http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/20/ipso-2011-ocean-report-mass-extinction_n_880656.html


Quote:

State Of The Ocean: 'Shocking' Report Warns Of Mass Extinction From Current Rate Of Marine Distress If the current actions contributing to a multifaceted degradation of the world's oceans aren't curbed, a mass extinction unlike anything human history has ever seen is coming, an expert panel of scientists warns in an alarming new report. The preliminary report from the International Programme on the State of the Ocean (IPSO) is the result of the first-ever interdisciplinary international workshop examining the combined impact of all of the stressors currently affecting the oceans, including pollution, warming, acidification, overfishing and hypoxia. “The findings are shocking," Dr. Alex Rogers, IPSO's scientific director, said in a statement released by the group. "This is a very serious situation demanding unequivocal action at every level. We are looking at consequences for humankind that will impact in our lifetime, and worse, our children's and generations beyond that." The scientific panel concluded that degeneration in the oceans is happening much faster than has been predicted, and that the combination of factors currently distressing the marine environment is contributing to the precise conditions that have been associated with all major extinctions in the Earth's history. According to the report, three major factors have been present in the handful of mass extinctions that have occurred in the past: an increase of both hypoxia (low oxygen) and anoxia (lack of oxygen that creates "dead zones") in the oceans, warming and acidification. The panel warns that the combination of these factors will inevitably cause a mass marine extinction if swift action isn't taken to improve conditions. The report is the latest of several published in recent months examining the dire conditions of the oceans. A recent World Resources Institute report suggests that all coral reefs could be gone by 2050 if no action is taken to protect them, while a study published earlier this year in BioScience declares oysters as "functionally extinct", their populations decimated by over-harvesting and disease. Just last week scientists forecasted that this year's Gulf "dead zone" will be the largest in history due to increased runoff from the Mississippi River dragging in high levels of nitrates and phosphates from fertilizers. A recent study in the journal Nature, meanwhile, suggests that not only will the next mass extinction be man-made, but that it could already be underway. Unless humans make significant changes to their behavior, that is. The IPSO report calls for such changes, recommending actions in key areas: immediate reduction of CO2 emissions, coordinated efforts to restore marine ecosystems, and universal implementation of the precautionary principle so "activities proceed only if they are shown not to harm the ocean singly or in combination with other activities." The panel also calls for the UN to swiftly introduce an "effective governance of the High Seas." "The challenges for the future of the ocean are vast, but unlike previous generations we know what now needs to happen," Dan Laffoley of the International Union for Conservation of Nature and Natural Resources (IUCN) and co-author of the report said in a press release for the new report. "The time to protect the blue heart of our planet is now, today and urgent."

Listen,  its total madness to listen to qualified people who have spent their life studying that particular field.

Instead listen to grumpy old men like Alan Jones who dont care for facts, and let their political ideology rule their minds.

There is a board for this called 'environment'. That is where all environmentalists hang out.

Doctor Jolly wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 10:23am:

Listen,  its total madness to listen to qualified people who have spent their life studying that particular field. Instead listen to grumpy old men like Alan Jones who dont care for facts, and let their political ideology rule their minds.

Yup, total madness listening to Malthusian Nazi pathological liars and psychopaths... 8-)

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 10:36am:

There is a board for this called 'environment'. That is where all environmentalists hang out.

Does this sort of article detract from your political slant?
Make your life difficult?
This is a direct result of human intervention much like Climate Change which BTW gets about 6 threads a day half of which are started by denialists to dispute scientific findings with mumbo jumbo from a screaming vested interest backed Queen.
You'd like all these difficult to blunt with 3 word statements articles shoved down on an environment board I'm sure but unless Mozzaok decides to move it it STAYS.
Suck it up.

Prevailing wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 10:43am:

Doctor Jolly wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 10:23am: Listen,  its total madness to listen to qualified people who have spent their life studying that particular field. Instead listen to grumpy old men like Alan Jones who dont care for facts, and let their political ideology rule their minds. Yup, total madness listening to Malthusian Nazi pathological liars and psychopaths... 8-)

Morning Prev
On the phone to God again I see

http://a4.l3-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/119/71ca0d9e9ccd2bf6d2a6d3f8adaaeaa7/m.jpg ;D

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 10:58am:

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 10:36am: There is a board for this called 'environment'. That is where all environmentalists hang out. Does this sort of article detract from your political slant? Make your life difficult? This is a direct result of human intervention much like Climate Change which BTW gets about 6 threads a day half of which are started by denialists to dispute scientific findings with mumbo jumbo from a screaming vested interest backed Queen. You'd like all these difficult to blunt with 3 word statements articles shoved down on an environment board I'm sure but unless Mozzaok decides to move it it STAYS. Suck it up.

The article does nothing. The article is not political, it is environmental.

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 11:05am:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 10:58am: progressiveslol wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 10:36am: There is a board for this called 'environment'. That is where all environmentalists hang out. Does this sort of article detract from your political slant? Make your life difficult? This is a direct result of human intervention much like Climate Change which BTW gets about 6 threads a day half of which are started by denialists to dispute scientific findings with mumbo jumbo from a screaming vested interest backed Queen. You'd like all these difficult to blunt with 3 word statements articles shoved down on an environment board I'm sure but unless Mozzaok decides to move it it STAYS. Suck it up. The article does nothing. The article is not political, it is environmental.

Well that just proves you are unable to grasp the bigger picture.
What sort of POLITICAL outcomes would you expect if the world fish stocks disappeared.That's what this article is talking about.
Just because you may only bother with fish every 2nd Wednesday doesn't mean the destruction of the Oceans & everything in them does not have political implications for the Globe.

You pandering to the drama Queen element on here Smithy?

You're as bad as Nemesis, who sees extremes and conspiracies everywhere these days.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 11:13am:

You pandering to the drama Queen element on here Smithy? You're as bad as Nemesis, who sees extremes and conspiracies everywhere these days.

What conspiracy?
I've just posted an article that relies on scientific research to back claims that we are stuffing the oceans even quicker than we thought.
It is others who shout conspiracy about science writing reports for cash, I just thought I'd beat them to it.

Drama Queen please, don't like or believe the article? refute it with facts not name calling.
As for the comparison with Nem, better than some I've seen you compared with. She may be a raving commie but her heart as you well know is in the right place.

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 11:24am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 11:13am: You pandering to the drama Queen element on here Smithy? You're as bad as Nemesis, who sees extremes and conspiracies everywhere these days. What conspiracy? I've just posted an article that relies on scientific research to back claims that we are stuffing the oceans even quicker than we thought. It is others who shout conspiracy about science writing reports for cash, I just thought I'd beat them to it. Drama Queen please, don't like or believe the article? refute it with facts not name calling. As for the comparison with Nem, better than some I've seen you compared with. She may be a raving commie but her heart as you well know is in the right place.

LOL, Smithy...thanks for the backhanded compliment - I think!?

Definitely no raving Commie - Greenie Social Democrat AKA 'Watermelon'!

::)

Coral reefs gone by 2050?
Haven't we heard all this alarmist crap before?
I'm sure they trot these same reports out decade after decade, and still the reef's remain.
Someone wake me up when Godzilla comes back to romperstomp Tokyo again.
2011, must be the year of the Drama Queen.
Get them tiara's on ladies. ;D

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 9:59am:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/06/20/ipso-2011-ocean-report-mass-extinction_n_880656.html Quote: State Of The Ocean: 'Shocking' Report Warns Of Mass Extinction From Current Rate Of Marine Distress If the current actions contributing to a multifaceted degradation of the world's oceans aren't curbed, a mass extinction unlike anything human history has ever seen is coming, an expert panel of scientists warns in an alarming new report. The preliminary report from the International Programme on the State of the Ocean (IPSO) is the result of the first-ever interdisciplinary international workshop examining the combined impact of all of the stressors currently affecting the oceans, including pollution, warming, acidification, overfishing and hypoxia. “The findings are shocking," Dr. Alex Rogers, IPSO's scientific director, said in a statement released by the group. "This is a very serious situation demanding unequivocal action at every level. We are looking at consequences for humankind that will impact in our lifetime, and worse, our children's and generations beyond that." The scientific panel concluded that degeneration in the oceans is happening much faster than has been predicted, and that the combination of factors currently distressing the marine environment is contributing to the precise conditions that have been associated with all major extinctions in the Earth's history. According to the report, three major factors have been present in the handful of mass extinctions that have occurred in the past: an increase of both hypoxia (low oxygen) and anoxia (lack of oxygen that creates "dead zones") in the oceans, warming and acidification. The panel warns that the combination of these factors will inevitably cause a mass marine extinction if swift action isn't taken to improve conditions. The report is the latest of several published in recent months examining the dire conditions of the oceans. A recent World Resources Institute report suggests that all coral reefs could be gone by 2050 if no action is taken to protect them, while a study published earlier this year in BioScience declares oysters as "functionally extinct", their populations decimated by over-harvesting and disease. Just last week scientists forecasted that this year's Gulf "dead zone" will be the largest in history due to increased runoff from the Mississippi River dragging in high levels of nitrates and phosphates from fertilizers. A recent study in the journal Nature, meanwhile, suggests that not only will the next mass extinction be man-made, but that it could already be underway. Unless humans make significant changes to their behavior, that is. The IPSO report calls for such changes, recommending actions in key areas: immediate reduction of CO2 emissions, coordinated efforts to restore marine ecosystems, and universal implementation of the precautionary principle so "activities proceed only if they are shown not to harm the ocean singly or in combination with other activities." The panel also calls for the UN to swiftly introduce an "effective governance of the High Seas." "The challenges for the future of the ocean are vast, but unlike previous generations we know what now needs to happen," Dan Laffoley of the International Union for Conservation of Nature and Natural Resources (IUCN) and co-author of the report said in a press release for the new report. "The time to protect the blue heart of our planet is now, today and urgent."

Oh good, another quote from a right wing rag by a right wing loony who can't voice an opinion.

All he reveals is he himself is a conspiracy, posing as a human.

Hmmmmmmm
Huffington Post - Right wing rag
Dsmithy70 - Right wing looney
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Have you been into the Hot Toddies to try & beat the cold???

So, they have discovered what we have always known, that all life forms are carbon based composition and armed with this proof they can accuse us of being a biological infection  they must save the Earth from through taxation...Good luck with that Adolf Hitler.

But what are you going to do you Nazi basterd when we send our power bills back and seek to have you prosecuted for crimes against humanity.

http://www.elistmania.com/images/articles/147/Original/Adolf_Hitler.jpg :D

Prevailing wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 1:03pm:

So, they have discovered what we have always known, that all life forms are carbon based composition and armed with this proof they can accuse us of being a biological infection  they must save the Earth from through taxation...Good luck with that Adolf Hitler. But what are you going to do you Nazi basterd when we send our power bills back and seek to have you prosecuted for crimes against humanity. http://www.elistmania.com/images/articles/147/Original/Adolf_Hitler.jpg :D

GO SURFING

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjkv29Y5NhE

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 1:14pm:

Prevailing wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 1:03pm: So, they have discovered what we have always known, that all life forms are carbon based composition and armed with this proof they can accuse us of being a biological infection  they must save the Earth from through taxation...Good luck with that Adolf Hitler. But what are you going to do you Nazi basterd when we send our power bills back and seek to have you prosecuted for crimes against humanity. http://www.elistmania.com/images/articles/147/Original/Adolf_Hitler.jpg :D GO SURFING http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjkv29Y5NhE

Ohhh Smithy...I love those clips....I've seen so many variations on that piece of film....

Why put themselves up for the humiliation and rejection when this carbon tax has no future? ;D ;D ;D ;D

By the way, can we get some more threads on the environment please?

There are only 9 on this page at the moment.

Is it me or is everyone obsessed with the fking environment?

Did we spend this amount of time in the 1980s and early 1990s obsessing over this bloody topic.


Geeeez, fair do's some of you need to lighten up and just go and enjoy life a bit.

The joke that is known as the IPCC is being taken over by greenpeace and are giving out unsubstanciated reports and making yet more of a mokery of the IPCC.

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2011/06/16/a-blunder-of-staggering-proportions-by-the-ipcc/

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 11:05am:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 10:58am: progressiveslol wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 10:36am: There is a board for this called 'environment'. That is where all environmentalists hang out. Does this sort of article detract from your political slant? Make your life difficult? This is a direct result of human intervention much like Climate Change which BTW gets about 6 threads a day half of which are started by denialists to dispute scientific findings with mumbo jumbo from a screaming vested interest backed Queen. You'd like all these difficult to blunt with 3 word statements articles shoved down on an environment board I'm sure but unless Mozzaok decides to move it it STAYS. Suck it up. The article does nothing. The article is not political, it is environmental.

You're the ones determined to make AGW a political football, it's a political issue now and we need to highlight the insanity of your position with the reality of the science. Fortunately, with people like creep and prevailing on your side, you guys are doing a pretty good job of that yourselves! ;D

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 4:36pm:

giving out unsubstanciated reports

Unsubstantiated? Really? ::)

http://www.springerlink.com/content/nu354g4p6576l238

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 2:11pm:

Did we spend this amount of time in the 1980s and early 1990s obsessing over this bloody topic.

If we had of done then things wouldn't be so urgent now and we would have moved into the low-carbon economy at a fraction of what it will cost to now. And we probably wouldn't have committed to even a degree of warming.

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 11:24am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 11:13am: You pandering to the drama Queen element on here Smithy? You're as bad as Nemesis, who sees extremes and conspiracies everywhere these days. What conspiracy? I've just posted an article that relies on scientific research to back claims that we are stuffing the oceans even quicker than we thought. It is others who shout conspiracy about science writing reports for cash, I just thought I'd beat them to it. Drama Queen please, don't like or believe the article? refute it with facts not name calling. As for the comparison with Nem, better than some I've seen you compared with. She may be a raving commie but her heart as you well know is in the right place.

-----------------

The scientific panel concluded that degeneration in the oceans is happening much faster than has been predicted, and that the combination of factors currently distressing the marine environment is contributing to the precise conditions that have been associated with all major extinctions in the Earth's history.

-


well reading that smithy   they admit they got it WRONG...

they also admit we had major extinctions long before man arrived..

last week they found another strain of dinosauer..that changed all their thinking about when and where......

now they have a very convenient thing to blame HUMANS..

ok now we sure as hell havent got everything right..no one is denying that...


but I still have yet to read.... what changes this TAX will make to all these problems that mankind is making..


they come up with all thei PANIC..I do not believe we changed the plabet and now the oceans in ten years.. I just do not believe it..

you can you can talk about all the fish disappearing...

but tell us please if you believe that.. how will this TAX stop it happen ig and when will it stop it happening..


and why is your bloody govt taking so long.

to decide that it is happenin g.

and we must spread the PANIC..

yet they cant tell us what when why and how.?

dont forget you have anothe r12 months to wait before ,

 if anything happens...lol

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 2:11pm:

By the way, can we get some more threads on the environment please? There are only 9 on this page at the moment. Is it me or is everyone obsessed with the fking environment? Did we spend this amount of time in the 1980s and early 1990s obsessing over this bloody topic. Geeeez, fair do's some of you need to lighten up and just go and enjoy life a bit.

lol... but but but,.,.. its happening and its happening right now...

PANIC PANIC.DANGER DANGER.

so they post stupid videos to make jokes about the marine life disappearing hilarious..

ITS ONLY MACCA THAT obsesses andrei... leave then alone..

cods wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 10:17pm:

I do not believe we changed the plabet and now the oceans

That's why we call you a "denier", dear, you deny the evidence :)

astro_surf wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 10:25pm:

cods wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 10:17pm: I do not believe we changed the plabet and now the oceans That's why we call you a "denier", dear, you deny the evidence :)

WOW! Is that right??? I have often wondered about that! you are so smart..

cods wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 10:17pm:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 11:24am: Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 11:13am: You pandering to the drama Queen element on here Smithy? You're as bad as Nemesis, who sees extremes and conspiracies everywhere these days. What conspiracy? I've just posted an article that relies on scientific research to back claims that we are stuffing the oceans even quicker than we thought. It is others who shout conspiracy about science writing reports for cash, I just thought I'd beat them to it. Drama Queen please, don't like or believe the article? refute it with facts not name calling. As for the comparison with Nem, better than some I've seen you compared with. She may be a raving commie but her heart as you well know is in the right place. ----------------- The scientific panel concluded that degeneration in the oceans is happening much faster than has been predicted, and that the combination of factors currently distressing the marine environment is contributing to the precise conditions that have been associated with all major extinctions in the Earth's history. - well reading that smithy   they admit they got it WRONG... they also admit we had major extinctions long before man arrived.. last week they found another strain of dinosauer..that changed all their thinking about when and where...... now they have a very convenient thing to blame HUMANS.. ok now we sure as hell havent got everything right..no one is denying that... but I still have yet to read.... what changes this TAX will make to all these problems that mankind is making.. they come up with all thei PANIC..I do not believe we changed the plabet and now the oceans in ten years.. I just do not believe it.. you can you can talk about all the fish disappearing... but tell us please if you believe that.. how will this TAX stop it happen ig and when will it stop it happening.. and why is your bloody govt taking so long. to decide that it is happenin g. and we must spread the PANIC.. yet they cant tell us what when why and how.? dont forget you have anothe r12 months to wait before ,  if anything happens...lol

I understand your upset about a new tax Cods, but frankly to understand the graviety of the issue you need to move past that.
I think you would know that so I won't waste keystrokes with it.

I'm not happy about the way it's been gone about either, but frankly lets look at BOTH options because both parties have a plan (of sorts) which WILL cost us tax dollars.(Unless of course you think Tony wasn't telling the gospel truth and the Direct Action Plan will disappear upon a winning election night)

Labor -
*Yes a tax, but on industry not you personally
* Extra money in your pocket, it will never be enough but the way they stress it, it has to be more than a token effort
*You, whilst not spoilt for choice can choose how that money is spent throughout the extra costs from Industry.
A decidedly liberal philosphy if you really think about it ;)
*Compensation for hardest hit industries to negate (hopefully) some of the increase to consumers.

Liberal-
*Give Industry a bucket load of tax dollars (with no obligation or at least none voiced so far) to maybe decrease their emissions.
Where is that money to be found? It whilst not directly coming out of your purse will come in the form of reduced services, higher cost for goverment services or perhaps a levy, we don't know.
* Planting trees, great idea but where does the land come from?
Aparently I've heard it will require a bucket load of space, sure there's plenty of space in this country but it's already sparce as far as trees go for a reason.


So theirs your choice in a nutshell
Regardless of anything you will PAY MORE for the environment so which would you rather.

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 11:08pm:

cods wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 10:17pm: Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 11:24am: Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 11:13am: You pandering to the drama Queen element on here Smithy? You're as bad as Nemesis, who sees extremes and conspiracies everywhere these days. What conspiracy? I've just posted an article that relies on scientific research to back claims that we are stuffing the oceans even quicker than we thought. It is others who shout conspiracy about science writing reports for cash, I just thought I'd beat them to it. Drama Queen please, don't like or believe the article? refute it with facts not name calling. As for the comparison with Nem, better than some I've seen you compared with. She may be a raving commie but her heart as you well know is in the right place. ----------------- The scientific panel concluded that degeneration in the oceans is happening much faster than has been predicted, and that the combination of factors currently distressing the marine environment is contributing to the precise conditions that have been associated with all major extinctions in the Earth's history. - well reading that smithy   they admit they got it WRONG... they also admit we had major extinctions long before man arrived.. last week they found another strain of dinosauer..that changed all their thinking about when and where...... now they have a very convenient thing to blame HUMANS.. ok now we sure as hell havent got everything right..no one is denying that... but I still have yet to read.... what changes this TAX will make to all these problems that mankind is making.. they come up with all thei PANIC..I do not believe we changed the plabet and now the oceans in ten years.. I just do not believe it.. you can you can talk about all the fish disappearing... but tell us please if you believe that.. how will this TAX stop it happen ig and when will it stop it happening.. and why is your bloody govt taking so long. to decide that it is happenin g. and we must spread the PANIC.. yet they cant tell us what when why and how.? dont forget you have anothe r12 months to wait before ,  if anything happens...lol I understand your upset about a new tax Cods, but frankly to understand the graviety of the issue you need to move past that. I think you would know that so I won't waste keystrokes with it. I'm not happy about the way it's been gone about either, but frankly lets look at BOTH options because both parties have a plan (of sorts) which WILL cost us tax dollars.(Unless of course you think Tony wasn't telling the gospel truth and the Direct Action Plan will disappear upon a winning election night) Labor - *Yes a tax, but on industry not you personally * Extra money in your pocket, it will never be enough but the way they stress it, it has to be more than a token effort *You, whilst not spoilt for choice can choose how that money is spent throughout the extra costs from Industry. A decidedly liberal philosphy if you really think about it ;) *Compensation for hardest hit industries to negate (hopefully) some of the increase to consumers. Liberal- *Give Industry a bucket load of tax dollars (with no obligation or at least none voiced so far) to maybe decrease their emissions. Where is that money to be found? It whilst not directly coming out of your purse will come in the form of reduced services, higher cost for goverment services or perhaps a levy, we don't know. * Planting trees, great idea but where does the land come from? Aparently I've heard it will require a bucket load of space, sure there's plenty of space in this country but it's already sparce as far as trees go for a reason. So theirs your choice in a nutshell Regardless of anything you will PAY MORE for the environment so which would you rather.

yes smithy I get that.... but what I dont get is..

WHAT THE BLOODY HELL THIS TAX WILL DO TO THE ENVIRONMENT

even these scientists dont spell it out what we can expect... and you know it..

they know so much! at least they have convinced you.. so they must be able to say,

well when all industry is using RE..all mines closed..[ which I have noted not one of them has called for].

then we will see such and such happen in such and such time..


smithy I have always said we need TAX we want.. then we have to pay...

this TAX in my mind is just that its another lurk for our world govts to flog the books..

all in name of paranoia and fear.


read you op... we have had 3 major extinctions.. its happened without man being involved... now conveniently its all man made.

and a TAX will stop it all..come on mate..

in the mean time they are still logging the rain forests..we are still allowing them to kill endangered species.. people are still buying ivory and tiger pelts..we still have drugs flying all over the world...

yet we are TAXing the climate and thats  going to fix it.....

yeah right!

cods wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 11:25pm:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 11:08pm: cods wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 10:17pm: Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 11:24am: Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jun 21st, 2011 at 11:13am: You pandering to the drama Queen element on here Smithy? You're as bad as Nemesis, who sees extremes and conspiracies everywhere these days. What conspiracy? I've just posted an article that relies on scientific research to back claims that we are stuffing the oceans even quicker than we thought. It is others who shout conspiracy about science writing reports for cash, I just thought I'd beat them to it. Drama Queen please, don't like or believe the article? refute it with facts not name calling. As for the comparison with Nem, better than some I've seen you compared with. She may be a raving commie but her heart as you well know is in the right place. ----------------- The scientific panel concluded that degeneration in the oceans is happening much faster than has been predicted, and that the combination of factors currently distressing the marine environment is contributing to the precise conditions that have been associated with all major extinctions in the Earth's history. - well reading that smithy   they admit they got it WRONG... they also admit we had major extinctions long before man arrived.. last week they found another strain of dinosauer..that changed all their thinking about when and where...... now they have a very convenient thing to blame HUMANS.. ok now we sure as hell havent got everything right..no one is denying that... but I still have yet to read.... what changes this TAX will make to all these problems that mankind is making.. they come up with all thei PANIC..I do not believe we changed the plabet and now the oceans in ten years.. I just do not believe it.. you can you can talk about all the fish disappearing... but tell us please if you believe that.. how will this TAX stop it happen ig and when will it stop it happening.. and why is your bloody govt taking so long. to decide that it is happenin g. and we must spread the PANIC.. yet they cant tell us what when why and how.? dont forget you have anothe r12 months to wait before ,  if anything happens...lol I understand your upset about a new tax Cods, but frankly to understand the graviety of the issue you need to move past that. I think you would know that so I won't waste keystrokes with it. I'm not happy about the way it's been gone about either, but frankly lets look at BOTH options because both parties have a plan (of sorts) which WILL cost us tax dollars.(Unless of course you think Tony wasn't telling the gospel truth and the Direct Action Plan will disappear upon a winning election night) Labor - *Yes a tax, but on industry not you personally * Extra money in your pocket, it will never be enough but the way they stress it, it has to be more than a token effort *You, whilst not spoilt for choice can choose how that money is spent throughout the extra costs from Industry. A decidedly liberal philosphy if you really think about it ;) *Compensation for hardest hit industries to negate (hopefully) some of the increase to consumers. Liberal- *Give Industry a bucket load of tax dollars (with no obligation or at least none voiced so far) to maybe decrease their emissions. Where is that money to be found? It whilst not directly coming out of your purse will come in the form of reduced services, higher cost for goverment services or perhaps a levy, we don't know. * Planting trees, great idea but where does the land come from? Aparently I've heard it will require a bucket load of space, sure there's plenty of space in this country but it's already sparce as far as trees go for a reason. So theirs your choice in a nutshell Regardless of anything you will PAY MORE for the environment so which would you rather. yes smithy I get that.... but what I dont get is.. WHAT THE BLOODY HELL THIS TAX WILL DO TO THE ENVIRONMENT even these scientists dont spell it out what we can expect... and you know it.. they know so much! at least they have convinced you.. so they must be able to say, well when all industry is using RE..all mines closed..[ which I have noted not one of them has called for]. then we will see such and such happen in such and such time.. smithy I have always said we need TAX we want.. then we have to pay... this TAX in my mind is just that its another lurk for our world govts to flog the books.. all in name of paranoia and fear. read you op... we have had 3 major extinctions.. its happened without man being involved... now conveniently its all man made. and a TAX will stop it all..come on mate.. in the mean time they are still logging the rain forests..we are still allowing them to kill endangered species.. people are still buying ivory and tiger pelts..we still have drugs flying all over the world... yet we are TAXing the climate and thats  going to fix it..... yeah right!

Like I said Cods the science does not matter, it's a fait accompli, you will pay more regardless whether it's right or wrong.It may even just be the lurk you speak of.
So which plan do you like best?

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 21^st, 2011 at 11:08pm:

I understand your upset about a new tax Cods,

Show me someone who is happy to have a new tax to pay and I'll show you an idiot.

Quote:

Like I said Cods the science does not matter, it's a fait accompli, you will pay more regardless whether it's right or wrong.It may even just be the lurk you speak of. So which plan do you like best?

I don't know about Cods...BUT I for one would like to see, or at least be told, exactly what result vs expendiiture we're looking at..

I'd like to see the numbers...as in what % of Co2 reduction we'll get on a dollar by dollar basis......how much it'll cost the people or the economy for every 1% of Co2 reduction..

If it's going to cost two or three times as much to reduce the Co2 levels as it will to deal with the effects of the rise, is it even justified??

I am a self confessed sceptic on the idea that human action is 'driving' global warming...

I'm open to the idea that there may be a small percentage we are contributing to it..but 2 or 5 % or even 10% isn't worth stuffing our whole civilisation over...the difference between 2 degrees Celcius and 1.90 degrees (or 1.95 or 1.98) isn't worth taking our technology level back 200 years...Basically because of the detrimental effects it would have..

I see Loony Lord Monkfish is back in Australia, it seems he loves it here because apart from the religious right in the USA we are the only country that takes climate change deniers seriously.
Isnt it grand to be in bed with the worlds leading lunatics   ;D ;D ;D

adelcrow wrote on Jun 22^nd, 2011 at 5:30pm:

I see Loony Lord Monkfish is back in Australia, it seems he loves it here because apart from the religious right in the USA we are the only country that takes climate change deniers seriously. Isnt it grand to be in bed with the worlds leading lunatics   ;D ;D ;D

And is 'Loony Lord Monkfish' any weirder than 'Bullshit Lord Gore"???

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jun 22^nd, 2011 at 5:34pm:

adelcrow wrote on Jun 22nd, 2011 at 5:30pm: I see Loony Lord Monkfish is back in Australia, it seems he loves it here because apart from the religious right in the USA we are the only country that takes climate change deniers seriously. Isnt it grand to be in bed with the worlds leading lunatics   ;D ;D ;D And is 'Loony Lord Monkfish' any weirder than 'Bullshit Lord Gore"???

L,O.L good one giz... like him buying his mansion in Florida...and Cate buying her seaview in Vanuato... all places that dont get sea changes of course...LOL>.

I love it... lets see this govt do the RIGHT thing... and switch off the AIRCON to start with

let see them  all on  question time wrapped in blankets..

.like they keep telling the poor people to do.

why leave it only to the old and frail to save this planet?..

lets see the bikes outside parliament house...


who would like to see that???

lets turn the water heater off in the parliament house pool..

how about all the freaking lights on 24/7...and no one home!

how about we stop all the freebee phone calls for our asylum seekers...something like $1.5.million a year at one detention centre alone...goodness only knows what damage mobils are doing..

how about turning all the pokermachines off each night about 6pm..untill they are all on RE..at least.