Are we equal ?
Are we of the same worth ?
Are we all "born equal" ?

Define equal.

" as great as another, of the same or similar quantity, degree, value, ability, etc...."   macquarie pocket dictionary

No we're not equal, although we should be. Equality is based on your education, your moral values, your race or religion, your appearance, your wallet etc.

Nar.  One could argue all are lives are of equal value, but of equal ability is a bit of a joke really innit?

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 18^th, 2011 at 12:21am:

Are we equal ? Are we of the same worth ? Are we all "born equal" ?

What do YOU personally think Sprint? Are we all equal?

Men and women for instance? Are they equal?

Whites vs black? Are they equal?

Christians vs non Christians? Are they equal?

After you finish telling us what YOU think .. could you then let us know what the Holy Bible thinks/says?

No people are not all equal. Give 10 people the same resource and you will get 10 different levels of utilisation of that resource.

Could you also let us know what the term equality means to you Sprint?

Do you think it is the same as equity? If not .. how is it different?

Are we all equal?

No.

It would be bluddy great though, if women gained equity above equality.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 18^th, 2011 at 12:21am:

Are we equal ? Are we of the same worth ? Are we all "born equal" ?

IMO,

Our circumstances, are never really within our control.

Certainly not the circumstances we are born into.

Our choices, always are - within our control.

In this life, we can make good choices, and/or, we can make poor choices.

The choices we make, are ours alone, imo.



+++

"It is our choices that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities."
Professor Dumbledore to Harry.
Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets - J K Rowling

...or our circumstances, imo.

Yadda wrote on Mar 18^th, 2011 at 3:35pm:

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 18th, 2011 at 12:21am: Are we equal ? Are we of the same worth ? Are we all "born equal" ? IMO, Our circumstances, are never really within our control. Certainly not the circumstances we are born into.

e.g.
I was living in a children's home, when i started school.

And i can still remember those 'circumstances' quite vividly.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 18^th, 2011 at 8:23am:

" as great as another, of the same or similar quantity, degree, value, ability, etc...."   macquarie pocket dictionary

macquarie pocket dictionary ;D

as great as another, of the same or similar quantity, degree, value, ability... at what?

we are all equals yes

brothers and sister beings with freewill yes

and eminating from the same creator source

this is divine and sacred construct in vibration/frequency

harmonics

namaste

-:)

This question invokes Orwell...

In an ideal world, we would all be equal - but in practice, some of us are more equal than others!

We are all different.

Some are more intelligent than others.

Some are stronger than others. Some are physically strong, while others are emotionally or mentally strong.

Some might not be strong or very intelligent but have great organisational skills. They might have the ability to help the strongest and most intelligent to work together to achieve much more than they would as individuals. Some are great leaders, some have an eye for detail, some are good at technical skills, some are good with people skills, some are healers and some have the innate ability to make us laugh, to produce great literature, to move us with hauntingly beautiful music or to inspire us with their art.  

There may be many fruits in the forest, but are apples and pears  equal? The question is just as relevant.

It's a good thing that we're not all the same. We all have individual talents, and we should be given the opportunity to develop these talents as much as possible...........equally.  (muso 2011)

There are simply two aspects to this question:

1) We are equal.

2) We have different levels of advancement.

::)

There are simply two aspects to this question:

1) We are equal. No matter bum or Jesus. The only diff is a bum's prayers will never be answered because he doesn't believe, or have the faculites, etc. (This is GOD's greatest tragedy)

2) We have different levels of advancement. From Mighty God to  - as yet in the mod world - mightless man.

Have I said a more obvious thing in my life?

beloved ones,

i manifest before you once more

in a divine frequency of LIGHT to let you in on something

you may not realize.

i am not guessing dear ones,when i tell you

one is weak,one is tall and strong one is low in moral

and one is beyond reproach..dear ones

we are all equal in the LIGHT and the eyes of the creator

mother father god.

you may be strong,and a figure for all to look upon with awe.

if that one does use his strength and position to inflict pain abuse

theft upon his/her brother sister beings,

things change in the next cycle..that one may be a crippled

being in the next for when this cycle is complete

it is you yourself in a fully conscious state that brings that

judgement upon your next incarnation where your soul does

manifest in a 3rd dimension on the many planets in your

universe and beyond.

this is all complete and perfect in design from the PRIME CREATOR

mother father GOD frequency vibration this is a divine construct.

and is the order of things for your souls' journey experience growth

to know individual perspective and freewill in the lower dimensions.

this is the 3rd dimension and there are many more

above and below

with no exterior or interior

there is no debate in truth upon this thread in reality and truth

we are all equal and experiencing this

the 3rd dimension

in a state of duality..we are multidimensional beings of love and light

with freewill

and so it is

namaste

-:)

muso wrote on Mar 18^th, 2011 at 11:30pm:

We are all different. Some are more intelligent than others. Some are stronger than others. Some are physically strong, while others are emotionally or mentally strong. Some might not be strong or very intelligent but have great organisational skills. They might have the ability to help the strongest and most intelligent to work together to achieve much more than they would as individuals. Some are great leaders, some have an eye for detail, some are good at technical skills, some are good with people skills, some are healers and some have the innate ability to make us laugh, to produce great literature, to move us with hauntingly beautiful music or to inspire us with their art.   There may be many fruits in the forest, but are apples and pears  equal? The question is just as relevant. It's a good thing that we're not all the same. We all have individual talents, and we should be given the opportunity to develop these talents as much as possible...........equally.  (muso 2011)

And then again... Some are psychopathic with a talent for destruction and a murderous lust for power.

yadda - indeed.
Some are born into very good circumstances, they have MANY options, MANY choices.
Many are born into dire situations, those have very few, sometimes no choices available to them.

Often, circumstances do not offer people the probability of  ............. "being an equal"
eg, being born to a crack addicted prostitute, it'ld be a hard road to hoe from the word go.



Yadda wrote on Mar 18^th, 2011 at 3:41pm:

Yadda wrote on Mar 18th, 2011 at 3:35pm: Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 18th, 2011 at 12:21am: Are we equal ? Are we of the same worth ? Are we all "born equal" ? IMO, Our circumstances, are never really within our control. Certainly not the circumstances we are born into. e.g. I was living in a children's home, when i started school. And i can still remember those 'circumstances' quite vividly.

Equitist wrote on Mar 18^th, 2011 at 8:29pm:

This question invokes Orwell... In an ideal world, we would all be equal - but in practice, some of us are more equal than others!

And in practice, though very poor, some peasant in India is blessed by God, and is a very happy man - in his heart.

Yet in the Gulf some oil sheik has $$ billions [which he never earned].
And though the oil sheik regularly commutes to London on his private jet, to indulge his desires for liquor and $2,000 a night whores, the oil sheik himself knows in his heart, that he is not a happy man.

Yes, life is so unfair,       ....whine, whine, whine.




In my experience, wicked people are always miserable, and the wicked invariably always curse others, for their own misfortunes, i.e. the wicked are always cursing others, for the consequences of their own choices.

Our circumstances in life are always beyond our control, e.g. the poor peasant in India, the tsunami victims, and survivors, in Japan, etc.

But if you are still breathing, you have choices in life, we all do.

If you make poor choices, stop whining about the consequences, and change your choices.

How can you improve your choices?

Ask God to heal you.

Proverbs 3:11
My son, despise not the chastening of the LORD; neither be weary of his correction:
12  For whom the LORD loveth he correcteth; even as a father the son in whom he delighteth.

Proverbs 9:6
Forsake the foolish, and live; and go in the way of understanding.
7  He that reproveth a scorner getteth to himself shame: and he that rebuketh a wicked man getteth himself a blot.
8  Reprove not a scorner, lest he hate thee: rebuke a wise man, and he will love thee.
9  Give instruction to a wise man, and he will be yet wiser: teach a just man, and he will increase in learning.
10  The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.




"If one wishes to enslave people, constrain their capacity for independent thought - not their hands;
for the chain of dependence is incomparably stronger that the chain of iron."



Orwell also said...

"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."
George Orwell

The whole issue of "equality" is so highly contingent on definition and caveats as to make the notion of equality a high minded ideal without substance.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 19^th, 2011 at 10:20am:

And then again... Some are psychopathic with a talent for destruction and a murderous lust for power.

Fortunately they are rare, and often the results of an unhappy childhood. Everybody, or almost everybody has potential.  

muso wrote on Mar 19^th, 2011 at 8:38pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 19th, 2011 at 10:20am: And then again... Some are psychopathic with a talent for destruction and a murderous lust for power. Fortunately they are rare, and often the results of an unhappy childhood. Everybody, or almost everybody has potential.

So we're not all equal then? ;)

And potential for what?

Congenital psychiatric disorders are not all that uncommon.

I'm not sure if there is some mistranslation in defining "equal", but to most, equal would mean just as the dictionary has stated.

If all creatures are equal in the eyes of God, then does that mean that a sheep should be payed the same salary as a CEO? Of course it doesn't.
It doesn't even mean that we should stop killing and eating sheep does it? Maybe to some animal liberationalists it means exactly that.

Considering that money is merely a human tool, it really has nothing to do with God's grand plan and should not be confused with the defintion of "equal in God's eyes" as stated in the bible or other religious texts.

Paying somebody, or giving accolades for a particular talent, discipline or skill should be thought of in the human terms, where the worth is predominantly associated with other humans, and not God's grand plan.

If a personal requirement exists to be payed in tangible assets in order to procure self-worth, then I'd have to wonder how much of God's message is actually getting through.

In human terms, it seems ridiculous to imagine that we are all equal in all areas. Otherwise, why would we even bother to vote if we are all the same?

I don't think that we've learnt very well how to embrace our differences and to appreciate the talents of others instead of being envious.
Yes there's a lot of prejudices still in existence, but to allow them to be distorted and used as leverage for personal human gain will not be doing any good for the team as a whole.
The human team is always bigger than the human player and nobody will get to be captain, or even make the team without possessing and working hard on certain skills.
The same goes for anybody, that if they don't make the team that they desire, then it's highly probable that they just aren't good enough.
Work harder or cry to God for your equal rights. Most people appreciate a hard worker.i

If all creatures are equal in the eyes of God, then does that mean that a sheep should be payed the same salary as a CEO? Of course it doesn't.
It doesn't even mean that we should stop killing and eating sheep does it? Maybe to some animal liberationalists it means exactly that.

Considering that money is merely a human tool, it really has nothing to do with God's grand plan and should not be confused with the defintion of "equal in God's eyes" as stated in the bible or other religious texts.

- Amadd

Seems the Mod of Spirituality is MIA again .. sighs.

Never mind ..

Amadd .. I only had to read this far before I realized that you've never read the Bible .. and as such you were posting utter nonsense.

The Bible does NOT say that ALL CREATURES ARE EQUAL! YOU HAVE MADE THAT UP!

Amadd .. if you are going to quote from or paraphrase sections of the Bible .. could you at the VERY least know wtf you are talking about FIRST?

It might be an idea to read it hey. Why? Because this sort of BS gets annoying (after a while) esp for those of us who have.

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 18^th, 2011 at 10:21am:

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 18th, 2011 at 12:21am: Are we equal ? Are we of the same worth ? Are we all "born equal" ? What do YOU personally think Sprint? Are we all equal? Men and women for instance? Are they equal? Whites vs black? Are they equal? Christians vs non Christians? Are they equal? After you finish telling us what YOU think .. could you then let us know what the Holy Bible thinks/says?

bump

lisa
Quote:

...........I only had to read this far before I realized that you've never read the Bible .. and as such you were posting utter nonsense. The Bible does NOT say that ALL CREATURES ARE EQUAL! YOU HAVE MADE THAT UP! Amadd .. if you are going to quote from or paraphrase sections of the Bible .. could you at the VERY least know wtf you are talking about FIRST? It might be an idea to read it hey. Why? Because this sort of BS gets annoying (after a while) esp for those of us who have. .

A fool’s mouth lashes out with pride,
  but the lips of the wise protect them.

Proverbs 14:3

Sprint .. if you're going to bother quoting the Bible .. could you at least make it relevant to the topic? Or is that asking too much of you?

Oh and could you also quote in context?

Many thanks in advance.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 10:29am:

lisa Quote: ...........I only had to read this far before I realized that you've never read the Bible .. and as such you were posting utter nonsense. The Bible does NOT say that ALL CREATURES ARE EQUAL! YOU HAVE MADE THAT UP! Amadd .. if you are going to quote from or paraphrase sections of the Bible .. could you at the VERY least know wtf you are talking about FIRST? It might be an idea to read it hey. Why? Because this sort of BS gets annoying (after a while) esp for those of us who have. . A fool’s mouth lashes out with pride,   but the lips of the wise protect them. Proverbs 14:3

That was very profound Sprintcyclist and even though I'm only an agnostic - I understood exactly what you meant.

STILL AT IT MANTRA?????

YOU'VE NOT LEARNED YET .. have you???

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 10:40am:

Sprint .. if you're going to bother quoting the Bible .. could you at least make it relevant to the topic? Or is that asking too much of you? Oh and could you also quote in context? Many thanks in advance.

bump

Quote:

YOU'VE NOT LEARNED YET .. have you???[/

More threats.

You are a stalker Lisa and an obnoxious one at that. I posted on this thread before you came along and offered your meaningless drivel. Your abuse now is obvious for everyone to see.

Why you haven't been banned from here is beyond understanding.

Are you going to report me to Sprintcyclist now for agreeing with him?

Looks like we're not all equal. ;D

Ahh yess Lisa, you missed an important word there which was "if"
Nowhere did I state that this is written in the bible.
I was merely referring to how far one might take the meaning of "equality".

In the next paragraph, I referred to what religious texts might say about equality, such as:
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus" (Gal. 3:28)


I can't say that I'm surprised that you think you own the definition of God.
i

[color=#0000ff]yadda - indeed.
Some are born into very good circumstances, they have MANY options, MANY choices.
Many are born into dire situations, those have very few, sometimes no choices available to them.

Often, circumstances do not offer people the probability of  ............. "being an equal"
eg, being born to a crack addicted prostitute, it'ld be a hard road to hoe from the word go.[/color]

Very well said, and sometimes the road will not only be hard to from the word go, at times impossible to surmount.

Religion is only a tool for the rich and strong to exploit for their own benefit.

mantra wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 10:59am:

Quote: YOU'VE NOT LEARNED YET .. have you???[/ More threats. You are a stalker Lisa and an obnoxious one at that. I posted on this thread before you came along and offered your meaningless drivel. Your abuse now is obvious for everyone to see. Why you haven't been banned from here is beyond understanding. Are you going to report me to Sprintcyclist now for agreeing with him?

Ive told you over 50 times last week and the week before that to sod off and to stop interrupting my posts which were directed at others.

And you promised FINALLY NOT to do this .. yet again as I predicted .. you are back to the same old troll tricks.

NOW again I will say this to you ONCE MORE ..

STOP FOLLOWING ME INTO TOPICS AND THEN INTERRUPTING MY POSTS DIRECTED AT OTHERS and THEIR POSTS DIRECTED AT ME .. with your childish and passive - aggressive BS!

ENOUGH!

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 1:20pm:

mantra wrote on Mar 20th, 2011 at 10:59am: Quote: YOU'VE NOT LEARNED YET .. have you???[/ More threats. You are a stalker Lisa and an obnoxious one at that. I posted on this thread before you came along and offered your meaningless drivel. Your abuse now is obvious for everyone to see. Why you haven't been banned from here is beyond understanding. Are you going to report me to Sprintcyclist now for agreeing with him? Ive told you over 50 times last week and the week before that to sod off and to stop interrupting my posts which were directed at others. And you promised FINALLY NOT to do this .. yet again as I predicted .. you are back to the same old troll tricks. NOW again I will say this to you ONCE MORE .. STOP FOLLOWING ME INTO TOPICS AND THEN INTERRUPTING MY POSTS DIRECTED AT OTHERS and THEIR POSTS DIRECTED AT ME .. with your childish and passive - aggressive BS! ENOUGH!

You disrupted my response to Sprintcyclist with an inference to report me. Am I not allowed to comment on a post someone else makes?

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 11:10am:

Looks like we're not all equal. ;D

In terms of pig headed stupidity .. some are truly talented and gifted. Unfortunately I am allergic to these types of people.

Here we go again Mantra ..

YOU are STILL FOLLOWING ME INTO TOPICS within a minute of me posting and interrupting my posts to and from others.

AGAIN I WILL SAY THIS ..

STOP!

GET SOME FRIGGING HELP

SOD OFF!

FRACK OFF!

WE went through this last week and the week before that and the week before that.

AND .. eventually YOU PROMISED TO STAY AWAY!

STICK TO YOUR PROMISE!

AND SOD OFF!

Amadd wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 11:10am:

Ahh yess Lisa, you missed an important word there which was "if" Nowhere did I state that this is written in the bible. I was merely referring to how far one might take the meaning of "equality". In the next paragraph, I referred to what religious texts might say about equality, such as: There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus" (Gal. 3:28) I can't say that I'm surprised that you think you own the definition of God.

Let me read back Amadd .. it's a tad hard to do so given all THE Mantra BS online static I need to avoid.

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 1:26pm:

Here we go again Mantra .. YOU are STILL FOLLOWING ME INTO TOPICS within a minute of me posting and interrupting my posts to and from others. AGAIN I WILL SAY THIS .. STOP! GET SOME FRIGGING HELP SOD OFF! FRACK OFF! WE went through this last week and the week before that and the week before that. AND .. eventually YOU PROMISED TO STAY AWAY! STICK TO YOUR PROMISE! AND SOD OFF!

You're the stalker Lisa. You were booted from here because of your bad behaviour. You've registered at a forum that I regularly post at to deliberately disrupt it and you've butted into this thread to cause trouble.

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 8:12am:

If all creatures are equal in the eyes of God, then does that mean that a sheep should be payed the same salary as a CEO? Of course it doesn't. It doesn't even mean that we should stop killing and eating sheep does it? Maybe to some animal liberationalists it means exactly that. Considering that money is merely a human tool, it really has nothing to do with God's grand plan and should not be confused with the defintion of "equal in God's eyes" as stated in the bible or other religious texts. - Amadd Seems the Mod of Spirituality is MIA again .. sighs. Never mind .. Amadd .. I only had to read this far before I realized that you've never read the Bible .. and as such you were posting utter nonsense. The Bible does NOT say that ALL CREATURES ARE EQUAL! YOU HAVE MADE THAT UP! Amadd .. if you are going to quote from or paraphrase sections of the Bible .. could you at the VERY least know wtf you are talking about FIRST? It might be an idea to read it hey. Why? Because this sort of BS gets annoying (after a while) esp for those of us who have.

Yeah .. as I thought ... I was correct.

YOU used the word IF as though it were a given .. and you did so by proceeding to use it within the context of developing an argument which had no biblical basis at all.

Amadd .. I don't OWN Biblical definitions .. just because I know the Bible very well. It means I know wtf I am talking about though.

Mantra SOD OFF!

STOP FOLLOWING ME INTO TOPICS within a minute of me posting and interrupting my posts to and from others.

AGAIN I WILL SAY THIS ..

STOP!

GET SOME FRIGGING HELP

SOD OFF!

FRACK OFF!

WE went through this last week and the week before that and the week before that.

AND .. eventually YOU PROMISED TO STAY AWAY!

STICK TO YOUR PROMISE!

AND SOD OFF!

GO AWAY! I am posting TO OTHERS! I'M NOT INTERESTED IN ANYTHING YOU HAVE TO SAY .. AT ALL!

Now Amadd .. let me read ALL of your last post .. as I said it's a tad hard given all of Mantra's trolling.

Ahh yess Lisa, you missed an important word there which was "if"
Nowhere did I state that this is written in the bible.
I was merely referring to how far one might take the meaning of "equality".

In the next paragraph, I referred to what religious texts might say about equality, such as:
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus" (Gal. 3:28)


I can't say that I'm surprised that you think you own the definition of God.

- Amadd

The religious text you are referring to IS the Bible. And Amadd .. read your own extracts from it .. notice how they have nothing at all to do with the idea of ALL CREATURES BEING EQUAL BEFORE GOD (which is your original assertion)?

In fact .. the sections you have NOW quoted from the Bible .. refer to human beings only. Ya dig?

If you care to read the Bible .. you will see that human beings have a special place above animals in God's eyes.

That is how God sees it. That is what His Word states.

The fact that I know/have read the Bible doesn't mean I own the definition of God either. As I said .. it means I know what I am talking about.

Quote:

you will see that human beings have a special place above animals in God's eyes.

Yet animals can live quite easily without humans but humans would find it very hard to live without animals.
We eat them.
Even those that don't eat them use animal products like cheese, the only people not reliant on animals are vegans, and many of them use animals to plough their fields. I think your fictional god buggered up.

skippy. wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 1:51pm:

Quote: you will see that human beings have a special place above animals in God's eyes. Yet animals can live quite easily without humans but humans would find it very hard to live without animals. We eat them. Even those that don't eat them use animal products like cheese, the only people not reliant on animals are vegans, and many of them use animals to plough their fields. I think your fictional god buggered up.

NO! NO! NO!! The Bible shows that God's original intention for creation was VERY different to what you and I see today.

Even so .. man/woman was created by God to hold a place ABOVE animals and plants.

And it wasn't God who fracked up at all .. it was HUMANS who fracked up. Sin (ie humans CHOOSING to sin) unfortunately interrupted the situation and introduced all sorts of glitches/issues.

NB I've had to summarize a lot here ok?

Tip: READ THE BIBLE for a more detailed account.

Quote:

NB I've had to summarise a lot here ok?

And made no sense whatsoever in doing so.
I hate to tell you this, but humans are just animals, evolved from apes.

Fine .. it's just that God and the Holy Bible beg to differ with your opinion.

Re making sense etc  .. read the Bible for a more detailed account.

You can google the Bible now .. here .. read about when God made animals and humans. NB the context, timing of when and why God made humans .. all for yourself.

http://niv.scripturetext.com/genesis/1-1.htm

http://niv.scripturetext.com/genesis/2.htm

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 2:16pm:

Fine .. it's just that God and the Holy Bible beg to differ with your opinion. Re making sense etc  .. read the Bible for a more detailed account. You can google the Bible now .. here .. read about when God made animals and humans. NB the context, timing of when and why God made humans .. all for yourself. http://niv.scripturetext.com/genesis/1-1.htm http://niv.scripturetext.com/genesis/2.htm

Lisa, I don't believe in fairies in the sky sweet thing, I believe in reality, you should try it some time.
I hate to tell you this, as you seem like a sucker, but the bible is all fairy tales and bullsh it.

I knew you were gonna say something like that Skippy.

Sweet thing eh lol :P

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 2:33pm:

I knew you were gonna say something like that Skippy. Sweet thing eh lol :P

Well I dont want to make you jealous but I've just called Bridonta sweet thing as well,but, some people say I'm condescending. :-/

mantra - hahhahah - some agnostics have been the more spiritual people I have met.
Likewise, some of the "welleducated religious people" would not know anything spiritual if it hit them in the face.
they were not "taught" it at sunday school, so they don't know it.

ie, that quote on a fools mouth, you understood easily.
Who would not ??





mantra wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 10:48am:

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 20th, 2011 at 10:29am: lisa Quote: ...........I only had to read this far before I realized that you've never read the Bible .. and as such you were posting utter nonsense. The Bible does NOT say that ALL CREATURES ARE EQUAL! YOU HAVE MADE THAT UP! Amadd .. if you are going to quote from or paraphrase sections of the Bible .. could you at the VERY least know wtf you are talking about FIRST? It might be an idea to read it hey. Why? Because this sort of BS gets annoying (after a while) esp for those of us who have. . A fool’s mouth lashes out with pride,   but the lips of the wise protect them. Proverbs 14:3 That was very profound Sprintcyclist and even though I'm only an agnostic - I understood exactly what you meant.

here are some tougher quotes for you mantra.
They are from when Jesus was railing against the pharisees.
When a spiritual man set his face against the aristoracy of "educated religious leaders" who were arrogant and excluded people from a spiritual life.


Quote:

“Woe to you Pharisees, because you give God a tenth of your mint, rue and all other kinds of garden herbs, but you neglect justice and the love of God. You should have practiced the latter without leaving the former undone.

luke 11:42



Quote:

Jesus replied, “And you experts in the law, woe to you, because you load people down with burdens they can hardly carry, and you yourselves will not lift one finger to help them.

luke 11:46


Quote:

52 “Woe to you experts in the law, because you have taken away the key to knowledge. You yourselves have not entered, and you have hindered those who were entering.”

luke 11:52

Quote:

The religious text you are referring to IS the Bible.

How can I be quoting or paraphrasing the bible with something that is not even there?

I thought I just threw up a few definitions of what "in God's eyes" might mean to different people, eg: animal liberationists.
I also separated them from what religious texts might say about equality.


Quote:

That is how God sees it. That is what His Word states.

Ok, so there can be no other interpretation of God other than what is written in the bible?


Quote:

The fact that I know/have read the Bible doesn't mean I own the definition of God either. As I said .. it means I know what I am talking about.

Do you mean that the bible owns God?

muso wrote on Mar 18^th, 2011 at 11:30pm:

We are all different.

Er... I'm not....

skippy. wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 2:47pm:

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 20th, 2011 at 2:33pm: I knew you were gonna say something like that Skippy. Sweet thing eh lol :P Well I dont want to make you jealous but I've just called Bridonta sweet thing as well,but, some people say I'm condescending. :-/

Ha ha .. IQ is gonna be jealous IF he sees this .. smirks :P

Soren wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 4:21pm:

muso wrote on Mar 18th, 2011 at 11:30pm: We are all different. Er... I'm not....

Ahh  .. well said Soren (as usual)!

Life Of Brian eh lol?

Brian: Please, please, please listen! I've got one or two things to say.
The Crowd: Tell us! Tell us both of them!
Brian: Look, you've got it all wrong! You don't NEED to follow ME, You don't NEED to follow ANYBODY! You've got to think for your selves! You're ALL individuals!
The Crowd: Yes! We're all individuals!
Brian: You're all different!
The Crowd: Yes, we ARE all different!
Man in crowd: I'm not...

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 4:15pm:

here are some tougher quotes for you mantra. They are from when Jesus was railing against the pharisees. When a spiritual man set his face against the aristoracy of "educated religious leaders" who were arrogant and excluded people from a spiritual life.

Those quotes gave me some thought - but they seem to contain fairly basic messages - although I could be wrong in my understanding.  



Quote:

“Woe to you Pharisees, because you give God a tenth of your mint, rue and all other kinds of garden herbs, but you neglect justice and the love of God. You should have practiced the latter without leaving the former undone.

They are ignorant and although they are wealthy enough to pay a tithe and believe this is all they need to enter the Kingdom they remain ignorant of God's righteousness.

Words  are not enough if there is no comprehension. Mercy, compassion and justice have to be shown to our neighbours before any claim can be laid to being God's servant. A tithe is no proof of loving God and is a secondary consideration to being merciful.  


Quote:

Jesus replied, “And you experts in the law, woe to you, because you load people down with burdens they can hardly carry, and you yourselves will not lift one finger to help them.

Don't expect from others what you can't do yourself ie - an expectation that others should carry the burden that you refuse to touch.


Quote:

52 “Woe to you experts in the law, because you have taken away the key to knowledge. You yourselves have not entered, and you have hindered those who were entering.”

The "experts" are misleading those who want to know the truth because they are ignorant themselves. Their false interpretation of the Scriptures is stopping others from learning.

yes behold these beloved ones

all in a state of confusion here wondering if we are all equal

those that know the truth know

that we do not have to convince you of a thing..

if you think we are not equal,and you are better

just keep comforting that if you do so choose,freewill you see?

however

you will know the truth as you will be made to allow for

divine timing...you have no say upon this dear ones,

so

just observe your experience..

i myself and i here saying these things of love and light

unto you may be pleasing unto you at this moment

or you may be offended for you do self loath yourself

or consumed with vanity or fear whichever flavour

this is yours at your invocation and keep comforting this

if this is your desire

there is no other way...yes continue

with forgiveness

namaste

-:)

Quote:

if you think we are not equal,and you are better just keep comforting that if you do so choose,freewill you see?

I've noticed this elitist approach by some who profess to be Christians. Those who shriek the loudest about their faith tend to be the biggest perpetrators in treating those around them like halfwits.

Not very Christian like at all, but the agnostics and atheists have come to expect this patronising behaviour from those who pretend to be devoutly religious.

Few of them practise what they preach.


James Chapter 3.

Show by your good life that your works are done with gentleness born of wisdom.

But if you have bitter envy and selfish ambition in your hearts, do not be boastful and false to the truth.

Such wisdom does not come down from above, but is earthly, unspiritual, devilish.

For where there is envy and selfish ambition, there will also be disorder and wickedness of every kind.

That's pretty good mantra.

Surprising how some simple words spoken 2000 years ago still have such depth and relevance to them.

I see slightly different things on those quotes, but certainly along the same lines as you see it.

yep, some agnostics are much more spiritual than some people who have been "taught" the bible



mantra wrote on Mar 20^th, 2011 at 7:43pm:

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 20th, 2011 at 4:15pm: here are some tougher quotes for you mantra. They are from when Jesus was railing against the pharisees. When a spiritual man set his face against the aristoracy of "educated religious leaders" who were arrogant and excluded people from a spiritual life. Those quotes gave me some thought - but they seem to contain fairly basic messages - although I could be wrong in my understanding.   Quote: “Woe to you Pharisees, because you give God a tenth of your mint, rue and all other kinds of garden herbs, but you neglect justice and the love of God. You should have practiced the latter without leaving the former undone. They are ignorant and although they are wealthy enough to pay a tithe and believe this is all they need to enter the Kingdom they remain ignorant of God's righteousness. Words  are not enough if there is no comprehension. Mercy, compassion and justice have to be shown to our neighbours before any claim can be laid to being God's servant. A tithe is no proof of loving God and is a secondary consideration to being merciful.   [quote]Jesus replied, “And you experts in the law, woe to you, because you load people down with burdens they can hardly carry, and you yourselves will not lift one finger to help them.

Don't expect from others what you can't do yourself ie - an expectation that others should carry the burden that you refuse to touch.


Quote:

52 “Woe to you experts in the law, because you have taken away the key to knowledge. You yourselves have not entered, and you have hindered those who were entering.”

The "experts" are misleading those who want to know the truth because they are ignorant themselves. Their false interpretation of the Scriptures is stopping others from learning. [/quote]

What a load of s.hit.

But don't stop now Sprint .. keep going .. tell us all how the Bible supports your sexist and racist stance. You know .. that stance you're so proud of and which appears in so many of your posts all over this message board.

Then perhaps you may be able to explain to us how your pro sexism and pro racism viewpoint has helped you in your relationships with women and people of other races (on both a professional and personal basis).

i am not religious as you may well know

i do observe that one whom has walked this earth as CHRIST

yes yeshua...long ago..humans can achieve this state

of one-ness..allknowingness and unity consciousness

CHRIST CONSCIOUSNESS

this frequency is within you brother sister beings

all are equal yes

in LOVE and LIGHT

namaste

-:)

God makes no distinction between men [mankind].
i.e.
Even those who refer to themselves, as Jews or Christians, are not above anyone else.




Deuteronomy 1:17
Ye shall not respect persons in judgment; but ye shall hear the small as well as the great; ye shall not be afraid of the face of man; for the judgment is God's: and the cause that is too hard for you, bring it unto me, and I will hear it.

Exodus 12:49
One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you.

Exodus 22:21
Thou shalt neither vex a stranger, nor oppress him...

Exodus 23:9
Also thou shalt not oppress a stranger...

Leviticus 19:33
And if a stranger sojourn with thee in your land, ye shall not vex him.
34  But the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself...



Before God all mankind are equal.

Acts 17:26
And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;
27  That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:


If we are all equal before God, then in what way does God judge, between one man, and another man ?

Acts 10:34
Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:
35  But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.

Romans 2:8
But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
9  Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
10  But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
11  For there is no respect of persons with God.
12  For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;
13  (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
14  For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
15  Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)

It Is The Light

Did you know there are people like Sprintcyclist (the Moderator of this forum) .. who profess to be a Christian (a follower of Christ) and who are pro sexist AND pro racist?

In short .. these "so called" Christians don't believe we are equal at all.

Does this surprise you at all?

I consider such Christians to be fake, hypocritical and liars because they subvert, invert and pervert the Holy Word of God in order to satisfy their extreme right wing political agendas.

Yadda wrote on Mar 21^st, 2011 at 9:47am:

God makes no distinction between men [mankind]. i.e. Even those who refer to themselves, as Jews or Christians, are not above anyone else.

Jeremiah 9:23
Thus saith the LORD, Let not the wise man glory in his wisdom, neither let the mighty man glory in his might, let not the rich man glory in his riches:
24  But let him that glorieth glory in this, that he understandeth and knoweth me, that I am the LORD which exercise lovingkindness, judgment, and righteousness, in the earth: for in these things I delight, saith the LORD.
25  Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will punish all them which are circumcised with the uncircumcised;
26  Egypt, and Judah, and Edom, and the children of Ammon, and Moab, and all that are in the utmost corners, that dwell in the wilderness: for all these nations are uncircumcised, and all the house of Israel are uncircumcised in the heart.


Romans 2:8
But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,


2 Thessalonians 2:7
For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
8  And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9  Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
10  And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
11  And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
12  That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 21^st, 2011 at 9:50am:

It Is The Light Did you know there are people like Sprintcyclist (the Moderator of this forum) .. who profess to be a Christian (a follower of Christ) and who are pro sexist AND pro racist? In short .. these "so called" Christians don't believe we are equal at all. Does this surprise you at all? I consider such Christians to be fake, hypocritical and liars because they subvert, invert and pervert the Holy Word of God in order to satisfy their extreme right wing political agendas.

This is true - but it has very little to do with the ethics of Christianity.
I am not a practising CHristian but I have no ethical or moral objection to the ideals of Jesus Christ - common sense really. I am not sure why the Jews reject Christianity and burn copies of the Gospels in the streets of Israeli cities.

The fact that a person is religious or pretends to be a follower of a particular religion does not really stop them from being racist or violent or immoral.

Hypocrisy is a global art form

Lets me honest - the entire military arm of every nation is based on violence and the threat to use it.

Yadda wrote on Mar 21^st, 2011 at 9:47am:

God makes no distinction between men [mankind]. i.e. Even those who refer to themselves, as Jews or Christians, are not above anyone else. Deuteronomy 1:17 Ye shall not respect persons in judgment; but ye shall hear the small as well as the great; ye shall not be afraid of the face of man; for the judgment is God's: and the cause that is too hard for you, bring it unto me, and I will hear it. Exodus 12:49 One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you. Exodus 22:21 Thou shalt neither vex a stranger, nor oppress him... Exodus 23:9 Also thou shalt not oppress a stranger... Leviticus 19:33 And if a stranger sojourn with thee in your land, ye shall not vex him. 34  But the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself... Before God all mankind are equal. Acts 17:26 And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation; 27  That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us: If we are all equal before God, then in what way does God judge, between one man, and another man ? Acts 10:34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons: 35  But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him. Romans 2:8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, 9  Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile; 10  But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile: 11  For there is no respect of persons with God. 12  For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law; 13  (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified. 14  For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: 15  Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)

Yadda .. thank you for posting all this. You've truly encouraged me in doing so.

It's good for others here to see that the Holy Bible DOES NOT SUPPORT RACISM OR SEXISM AT ALL!

And ANY person (not just Sprintcyclist) who professes to be a Christian would do well to take a step back and reconsider their position in light of what the Bible says before they come onto message boards spreading extreme right wing ideology driven nonsense ..  which clearly contravenes God's Holy Word.

And after they've done that .. they ought to set things right with God by apologising to God for allowing a pathetic man made extreme right wing ideology to rule their mind and heart to the extent where they disobeyed and rebelled against the tenets and core values of the Bible.

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 21^st, 2011 at 10:08am:

Yadda .. thank you for posting all this. You've truly encouraged me in doing so. It's good for others here to see that the Holy Bible DOES NOT SUPPORT RACISM OR SEXISM AT ALL! And ANY person (not just Sprintcyclist) who professes to be a Christian would do well to take a step back and reconsider their position in light of what the Bible says before they come onto message boards spreading extreme right wing ideologies which contravene God's Holy Word. And after they've done that .. they ought to apologise to God for allowing a man made extreme right wing ideology to rule their mind and heart to the extent where they disobeyed and rebelled against the tenets and core values of the Bible.

Foolosophy,

Though you are happy to commend my opinion here, i will opine that you will NOT agree with the TRUTH which i express here.....
[CORRECTION; Sorry Lisa.    I cited the incorrect poster. I imagined that you were 'Foolosophy' .      :o  ]


"Moslem entitlement"
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1300659922/0#0

Quote:

There is no 'Universality' of man, within ISLAM. ...Yet it is non-moslems who are the ones being called, 'racists', or, 'bigots' whenever they have the temerity to challenge this sense of entitlement which moslems embrace and cherish, ...to be the masters of all of mankind. Moslems see no injustice, or moral contradiction in those thoughts. Why so? Because moslems mentally 'embrace' their entitlement, bestowed by Allah, to rule over others.

The fact that a person is religious or pretends to be a follower of a particular religion does not really stop them from being racist or violent or immoral.

Hypocrisy is a global art form.

- Foolosophy

God would agree with you there.

In His Word we find this:


"Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?'

And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'"

- Matthew 7:21-23


Foolosophy .. there are Christians and there are Christians.

They all look real .. but some are fake. The latter subvert, invert and pervert the Word of God. In doing so .. they bring Christianity into disrepute and many people are needlessly turned away by their Godless and non Biblical views.

In the same way they've turned others away .. one day God himself will turn them away.

It's good for us to remember this whenever we are confronted by ANY so called Christian who preaches racism and sexism (which as we've seen above .. the Bible clearly does not support).

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 21^st, 2011 at 10:08am:

Yadda wrote on Mar 21st, 2011 at 9:47am: God makes no distinction between men [mankind]. i.e. Even those who refer to themselves, as Jews or Christians, are not above anyone else. Deuteronomy 1:17 Ye shall not respect persons in judgment; but ye shall hear the small as well as the great; ye shall not be afraid of the face of man; for the judgment is God's: and the cause that is too hard for you, bring it unto me, and I will hear it. Exodus 12:49 One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you. Exodus 22:21 Thou shalt neither vex a stranger, nor oppress him... Exodus 23:9 Also thou shalt not oppress a stranger... Leviticus 19:33 And if a stranger sojourn with thee in your land, ye shall not vex him. 34  But the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself... Before God all mankind are equal. Acts 17:26 And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation; 27  That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us: If we are all equal before God, then in what way does God judge, between one man, and another man ? Acts 10:34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons: 35  But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him. Romans 2:8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, 9  Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile; 10  But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile: 11  For there is no respect of persons with God. 12  For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law; 13  (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified. 14  For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: 15  Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;) Yadda .. thank you for posting all this. You've truly encouraged me in doing so. It's good for others here to see that the Holy Bible DOES NOT SUPPORT RACISM OR SEXISM AT ALL! And ANY person (not just Sprintcyclist) who professes to be a Christian would do well to take a step back and reconsider their position in light of what the Bible says before they come onto message boards spreading extreme right wing ideology driven nonsense ..  which clearly contravenes God's Holy Word. And after they've done that .. they ought to set things right with God by apologising to God for allowing a pathetic man made extreme right wing ideology to rule their mind and heart to the extent where they disobeyed and rebelled against the tenets and core values of the Bible.

AND NO YADDA .. I AM NOT FOOLOSOPHY LOL :)

Thanks again for posting all this for everyone to see.

It's impt that everyone sees what the Holy Bible has to say about racism and sexism.

Quote:

Did you know there are people like Sprintcyclist (the Moderator of this forum) .. who profess to be a Christian (a follower of Christ) and who are pro sexist AND pro racist? In short .. these "so called" Christians don't believe we are equal at all. Does this surprise you at all? I consider such Christians to be fake, hypocritical and liars because they subvert, invert and pervert the Holy Word of God in order to satisfy their extreme right wing political agendas.

::)

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 21^st, 2011 at 10:34am:

Thanks again for posting all this for everyone to see. It's impt that everyone sees what the Holy Bible has to say about racism and sexism.

Lisa,

The Bible shows that many women were 'favoured' by God.

e.g.
Ruth, who was both a 'stranger' and, a woman.    ;)

Ruth was a Moabitess [a woman of Moab], i.e. a people who were traditional enemies of Israel.

And, Ruth was the great grandmother of King David.

Yadda wrote on Mar 21^st, 2011 at 10:59am:

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 21st, 2011 at 10:34am: Thanks again for posting all this for everyone to see. It's impt that everyone sees what the Holy Bible has to say about racism and sexism. Lisa, The Bible shows that many women were 'favoured' by God. e.g. Ruth, who was both a 'stranger' and, a woman.    ;) Ruth was a Moabitess [a woman of Moab], i.e. a people who were traditional enemies of Israel. And, Ruth was the great grandmother of King David.

WELL SAID!

I had that saved .. ready to post but you beat me to it lol :)

Thanks once again for your support in demonstrating to all how sexism and racism goes against God's Holy Word.

It's such a shame to see "so called Christians" (like Sprintcyclist) about .. who preach sexism and racism ie hate for the sake of upholding a man made extreme right wing ideology which clearly contravenes God's Word. In short .. they are practising confusion and lawlessness.

Good for all to see what God himself says about this .. as I've stated above in Matthew 7:21-23:

"Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'"

Regards

Lisa

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 21^st, 2011 at 11:05am:

Yadda wrote on Mar 21st, 2011 at 10:59am: Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 21st, 2011 at 10:34am: Thanks again for posting all this for everyone to see. It's impt that everyone sees what the Holy Bible has to say about racism and sexism. Lisa, The Bible shows that many women were 'favoured' by God. e.g. Ruth, who was both a 'stranger' and, a woman.    ;) Ruth was a Moabitess [a woman of Moab], i.e. a people who were traditional enemies of Israel. And, Ruth was the great grandmother of King David. WELL SAID! I had that saved .. ready to post but you beat me to it lol :) Thanks once again for your support in demonstrating to all how sexism and racism goes against God's Holy Word. It's such a shame to see "so called Christians" (like Sprintcyclist) about .. who preach sexism and racism ie hate for the sake of upholding a man made extreme right wing ideology which clearly contravenes God's Word. In short .. they are practising confusion and lawlessness. Good for all to see what God himself says about this .. as I've stated above in Matthew 7:21-23: "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'"

Oh and Yadda .. you gonna mention Deborah next? You may as well let everyone know about her now.

And Esther .. while you're there.

<< smiles >>

Did you know there are people like Sprintcyclist (the Moderator of this forum) .. who profess to be a Christian (a follower of Christ) and who are pro sexist AND pro racist?

In short .. these "so called" Christians don't believe we are equal at all.

Does this surprise you at all?

___________

freewill

i do not judge i observe yes,

many of these ones are freemasons..maybe sprinter

is a freemason in the flock of christians catholics muslims

there are many.

namaste

-:)

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 21^st, 2011 at 11:14am:

Yadda .. you gonna mention Deborah next? You may as well let everyone know now. And Esther .. while you're there. << smiles >>

And Abigail.

Now there was a wise woman.

Much, much, wiser than her husband!     ;)

1 Samuel 25

That's right Yadda .. the Word discredits her husband as a churl and a fool and even upholds HER above her husband.

Oh and let's not forget .. DEBORAH WAS a famous JUDGE of ISRAEL .. and she ruled wisely.

It's good for those so called Christians in our midst who are so proud of being pro sexist and pro racist .. to remember that.

The women in the Bible aren’t just window dressing or background scenery. Women like Sarah are not just wives and mothers; they’re also matriarchs, prophetesses, teachers, and leaders, as in the case of Deborah the Judge and Esther the Queen.

How restrictive trying to look at this question through the narrow lens of the bible.

... wrote on Mar 21^st, 2011 at 12:30pm:

How restrictive trying to look at this question through the narrow lens of the bible.

That is your opinion.

And you are entitled to it.




Do you believe that secular man and is reasoning powers are so very superior ???

To the wisdom about man, which is secreted away, within the Bible.

Proverbs 25:2
It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.




The human condition fascinates me.

It fascinates me, how humans want authority, and the right to choose [to pleasure themselves].

Yet will subsequently then, totally reject the responsibility for the predictable negative consequences of many of those choices.

I study the Bible because the human condition fascinates me.

I also watch popular movies also, because the human condition fascinates me.

It gives me pleasure, to learn more about my own flawed nature.

Its all good.     ;)


"It is counter-productive to raise children in a world without consequences."
Temperance Brennan
Bones - The Bone That Blew
season 4 disc 3

It's wonderful and encouraging to see that there are Christians (like Yadda) out there who are genuine and can take the Bible in context.

Thank you Yadda for showing others on here that God in his Holy Word does NOT SUPPORT racism OR sexism. There are so many verses and whole passages within the Old and New Testaments of the Holy Bible which clearly show God is NO RESPECTOR OF PERSONS.

And both you and I have outlined quite a few of these examples today.

It is a shame and a disgrace to see so called Christians (like Sprint) who walk into message boards to pluck 1 verse out of context and somehow assert this as evidence that God is some racist and/or sexist being.

I am disgusted that Sprint has even started a new topic attempting to do just that in here:

http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1300677736/0#4

A closer look at such people reveals that they have effectively betrayed and sold out on God in order to pathetically and desperately legitimize an extreme Right Wing ideology which contravenes the core tenets of the Holy Bible.

Quote:

How restrictive trying to look at this question through the narrow lens of the bible.

Exactly.

"In the Church of England in Britain, the mother church of the world’s 76 million Anglicans, women priests make up only about 16 per cent of full-time clergy. The church is also pushing towards the consecration of women bishops but there is significant dissent within church ranks. The international provinces – the national and regional units that comprise the global church – are still split. In Australia there are 360 women among a total of 3403 Anglican priests."

For those who are too young to remember this series :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWKy4RHf5tQ

The idea of political emancipation that we take for granted was first worked out on the basis of Christianity, by John Locke. Europe had a devastating period of religiou wars and England had a couple of revolutions and civil wars and an executed king in the 17th century (beat the Frencg again, this time by ovr a 100 years).

Locke's arguments were based on Christian doctrines and the use of reason (a divine element in humans). Not surprisingly, his arguments are diametrically opposed to Islamic doctrines on the nature of religion and government. My point is that Locke's (and our) argument for political emancipation and religious tolerance could be made only in a Christian context and a peculiarly English one at that; and cannot be made in other religious contexts to this day unless they share those fundamentally Christian views of the person, of religion and government.

Hindu, Mohammedan, Voodoo, Buddhist doctrines do not offer a way out of inequality. Christiany may not spell it all out exactly like the Universal Declaration of Human Rights but it has offered the only foundations and path to that declaration.

Soren wrote on Mar 21^st, 2011 at 10:40pm:

The idea of political emancipation that we take for granted was first worked out on the basis of Christianity, by John Locke. Europe had a devastating period of religious wars and England had a couple of revolutions and civil wars and an executed king in the 17th century (beat the French again, this time by over a 100 years). Locke's arguments were based on Christian doctrines and the use of reason (a divine element in humans). Not surprisingly, his arguments are diametrically opposed to Islamic doctrines on the nature of religion and government. My point is that Locke's (and our) argument for political emancipation and religious tolerance could be made only in a Christian context and a peculiarly English one at that; and cannot be made in other religious contexts to this day unless they share those fundamentally Christian views of the person, of religion and government. Hindu, Mohammedan, Voodoo, Buddhist doctrines do not offer a way out of inequality. Christianity may not spell it all out exactly like the Universal Declaration of Human Rights but it has offered the only foundations and path to that declaration.

Soren .. in short you are saying that Christianity is the source/basis of freedom and equality?

If so .. how do you explain the insane rants of so called Christians like Sprint .. yes the Moderator of this forum .. who attempts to use Christianity to support RACISM and SEXISM?

Please don't come back with .. oh but he's a fool who plucks lonely verses out of context from the Bible in order to pathetically support his medieval BS .. because I've already exposed this on a number of occasions .. AND Sprint has had no comeback since. If anything he runs away like a scared chicken .. then comes back after a few hours with the strategy of starting another topic to try and hide the topic in which I made a fool of his inability to use the Bible in a debate.

In short .. he's a coward with not much intelligence or knowledge of the Bible. And I doubt he is even a Christian .. given the anti Biblical rubbish he is attempting to push on the Sprintuality forum .. which has nothing to do with Spirituality at all.

Soren wrote on Mar 21^st, 2011 at 10:40pm:

The idea of political emancipation that we take for granted was first worked out on the basis of Christianity, by John Locke. Europe had a devastating period of religiou wars and England had a couple of revolutions and civil wars and an executed king in the 17th century (beat the Frencg again, this time by ovr a 100 years). Locke's arguments were based on Christian doctrines and the use of reason (a divine element in humans). Not surprisingly, his arguments are diametrically opposed to Islamic doctrines on the nature of religion and government. My point is that Locke's (and our) argument for political emancipation and religious tolerance could be made only in a Christian context and a peculiarly English one at that; and cannot be made in other religious contexts to this day unless they share those fundamentally Christian views of the person, of religion and government. Hindu, Mohammedan, Voodoo, Buddhist doctrines do not offer a way out of inequality. Christiany may not spell it all out exactly like the Universal Declaration of Human Rights but it has offered the only foundations and path to that declaration.

Locke was one of many thinkers who had a great influence on the US Constitution and Bill of Rights, but he didn't have a monpoloy on secular and libertarian views. His Christian ideas were not exactly orthodox, and most of the rest of the founding fathers and other influences were either Deists or very far from orthodox. To say that the Age of Reason and Secularism sprung from mainstream Christianity is like saying that Satanism came from Christianity. Well I guess they both did in a way, and Christians at the time tarred  Satanists, Atheists and Deists with the same brush.

Ironically, the founding fathers of that most Christian of countries mostly believed in the God of nature, some more vociferously than others. The beginning of the "Age of Reason" was more of a departure from Christianity rather than a legacy of it.  

Most of the religions you mention are not champions of equality, and neither is Christianity, which was necessarily hierarchical. The one I highlighted is an exception. You could add Jainism (Jain Dharma) to that, and possibly Bahai.

The Bible doesn't even denounce slavery, and the advocates of slavery took great advantage of that fact. As a prominent advocate of slavery, so did John Locke.

"In the Church of England in Britain, the mother church of the world’s 76 million Anglicans, women priests make up only about 16 per cent of full-time clergy. The church is also pushing towards the consecration of women bishops but there is significant dissent within church ranks. The international provinces – the national and regional units that comprise the global church – are still split. In Australia there are 360 women among a total of 3403 Anglican priests."

- extracted from Amadd's post


In Sydney .. I am happy to report that the Church of England is working on this issue RIGHT NOW .. and in an awesome way too!

Most of my friends from University are now Anglican ministers around Sydney. 2 of them are women .. the rest are men.

I almost joined them .. but was side tracked by marriage in my early 20's which saw me follow a very different path in life.

Where are they now? Doing the most awesome work in many types of ministries.

The trend is changing Amadd .. and more and more women are coming through the ranks (within the Anglican Church). It's just a matter of time before we see those stats equalize.

The Bible does not support sexism or racism .. and ANY person (like Sprint) who says otherwise has an ulterior motive/agenda, is lying and is attempting to lead people astray!

That is the truth of the matter!

John Locke .. now there's an interesting philosopher ... where is the Philosophy forum again?

The utilitarians John S. Mill and Jeremy Bentham would have given the notion of equality a great push along. The basic formula was "happiness for the greatest number"; yet Mill did take issue with mobification because it has a tendency to squeeze out and ostracize brilliance.
Happiness for the greatest number reduces everyone to the same set of characteristics and therefore appeals to the common denominator. Thus equality is given a great boon.

But whether we are really equal requires that we having specific measuring sticks on what constitutes equality. Are we talking football? Running? Writing? Capacity for abstraction? Memory recall?

Each specialisation has its own skills and merits so therefore how do you compare equality across specialisations? Couldn't a measuring stick only be used within the specialisation, that is, couldn't you only compare one football player with another, and not, say, against a medical practitioner? Then, when comparing football player to football player don't we really see equality has little bearing? Why should the skilled football player be named an equal to a less skilled player?


All this talk of equality (and believe me I hear it, read it, and talk about it everyday because I tutor sociology) seems to be vague and riddled with envy and resentment. Why pull down what you are not? Why not use your opponent as a tool to compete with thus heightening your own skill sets in the process?

Locke was one of many thinkers who had a great influence on the US Constitution and Bill of Rights, but he didn't have a monopoloy on secular and libertarian views. His Christian ideas were not exactly orthodox, and most of the rest of the founding fathers and other influences were either Deists or very far from orthodox. To say that the Age of Reason and Secularism sprung from mainstream Christianity is like saying that Satanism came from Christianity. Well I guess they both did in a way, and Christians at the time tarred  Satanists, Atheists and Deists with the same brush.

- Muso




http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1300752332/0#0

Locke - the Father of Liberalism or Contradiction?


Ok Muso, Soren and Time <-- I was hoping you'd join the discussion actually lol ..

I found the Philosophy Forum .. way down, down, down in the bottom of nowhere.

I've started the above topic there in order to examine Locke and a few of his ideas.

yadda - so god favoured many women ?


well, favouring anyone is unequal




Yadda wrote on Mar 21^st, 2011 at 10:59am:

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 21st, 2011 at 10:34am: Thanks again for posting all this for everyone to see. It's impt that everyone sees what the Holy Bible has to say about racism and sexism. Lisa, The Bible shows that many women were 'favoured' by God. e.g. Ruth, who was both a 'stranger' and, a woman.    ;) Ruth was a Moabitess [a woman of Moab], i.e. a people who were traditional enemies of Israel. And, Ruth was the great grandmother of King David.

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 10:05am:

I tutor sociology

That's terrible. Verily, great is your affliction, brother. I'm so sorry for you. Sociology, of all things! How dreadful! And soooo '70s!

yadda - so god favoured many women ?


well, favouring anyone is unequal

- Sprint to Yadda

I know I am not Yadda but I'm a Christian like him .. and like him .. I am absolutely disgusted with you Sprint!

1stly - since when did God suddenly become god? Hmm?

2ndly - you know damn well that God favoured MEN AND WOMEN!

In so doing GOD favoured BOTH .. which ONCE AGAIN proves that your pro sexist rubbish is non Biblical based.

If anything it calls into question your supposed profession as a Christian!

How dare you attempt to dirty a holy God with your pro sexist and pro racist, anti Scriptural garbage! You've attempted to prove God is sexist/racist a few times and in all instances .. you have failed! Why? Because GOD is not the pro sexist/pro racist person YOU are.

If your own posts are anything to go by .. you don't know much about God at all. What you do know is this: you MUST hold onto an extremist right wing political ideology which is struggling for legitimacy in your little confused head .. and your pathetic posts to date indicate you're a man in spiritual turmoil.

You are CLEARLY in the wrong here Sprint! Don't expect any support at all from the Christian posters on this message board .. because we've already had to SHOW YOU (OVERTLY BY SPOON-FEEDING YOU LIKE A BABY) that God himself doesn't support your pro sexist and pro racist rubbish .. and we've done so by barraging your stupidity with so much of God's own WORD already.

It's so called "Christians" like you who give Christianity a bad name!

And to think .. I've had the guts to take you on .. and I'm a woman too. Well .. I would have done the same had I been born a male!

There is NO place for your pro sexist/pro racist rubbish in Christianity .. and there is no place for it in society either.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 10:29am:

yadda - so god favoured many women ? well, favouring anyone is unequal

God's word states that God does favour certain individuals.

But on what basis, is God's 'favouritism' 'given' ???


"Are we all equal ?"
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1300371718/64#64

Quote:

If we are all equal before God, then in what way does God judge, between one man, and another man ? Acts 10:34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons: 35  But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him. Romans 2:8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, 9  Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile; 10  But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile: 11  For there is no respect of persons with God. 12  For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law; 13  (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified. 14  For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: 15  Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)

God's consistent advice, to those who love him, MkI....

John 14:15
If ye love me, keep my commandments.
16  And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
17  Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
...
21  He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

Matthew 19:17
....if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
18  He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
19  Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

1 Corinthians 2:12
Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13  Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14  But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.


God's consistent advice, to those who love him, MkII....

"...Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you, And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty."
2 Corinthians 6:14-18
James 4:4
1 John 2:15

Our separation from what God hates, is a theme carried over from the OT;
Leviticus 18:24
Leviticus 20:23, 24, 26
Deuteronomy 7:6
Deuteronomy 14:2




Quote:

"It is the life that is obedient to God and separated from the world that provides the proof of one's conversion."

And imo, of all branches of Christian organised religion, are the religion of man.

2 Timothy 3:5
Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof:...


+++

There will NOT be a revival among the 'believers'...

2 Thessalonians 2:3
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

Romans 9:27
Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:

Luke 17:26
And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man.
27  They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all.

'as it was in the days of Noe'  ???

Genesis 6:5
And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
11  ....and the earth was filled with violence.


God seeks a clean heart, not those who are worldly 'wise' [i.e. not those who seek only to be 'on the winning side'].


1 Corinthians 3:16
Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

Those in rebellion against God's righteousness, displace the spirit of God!

They themselves, 'push' God's spirit away.

That is the wisdom of God.

The 'wicked', are 'self-selecting', in as much as they abhor God's righteousness [laws], in as much as they choose to do what is right in their own eyes, his spirit refuses to mingle or 'dwell' with them.

Excellent Yadda! Keep hammering the Word of God at him ...

And let's not forget this precious little gem from the New Testament of the Holy Bible ..

And it shall come to pass in the last days said God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy ..

Acts 2:17

NB ALL FLESH means ALL RACES!

NB SONS AND DAUGHTERS means MEN AND WOMEN!

Inclusive words/phrases like this grate against sexism and racism .. and so they should because God is NOT sexist nor is he racist!

yadda

Quote:

.......God's word states that God does favour certain individuals......

which makes me think, we are not all equal.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 12:26pm:

yadda Quote: .......God's word states that God does favour certain individuals...... which makes me think, we are not all equal.

We are not equal in our circumstances.

But not equal in choice ???

I think that yes, we are equal in choice.

e.g.
Even where [i.e. IF ] the circumstances of two men were equal,
a good man will make a good choice [in that equal circumstance, or, hardship],
while it is likely that,
a wicked man will make a poor choice [in that equal circumstance, or, hardship].


As Jesus and Paul, pointed out;

Matthew 12:35
A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things.


Romans 2:14
For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
15  Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)




As i tried to make clear here;

"Are we all equal ?"
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1300371718/9#9

Quote:

IMO, Our circumstances, are never really within our control. Certainly not the circumstances we are born into. Our choices, always are - within our control. In this life, we can make good choices, and/or, we can make poor choices. The choices we make, are ours alone, imo.

Soren wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 10:55am:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Mar 22nd, 2011 at 10:05am: I tutor sociology That's terrible. Verily, great is your affliction, brother. I'm so sorry for you. Sociology, of all things! How dreadful! And soooo '70s!

;D

I think Max Weber still has a bit to offer though.

Yadda .. you previously mentioned this verse from the Holy Bible:

"God is no respecter of persons"

Could you kindly explain what this actually means?

Does it mean God considers some people to be higher than others based on something like sex or race .. for instance?

Or does it mean that in the eyes of God we are all the same .. we are all equal?

Why are we still talking about God. He/she/it has no bearing on the matter. Equality is a human idea.

On another note, there's an interesting mix in the thinkers of equality, with classical liberals on the one side arguing for it, and Marxists on the other arguing for it as well. Leftists and rightists both arguing for the same thing????? Who would have thought it!

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 1:12pm:

Yadda .. you previously mentioned this verse from the Holy Bible: "God is no respecter of persons" Could you kindly explain what this actually means? Does it mean God considers some people to be higher than others based on something like sex or race .. for instance? Or does it mean that in the eyes of God we are all the same .. we are all equal?

Romans 2:11
For there is no respect of persons with God.


IMO,
When we come to judgement,

Galatians 6:7
Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
8  For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

God will judge the guilty, as guilty, and the righteous as righteous.

God will not excuse wilful wickedness in anyone.

He cannot, and remain holy.

Psalms 5:4
For thou art not a God that hath pleasure in wickedness: neither shall evil dwell with thee.
5  The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.
6  Thou shalt destroy them that speak leasing: the LORD will abhor the bloody and deceitful man.


Just like darkness and light cannot dwell together.

Neither can God, dwell with the wicked.

It is an impossibility.


+++

"God is no respecter of persons"

e.g.
Leviticus 19:15
Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment: thou shalt not respect the person of the poor, nor honour the person of the mighty: but in righteousness shalt thou judge thy neighbour.



What about people who have been wicked, but now truly repent their foolishness ???

God offers those people forgiveness, and, mercy.

God has the power to heal us, to purge away the stain of our sins, if we repent.



Psalms 34:18
The LORD is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit.

Psalms 51:17
The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.

Isaiah 55:6
Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:
7  Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.

Isaiah 57:15
For thus saith the high and lofty One that inhabiteth eternity, whose name is Holy; I dwell in the high and holy place, with him also that is of a contrite and humble spirit, to revive the spirit of the humble, and to revive the heart of the contrite ones.
16  For I will not contend for ever, neither will I be always wroth: for the spirit should fail before me, and the souls which I have made.

Isaiah 66:2
...to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word.




+++

Jeremiah 17:10
I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.

Psalms 11:4
The LORD is in his holy temple, the LORD'S throne is in heaven: his eyes behold, his eyelids try, the children of men.
5  The LORD trieth the righteous: but the wicked and him that loveth violence his soul hateth.

Psalms 146:8
The LORD openeth the eyes of the blind: the LORD raiseth them that are bowed down: the LORD loveth the righteous:

Ok Yadda ..

Many thanks for your detailed answer. The above portions of scripture which you've quoted .. clearly demonstrate that we are all equal before God and that God gives us all equal opportunities. Right?

If that is correct .. then what does this say about God and racism/ sexism?

Is God pro racist/pro sexist? Or is he anti sexist/anti racist?

Do you think God would want us to be racist or sexist?

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 10:05am:

All this talk of equality (and believe me I hear it, read it, and talk about it everyday because I tutor sociology)

Do you just teach sociology, or are you a practicing social worker too?  :P

Well at least you don't teach philosophy.

it_is_the_light wrote on Mar 21^st, 2011 at 11:15am:

many of these ones are freemasons..maybe sprinter is a freemason in the flock of christians catholics muslims there are many. namaste -:)

He's not a freemason - He's just a very naughty boy  ;D

maybe sprinter is a freemason

- IT IS THE LIGHT

Nahh I doubt it. I mean they couldn't be THAT desperate to take him on board .. could they lol ??

We Christians certainly don't want him .. I suppose we could always feed him to the lions :P

Just joking!

Muso is right .. Sprint has been a naughty boy.

Can I volunteer to spank him lol ?

Let's try to stay on topic here. (myself included)

muso wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 4:38pm:

Let's try to stay on topic here. (myself included)

What topic?

Sprint has clearly lost the debate and has had to run for cover.

And he knows if he comes back again to pathetically quote a Bible verse out of context .. in some vain attempt to try and prove that God is sexist and/or racist .. he is going to face yet another barrage of verse after verse after verse in return fire .. all from the Bible too!

And I doubt he's gonna be that silly .. given he's tried that stunt twice today .. and it backfired to the point where he made himself look like a fool in front of everyone.

Just read back Muso .. it's all there in black and white for all to see :)

Yeah read it back Lisa, and you'll realise why I once asked you if you are a nun  ::)

If not a nun, you are a nun event - controlled by your superiors.

Yadda wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 1:37pm:

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 22nd, 2011 at 1:12pm: Yadda .. you previously mentioned this verse from the Holy Bible: "God is no respecter of persons" Could you kindly explain what this actually means? Does it mean God considers some people to be higher than others based on something like sex or race .. for instance? Or does it mean that in the eyes of God we are all the same .. we are all equal? Romans 2:11 For there is no respect of persons with God. IMO, When we come to judgement, Galatians 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. 8  For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting. God will judge the guilty, as guilty, and the righteous as righteous. God will not excuse wilful wickedness in anyone. He cannot, and remain holy. Psalms 5:4 For thou art not a God that hath pleasure in wickedness: neither shall evil dwell with thee. 5  The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity. 6  Thou shalt destroy them that speak leasing: the LORD will abhor the bloody and deceitful man. Just like darkness and light cannot dwell together. Neither can God, dwell with the wicked. It is an impossibility. +++ "God is no respecter of persons" e.g. Leviticus 19:15 Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment: thou shalt not respect the person of the poor, nor honour the person of the mighty: but in righteousness shalt thou judge thy neighbour. What about people who have been wicked, but now truly repent their foolishness ??? God offers those people forgiveness, and, mercy. God has the power to heal us, to purge away the stain of our sins, if we repent. Psalms 34:18 The LORD is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit. Psalms 51:17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise. Isaiah 55:6 Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near: 7  Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon. Isaiah 57:15 For thus saith the high and lofty One that inhabiteth eternity, whose name is Holy; I dwell in the high and holy place, with him also that is of a contrite and humble spirit, to revive the spirit of the humble, and to revive the heart of the contrite ones. 16  For I will not contend for ever, neither will I be always wroth: for the spirit should fail before me, and the souls which I have made. Isaiah 66:2 ...to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word. +++ Jeremiah 17:10 I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings. Psalms 11:4 The LORD is in his holy temple, the LORD'S throne is in heaven: his eyes behold, his eyelids try, the children of men. 5  The LORD trieth the righteous: but the wicked and him that loveth violence his soul hateth. Psalms 146:8 The LORD openeth the eyes of the blind: the LORD raiseth them that are bowed down: the LORD loveth the righteous:

Well that answers that!

Next!

are we all equal ?
Most people said "no"



Some rushed to the bible to prove it otherwise.
I did not ask them what the bible said.
Anyhow, seems the bible says all people are not equal.
According to the quotes given, some are guilty, some are righteous.
Some are willfully wicked

So, we are unequal.

pity, but there it is. As given by yadda and agreed by lisa.
Oh, and almost everyone else said that WELL before lisa and yadda.

It's just how the world is.
It's just how humans are.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 23^rd, 2011 at 11:11pm:

are we all equal ? Most people said "no" Some rushed to the bible to prove it otherwise. I did not ask them what the bible said. Anyhow, seems the bible says all people are not equal. According to the quotes given, some are guilty, some are righteous. Some are willfully wicked So, we are unequal. pity, but there it is. As given by yadda and agreed by lisa. Oh, and almost everyone else said that WELL before lisa and yadda. It's just how the world is. It's just how humans are.

Do you mean "if EVERY persons life or worthiness to exist is of equal value?"

Then I suppose the answer SHOULD  be YES but it isnt in reality

Why?

So perhaps we can ask "WHY isnt everybody equal"?

The discipline and principles of Foosolophy tackle this very problem but this isnt the time and place to elaborate in detail upon them

cheers

are we all equal ?
Most people said "no"

__________

this has been covered already

most is not always correct now is it.

i am here again to announce

we are all equal.

i stand in CHRISTED LIGHT and am immune to this confusion.

we are all an individual vibration manifesting in a merkabah,

sacred geometrical construct in the 3rd order of dimension with

freewill...i observe many in a state of confusion...so be it,

forgiven

namaste

-:)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHSKWLs_kdY&feature=feedu

Richard C. Hoagland HAARP Japan Earthquake 1

__________

we are all interdimension,multidimensional time travellers.

we have done this for eons...brother and sister beings

humbly in CHRISTED LIGHT.

fear not,for I AM with thee

namaste

-:)

it_is_the_light wrote on Mar 27^th, 2011 at 5:55am:

we are all interdimensional, multidimensional time travellers.

It means nothing to them LIGHT.
We are just what we are aware of.
Boring slaves with wives and kids.

Richard C. Hoagland will be remembered as the delusion, who had grand aims. He had delusions of grandeur, with connections that were all in his mind. Like the face on Mars that since has been seen.
Or else he would be heard and recognised as a scientist better than mainstream, like Einstein, in time.

 Moreoverall, science (which means knowing) can never be offered until it passes the test. Of experiment, and proof.

---

What have you got to say, Good Sir Light, about yourself?  

forgiven.

i have no control over this

for it is divine law

and so it is

namaste

-:)

 ;D

ALL ITEMS IN STORE SAME PRICE TOMORROW
ONLY NO REPAYMENTS EVER *EXLUDES NOTHING JC HIFI

Superman1 wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 3:25am:

Richard C. Hoagland will be remembered as the delusion, who had grand aims. He had delusions of grandeur, with connections that were all in his mind. Like the face on Mars that since has been seen. Or else he would be heard and recognised as a scientist better than mainstream, like Einstein, in time.  Moreoverall, science (which means knowing) can never be offered until it passes the test. Of experiment, and proof.

In the future, it's possible. I saw the movie Idiocracy. Maybe Hoagland will be up there on the podium with Bozo the Clown.

Quote:

He replied, “Because the knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them. Whoever has will be given more, and they will have an abundance. Whoever does not have, even what they have will be taken from them.

Matthew 13:11,12

Seems as though we are not all equal.

If we were all equal, then communism would be a given, not an idealism.
Of course we are not all equal in ability, it's ridiculous to suggest otherwise.

However, you don't need to be a prophet or a "believer" to understand that each aspect of life has it's own intrinsic value. One cannot operate properly without the co-operation, the work for one's self, and the competition of the next.

I doubt that anybody here hasn't been touched at one time or another by somedody who is disabled in a physical sense, but who provides so much (spiritual) value for others who are more able bodied.

I'm not too keen on the spoilt brat types like "Light" who endeavours to provide a cult unto himself without providing hardly any real value to the future of other people whatsoever. He can continue to lie and say that he loves everything..I will continue to hate that ridiculous philosophy. It's without value.

I'd say that we are potentially equal in value, but not in ability.
The value that you provide or that you want to provide is a choice.

So far I couldn't be bothered to provide any value to insolent morons such as feminists or sponging racists because I am blessed with the ablitiy to not require it, and I don't think that they deserve it from me in the least.
There is a definite lack of personal value to me, and I treat it that way, as any good democracist should.ii

Yes.

You all know that I differentiate, segregate RACES and CULTURES of the World into their own 'unique' state of being.
But I can do that for I truely understand that they are all equal to begin with and they will still be so to end with.
When a black man approaches me in a Backpacker Hostel where I worked NightShift to tell me that he has impregnated another "white Biatch", I would just smile and say "Something lost is something gained my Friend" by which he dropped dead in front of my Longevity of life. ;) ;D 555 years and still growing. ;)
...typical Australian. :D

no

You are equal to me Cliff Richard.
So raise your sorry-arsed game. Stop ya bludgeing and going for compenstation, etc, etc, etc, etc .
Stop being a derro, drongo, nuff nuff, wanker, yobbo, strine, numpty, skegg, westie, bogun ...typical Aussie LOSER
and raise yourself up to be 'equal' with me.
[smiley=evil.gif]

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 18^th, 2011 at 12:21am:

Are we equal ? Are we of the same worth ? Are we all "born equal" ?

Of course not. Born equal is a ridiculous notion. All we have in common at birth is being human. WHat of those born with a deformity? A severe mental impairment? Those born into ultra pverty?

None of those kids is equal.

Dumb question, clearly not a thought given.

boogieman wrote on Jun 29^th, 2011 at 10:03am:

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 18th, 2011 at 12:21am: Are we equal ? Are we of the same worth ? Are we all "born equal" ? Of course not. Born equal is a ridiculous notion. All we have in common at birth is being human. WHat of those born with a deformity? A severe mental impairment? Those born into ultra pverty? None of those kids is equal. Dumb question, clearly not a thought given.

boogie - that was my sentiments exactly .
apart from it being a dumb question, of course. :-)

I am quite amazed as a star at your antics on earth, onlooking from afar (NO I am NOT It_isn't_the _light  = haha.)

Am I a fool to believe you ask are we all created equal?

A clone is a clone after all, an ape is a clone to us all bar 2%
That horrible majesty ought to be enough to set off the alarm to your lack of intell.

I hope this is right enough I mean no insalt just pepper of the earth.

Even animals are our equals. Even insects. And the poor cold bacteria.
For such is the fate of man = unconcious.

http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~sai/DNAPhantom.htm


WM
The DNA PHANTOM EFFECT:
Direct Measurement of A New Field in the Vacuum Substructure - by Dr. Vladimir Poponin

UPDATE ON DNA PHANTOM EFFECT (19/ 3 / 02)
Below is an email to TWM from Dr. Peter Gariaev, a joint researcher with Dr. Poponin.
More info about Peter Gariaev's work - click here.  

INTRODUCTION
In this contribution I am going to describe some observations and interpretations of a recently discovered anomalous phenomenon which we are calling the DNA Phantom Effect in Vitro or the DNA Phantom for short. We believe this discovery has tremendous significance for the explanation and deeper understandings of the mechanisms underlying subtle energy phenomena including many of the observed alternative healing phenomena [1,2]. This data also supports the heart intelligence concept and model developed by Doc Lew Childre [3,4]. (See also contributions by Rollin McCraty and Glen Rein in this volume).
This new phenomenon -- the DNA phantom effect -- was first observed in Moscow at the Russian Academy of Sciences as a surprise effect during experiments measuring the vibrational modes of DNA in solution using a sophisticated and expensive "MALVERN" laser photon correlation spectrometer (LPCS) [5]. These effects were analyzed and interpreted by Gariaev and Poponin [6].

The new feature that makes this discovery distinctly different from many other previously undertaken attempts to measure and identify subtle energy fields [1] is that the field of the DNA phantom has the ability to be coupled to conventional electromagnetic fields of laser radiation and as a consequence, it can be reliably detected and positively identified using standard optical techniques.

Furthermore, it seems very plausible that the DNA phantom effect is an example of subtle energy manifestation in which direct human influence is not involved. These experimental data provide us not only quantitative data concerning the coupling constant between the DNA phantom field and the electromagnetic field of the laser light but also provides qualitative and quantitative information about the nonlinear dynamics of the phantom DNA fields. Note that both types of data are crucial for the development of a new unified nonlinear quantum field theory which must include the physical theory of consciousness and should be based on a precise quantitative background.

RESULTS
The background leading to the discovery of the DNA phantom and a description of the experimental set up and conditions will be helpful. A block diagram of the laser photon correlation spectrometer used in these experiments is presented in Figure 1. In each set of experimental measurements with DNA samples, several double control measurements are performed. These measurements are performed prior to the DNA being placed in the scattering chamber. When the scattering chamber of the LPCS is void of physical DNA, and neither are there are any phantom DNA fields present, the autocorrelation function of scattered light looks like the one shown in Figure 2a. This typical control plot represents only background random noise counts of the photomultiplier. Note that the intensity of the background noise counts is very small and the distribution of the number of counts per channel is close to random. Figure 2b demonstrates a typical time autocorrelation function when a physical DNA sample is placed in the scattering chamber, and typically has the shape of an oscillatory and slowly exponentially decaying function. When the DNA is removed from the scattering chamber, one anticipates that the autocorrelation function will be the same as before the DNA was placed in the scattering chamber. Surprisingly and counter-intuitively it turns out that the autocorrelation function measured just after the removal of the DNA from the scattering chamber looks distinctly different from the one obtained before the DNA was placed in the chamber. Two examples of the autocorrelation functions measured just after the removal of the physical DNA are shown in Figures 2c and d. After duplicating this many times and checking the equipment in every conceivable way, we were forced to accept the working hypothesis that some new field structure is being excited from the physical vacuum. We termed this the DNA phantom in order to emphasize that its origin is related with the physical DNA. We have not yet observed this effect with other substances in the chamber. After the discovery of this effect we began a more rigorous and continuous study of this phenomena. We have found that, as long as the space in the scattering chamber is not disturbed, we are able to measure this effect for long periods of time. In several cases we have observed it for up to a month. It is important to emphasize that two conditions are necessary in order to observe the DNA phantoms. The first is the presence of the DNA molecule and the second is the exposure of the DNA to weak coherent laser radiation. This last condition has been shown to work with two different frequencies of laser radiation.

I think more likely that we all have different skills - doesn't make make one superior or not - just different.
My wife is a genius, she writes the most wonderful books but ask her to do some practical work around the house...........

We are not all equal, but does not mean that we do not deserve equal consideration. To be given equal consideration is our right.

We're all equal...

To 46.

That's nice. I'm equal to 55.

I'm only equal to eternity :(

muso wrote on Jul 8^th, 2011 at 8:13pm:

That's nice. I'm equal to 55.

Chromosomes?

Nup nuthin' physical

---

EDIT [timestamp=1310215048]
Woops

1) I didn't even notice ☼Helian☼ wrote

Quote:

Chromosomes?

in answer to ♫muso♪ not me [smiley=beer.gif]. {I really must stop brewing my own beer recipes}

2) I didn't even get til now that I'm equal to 55 or 46 was a joke. Haha. I kept thinking about it and couldn't get what the heck you meant except you must mean your age. But I still didn't get why.  :-/

All of which proves ∞I∞ am inferior! So no we are not all equal ☺☻

Superman1 wrote on Jul 8^th, 2011 at 10:04pm:

Nup nuthin' physical

Then we're all equal in our capacity to imagine our own superiority.

Needless to say, the question 'are we equal' can be thought of only in a society where there is an underlying God-is-Love idea and then the question makes sense. It then means "are we equal (before god) who made us in his own image"?

The question would not occur to tribal people in the Amazon or PNG. Or to any culture other than a Judeao-Christian one.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jul 8^th, 2011 at 10:15pm:

Superman1 wrote on Jul 8th, 2011 at 10:04pm: Nup nuthin' physical Then we're all equal in our capacity to imagine our own superiority.

;D Succinct.

quite true soren

namaste

-:)

Soren wrote on Jul 8^th, 2011 at 10:34pm:

Needless to say, the question 'are we equal' can be thought of only in a society where there is an underlying God-is-Love idea and then the question makes sense. It then means "are we equal (before god) who made us in his own image"? The question would not occur to tribal people in the Amazon or PNG. Or to any culture other than a Judeao-Christian one.

The question makes sense and is poignant to anyone anywhere who sees nothing but inequality.

The privileged in any society are happy to promote the idea of equality to the unprivileged masses where it helps to preserve their privileged status. Did Thomas Jefferson believe when he wrote the 'magnificent' Declaration of Independence that he and his 'founding father' peers were equal to the slaves on his plantation? Where was this 'equality' he spoke of 'self-evident'?

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jul 9^th, 2011 at 10:29am:

The question makes sense and is poignant to anyone anywhere who sees nothing but inequality. The privileged in any society are happy to promote the idea of equality to the unprivileged masses where it helps to preserve their privileged status. Did Thomas Jefferson believe when he wrote the 'magnificent' Declaration of Independence that he and his 'founding father' peers were equal to the slaves on his plantation? Where was this 'equality' he spoke of 'self-evident'?

Poor old Thomas Jefferson.


'Are we all equal ?'

Yes and no.

No.

We are not all equal.

We all have differing capacities and talents, depending largely upon the luck of who our parents were [genes], and where we were born [1st world thru to 3rd world].


Yes.

The rain and sun fall on us all equally.


Q.
But should we be engaged in a struggle to make all mankind 'equal' ?

Should we all be dedicated to 'egalitarianism' ???

IMO, no.



Dictionary;
egalitarian = = believing in or based on the principle that all people are equal and deserve equal rights and opportunities.


If i did believe in egalitarianism i would be seeking to burst open the gates of all of our prisons.

I would be seeking to disarm our defence forces.

To disband our [oppressive] police services.

And to close our law courts.

Because in an egalitarian society, we would clearly have no need for such institutions, and services.



But, the consequences of assuming that we could be 'equal' and have equal rights, and seeking to give all persons equal rights, in a society such as ours, imo, would never work.

It would never be practical.

Why not ?

Because we all innately seem to grow up into individuals who have differing capacities and talents.

And because 'p!sssing into the wind' always seemed to me, to be a very silly thing to try to do.

And, trying to artificially transform and treat an innately dumb kid, into, and as though they were an innately smart kid [and to then give them both exactly the same reward, for the consequences of each of their individual efforts], would also seem to me to be a very silly thing to do.

e.g.
As a resident of Sydney, would you like to have the construction of your SydHarb bridge overseen by qualified engineers [as it was] ?

OR, in the interests of giving every idiot an even break, would you like to have your SydHarb bridge constructed by nincompoops ?

[Yes, its a real word.]

Dictionary;
nincompoop /"nINk@mpu;p/
· n. a stupid person.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jul 8^th, 2011 at 9:57pm:

muso wrote on Jul 8th, 2011 at 8:13pm: That's nice. I'm equal to 55. Chromosomes?

years

muso wrote on Jul 11^th, 2011 at 11:23am:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jul 8th, 2011 at 9:57pm: muso wrote on Jul 8th, 2011 at 8:13pm: That's nice. I'm equal to 55. Chromosomes? years

Ah the years!

Wiser or dumber?

Quote:

And, trying to artificially transform and treat an innately dumb kid, into, and as though they were an innately smart kid [and to then give them both exactly the same reward, for the consequences of each of their individual efforts], would also seem to me to be a very silly thing to do.

G.W.Bush is a prime example of why we should respect inequality.


Quote:

"I know the human being and fish can coexist peacefully."

Neither man nor fish...an amphibian amongst men!

Amadd wrote on Jul 12^th, 2011 at 11:07am:

Quote: And, trying to artificially transform and treat an innately dumb kid, into, and as though they were an innately smart kid [and to then give them both exactly the same reward, for the consequences of each of their individual efforts], would also seem to me to be a very silly thing to do. G.W.Bush is a prime example of why we should respect inequality.

LOL


Exactly so, Amadd.

Yadda wrote on Jul 10^th, 2011 at 11:19pm:

As a resident of Sydney, would you like to have the construction of your SydHarb bridge overseen by qualified engineers [as it was] ? OR, in the interests of giving every idiot an even break, would you like to have your SydHarb bridge constructed by nincompoops ?

My frien, you are most mistaken. The Syd Ha'arb Bridge is wonderful construction in Lahore, Pakistan.

It was not built by the nincompoops, but by the djin.

Allah Uakbar!

So, after all that madness, does 1+1 = 1?

Superman1 wrote on Aug 6^th, 2011 at 9:29pm:

So, after all that madness, does 1+1 = 1?

It does... Its called conception.

But that's inferior, for it's propagating man's clone. INSTEAD OF PROGRESSING.

HHA, MWAHAHAH...MWAHAGHHAGAH HAGHhh

But right you are it is equal therefore, in the horrible error of all.

Superman1 wrote on Aug 6^th, 2011 at 9:52pm:

But that's inferior, for it's propagating man's clone. INSTEAD OF PROGRESSING.

Errr... No... it's the promotion of genetic diversity... 1 egg + 1 sperm = 1 zygote.

But I mean that genetics are dominated by the mental, or thought.

Superman1 wrote on Aug 6^th, 2011 at 10:06pm:

But I mean that genetics are dominated by the mental, or thought.

I see a career in penis enlargement for superboy  ;D

Superman1 wrote on Aug 6^th, 2011 at 10:06pm:

But I mean that genetics are dominated by the mental, or thought.

It's driven by instinct... A bit deeper than conscious thought.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6^th, 2011 at 10:38pm:

Superman1 wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:06pm: But I mean that genetics are dominated by the mental, or thought. It's driven by instinct... A bit deeper than conscious thought.

True, but instinct is driven by habit, which initially, is conscious thought. We chose to do things a few times, they become habit, then instinct, then over a few generations, genetics.

Painters and musicians, gamblers and alcoholics sometimes pass these traits on.

The sins of the father are visited upon the son.

Karnal wrote on Aug 6^th, 2011 at 11:04pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:38pm: Superman1 wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:06pm: But I mean that genetics are dominated by the mental, or thought. It's driven by instinct... A bit deeper than conscious thought. True, but instinct is driven by habit, which initially, is conscious thought. We chose to do things a few times, they become habit, then instinct, then over a few generations, genetics.

No one chooses to get into the habit of the sex drive.

Guess you haven't heard that a standing cock has no conscience.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6^th, 2011 at 11:05pm:

Karnal wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:04pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:38pm: Superman1 wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:06pm: But I mean that genetics are dominated by the mental, or thought. It's driven by instinct... A bit deeper than conscious thought. True, but instinct is driven by habit, which initially, is conscious thought. We chose to do things a few times, they become habit, then instinct, then over a few generations, genetics. No one chooses to get into the habit of the sex drive. Guess you haven't heard that a standing cock has no conscience.

No, but what it's attracted to is. Sure, they say it's all genes. Crap.

Karnal wrote on Aug 6^th, 2011 at 11:06pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:05pm: Karnal wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:04pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:38pm: Superman1 wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:06pm: But I mean that genetics are dominated by the mental, or thought. It's driven by instinct... A bit deeper than conscious thought. True, but instinct is driven by habit, which initially, is conscious thought. We chose to do things a few times, they become habit, then instinct, then over a few generations, genetics. No one chooses to get into the habit of the sex drive. Guess you haven't heard that a standing cock has no conscience. No, but what it's attracted to is. Sure, they say it's all genes. Crap.

Do you think you could teach yourself to get hot over the thought of rooting a goat's arse? (Assuming that's not what attracts you now).

NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6^th, 2011 at 11:08pm:

Karnal wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:06pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:05pm: Karnal wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:04pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:38pm: Superman1 wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:06pm: But I mean that genetics are dominated by the mental, or thought. It's driven by instinct... A bit deeper than conscious thought. True, but instinct is driven by habit, which initially, is conscious thought. We chose to do things a few times, they become habit, then instinct, then over a few generations, genetics. No one chooses to get into the habit of the sex drive. Guess you haven't heard that a standing cock has no conscience. No, but what it's attracted to is. Sure, they say it's all genes. Crap. Do you think you could teach yourself to get hot over the thought of rooting a goat's arse? (Assuming that's not what attracts you now).

My frien, I do this with pretty lady goat in Lahore.

Karnal wrote on Aug 6^th, 2011 at 11:11pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:08pm: Karnal wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:06pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:05pm: Karnal wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:04pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:38pm: Superman1 wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:06pm: But I mean that genetics are dominated by the mental, or thought. It's driven by instinct... A bit deeper than conscious thought. True, but instinct is driven by habit, which initially, is conscious thought. We chose to do things a few times, they become habit, then instinct, then over a few generations, genetics. No one chooses to get into the habit of the sex drive. Guess you haven't heard that a standing cock has no conscience. No, but what it's attracted to is. Sure, they say it's all genes. Crap. Do you think you could teach yourself to get hot over the thought of rooting a goat's arse? (Assuming that's not what attracts you now). My frien, I do this with pretty lady goat in Lahore.

Gee... What a surprise  ::)

NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6^th, 2011 at 11:12pm:

Karnal wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:11pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:08pm: Karnal wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:06pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:05pm: Karnal wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:04pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:38pm: Superman1 wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:06pm: But I mean that genetics are dominated by the mental, or thought. It's driven by instinct... A bit deeper than conscious thought. True, but instinct is driven by habit, which initially, is conscious thought. We chose to do things a few times, they become habit, then instinct, then over a few generations, genetics. No one chooses to get into the habit of the sex drive. Guess you haven't heard that a standing cock has no conscience. No, but what it's attracted to is. Sure, they say it's all genes. Crap. Do you think you could teach yourself to get hot over the thought of rooting a goat's arse? (Assuming that's not what attracts you now). My frien, I do this with pretty lady goat in Lahore. Gee... What a surprise  ::)

Don't knock goats. Plenty of goats get it all the time.

Karnal wrote on Aug 6^th, 2011 at 11:20pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:12pm: Karnal wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:11pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:08pm: Karnal wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:06pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:05pm: Karnal wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 11:04pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:38pm: Superman1 wrote on Aug 6th, 2011 at 10:06pm: But I mean that genetics are dominated by the mental, or thought. It's driven by instinct... A bit deeper than conscious thought. True, but instinct is driven by habit, which initially, is conscious thought. We chose to do things a few times, they become habit, then instinct, then over a few generations, genetics. No one chooses to get into the habit of the sex drive. Guess you haven't heard that a standing cock has no conscience. No, but what it's attracted to is. Sure, they say it's all genes. Crap. Do you think you could teach yourself to get hot over the thought of rooting a goat's arse? (Assuming that's not what attracts you now). My frien, I do this with pretty lady goat in Lahore. Gee... What a surprise  ::) Don't knock goats. Plenty of goats get it all the time.

Thought you're the one who's doing the knocking ;D

I thought 'this sort of thing' was restricted to the elite of the US army?

http://www.jonronson.com/goats_04.html

Quote:

Karnal wrote True, but instinct is driven by habit, which initially, is conscious thought. We chose to do things a few times, they become habit, then instinct, then over a few generations, genetics. Painters and musicians, gamblers and alcoholics sometimes pass these traits on. The sins of the father are visited upon the son.

Quote:

Helian wrote No one chooses to get into the habit of the sex drive. Guess you haven't heard that a standing cock has no conscience.

Both good points. I think Karnal is right in that instinct is deeply ingrained habit, and that after, say, hundreds of years it becomes "genetic". Our most frequent habits are the oldest instincts. Like the desire for group association and protection is probably as old as human beings themselves. But, I think Helian has a point that the sex drive must be primordial. Otherwise, we get stuck in a regress argument whereby human beings were taught by some "thing" external to themselves on how and why to reproduce. In short, if the sex drive is not innate, it must come from without. This doesn't make sense as it makes human beings out to be empty vessels waiting to be filled with information, and only then can it act at all. (If it is true we are empty vessels then the regress argument falls into further problems, like, how does the human learn? Is learning how to learn taught as well? If so, then we must learn how to learn on learning, and so on ad infinitum. Contrary to this, human beings must be primordially equipped with something like "grasping mechanisms").
The idea of the sex drive being the motor of existence isn't old. I am sure Plato stated eros was the basis of all life.

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Aug 8^th, 2011 at 9:15am:

Quote: Karnal wrote True, but instinct is driven by habit, which initially, is conscious thought. We chose to do things a few times, they become habit, then instinct, then over a few generations, genetics. Painters and musicians, gamblers and alcoholics sometimes pass these traits on. The sins of the father are visited upon the son. [quote]Helian wrote No one chooses to get into the habit of the sex drive. Guess you haven't heard that a standing cock has no conscience.

Both good points. I think Karnal is right in that instinct is deeply ingrained habit, and that after, say, hundreds of years it becomes "genetic". Our most frequent habits are the oldest instincts. Like the desire for group association and protection is probably as old as human beings themselves. But, I think Helian has a point that the sex drive must be primordial. Otherwise, we get stuck in a regress argument whereby human beings were taught by some "thing" external to themselves on how and why to reproduce. In short, if the sex drive is not innate, it must come from without. This doesn't make sense as it makes human beings out to be empty vessels waiting to be filled with information, and only then can it act at all. (If it is true we are empty vessels then the regress argument falls into further problems, like, how does the human learn? Is learning how to learn taught as well? If so, then we must learn how to learn on learning, and so on ad infinitum. Contrary to this, human beings must be primordially equipped with something like "grasping mechanisms").
The idea of the sex drive being the motor of existence isn't old. I am sure Plato stated eros was the basis of all life.

[/quote]

Freud thought eros was learned - through unconscious systems like the Oedepal Complex. Sometimes though, things go awry and you get fetishes.

Drug addicts have a similar instinct towards drugs. Some have them towards money. I know sex seems more compulsive than other drives, but try going without food for a while. This is why people in religious and spiritual traditions fast. You can learn about your instincts, and you can learn how to overcome them - but they are not "you".

Our instincts are not as powerful as evolutionary biology gives them credit for. Nor are they are not the basis for our identity, as sexual politics would have you believe.

Instincts CAN be changed - or at the very least, known.

An interesting observation that some compulsive gamblers have reported... When they're on a gambling bender, they lose their sex drive... When they've lost all their money, their sex drive returns with a vengeance.

Does their obsessive-compulsive disorder (manifesting as their need to gamble) somehow co-opt the sex drive? Or is it repressed by the their disorder?

My bet is on the former.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Aug 8^th, 2011 at 9:10pm:

An interesting observation that some compulsive gamblers have reported... When they're on a gambling bender, they lose their sex drive... When they've lost all their money, their sex drive returns with a vengeance. Does their obsessive-compulsive disorder (manifesting as their need to gamble) somehow co-opt the sex drive? Or is it repressed by the their disorder? My bet is on the former.

So remove the sex drive and the habit is beaten? It would make an interesting experiment.

normally obsessions do not come as an individual item.
they are packaged together with a few outlets

A "driven" person pursues activities uncommonly.
their "drive" exhibits itself in a number of outlets.
remove one outlet and another will emerge.

many successful artists and businesspeople are obsessive

A reformed alcoholic may preach relentlessly on the evils of drink.
he is still obsessive, just about something else now.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Aug 8^th, 2011 at 9:29pm:

normally obsessions do not come as an individual item. they are packaged together with a few outlets A "driven" person pursues activities uncommonly. their "drive" exhibits itself in a number of outlets. remove one outlet and another will emerge. many successful artists and businesspeople are obsessive A reformed alcoholic may preach relentlessly on the evils of drink. he is still obsessive, just about something else now.

Am delighted to agree on something :-)

Karnal wrote on Aug 8^th, 2011 at 3:33pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Aug 8th, 2011 at 9:15am: Quote: Karnal wrote True, but instinct is driven by habit, which initially, is conscious thought. We chose to do things a few times, they become habit, then instinct, then over a few generations, genetics. Painters and musicians, gamblers and alcoholics sometimes pass these traits on. The sins of the father are visited upon the son. [quote]Helian wrote No one chooses to get into the habit of the sex drive. Guess you haven't heard that a standing cock has no conscience. Both good points. I think Karnal is right in that instinct is deeply ingrained habit, and that after, say, hundreds of years it becomes "genetic". Our most frequent habits are the oldest instincts. Like the desire for group association and protection is probably as old as human beings themselves. But, I think Helian has a point that the sex drive must be primordial. Otherwise, we get stuck in a regress argument whereby human beings were taught by some "thing" external to themselves on how and why to reproduce. In short, if the sex drive is not innate, it must come from without. This doesn't make sense as it makes human beings out to be empty vessels waiting to be filled with information, and only then can it act at all. (If it is true we are empty vessels then the regress argument falls into further problems, like, how does the human learn? Is learning how to learn taught as well? If so, then we must learn how to learn on learning, and so on ad infinitum. Contrary to this, human beings must be primordially equipped with something like "grasping mechanisms"). The idea of the sex drive being the motor of existence isn't old. I am sure Plato stated eros was the basis of all life.

Freud thought eros was learned - through unconscious systems like the Oedepal Complex. Sometimes though, things go awry and you get fetishes.

Drug addicts have a similar instinct towards drugs. Some have them towards money. I know sex seems more compulsive than other drives, but try going without food for a while. This is why people in religious and spiritual traditions fast. You can learn about your instincts, and you can learn how to overcome them - but they are not "you".

Our instincts are not as powerful as evolutionary biology gives them credit for. Nor are they are not the basis for our identity, as sexual politics would have you believe.

Instincts CAN be changed - or at the very least, known.[/quote]


If everything is "learned" then everything has been formed from without. Under this scenario the human being is just a receiver of forms. If that is true, who or what creates the forms?

This is the problem confronting the believers of the tabula rasa.

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Aug 9^th, 2011 at 7:01pm:

If everything is "learned" then everything has been formed from without. Under this scenario the human being is just a receiver of forms. If that is true, who or what creates the forms? This is the problem confronting the believers of the tabula rasa.

I don't believe that everything is learned.  There is a balance between 'nature' and 'nurture' in just about everything. There are certain predispositions ingrained in our genetics, and superimposed on that is the 'plastic' brain.  The extent to which these factors influence behaviour is an individual attribute.

Grey wrote on Aug 8^th, 2011 at 9:31pm:

Sprintcyclist wrote on Aug 8th, 2011 at 9:29pm: normally obsessions do not come as an individual item. they are packaged together with a few outlets A "driven" person pursues activities uncommonly. their "drive" exhibits itself in a number of outlets. remove one outlet and another will emerge. many successful artists and businesspeople are obsessive A reformed alcoholic may preach relentlessly on the evils of drink. he is still obsessive, just about something else now. Am delighted to agree on something :-)

yes, it's a bit of a rareity

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYWK_yEXWZE&feature=related

The Divinyls - Elsie

Why copy and paste the myriads?

When you can just copy the cause?

Makes me laugh a trifle, man.