http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MDlZk89oaQ

LOL - they lost the debate.

I was going to post this myself. The third speaker for the affirmative was brilliant.

Mehdi hasan was brilliant.

Soren got owned.

Study shows Islam growing, Christianity declining in the UK


By: John Bingham

Source: telegraph.co.uk

A new analysis of the 2011 census shows that a decade of mass immigration helped mask the scale of decline in Christian affiliation among the British-born population – while driving a dramatic increase in Islam, particularly among the young.

It suggests that only a minority of people will describe themselves as Christians within the next decade, for first time.

Meanwhile almost one in 10 under 25s in Britain is now a Muslim.

The proportion of young people who describe themselves as even nominal Christians has dropped below half for the first time.

Initial results from the 2011 census published last year showed that the total number of people in England and Wales who described themselves as Christian fell by 4.1 million – a decline of 10 per cent.
But new analysis from the Office for National Statistics shows that that figure was bolstered by 1.2 million foreign-born Christians, including Polish Catholics and evangelicals from countries such as Nigeria.They disclosed that there were in fact 5.3 million fewer British-born people describing themselves as Christians, a decline of 15 per cent in just a decade.At the same time the number of Muslims in England and Wales surged by 75 per cent – boosted by almost 600,000 more foreign born followers of the Islamic faith.

While almost half of British Muslims are under the age of 25, almost a quarter of Christians are over 65.

The average age of a British Muslim is just 25, not far off half that of a British Christian.

Younger people also drove a shift away from religion altogether, with 6.4 million more people describing themselves as having no faith than 10 years earlier.

Secular campaigners said the new figures showed that Christianity had now dropped below “critical mass” making the case for disestablishing the Church of England stronger.

But the Church insisted that while there had been a significant drop in “nominal” Christians, the core of the Church remained firm.

Prof David Coleman, Professor of demography at Oxford University, said: “This is a very substantial change – it is difficult to see whether any other change in the census could have been remotely as big.

“But I wonder how far it reflects an overarching change in society where it is more acceptable more normal to say that you are not religious or are not Christian.”

Dr Fraser Watts, a Cambridge theologian, said it was “entirely possible” the people identifying themselves as Christians could become a minority within the next decade on the basis of the figures.

“It is still pretty striking and it is a worrying trend and confirms what anyone can observe – that in many churches the majority of the congregation are over 60,” he said.

Keith Porteous Wood, executive director of the National Secular Society, said the long-term reduction of Christianity, particularly among young people, was now “unstoppable”.

“In another 20 years there are going to be more active Muslims than there are churchgoers,” he said.

“The time has now come that institutional Christianity is no longer justified, the number has dropped below critical mass for which there is no longer any justification for the established Church, for example, or the monarch going through a religious ceremony at coronation.

“The expressions of optimism by the church are just completely misplaced.”

But a spokesman for the Church of England said: “These figures highlight the diversity of Christianity in this country today, something which has been increasing for decades and shows the relevance of Christianity to people from all backgrounds.

“These figures once again confirm that this remains a faithful nation and that the fall in the numbers identifying themselves as Christians is a challenge but – as you can see from the stability of Church of England attendance figures – the committed worshipping centre of the church remains firm.

“The challenge to the Church is to reconnect with the nominal.”

Neither of you have disputed, let alone refuted, anything Daniel Johnson said.
Because you can't.

shockresist wrote on Jul 15^th, 2013 at 5:50pm:

Mehdi hasan was brilliant. Soren got owned.

Owned? Good heavens, the old boy is free to think for himself! You must admit, in a civilised society, he does have that liberty.

He just chooses not to.

Scientific, innit. Superior logic. Common sense - on stilts.

Have another stilt - have two!

Lets see Daniel talk about rape of kids in the catholic church.

Soren wrote on Jul 15^th, 2013 at 8:38pm:

Neither of you have disputed, let alone refuted, anything Daniel Johnson said. Because you can't.

MOTION: THIS HOUSE BELIEVES ISLAM IS A RELIGION OF PEACE.
Yes’s: 286
No’s: 168

shockresist wrote on Jul 15^th, 2013 at 5:50pm:

Mehdi hasan was brilliant. Soren got owned.

Mehdi is a great speaker. Johnson just peddles lies and half-truths.

True Colours wrote on Jul 15^th, 2013 at 10:05pm:

Johnson just peddles lies and half-truths.

For example?

Daniel Johnson | Islam Is Not A Peaceful Religion | Oxford Union
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MDlZk89oaQ




Is Daniel Johnson, a [lefist] worm who has turned ?

Anyway, he gave a very good public oration about the 'cancer' in our midst, good on him for it.

And during the oration we could see many of the 'cancer cells' close by, squirming in discomfort!




Q.
Will we ever see such sentiments/arguments publicly expressed here in Australia on the ABC TV, 'Big Ideas', forum ???






+++




True Colours wrote on Jul 15^th, 2013 at 10:05pm:

shockresist wrote on Jul 15th, 2013 at 5:50pm: Mehdi hasan was brilliant. Soren got owned. Mehdi is a great speaker. Johnson just peddles lies and half-truths.

Are forums like this slowly dying?
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1365893107/5#5

Quote:

Open societies do not fear the opinions of fools. ....they rather, EXPOSE and laugh at folly! In any free and open debate, if a 'position' is absurd, if an 'argument' is absurd, ...then the debater is [often] condemned to all, WITH HIS OWN WORDS. And isn't the exposure of folly, and error, THE VERY FUNCTION, of free and open debate? Free and open debate *is meant* to be a contest of ideas! ....where every folly is revealed. And i would contend, that open debate is healthy, to all general freedoms in a society. Whereas, lies are easily concealed in closed societies, ....*because* these closed societies are places where lies, and falsehood, ....ARE NEVER EXPOSED TO SCRUTINY, OR SPOKEN TRUTH.

Yadda wrote on Jul 16^th, 2013 at 9:40am:

Anyway, he gave a very good public oration about the 'cancer' in our midst, good on him for it.

Hitler and Goebbels would be so proud of you Yadda. Do you believe your hatred is a great advertisement for your beliefs?

True Colours wrote on Jul 16^th, 2013 at 8:50pm:

Yadda wrote on Jul 16th, 2013 at 9:40am: Anyway, he gave a very good public oration about the 'cancer' in our midst, good on him for it. Hitler and Goebbels would be so proud of you Yadda.

I think what there trying to say here is that jews and christiand are peaceful.

Just ask the people of Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan and Chechnya.

shockresist wrote on Jul 16^th, 2013 at 9:01pm:

True Colours wrote on Jul 16th, 2013 at 8:50pm: Yadda wrote on Jul 16th, 2013 at 9:40am: Anyway, he gave a very good public oration about the 'cancer' in our midst, good on him for it. Hitler and Goebbels would be so proud of you Yadda. I think what there trying to say here is that jews and christiand are peaceful. Just ask the people of Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan and Chechnya.

I don't believe that it is credible in this information age;

http://www.jihadwatch.org/


THE RELIGION OF PEACE
http://thereligionofpeace.com/

...for moslems to incessantly and insistently make the claim that 'moslems are innocents', who are always the persecuted victims of others.

Or to make the claim that ISLAM can be realistically or credibly portrayed as a benevolent and virtuous philosophy.



Examining all of the freely available evidence [relating to the intent of ISLAM/moslems], it is clear [to all reasonable men in this age] that ISLAM is a vicious and malevolent philosophy, which is destructive to the human psyche.

And [it is clear to all reasonable men], that moslems [ALL moslems who have come of age], are a highly deceitful, malicious, malevolent and violent group of human beings, who justify and choose to live by a morality and set of rules/laws that are viewed as repugnant by almost all other human beings, who are not enthralled by ISLAM.








+++

Examples of information about moslem intent, which give the lie to claims of 'innocence' and 'virtue' of moslems [and the moslem community];





EXAMPLE #1;

"....the death of those who are killed for the cause of God gives more impetus to the cause, which continues to thrive on their blood."
ISLAMIC scholar, Sayyid Qutb

ISLAM makes lawful, any and every moslem lawlessness and savagery - so long as such ISLAMIC savagery is visited upon those persons who are outside of the moslem 'camp'.

How ?

Because ISLAM itself, 'legitimises' moslem lawlessness and savagery, against those who reject ISLAM.






EXAMPLE #2;

FROM ISLAM'S PRIMARY THEOLOGICAL TEXT.....

"....Lo! Allah is an enemy to those who reject Faith."
Koran 2.98


"....those who reject Allah have no protector."
Koran 47.008
v. 8-11






EXAMPLE #3;

ISLAM - deceitful, hateful, vicious, and without an ounce of integrity...

Please watch this YT...
Muslims being deceptive Islam EX-Muslims
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZx8cNSC9O0






EXAMPLE #4;


Quote:

Live in peace till strong enough to wage jihad, says UK Deoband scholar to Muslims London, Sept.8 [2007] A Deobandi scholar believes Muslims should preach peace till they are strong enough to undertake a jihad, or a holy war. Justice Muhammad Taqi Usmani was quoted by the BBC as saying that Muslims should live peacefully in countries such as Britain, where they have the freedom to practise Islam, only until they gain enough power to engage in battle. A former Sharia judge in Pakistan's Supreme Court, 64-year-old Usmani, is...a regular visitor to Britain. Polite and softly spoken.... He agreed that it was wrong to suggest that the entire non-Muslim world was intent on destroying Islam, but justifies an aggressive military jihad as a means of establishing global Islamic supremacy.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article2409833.ece






EXAMPLE #5;

Islam's Hatred of the Non-Muslim
http://www.meforum.org/3545/islam-hatred-non-muslim

Quote:

....Supremacy of the Muslim and the Way of War ....Being God's chosen people, Muslims need have no guilt or remorse toward the infidels. The world is divided into two distinct realms: Dar al-Islam (the house of submission) and Dar al-Harb (the house of the sword), and the normal and only justified relationship between the two is a state of perpetual war. There can be no peace with non-Muslims, only temporary truces.[64] Islam's concept of a just war is any war directed against the infidels, whatever its causes and circumstances, since fighting the infidel is always morally justified and religiously legitimized. .....Islam then sees war as the means of creating peace by subjugating all others and enforcing Islamic order. A pax Islamica covering the globe is the aim of jihad, and therefore, it is a just war. A hudna or truce does not imply the abandonment of jihad but rather a suspension of hostilities, a dormant status from which a leader may revive fighting at any time at his will.[66] For the Muslim, a permanent peace is a theological state to be achieved for the sake of the good (al-Wala) rather than a political one, which is no more than a temporary truce to gain strategic advantage.

IN THEIR PORTRAYING ISLAM [to non-moslems] AS A VIRTUOUS AND BENIGN PHILOSOPHY,
ALL MOSLEMS, ARE COMPLICIT, IN LYING THROUGH THEIR TEETH

shockresist wrote on Jul 16^th, 2013 at 9:01pm:

True Colours wrote on Jul 16th, 2013 at 8:50pm: Yadda wrote on Jul 16th, 2013 at 9:40am: Anyway, he gave a very good public oration about the 'cancer' in our midst, good on him for it. Hitler and Goebbels would be so proud of you Yadda. I think what there trying to say here is that jews and christiand are peaceful. Just ask the people of Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan and Chechnya.

A LYING DECEITFUL 'MAINSTREAM' MOSLEM COMMUNITY, are using sophistry and blatant unashamed deceit to deceive local non-moslem host communities, about the nature of ISLAM/moslems....

["unashamed deceit" - when their deceit is exposed, moslems will barefacedly deny the evidence of their deceit.]



EXAMPLE #1,

The Muslim Council of Britain [which presents itself as the umbrella organisation, in the UK, representing all British 'mainstream' moslems] declares on its website that the moslem community, condemns extremism and violence....


Quote:

Rejecting Terror Thursday, 11 April 2013 Muslims everywhere consider all acts of terrorism that aims to murder and maim innocent human beings utterly reprehensible and abhorrent. There is no theological basis whatsoever for such acts in our faith. The very meaning of the word 'Islam' is peace. It rejects terror and promotes peace and harmony.

http://www.mcb.org.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=2307:mcbnewstemplate&catid=82:mcb-news
http://www.mcb.org.uk/article_detail.php?article=announcement-656




YET, FROM ISLAM'S PRIMARY THEOLOGICAL TEXT.....


"O ye who believe! Fight those of the disbelievers who are near to you, and let them find harshness in you, and know that Allah is with those who keep their duty (unto Him)."
Koran 9.123


"Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain:...."
Koran 9.111iEXAMPLE #2,

Speaking in the UK, publicly, AND THEN PRIVATELY, regarding the London 7/7 bombing victims.


Quote:

"......In public interviews Bakri condemned the killing of all innocent civilians. Later when he addressed his own followers he explained that he had in fact been referring only to Muslims as only they were innocent: Yes I condemn killing any innocent people, but not any kuffar."

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2087-1724541,00.html





EXAMPLE #3,

a deceit, that is endorsed by 'mainstream' ISLAM, as per revealed by this moslem scholar......


Quote:

Live in peace till strong enough to wage jihad, says UK Deoband scholar to Muslims London, Sept.8 [2007] A Deobandi scholar believes Muslims should preach peace till they are strong enough to undertake a jihad, or a holy war. Justice Muhammad Taqi Usmani was quoted by the BBC as saying that Muslims should live peacefully in countries such as Britain, where they have the freedom to practise Islam, only until they gain enough power to engage in battle. A former Sharia judge in Pakistan's Supreme Court, 64-year-old Usmani, is...a regular visitor to Britain. Polite and softly spoken.... He agreed that it was wrong to suggest that the entire non-Muslim world was intent on destroying Islam, but justifies an aggressive military jihad as a means of establishing global Islamic supremacy.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article2409833.ece

Bibles theological text,


Matthew 23

You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell? 34Therefore I am sending you prophets and wise men and teachers. Some of them you will kill and crucify; others you will flog in your synagogues and pursue from town to town. 35And so upon you will come all the righteous blood that has been shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36I tell you the truth, all this will come upon this generation.


Deuteronomy 20:10-14

As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace.  If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor.  But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town.  When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town.  But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder.  You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you.

shockresist wrote on Jul 17^th, 2013 at 7:44am:

Bibles theological text, Matthew 23 You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell? 34Therefore I am sending you prophets and wise men and teachers. Some of them you will kill and crucify; others you will flog in your synagogues and pursue from town to town. 35And so upon you will come all the righteous blood that has been shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36I tell you the truth, all this will come upon this generation. Deuteronomy 20:10-14 As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace.  If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor.  But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town.  When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town.  But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder.  You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you.

Does Deuteronomy 20:10-14 indicate a ruthless, uncaring God ???

Read on.....




Exodus 12:49
One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you.

Exodus 22:21
Thou shalt neither vex a stranger, nor oppress him...

Exodus 23:9
Also thou shalt not oppress a stranger...

Leviticus 19:33
And if a stranger sojourn with thee in your land, ye shall not vex him.
34  But the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself...

n.b.
.....and thou shalt love him as thyself

Leviticus 25:47-49
[these verses clearly speak of [and reveal that it was entirely 'lawful'] for Hebrews [themselves] to become bond servants [slaves], to prosperous strangers living among the Hebrews.]

Deuteronomy 1:16
And I charged your judges at that time, saying, Hear the causes between your brethren, and judge righteously between every man and his brother, and the stranger that is with him.

Deuteronomy 10:17-19
For the LORD your God... loveth the stranger, ...Love ye therefore the stranger: for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt.

Deuteronomy 24:17
Thou shalt not pervert the judgment of the stranger, nor of the fatherless; nor take a widow's raiment to pledge:
18  But thou shalt remember that thou wast a bondman in Egypt, and the LORD thy God redeemed thee thence: therefore I command thee to do this thing.

Deuteronomy 27:19
Cursed be he that perverteth the judgment of the stranger...






My God does not kill people [or justify the killing of people] because they are not/or were not, 'Hebrews' - nor for the reason that they were 'unbelievers'.

Those who were killed, in the land of Israel [e.g. Deuteronomy 20:10-14], were killed, so as to cleanse the land, of the wicked actions of those people.



Deuteronomy 12:28
Observe and hear all these words which I command thee, that it may go well with thee, and with thy children after thee for ever, when thou doest that which is good and right in the sight of the LORD thy God.
29  When the LORD thy God shall cut off the nations from before thee, whither thou goest to possess them, and thou succeedest them, and dwellest in their land;
30  Take heed to thyself that thou be not snared by following them, after that they be destroyed from before thee; and that thou enquire not after their gods, saying, How did these nations serve their gods? even so will I do likewise.
31  Thou shalt not do so unto the LORD thy God: for every abomination to the LORD, which he hateth, have they done unto their gods; for even their sons and their daughters they have burnt in the fire to their gods.
32  What thing soever I command you, observe to do it: thou shalt not add thereto, nor diminish from it.






Deuteronomy 11:12
A land which the LORD thy God careth for: the eyes of the LORD thy God are always upon it, from the beginning of the year even unto the end of the year.

Far from what some people [e.g. moslems] like to suggest/portray,
THERE IS NO MORAL EQUIVALENCE BETWEEN CHRISTIANITY [with Judaism], AND ISLAM.



For moslems to suggest that there is a moral equivalence between ISLAM, and Christianity [and Judaism], is yet another moslem deceit - being proffered to the uninformed and the ignorant.

Yadda wrote on Jul 17^th, 2013 at 8:40am:

Far from what some people [e.g. moslems] like to suggest/portray, THERE IS NO MORAL EQUIVALENCE BETWEEN CHRISTIANITY [with Judaism], AND ISLAM.

Agree. Islam is far more moral.

True Colours wrote on Jul 17^th, 2013 at 11:29am:

Yadda wrote on Jul 17th, 2013 at 8:40am: Far from what some people [e.g. moslems] like to suggest/portray, THERE IS NO MORAL EQUIVALENCE BETWEEN CHRISTIANITY [with Judaism], AND ISLAM. Agree. Islam is far more moral.

Islam prescribes 100 lashes for consenting sex outside of marriage

Islam prescribes stoning to death for adultery.


Quote:

There is no prescribed punishment for one who has sexual intercourse with an animal www.sunnah.com/abudawud/40/115

Pakistan leads the world in google searches for donkey sex. ;D

True Colours wrote on Jul 17^th, 2013 at 11:29am:

Yadda wrote on Jul 17th, 2013 at 8:40am: Far from what some people [e.g. moslems] like to suggest/portray, THERE IS NO MORAL EQUIVALENCE BETWEEN CHRISTIANITY [with Judaism], AND ISLAM. Agree. Islam is far more moral.

TC,

You are insane, imo, to suggest that.




http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1354166840/18#18

http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1354166840/19#19

True Colours wrote on Jul 17^th, 2013 at 11:29am:

Yadda wrote on Jul 17th, 2013 at 8:40am: Far from what some people [e.g. moslems] like to suggest/portray, THERE IS NO MORAL EQUIVALENCE BETWEEN CHRISTIANITY [with Judaism], AND ISLAM. Agree. Islam is far more moral.

TC,

You are insane, imo, to suggest that.



e.g....



July 12, 2008
Pakistan: Christian girls kidnapped; captors file for custody, claiming girls converted to Islam
And the police weren't about to be of any help without outside pressure: The girls' father "was told to 'remain silent,' as the officers said the girls had embraced Islam in a written statement."
"Pakistan: Girls kidnapped, allegedly forced to convert,"
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2008/07/pakistan-christian-girls-kidnapped-captors-file-for-custody-claiming-girls-converted-to-islam.html

"The girls' father "was told to 'remain silent,' "


The 'prophet' of ISLAM said that, a persons silence is [their] consent.

That means that to moslems,  ........>> OUR silence << signals OUR agreement [with what moslems do].

Google;
mohammed, silence is consent



the very same Christian girls [above], update....


July 14, 2008
Pakistan: 13- and 10-year-old girls abducted, raped, and forced into the fold of Islam
More Christian girls being forced to convert to the religion of peace. As this report notes, the Muslim majority, including the police, are either actively or passively aiding the abductors, a common phenomenon in Muslim majority countries, such as Egypt, where Coptic girls are regularly abducted.
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2008/07/pakistan-13--and-10-year-old-girls-abducted-raped-and-forced-into-the-fold-of-islam.html


the very same Christian girls [above], update....


July 20, 2008
Pakistan: Court grants custody of Christian girls to Muslim kidnappers
Because they converted to Islam, you see. More on this story. "Pakistan: Court Grants Custody of Girls to Kidnappers," from Compass Direct News, July 18:
  ISTANBUL, July 18 (Compass Direct News) A Pakistani couple has appealed a court decision to award custody of their two daughters, 10 and 13, to the children’s alleged kidnappers. The court based its custody decision on the girls’ conversion to Islam.
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2008/07/pakistan-court-grants-custody-of-christian-girls-to-muslim-kidnappers.html





Pakistan: New details may re-open case of sisters kidnapped and forced to convert to Islam
An update on this story. "Pakistan: Girl's account re-opens custody fight for sisters," from Compass Direct News, October 24:
    ISTANBUL, Turkey, October 24 (Compass Direct News) - Lawyers for two underage Christian sisters who were kidnapped plan to renew a custody fight for the older girl, a 13-year-old allegedly coerced into marrying her captor, based on new statements from her 10-year-old sister that they were raped and forced to convert to Islam.
    The plans come after the court last month allowed 13-year-old Saba Masih to decide whether to return to her parents or remain with her husband; apparently still terrified from death threats, she chose to remain with her captor. Amjad Ali married Saba Masih shortly after the girls were kidnapped on June 26.
    In the Sept. 9 ruling the court ordered the return of her 10-year-old sister, Aneela Masih, to her parents, a move lawyers hail as a rare and significant victory for human rights in Pakistan.
    Since her release Aneela Masih has told her uncle, Khalid Raheel, previously unknown details of the sisters’ capture, including rape and forced conversion to Islam, according to the Centre for Legal Aid Assistance and Settlement (CLAAS).
    Aneela Masih told Raheel that she and her sister were kidnapped when they stopped to buy fruit en route to their uncle’s home. The sisters were taken away by taxi and then raped, she said. After being tied up and locked in a room, she told him, the two were forced to make professions of Islamic faith.
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2008/10/pakistan-new-details-may-re-open-case-of-sisters-kidnapped-and-forced-to-convert-to-islam.html


Pakistan: Christian girls and women, some already married, abducted and forcibly converted to Islam
The marriages of captives are abrogated, by order of the Qur'an: "And all married women (are forbidden unto you) save those (captives) whom your right hands possess. It is a decree of Allah for you" (4:24).
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2012/01/pakistan-christian-girls-some-already-married-abducted-and-forcibly-converted.html


[size=14]Pakistan: Hindu girl Rinkle Kumari kidnapped and forcibly converted to Islam
"It has been decades that Hindu girls have been abducted and forcibly converted. We hear little or no voice at all against this oppression." Indeed, this is a human rights abuse that the world ignores.
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2012/05/pakistan-hindu-girl-rinkle-kumari-kidnapped-and-forcibly-converted-to-islam.html


And on, and on, and on....
http://www.jihadwatch.org/non-muslims-in-muslim-countries/

Yadda wrote on Jul 17^th, 2013 at 8:40am:

Far from what some people [e.g. moslems] like to suggest/portray, THERE IS NO MORAL EQUIVALENCE BETWEEN CHRISTIANITY [with Judaism], AND ISLAM. For moslems to suggest that there is a moral equivalence between ISLAM, and Christianity [and Judaism], is yet another moslem deceit - being proffered to the uninformed and the ignorant.

Your absolutely right.

There is no equivialency between christinaity and islam.

Islam is the pure religion, they testify in one God and that Prophet Mohamed is the Final messenger.They have a book which has not ever been changed, modified or altered.

Unline christinaity, you don't know who is who.Is jesus god?Is jesus son of god? Three gods in one? Jesus is a man?

The bible has been changed and altered and even biblical scholars say there are 5000 mistakes in the bible.What god would make so much mistakes?

Jesus even predicts the coming of Mohamed as the comforter,


JOHN 15:26:  "When the Comforter comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who goes out from the Father, he will testify about me."

Islam is a peaceful religion...YEAH RIGHT!..Latest example:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-23337659

Khamis had no other choice than to leave his house in the village of Dalga, near the central Egyptian city of Minya. After an arson attack on his cousin's house and the fatal shooting of another relative, he fled into hiding with his wife and six children.

He said they had been singled out for no other reason than being Christians.

"It was a terrible night," recalled Khamis, who agreed to talk to us but did not want to be identified. Khamis is not his real name.

Khamis recounted what happened on the night of 3 July, when the army deposed Islamist former President Mohammed Morsi.

"Angry mobs and thugs rampaged through houses owned by Christians. They started with the house of my cousin, looting and setting it on fire. We weren't taking any chances - we fled the village."

more:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-23337659

Today's generation of self centered narcissists will only get it when it comes a knockin on their own door.Even then they will try to sue the government first for compensation before finally realizing they only have themselves to blame.

Baronvonrort wrote on Jul 17^th, 2013 at 12:40pm:

There is no prescribed punishment for one who has sexual intercourse with an animal

You truly are an ignoramus.


Quote:

Whoever you find unto (having sex with) an animal, kill him and kill the animal with him. - Tirmithi

What is going on in these Christian countries? First the US military permits its members to perform bestiality, now this in Germany:



Quote:

Bestiality brothels are 'spreading through Germany' warns campaigner as abusers turn to sex with animals as 'lifestyle choice' Animal welfare officer Madeleine Martin problem of 'erotic zoos' is growing She tells of farmer whose once friendly sheep began refusing human contact So when he put CCTV in his barn he watched men file in and abuse his herd Bestiality brothels are spreading through Germany faster than ever thanks to a law that makes animal porn illegal but sex with animals legal, a livestock protection officer has warned. Madeleine Martin told the Frankfurter Rundschau that current laws were not protecting animals from predatory zoophiles who are increasingly able to turn to bestiality as a 'lifestyle choice'. She highlighted one case where a farmer in the Gross-Gerau region of southwest Germany, noticed his once friendly flock of sheep were beginning to shy away from human contact. So he rigged a CCTV camera in the rafters of his barn to discover multiple men sneaking in during the night to sexually abuse his beloved livestock. 'There are now animal brothels in Germany,' Martin told the paper, adding that people were playing down the issue by by describing it as a 'lifestyle choice'. Armed with a host of similar case studies, Ms Martin is now calling for the government to categorically ban bestiality across the country. Last November German authorities said they were planning to reinstate an old law forbidding sex with animals after a sharp rise in incidents of bestiality along with websites promoting it... ...Bestiality dropped off the statute books as a crime in 1969 but in recent years the number of people believed to be participating in such acts has increased significantly. There are even 'erotic zoos' which people can visit to abuse animals ranging from llamas to goats. :o German 'zoophile' group ZETA has announced it will mount a legal challenge should a ban on bestiality become law. 'Mere concepts of morality have no business being law,' said ZETA chairman Michael Kiok... DailyMail, 1 July 2013

True Colours wrote on Jul 17^th, 2013 at 1:33pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Jul 17th, 2013 at 12:40pm: There is no prescribed punishment for one who has sexual intercourse with an animal You truly are an ignoramus. Quote: Whoever you find unto (having sex with) an animal, kill him and kill the animal with him. - Tirmithi What is going on in these Christian countries? First the US military permits its members to perform bestiality, now this in Germany: [quote]Bestiality brothels are 'spreading through Germany' warns campaigner as abusers turn to sex with animals as 'lifestyle choice' Animal welfare officer Madeleine Martin problem of 'erotic zoos' is growing She tells of farmer whose once friendly sheep began refusing human contact So when he put CCTV in his barn he watched men file in and abuse his herd Bestiality brothels are spreading through Germany faster than ever thanks to a law that makes animal porn illegal but sex with animals legal, a livestock protection officer has warned. Madeleine Martin told the Frankfurter Rundschau that current laws were not protecting animals from predatory zoophiles who are increasingly able to turn to bestiality as a 'lifestyle choice'. She highlighted one case where a farmer in the Gross-Gerau region of southwest Germany, noticed his once friendly flock of sheep were beginning to shy away from human contact. So he rigged a CCTV camera in the rafters of his barn to discover multiple men sneaking in during the night to sexually abuse his beloved livestock. 'There are now animal brothels in Germany,' Martin told the paper, adding that people were playing down the issue by by describing it as a 'lifestyle choice'. Armed with a host of similar case studies, Ms Martin is now calling for the government to categorically ban bestiality across the country. Last November German authorities said they were planning to reinstate an old law forbidding sex with animals after a sharp rise in incidents of bestiality along with websites promoting it... ...Bestiality dropped off the statute books as a crime in 1969 but in recent years the number of people believed to be participating in such acts has increased significantly. There are even 'erotic zoos' which people can visit to abuse animals ranging from llamas to goats. :o German 'zoophile' group ZETA has announced it will mount a legal challenge should a ban on bestiality become law. 'Mere concepts of morality have no business being law,' said ZETA chairman Michael Kiok... DailyMail, 1 July 2013

[/quote]

Perhaps you should read Soren's post here:reply 22

http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1371594464/15

It reflects the growing trend of lefties who are turning their nose up at anything that could be construed as "of the establishment"..hardly anything to do with christians..rather atheists

shockresist wrote on Jul 17^th, 2013 at 1:01pm:

Yadda wrote on Jul 17th, 2013 at 8:40am: Far from what some people [e.g. moslems] like to suggest/portray, THERE IS NO MORAL EQUIVALENCE BETWEEN CHRISTIANITY [with Judaism], AND ISLAM. For moslems to suggest that there is a moral equivalence between ISLAM, and Christianity [and Judaism], is yet another moslem deceit - being proffered to the uninformed and the ignorant. Your absolutely right. There is no equivialency between christinaity and islam. Islam is the pure religion, they testify in one God and that Prophet Mohamed is the Final messenger.They have a book which has not ever been changed, modified or altered.

Sure it got changed.

Its just that moslems continue to deny that the Koran is a fabrication, even when scientists have proven that the Koran is a fabrication


Google;
Quranic Manuscripts Sana






Quote:

Unline christinaity, you don't know who is who.Is jesus god?Is jesus son of god? Three gods in one? Jesus is a man?

shockresist,

Not me.

It is you, who does not know who Jesus is.

Three Gods in one ?

No.


Deuteronomy 6:4
Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:








Quote:

The bible has been changed and altered and even biblical scholars say there are 5000 mistakes in the bible.What god would make so much mistakes?

So, your an expert of the Jewish and Christian bibles ?            ;D

Sure.








Quote:

Jesus even predicts the coming of Mohamed as the comforter, JOHN 15:26:  "When the Comforter comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who goes out from the Father, he will testify about me."

Dream on white boy!     LOL

Yes folks, Mohammed is the comforter of mankind!!       LOL






+++



shockresist,

Read the bible - yes, it is a large manuscript.

Read about the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls - and the implications of their discovery.

Read about the discovery of the Sana Quranic Manuscripts - and the implications for the validity of the Koran, of their discovery!!         :P



And if after you have done those things, if you still believe that Mohammed is the comforter of mankind, well that is OK.

You can believe whatever you want to believe.

And i won't cut your head off.

I don't need to.

brumbie wrote on Jul 17^th, 2013 at 1:21pm:

Islam is a peaceful religion...YEAH RIGHT!

brumbie,

I does not matter how much evidence you provide, which shows how mendacious moslems ARE, and which demonstrates how wicked, immoral, and irrational, moslems ARE,
.....moslems will simply ignore all evidences which 'slander' ISLAM.

ISLAM has bent the minds of moslems, so that moslems can no longer react to data with any rational response.

In the mind of the moslem;

Moslems are righteous and correct [no matter how immoral or irrational they behave], because they are justified by ISLAM.

In the mind of the moslem;
...murder is lawful, because the murder of Allah's enemies is justified by ISLAM.

And anyone who disagrees with them [them! the 'rightly guided'], is an enemy of Allah.
i.e.
All of mankind.





In the mind of the moslem;

Moslems are always righteous and correct - hey! they are moslems!

And all of unbelieving mankind, are the servants of SATAN.

.....so any punishment which the moslem can inflict, upon the enemies of Allah, is righteous and is a good work.




+++

MURDERING INFIDELS WHO RESIST THE MOSLEMS, IS TOTALLY RIGHTEOUS AND IS TOTALLY JUSTIFIED.
......Allah has said so;



Koran 2.98
Koran 47:8-11
Koran 4.74-76

The content of those three Koran verse groups, together, form a 'virtuous circle'.

Each verse group firstly confirms and then reinforces the ISLAMIC 'religious' paradigm, that;
1/    unbelief [in man] is a serious 'religious' crime, and that,
2/    the 'criminals' [i.e. the 'unbelievers'] deserve every punishment they get, and the 'criminals' are outside of the protection of law, and that,
3/    good moslems have an obligation to,    ....'fight in the cause of Allah' , and all good moslems are 'rightly guided' and are justified in their 'crime fighting'.




Those arguments [above] are 'logically' demonstrated...

1/    "...Allah is an enemy to those who reject Faith." [i.e. 'Unbelief' [in man] is a crime.].
Koran 2.98
[ - - The enemy of moslems is identified. All of 'unbelieving' mankind, are the declared enemy of moslems.]

2/    "...those who reject Allah have no protector."
Koran 47:8-11
[ - - Here, it is clearly stated to every good moslem, that moslem enmity, violence, and warfare, against 'those who reject Faith', is morally justified, and 'lawful'. /sarc off]

3/    "...And why should ye not fight in the cause of Allah and of [i.e. for] those who, being weak, are ill-treated (and oppressed)?...Those who believe fight in the cause of Allah, and those who reject Faith Fight in the cause of Evil: So fight ye against the friends of Satan:.."
Koran 4.74-76
[ - - Those who reject 'Faith' are ipso facto, 'rightly' deemed, by ISLAM and by Allah, as being innately evil. Therefore those who reject 'Faith', are described as 'oppressors', and are the rightful targets of moslem enmity, violence, and warfare.
...'those who reject Faith' are described [Koran 4.74-76], as 'oppressors' and as, 'the friends of Satan'.]



Once again, the 'theology' which ISLAM inculcates into the psyche of all moslems, is this;...

1/    'Unbelief' [in man] is a crime.
2/    The 'criminals' have no 'lawful' protection whatsoever.
3/    The crime of 'unbelief' >> must << be punished by good moslems, and the punishment of 'unbelief' is morally justified, because, the 'unbelievers' are in league with evil forces, and they are the oppressors of the people [stated in Koran 4.74-76].

Yadda hates Jesus Christ the most

And we all know why don't we ladies and gentlemen.

Chimp_Logic wrote on Jul 18^th, 2013 at 1:17am:

Yadda hates Jesus Christ the most And we all know why don't we ladies and gentlemen.

Do we chimp ?

Enlighten us.

shockresist wrote on Jul 17^th, 2013 at 1:01pm:

Islam is the pure religion, they testify in one God and that Prophet Mohamed is the Final messenger.

"Alice Soren laughed: "There's no use trying," she he said; "one can't believe impossible things."

"I daresay you haven't had much practice," said the Queen Shockresist. "When I was younger, I always did it for half an hour a day. Why, sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast."

Yadda wrote on Jul 18^th, 2013 at 1:49am:

Chimp_Logic wrote on Jul 18th, 2013 at 1:17am: Yadda hates Jesus Christ the most And we all know why don't we ladies and gentlemen. Do we chimp ? Enlighten us.

I come not to bring peace, but a sword.

Karnal wrote on Jul 18^th, 2013 at 10:31am:

Yadda wrote on Jul 18th, 2013 at 1:49am: Chimp_Logic wrote on Jul 18th, 2013 at 1:17am: Yadda hates Jesus Christ the most And we all know why don't we ladies and gentlemen. Do we chimp ? Enlighten us. I come not to bring peace, but a sword.

Proverbs 28:5
Evil men understand not judgment: but they that seek the LORD understand all things.




K,

I do not 'follow' your explanation.

Why do i hate Jesus ?








K,

Is justice/judgement a fairytale?       [i.e. something unreal, and unobtainable, in the society of man ? ]

Is that what you think ?

We are going to going to have to 're-compute'.

For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction.
Newton's Third Law of Motion








Within a society of man, only truth and judgement [of wrong doing] brings peace.

The discomfort of judgement is not welcomed by the wrong doers.

Rather, the wrong doers, like to call judgement, 'injustice'.

Wrong doers are in rebellion - against,     justice, truth.

Poor things.





Black is white.

White is black.

Up is down.

Down is up.

Do you really believe that, K ?



It does not work, K.

All of the whores and all of the liars, are going to be 'brought to book'.             :'(

Good.              ;D



AGAIN....
For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction.
Newton's Third Law of Motion






Is Atheism a Religion?
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1304543494/651#651

K,

All of the 'whores' [of this world] who do not see a problem in 'selling themselves' [and selling others, 'down the river'], are going to discover, that they have,      .....sold themselves !




Romans 6:16
Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

2 Peter 2:19
While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.



God is clever.



Psalms 10:2
The wicked in his pride doth persecute the poor: let them be taken in the devices that they have imagined.


Proverbs 11:6
The righteousness of the upright shall deliver them: but transgressors shall be taken in their own naughtiness.

Karnal wrote on Jul 18^th, 2013 at 10:31am:

Yadda wrote on Jul 18th, 2013 at 1:49am: Chimp_Logic wrote on Jul 18th, 2013 at 1:17am: Yadda hates Jesus Christ the most And we all know why don't we ladies and gentlemen. Do we chimp ? Enlighten us. I come not to bring peace, but a sword.

Turn the other cheek, doseth not pull out the eye of your neighbor.

The camel shall paseth not from the eye of a needle tis your riches enough?

Your racist bigotry and propaganda will be sorted out by the devil himself

Enjoy your time in the putrid fire dungeons of Hades.

There ye shall Rotteth like a putrid weasel

Chimp_Logic wrote on Jul 18^th, 2013 at 1:02pm:

Karnal wrote on Jul 18th, 2013 at 10:31am: Yadda wrote on Jul 18th, 2013 at 1:49am: Chimp_Logic wrote on Jul 18th, 2013 at 1:17am: Yadda hates Jesus Christ the most And we all know why don't we ladies and gentlemen. Do we chimp ? Enlighten us. I come not to bring peace, but a sword. Turn the other cheek, doseth not pull out the eye of your neighbor. The camel shall paseth not from the eye of a needle tis your riches enough? Your racist bigotry and propaganda will be sorted out by the devil himself Enjoy your time in the putrid fire dungeons of Hades. There ye shall Rotteth like a putrid weasel

That's right, Chimp. I think you've summed up Y's position pretty well.

Soren wrote on Jul 18^th, 2013 at 9:13am:

shockresist wrote on Jul 17th, 2013 at 1:01pm: Islam is the pure religion, they testify in one God and that Prophet Mohamed is the Final messenger. "Alice Soren laughed: "There's no use trying," she he said; "one can't believe impossible things." "I daresay you haven't had much practice," said the Queen Shockresist. "When I was younger, I always did it for half an hour a day. Why, sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast."

Your right, you cant believe in impossible things.

Jesus cant be God when he even says that No-one has seen God.

shockresist wrote on Jul 18^th, 2013 at 6:34pm:

Soren wrote on Jul 18th, 2013 at 9:13am: shockresist wrote on Jul 17th, 2013 at 1:01pm: Islam is the pure religion, they testify in one God and that Prophet Mohamed is the Final messenger. "Alice Soren laughed: "There's no use trying," she he said; "one can't believe impossible things." "I daresay you haven't had much practice," said the Queen Shockresist. "When I was younger, I always did it for half an hour a day. Why, sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast." Your right, you cant believe in impossible things. Jesus cant be God when he even says that No-one has seen God.

"Forgive them, Father, they know not what they do."

Show me the same forgiveness in any passage of the Qur'an.

Christianity has moved on. What was once 'an eye for an eye' has become 'turn the other cheek'.

Can the same be said of Islam?

Lionel Edriess wrote on Jul 18^th, 2013 at 8:25pm:

shockresist wrote on Jul 18th, 2013 at 6:34pm: Soren wrote on Jul 18th, 2013 at 9:13am: shockresist wrote on Jul 17th, 2013 at 1:01pm: Islam is the pure religion, they testify in one God and that Prophet Mohamed is the Final messenger. "Alice Soren laughed: "There's no use trying," she he said; "one can't believe impossible things." "I daresay you haven't had much practice," said the Queen Shockresist. "When I was younger, I always did it for half an hour a day. Why, sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast." Your right, you cant believe in impossible things. Jesus cant be God when he even says that No-one has seen God. "Forgive them, Father, they know not what they do." Show me the same forgiveness in any passage of the Qur'an. Christianity has moved on. What was once 'an eye for an eye' has become 'turn the other cheek'. Can the same be said of Islam?

There are many examples, im not going to sit here all night and say them all.

My favourite example is a story of the Prophet Mohamed when he was preaching in a certain area of Arabia. He went to a certain area to teach them about the oneness of the lord.The people who he went to disagreed with him and instead of talking about the differences, they threw rocks at him, got kids to chase him with sticks, set dogs on him, he left the area bruised and bloodied.

The angel Gabriel then came to Mohamed and asked Mohamedd "O Mohamed, if you want me to I will destroy the community which attacked you"

Prophet Mohamed said no and replied "Mayeb there will be people fom the community who will one day embrace islam"

And behold, Mohamed went from 5 followers to a billion followers.

My favourite story is when an army from Mecca attacked Muhammed. There was a nearby tribe of Jews who were allied with Muhammed. They lent him tools to help build a trench. The siege ended without a real fight. However, Muhammed discovered that his "allies" had been negotiating with his attackers to join there side, assuming they would have an easy victory over Muhammed. So he attacked them, won, and then chopped off the head of every single man in the tribe. He took all their possessions. They took the women and children as slaves. Muhammed himself took one of the women for his personal sex slave. To show forgiveness, Muhammed offered to set her free so that she could marry him and become his 12th wife instead of his sex slave. She refused. To this day we honour her tradition by only having 11 in a cricket team, and mocking the 12th one.

In lots of other stories he killed and plundered lots of other people and told his followers that it's cool if they do it for him and Allah.

And behold, Mohamed went from 5 followers to a billion followers.

Soren wrote on Jul 18^th, 2013 at 10:14pm:

In lots of other stories he killed and plundered lots of other people and told his followers that it's cool if they do it for him and Allah. And behold, Mohamed went from 5 followers to a billion followers.

.....and it follows, and it is apparent, that the nature of [many/most] men, is that men will always seek to get something, for nothing [i.e. to steal what they desire, from others].

And [we observe that] many/most men will allow that 'acquisitive' behaviour/nature in themselves - even when such behaviour is clearly immoral.

And all moslems [by their choice to remain a 'moslem'] are in that particular 'camp' of men.




ISLAM instils a culture of 'lawful' lawlessness, in those who embrace it.

And moslems [enthralled by ISLAM], do not see what the problem is.     :o






'Normal' criminal behaviour - in mankind
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1293669294/0#0

Quote:

A simple definition of SANITY/INSANITY. Typically, an unrestrained sane person will act in ways which are harmless to others, and in ways which are creative, and productive [for himself, others, and society]. And typically, and conversely, an unrestrained INSANE person will act in ways which are harmful and destructive to himself, and, or, others around him.

shockresist wrote on Jul 18^th, 2013 at 6:34pm:

Soren wrote on Jul 18th, 2013 at 9:13am: shockresist wrote on Jul 17th, 2013 at 1:01pm: Islam is the pure religion, they testify in one God and that Prophet Mohamed is the Final messenger. "Alice Soren laughed: "There's no use trying," she he said; "one can't believe impossible things." "I daresay you haven't had much practice," said the Queen Shockresist. "When I was younger, I always did it for half an hour a day. Why, sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast." Your right, you cant believe in impossible things. Jesus cant be God when he even says that No-one has seen God.

Correct.

"No one has seen God, therefore God does not exist."       [an example of the logic of men.     n.b. logic from the intellect of finite men.]           ;D

freediver wrote on Jul 18^th, 2013 at 10:13pm:

My favourite story is when an army from Mecca attacked Muhammed. There was a nearby tribe of Jews who were allied with Muhammed. They lent him tools to help build a trench. The siege ended without a real fight. However, Muhammed discovered that his "allies" had been negotiating with his attackers to join there side, assuming they would have an easy victory over Muhammed. So he attacked them, won, and then chopped off the head of every single man in the tribe. He took all their possessions. They took the women and children as slaves. Muhammed himself took one of the women for his personal sex slave. To show forgiveness, Muhammed offered to set her free so that she could marry him and become his 12th wife instead of his sex slave. She refused. To this day we honour her tradition by only having 11 in a cricket team, and mocking the 12th one.

But Mohammed [and his men] took those women and children captive, because Mohammed didn't want those women and children to be destitute.        :P

That man Mohammed, what virtue in human form !!!!        :P

Yadda wrote on Jul 19^th, 2013 at 11:32am:

But Mohammed [and his men] took those women and children captive, because Mohammed didn't want those women and children to be destitute.

Very true Y.

And then they raped them.

Gandalf, what are your thoughts on the other Jewish tribes that bought some of them off Muhammed because they felt guilty about their involvement in Muhammed evil deeds? It hardly makes it sound like turning them into sex slaves was the only way to help these women.

freediver wrote on Jul 19^th, 2013 at 2:05pm:

And then they raped them.

I've yet to see any evidence of that.

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 19^th, 2013 at 2:18pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 19th, 2013 at 2:05pm: And then they raped them. I've yet to see any evidence of that.

Go read your holy books gandalf.

Try this verse Gandalf-www.sunnah.com/bukhari/64/182

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 19^th, 2013 at 2:18pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 19th, 2013 at 2:05pm: And then they raped them. I've yet to see any evidence of that.

So what do you think concubine means Gandalf? Remember, raping your wife is not a punishable offence in Islam, so how do you think concubines got along?

Baronvonrort wrote on Jul 19^th, 2013 at 2:26pm:

Try this verse Gandalf-www.sunnah.com/bukhari/64/182

yes? and where is the raping described?


freediver wrote on Jul 19^th, 2013 at 2:30pm:

So what do you think concubine means Gandalf?

Umm... a woman who lives with a man, but who is not married to him?

Is that your definition of rape? Are you trying to be stupid?

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 19^th, 2013 at 2:49pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Jul 19th, 2013 at 2:26pm: Try this verse Gandalf-www.sunnah.com/bukhari/64/182 yes? and where is the raping described?

Are you claiming the female captives consented to having sex with those muslims who captured them on the very same day?

What is the arabic word for rape?

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 19^th, 2013 at 2:49pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 19th, 2013 at 2:30pm: So what do you think concubine means Gandalf? Umm... a woman who lives with a man, but who is not married to him?

;D

Baronvonrort wrote on Jul 19^th, 2013 at 2:55pm:

Are you claiming the female captives consented to having sex with those muslims who captured them on the very same day?

umm.. you'll have to show me where it says it was all done on the same day.


freediver wrote on Jul 19^th, 2013 at 3:10pm:

Grin

lols indeed - you justify your accusation of rape by mentioning the word "concubine" - as if the two words are synonymous.

Jokes on you FD.

edit - wait, FD you are saying concubine means something different?

A woman who cohabits with a man without being legally married to him.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/concubine

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 19^th, 2013 at 2:49pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Jul 19th, 2013 at 2:26pm: Try this verse Gandalf-www.sunnah.com/bukhari/64/182 yes? and where is the raping described?

gandalf,

SCENARIO;

I somehow successfully steal YOUR sister for ransom [so that i can 'legitimately' 'earn' some money for myself].
But, while YOUR sister is in my custody, i decide to have sex with her.
And i do have sex with her.

gandalf,
Q.
If i am detaining your sister [preventing her from leaving], and i have sex with her, then in what sense did i NOT rape your sister ?



+++
The scenario, is one which Mohammed and his companions 'played out'.

That that event occurred, is recorded in the Hadith.

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 19^th, 2013 at 11:44am:

Yadda wrote on Jul 19th, 2013 at 11:32am: But Mohammed [and his men] took those women and children captive, because Mohammed didn't want those women and children to be destitute. Very true Y.

gandalf,

So, you are not always being a candid, and a sincere moslem person, on this forum, then ?        ;)

freediver wrote on Jul 19^th, 2013 at 2:30pm:

Remember, raping your wife is not a punishable offence in Islam, so how do you think concubines got along?

For nearly all of Christian/Western history, marital rape was not a punishable offence.

So obviously that means most Christian/Western men throughout history raped their wives right? Because if the government doesn't stop you, then you will surely do it right?

Freediver does this mean that you are the product of rape?

Rape was pretty common in the past. I have no doubt that plenty of my ancestors were raped.

Most people would prefer sex slaves and carting women home from battle to stay in the past. Same with slaughtering every able bodied man.

Mohammed was a priapic, horny Arab. 10 wives? Hello?!
A sex addict hearing self-justifying voices.

True Colours wrote on Jul 19^th, 2013 at 9:52pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 19th, 2013 at 2:30pm: Remember, raping your wife is not a punishable offence in Islam, so how do you think concubines got along? For nearly all of Christian/Western history, marital rape was not a punishable offence.

You are not living in 'nearly all of history'.



You are living NOW!

Soren wrote on Jul 21^st, 2013 at 9:56pm:

Mohammed was a priapic, horny Arab. 10 wives? Hello?! A sex addict hearing self-justifying voices.

Feeling a little inadequate Soren?