Quote:

Change of attitude needed as debate overheats BY ROSSLYN BEEBY 14 Jun, 2011 04:00 AM An excess of vitriol has led to a climate of fear among scientists. What are the essential qualities of a good debate? According to the Kettering Foundation - a United States think tank that explores issues of democracy - good debate is characterised by broad participation, civility, diversity of views and a willingness to consider opposing arguments and re-examine one's own. Good debate is not about personal attacks or ''bully pulpit'' generalisations. Just over a week ago, The Canberra Times published a story revealing Australia's climate scientists are being targeted by ''a vicious unrelenting email campaign that has resulted in police investigations of death threats''. It's been interesting to watch, and read, the reaction. Seriously, who could condone abusive, violent threats against Australia's scientists? Or, apparently taking their cue from the kind of sexist comments that launched the global Slutwalk phenomenon, argue those arrogant climate scientists are just asking for it? Naturally, there are opposing views on climate change and the Gillard Government's proposed carbon tax, just as there were opposing views on the introduction of a goods and services tax. But it's possible to disagree with dignity. Various bloggers have accused us of ''beating up'' our front-page story from a handful of complaints. Not so. We spoke to more than 30 scientists, in all states and territories, to ascertain if threats were confined to pockets of high-profile scientists regularly quoted by the media. They were not. It seems anyone speaking up on climate change - however briefly - is fair game in this trolling campaign. Two of the most shocking cases involved young women who have had little media experience or exposure. One was invited to speak on climate change at a suburban library. Her brief was simple - talk about everyday things people can do to cut their carbon footprint, talk about climate books available at the library (list provided), leave time for questions, and mingle afterwards. The other woman was asked by a local newspaper to pose with her young children for a photograph to illustrate an article promoting a community tree-planting event. She was briefly quoted as saying planting trees could help mitigate climate change. Two days after the article appeared, she received emails containing threats of sexual assault and violence against her children. As for the woman speaking at the library, her car windscreen was smeared with excrement - animal or human, does it matter? - and the words ''climate turd'' written (also in excrement) across the car bonnet. Proof perhaps, of a climate dissenter with a Freudian complex indicating arrested development. These vile attacks were intended to intimidate. Why not raise a difference of opinion during the half-hour of coffee and chat after the library talk? Why send abusive emails to a young woman whose photograph illustrates a chatty story in the back pages of a regional newspaper? Several bloggers who dispute the reality of climate change have disputed the veracity of these threats. Opposition science spokeswoman Sophie Mirabella issued a statement claiming, ''the apparently false allegation of death threats have diminished the individuals involved and reflect poorly on the scientific community''. False allegation? Who did she speak to? Apparently not the climate scientist who has been advised by state police to install a panic button in his office after receiving death threats. Or to the scientist who had his house vandalised (hence police advice to install video surveillance), or the researcher who received an email, with a marksman's target superimposed on his photo. Sorry Sophie, none of this behaviour is acceptable.

Quote:

The unpleasant reality is several universities across Australia have been forced to upgrade security to protect scientists. This has ranged from deleting phone numbers from websites and removing names from faculty notice boards, to installing multiple card-swipe entries, office doors protected by punch-in codes, and moving researchers to areas with secure lifts. The Australian National University's former Vice-Chancellor Professor Ian Chubb confirmed the university moved several researchers to secure buildings after threats to their personal safety. Did these threats occur, as claimed by Herald Sun blogger Andrew Bolt ''five or six years ago''? No. An email from the ANU media office confirms, ''the university took the decision last year''. Have the threats abated? Not according to the majority of scientists we contacted. Two weeks ago, when ANU economist Professor Ross Garnaut published the final report in his climate update, many scientists said their computers and mobile phones were flooded with spam emails and texts, many abusive or defamatory. And that's how we came across the story. There was no ''exquisitely timed'' release of information as claimed by one climate sceptic's blog. There was no conspiracy, rather it was just a chance catch-up call that yielded an unexpected result. We rang a contact (an ecologist) on his landline as he was furiously - in both senses of the word - deleting spam from his mobile. All political parties should condemn these attacks on our scientists. And to his credit - and despite his dissenting views on climate change - Nationals Senator Barnaby Joyce did so, saying no one deserved such tactics. Dissent should not exclude reason or respect. Rosslyn Beeby is science and environment reporter.

;D ;D ;D


WELL WHAT DO YOU EXPECT ASTRO SURF  GIVEN THAT PEOPLE THESE DAYS ARE FACING SUCH ISSUES AS THE RISE OF THE COST OF LIVING, THROUGH PRICE RISES IN GROCERIES, FUEL, ELECTRICITY BILLS

AND ON TOP OF THAT WE HAVE A LYING GOVERNMENT THAT WANTS TO IMPOSE MORE POTENTIAL FINANCIAL DIFICULTIES THROUGH A CARBON TAX ????


WHAT DID YOU EXPECT, ARE THE LEFT THAT IGNORANT ????  ;D ;D

As long as JuLIAR Gilliard continues to push the carbon tax forward, it will get more HEATED,


THE POWER OF HER LIE IS WHAT GETTING ALOT OF AUSTRALIANS HEATED UP.

stryder wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 12:51pm:

;D ;D ;D [font=Tahoma][size=20]EOPLE THESE DAYS ARE FACING SUCH ISSUES AS THE RISE OF THE COST OF LIVING, THROUGH PRICE RISES IN GROCERIES, FUEL, ELECTRICITY BILLS

You condone threats and intimidation against people you disagree with. Thanks for amply proving the point of the article. You're a disgrace. People like you have no place in Australian democracy.

Quote:

You condone threats and intimidation against people you disagree with. Thanks for amply proving the point of the article. You're a disgrace. People like you have no place in Australian democracy.

YOU LEFTIES DO IT AS WELL AMONG OTHER ISSUES

What hypocrisy,  ;D ;D

stryder wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 12:57pm:

Quote: You condone threats and intimidation against people you disagree with. Thanks for amply proving the point of the article. You're a disgrace. People like you have no place in Australian democracy. YOU LEFTIES DO IT AS WELL AMONG ISSUES

NO I DON'T, YOU LIAR, I AM NOT "THE LEFT", I HAVE NMEVER CONDONED VIOLENT LANGUAGE IN POLITICS. WHEN SOMEONE FINALLY DOES GET HURT YOUR ACOLYTES ;LIKE JONES, BOLT, ABBOTT AND MIRABELLA WILL ONLY HAVE THEMSLEVES TO BLAME.

WHEREAS IDIOTS LIKE YOU ARE THE ONES LIKELY TO HURT SOMEONE. WE SHOULD DEPORT PEOPLE LIKE YOU. YOU HAVE NO PLACE IN THIS DEMOCRACY.

AS FAR AS I AM CONCERNED, WHEN WE HAVE A LYING GOVERNMENT WHO LISTENS TO SCIENTISTS WHO ARE POLITICALLY MOTIVATED ENOUGH TO THERE TAXATION CAUSE, TO SUGGEST THIS FAULTY SCIENCE BEHIND CLIMATE CHANGE. over the wishes of the australian people, prepare for what you deserve.


The arrogance of the lefties is soooo silly, ASTRO SURF YOU ARE PROVING THAT ALL THE TIME, AS WELL AS BEING A FLAWED THINKING PERSON.

Quote:

NO I DON'T, YOU LIAR, I AM NOT "THE LEFT", I HAVE NMEVER CONDONED VIOLENT LANGUAGE IN POLITICS

by Astro surf

IM NOT IMPLYING YOU PERSONALLY ASTRO SURF, BUT OTHER LEFTIES DO RESORT TO EXTREMISM AS WELL AS PEOPLE FROM THE RIGHT

stryder wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 1:06pm:

prepare for what you deserve

Yes, you're a disgrace, you have already demonstrated that you are happy to cheer on threats of violence and intimidation. You're a coward. You are not an Australian, you should be shipped off to Malaysia or Nauru or something

stryder wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 1:10pm:

Quote: NO I DON'T, YOU LIAR, I AM NOT "THE LEFT", I HAVE NMEVER CONDONED VIOLENT LANGUAGE IN POLITICS by Astro surf IM NOT IMPLYING YOU PERSONALLY ASTRO SURF, BUT OTHER LEFTIES DO RESORT TO EXTREMISM AS WELL AS PEOPLE FROM THE RIGHT

You are implying that it is a-OK to threaten and intimidate people with whom you disagree. There is no room for people like you in Australian politics

astro_surf wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 1:12pm:

stryder wrote on Jun 18th, 2011 at 1:10pm: Quote: NO I DON'T, YOU LIAR, I AM NOT "THE LEFT", I HAVE NMEVER CONDONED VIOLENT LANGUAGE IN POLITICS by Astro surf IM NOT IMPLYING YOU PERSONALLY ASTRO SURF, BUT OTHER LEFTIES DO RESORT TO EXTREMISM AS WELL AS PEOPLE FROM THE RIGHT You are implying that it is a-OK to threaten and intimidate people with whom you disagree. There is no room for people like you in Australian politics

You are not an Australian, you should be shipped off to Malaysia or Nauru or something   IS that a threat    ;)

Quote:

WHEREAS IDIOTS LIKE YOU ARE THE ONES LIKELY TO HURT SOMEONE. WE SHOULD DEPORT PEOPLE LIKE YOU. YOU HAVE NO PLACE IN THIS DEMOCRACY.

;D ;D ;D ;D

I cannot believe how much of a TWIT you are until this moment ASTRO SURF when I read this.


TAKE A CHILL PILL ASTRO SURF BECAUSE YOU ARE EMMITTING TOO MUCH CARBON CRAP HERE


First Im not suggesting that I support extremist behaviour in any shape or form, BUT I UNDERSTAND THE ANGER AGAINST JULIAR GILLIARD WHO LIED OVER THE CARBON TAX, AND THE THREAT OF IT IMPOSED GIVEN THAT RISING COST OF LIVING IS A BIG ISSUE IN THE MIDDLE OF IT


I UNDERSTAND THE ANGER, BUT I DONT SUPPORT DANGEROUS EXTREMIST VOLIENCE,

COMPREDENDO, UNDERSTAND ????

stryder wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 12:51pm:

;D ;D ;D WELL WHAT DO YOU EXPECT ASTRO SURF  GIVEN THAT PEOPLE THESE DAYS ARE FACING SUCH ISSUES AS THE RISE OF THE COST OF LIVING, THROUGH PRICE RISES IN GROCERIES, FUEL, ELECTRICITY BILLS AND ON TOP OF THAT WE HAVE A LYING GOVERNMENT THAT WANTS TO IMPOSE MORE POTENTIAL FINANCIAL DIFICULTIES THROUGH A CARBON TAX ???? WHAT DID YOU EXPECT, ARE THE LEFT THAT IGNORANT ????  ;D ;D

Right..so it's okay to poo on someone's car because you're facing cost of living pressure?  You really are an idiot stryder. Really, really, are a complete baffoon.  

Quote:

Right..so it's okay to poo on someone's car because you're facing cost of living pressure?  You really are an idiot stryder. Really, really, are a complete baffoon.

By Alevine

IS IT OK TO MAKE DEATH THREATS AGAINST PETER RIETH BECAUSE OF HIS POSITION IN THE WATERFRONT DISPUTE ???


IS IT OK TO MAKE DEATH THREATS AGAINST PHILLIP RUDDOCK OVER HIS POSITION ON THE BOAT PEOPLE ISSUE IN THAT TIME ????


YOU TELL ME ALEVINE HOW MANY LEFTIES HAD A DISPUTE WITH THAT ????????

ALL ABOARD THE CLIMATE HOAX GRAVY TRAIN

Looking for a high-paying career? Well how about becoming a climate scientist? According to an article in National Review entitled “All aboard the climate gravy train,” author Ian Murray explains that while global warming advocates like to portray climate scientists as poorly paid academics, immune to the influence of money, climate science has actually become one of the highest paid professions in America. He notes that while firefighters average about $21 per hour and university professors around $50, climate scientists average about $73 per hour, making it the third highest-paid public sector job, ranking even above judges. So apparently, there is a lot of “green” floating around environmental science after all.

Well what can one say to this comment. You really are quite spot on. Debate in this country and for that matter this forum has deteriorated to a point where I really have completely lost hope.

A few years ago I thought it would be good to join a forum so as to discuss issues that mattered and improve my education of the facts and find a mature debate that helped me to understand what are usually complex issues.

To my horror I found none of this, misinformation and extremist attitudes that rarely had anything to do with the subject but rather with the hugh divid that has developed in Australian society. The first site I used wore me down until one particular poster who constantly flooded the site with threads based on Murdoch news paper articles drove me so insane I could not see any point in continuing. There was no debate simply a campaign to relentlessly drive an opinion on to every mind that would give in.

I changed to this site looking for a fresh start and unfortunately have found more or less the same problem. Too few start too many threads about the same things using poor quality sources that they believe in religiously. It is sad and all that is achieved is a very poor quality debate, in fact it is not debate at all.

I find that I am constantly pigeon holed as a lefty, well I suppose to a degree I am, I believe in common decency, human rights and the need to look after each other. I don't have an issue paying for it, so yes I suppose I am a lefty in the eyes of many. Funny though I have always been a swinging voter.

The current state of debate in all spheres of this countries fabric has become divided by anger, hate, extremism and misinformation. We cannot put our head in the sand and pretend that this can be this way or that when they are not. I have seen and heard things said and done that really concern me as to the state of mind of the general Australian public.

Many years ago I was honoured to enjoy a day walking the streets of old Munich in Bavaria with the grandmother of a close friend. She had been a member of the German communist party in the 1920's where she met her husband. They were active politically as was the world at that time but Germany was in great turmoil and depression after WW1. She and her husband were lucky they recognised what Hitler was early and withdrew from the communist party saving themselves the pain of the camps, they also realised to shut up and stop descenting. She told me of her regrets as she watch her friends and family fall in love with the Nazi's and then descend into fear as they saw what was happening. The debate was smothered and behaviour like hate of minority groups, science, religion and truth was encouraged and self-indulgence prevailed.

Keeping it in balance, I see so much of this in our own society, hate of people and religious groups that don't suit, suppression of idea's and understanding and a stifled debate. I fear for my home and where we are headed, I question the values that seem to be rising and the lack of awareness we have of fact over popular belief. In the end I even find myself feeling angry at some of the posting and have had a go too. I think I will leave it alone for a while, delete the site off my computer and try and clear my thinking as the current debate simply scares me as it lacks accountable truth and honourable behaviour.

stryder wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 1:33pm:

Quote: Right..so it's okay to poo on someone's car because you're facing cost of living pressure?  You really are an idiot stryder. Really, really, are a complete baffoon. By Alevine IS IT OK TO MAKE DEATH THREATS AGAINST PETER RIETH BECAUSE OF HIS POSITION IN THE WATERFRONT DISPUTE ??? IS IT OK TO MAKE DEATH THREATS AGAINST PHILLIP RUDDOCK OVER HIS POSITION ON THE BOAT PEOPLE ISSUE IN THAT TIME ???? YOU TELL ME ALEVINE HOW MANY LEFTIES HAD A DISPUTE WITH THAT ????????

Extremes on both sides, never been disputed.  The one thing I'll say though is that unlike you, I don't condone the extreme on my side of politics, and make excuses for it.  By doing so, my friend, you show yourself to be a part of that extreme.  And for that, I truly pity you.

Quote:

You really are an idiot stryder. Really, really, are a complete baffoon.   Back to top

And you have a first class idiocy within you alevine, that would shake any human being to realise to never ever reach THAT LEVEL.

Quote:

The one thing I'll say though is that unlike you, I don't condone the extreme on my side of politics, and make excuses for it.  By doing so, my friend, you show yourself to be a part of that extreme.  And for that, I truly pity you.

By alevine

You see how much of an idiot you are IT REALLY FLOWS IN YOUR POSTS, I SAID I UNDERSTAND THE ANGER BEHIND PEOPLE WHO FEEL ANGRY WITH GILLIAD, THE GREENS, THE POLITICAL MOTIVATED SCIENTISTS, THE INDEPENDENTS, and yes POOING ON SOMEONES CAR IS SOMEWHAT EXTREME,  ;D ;D ;D

But I dont support dangerous extreme behavior, NOW IF YOU CANT ACCEPT THAT, THEN GO TO HELL

stryder wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 1:48pm:

Quote: The one thing I'll say though is that unlike you, I don't condone the extreme on my side of politics, and make excuses for it.  By doing so, my friend, you show yourself to be a part of that extreme.  And for that, I truly pity you.       By alevine You see how much of an idiot you are IT REALLY FLOWS IN YOUR POSTS, I SAID I UNDERSTAND THE ANGER BEHIND PEOPLE WHO FEEL ANGRY WITH GILLIAD, THE GREENS, THE POLITICAL MOTIVATED SCIENTISTS, THE INDEPENDENTS, and yes POOING ON SOMEONES CAR IS SOMEWHAT EXTREME,  ;D ;D ;D But I dont support dangerous extreme behavior, NOW IF YOU CANT ACCEPT THAT, THEN GO TO HELL

It's good to see that when you are shown the errors in your thinking you quickly backtrack.  Perhaps some level of rational thought still exists in you.  It's a pity however that you can't realise your extremes until such a time as someone else picks up on it.  Oh well.

I sincerely hope you obtain some serious help, stryder. Especially if originally you believe it acceptable to poo on someones car because of anger.  And I hope you don't do it yourself.

stryder wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 1:33pm:

Quote: Right..so it's okay to poo on someone's car because you're facing cost of living pressure?  You really are an idiot stryder. Really, really, are a complete baffoon. By Alevine IS IT OK TO MAKE DEATH THREATS AGAINST PETER RIETH BECAUSE OF HIS POSITION IN THE WATERFRONT DISPUTE ??? IS IT OK TO MAKE DEATH THREATS AGAINST PHILLIP RUDDOCK OVER HIS POSITION ON THE BOAT PEOPLE ISSUE IN THAT TIME ???? YOU TELL ME ALEVINE HOW MANY LEFTIES HAD A DISPUTE WITH THAT ????????

Is it ok to threaten anyone with physical or mental harm &/or death, no matter what their Political affiliations?

Is it ok to lie, twist, spin & misdirect for the short term Policitcal & financial gain of some at the expense of the longer term loss of others?

The answer is NO!

perceptions_now wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 2:05pm:

stryder wrote on Jun 18th, 2011 at 1:33pm: Quote: Right..so it's okay to poo on someone's car because you're facing cost of living pressure?  You really are an idiot stryder. Really, really, are a complete baffoon. By Alevine IS IT OK TO MAKE DEATH THREATS AGAINST PETER RIETH BECAUSE OF HIS POSITION IN THE WATERFRONT DISPUTE ??? IS IT OK TO MAKE DEATH THREATS AGAINST PHILLIP RUDDOCK OVER HIS POSITION ON THE BOAT PEOPLE ISSUE IN THAT TIME ???? YOU TELL ME ALEVINE HOW MANY LEFTIES HAD A DISPUTE WITH THAT ???????? Is it ok to threaten anyone with physical or mental harm &/or death, no matter what their Political affiliations? Is it ok to lie, twist, spin & misdirect for the short term Policitcal & financial gain of some at the expense of the longer term loss of others? The answer is NO!

Btw, has anyone had a look at how our Politicans perform, all of them?

I suspect they may fall a little short, in some of the above!  

Quote:

I sincerely hope you obtain some serious help, stryder. Especially if originally you believe it acceptable to poo on someones car because of anger.  And I hope you don't do it yourself.

GET A HOLD OF YOURSELF, ALEVINE

WELL IT COULD HAVE BEEN WORSE, THEY COULD HAVE SLIT THE TRYES, SCRATCH THE PAINT, THROW A BRICK AND SMASH THE WINDSCREEN.


For all we know it was a just a bit of pooooooh, never mind just go to and find a nearest car wash at a service station AND JUST WASH IT OFF  ;D ;D ;D ;D

stryder wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 2:09pm:

GET A HOLD OF YOURSELF, ALEVINE WELL IT COULD HAVE BEEN WORSE, THEY COULD HAVE SLIT THE TRYES, SCRATCH THE PAINT, THROW A BRICK AND SMASH THE WINDSCREEN. For all we know it was a just a bit of pooooooh, never mind just go to and find a nearest car wash at a service station AND JUST WASH IT OFF  ;D ;D ;D ;D

So, by your thinking it's okay to poo on someones property because it can easily be washed off?

Once again, go get some help, stryder. Seriously, mate.

Quote:

Once again, go get some help, stryder. Seriously, mate.

;D ;D ;D CAN YOU BELIEVE THIS ????

I WONDER HOW MANY TIMES HAVE LEFTIES LAUNCHED EXCREMENTS IN EXTREME PROTESTING ???? Alevine

stryder wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 2:15pm:

;D ;D ;D CAN YOU BELIEVE THIS ???? I WONDER HOW MANY TIMES HAVE LEFTIES LAUNCHED EXCREMENTS IN EXTREME PROTESTING ???? Alevine

Once again, the difference between me and you is that I don't condone it.  Hence why I suggest you get yourself some help.

PS: please stop shouting. Your high-pitched shrieking voice is not helping anyone.

I WONDER HOW MANY TIMES HAVE LEFTIES LAUNCHED EXCREMENTS IN EXTREME PROTESTING ???? Alevine




Cancun climate protesters throw feces, destroy property  | Print |   E-mail  
Written by Alex Newman    
Sunday, 12 December 2010 13:00  
0Global-warming protesters in Cancun for the United Nations COP16 climate summit poured human feces in the streets, threw eggs at police, attacked American fast-food establishments, and generally went on a rampage demanding “action” and “climate justice,” among other things.

Mexican riot police were out in force, some of them driving military trucks with machine guns attached. But unlike the summit in Copenhagen last year — where police were lambasted in the press for beating and caging out-of-control climate marauders — so far there have not been reports of impropriety or police misconduct. Estimates for the larger demonstrations in Cancun put the figure at around 1,500, however — much smaller than the crowds at the COP15.

A McDonald's restaurant was one of the targets. It was spray painted by masked climate vandals dressed in all-black costumes. Other protesters used what was described by a German media outlet as human waste to make their point. But some of the activists, however wrong they might have been, were at least more civilized.

As usual, protestors representing all sorts of causes and organizations were present at the confab. They included anti-globalization demonstrators, communists waving flags featuring mass-murderer Ernesto “Che” Guevara, save-the-trees types, native American groups, and countless more. Most were upset about different aspects of the “climate” negotiations going on inside — secrecy, bullying, exclusion, bribes, and countless other problems — and were there to demand some sort of remedy. Others were simply upset with “capitalism.”

http://www.thenewamerican.com/tech-mainmenu-30/environment/5484-cancun-climate-protesters-throw-feces-destroy-property

stryder wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 2:24pm:

I WONDER HOW MANY TIMES HAVE LEFTIES LAUNCHED EXCREMENTS IN EXTREME PROTESTING ???? Alevine Cancun climate protesters throw feces, destroy property  | Print |   E-mail   Written by Alex Newman     Sunday, 12 December 2010 13:00   0Global-warming protesters in Cancun for the United Nations COP16 climate summit poured human feces in the streets, threw eggs at police, attacked American fast-food establishments, and generally went on a rampage demanding “action” and “climate justice,” among other things. Mexican riot police were out in force, some of them driving military trucks with machine guns attached. But unlike the summit in Copenhagen last year — where police were lambasted in the press for beating and caging out-of-control climate marauders — so far there have not been reports of impropriety or police misconduct. Estimates for the larger demonstrations in Cancun put the figure at around 1,500, however — much smaller than the crowds at the COP15. A McDonald's restaurant was one of the targets. It was spray painted by masked climate vandals dressed in all-black costumes. Other protesters used what was described by a German media outlet as human waste to make their point. But some of the activists, however wrong they might have been, were at least more civilized. As usual, protestors representing all sorts of causes and organizations were present at the confab. They included anti-globalization demonstrators, communists waving flags featuring mass-murderer Ernesto “Che” Guevara, save-the-trees types, native American groups, and countless more. Most were upset about different aspects of the “climate” negotiations going on inside — secrecy, bullying, exclusion, bribes, and countless other problems — and were there to demand some sort of remedy. Others were simply upset with “capitalism.” http://www.thenewamerican.com/tech-mainmenu-30/environment/5484-cancun-climate-protesters-throw-feces-destroy-property

Once again, the difference between me and you is that I don't condone it.  Hence why I suggest you get yourself some help.

PS: please stop shouting. Your high-pitched shrieking voice is not helping anyone.

Maeve wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 1:34pm:

ALL ABOARD THE CLIMATE HOAX GRAVY TRAIN Looking for a high-paying career? Well how about becoming a climate scientist? According to an article in National Review entitled “All aboard the climate gravy train,” author Ian Murray explains that while global warming advocates like to portray climate scientists as poorly paid academics, immune to the influence of money, climate science has actually become one of the highest paid professions in America. He notes that while firefighters average about $21 per hour and university professors around $50, climate scientists average about $73 per hour, making it the third highest-paid public sector job, ranking even above judges. So apparently, there is a lot of “green” floating around environmental science after all.

Exactly and this is why many of us remain sceptical.  AGW has become a religion and some so-called scientists are doing very well from it at the expense of real science projects.

As for this story, again I am sceptical.  It seems the warmies are trotting out this sort of extremist tale in some desperate attempt to garner sympathy for their yet unproven cause.  Just recently Astro surf (I think) trotted out a story written by little Graham Readfearn which had been discredited by those who were aware he lifted much of his scary scientists-receive-death-threats from a piece the wonderfully erudite Green, Professor Clive Hamilton, wrote over 12 months ago.

I remain sceptical about the entire "dangerous" global warming catastrophe, including media whip-ups from those who wish to change the world for the worst.

By the way, I wonder if we will actually enter another Maunder Minimum now the Sun seems to have decided to take a bit of a holiday?   :)

nairbe wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 1:38pm:

Well what can one say to this comment. You really are quite spot on. Debate in this country and for that matter this forum has deteriorated to a point where I really have completely lost hope. A few years ago I thought it would be good to join a forum so as to discuss issues that mattered and improve my education of the facts and find a mature debate that helped me to understand what are usually complex issues. To my horror I found none of this, misinformation and extremist attitudes that rarely had anything to do with the subject but rather with the hugh divid that has developed in Australian society. The first site I used wore me down until one particular poster who constantly flooded the site with threads based on Murdoch news paper articles drove me so insane I could not see any point in continuing. There was no debate simply a campaign to relentlessly drive an opinion on to every mind that would give in. I changed to this site looking for a fresh start and unfortunately have found more or less the same problem. Too few start too many threads about the same things using poor quality sources that they believe in religiously. It is sad and all that is achieved is a very poor quality debate, in fact it is not debate at all. I find that I am constantly pigeon holed as a lefty, well I suppose to a degree I am, I believe in common decency, human rights and the need to look after each other. I don't have an issue paying for it, so yes I suppose I am a lefty in the eyes of many. Funny though I have always been a swinging voter. The current state of debate in all spheres of this countries fabric has become divided by anger, hate, extremism and misinformation. We cannot put our head in the sand and pretend that this can be this way or that when they are not. I have seen and heard things said and done that really concern me as to the state of mind of the general Australian public. Many years ago I was honoured to enjoy a day walking the streets of old Munich in Bavaria with the grandmother of a close friend. She had been a member of the German communist party in the 1920's where she met her husband. They were active politically as was the world at that time but Germany was in great turmoil and depression after WW1. She and her husband were lucky they recognised what Hitler was early and withdrew from the communist party saving themselves the pain of the camps, they also realised to shut up and stop descenting. She told me of her regrets as she watch her friends and family fall in love with the Nazi's and then descend into fear as they saw what was happening. The debate was smothered and behaviour like hate of minority groups, science, religion and truth was encouraged and self-indulgence prevailed. Keeping it in balance, I see so much of this in our own society, hate of people and religious groups that don't suit, suppression of idea's and understanding and a stifled debate. I fear for my home and where we are headed, I question the values that seem to be rising and the lack of awareness we have of fact over popular belief. In the end I even find myself feeling angry at some of the posting and have had a go too. I think I will leave it alone for a while, delete the site off my computer and try and clear my thinking as the current debate simply scares me as it lacks accountable truth and honourable behaviour.

You are not an island with these thoughts and fears :(

The pigeon-holing of people into "Right" and "Left" - then just cheerleading for "your side" is the biggest frustration.

People seem incapable of holding their own opinions anymore.

Quote:

PS: please stop shouting. Your high-pitched shrieking voice is not helping anyone.

Didnt know silence can be sooo deafening.


YOUR BEING THE IDIOT HERE ALEVINE FOR REFUSING TO REALISE THE SCALE OF WHAT JULIAR GILLIARD AND LABOR HAVE DONE IN GENERATING THIS ANGER.

stryder wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 2:30pm:

Quote: PS: please stop shouting. Your high-pitched shrieking voice is not helping anyone. Didnt know silence can be sooo deafening. YOUR BEING THE IDIOT HERE ALEVINE FOR REFUSING TO REALISE THE SCALE OF WHAT JULIAR GILLIARD AND LABOR HAVE DONE IN GENERATING THIS ANGER.

You've always been angry shouty
IT'S WHY WE LOVE YOU :-*

stryder wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 2:30pm:

Quote: PS: please stop shouting. Your high-pitched shrieking voice is not helping anyone. Didnt know silence can be sooo deafening. YOUR BEING THE IDIOT HERE ALEVINE FOR REFUSING TO REALISE THE SCALE OF WHAT JULIAR GILLIARD AND LABOR HAVE DONE IN GENERATING THIS ANGER.

Why are you being so defensive stryder? Did I pick correctly that you have a high-pitched shrieking voice?  

Or are you just upset because I happen to disagree with your belief in handling poo when you are angry?  

Quote:

Why are you being so defensive stryder? Did I pick correctly that you have a high-pitched shrieking voice?   Or are you just upset because I happen to disagree with your belief in handling poo when you are angry?

YOU SHOULD KNOW ALREADY BY NOW ALEVINE, I find great comfort in making my points in CAP LOCKS,  ;D ;D ;D

ITS NOTHING PERSONAL AGAINST YOU. ?

Quote:

You've always been angry shouty IT'S WHY WE LOVE YOU

By Dsmithy


MEEEEE, NEVER LOVED YOU, NOT IN A LONG TIME,  ;D ;D ;D

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 2:26pm:

nairbe wrote on Jun 18th, 2011 at 1:38pm: Well what can one say to this comment. You really are quite spot on. Debate in this country and for that matter this forum has deteriorated to a point where I really have completely lost hope. A few years ago I thought it would be good to join a forum so as to discuss issues that mattered and improve my education of the facts and find a mature debate that helped me to understand what are usually complex issues. To my horror I found none of this, misinformation and extremist attitudes that rarely had anything to do with the subject but rather with the hugh divid that has developed in Australian society. The first site I used wore me down until one particular poster who constantly flooded the site with threads based on Murdoch news paper articles drove me so insane I could not see any point in continuing. There was no debate simply a campaign to relentlessly drive an opinion on to every mind that would give in. I changed to this site looking for a fresh start and unfortunately have found more or less the same problem. Too few start too many threads about the same things using poor quality sources that they believe in religiously. It is sad and all that is achieved is a very poor quality debate, in fact it is not debate at all. I find that I am constantly pigeon holed as a lefty, well I suppose to a degree I am, I believe in common decency, human rights and the need to look after each other. I don't have an issue paying for it, so yes I suppose I am a lefty in the eyes of many. Funny though I have always been a swinging voter. The current state of debate in all spheres of this countries fabric has become divided by anger, hate, extremism and misinformation. We cannot put our head in the sand and pretend that this can be this way or that when they are not. I have seen and heard things said and done that really concern me as to the state of mind of the general Australian public. Many years ago I was honoured to enjoy a day walking the streets of old Munich in Bavaria with the grandmother of a close friend. She had been a member of the German communist party in the 1920's where she met her husband. They were active politically as was the world at that time but Germany was in great turmoil and depression after WW1. She and her husband were lucky they recognised what Hitler was early and withdrew from the communist party saving themselves the pain of the camps, they also realised to shut up and stop descenting. She told me of her regrets as she watch her friends and family fall in love with the Nazi's and then descend into fear as they saw what was happening. The debate was smothered and behaviour like hate of minority groups, science, religion and truth was encouraged and self-indulgence prevailed. Keeping it in balance, I see so much of this in our own society, hate of people and religious groups that don't suit, suppression of idea's and understanding and a stifled debate. I fear for my home and where we are headed, I question the values that seem to be rising and the lack of awareness we have of fact over popular belief. In the end I even find myself feeling angry at some of the posting and have had a go too. I think I will leave it alone for a while, delete the site off my computer and try and clear my thinking as the current debate simply scares me as it lacks accountable truth and honourable behaviour. You are not an island with these thoughts and fears :(

Ditto, double ditto!!

stryder wrote on Jun 18^th, 2011 at 2:45pm:

Quote: Why are you being so defensive stryder? Did I pick correctly that you have a high-pitched shrieking voice?   Or are you just upset because I happen to disagree with your belief in handling poo when you are angry? YOU SHOULD KNOW ALREADY BY NOW ALEVINE, I find great comfort in making my points in CAP LOCKS,  ;D ;D ;D ITS NOTHING PERSONAL AGAINST YOU. ?

Never said it was.  Just saying the imagination of a child's high pitched shrieking each time you post is becoming rather annoying. That's all.