I have to agree..I would rather a theif take my stash than a bank.

Not hijacking amadd ok?

Ill start another thread.

No I meant someone who had gotten in huge trouble from the police for it.

Or, you could just give an example of someone who hides a lof of cash at home. I'd be happy with their address, where they hide it, and what time of the day they aren't at home.

freediver wrote on Oct 10^th, 2008 at 11:23am:

No I meant someone who had gotten in huge trouble from the police for it. Or, you could just give an example of someone who hides a lof of cash at home. I'd be happy with their address, where they hide it, and what time of the day they aren't at home.

ha ha.. do know of pple who keep cash at home. An old couple and one older man..Im sure they are not about to let me know the secret spot ( X marks the spot)?


put up  thread in Chat.  cont there?

I doubt if it would do any good to stash your money at home. It would only make matters worse by taking money out of circulataion.

Oh ..and I'll take out one or two disrespectful statements. I do get a bit too fired up when I watch those types of shows.

Amadd wrote on Oct 10^th, 2008 at 11:39am:

I doubt if it would do any good to stash your money at home. It would only make matters worse by taking money out of circulataion. Oh ..and I'll take out one or two disrespectful statements. I do get a bit too fired up when I watch those types of shows.

You do post with passion and a bit of fire Amadd..but that makes for good reading most times....   ;)

Quote:

Im going to take a look at your link when I have a spare hour or so  maddy..dont be mean to me ok..Im a bit fragile today

It's OK Oceanz, I won't give you a hard time. I hope that you're feeling better today. You deserve to feel great every day.

OK. I was wondering if anybody had watched the second "Zeitgeist" movie/doco. and was looking for thoughts and opinions. If nobody has watched it, or doesn't intend to, then that's fine. I haven't even got a problem with threads moving on to different subjects, but I would've liked to at least start off by discussing the movie.

I can't really sum it up in 20 words or less, but I'll try to give an impartial view of it.
To be critical, I'd say that it's a bit boring, a bit too idealogical, nothing that I haven't seen before, there's quite a bit of movie making involved, and I don't know much about the people who provide their POV's or (so-called) facts.


On the flip side: Considering that the movie has been in the making since before the U.S. sub-prime crsis, some may call it prophetic. But of course there's nothing at all prophetic about it, it's merely realistic. We were talking about the very same things on Cracker since before the sub-prime crisis.
The movie, however, takes our discussions a step further into what one might call "planned obsolescence".

We've all heard the doomsayers, the communists, etc. talking about the folly of capitalism.
I've heard economists on the radio saying things like: "Oh..this may have exposed a fatal flaw in capitalism."  
And what is that fatal flaw? The fatal flaw is that capitalism is merely a pyramid scheme which always requires non-existent money and poor people to be created in order to survive. That may be OK for a period, however, when we reach what we may have reached now, ie: Countries cannot even afford to pay the interest on their foreign debts, the fatal flaws are exposed.
The non-existent money that the U.S. has pumped into their banking system will provide  9 x that amount for their economy. When you consider the 500+ banking companies in the U.S., the potential for loan approvals is staggering.
So the question is, can this "pyramid scheme" keep going regardless of not even being able to keep up with foreign debt interest payments? Have we reached saturation point for capitalism?

The show then goes on to talk about things like the "venus project". It's very idealogical, but who knows? If we reach for the stars, we may be at least make it to the moon.
Religious people will no doubt find a lot of the movie to be confronting, however, it's only putting on the screen that of which a lot of people (probably the majority) already think; realise religion for what it is, take the good stuff from it, and then move on to beyond the eras of their writings.
The movie's POV has a dislike for the "institutions" of religion, not religious followers or their perception of what God may be.
It would seem pretty silly to say, "that person is religious, or an atheist, so nothing they have to say is worthwhile". But some people do.



So, if you happen to watch the show sometime (maybe a rainy Sunday arvo when all that's on TV is an old gladiator movie), I'd like to hear some comments.

I like capitalsm, tempered with a social conscience.
ie, the successful entrepreneurs should be rewarded, at the same time, the less fortunate should be protected.
The sub-prime scene and ensuing problems has been on the cards for about 4 years.
US debt was just too big.
The world economy/manufacturing/industry runs on consumer demand.
If that demand changes, so will the world economy/manufacturing.
as long as the capitalist society is allowed to adapt, it will be for the best.

most people have a well foounded dislike for "institutions of religion."
Generally they are quite unspiritual.

Take care

Not saying I dislike capitalism, but in the most pure sense of the word, capitalism is a system set up for failure from the word go.

It is impossible for capitalism to succeed.

The problem is people who study economics are generally robots and useless at being abstract. I have close family with economics degrees. They are unable to make anything better.

Quote:

I like capitalsm, tempered with a social conscience.

Well I'm not sure if that's an oxymoron, but it's got to be pretty close to being one.
What if, to survive, capitalism will always require poor people, starving people, suffering, wars and slavery? What if there is absolutely no way out of this for capitalism to flourish? Would it still be to your liking?

I agree that those who produce value to society should be rewarded. But the sad fact is that many people of talent become victims of capitalism and don't get to provide their true value to society.
Even in the capitalistic boom of the past 10 years, there hasn't been much of an impact on the world issues that most of us would regard as being the most important.
We have all of the capabilities to tackle these issues, but it's not happening very well at all. I realize that idealisms such as the venus project are a bit "airy fairy", but then again, so is the belief that simply praying to God will cause change - not that I'm against people praying to God if it floats their boat.


Quote:

It is impossible for capitalism to succeed.

For the general perception of the word "success", I agree.
But I suppose it depends on what your idea of "success" is.
I'd tack on the end of that quote: ..without enslaving people with debt.

yes, you could say capitalism is an unachievable/self defeating goal.
And capitalism with a social conscience is an oxymoron.