......if Abbott wins in September?

'Thoughts?'

In the dreaded likelihood that it does happen, Malcolm Turnbull is the clear choice, and for that very reason, the Libs will never make him Treasurer.

Angry Anderson  ;D

I reckon it will be Barnaby Joyce, if he wins against Windsor, but then again, why has Hockey been LNP  shadow Treasurer unless he is The Man.

well Joyce does have credentials... but I go for Turnbull he is a business man self made millionaire.. nothing wrong with that..

and now the labs accept millionaires in parliament..???????? its ok to be one as treasurer I would think..in fact after this disaster anything would be better..

cods wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 7:06pm:

well Joyce does have credentials... but I go for Turnbull he is a business man self made millionaire.. nothing wrong with that.. and now the labs accept millionaires in parliament..???????? its ok to be one as treasurer I would think..in fact after this disaster anything would be better..

So....what of Hockey?  He is the current Shadow Treasurer.  Surely he was the author of, and thoroughly understood, all the comments he has been making inside and out of Parliament on matters financial etc.  Or was he just mouthing the words written for him by someone else?

Has Hockey actually got any credentials in this area?

Please explain.

:-?

Gina ~ via strings

Aussie wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 7:12pm:

cods wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:06pm: well Joyce does have credentials... but I go for Turnbull he is a business man self made millionaire.. nothing wrong with that.. and now the labs accept millionaires in parliament..???????? its ok to be one as treasurer I would think..in fact after this disaster anything would be better.. So....what of Hockey?  He is the current Shadow Treasurer.  Surely he was the author of, and thoroughly understood, all the comments he has been making inside and out of Parliament on matters financial etc.  Or was he just mouthing the words written for him by someone else? Has Hockey actually got any credentials in this area? Please explain. :-?

I wish I could if only I had worked in treasury..

Joe is fine I like him and I think most do..

but there is a mountain there to be climbed..and it wont be pretty and it will be tough going....

so far Joe hasnt had to balance any books... I think the job could be way out of his league... but what do I know you guys tell me that over and over I am surprised you are interested in what I think.

____ wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 7:16pm:

Gina

she aint elected.

We can take this a step further.  If Abbott wins:

1.  It is a given that he is known, and openly described thus, as a numbnuts on anything to do with the economy.

2.  Hockey also has no economic credentials that I have am aware of.

So, who will the LNP throw up to run the National Family Budget, matters of international financial significance, matters of corporate and personal taxation, matters of Federal/State financial relations etc etc?

Gina does not need to be elected.  She has the LNP is her back pocket.

cods wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 7:17pm:

____ wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:16pm: Gina she aint elected.

yet the conservatives owe her big time.

Aussie wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 7:18pm:

We can take this a step further.  If Abbott wins: 1.  It is a given that he is known, and openly described thus, as a numbnuts on anything to do with the economy. 2.  Hockey also has no economic credentials that I have am aware of. So, who will the LNP throw up to run the National Family Budget, matters of international financial significance, matters of corporate and personal taxation, matters of Federal/State financial relations etc etc?

Abbott has a degree in economics../Law

Joe a degree in Law. and art so he could be quite suitable.. ;D ;D

____ wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 7:18pm:

cods wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:17pm: ____ wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:16pm: Gina she aint elected. yet the conservatives owe her big time.

whats that got to do with anything... she has to run for election and if she wants to be in the liberal party she has to be a member to be selected which she isnt.


you havent been following NSW ICAC Inc have you I think its the labor party that owe the miners b ig time..lots of lunches and dinners and prostitutes.. boy they are big on ,prossies arent they.

cods wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 7:23pm:

Aussie wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:18pm: We can take this a step further.  If Abbott wins: 1.  It is a given that he is known, and openly described thus, as a numbnuts on anything to do with the economy. 2.  Hockey also has no economic credentials that I have am aware of. So, who will the LNP throw up to run the National Family Budget, matters of international financial significance, matters of corporate and personal taxation, matters of Federal/State financial relations etc etc? Abbott has a degree in economics../Law Joe a degree in Law. and art so he could be quite suitable.. ;D ;D

Come on cods, you know as well as I do that the LNP know Abbott  is an economic innumerate.  Both Hewson and Costello have actually said so.

In fact, when you look around the LNP mob, they have got bugger all on matters generally, but on economics,  all they seem to have are Turnbull and Barnaby....and yet it is Hockey who has been Shadow Treasurer!

As I said ^^^^ Gina does not need to be elected.  She owns Abbott.

http://www.independentaustralia.net/Wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/GinaTony.jpg

Bob Katter

Peter Freedman wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 7:34pm:

Bob Katter

This is an important electoral issue.  After all, Abbott has told us all about the so called 'budget emergency,' etc etc, so surely we are entitled to know who will be at the head of the LNP's management of it.

Aussie wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 7:38pm:

Peter Freedman wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:34pm: Bob Katter This is an important electoral issue.  After all, Abbott has told us all about the so called 'budget emergency,' etc etc, so surely we are entitled to know who will be at the head of the LNP's management of it.

It is very serious, I agree. They'll have to have a whip round to remain solvent and Bob's got the biggest hat.

Aussie wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 7:18pm:

We can take this a step further.  If Abbott wins: 1.  It is a given that he is known, and openly described thus, as a numbnuts on anything to do with the economy. 2.  Hockey also has no economic credentials that I have am aware of. So, who will the LNP throw up to run the National Family Budget, matters of international financial significance, matters of corporate and personal taxation, matters of Federal/State financial relations etc etc? Gina does not need to be elected.  She has the LNP is her back pocket.

only one treasurer has ever had economic qualifications - Labor's John Kerin and his single 1991 budget was a dud.

longweekend58 wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 8:18pm:

Aussie wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:18pm: We can take this a step further.  If Abbott wins: 1.  It is a given that he is known, and openly described thus, as a numbnuts on anything to do with the economy. 2.  Hockey also has no economic credentials that I have am aware of. So, who will the LNP throw up to run the National Family Budget, matters of international financial significance, matters of corporate and personal taxation, matters of Federal/State financial relations etc etc? Gina does not need to be elected.  She has the LNP is her back pocket. only one treasurer has ever had economic qualifications - Labor's John Kerin and his single 1991 budget was a dud.

So....who will be the LNP Government's (if they win) Treasurer?

Aussie wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 8:33pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 8:18pm: Aussie wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:18pm: We can take this a step further.  If Abbott wins: 1.  It is a given that he is known, and openly described thus, as a numbnuts on anything to do with the economy. 2.  Hockey also has no economic credentials that I have am aware of. So, who will the LNP throw up to run the National Family Budget, matters of international financial significance, matters of corporate and personal taxation, matters of Federal/State financial relations etc etc? Gina does not need to be elected.  She has the LNP is her back pocket. only one treasurer has ever had economic qualifications - Labor's John Kerin and his single 1991 budget was a dud. So....who will be the LNP Government's (if they win) Treasurer?

Maqqa ..... if any lib can make 2 + 2 = 6, it's maqqa!

Our next treasurer may not even be in Australia right now. Has anyone thought of that?

He may be yet to return, leftards.

Oh sh1t, why did I not see that coming.

;D

Karnal wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 10:09pm:

Our next treasurer may not even be in Australia right now. Has anyone thought of that? He may be yet to return, leftards.

Who?!

I can’t say. It’s top secret Dunedin Liberal Party business.

longweekend58 wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 8:18pm:

Aussie wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:18pm: We can take this a step further.  If Abbott wins: 1.  It is a given that he is known, and openly described thus, as a numbnuts on anything to do with the economy. 2.  Hockey also has no economic credentials that I have am aware of. So, who will the LNP throw up to run the National Family Budget, matters of international financial significance, matters of corporate and personal taxation, matters of Federal/State financial relations etc etc? Gina does not need to be elected.  She has the LNP is her back pocket. only one treasurer has ever had economic qualifications - Labor's John Kerin and his single 1991 budget was a dud.

and he didnt know what GDP meant from memory??LOL....right in the middle of his TV speech.

Abbott and Hockey - What a joke the whole world will be laughing at us.

Dnarever wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 11:27pm:

Abbott and Hocket - What a joke the whole world will be laughing at us.

its better than what they are doing right now...

standing with their mouths wide open wondering what the hell did the worlds greatest do to bring the best economy in the world down to the level of Greece almost...one more year and thats where we would be   

but keep laughing lets see if you are still laughing in 6 years time..we gave your rubbish 6 years after all.well we didnt,the stupid who believed them did.

whatsisname Oakeshott and the others... almost forgotten already.

cods wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 11:37pm:

Dnarever wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 11:27pm: Abbott and Hocket - What a joke the whole world will be laughing at us. its better than what they are doing right now... standing with their mouths wide open wondering what the hell did the worlds greatest do to bring the best economy in the world down to the level of Greece almost...one more year and thats where we would be    but keep laughing lets see if you are still laughing in 6 years time..we gave your rubbish 6 years after all.well we didnt,the stupid who believed them did. whatsisname Oakeshott and the others... almost forgotten already.

standing with their mouths wide open wondering what the hell did the worlds greatest do to bring the best economy in the world down to the level of Greece almost

In fact almost any country who may be looking would understand that they are all closer to that position than Australia is but don't let facts get in the way of your dogmatic beliefs.

I agree, Cods. We should get Germany to bail out the banks.

Westpac’s on its knees.

bah, treasurer schmeasurer,  who cares.
heres all the tresurer needs to do.

walk in to that army of public servants in the treasury dept and say," gooday fellas, please reduce government spending by 10 % in every department and reduce taxes by 7.5 %)  remember we have to pay off labors debt.so we need a 2.5 % margin

then just retire to the golf course.

you see as you sit in gridlock traffic going to work every morning in the dark and getting home after dark, ask yourself if all this BIG GOVERNMENT is really working for YOU.

big health care...but cant get an op done for frigging ages and 8 hour wait in cas

big education...but each year OZ slipd further down the literacy and maths rankings

big welfare...how much of that does joe the worker from the burbs get/  sweet f all.  great if your a bludger with a bad back or a junkie who cant work coz he fried his brain or a queue jumper.


i could go on but the answer is  BIG GOV  does nothing for the average citizen but enslave him to a horrible exhausting grind.  in this age of technology and labor saving.  he should only be working 4 hours a day but BIG GOV has to be fed. it truly is the beast. the gift that never gives and just keeps taking.

there is only one sensible solution.  just put it on a diet.

thats why  the tresusrers job is just so easy.  just order the cutbacks and piss off.

scrap NDIS  (bureaucratic nightmare)
scrap carbon tax (come on, that aint going to work, how many people here have sold their carsd to save the planet  lol)
scrap gonski (more money for a system that does not reward excellence.. in fact roposes propping up rubbish schools and penalising the cream)
scrap NBN
scrap ths baby bonus
scrap assylum seeker aid, make em work or starve (this is what we do with the kiwis by the way..no benefits for them)
scrap all the  royal commisions and lawyers picnics


with the saving . tax cuts for small business to employ people

unemployment is going to be the big problem in the next 10 years and big gov with big deficits strangling the productive private sector is just shooting youself in the foot.

so i'll just put a note in skippys pouch saying 10 % slash to everything , (20 % slash to the public servants numbers)  and skippy can hop into parliament, deliver the note and declare "my work here is done" :)

Who will be Treasurer?

Around 30 posts and the interesting fact is that not 1 single conservative has said that the current shadow treasurer is fit for the job or competent to do it.

Not worried about a conservative government with the economy led by a Hockey Abbott team, crazy if your not.

Joe Hockey

Just love the way he mixes up billions with millions.

____ wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 8:55am:

Joe Hockey Just love the way he mixes up billions with millions.

better than the other way round

did you see swanny lost $14bn hell whats wrong with losing $14bn I hear you say???????????thats on top of the $18bn disaster and the black hole from hell.

never mind he will go down in history for not getting one thing right..

Dnarever wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 11:27pm:

Abbott and Hockey - What a joke the whole world will be laughing at us.

I think "the whole world " has guffawed it's guts sore seeing what the disaster the present mob has created during their time in office. You can only laugh so much, then you start to pity, and they've been pitying Australia for quite some time now.

Why not use the talents of their new members like Angry Anderson..he could teach kids to shoot up heroin in toilets  ;D

A bit like Labor using the dishonest talents of Gillard......three easy lessons on loyalty. Then they can go through Brothels for Idiots by Craig Thompson, or the fraudulent use of credit cards..........

____ wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 7:16pm:

Gina ~ via strings

Keep that FAT Cow as far away from Canberra as posible.

Bury her with Lang

One evil monster with another.

Ok Hockey then, But he would have to be available to be PM if Satans Labor Party discredits Abbott as the PM

warrigal wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 11:48am:

____ wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:16pm: Gina ~ via strings Keep that FAT Cow as far away from Canberra as posible. Bury her with Lang One evil monster with another.

shes one of the worlds richest women....must be money in evil..

what has she done to you?????????....for that matter what did either of them do to you?

Socrates wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 11:27am:

Dnarever wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 11:27pm: Abbott and Hockey - What a joke the whole world will be laughing at us. I think "the whole world " has guffawed it's guts sore seeing what the disaster the present mob has created during their time in office. You can only laugh so much, then you start to pity, and they've been pitying Australia for quite some time now.

has guffawed it's guts sore seeing what the disaster the present mob has created

Considering that our position is a lot better than most of them you comment lacks substance and makes you look foolish.

Socrates wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 11:27am:

Dnarever wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 11:27pm: Abbott and Hockey - What a joke the whole world will be laughing at us. I think "the whole world " has guffawed it's guts sore seeing what the disaster the present mob has created during their time in office. You can only laugh so much, then you start to pity, and they've been pitying Australia for quite some time now.

what an idiotic statement... the entire world would LOVE to have Australia's version of economic problems.

Aussie wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 8:33pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 8:18pm: Aussie wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:18pm: We can take this a step further.  If Abbott wins: 1.  It is a given that he is known, and openly described thus, as a numbnuts on anything to do with the economy. 2.  Hockey also has no economic credentials that I have am aware of. So, who will the LNP throw up to run the National Family Budget, matters of international financial significance, matters of corporate and personal taxation, matters of Federal/State financial relations etc etc? Gina does not need to be elected.  She has the LNP is her back pocket. only one treasurer has ever had economic qualifications - Labor's John Kerin and his single 1991 budget was a dud. So....who will be the LNP Government's (if they win) Treasurer?

And the point of having a shadow treasurer is ????

We will have tweedle dumb and tweedle dumber in charger of the economy if the libs win - that is a known..

Dnarever wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 2:46pm:

Aussie wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 8:33pm: longweekend58 wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 8:18pm: Aussie wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:18pm: We can take this a step further.  If Abbott wins: 1.  It is a given that he is known, and openly described thus, as a numbnuts on anything to do with the economy. 2.  Hockey also has no economic credentials that I have am aware of. So, who will the LNP throw up to run the National Family Budget, matters of international financial significance, matters of corporate and personal taxation, matters of Federal/State financial relations etc etc? Gina does not need to be elected.  She has the LNP is her back pocket. only one treasurer has ever had economic qualifications - Labor's John Kerin and his single 1991 budget was a dud. So....who will be the LNP Government's (if they win) Treasurer? And the point of having a shadow treasurer is ???? We will have tweedle dumb and tweedle dumber in charger of the economy if the libs win - that is a known..

;) Hey we already have that. So no change!

woody2014 wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 2:50pm:

Dnarever wrote on May 18th, 2013 at 2:46pm: Aussie wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 8:33pm: longweekend58 wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 8:18pm: Aussie wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:18pm: We can take this a step further.  If Abbott wins: 1.  It is a given that he is known, and openly described thus, as a numbnuts on anything to do with the economy. 2.  Hockey also has no economic credentials that I have am aware of. So, who will the LNP throw up to run the National Family Budget, matters of international financial significance, matters of corporate and personal taxation, matters of Federal/State financial relations etc etc? Gina does not need to be elected.  She has the LNP is her back pocket. only one treasurer has ever had economic qualifications - Labor's John Kerin and his single 1991 budget was a dud. So....who will be the LNP Government's (if they win) Treasurer? And the point of having a shadow treasurer is ???? We will have tweedle dumb and tweedle dumber in charger of the economy if the libs win - that is a known.. Hey we already have that. So no change!

No we currently have guys who can justifiably call the next in line that.

If you want to rate the current guys dumb and dumber then the next are dumbest and even dumber than that.

Poll

warrigal wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 3:46pm:

Poll

G'day Warrigal.  Could you modify the Poll you added to reflect what I asked in the OP, which was who will be Treasurer if Abbott wins in September?

Socrates wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 11:27am:

Dnarever wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 11:27pm: Abbott and Hockey - What a joke the whole world will be laughing at us. I think "the whole world " has guffawed it's guts sore seeing what the disaster the present mob has created during their time in office. You can only laugh so much, then you start to pity, and they've been pitying Australia for quite some time now.

you don't get out much do you? Talk to many people overseas? Or do you just start to laugh every time you look in the mirror?

I have many relatives in various countries, and they have all at some point or other in the last 3 or 4 yrs, commented on how lucky we are in Australia with our government ...

If the Liberals win it will be Hockey - I know it sounds like a bad joke but that is what happens to shadow treasurers who form government.

A vote for the conservative is a vote to put the two biggest economic num nuts into control of the economy that we have ever had, and that is a fact.

John Smith wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 5:23pm:

Socrates wrote on May 18th, 2013 at 11:27am: Dnarever wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 11:27pm: Abbott and Hockey - What a joke the whole world will be laughing at us. I think "the whole world " has guffawed it's guts sore seeing what the disaster the present mob has created during their time in office. You can only laugh so much, then you start to pity, and they've been pitying Australia for quite some time now. you don't get out much do you? Talk to many people overseas? Or do you just start to laugh every time you look in the mirror? I have many relatives in various countries, and they have all at some point or other in the last 3 or 4 yrs, commented on how lucky we are in Australia with our government ...

I think they are saying 'how lucky we are in Australia'. I doubt very much they add 'with our govt'. I cant imagine too many people would ever laud a govt

Quote:

Who will be Treasurer?

This bloke would be better than Swan...... ;D

http://images.smh.com.au/2011/12/29/2864732/ipad-art-wide-red-20dog1-420x0.jpg

Swagman wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 6:05pm:

Quote: Who will be Treasurer? This bloke would be better than Swan...... ;D http://images.smh.com.au/2011/12/29/2864732/ipad-art-wide-red-20dog1-420x0.jpg

....and better than Abbott/Hockey.  (See how easy, and stupid, that was?)

:D

longweekend58 wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 5:49pm:

John Smith wrote on May 18th, 2013 at 5:23pm: Socrates wrote on May 18th, 2013 at 11:27am: Dnarever wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 11:27pm: Abbott and Hockey - What a joke the whole world will be laughing at us. I think "the whole world " has guffawed it's guts sore seeing what the disaster the present mob has created during their time in office. You can only laugh so much, then you start to pity, and they've been pitying Australia for quite some time now. you don't get out much do you? Talk to many people overseas? Or do you just start to laugh every time you look in the mirror? I have many relatives in various countries, and they have all at some point or other in the last 3 or 4 yrs, commented on how lucky we are in Australia with our government ... I think they are saying 'how lucky we are in Australia'. I doubt very much they add 'with our govt'. I cant imagine too many people would ever laud a govt

Yeah, right. If the Libs win in September, there'll be so much lauding going on this forum will look like a Buck Palace garden party.

Swagman wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 6:05pm:

Quote: Who will be Treasurer? This bloke would be better than Swan...... http://images.smh.com.au/2011/12/29/2864732/ipad-art-wide-red-20dog1-420x0.jpg

http://images.smh.com.au/2011/12/29/2864732/ipad-art-wide-red-20dog1-420x0.jpg



Maybe but how does that line up with the fact that Swan is probably twice as competant as Hockey?

cods wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 7:06pm:

I go for Turnbull he is a business man self made millionaire.. nothing wrong with that.. and now the labs accept millionaires in parliament..???????? its ok to be one as treasurer I would think..in fact after this disaster anything would be better..

FIRSTLY, which "disaster" ?


Quote:

Former prime minister John Howard gave the economy a big tick before Treasurer Wayne Swan delivered his sixth budget on Tuesday night. Mr Howard told a mortgage and finance industry convention in Sydney the economy was resilient despite the belief that it was ''running on empty''. In an off-the-cuff speech on Friday, reported by trade website The Adviser, Mr Howard was upbeat about the economy. ''When the Prime Minister and the Treasurer and others tell you that the Australian economy is doing better than most - they are right,'' Mr Howard said. The low unemployment rate had surprised him, he said. ''We are still fortunate that we have an unemployment rate with a five in front of it. I wouldn't have thought that was going to be possible a few years ago, and I don't think many people would. Our unemployment has remained pleasingly quite low,'' Mr Howard said. ''And our debt to GDP ratio, the amount of money we owe, to the strength of our economy, is still a lot better than most other countries,'' he said. He said Australia's economy was better than the economies of Japan, the US and most European countries. This is in stark contrast to his protege and Opposition Leader Tony Abbott's assessment of doom and gloom on Monday. http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/resilient-economy-in-better-shape-than-most-says-howard-20130514-2jke5.html#ixzz2Te3JNgsM

Malcolm Turnbull is "streets ahead" in credentials for the role of Federal Treasurer - than anyone else on the Abbott front bench

... but too big a threat to be breathing down Abbott's neck as the party leader

He is less of a danger kept as communications spokesperson - pushing up-hill the blancmange they laughingly call their NBN model and policy
Abbott knows Turnbull will never be taken seriously in ANY role - as long as he is straddled with THAT one

buzzanddidj wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 10:32pm:

cods wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:06pm: I go for Turnbull he is a business man self made millionaire.. nothing wrong with that.. and now the labs accept millionaires in parliament..???????? its ok to be one as treasurer I would think..in fact after this disaster anything would be better.. FIRSTLY, which "disaster" ? Quote: Former prime minister John Howard gave the economy a big tick before Treasurer Wayne Swan delivered his sixth budget on Tuesday night. Mr Howard told a mortgage and finance industry convention in Sydney the economy was resilient despite the belief that it was ''running on empty''. In an off-the-cuff speech on Friday, reported by trade website The Adviser, Mr Howard was upbeat about the economy. ''When the Prime Minister and the Treasurer and others tell you that the Australian economy is doing better than most - they are right,'' Mr Howard said. The low unemployment rate had surprised him, he said. ''We are still fortunate that we have an unemployment rate with a five in front of it. I wouldn't have thought that was going to be possible a few years ago, and I don't think many people would. Our unemployment has remained pleasingly quite low,'' Mr Howard said. ''And our debt to GDP ratio, the amount of money we owe, to the strength of our economy, is still a lot better than most other countries,'' he said. He said Australia's economy was better than the economies of Japan, the US and most European countries. This is in stark contrast to his protege and Opposition Leader Tony Abbott's assessment of doom and gloom on Monday. http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/resilient-economy-in-better-shape-than-most-says-howard-20130514-2jke5.html#ixzz2Te3JNgsM Malcolm Turnbull is "streets ahead" in credentials for the role of Federal Treasurer - than anyone else on the Abbott front bench ... but too big a threat to be breathing down Abbott's neck as the party leader He is less of a danger kept as communications spokesperson - pushing up-hill the blancmange they laughingly call their NBN model and policy Abbott knows Turnbull will never be taken seriously in ANY role - as long as he is straddled with THAT one

ONLY LEFTIES BELIEVE THE CRAP IN THE SMH..

cods wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 10:37pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on May 18th, 2013 at 10:32pm: cods wrote on May 17th, 2013 at 7:06pm: I go for Turnbull he is a business man self made millionaire.. nothing wrong with that.. and now the labs accept millionaires in parliament..???????? its ok to be one as treasurer I would think..in fact after this disaster anything would be better.. FIRSTLY, which "disaster" ? Quote: Former prime minister John Howard gave the economy a big tick before Treasurer Wayne Swan delivered his sixth budget on Tuesday night. Mr Howard told a mortgage and finance industry convention in Sydney the economy was resilient despite the belief that it was ''running on empty''. In an off-the-cuff speech on Friday, reported by trade website The Adviser, Mr Howard was upbeat about the economy. ''When the Prime Minister and the Treasurer and others tell you that the Australian economy is doing better than most - they are right,'' Mr Howard said. The low unemployment rate had surprised him, he said. ''We are still fortunate that we have an unemployment rate with a five in front of it. I wouldn't have thought that was going to be possible a few years ago, and I don't think many people would. Our unemployment has remained pleasingly quite low,'' Mr Howard said. ''And our debt to GDP ratio, the amount of money we owe, to the strength of our economy, is still a lot better than most other countries,'' he said. He said Australia's economy was better than the economies of Japan, the US and most European countries. This is in stark contrast to his protege and Opposition Leader Tony Abbott's assessment of doom and gloom on Monday. http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/resilient-economy-in-better-shape-than-most-says-howard-20130514-2jke5.html#ixzz2Te3JNgsM ONLY LEFTIES BELIEVE THE CRAP IN THE SMH. .

You could print former Prime Minister, John Howard's speech on the widely envied healthy state of the Australian economy in the SMH, The Australian - or on a used sanitory napkin

The MESSAGE is still the same


Trying to imply Howard talks BULLSH!T here - based on the source *
- is a pretty LIMP-DICKED argument





*( ... mind YOU, you won't find a Murdoch publication quoting Howard on THIS occasion)

Meanwhile, out in the real world, the economy is in nothing like the amazing shape that post would have you believe.

We are recruiting for a mid tier $180k role down there and I have been stunned at the amount of candidates made redundant in the last 6 months....

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 1:33am:

We are recruiting for a mid tier $180k role down there and I have been stunned at the amount of candidates made redundant in the last 6 months....

If these candidates are applying for a $180k role it's no wonder so many have been made redundant. They're too expensive. It's time to give everyone a pay cut.

That's market rate. It's for the head of finance position.

Most of those on the market have come out of $200k roles but are willing to drop down to get a role.

The economy is not in an awesome shape that people would have you believe.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 2:09am:

The ( ... Australian) economy is not in an awesome shape that people would have you believe.

We ALL know Howard had a bit of form in being less than forthcoming with the truth - but we doubt that this "talent" now extends to giving a Labor Government any tick of approval in economic management - where any tick of approval is not warranted

Looking at the facts and figures ( ... not to mention a AAA credit rating consensus) he had no other options




THERE HAS been a lot of misinformation around lately regarding the situation Australia currently finds itself in economically.

The fact of the matter is you will struggle to find a country that is more envied for its financial position than Australia.

The Global Financial Crisis that struck in September 2008 with the collapse of Lehman Brothers was the biggest financial shock the world has seen since the Great Depression. Global credit markets froze, global economic growth fell off a cliff, unemployment began to slide and people started losing their homes and the quality of life they were used to.

Through it all Australia remained top of the heap on almost every count.

The Government and the Treasurer have been talking about the attributes we should be proud of, when it comes to our economy, for years.

They are right when they say we have:

■low debt;
■low unemployment;
■AAA credit rating from all three major ratings agencies;
■low inflation; and
■trend growth

Australia’s debt is the second lowest in the OECD. Gross debt stands at 28.9% of GDP.

This compares to Japan at 224%, Greece at 193.2%, Portugal at 133.1%, Italy at 129.6%, Ireland at 127.7%, United States at 113%, France at 108.2%, UK at 110.4%, Canada at 85.5%, Spain at 100.2% and Germany at 86.2%.



We do not have high levels of debt. It is a red herring.

Amazing the vote poll actually suggests Hockey, un fortunate he my have to one day be PM, like Keating was with Hawke.

Satan's Labor party will discredit Abbott again and then we will have to find someone else.

Human beings, It is in our nature to destroy ourselfs.

buzzanddidj wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 2:50am:

Australia’s debt is the second lowest in the OECD. Gross debt stands at 28.9% of GDP.

The debt inherited by Wayne Swan stood at 9.7% of GDP .

In his six years of not once delivering a surplus, he has increased the debt of Australia by over 330%.

Just worth pointing out he also has no formal education in finance and economics and holds a Bachelor of Arts degree.

Probably goes to explain why he can't challenge Treasurys hilarious forecasts?

Either way, he's done a shite job.

Where does the gross debt of 28.9% of GDP come from?  I am sure I heard Swann say in his Budget Speech that it was 10/11%

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 9:17am:

buzzanddidj wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 2:50am: Australia’s debt is the second lowest in the OECD. Gross debt stands at 28.9% of GDP. The debt inherited by Wayne Swan stood at 9.7% of GDP . In his six years of not once delivering a surplus, he has increased the debt of Australia by over 330%. Just worth pointing out he also has no formal education in finance and economics and holds a Bachelor of Arts degree. Probably goes to explain why he can't challenge Treasurys hilarious forecasts? Either way, he's done a shite job.

While the wonderfull USA where everything is teriffic and they give you petrol for free has a debt to GDP ration of 105%.

Just wonderfull performance there hey?

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 9:17am:

buzzanddidj wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 2:50am: Australia’s debt is the second lowest in the OECD. Gross debt stands at 28.9% of GDP. The debt inherited by Wayne Swan stood at 9.7% of GDP . In his six years of not once delivering a surplus, he has increased the debt of Australia by over 330%. Just worth pointing out he also has no formal education in finance and economics and holds a Bachelor of Arts degree. Probably goes to explain why he can't challenge Treasurys hilarious forecasts? Either way, he's done a shite job.

andrei, your assessment is too much of a complement to this man.  he has been much worse than that.
grocery watch, fuelwatch, and a tax that raises no money and a carbon tax where the government fully compensates most of the polluters.  planet cuckoo land

Aussie wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 9:21am:

Where does the gross debt of 28.9% of GDP come from?  I am sure I heard Swann say in his Budget Speech that it was 10/11%

Debt to GDP is different from government debt.

If you look at Andrei's full story he will tell you that Labor inherited a Debt to GDP of 9. something.

You may recall that the conservatives claimed to have paid off the debt. Australias debt to GDP was never zero.

The other conservatives want him to go away with this line as it does not really support the liberals view overall and in fact goes to display one of their real failures and broken promises.

Dnarever wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 9:25am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 9:17am: buzzanddidj wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 2:50am: Australia’s debt is the second lowest in the OECD. Gross debt stands at 28.9% of GDP. The debt inherited by Wayne Swan stood at 9.7% of GDP . In his six years of not once delivering a surplus, he has increased the debt of Australia by over 330%. Just worth pointing out he also has no formal education in finance and economics and holds a Bachelor of Arts degree. Probably goes to explain why he can't challenge Treasurys hilarious forecasts? Either way, he's done a shite job. While the wonderfull USA where everything is teriffic and they give you petrol for free has a debt to GDP ration of 105%. Just wonderfull performance there hey?

Do you live in the USA dna?

KJT1981 wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 9:32am:

Dnarever wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 9:25am: Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 9:17am: buzzanddidj wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 2:50am: Australia’s debt is the second lowest in the OECD. Gross debt stands at 28.9% of GDP. The debt inherited by Wayne Swan stood at 9.7% of GDP . In his six years of not once delivering a surplus, he has increased the debt of Australia by over 330%. Just worth pointing out he also has no formal education in finance and economics and holds a Bachelor of Arts degree. Probably goes to explain why he can't challenge Treasurys hilarious forecasts? Either way, he's done a shite job. While the wonderfull USA where everything is teriffic and they give you petrol for free has a debt to GDP ration of 105%. Just wonderfull performance there hey? Do you live in the USA dna?

Andrei does - the guy making the claim and it's his hypocricy.

Where in my post have I referenced the United States?

I pointed out -

Swan inherited a debt of 9.7% of GDP
It is now 28%
The gross debt has increased by over 330%
He has not delivered 1 surplus
His background is a BA (Hons)

Any of those wrong?

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 9:37am:

Where in my post have I referenced the United States? I pointed out - Swan inherited a debt of 9.7% of GDP It is now 28% The gross debt has increased by over 330% He has not delivered 1 surplus His background is a BA (Hons) Any of those wrong?

Every time you see an advantage you look to the good old USA.

I believe that what you have stated is correct if a bit misleading to some who do not understand the difference between debt to GDP and the Australian government debt numbers most frequently quoted which is about 11% of GDP.

Anyway I see in the bigger picture with the Liberals bringing a further 100 Billion of unfunded spending to the table with a Hockey Abbott economic team as a recipe for a much worse position with no real hope of improvement.

On the other hand Labor have been progressively cutting back budget after budget and making real ground in the right direction in a really tough situation.

Things could  have clearly got a lot worse - just look at the rest of the world, the conservatives economic team look our best chance to get there too.

Australia's saving grace during the WFC was the competent and astute way the government of John Howard with Peter Costello as Treasurer left the country in a very good position to weather the storm. Rudd, Gillard and Swan basically wasted the surplus because it was there, and created massive debt. So again I say, the rest of the world admires what the Howard government left and does NOT attribute any of Australia's enviable position to the Labor mob, they pity the average Australian for being subjected to the blatant incompetence of this government.

Socrates wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 9:53am:

Australia's saving grace during the WFC was the competent and astute way the government of John Howard with Peter Costello as Treasurer left the country in a very good position to weather the storm. Rudd, Gillard and Swan basically wasted the surplus because it was there, and created massive debt. So again I say, the rest of the world admires what the Howard government left and does NOT attribute any of Australia's enviable position to the Labor mob, they pity the average Australian for being subjected to the blatant incompetence of this government.

Peter Costello as Treasurer left the country in a very good position to weather the storm.

They in fact left the economy geared to fail in anything less than an ideal well above average world economic environment.

Rudd, Gillard and Swan basically wasted the surplus

I think you have used the wrong term. The surplus is the yearly budget position - its not government savings ?

The surplus was at about 0.8% of GDP not spent on a yearly basis. The GFC was a downturn of over 3% of GDP. Neither Labor or the Liberals could have done anything about this the simple math is 3 - 0.8 = -2.2

Nothing to do with anyone doing anything - instant deficit. Basically when you have spending locked in and income goes away you end up in debt.

All the reliable and reasonable economic analysis shows that the Liberals would have faired a lot worse.

Handing out $1,000 cheques to some people but excluding those who paid in the most for the surplus is not both waste and political favouritism?

I beg to differ.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 10:14am:

Handing out $1,000 cheques to some people but excluding those who paid in the most for the surplus is not both waste and political favouritism? I beg to differ.

Giving money to people less likely to spend it was going to do nothing to help the economy.

I got nothing and had I been given the payment it would have likely been invested or left in the account for a long time.

Well in my case probably not if it was just money that would have been its fate but in this type of case I would have gone out of my way to spend it appropriately, most wouldn't though.

Dnarever wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 10:29am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 10:14am: Handing out $1,000 cheques to some people but excluding those who paid in the most for the surplus is not both waste and political favouritism? I beg to differ. Giving money to people less likely to spend it was going to do nothing to help the economy. I got nothing and had I been given the payment it would have likely been invested or left in the account for a long time. Well in my case probably not if it was just money that would have been its fate but in this type of case I would have gone out of my way to spend it appropriately, most wouldn't though.

Giving money to dead people and people living overseas...........brilliant idea.

The clubs saw a rise in their takings also, pokies included.

Dnarever wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 10:29am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 10:14am: Handing out $1,000 cheques to some people but excluding those who paid in the most for the surplus is not both waste and political favouritism? I beg to differ. Giving money to people less likely to spend it was going to do nothing to help the economy. I got nothing and had I been given the payment it would have likely been invested or left in the account for a long time. Well in my case probably not if it was just money that would have been its fate but in this type of case I would have gone out of my way to spend it appropriately, most wouldn't though.

borrowing money on world money markets (in direct competition with business and therefore disadvantaging business) and giving the money to the losers and wasters and bludgers to spend on cheap chinese made trinkets on ebay and in kmart.

smacking REDICULOUS.

give that money to small business and we'll grow that pie baby.  freaking morons these lefties, dont have a clue about anything but bribing brain dead losers with wads of cash. it is lunacy (and deep down you know that DNA) as you seem a reasonably intelligent fellow most of the time ;)

Yes for the most part I'd agree with that. What do they say about buying your friends......not worth having and that's just what Labor has attempted to do. Sooner or later the truth shines through, unfortunately the consequences in this case is an Australia left by the rats deep in debt.

So.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYquo--5tl0

Will it be Hockey, who is obviously out of his depth by far, or Robb...............or who?

:D

buzzanddidj wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 2:50am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 2:09am: The ( ... Australian) economy is not in an awesome shape that people would have you believe. We ALL know Howard had a bit of form in being less than forthcoming with the truth - but we doubt that this "talent" now extends to giving a Labor Government any tick of approval in economic management - where any tick of approval is not warranted Looking at the facts and figures ( ... not to mention a AAA credit rating consensus) he had no other options THERE HAS been a lot of misinformation around lately regarding the situation Australia currently finds itself in economically. The fact of the matter is you will struggle to find a country that is more envied for its financial position than Australia. The Global Financial Crisis that struck in September 2008 with the collapse of Lehman Brothers was the biggest financial shock the world has seen since the Great Depression. Global credit markets froze, global economic growth fell off a cliff, unemployment began to slide and people started losing their homes and the quality of life they were used to. Through it all Australia remained top of the heap on almost every count. The Government and the Treasurer have been talking about the attributes we should be proud of, when it comes to our economy, for years. They are right when they say we have: ■low debt; ■low unemployment; ■AAA credit rating from all three major ratings agencies; ■low inflation; and ■trend growth Australia’s debt is the second lowest in the OECD. Gross debt stands at 28.9% of GDP. This compares to Japan at 224%, Greece at 193.2%, Portugal at 133.1%, Italy at 129.6%, Ireland at 127.7%, United States at 113%, France at 108.2%, UK at 110.4%, Canada at 85.5%, Spain at 100.2% and Germany at 86.2%. We do not have high levels of debt. It is a red herring.

we DO have high levels of debt. in fact it is the largest in our history in dollar terms and very close to the largest in GDP terms. and what is worse is that only a mere 6 years ago we have NO DEBT at all.

Dnarever wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 9:30am:

Aussie wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 9:21am: Where does the gross debt of 28.9% of GDP come from?  I am sure I heard Swann say in his Budget Speech that it was 10/11% Debt to GDP is different from government debt. If you look at Andrei's full story he will tell you that Labor inherited a Debt to GDP of 9. something. You may recall that the conservatives claimed to have paid off the debt. Australias debt to GDP was never zero. The other conservatives want him to go away with this line as it does not really support the liberals view overall and in fact goes to display one of their real failures and broken promises.

NET DEBT... basically meaning there is more in the bank than there is in debt. At any single time the government is in debt for a whole host of things but in 2007 also had cash reserves in excess of the level of debt.

.....yet Andrei was talking about gross debt as a % of GDP.  You now refer to nett debt.

I don't believe either of you, but it is telling concerning Mr. Hicks who claims to be an international guru of all things economic.

:D

longweekend58 wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 8:04pm:

We DO have high levels of debt. In fact it is the largest in our history in dollar terms and very close to the largest in GDP terms. and what is worse is that only a mere 6 years ago we have NO DEBT at all.

Don't pretend to be STUPID
It doesn't BECOME you

Even John Howard is capable of coming clean with the TRUTH - occasionally - and giving credit, where credit is DUE






Quote:

Former prime minister John Howard gave the economy a big tick before Treasurer Wayne Swan delivered his sixth budget on Tuesday night. ''And our debt to GDP ratio, the amount of money we owe, to the strength of our economy, is still a lot better than most other countries,'' he said. He said Australia's economy was better than the economies of Japan, the US and most European countries. This is in stark contrast to his protege and Opposition Leader Tony Abbott's assessment of doom and gloom on Monday. http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/resilient-economy-in-better-shape-than-most-says-howard-20130514-2jke5.html#ixzz2Te3JNgsM

Australia’s GFC stimulus debt is the second lowest in the OECD.
Gross debt stands at 28.9% of GDP.

This compares to Japan at 224%,
Greece at 193.2%,
Portugal at 133.1%,
Italy at 129.6%,
Ireland at 127.7%,
United States at 113%,
France at 108.2%,
UK at 110.4%,
Canada at 85.5%,
Spain at 100.2%
Germany at 86.2%.






https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BGeNUmoCQAAGGVT.jpg

Aussie wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 8:13pm:

.....yet Andrei was talking about gross debt as a % of GDP.  You now refer to nett debt. I don't believe either of you, but it is telling concerning Mr. Hicks who claims to be an international guru of all things economic. :D

you can find the figures in the treasury statements at each budget and THEY refer to net debt. it is the common methodology for expressing a company's debt position.

buzzanddidj wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 8:54am:

longweekend58 wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 8:04pm: We DO have high levels of debt. In fact it is the largest in our history in dollar terms and very close to the largest in GDP terms. and what is worse is that only a mere 6 years ago we have NO DEBT at all. Don't pretend to be STUPID It doesn't BECOME you Even John Howard is capable of coming clean with the TRUTH - occasionally - and giving credit, where credit is DUE Quote: Former prime minister John Howard gave the economy a big tick before Treasurer Wayne Swan delivered his sixth budget on Tuesday night. ''And our debt to GDP ratio, the amount of money we owe, to the strength of our economy, is still a lot better than most other countries,'' he said. He said Australia's economy was better than the economies of Japan, the US and most European countries. This is in stark contrast to his protege and Opposition Leader Tony Abbott's assessment of doom and gloom on Monday. http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/resilient-economy-in-better-shape-than-most-says-howard-20130514-2jke5.html#ixzz2Te3JNgsM Australia’s GFC stimulus debt is the second lowest in the OECD. Gross debt stands at 28.9% of GDP. This compares to Japan at 224%, Greece at 193.2%, Portugal at 133.1%, Italy at 129.6%, Ireland at 127.7%, United States at 113%, France at 108.2%, UK at 110.4%, Canada at 85.5%, Spain at 100.2% Germany at 86.2%. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BGeNUmoCQAAGGVT.jpg

you have a poor definition of 'good'. all you need to do to be good is to be better than the mob of scumbags you hang around with. If you hang around with murderers then simply being a rapist makes you look good.

good performance is not RELATIVE, it is ABSOLUTE and BTW we were FIRST in debt position before this useless mob came to power.

Quote:

good performance is not RELATIVE, it is ABSOLUTE

Of course it's relative. Performance is a comparative measure.
You need something to use as a yard stick. In your case, the only yard stick you find acceptable is the previous government's performance - that's not the only valid one. Actually, that's probably the least valid as it ignores changes to outside forces and requires speculation on how that Government would have continued to perform.

Australia Gross Debt 2007 - 2013

2007 $58,284,000,000
2008 $60,462,000,000
2009 $101,147,000,000
2010 $147,133,000,000
2011 $191,291,000,000
2012 $233,976,000,000
2013 $254,000,000,000 (projected)

Increase in debt under ALP Government - $195,716,000,000
Increase of 335.8%

Debt to GDP 2007 - 9.7%
Debt to GDP 2013 - 28.9%

Life_goes_on wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 9:37am:

Quote: good performance is not RELATIVE, it is ABSOLUTE Of course it's relative. Performance is a comparative measure. You need something to use as a yard stick. In your case, the only yard stick you find acceptable is the previous government's performance - that's not the only valid one. Actually, that's probably the least valid as it ignores changes to outside forces and requires speculation on how that Government would have continued to perform.

if you want to use relative measurement then you need to be consistent and use relative RATE OF CHANGE. How about you measure the rate of increase in debt rather than the absolute figures???  Then of course you will find that Australia fares very badly having increased its debt at a faster rate than most of the others.

being a lap ahead in a race doesn't say much about you if you were 3 laps ahead earlier.

longweekend58 wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 9:50am:

Life_goes_on wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 9:37am: Quote: good performance is not RELATIVE, it is ABSOLUTE Of course it's relative. Performance is a comparative measure. You need something to use as a yard stick. In your case, the only yard stick you find acceptable is the previous government's performance - that's not the only valid one. Actually, that's probably the least valid as it ignores changes to outside forces and requires speculation on how that Government would have continued to perform. if you want to use relative measurement then you need to be consistent and use relative RATE OF CHANGE. How about you measure the rate of increase in debt rather than the absolute figures???  Then of course you will find that Australia fares very badly having increased its debt at a faster rate than most of the others. being a lap ahead in a race doesn't say much about you if you were 3 laps ahead earlier.

Consistent? How on earth is using relative rate of change being consistent? Consistent by who?
Again, you're simply cherry picking a measurement which produces a result that fits your viewpoint.
There isn't one simple yard stick you can use that gives an accurate indicator of the performance of a Government. You need to use more than just one.

Quote:

being a lap ahead in a race doesn't say much about you if you were 3 laps ahead earlier.

In a race, the only thing that counts is who is first past the post on that last lap.

Life_goes_on wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 10:36am:

Quote: being a lap ahead in a race doesn't say much about you if you were 3 laps ahead earlier. In a race, the only thing that counts is who is first past the post on that last lap.

if you are the 4th person in a 4X100 race and you start your leg 50M in front and end it 10M in front you will be viewed by everyone as a loser.

but in this case, swan started the last leg 50M in front of everyone and finished SECOND.

a bad performance all round.

Life_goes_on wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 10:08am:

longweekend58 wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 9:50am: Life_goes_on wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 9:37am: Quote: good performance is not RELATIVE, it is ABSOLUTE Of course it's relative. Performance is a comparative measure. You need something to use as a yard stick. In your case, the only yard stick you find acceptable is the previous government's performance - that's not the only valid one. Actually, that's probably the least valid as it ignores changes to outside forces and requires speculation on how that Government would have continued to perform. if you want to use relative measurement then you need to be consistent and use relative RATE OF CHANGE. How about you measure the rate of increase in debt rather than the absolute figures???  Then of course you will find that Australia fares very badly having increased its debt at a faster rate than most of the others. being a lap ahead in a race doesn't say much about you if you were 3 laps ahead earlier. Consistent? How on earth is using relative rate of change being consistent? Consistent by who? Again, you're simply cherry picking a measurement which produces a result that fits your viewpoint. There isn't one simple yard stick you can use that gives an accurate indicator of the performance of a Government. You need to use more than just one.

the only viable measurement of any govts performance is by comparing the starting position to the ending position. you'd find it near impossible to find a credible analyst who's say anything different.

longweekend58 wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 1:03pm:

Life_goes_on wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 10:36am: Quote: being a lap ahead in a race doesn't say much about you if you were 3 laps ahead earlier. In a race, the only thing that counts is who is first past the post on that last lap. if you are the 4th person in a 4X100 race and you start your leg 50M in front and end it 10M in front you will be viewed by everyone as a loser. but in this case, swan started the last leg 50M in front of everyone and finished SECOND. a bad performance all round.

As always, you think you know what everyone's opinion or thoughts are. I really doubt that once a the race is over, that many care or even remember anything other than who won it.

And Swan has finished second to who exactly? I'm unaware that there was someone else doing the exact same job at the same time. Who exactly are you comparing his performance to?

longweekend58 wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 9:03am:

buzzanddidj wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 8:54am: longweekend58 wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 8:04pm: We DO have high levels of debt. In fact it is the largest in our history in dollar terms and very close to the largest in GDP terms. and what is worse is that only a mere 6 years ago we have NO DEBT at all. Don't pretend to be STUPID It doesn't BECOME you Even John Howard is capable of coming clean with the TRUTH - occasionally - and giving credit, where credit is DUE Quote: Former prime minister John Howard gave the economy a big tick before Treasurer Wayne Swan delivered his sixth budget on Tuesday night. ''And our debt to GDP ratio, the amount of money we owe, to the strength of our economy, is still a lot better than most other countries,'' he said. He said Australia's economy was better than the economies of Japan, the US and most European countries. This is in stark contrast to his protege and Opposition Leader Tony Abbott's assessment of doom and gloom on Monday. http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/resilient-economy-in-better-shape-than-most-says-howard-20130514-2jke5.html#ixzz2Te3JNgsM Australia’s GFC stimulus debt is the second lowest in the OECD. Gross debt stands at 28.9% of GDP. This compares to Japan at 224%, Greece at 193.2%, Portugal at 133.1%, Italy at 129.6%, Ireland at 127.7%, United States at 113%, France at 108.2%, UK at 110.4%, Canada at 85.5%, Spain at 100.2% Germany at 86.2%. you have a poor definition of 'good'.

MY definition ?
I just presented the FACTS




https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BGeNUmoCQAAGGVT.jpg




The BIG ticks of APPROVAL come from ...

Standard & Poor's
Moody's
Fitch's
The Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD)
EuroMoney (Finance Minister of the Year Honours)
The International Monetary Fund (IMF)
The Reserve Bank of Australia (RBA)
The Australian Bureau of Statistics ( ... by stealth)
The Butcher
The Baker
The Candlestick Maker

... and NOW - a few days back - the former member for Bennelong


The ONLY talking down of the ecomomy and the Federal Treasurer is coming from the Opposition, NEWS Ltd - and Sydney shock-jocks


I know who I trust

Life_goes_on wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 1:23pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 1:03pm: Life_goes_on wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 10:36am: Quote: being a lap ahead in a race doesn't say much about you if you were 3 laps ahead earlier. In a race, the only thing that counts is who is first past the post on that last lap. if you are the 4th person in a 4X100 race and you start your leg 50M in front and end it 10M in front you will be viewed by everyone as a loser. but in this case, swan started the last leg 50M in front of everyone and finished SECOND. a bad performance all round. As always, you think you know what everyone's opinion or thoughts are. I really doubt that once a the race is over, that many care or even remember anything other than who won it. And Swan has finished second to who exactly? I'm unaware that there was someone else doing the exact same job at the same time. Who exactly are you comparing his performance to?

it gets harder and harder to get you to understand basic facts, nevermind metaphors. prior to Swan we had the LOWEST level of debt (ie zero) of the OECD. now we are the second lowest ergo we have fallen back one place.

and you can be very sure that a coach would soon trho off the team a final leg runner who took a 50M lead and turned it into a 10M lead. he would be gone double-quick.

buzzanddidj wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 3:53pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 9:03am: buzzanddidj wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 8:54am: longweekend58 wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 8:04pm: We DO have high levels of debt. In fact it is the largest in our history in dollar terms and very close to the largest in GDP terms. and what is worse is that only a mere 6 years ago we have NO DEBT at all. Don't pretend to be STUPID It doesn't BECOME you Even John Howard is capable of coming clean with the TRUTH - occasionally - and giving credit, where credit is DUE Quote: Former prime minister John Howard gave the economy a big tick before Treasurer Wayne Swan delivered his sixth budget on Tuesday night. ''And our debt to GDP ratio, the amount of money we owe, to the strength of our economy, is still a lot better than most other countries,'' he said. He said Australia's economy was better than the economies of Japan, the US and most European countries. This is in stark contrast to his protege and Opposition Leader Tony Abbott's assessment of doom and gloom on Monday. http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/resilient-economy-in-better-shape-than-most-says-howard-20130514-2jke5.html#ixzz2Te3JNgsM Australia’s GFC stimulus debt is the second lowest in the OECD. Gross debt stands at 28.9% of GDP. This compares to Japan at 224%, Greece at 193.2%, Portugal at 133.1%, Italy at 129.6%, Ireland at 127.7%, United States at 113%, France at 108.2%, UK at 110.4%, Canada at 85.5%, Spain at 100.2% Germany at 86.2%. you have a poor definition of 'good'. MY definition ? I just presented the FACTS https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BGeNUmoCQAAGGVT.jpg The BIG ticks of APPROVAL come from ... Standard & Poor's Moody's Fitch's The Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) EuroMoney (Finance Minister of the Year Honours) The International Monetary Fund (IMF) The Reserve Bank of Australia (RBA) The Australian Bureau of Statistics ( ... by stealth) The Butcher The Baker The Candlestick Maker ... and NOW - a few days back - the former member for Bennelong The ONLY talking down of the ecomomy and the Federal Treasurer is coming from the Opposition, NEWS Ltd - and Sydney shock-jocks I know who I trust

RELATIVE DETERMINATION. you don't define yourself as sane by comparing yourself to absolute lunatics.

At this rate if Abbott gets up.....it will not be Barnaby Joyce.

We can believe Polls can't we?

;)

Quote:

it gets harder and harder to get you to understand basic facts, nevermind metaphors. prior to Swan we had the LOWEST level of debt (ie zero) of the OECD. now we are the second lowest ergo we have fallen back one place.

Second lowest to Estonia?
Estonia who went from a comparable unemployment rate of around 4.2% in Jan 2008 through to 20% in Feb 2010 and is now currently sitting at around 10% unemployment?

I guess it depends on what you're using as your yardstick and what you consider more important: debt or unemployment?

Or just maybe a government's performance isn't based purely on debt, but rather a combination of factors.

buzzanddidj wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 3:53pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 9:03am: buzzanddidj wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 8:54am: longweekend58 wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 8:04pm: We DO have high levels of debt. In fact it is the largest in our history in dollar terms and very close to the largest in GDP terms. and what is worse is that only a mere 6 years ago we have NO DEBT at all. Don't pretend to be STUPID It doesn't BECOME you Even John Howard is capable of coming clean with the TRUTH - occasionally - and giving credit, where credit is DUE Quote: Former prime minister John Howard gave the economy a big tick before Treasurer Wayne Swan delivered his sixth budget on Tuesday night. ''And our debt to GDP ratio, the amount of money we owe, to the strength of our economy, is still a lot better than most other countries,'' he said. He said Australia's economy was better than the economies of Japan, the US and most European countries. This is in stark contrast to his protege and Opposition Leader Tony Abbott's assessment of doom and gloom on Monday. http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/resilient-economy-in-better-shape-than-most-says-howard-20130514-2jke5.html#ixzz2Te3JNgsM Australia’s GFC stimulus debt is the second lowest in the OECD. Gross debt stands at 28.9% of GDP. This compares to Japan at 224%, Greece at 193.2%, Portugal at 133.1%, Italy at 129.6%, Ireland at 127.7%, United States at 113%, France at 108.2%, UK at 110.4%, Canada at 85.5%, Spain at 100.2% Germany at 86.2%. you have a poor definition of 'good'. MY definition ? I just presented the FACTS https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BGeNUmoCQAAGGVT.jpg The BIG ticks of APPROVAL come from ... Standard & Poor's Moody's Fitch's The Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) EuroMoney (Finance Minister of the Year Honours) The International Monetary Fund (IMF) The Reserve Bank of Australia (RBA) The Australian Bureau of Statistics ( ... by stealth) The Butcher The Baker The Candlestick Maker ... and NOW - a few days back - the former member for Bennelong The ONLY talking down of the ecomomy and the Federal Treasurer is coming from the Opposition, NEWS Ltd - and Sydney shock-jocks I know who I trust

Too bloody right!!!

:)

longweekend58 wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 5:12pm:

.it gets harder and harder to get you to understand basic facts, nevermind metaphors. prior to Swan we had the LOWEST level of debt (ie zero) of the OECD. now we are the second lowest ergo we have fallen back one place. and you can be very sure that a coach would soon trho off the team a final leg runner who took a 50M lead and turned it into a 10M lead. he would be gone double-quick.

prior to Swan we had the LOWEST level of debt (ie zero)

Your friend Andrei keep putting the debt to GDP at about 10%.

you can be very sure that a coach would soon trho off the team a final leg runner who took a 50M lead and turned it into a 10M lead.

Runners get to run on the same track on the same day in the same conditions.

All you are really comparing is the best economic period in over a century to about the worst and pretending it makes no difference.

Why does the question, Who will be Treasurer after september, become a economics debate.

who has better gdp, and who survive the gfc better.

We didn't survive the GFC.

17 billion dollar debt , we failed.