But not to worry, Labor is bringing back to where it should be.

http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/17279341/budget-has-been-deteriorating-for-10-years/

righties not commenting on Howards legacy?

The mistake made by the Liberals was understandable but it really was a doosey from those wonderfull economic managers to screw us all up the way they have.

Dnarever wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 1:10pm:

The mistake made by the Liberals was understandable but it really was a doosey from those wonderfull economic managers to screw us all up the way they have.

funny how you blame howard for 4 of those ten years but have no blame whatsover for labor who presided of 6 of them,

longweekend58 wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 1:48pm:

Dnarever wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 1:10pm: The mistake made by the Liberals was understandable but it really was a doosey from those wonderfull economic managers to screw us all up the way they have. funny how you blame howard for 4 of those ten years but have no blame whatsover for labor who presided of 6 of them,

Seems someone has been asleep at the wheel for the past 6 years.

Labor was quick to change some of Howards policies, say border protection policy for instance I presume for the better because Labor knows best when it comes to humanitarian thingys doesn't it???????

But neither Rudd nor Dullard could see merit in winding back some tax policy.....who is to blame again...??

I have got a funny feeling Costello tried warning us about that even to the extent of saying start saving morons..stop borrowing for Xmas....mmmmmmmmmmm


and the other idiots said SPEND SPEND SPEND>>

cods wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 2:45pm:

I have got a funny feeling Costello tried warning us about that even to the extent of saying start saving morons..stop borrowing for Xmas....mmmmmmmmmmm and the other idiots said SPEND SPEND SPEND>>

Sadly the PMs that stuffed it up were Howard and Rudd..While he was Treasurer Costello had many arguments with Howard about the long term consequences of Howards waste

longweekend58 wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 1:48pm:

Dnarever wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 1:10pm: The mistake made by the Liberals was understandable but it really was a doosey from those wonderfull economic managers to screw us all up the way they have. funny how you blame howard for 4 of those ten years but have no blame whatsover for labor who presided of 6 of them,

it was Howard ... he is the one that taught all you morons the bad habit of expecting middle class welfare, bad habits are hard to break, top it all off with the GFC and it was always going to take a decade to get back on top.

cods wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 2:45pm:

I have got a funny feeling Costello tried warning us about that even to the extent of saying start saving morons..stop borrowing for Xmas....mmmmmmmmmmm and the other idiots said SPEND SPEND SPEND>>

was that before or after he was done with his spening spending spending?

longweekend58 wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 1:48pm:

Dnarever wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 1:10pm: The mistake made by the Liberals was understandable but it really was a doosey from those wonderfull economic managers to screw us all up the way they have. funny how you blame howard for 4 of those ten years but have no blame whatsover for labor who presided of 6 of them,

funny how you blame howard for 4 of those ten years

2002 to 2007 = 4 Years ????

Labor were responsible for 1 tax cut which contributed to the problem - the liberals had about 5 tax cuts which created the problem.

The question is why did Howard waste so much money while knowing the boom was only ever going to be a short term thing?
Did Howard want future generations to be lumbered with massive debt or was he trying to sabotage future govts or both?

adelcrow wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 3:45pm:

The question is why did Howard waste so much money while knowing the boom was only ever going to be a short term thing? Did Howard want future generations to be lumbered with massive debt or was he trying to sabotage future govts or both?

Howard knew he would be long gone before the sh it hit the fan. But I see as usual the same suspects defending the fvckwit. ::)

Let's give the country's money away.......we've got billions after Howard and Costello put Australia back in the black. We'll be very popular and when the GFC comes along we'll blame the shortfall we're creating on the Coalition........sound familiar? 

Socrates wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 3:48pm:

Let's give the country's money away.......we've got billions after Howard and Costello put Australia back in the black. We'll be very popular and when the GFC comes along we'll blame the shortfall we're creating on the Coalition........sound familiar?

It not 'we' making the claim, sh1tforbrains, it's the parliamentary budget office ... or are you another one thats going to claim any figures that don't prove your own bias as false?

It is beyond pathetic to blame the current problems on a PM that hasn't been in power for 6 years. Any changes in economic conditions and the affordability of certain welfare programs are the province of the current govt to ascertain and modify.  Why the hell do we even have a govt if they feel unable to change things?  After 6 years there is no one to blame but Labor.

longweekend58 wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 4:08pm:

It is beyond pathetic to blame the current problems on a PM that hasn't been in power for 6 years. Any changes in economic conditions and the affordability of certain welfare programs are the province of the current govt to ascertain and modify.  Why the hell do we even have a govt if they feel unable to change things?  After 6 years there is no one to blame but Labor.

why is it pathetic? How does time change anything? If he fcuked up, he fcuked up .... don't try to excuse it because it was 6 yrs ago.

I find it hard to believe that our lord and saviour and the greatest leader the world has ever known John Winston Howard would ever waste our money like the leftards are claiming. Lets face it..if it wasn't for Howard China would never have had the boom we rode on for several years.
Every Chinese schoolkid knows that so why do the leftards find it so hard to accept?  :D

longweekend58 wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 4:08pm:

It is beyond pathetic to blame the current problems on a PM that hasn't been in power for 6 years. Any changes in economic conditions and the affordability of certain welfare programs are the province of the current govt to ascertain and modify.  Why the hell do we even have a govt if they feel unable to change things?  After 6 years there is no one to blame but Labor.

Thats funny because you blame every Labor govt since Federation for everything thats gone wrong in your life  :D
More selective outrage?  :D

Howards gone guys.

get over it.

... wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 4:22pm:

Howards gone guys. get over it.

+1

John Smith wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 12:13pm:

But not to worry, Labor is bringing back to where it should be. http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/17279341/budget-has-been-deteriorating-for-10-years/

What a load of horse schitt.... ;D

Your getting desperate Smithy.... ;D

Swagman wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 4:47pm:

John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 12:13pm: But not to worry, Labor is bringing back to where it should be. http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/17279341/budget-has-been-deteriorating-for-10-years/ What a load of horse schitt.... ;D Your getting desperate Smithy.... ;D

How so? Are you under some sort of impression that I wrote the report?

John Smith wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 4:52pm:

Swagman wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 4:47pm: John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 12:13pm: But not to worry, Labor is bringing back to where it should be. http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/17279341/budget-has-been-deteriorating-for-10-years/ What a load of horse schitt.... ;D Your getting desperate Smithy.... ;D How so? Are you under some sort of impression that I wrote the report?

It's horse schitt because it excludes GST receipts.  Howard's income tax cuts were the result of the GST tax reform package.

Nothing stopped Labor from increasing income tax rates if they didn't agree with Howard's cuts.  They've had 6 years to do it.....Nope they just did what all Labor Governments do....they went overdrawn.  The overspent by $190 Billion in 5 budgets with another $18 Bill forcasted for next year. 

John Smith wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 4:11pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 4:08pm: It is beyond pathetic to blame the current problems on a PM that hasn't been in power for 6 years. Any changes in economic conditions and the affordability of certain welfare programs are the province of the current govt to ascertain and modify.  Why the hell do we even have a govt if they feel unable to change things?  After 6 years there is no one to blame but Labor. why is it pathetic? How does time change anything? If he fcuked up, he fcuked up .... don't try to excuse it because it was 6 yrs ago.

I dont believe he did. But if he did, the responsibility is for the current govt to FIX - not whine about 6 years later.

John Smith wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 12:13pm:

But not to worry, Labor is bringing back to where it should be. http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/17279341/budget-has-been-deteriorating-for-10-years/

How much you wanna bet that report was compiled by Labor hacks??? I'll take years of surpluses and zero debt over years of deficits and skyrocketing debt any day.

Armchair_Politician wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 5:45pm:

John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 12:13pm: But not to worry, Labor is bringing back to where it should be. http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/17279341/budget-has-been-deteriorating-for-10-years/ How much you wanna bet that report was compiled by Labor hacks??? I'll take years of surpluses and zero debt over years of deficits and skyrocketing debt any day.

you know a report is garbage when it somehow manages to agree with labor hype. Somehow howards $22B surplus sis a deficit but Swans last budget reduced this deficit.

Wayne Swan in his tenure has increased Australia's gross debt by 334%.

longweekend58 wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 8:36pm:

Armchair_Politician wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 5:45pm: John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 12:13pm: But not to worry, Labor is bringing back to where it should be. http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/17279341/budget-has-been-deteriorating-for-10-years/ How much you wanna bet that report was compiled by Labor hacks??? I'll take years of surpluses and zero debt over years of deficits and skyrocketing debt any day. you know a report is garbage when it somehow manages to agree with labor hype. Somehow howards $22B surplus sis a deficit but Swans last budget reduced this deficit.

Somehow howards $22B surplus sis a deficit

The other exagerators are only claiming that Howards $14B surplus was $20B you have increased it to $22B.
Think it may reach $30B by the election.

Somehow

You going to pretend that you don't understand exactly why? You may like to pretend that way or deny that there is any such thing as a structural deficit however I don't believe that you are stupid.

You may not like it but you do understand.

Swagman wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 5:08pm:

John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 4:52pm: Swagman wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 4:47pm: John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 12:13pm: But not to worry, Labor is bringing back to where it should be. http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/17279341/budget-has-been-deteriorating-for-10-years/ What a load of horse schitt.... ;D Your getting desperate Smithy.... ;D How so? Are you under some sort of impression that I wrote the report? It's horse schitt because it excludes GST receipts.  Howard's income tax cuts were the result of the GST tax reform package. Nothing stopped Labor from increasing income tax rates if they didn't agree with Howard's cuts.  They've had 6 years to do it.....Nope they just did what all Labor Governments do....they went overdrawn.  The overspent by $190 Billion in 5 budgets with another $18 Bill forcasted for next year.

The article is about the federal budget .. Gst receipts are collected on behalf of the states. They have nothing to do with the federal budget.

longweekend58 wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 5:44pm:

John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 4:11pm: longweekend58 wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 4:08pm: It is beyond pathetic to blame the current problems on a PM that hasn't been in power for 6 years. Any changes in economic conditions and the affordability of certain welfare programs are the province of the current govt to ascertain and modify.  Why the hell do we even have a govt if they feel unable to change things?  After 6 years there is no one to blame but Labor. why is it pathetic? How does time change anything? If he fcuked up, he fcuked up .... don't try to excuse it because it was 6 yrs ago. I dont believe he did. But if he did, the responsibility is for the current govt to FIX - not whine about 6 years later.

easier said than done ...they've had a few other things to worry about in the meantime. I know, you like to pretend every decision is about the budget and the GFC never happened, minority govt. never happened, but they did ... pull your head out of your ar$e and open your eyes.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 8:57pm:

Wayne Swan in his tenure has increased Australia's gross debt by 334%.

you chop and change from gross debt to net debt depending on the argument ... why don't you pick a figure and stick to it? afraid your argument doesn't stand on it's own merits without the embellishment?

It's hardly saying anything new.

From an opinion piece in The Australian, May 16, 2009.


Quote:

KEN Henry must have realised by now that his Treasury Department let the nation down at the last federal election.    The charter of budget honesty was meant to take the guesswork out of fiscal policy for voters because it gave Treasury the opportunity to update the numbers in the middle of the campaign. We were told there would be surpluses into the next decade. In fact, the budget was shot at the time of the election because too much of the revenue windfall from the resources boom had been handed back as tax cuts and increased spending. "The structural budget balance deteriorated from 2002-03, moving into structural deficit in 2006-07," Treasury said in budget paper No1 on Tuesday night. The Coalition will resist this reading of recent history. It will want to argue that a larger surplus on paper in the good times would have been untenable because the electorate wanted its money back. It should give up now. Peter Costello left a trail of clues in the extensive interviews he gave to authors before and after the election that John Howard's mania for spending was damaging the integrity of the budget.

John Smith wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 9:13pm:

Swagman wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 5:08pm: John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 4:52pm: Swagman wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 4:47pm: John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 12:13pm: But not to worry, Labor is bringing back to where it should be. http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/17279341/budget-has-been-deteriorating-for-10-years/ What a load of horse schitt.... ;D Your getting desperate Smithy.... ;D How so? Are you under some sort of impression that I wrote the report? It's horse schitt because it excludes GST receipts.  Howard's income tax cuts were the result of the GST tax reform package. Nothing stopped Labor from increasing income tax rates if they didn't agree with Howard's cuts.  They've had 6 years to do it.....Nope they just did what all Labor Governments do....they went overdrawn.  The overspent by $190 Billion in 5 budgets with another $18 Bill forcasted for next year.  The article is about the federal budget .. Gst receipts are collected on behalf of the states. They have nothing to do with the federal budget.

wrong  AGAIN!!!!  GST is collected BY the feds FOR the feds. as part of the current arrangements, all GST is returned to the states along with other federal grants etc. they form an integral part of the budget.

John Smith wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 9:16pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 8:57pm: Wayne Swan in his tenure has increased Australia's gross debt by 334%. you chop and change from gross debt to net debt depending on the argument ... why don't you pick a figure and stick to it? afraid your argument doesn't stand on it's own merits without the embellishment?

he has to use gross debt increase in percentasge terms because net debt was $0.  you cant show a percentage increase based on zero.

longweekend58

I only have one question on this dumb thread ..... if everything is either Howards fault or Abbott's fault or even Murdocks fault....... why do we need the ALP at all ?

RightSadFred wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 9:51am:

longweekend58 I only have one question on this dumb thread ..... if everything is either Howards fault or Abbott's fault or even Murdocks fault....... why do we need the ALP at all ?

Ive been wondering that myself. The govt isnt impotent although sometimes you ahve to wonder about this one.

John Smith wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 9:13pm:

Swagman wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 5:08pm: John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 4:52pm: Swagman wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 4:47pm: John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 12:13pm: But not to worry, Labor is bringing back to where it should be. http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/17279341/budget-has-been-deteriorating-for-10-years/ What a load of horse schitt.... ;D Your getting desperate Smithy.... ;D How so? Are you under some sort of impression that I wrote the report? It's horse schitt because it excludes GST receipts.  Howard's income tax cuts were the result of the GST tax reform package. Nothing stopped Labor from increasing income tax rates if they didn't agree with Howard's cuts.  They've had 6 years to do it.....Nope they just did what all Labor Governments do....they went overdrawn.  The overspent by $190 Billion in 5 budgets with another $18 Bill forcasted for next year.  The article is about the federal budget .. Gst receipts are collected on behalf of the states. They have nothing to do with the federal budget.

GST revenues may be directed at the States but they are collected by the commonwealth and form part of the Commonwealth budget. Read the budget papers Smithy.

Revenue

Expenditure

More revenue in from GST just meant less revenue from income tax was doled out to the States enabling income tax cuts to be made.

The report ignores this.  Just like the Henry tax reform review it ignores the GST.....

Judith Sloan:

But one of the messages of the estimates of the structural budget balances produced by Treasury and the PBO this week cannot go unchallenged. This message is that the budgetary pickle we are in is really all the fault of Howard and Peter Costello.

To be blunt, this is just rubbish. Even if we assume that Howard and Costello overspent by not producing even bigger cash surpluses, this government has had plenty of time to reverse the tax cuts and institute spending restraint. It has done neither.

And to blame other factors, such as the decision to abandon the indexation of petroleum excise, is just bizarre. Get over it, I say. The decision was taken by the Howard government. If the Labor government didn't like it, indexation could have been reinstated.

Economic pointy heads aside, I can't believe anyone is taking any notice of this arcane discussion of the true state of the budget. And bear in mind, the forecast improvement to the structural budget balance is completely dependent on the forward projections in this year's budget being met. The government has a very poor record when it comes to budget projections coming true.

The real discussion we need to have is that lower taxes are good - they encourage work effort and create incentives for investment and saving - and government spending needs to be limited and restricted to those areas with the highest net social benefits.

RightSadFred wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 9:51am:

longweekend58 I only have one question on this dumb thread ..... if everything is either Howards fault or Abbott's fault or even Murdocks fault....... why do we need the ALP at all ?

To fix the mess that Howard, Abbott and Murdock are and /or will make.

longweekend58 wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 9:40am:

John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 9:16pm: Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 22nd, 2013 at 8:57pm: Wayne Swan in his tenure has increased Australia's gross debt by 334%. you chop and change from gross debt to net debt depending on the argument ... why don't you pick a figure and stick to it? afraid your argument doesn't stand on it's own merits without the embellishment? he has to use gross debt increase in percentasge terms because net debt was $0.  you cant show a percentage increase based on zero.

And it compulsory to use a misleading percentage?

Forum rules require a worthless percentage to be used in support of all meaningless dribble?

Dnarever wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 12:58pm:

RightSadFred wrote on May 23rd, 2013 at 9:51am: longweekend58 I only have one question on this dumb thread ..... if everything is either Howards fault or Abbott's fault or even Murdocks fault....... why do we need the ALP at all ? To fix the mess that Howard, Abbott and Murdock are and /or will make.

Yes, invariably labor has had to come in and fix the liberals mess they create through inaction.

Whitlam had to bring Australia out of the 18th century.
Hawke had to bring Australia into the 20th century.
Rudd had to bring Australia out of the 1950's.

All come at a cost, but if you left liberals in power for too long, it feels like you are in a time machine going backwards.

Yeah yeah, someones just exited a union meeting with the usual lefty brainwashing.

Whitlam was a commie nut bag

Hawke was a drunk

Kevin was a lemon

and Julia is a liar

Not much to cheer about there comrades   ;D

Swagman wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 3:47pm:

Yeah yeah, someones just exited a union meeting with the usual lefty brainwashing. Whitlam was a commie nut bag Hawke was a drunk Kevin was a lemon and Julia is a liar Not much to cheer about there comrades   ;D

Whitlam : the last great reformer to lead Australia.

Hawke: didn't drink the whole time he spent as PM. (Howard used to fall asleep drunk in Parliament).

Julia: Has told less lies than Howard by about 1 to 50 and would rate at least the same against Abbott.

Dnarever wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 5:14pm:

Swagman wrote on May 23rd, 2013 at 3:47pm: Yeah yeah, someones just exited a union meeting with the usual lefty brainwashing. Whitlam was a commie nut bag Hawke was a drunk Kevin was a lemon and Julia is a liar Not much to cheer about there comrades   ;D Whitlam : the last great reformer to lead Australia. Hawke: didn't drink the whole time he spent as PM. (Howard used to fall asleep drunk in Parliament). Julia: Has told less lies than Howard by about 1 to 50 and would rate at least the same against Abbott.

of course you believe all that... what have you got if you dont?. 8-)

cods wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 5:18pm:

Dnarever wrote on May 23rd, 2013 at 5:14pm: Swagman wrote on May 23rd, 2013 at 3:47pm: Yeah yeah, someones just exited a union meeting with the usual lefty brainwashing. Whitlam was a commie nut bag Hawke was a drunk Kevin was a lemon and Julia is a liar Not much to cheer about there comrades   ;D Whitlam : the last great reformer to lead Australia. Hawke: didn't drink the whole time he spent as PM. (Howard used to fall asleep drunk in Parliament). Julia: Has told less lies than Howard by about 1 to 50 and would rate at least the same against Abbott. of course you believe all that... what have you got if you dont?.

Why wouldn't I - it is pretty much fact.