Postmodern Trendoid wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:37am:

What's more important, climate change or gay rights?

Reminds me of an interesting article in the LA Times.
http://articles.latimes.com/2006/jul/02/opinion/op-gilbert2

This is worth a read:


Quote:

If only gay sex caused global warming NO ONE seems to care about the upcoming attack on the World Trade Center site. Why? Because it won't involve villains with box cutters. Instead, it will involve melting ice sheets that swell the oceans and turn that particular block of lower Manhattan into an aquarium. The odds of this happening in the next few decades are better than the odds that a disgruntled Saudi will sneak onto an airplane and detonate a shoe bomb. And yet our government will spend billions of dollars this year to prevent global terrorism and ... well, essentially nothing to prevent global warming. Why are we less worried about the more likely disaster? Because the human brain evolved to respond to threats that have four features -- features that terrorism has and that global warming lacks. First, global warming lacks a mustache. No, really. We are social mammals whose brains are highly specialized for thinking about others. Understanding what others are up to -- what they know and want, what they are doing and planning -- has been so crucial to the survival of our species that our brains have developed an obsession with all things human. We think about people and their intentions; talk about them; look for and remember them. That's why we worry more about anthrax (with an annual death toll of roughly zero) than influenza (with an annual death toll of a quarter-million to a half-million people). Influenza is a natural accident, anthrax is an intentional action, and the smallest action captures our attention in a way that the largest accident doesn't. If two airplanes had been hit by lightning and crashed into a New York skyscraper, few of us would be able to name the date on which it happened. Global warming isn't trying to kill us, and that's a shame. If climate change had been visited on us by a brutal dictator or an evil empire, the war on warming would be this nation's top priority. The second reason why global warming doesn't put our brains on orange alert is that it doesn't violate our moral sensibilities. It doesn't cause our blood to boil (at least not figuratively) because it doesn't force us to entertain thoughts that we find indecent, impious or repulsive. When people feel insulted or disgusted, they generally do something about it, such as whacking each other over the head, or voting. Moral emotions are the brain's call to action.......

One must ask why the CFC  causal link to ozone layer depletion was tackled relatively quickly on an international scale and non CFC refrigerants and fluids replaced the conventional CFCs which were banned, (and still are)

It implies that action can be taken at a high level with great efficiency and creativity.

But as we all know stopping the corporatized fossil fuel juggernaut is a very different task, a very different monster. Its tentacles reach far and wide and strangle everything from banks, politicians, militaries, royalty, the media, even the church, and scientific priests who cross the integrity line by selling their spin.

It will take a bullet right in the eye of the fossilized corporate cyclops before rapid progress is undertaken in an international scale.

By that time it may well be far too late.

We know of many irreversible tipping points that can be triggered by our current AGW insanity.

And there are unknown tipping points that lurk in the deep abyss of our mortal collective arrogance

Humans are inherently self destructive it seems

What's more important, climate change or gay right

I give up ???

Most on the right seem gay so I'll go for that one ???

Chimp_Logic wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 8:41pm:

... Humans are inherently self destructive it seems

Given the vastness of space and the improbability that ours is the only planet on which life has evolved, it seems unlikely that we're the only "intelligent" life in the universe. I've often wondered, therefore, why we're not overrun with interstellar tourists.

Perhaps we're seeing the answer now. They're not coming because they're all dead. That which we call "intelligence" is not survivable.  :(

# wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 9:15pm:

Chimp_Logic wrote on Sep 23rd, 2013 at 8:41pm: ... Humans are inherently self destructive it seems Given the vastness of space and the improbability that ours is the only planet on which life has evolved, it seems unlikely that we're the only "intelligent" life in the universe. I've often wondered, therefore, why we're not overrun with interstellar tourists. Perhaps we're seeing the answer now. They're not coming because they're all dead. That which we call "intelligence" is not survivable.  :(

Some very interesting points you raise there mr hash.

No doubt that the probability of life exclusively forming on earth in this vast universe must approach zero.

Why haven't we been overrun with alien visitors?

Well, the vast interstellar distances is a massive physical barrier to overcome even with life that is conscious, intelligent, creative and able to use technology.

Then of course, even if a life form manages to overcome this barrier, they would need to time their exploration to nearby stars that just happen to have planets that contained life on them.

My ipad has an APP installed called EXOPLANET, and it constantly updates the latest discoveries of planets orbiting stars. At the moment there are about 1000 confirmed exoplanet a with updates occurring on a weekly basis

# wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 9:15pm:

Given the vastness of space and the improbability that ours is the only planet on which life has evolved, it seems unlikely that we're the only "intelligent" life in the universe. I've often wondered, therefore, why we're not overrun with interstellar tourists.

I'm a bit more optimistic than you. I think that humanity will prevail, although we'll lose a few billion over the coming centuries.

James Lovelock thinks that we'll be able to set up new sustainable cities in Antarctica. Who knows? At any rate, the survivors must learn from the tragedy that is about to unfold. 

I have high hopes for humanity. My hopes involve eventual colonisation of local star systems, starting with our neighbouring planet, Mars. The satellites of Mars are easier to get to than the moon because of their lower gravity. Eventually they will become the fuel depots of  the local Solar system. They are potentially made of fuel.

There both a waste of tax payers money.....!!!

Only 2 to 3% of the population is gay, so gay rights are a minority group looking after their own needs.

And we all know the AGW is a scam to fleece nations of their wealth and dictate to them how they can use their own energy resources.

Ajax wrote on Sep 24^th, 2013 at 3:20pm:

There both a waste of tax payers money.....!!! Only 2 to 3% of the population is gay, so gay rights are a minority group looking after their own needs. And we all know the AGW is a scam to fleece nations of their wealth and dictate to them how they can use their own energy resources.

You don't get it. The comment is if only global warming were caused by gay sex, then people might actually do something about it.

Ajax wrote on Sep 24^th, 2013 at 3:20pm:

There both a waste of tax payers money.....!!! Only 2 to 3% of the population is gay, so gay rights are a minority group looking after their own needs. And we all know the AGW is a scam to fleece nations of their wealth and dictate to them how they can use their own energy resources.

Only 0.0000031% of the population are in positions of unaccountable unelectable power and wealth! and yet they control the fascist Corpocracy that enslaves you.

You seem to have no moral issues with the fascist tyrants that you serve and support.

You have a lot of explaining to do dark batman

Chimp_Logic wrote on Sep 24^th, 2013 at 5:12pm:

Ajax wrote on Sep 24th, 2013 at 3:20pm: There both a waste of tax payers money.....!!! Only 2 to 3% of the population is gay, so gay rights are a minority group looking after their own needs. And we all know the AGW is a scam to fleece nations of their wealth and dictate to them how they can use their own energy resources. Only 0.0000031% of the population are in positions of unaccountable unelectable power and wealth! and yet they control the fascist Corpocracy that enslaves you. You seem to have no moral issues with the fascist tyrants that you serve and support. You have a lot of explaining to do dark batman

Hey chimp

Your logic is flawed....................!!!!!!!

The elite moguls that want to run the whole world under one umbrella are the very same people that are pushing for carbon pricing all over the world......!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Chimp is obviously a pinko.  Do you understand the point of the thread now?

muso wrote on Sep 24^th, 2013 at 5:38pm:

Chimp is obviously a pinko.  Do you understand the point of the thread now?

Hey I don't believe we have a climate crisis and therefore that hypothetical of climate crises assuming some other face like a dictator etc.

Is shear nonsense and I cant relate to it......!!!!

The site of the twin towers will not become a swamp anytime soon.

Ajax wrote on Sep 24^th, 2013 at 5:23pm:

Chimp_Logic wrote on Sep 24th, 2013 at 5:12pm: Ajax wrote on Sep 24th, 2013 at 3:20pm: There both a waste of tax payers money.....!!! Only 2 to 3% of the population is gay, so gay rights are a minority group looking after their own needs. And we all know the AGW is a scam to fleece nations of their wealth and dictate to them how they can use their own energy resources. Only 0.0000031% of the population are in positions of unaccountable unelectable power and wealth! and yet they control the fascist Corpocracy that enslaves you. You seem to have no moral issues with the fascist tyrants that you serve and support. You have a lot of explaining to do dark batman The elite moguls that want to run the whole world under one umbrella are the very same people that are pushing for carbon pricing all over the world......!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I agree with you there.

They control most things and can see the writing on the wall for the fossil fuel industry. It is a finite resource which is unsustainable and non renewable.

I don't support them AT ALL.

You pick and chose what fascist elements they implement socio-politically upon the masses to suit your dogmatic ideology and paranoia.

As far a carbon tax goes. There are taxes on almost everything to varying degrees. Taxes are important. It's the main source of funding to generate equitable societies and social institution.

Sadly the tax system is erected for the rich and elite corporate tyrannies.

You would know this is true. Look around you. Who pays? Who benefits? Who profits? Who struggles?

What would christ do?

Ajax wrote on Sep 24^th, 2013 at 5:53pm:

muso wrote on Sep 24th, 2013 at 5:38pm: Chimp is obviously a pinko.  Do you understand the point of the thread now? Hey I don't believe we have a climate crisis and therefore that hypothetical of climate crises assuming some other face like a dictator etc. Is shear nonsense and I cant relate to it......!!!!

I don't think you can bear relating to it. As I explain the obvious shortcomings of one denialist argument after another, you cling to your denial. You realise that the satellite altimetry is sufficiently accurate, but you're scared to admit that fact. Who are you trying to deceive? Only yourself.

What would christ do?

__________

look within

namaste

- : )

Chimp_Logic wrote on Sep 24^th, 2013 at 6:40pm:

As far a carbon tax goes. There are taxes on almost everything to varying degrees. Taxes are important. It's the main source of funding to generate equitable societies and social institution.

(applause)

Now and again, the reasonably person in you wins over from the Marxist Loony.