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Message started by True Colours on Jul 31st, 2013 at 4:08am

Title: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by True Colours on Jul 31st, 2013 at 4:08am
Cracks appearing in US marines' charm offensive in Darwin

Locals are grumpy about the noisy aircraft and nervous about the marine battalion growing to 2,500 by 2017-18


The thunder of fighter jets is fast becoming a key feature among Darwin’s dry season attractions.

Beer, backpackers, crocs and thongs are being joined by the ever-increasing roar of war machines overhead, leaving transient performers in town for the Mindil beach markets begrudgingly admitting it has become the "military capital of Australia".

One man who has lived in the north-east outskirts of Darwin for 40 years but does not want to be named grimaces as yet another US marine F/A-18 jet flies overhead from Royal Australian Air Force Base Darwin, temporarily rendering any conversation hopeless.

"That’s Darwin," he shrugs, once the noise has dissipated.

But it’s not the mix of multinational pilots in town for the RAAF’s largest annual combat training activity each June, Pitch Black, that has created the biggest stir among locals. Instead it is the 200-strong contingent of US marines based at Darwin’s Robertson Barracks and the fact they are paving the way for a full 1,100-strong battalion to arrive next year, increasing to 2,500 by 2017-18, that is making the most noise.

On Darwin’s main entertainment strip, Mitchell Street, socialising Americans from Lima Company, 3rd Battalion, 3rd Marine Regiment, are easily spotted at night in civilian clothes.

They stay together in groups of three or four...



..Basewatch member Justin Tutty...wants ground rules established regarding the fighter jets, transport aircraft and navy support vessels that will arrive to support them, particularly if it includes the MV-22 Osprey tilt rotor aircraft, commonly referred to as the “widow maker”, which has been involved in three crashes at the US’s third largest offshore military base at Okinawa, Japan, since 1998.

His case was highlighted recently when a botched training drill in Queensland resulted in two unarmed bombs and two inert bombs filled with concrete being dumped by US aircraft into deep waters in the Great Barrier Reef marine park, much to the outrage of local environmentalists.

"A lot of people are grumpy about noisy aircraft and there’s going to be more of that," Tutty says.

The marines are part of a US force posture initiative under which its presence will increase in northern Australia as it pivots its attention away from the Middle East and Europe, and its economic decline, and into the Indian Ocean and the east and south-east Asia regions.

ADF Commander 1st Brigade Brigadier John Frewen says it is a natural extension of the Australian/US alliance that has been in place for many years...

...Tutty fears the full battalion will be a riskier prospect than the small group that has been charming the locals so far.

A Deloitte Access Economics report commissioned by the ADF and released in April, Social Impact of rotations of up to 1,100 US Marines and associated equipment in Northern Australia, found that ...in Okinawa...seven cases of reported or alleged sexual assault cases between 1996 and 2012.

Australia too had experienced its own issues with the US military, including in 2001 when up to three cases of alleged sexual assault by visiting servicemen were reported to NT police.

Deloitte suggested there was a 1 in 20 chance of a sexual assault taking place in a period of six months by an 1100-strong force of marines in the NT...

...US military personnel deployed in Australia operate under the 1963 Status of Forces Agreement.

It holds them to account under Australian law for crimes committed within its borders, but also provides for limited circumstances when they could be charged under US military law instead.

University of Canberra government and law assistant professor, Dr Robin Tennant-Wood says there is a certain level of diplomatic protection afforded to military personnel, but there have been cases in the past when visiting US naval personnel have been returned to Australia to face trial after being accused of assault or various petty crimes.

Given that the rotation was announced as a "mark of friendship" between the two countries, however, the US would be keeping marines on a tight leash with short rotations.

But Tutty also wants assurance that Australia would not end up providing logistical support for US nuclear-capable "war machines" or have to tolerate the presence of illegal nuclear WMDs, and the stockpiling of depleted uranium and cluster munitions.

"I’m not ‘anti-American’. I support a defence force and I’m confident this co-operation can work, but it’s a difficult policy challenge," he says.

"If there is a future war that Australia doesn’t agree with, we’re in a position to find ourselves logistically supporting US deployment to that war zone."

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/jul/30/darwin-us-marines-too-close

Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by True Colours on Jul 31st, 2013 at 4:14am












Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by BigOl64 on Jul 31st, 2013 at 6:52am

True Colours wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 4:14am:











Great work adding photos that have nothing to do with the post and are not taken anywhere near Darwin; just to add add an extra layer of bullsh1t to your stupid story.


The gardian fish wrapper doesn't check its facts too well, the aircraft noise complaints had nothing to do with the US but with the RAAF  F-18s.


Never let the facts get in the way of good beat up hey?   ;D




Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by True Blue... on Jul 31st, 2013 at 7:45am
struth....  ::)

Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by pansi1951 on Jul 31st, 2013 at 8:04am

US jets are quiet, it's those other jets that make all the noise  ;) ;)

Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by BigOl64 on Jul 31st, 2013 at 8:23am

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 8:04am:
US jets are quiet, it's those other jets that make all the noise  ;) ;)



They are very quiet when they are not there, ya winner  ;D


Might I suggest not commenting on subject you know bugger all about, save yourself a sh1t load of embarassment.


Stick to subjects like life as a check out chick and a chardonnay socialism, you know the life you lead.



Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by donincognito on Jul 31st, 2013 at 10:14am

BigOl64 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 8:23am:
Might I suggest not commenting on subject you know bugger all about, save yourself a sh1t load of embarassment.

Its amusing that you say this, because you clearly havent heard about the battle for brisbane.

You remember, that time when the US troops stationed in one of our cities started a multi day battle with the troops that were hosting them.

Sounds like a crappy precedent to be following.

Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by BigOl64 on Jul 31st, 2013 at 10:55am

donincognito wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 10:14am:

BigOl64 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 8:23am:
Might I suggest not commenting on subject you know bugger all about, save yourself a sh1t load of embarassment.

Its amusing that you say this, because you clearly havent heard about the battle for brisbane.

You remember, that time when the US troops stationed in one of our cities started a multi day battle with the troops that were hosting them.

Sounds like a crappy precedent to be following.



I was not aware that there was an issue with loud noise from USAF F18s during the Battle for Brisbane in the 1940's. Thank you for that insightfull history lesson.  ;D



Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by donincognito on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:11am

BigOl64 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 10:55am:

donincognito wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 10:14am:

BigOl64 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 8:23am:
Might I suggest not commenting on subject you know bugger all about, save yourself a sh1t load of embarassment.

Its amusing that you say this, because you clearly havent heard about the battle for brisbane.

You remember, that time when the US troops stationed in one of our cities started a multi day battle with the troops that were hosting them.

Sounds like a crappy precedent to be following.



I was not aware that there was an issue with loud noise from USAF F18s during the Battle for Brisbane in the 1940's. Thank you for that insightfull history lesson.  ;D

See, what you are doing is making up an argument that I did not say, and then defeating that. Its called a strawman argument. Its really freaking obvious when you do it, so I suggest you dont.

Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by BigOl64 on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:14am

donincognito wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:11am:

BigOl64 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 10:55am:

donincognito wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 10:14am:

BigOl64 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 8:23am:
Might I suggest not commenting on subject you know bugger all about, save yourself a sh1t load of embarassment.

Its amusing that you say this, because you clearly havent heard about the battle for brisbane.

You remember, that time when the US troops stationed in one of our cities started a multi day battle with the troops that were hosting them.

Sounds like a crappy precedent to be following.



I was not aware that there was an issue with loud noise from USAF F18s during the Battle for Brisbane in the 1940's. Thank you for that insightfull history lesson.  ;D

See, what you are doing is making up an argument that I did not say, and then defeating that. Its called a strawman argument. Its really freaking obvious when you do it, so I suggest you dont.



The please tell me what the hell the Battle for Brisbane in the 1940s has to do with USAF F18 aircraft noise in Darwin in 2013.


Hate to hurt your feeling by misunderstanding your point. Which amay or may not have anything to do with my actual post. Im guessing not, but surprise me.



Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by gizmo_2655 on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:18am

donincognito wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 10:14am:

BigOl64 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 8:23am:
Might I suggest not commenting on subject you know bugger all about, save yourself a sh1t load of embarassment.

Its amusing that you say this, because you clearly havent heard about the battle for brisbane.

You remember, that time when the US troops stationed in one of our cities started a multi day battle with the troops that were hosting them.

Sounds like a crappy precedent to be following.


Actually it was the Australians that threw the first punch in the Battle of Brisbane, admittedly with a fair bit of provocation.

Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by Peter Freedman on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:22am
Bet the prostitutes of Brisbane aren't complaining..... :-*

Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by BigOl64 on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:39am

donincognito wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:11am:

BigOl64 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 10:55am:

donincognito wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 10:14am:

BigOl64 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 8:23am:
Might I suggest not commenting on subject you know bugger all about, save yourself a sh1t load of embarassment.

Its amusing that you say this, because you clearly havent heard about the battle for brisbane.

You remember, that time when the US troops stationed in one of our cities started a multi day battle with the troops that were hosting them.

Sounds like a crappy precedent to be following.



I was not aware that there was an issue with loud noise from USAF F18s during the Battle for Brisbane in the 1940's. Thank you for that insightfull history lesson.  ;D

See, what you are doing is making up an argument that I did not say, and then defeating that. Its called a strawman argument. Its really freaking obvious when you do it, so I suggest you dont.



Anyone amused by the King of anal retentive, semantic arguing taking my initial post, removing any information which gave the posted sentence context. Then repackaged it with some inane comentary that has nothing to do with anything in any of the posts and when I treat his reply with distain and disrespect he cries about some straw man fallacy argument.   ;D


Good one ya winner.



Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by donincognito on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:45am

BigOl64 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:14am:
The please tell me what the hell the Battle for Brisbane in the 1940s has to do with USAF F18 aircraft noise in Darwin in 2013.

Very little.

It has a lot to do with how locals feel about the matter, and the friction overseas troops can cause, and the issues that this friction will generate.

This may surprise you, but people who have been trained to kill other people for a job tend not to be the most considerate neighbours.


Quote:
Hate to hurt your feeling by misunderstanding your point. Which amay or may not have anything to do with my actual post. Im guessing not, but surprise me.

My feelings arent hurt by the fact you have shite reading comprehension and debating skills.


gizmo_2655 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:18am:
Actually it was the Australians that threw the first punch in the Battle of Brisbane, admittedly with a fair bit of provocation.

Fair call. Still, the whole thing couldnt have happened if there were no US marines in the city.



Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by gizmo_2655 on Jul 31st, 2013 at 12:44pm

donincognito wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:45am:

BigOl64 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:14am:
The please tell me what the hell the Battle for Brisbane in the 1940s has to do with USAF F18 aircraft noise in Darwin in 2013.

Very little.

It has a lot to do with how locals feel about the matter, and the friction overseas troops can cause, and the issues that this friction will generate.

This may surprise you, but people who have been trained to kill other people for a job tend not to be the most considerate neighbours.


Quote:
Hate to hurt your feeling by misunderstanding your point. Which amay or may not have anything to do with my actual post. Im guessing not, but surprise me.

My feelings arent hurt by the fact you have shite reading comprehension and debating skills.


gizmo_2655 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:18am:
Actually it was the Australians that threw the first punch in the Battle of Brisbane, admittedly with a fair bit of provocation.

Fair call. Still, the whole thing couldnt have happened if there were no US marines in the city.


To be honest, I can't remember if they were Marines, or Infantry or even Navy....I do know it was started on behalf of a couple of black US sailors, but the 'pressure' started to build outside of Coff's Harbour.

Title: Re: Increased US Presence Ruffles Feathers In Darwin
Post by BigOl64 on Jul 31st, 2013 at 1:47pm

donincognito wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:45am:

BigOl64 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:14am:
The please tell me what the hell the Battle for Brisbane in the 1940s has to do with USAF F18 aircraft noise in Darwin in 2013.

Very little.

It has a lot to do with how locals feel about the matter, and the friction overseas troops can cause, and the issues that this friction will generate.

This may surprise you, but people who have been trained to kill other people for a job tend not to be the most considerate neighbours.


Quote:
Hate to hurt your feeling by misunderstanding your point. Which amay or may not have anything to do with my actual post. Im guessing not, but surprise me.

My feelings arent hurt by the fact you have shite reading comprehension and debating skills.


gizmo_2655 wrote on Jul 31st, 2013 at 11:18am:
Actually it was the Australians that threw the first punch in the Battle of Brisbane, admittedly with a fair bit of provocation.

Fair call. Still, the whole thing couldnt have happened if there were no US marines in the city.



So your initial post had absolutely bugger all to do with my post and you deliberately took my post out of context so you could 'win'?


BTW my comprehension skills are fine, you may need to polish up a bit and try to reply to what has been written and not what you need to be written so you can present your bullsh1t argument.



Maybe pansi might be better to talk to rather than someone who has actally servved in the ADF and worked with the USAF and finally I also actually work in Darwin and this whole story is a fvcken beat up nothing more.



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