Tony's sensible centre is a chocolate-wrapped deceit

    Paul Howes
    The Sunday Telegraph
    July 22, 2012 12:00AM

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THERE'S a new phrase entering the political lexicon: "sensible centre". It's Tony Abbott's new favourite saying.    :-?

Apparently, the "pendulum" has "swung too far" away from the "sensible centre".

What I'd like to ask Abbott is this: Who is being paid too much? What conditions of which workers do you think overly generous?

What would you like to cut first? Penalty rates? Overtime? Annual leave entitlements?    :-?

Of course, Abbott will never tell, at least not before the election. The Liberals learnt that the hard way.There's been a lot of talk this week about the union movement's plans for a fighting fund for the next election. Unions are preparing to fight hard because there is so much at stake.

As ACTU secretary Dave Oliver said this week: "We are talking about security of workers' entitlements. "We're talking about secure jobs. We're talking about proper industry policy, such as in the automotive industry. All these things are happening and we are supportive of all of that."

And when you have an opposition which has started to come out of the closet on its plans to rip away at workers' rights it is, of course, natural for unions - the guardians of such rights - to defend our members.

This week I was in the United States attending the Australian American Leadership Dialogue. I spoke with a number of labour market economists who talked in great detail about the stagnation of the working conditions of middle class Americans.

One of the big differences between Australian and American workplaces is the comparative weakness of the US union movement coupled with an extremely deregulated labour market.

Since 2003 it's estimated that the median hourly pay rate fell 2 per cent (after inflation).

The Australian perspective is quite the opposite. Over the past decade, real wages have grown in our country by almost 57 per cent, and our economy is still the envy of the world.

The challenges facing the US economy and the strength of ours comprehensibly demonstrates the hollowness of the argument run by many in the Liberal Party that a completely deregulated labour market is somehow better for the economy. The truth is that conservatives want a deregulated labour market because that's the best way to smash the power of workers.    :(

Conservatives talk about the "sensible centre", as though it's something unions are against. It's not. The "sensible centre" is an artificial construct made up by people like Tony Abbott when they're trying to justify cutting wages and conditions. It's nothing more than a hollow attempt to justify cutting workers' rights.   :(

Away from all the rhetoric and hyperbole about "union bosses" and "union power", the real issue at stake at the next federal election is the hip pockets of working Australians.

Unions want business to do well. Businesses employ workers, and it should be that the better a business does, the better its workers do. Unions, as a part of a civilised society, work best when they're working with this firmly in mind, seeking to better the lives of their members.    ;)

Because the truth is that unions aren't against the "sensible centre" any more than they're against the clear blue sky.

Paul Howes is the national secretary of the AWU

What I'd like to ask Abbott is this: Who is being paid too much? What conditions of which workers do you think overly generous?    :-?

What would you like to cut first? Penalty rates? Overtime? Annual leave entitlements?    :(

Does anyone really, honestly expect Paul Howes to be objective and honest? Yeah, I didn't think so.

Does anyone think Mr Abbott, will ever spell out his industrial relation plans?.    :(

wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 7:28am:

Does anyone think Mr Abbott, will ever spell out his industrial relation plans?.    :(

In good time, petal. In good time.

They must be very frightening I imagine.    :o

wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 6:56am:

Who is being paid too much?

Craig Thomson.

Armchair_Politician wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 7:24am:

Does anyone really, honestly expect Paul Howes to be objective and honest? Yeah, I didn't think so.

Read the article again - it looks very objective and very honest.

Unions are the ones making up the workchoices scare stories, and will do anything to words in the coalitions mouth about the topic

LOL

Howes makes comparisons between wage growth in Australia and the United States, omitting that Australia has actually benefited from a surging terms of trade.

#Fail

It is a big issue for small business.

Open up and Saturday/Sunday and you have penalty rates, overtime/weekend rates etc.

All need to be paid for from selling products at the same price.

Q

Should products sold/produced on weekends/nights etc be more expensive?

Of course you have penalty rates for weekend work, and quite rightly so.    ;)

wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 11:43am:

Of course you have penalty rates for weekend work, and quite rightly so.    ;)

Why? It's not different to working on a Tuesday or Thursday.

Get rid of penalty rates.

wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 11:43am:

Of course you have penalty rates for weekend work, and quite rightly so.    ;)

So should your weekend cup of coffee go up to cover for these rates?

FriYAY wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 11:47am:

wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 11:43am: Of course you have penalty rates for weekend work, and quite rightly so.    ;) So should your weekend cup of coffee go up to cover for these rates?

They do, I got a 10 per cent Sunday surcharge yesterday.

No way, people should get penalty rates for working overtime and weekends.  If they don't want to pay the penalty rates.  Then don't expect people to work the weekends.   ;)      

wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 11:51am:

No way, people should get penalty rates for working overtime and weekends.  If they don't want to pay the penalty rates.  Then don't expect people to work the weekends.   ;)

OK….

But when businesses decide not to open or close down, you won’t go putting up….

“X amount of people lose their jobs….”

…….sob stories will you.

Because if that happens no one will be getting extra work and extra $$.

They have a choice.  They can decide to open on weekends if they want.  Alternatively they can stay closed if they want.  Its their choice.    :)   

wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 12:12pm:

They have a choice.  They can decide to open on weekends if they want.  Alternatively they can stay closed if they want.  Its their choice.    :)

Because if that happens no one will be getting extra work and extra $$.

;)

Hardly worth doing, if they don't get the penalty rates though.    :( 

wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 12:18pm:

Hardly worth doing, if they don't get the penalty rates though.    :(

Probably right, the extra $$ for lower paid work is a massive bonus for a lot of people.

I’ve done a lot of shift work and the shift loading for afternoon and nights made up for pretty low pay for “normal hours”

Just ban weekend trading for big business.

FriYAY wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 11:41am:

It is a big issue for small business. Open up and Saturday/Sunday and you have penalty rates, overtime/weekend rates etc. All need to be paid for from selling products at the same price. Q Should products sold/produced on weekends/nights etc be more expensive?

Shane B wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 11:45am:

wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 11:43am: Of course you have penalty rates for weekend work, and quite rightly so.    ;) Why? It's not different to working on a Tuesday or Thursday. Get rid of penalty rates.

Why should someone that has to work weekends or at nights miss out on family time with their kids.

How about we go back to the olden days

Everyone works 9.00 am until 5.00pm Monday to Friday.

Nothing open or no one working after 5.00pm Friday until 9.00 am Monday.

Shane B wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 11:45am:

wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 11:43am: Of course you have penalty rates for weekend work, and quite rightly so.    ;) Why? It's not different to working on a Tuesday or Thursday. Get rid of penalty rates.

You know that business has survived & profited for many decades even though penalty rates existed.
So why the sudden push to get rid of them?
Because our present business model of anything less than 10% p/ann profit growth is a failure requires 1 of 2 things.
More customers
or
Less overheads

You might like to dwell on what committing about a 3rd of our workforce to "working POVERTY" status will do to the economy overall?

John S wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 12:28pm:

FriYAY wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 11:41am: It is a big issue for small business. Open up and Saturday/Sunday and you have penalty rates, overtime/weekend rates etc. All need to be paid for from selling products at the same price. Q Should products sold/produced on weekends/nights etc be more expensive? Shane B wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 11:45am: wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 11:43am: Of course you have penalty rates for weekend work, and quite rightly so.    ;) Why? It's not different to working on a Tuesday or Thursday. Get rid of penalty rates. Why should someone that has to work weekends or at nights miss out on family time with their kids. How about we go back to the olden days Everyone works 9.00 am until 5.00pm Monday to Friday. Nothing open or no one working after 5.00pm Friday until 9.00 am Monday.

If you're missing on time out with your kids, that's a lifestyle choice. If you don't like it get another job.

Shouldn't have to get another job.  Might be quite happy working there Monday to Friday.    :)

If business wants to get rid of Penalty rates Fine.
But I do expect the whole of the economy to function 24/7
Including all insurance companies/banks/post offices/government departments etc.
How much more competitive would we be???
So you won't be able to change jobs Shaun as all industries will be on 7 day rosters with no penalties.

How about business go for this change instead of bashing the weakest in the food chain.
And where's all that compassion for " Some of Australia's lowest paid workers" we see in Thomson threads gone?

Verge wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 11:27am:

Unions are the ones making up the workchoices scare stories, and will do anything to words in the coalitions mouth about the topic

Actually it is Tony Abbott who is making IR related statments which tend to be saying that if elected he intends to very much go in that direction again.

wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 12:45pm:

Shouldn't have to get another job.  Might be quite happy working there Monday to Friday.    :)

If you apply for a job at a business and you are informed that you may be required to work weekends then the onus is on you to decide if that is something you're willing to do before accepting the job. If you do accept the job, then you have no right or reason to whine. If you take a job that did not previously include weekend work but now does, then you can either work weekends or quit. The choice is yours. No one can force you. Having said that, your comment smacks of stupidity.

Dnarever wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 8:40am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 7:24am: Does anyone really, honestly expect Paul Howes to be objective and honest? Yeah, I didn't think so. Read the article again - it looks very objective and very honest.

when I first came to Australia in those days of laid back she will be right days... the union started a .. Why are we not paid the same as Americans..

they considered aussies hard done by in comparison.

so there were huge increases..what they didnt inform the laidback aussie was Americans only had two weeks paid holidays a year..paid public holidays throughout the year were very few..

it was the norm to work all day Saturday not just a half day like it was here then..

when we compare ourselves to others as this guys does.. we never really get the full picture.. we take all these paid public holidays for granted.. the real truth is  someone has to pay for them..

I think its appalling someone like Howes who is desperate to hang onto the ... we will die if the Union Movement dies..who is really hanging onto his own job and a very lucrative one it is too if THOMO is any indication..

I dont see  Howes at the dont of a picket line handing out food hampers like they did years ago..in fact I dont see any union giving back to a member  EVER..

they may have got many chan ges over the years and well done they have.. but they have been PAID to do JUST THAT..lets not kid ourselves..

even unions will one day be past their use by date.. Howes just hopes it doesnt happen any time soon.

you can see the look on his face  seat on the front bench if ever I saw one..

Dnarever wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 4:14pm:

Verge wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 11:27am: Unions are the ones making up the workchoices scare stories, and will do anything to words in the coalitions mouth about the topic Actually it is Tony Abbott who is making IR related statments which tend to be saying that if elected he intends to very much go in that direction again.

thats your interpretation...

What is the sensible centre??

FriYAY wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 12:08pm:

wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 11:51am: No way, people should get penalty rates for working overtime and weekends.  If they don't want to pay the penalty rates.  Then don't expect people to work the weekends.   ;)       OK…. But when businesses decide not to open or close down, you won’t go putting up…. “X amount of people lose their jobs….” …….sob stories will you. Because if that happens no one will be getting extra work and extra $$.

Um, capitalism won't be disappearing as a concept no matter what you do!  ;) ;) ;) ;)  :D

Shane B wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 12:37pm:

John S wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 12:28pm: FriYAY wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 11:41am: It is a big issue for small business. Open up and Saturday/Sunday and you have penalty rates, overtime/weekend rates etc. All need to be paid for from selling products at the same price. Q Should products sold/produced on weekends/nights etc be more expensive? Shane B wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 11:45am: wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 11:43am: Of course you have penalty rates for weekend work, and quite rightly so.    ;) Why? It's not different to working on a Tuesday or Thursday. Get rid of penalty rates. Why should someone that has to work weekends or at nights miss out on family time with their kids. How about we go back to the olden days Everyone works 9.00 am until 5.00pm Monday to Friday. Nothing open or no one working after 5.00pm Friday until 9.00 am Monday. If you're missing on time out with your kids, that's a lifestyle choice. If you don't like it get another job.

Shane B likes to be in control methinks!

Must be a crack smokin' metrosexual liberal voter who really really really really really wants to imitate his moustached real estate selling daddykins!!!  ;D ;D  ::)  :)  ;) ;) ;) ;)  ::)

have just watched the news where in LEETON they are destroying the orange crop..

WHY because it costs too much to turn it into concentrate here..much easier and cheaper to import orange concentrate..

humm I didnt see Howes there though..just a grower on the verge of cutting down all the trees.

a beautiful crop of oranges.. millions of them

and because we all want a HUGE bite out of this cherry... read orange..we dump them rather than use them..

does anyone bother to go overseas where we buy this concentrate from and find out how it costs them so much less to produce and put onto the shelves in our stores than it is for us to do????


its seems it doesnt matter how far things travel to get into our stores.. they still cost less than we can to produce them... WHY is this SO?


couldnt be wages only surely???.. we know the grower farmer isnt ripping us off...


so whats the answer crook or Mr Howes??????

cods wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 5:51pm:

have just watched the news where in LEETON they are destroying the orange crop.. WHY because it costs too much to turn it into concentrate here..much easier and cheaper to import orange concentrate.. humm I didnt see Howes there though..just a grower on the verge of cutting down all the trees. a beautiful crop of oranges.. millions of them and because we all want a HUGE bite out of this cherry... read orange..we dump them rather than use them.. does anyone bother to go overseas where we buy this concentrate from and find out how it costs them so much less to produce and put onto the shelves in our stores than it is for us to do???? its seems it doesnt matter how far things travel to get into our stores.. they still cost less than we can to produce them... WHY is this SO? couldnt be wages only surely???.. we know the grower farmer isnt ripping us off... so whats the answer crook or Mr Howes??????

This happens all the time..when its time to bulldoze old unproductive citrus trees and plant new ones they call in the media and pretend they are bulldozing the trees because they cant afford to produce oranges anymore.
In a few months time the block will be full of new orange trees.
The media and the public fall for this little con every time.

cods wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 5:51pm:

have just watched the news where in LEETON they are destroying the orange crop.. WHY because it costs too much to turn it into concentrate here..much easier and cheaper to import orange concentrate.. humm I didnt see Howes there though..just a grower on the verge of cutting down all the trees. a beautiful crop of oranges.. millions of them and because we all want a HUGE bite out of this cherry... read orange..we dump them rather than use them.. does anyone bother to go overseas where we buy this concentrate from and find out how it costs them so much less to produce and put onto the shelves in our stores than it is for us to do???? its seems it doesnt matter how far things travel to get into our stores.. they still cost less than we can to produce them... WHY is this SO? couldnt be wages only surely???.. we know the grower farmer isnt ripping us off... so whats the answer crook or Mr Howes??????

Won't the bulldozing cost them money? They wouldn't spend the money for no reason. And why would they bulldoze productive trees unless they're going to plant something else? If they were going to do nothing then they'd be better to let the fruit lie where it falls, leave the trees productive and hope the situation improves next year.

In other words, they've probably worked out that they can get more money from some OTHER crop!

The amazing power of logic. Brilliant, innit?

Its a con every blockie from all corners of the country uses to get attention.
Like I said..the block will be full of young orange trees as soon as spring hits the air.
Its living proof that the Aussie media is full of easily led morons.

Shane B wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 11:45am:

wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 11:43am: Of course you have penalty rates for weekend work, and quite rightly so.    ;) Why? It's not different to working on a Tuesday or Thursday. Get rid of penalty rates.

Lol, oh my little acorn is going to get a workout over that one!

  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

If you apply for a job at a business and you are informed that you may be required to work weekends then the onus is on you to decide if that is something you're willing to do before accepting the job. If you do accept the job, then you have no right or reason to whine. If you take a job that did not previously include weekend work but now does, then you can either work weekends or quit. The choice is yours. No one can force you. Having said that, your comment smacks of stupidity.
Seems fair enough to me, if they told me that when I started the job.  However one would assume that they would get the penalty rates for this work.    ;)

wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 6:41pm:

If you apply for a job at a business and you are informed that you may be required to work weekends then the onus is on you to decide if that is something you're willing to do before accepting the job. If you do accept the job, then you have no right or reason to whine. If you take a job that did not previously include weekend work but now does, then you can either work weekends or quit. The choice is yours. No one can force you. Having said that, your comment smacks of stupidity. Seems fair enough to me, if they told me that when I started the job.  However one would assume that they would get the penalty rates for this work.    ;)

Exactly: Shane B isn't very good at crossing his ts and dottign his eyes yet....

....must be a young crack smoker!!

Mr Abbott, Who Is Being Paid Too Much.

Agree

If you cant afford to pay your workers a decent wage and offer up 21st century working conditions you shouldnt be in business.
I do wonder why neo con voters think they should protect a few mega rich tax dodgers over the basic human rights of working people.
Does it make them feel like part of the establishment if the behave like lapdogs?

adelcrow wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 6:50pm:

If you cant afford to pay your workers a decent wage and offer up 21st century working conditions you shouldnt be in business. I do wonder why neo con voters think they should protect a few mega rich tax dodgers over the basic human rights of working people. Does it make them feel like part of the establishment if the behave like lapdogs?

It makes them feel like Daddy is near!!  ;) ;)

BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 6:54pm:

adelcrow wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 6:50pm: If you cant afford to pay your workers a decent wage and offer up 21st century working conditions you shouldnt be in business. I do wonder why neo con voters think they should protect a few mega rich tax dodgers over the basic human rights of working people. Does it make them feel like part of the establishment if the behave like lapdogs? It makes them feel like Daddy is near!!  ;) ;)

Working people seeking to take basic conditions fought for over a century off other working people..theres a word for them.

Dnarever wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 6:46pm:

Mr Abbott, Who Is Being Paid Too Much. Agree

And yet Mr Abbott is so incompetent that he said he cant afford to pay his bills on a shadow ministers salary.
And he wants to control the purse strings of the country  ;D

BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 4:40pm:

What is the sensible centre??

What is the sensible centre??


It is the position that we have been moving away from for about 25 years now.

We Had the Hawke Keating Governments with rather conservative IR policy aimed at producing good economic results largely at the expense of the employee with deals going to the right like the accord and enterprise bargaining where in order to get the increase that you had already earned you were required to give something away.

This was followed by the Howard government going further again to the right with the removal of unfair dismissal and the 1996 industrial relations act, legislation for workplace agreements 1997 (the water front dispute) and a number of small adjustments to the right then Workchoices. Goes to complete around a 25 year lurch to the right on IR. Followed by a slight bump back towards the centre with the fair work legislation.

Things would need to move significantly in the employees direction to go to the centre from the position we are currently in.

I'm best friend of workers: Abbott

Date
    July 13, 2012


OPPOSITION Leader Tony Abbott declared that Australian workers would find he was ''their best friend'' - prompting Julia Gillard to retort that ''with friends like that who needs an enemy?''    :-?

The government seized on Mr Abbott's promise to the tourism industry on Wednesday that he would get more flexibility into workplaces, saying a Coalition government would attack penalties.

Workplace Relations Minister Bill Shorten said: ''Let's decode what Mr Abbott is saying. He's saying to hospitality workers, to retail workers - who are amongst the lowest paid in Australia - that he will cut their penalty rates because he wants to make the big end of town happy with him on industrial relations.'' He challenged the opposition to ''come clean'' with its IR policy.    >:(

But Mr Abbott, who says he wants to restore the industrial relations pendulum to the ''sensible centre'', flatly denied he wanted to cut penalty rates in the tourism industry. Pressed on what he meant by flexibility, he said the Coalition workplace policy would be sensible, responsible, careful, cautious and based on real problems not ideology.


''The one thing that the Australian workers will find is that I am their best friend. What I want to see is higher wages and more jobs. That's what I was like when I was the workplace relations minister.''

Ms Gillard accused Mr Abbott of ducking and weaving on whether he would ''rip penalty rates off working people. We've been here before when Mr Abbott was in government and he and his cohorts were in on a plan to rip penalty rates off hard-working Australians.''

Mr Shorten, who has received the government-commissioned review of the Fair Work Act, rejected business claims that productivity had fallen as a result of the IR changes Labor made.

''They have no evidence for that statement. I'm just not buying that bill of goods. Productivity has fallen in Australia over the last 10 years. The majority of that time, it was the old Liberal laws in place.

''So productivity has fallen, but it's been a haunting secret for 10 years. If you look at the last three quarters, productivity has been lifting again.''

Asked if a more flexible approach to workplace relations was required, Mr Shorten said he believed the labour market was undergoing a ''silent revolution''. He predicted future productivity would be boosted using a ''collaborative'' approach between workers and business.

What was needed to lift productivity - workers doing more with the same effort - was high-value, reasonably well-paid workplaces, he said. The government was addressing productivity by addressing skills and infrastructure.    ;)

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/im-best-friend-of-workers-abbott-20120712-21yvv.html#ixzz21R1QXTqd

Ms Gillard accused Mr Abbott of ducking and weaving on whether he would ''rip penalty rates off working people. We've been here before when Mr Abbott was in government and he and his cohorts were in on a plan to rip penalty rates off hard-working Australians.''    :(

wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 7:12pm:

Ms Gillard accused Mr Abbott of ducking and weaving on whether he would ''rip penalty rates off working people. We've been here before when Mr Abbott was in government and he and his cohorts were in on a plan to rip penalty rates off hard-working Australians.''    :(

Abbott has never worked a day in his life and yet he wants to strip the rights from our poorest workers..typical neo con.
If he cant survive on a shadow ministers salary why would he think our poorest workers can survive without basic working conditions and wages?

Quote:

Mr Abbott Who Is Being Paid Too Much?.

Members of the Williamson family? That includes Michael Williamson, charming and thrifty wife Julieanne, and rock star son Christopher.


Quote:

HSU: $20 million of dubious spending, report finds SUSPICIOUS procurement practices, nepotism and cronyism resulted in the union boss Michael Williamson, his family and friends reaping millions of dollars from the troubled Health Services Union during his 15-year reign. The final report by Ian Temby, QC, and the accountant Dennis Robertson, which has been obtained by the Herald, paints a disturbing picture of the HSUeast branch. More than $20 million in questionable payments was paid to suppliers to the union without any form of tendering or contract. [...] http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/hsu-20-million-of-dubious-spending-report-finds-20120723-22kmi.html

adelcrow wrote on Jul 23^rd, 2012 at 6:18pm:

Its a con every blockie from all corners of the country uses to get attention. Like I said..the block will be full of young orange trees as soon as spring hits the air. Its living proof that the Aussie media is full of easily led morons.

LOL

You and Gist are both chock-a-block full of crap.

You are making it up, you have no idea.

As far back as 20 years cheap Brazilian imports started to ruin the Australian citrus industry.

I remember at one stage in the mid 1990's you could land Brazilian concentrate for the equivalent farm price of $20/t against production costs of $30-40/t. People let their fruit rot.

Get a clue you destructive lying morons.

>:(

FriYAY wrote on Jul 24^th, 2012 at 9:56am:

adelcrow wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 6:18pm: Its a con every blockie from all corners of the country uses to get attention. Like I said..the block will be full of young orange trees as soon as spring hits the air. Its living proof that the Aussie media is full of easily led morons. LOL You and Gist are both chock-a-block full of crap. You are making it up, you have no idea. As far back as 20 years cheap Brazilian imports started to ruin the Australian citrus industry. I remember at one stage in the mid 1990's you could land Brazilian concentrate for the equivalent farm price of $20/t against production costs of $30-40/t. People let their fruit rot.Get a clue you destructive lying morons. >:(

Yet the only answer to stopping that is protectionism, a policy the conservatives like phony tony dismiss.

skippy. wrote on Jul 24^th, 2012 at 9:59am:

FriYAY wrote on Jul 24th, 2012 at 9:56am: adelcrow wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 6:18pm: Its a con every blockie from all corners of the country uses to get attention. Like I said..the block will be full of young orange trees as soon as spring hits the air. Its living proof that the Aussie media is full of easily led morons. LOL You and Gist are both chock-a-block full of crap. You are making it up, you have no idea. As far back as 20 years cheap Brazilian imports started to ruin the Australian citrus industry. I remember at one stage in the mid 1990's you could land Brazilian concentrate for the equivalent farm price of $20/t against production costs of $30-40/t. People let their fruit rot.Get a clue you destructive lying morons. >:( Yet the only answer to stopping that is protectionism, a policy the conservatives like phony tony dismiss.

At the time there was a 30% import tariff on Australian concentrate to Brazil and 5% on Brazilian imports.

We would process beautiful Oz Valencias just to make peel juice and extract oragne oil, the juice was pretty much worthless, so many people went under.


This isn’t about morons with stupid opinions.

Go away.

FriYAY wrote on Jul 24^th, 2012 at 10:05am:

skippy. wrote on Jul 24th, 2012 at 9:59am: FriYAY wrote on Jul 24th, 2012 at 9:56am: adelcrow wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 6:18pm: Its a con every blockie from all corners of the country uses to get attention. Like I said..the block will be full of young orange trees as soon as spring hits the air. Its living proof that the Aussie media is full of easily led morons. LOL You and Gist are both chock-a-block full of crap. You are making it up, you have no idea. As far back as 20 years cheap Brazilian imports started to ruin the Australian citrus industry. I remember at one stage in the mid 1990's you could land Brazilian concentrate for the equivalent farm price of $20/t against production costs of $30-40/t. People let their fruit rot.Get a clue you destructive lying morons. >:( Yet the only answer to stopping that is protectionism, a policy the conservatives like phony tony dismiss. At the time there was a 30% import tariff on Australian concentrate to Brazil and 5% on Brazilian imports. We would process beautiful Oz Valencias just to make peel juice and extract oragne oil, the juice was pretty much worthless, so many people went under. This isn’t about morons with stupid opinions. Go away.

Sorry, facts a bit hard to handle for a fvckwit like you.

skippy. wrote on Jul 24^th, 2012 at 10:07am:

FriYAY wrote on Jul 24th, 2012 at 10:05am: skippy. wrote on Jul 24th, 2012 at 9:59am: FriYAY wrote on Jul 24th, 2012 at 9:56am: adelcrow wrote on Jul 23rd, 2012 at 6:18pm: Its a con every blockie from all corners of the country uses to get attention. Like I said..the block will be full of young orange trees as soon as spring hits the air. Its living proof that the Aussie media is full of easily led morons. LOL You and Gist are both chock-a-block full of crap. You are making it up, you have no idea. As far back as 20 years cheap Brazilian imports started to ruin the Australian citrus industry. I remember at one stage in the mid 1990's you could land Brazilian concentrate for the equivalent farm price of $20/t against production costs of $30-40/t. People let their fruit rot.Get a clue you destructive lying morons. >:( Yet the only answer to stopping that is protectionism, a policy the conservatives like phony tony dismiss. At the time there was a 30% import tariff on Australian concentrate to Brazil and 5% on Brazilian imports. We would process beautiful Oz Valencias just to make peel juice and extract oragne oil, the juice was pretty much worthless, so many people went under. This isn’t about morons with stupid opinions. Go away. Sorry, facts a bit hard to handle for a fvckwit like you.

LOL

Go away moron, you got nothing but abuse and calling people socks.

Pathetic little try hard, make me LOL.

;D ;D ;D

I just respond in kind,moron. you obviously have too little a brain to comprehend.