www.theage.com.au/world/indonesias-mixed-messages-on-fate-of-drug-traffickers-on-death-row-20141212-1260pp.html 

White aprons will be hung carefully around their necks, with red targets positioned over their chests. They will be offered blindfolds, and asked if they would like to stand, sit or lie down.

Then their hearts will be riddled with judicially sanctioned bullets until they are dead.

Indonesia's method of execution has not changed since a decree signed by its first president in 1964. The enthusiasm with which it is applied has waxed and waned over the 50 years since, but from his early talk, the seventh President, Joko Widodo, seems likely to be one of the more bloodthirsty.

_______________________________
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

comment;

Australia must return this bloodlust and premeditated, cold-blooded killing of our citizens with severe revenge.

Australia has given Muslim Indonesia everything...billions of dollars in aid, billions more dollars and the lives of doctors and nurses in a chopper crash after the tsunami...and other help.
She has asked nicely for the lives of her citizens currently on death row, but in return has only received hate and scorn.
Some say "typical, what else did you expect"?

Australia must;

. Tell Indonesia to get stuffed, including the President.
. Cancel all security ties with Indonesia
. Stop all aid to Indonesia, all of it, every last cent.
. Stop sending Indonesia cattle and food of any description.
. Stop all exports to, and imports from, Indonesia.
. Ban all travel from Australia to Indonesia, and vice versa.
. Boot the Indonesian ambassador out of Australia permanently, and bulldoze the Indonesian embassy.
. Deport all Indonesian nationals out of Australia, including students.
. Close all Indonesian companies/businesses in Australia.
. Tell all Australians to, next time there's a tsunami/earthquake in Indonesia, simply ignore it all and pretend that Indonesia doesn't exist.

...for starters

bambu wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:00pm:

Ban all travel from Australia to Indonesia ...

The bogans will never give up their holidays in Bali.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:04pm:

bambu wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:00pm: Ban all travel from Australia to Indonesia ... The bogans will never give up their holidays in Bali.

They will if they're made to.

they knew the risks and they took them ... they have no one else to blame but themselves ...

you certainly can't blame the Indonesians for enforcing their laws.

John Smith wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:06pm:

you certainly can't blame the Indonesians for enforcing their laws.

We can certainly criticise them for having barbaric laws.

John Smith wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:06pm:

they knew the risks and they took them ... they have no one else to blame but themselves ... you certainly can't blame the Indonesians for enforcing their laws.

Of course you can.
They're pretending to be civilised ...what a joke.
Just a human rights wasteland in reality.

Bob Hawke called Malaysia 'barbaric' when they execution-hanged Barlow and Chambers.
Hopefully he'll do the same to Indonesia when they execution-shred Chan [now a Christian, mentored by The Salvation Army] and Sukumaran soon.

Abbott needs to start a 'war' with Indonesia over this, fire up and stand for something!
The mamby pamby, PC drivel he goes on with about Indonesia, running up there all the time and seemingly licking their boots...is a big part of why he's way behind in the polls.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:09pm:

We can certainly criticise them for having barbaric laws.

you do that ... whereas, I'll criticise those who break their law ... even more so since the penalty is so extreme


bambu wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:14pm:

They're pretending to be civilised...

no ones pretending to be anything ... it is you who has label them as civillised or barbaric .. I don't think they care what you think

Whats' the problem?  Break their Laws of which you have full knowledge, then cop the consequences.

Or, is this an anti capital punishment Thread?  If so, I'd take a very different position.

John Smith wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:16pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:09pm: We can certainly criticise them for having barbaric laws. you do that ... whereas, I'll criticise those who break their law ...

I criticise them too. Being opposed to the death penalty doesn't mean that one is opposed to all forms of punishment.

I'm perfectly capable of criticising more than one thing at a time:

- The Bali 9 are criminals, and deserve to be punished.

- The Indonesians have barbaric laws.

There, I did it.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:20pm:

John Smith wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:16pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:09pm: We can certainly criticise them for having barbaric laws. you do that ... whereas, I'll criticise those who break their law ... I criticise them too. Being opposed to the death penalty doesn't mean that one is opposed to all forms of punishment. I'm perfectly capable of criticising more than one thing at a time: - The Bali 9 are criminals, and deserve to be punished. - The Indonesians have barbaric laws. There, I did it.

[smiley=2vrolijk_08.gif] [smiley=2vrolijk_08.gif]

John Smith wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:16pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:09pm: We can certainly criticise them for having barbaric laws. you do that ... whereas, I'll criticise those who break their law ... even more so since the penalty is so extreme bambu wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:14pm: They're pretending to be civilised... no ones pretending to be anything ... it is you who has label them as civillised or barbaric .. I don't think they care what you think

They don't care what anyone thinks.
The Australian govt should make them care...or cut them adrift, put the national cheque book back in the safe, and ignore them forevermore.
Stop giving them money, food, trade, travel etc and the time of day.
Boot their ambassador and all their companies, businesses and students out.
Tell them to f off, and disconnect the phone.

bambu wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:24pm:

John Smith wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:16pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:09pm: We can certainly criticise them for having barbaric laws. you do that ... whereas, I'll criticise those who break their law ... even more so since the penalty is so extreme bambu wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:14pm: They're pretending to be civilised... no ones pretending to be anything ... it is you who has label them as civillised or barbaric .. I don't think they care what you think They don't care what anyone thinks. The Australian govt should make them care...or cut them adrift, put the national cheque book back in the safe, and ignore them forevermore. Stop giving them money, food, trade, travel etc and the time of day. Boot their ambassador and all their companies, businesses and students out. Tell them to f off, and disconnect the phone.

Why....because they have capital punishment?  If so, we better get busy with this lot for starters:

Alabama
Arizona
Arkansas
California
Colorado
Delaware
Florida
Georgia
Idaho
Indiana
Kansas
Kentucky      Louisiana
Mississippi
Missouri
Montana
Nebraska
Nevada
New Hampshire
North Carolina
Ohio
Oklahoma
Oregon      Pennsylvania
South Carolina
South Dakota
Tennessee
Texas
Utah
Virginia
Washington
Wyoming

The big thing that worries me about this affair is the Australian authorities knew in advance what was going on and did nothing to prevent some of them from leaving the country.
In no way am I condoning the actions, greed, or stupidity of those involved.



Quote:

WHEN Lee Rush learned in April 2005 that his son Scott was off to Bali, he felt sick.    Scott had no money, no passport - as far as his father knew - and a history of drug use. Rush phoned an old lawyer friend, Robert Myers, who voiced his worst fears: that Scott might be travelling as a paid courier to carry drugs. The two men agreed the 19-year-old had to be stopped. Myers rang a contact in the Australian Federal Police and asked him to have Scott intercepted before he left the country, on suspicion of illegal activity. By his account, he was assured this would happen. But the AFP took a different course. Instead, as the young Queenslander was preparing to fly out of Australia, the AFP tipped off their counterparts in the Indonesian National Police. Nine days later Rush was arrested with three other mules at Bali's Denpasar airport as they were about to return home with nearly 8kg of heroin strapped to their bodies. In September 2006 an Indonesian court sentenced Rush to death.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/features/how-the-afp-trapped-the-bali-nine/story-e6frg6z6-1225910600831?nk=033a6594a3671f26cb5dbca813a5f19f

bambu wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:24pm:

The Australian govt should make them care

just remember, they buy a lot more from us then we do from them .... the australian govt's not going to do poo

Aussie wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:17pm:

Whats' the problem?  Break their Laws of which you have full knowledge, then cop the consequences. Or, is this an anti capital punishment Thread?  If so, I'd take a very different position.

It sure is an anti-death chambers in Indonesia thread.

They have Chan and Sukumaran in prison...but oh no that's not good enough to suit them.

Their families are able to visit them if they're alive, and Muslim Indonesia certainly obviously doesn't want that.

Of course what we should do in reply is feed Indonesian criminals in our prisons to crocodiles Fridays at lunchtime...sell tickets and give the proceeds to charity.
Oh that's right, we're civilised.

Lobo wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:26pm:

The big thing that worries me about this affair is the Australian authorities knew in advance what was going on and did nothing to prevent some of them from leaving the country. In no way am I condoning the actions, greed, or stupidity of those involved. Quote: WHEN Lee Rush learned in April 2005 that his son Scott was off to Bali, he felt sick.    Scott had no money, no passport - as far as his father knew - and a history of drug use. Rush phoned an old lawyer friend, Robert Myers, who voiced his worst fears: that Scott might be travelling as a paid courier to carry drugs. The two men agreed the 19-year-old had to be stopped. Myers rang a contact in the Australian Federal Police and asked him to have Scott intercepted before he left the country, on suspicion of illegal activity. By his account, he was assured this would happen. But the AFP took a different course. Instead, as the young Queenslander was preparing to fly out of Australia, the AFP tipped off their counterparts in the Indonesian National Police. Nine days later Rush was arrested with three other mules at Bali's Denpasar airport as they were about to return home with nearly 8kg of heroin strapped to their bodies. In September 2006 an Indonesian court sentenced Rush to death. http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/features/how-the-afp-trapped-the-bali-nine/story-e6frg6z6-1225910600831?nk=033a6594a3671f26cb5dbca813a5f19f

I feel sorry for the father ... the guilt will destroy him

John Smith wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:32pm:

bambu wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:24pm: The Australian govt should make them care just remember, they buy a lot more from us then we do from them .... the australian govt's not going to do poo

True.
And stand for nothing...and as a result get booted out of office at the next election...which will serve them right for being 'wimps' and 'boot lickers'.
How many times have Abbott, Bishop and co been to Indonesia now?
They just got 'slapped in the face' and 'bashed up' by Indonesia and its President...bigtime!
...and kicked to the kerb!
So much for all the ASEAN group hugs. ;D

John Smith wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:33pm:

Lobo wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:26pm: The big thing that worries me about this affair is the Australian authorities knew in advance what was going on and did nothing to prevent some of them from leaving the country. In no way am I condoning the actions, greed, or stupidity of those involved. Quote: WHEN Lee Rush learned in April 2005 that his son Scott was off to Bali, he felt sick.    Scott had no money, no passport - as far as his father knew - and a history of drug use. Rush phoned an old lawyer friend, Robert Myers, who voiced his worst fears: that Scott might be travelling as a paid courier to carry drugs. The two men agreed the 19-year-old had to be stopped. Myers rang a contact in the Australian Federal Police and asked him to have Scott intercepted before he left the country, on suspicion of illegal activity. By his account, he was assured this would happen. But the AFP took a different course. Instead, as the young Queenslander was preparing to fly out of Australia, the AFP tipped off their counterparts in the Indonesian National Police. Nine days later Rush was arrested with three other mules at Bali's Denpasar airport as they were about to return home with nearly 8kg of heroin strapped to their bodies. In September 2006 an Indonesian court sentenced Rush to death. http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/features/how-the-afp-trapped-the-bali-nine/story-e6frg6z6-1225910600831?nk=033a6594a3671f26cb5dbca813a5f19f I feel sorry for the father ... the guilt will destroy him

From the Horse's Mouth ~ Bob Myers QC on Australian Story.

Link.

Aussie wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:26pm:

bambu wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:24pm: John Smith wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:16pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:09pm: We can certainly criticise them for having barbaric laws. you do that ... whereas, I'll criticise those who break their law ... even more so since the penalty is so extreme bambu wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:14pm: They're pretending to be civilised... no ones pretending to be anything ... it is you who has label them as civillised or barbaric .. I don't think they care what you think They don't care what anyone thinks. The Australian govt should make them care...or cut them adrift, put the national cheque book back in the safe, and ignore them forevermore. Stop giving them money, food, trade, travel etc and the time of day. Boot their ambassador and all their companies, businesses and students out. Tell them to f off, and disconnect the phone. Why....because they have capital punishment?  If so, we better get busy with this lot for starters: Alabama Arizona Arkansas California Colorado Delaware Florida Georgia Idaho Indiana Kansas Kentucky      Louisiana Mississippi Missouri Montana Nebraska Nevada New Hampshire North Carolina Ohio Oklahoma Oregon      Pennsylvania South Carolina South Dakota Tennessee Texas Utah Virginia Washington Wyoming

All 'barbaric' too!
Always has been...and still is.

http://www.news.com.au/world/north-america/george-stinney-14-exonerated-70-years-after-he-was-executed-for-double-murder/story-fnh81jut-1227160168481

Exonerated ... Stinney was a small, frail boy who said whatever he thought would make authorities happy. (AP Photo/South Carolina Department of Archives and History, File) Source: AP

MORE than 70 years after the state of South Carolina sent a 14-year-old black boy to the electric chair after the killings of two white girls in a segregated mill town, a judge threw out his conviction, saying the state committed a great injustice.
 
George Stinney was arrested, convicted of murder in a one-day trial and executed in 1944 — all in the span of about three months and without an appeal. The speed in which South Carolina meted out justice against the youngest person executed in the United States in the 20th century was shocking and extremely unfair, Circuit Judge Carmen Mullen wrote in her ruling Wednesday.

No need to get wound up.  I am and always have been bitterly opposed to capital punishment.  My point is that there is no need to focus just on Indonesia, when there are many so called 'civilised States' where it exists among one of our closest allies

Aussie wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:54pm:

No need to get wound up.  I am and always have been bitterly opposed to capital punishment.  My point is that there is no need to focus just on Indonesia, when there are many so called 'civilised States' where it exists among one of our closest allies

Not wound up.
I'm posting in a cool, calm, rational, and quiet voice. ;)

Yes, our closest ally USA, ...but its death chambers are still 'barbaric' and 'uncivilised'.

Indonesia is a disgrace...time we/our govt treated it as such.

bambu wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 8:06pm:

Aussie wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:54pm: No need to get wound up.  I am and always have been bitterly opposed to capital punishment.  My point is that there is no need to focus just on Indonesia, when there are many so called 'civilised States' where it exists among one of our closest allies Not wound up. I'm posting in a cool, calm, rational, and quiet voice. ;) Yes, our closest ally USA, ...but its death chambers are still 'barbaric' and 'uncivilised'. Indonesia is a disgrace...time we/our govt treated it as such.

Why stop there?

bambu wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:00pm:

www.theage.com.au/world/indonesias-mixed-messages-on-fate-of-drug-traffickers-on-death-row-20141212-1260pp.html  White aprons will be hung carefully...

bambu, when tourist alight at Ngurah Rai Airport they might observe a sign that says Welcome to Indonesia. Tourists might take the time to consider what the sign means. It's Indonesia not Australia. Why don't we let the Indonesians run their country as they see fit. Let's call a halt to all this polypragmonic behaviour by hand-wringers and concentrate on living.

salad in wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 8:35pm:

bambu wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:00pm: www.theage.com.au/world/indonesias-mixed-messages-on-fate-of-drug-traffickers-on-death-row-20141212-1260pp.html  White aprons will be hung carefully... bambu, when tourist alight at Ngurah Rai Airport they might observe a sign that says Welcome to Indonesia. Tourists might take the time to consider what the sign means. It's Indonesia not Australia. Why don't we let the Indonesians run their country as they see fit. Let's call a halt to all this polypragmonic behaviour by hand-wringers and concentrate on living.

More like 'take our money and help then slap us in the face and use us as a doormat' Indonesia/ns.
The people who say that "Indonesia/ns hate Australia/ns" seem to be correct.
What other conclusion can they be expected to reach...given this;

http://www.theage.com.au/world/indonesian-president-joko-widodo-hardens-line-on-drug-offenders-on-death-row-20141218-12a8d7.html

Jakarta: Indonesia's President has entrenched his hard line against mercy for drug offenders on death row, stressing he "will never" grant them clemency.

"There are 64 [people] sentenced to death by the courts and as I've said about clemency request for drugs cases, I will never give clemency," he said at an event in Jakarta.

"Never will. Never will.

"I'm stressing this again and again so that it's all clear, so there will be no one who thinks that death penalty is [given] by the President.

"The sentence is from the courts and we don't give forgiveness or clemency."

Mr Joko received applause for the comments, made at a function in Jakarta.

#####

Oh no you don't Joko...their deaths are on your head...their blood is on your hands.

Yes, they're cheering in Indonesia for the execution-slaughter of our people on death row.

Oh the absolute hate!

http://www.theage.com.au/world/indonesian-president-joko-widodo-hardens-line-on-drug-offenders-on-death-row-20141218-12a8d7.html

Indonesian Foreign Ministry spokesman Armanatha Nasir said other countries should respect Indonesia's legal processes, even though it campaigns to save its own citizens from execution overseas.

"When we talk about death sentence there's the process of others, and domestically, there's our process," he told reporters.

"We respect their process abroad and so they should also respect ours."

#####

No you don't!
Indonesia is a hypocritical joke...and nasty.


http://www.canada.com/story_print.html?id=b5a59e69-58ef-4d01-8110-af99a336e6ff&sponsor=

2011

The execution a week ago of Ruyati binti Sapubi, 54, has caused public outrage in Indonesia, prompting the Jakarta government of President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono to take stern action against the Riyadh regime.

Indonesian revulsion at the barbarity of the Saudi system has been stoked by the failure of Riyadh authorities to tell Jakarta's ambassador that the execution was to take place and then allowing a video of the beheading to be available on a website.

The situation has been given even more momentum with the news last week from Indonesia's minister of justice and human rights, Patrialis Akbar, that another 22 of the country's citizens are awaiting execution by the sword in Saudi Arabia.

bambu wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 7:14am:

salad in wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 8:35pm: bambu wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:00pm: www.theage.com.au/world/indonesias-mixed-messages-on-fate-of-drug-traffickers-on-death-row-20141212-1260pp.html  White aprons will be hung carefully... bambu, when tourist alight at Ngurah Rai Airport they might observe a sign that says Welcome to Indonesia. Tourists might take the time to consider what the sign means. It's Indonesia not Australia. Why don't we let the Indonesians run their country as they see fit. Let's call a halt to all this polypragmonic behaviour by hand-wringers and concentrate on living. More like 'take our money and help then slap us in the face and use us as a doormat' Indonesia/ns. The people who say that "Indonesia/ns hate Australia/ns" seem to be correct. Yes, they're cheering in Indonesia for the execution-slaughter of our people on death row. Oh the absolute hate!

Of course the Indonesians hate us. Does that mean we can't return that hate in spades. I regard the Indonesians as pure filth.

Also, Chan and Sukumaran are NOT Australians; they are drug dealers happy to sell their product to willing buyers without a thought as to whether the user might die or not. Take both of them out with the trash.

The AFP did the sensible thing when they tipped off the Indonesians.

Several million dollars saved to the Australian taxpayer for police-work, court cases, jail-time, and endless appeals ... with the money now going towards our own drug rehabilitation centres where addicts are weaned off their soul-destroying habits.

It's all worked out very nicely. Plenty of cause for celebration.

A win-win result for everyone except the guilty ~ and that's as it should be.

I personally wouldn't have them shot, but would have them in jail for a minimum of 30 years not so much as a punishment, but just to keep them off the streets and away from our kids.

A primitive country governed, in reality, but the rule of the gun.

Any halfway decent Islamic or otherwise nation would see the wisdom of getting rid of capital punishment.

On my world travels, I have no desire to go there..... any of it.

I have not, do not, and will not support the State-sanctioned murder that is the death penalty
except in the most extreme of circumstances, and with 100% irrefutable proof of guilt.

Imposing the DP for dealing or using drugs (ANY drugs) is simply obscene, and is a far worse
crime than the one it's supposedly punishing.

It is a primitive, barbaric form of 'justice' which has no place in any country which wishes to
be regarded as a civilised, advanced or enlightened society. Its primary driving motivation is
vengeance, cruelty &/or sadism, justice has absolutely nothing to do with it, and never did.

By all means let this mob do some hard, lengthy time (not life without parole, as that is also
manifestly excessive for the crime). But by killing them, or supporting/calling for them to be
killed, you lower yourself to WAY below their level.

Quite frankly, the DP should be a crime under international law, with harsh sanctions applied
to any country which practices it.

bambu wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:14pm:

John Smith wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:06pm: they knew the risks and they took them ... they have no one else to blame but themselves ... you certainly can't blame the Indonesians for enforcing their laws. Of course you can. They're pretending to be civilised ...what a joke. Just a human rights wasteland in reality. Bob Hawke called Malaysia 'barbaric' when they execution-hanged Barlow and Chambers. Hopefully he'll do the same to Indonesia when they execution-shred Chan [now a Christian, mentored by The Salvation Army] and Sukumaran soon. Abbott needs to start a 'war' with Indonesia over this, fire up and stand for something! The mamby pamby, PC drivel he goes on with about Indonesia, running up there all the time and seemingly licking their boots...is a big part of why he's way behind in the polls.

don't hold back.  tell us what you REALLY think.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:20pm:

John Smith wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:16pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:09pm: We can certainly criticise them for having barbaric laws. you do that ... whereas, I'll criticise those who break their law ... I criticise them too. Being opposed to the death penalty doesn't mean that one is opposed to all forms of punishment. I'm perfectly capable of criticising more than one thing at a time: - The Bali 9 are criminals, and deserve to be punished. - The Indonesians have barbaric laws. There, I did it.

ditto.

mind you the AFP broke Australian law to let them be caught there but the AFP only occasionally gets anything right.

John Smith wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:16pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:09pm: We can certainly criticise them for having barbaric laws. you do that ... whereas, I'll criticise those who break their law ... even more so since the penalty is so extreme bambu wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:14pm: They're pretending to be civilised... no ones pretending to be anything ... it is you who has label them as civillised or barbaric .. I don't think they care what you think

Anyone who goes to Indonesia knows the penalty for drugs offences. Zero sympathy.

Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 9:46am:

I personally wouldn't have them shot ...

You're restoring my faith in humanity, Aunt Herb.

Your cover is slipping.

As far as i am concerned, Im sorry but they must have known there would be deadly consequences through the indonesian judicial system if they are caught smuggling drugs in either direction, AND THEY GOT CAUGHT, thats indonesian law, thats there right and all australians should know better on what not to do over in Bali, Thailand or some other exotic asian country if they wish to go there.


Personally I wouldnt wanna go to bali.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 12:00pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 9:46am: I personally wouldn't have them shot ... You're restoring my faith in humanity, Aunt Herb. Your cover is slipping.

Tread very carefully, gregg ...

Ayatollah al-Gandalfi has declared a Death Fatwa on certain pests hereabouts ...

I've had enough of watching beheading videos for this year, thank you very much.

I wish the Indonesian justice system would hurry up and carry out the sentence.
It's no deterrent if they keep delaying.

Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 9:46am:

The AFP did the sensible thing when they tipped off the Indonesians.  Several million dollars saved to the Australian taxpayer for police-work, court cases, jail-time, and endless appeals ... with the money now going towards our own drug rehabilitation centres where addicts are weaned off their soul-destroying habits. It's all worked out very nicely. Plenty of cause for celebration. A win-win result for everyone except the guilty ~ and that's as it should be. I personally wouldn't have them shot, but would have them in jail for a minimum of 30 years not so much as a punishment, but just to keep them off the streets and away from our kids.

Against the AFP's charter to dob in Australians to foreign govts when they'll face the death penalty.

AFP...baaah.

It all worked out very nicely...if you don't believe in human rights and granting a couple of favours to those who have given you so much in the name of friendship and love.

Australia should immediately pass a new law increasing the sentences of all Indonesian criminals in our prisons to 50 years.

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 1:25pm:

I wish the Indonesian justice system would hurry up and carry out the sentence. It's no deterrent if they keep delaying.

It's no deterrent at all.

If it was, there'd be no such thing as the Bali 9.

Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 9:46am:

The AFP did the sensible thing when they tipped off the Indonesians. Several million dollars saved to the Australian taxpayer for police-work, court cases, jail-time, and endless appeals ... with the money now going towards our own drug rehabilitation centres where addicts are weaned off their soul-destroying habits. It's all worked out very nicely. Plenty of cause for celebration. A win-win result for everyone except the guilty ~ and that's as it should be. I personally wouldn't have them shot, but would have them in jail for a minimum of 30 years not so much as a punishment, but just to keep them off the streets and away from our kids.

And this is the thanks they get for trying to bring you a stronger painkiller than those silly Neurophen you take.

Even if your quack prescribes MS Contin, it’s weaker than decent diacetyl morphine AKA smack.

In any other time, the Bali 9 would be considered heroes for liberating people from their pain, just as the chemist who developed Heroin for Bayer was.

bambu wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 1:26pm:

Australia should immediately pass a new law increasing the sentences of all Indonesian criminals in our prisons to 50 years.

While certainly not as barbaric as capital punishment, increasing all sentences to 50 years would just be lowering ourselves to their level.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 1:27pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 1:25pm: I wish the Indonesian justice system would hurry up and carry out the sentence. It's no deterrent if they keep delaying. It's no deterrent at all. If it was, there'd be no such thing as the Bali 9.

The government cannot legislate against people being stupid in spite of anything they do.
And delaying carrying out of any sentence serves no-one.

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 1:25pm:

I wish the Indonesian justice system would hurry up and carry out the sentence. It's no deterrent if they keep delaying.

In America the death penalty is carried out on average 9 years after sentencing ~ which I think is an utter obscenity.

Death sentences should be carried out with the utmost expedition just as they do in most of Asia.

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 1:25pm:

I wish the Indonesian justice system would hurry up and carry out the sentence. It's no deterrent if they keep delaying.

It'll be no deterrent anyway.
Indonesia will still be awash with drugs...it's the Mr Bigs in Asia you know.
See any of them being execution-slaughtered?

All that heroin...magic heroin...just flew in the windows and onto the tables for the Bali 9 to pack up and strap to their bodies.
The Indonesian cops had the Bali 9 under surveillance from the moment they arrived in Bali...yet didn't see one person deliver all that heroin to the Bali 9 at different locations.
;D

The Saudis are beheading drug smugglers at express pace...but the place is awash with drugs, in ever increasing amounts.

Some people seem to think that Indonesia just loves to execution-slaughter people, including foreigners...to appear like "tough guys" and have foreigners begging them.

bambu wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 1:26pm:

Australia should immediately pass a new law increasing the sentences of all Indonesian criminals in our prisons to 50 years.

Our federal and State police are in utter contempt of our law courts for their ridiculous leniency in so many cases.

I believe this might be why the AFP tipped off the Indonesians ~ so that these dealers in death would get pretty much what they deserve.

Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 1:36pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 1:25pm: I wish the Indonesian justice system would hurry up and carry out the sentence. It's no deterrent if they keep delaying. In America the death penalty is carried out on average 9 years after sentencing ~ which I think is an utter obscenity. Death sentences should be carried out with the utmost expedition just as they do in most of Asia.

What about the people who are found to be innocent...20 and 30 years after they were tossed onto death row?

Death penalties should be abolished...and all death chambers bulldozed.

bambu wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 1:38pm:

It'll be no deterrent anyway.

Indeed.

If capital punishment is an effective deterrent, why is it still being carried out?

bambu wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 1:38pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 1:25pm: I wish the Indonesian justice system would hurry up and carry out the sentence. It's no deterrent if they keep delaying. It'll be no deterrent anyway. Indonesia will still be awash with drugs...it's the Mr Bigs in Asia you know. See any of them being execution-slaughtered? All that heroin...magic heroin...just flew in the windows and onto the tables for the Bali 9 to pack up and strap to their bodies. The Indonesian cops had the Bali 9 under surveillance from the moment they arrived in Bali...yet didn't see one person deliver all that heroin to the Bali 9 at different locations. ;D The Saudis are beheading drug smugglers at express pace...but the place is awash with drugs, in ever increasing amounts. Some people seem to think that Indonesia just loves to execution-slaughter people, including foreigners...to appear like "tough guys" and have foreigners begging them.

There are bugger all drugs in.Indonesia. Some pot, a fair bit of speed, and coffee. That’s it. If you want to score smack, go to.India or Pakistan. You can’t even buy heroin in Thailand anymore.

Alas, the good old days are long gone.

bambu wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 1:38pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 1:25pm: I wish the Indonesian justice system would hurry up and carry out the sentence. It's no deterrent if they keep delaying. It'll be no deterrent anyway. Indonesia will still be awash with drugs...it's the Mr Bigs in Asia you know. See any of them being execution-slaughtered? All that heroin...magic heroin...just flew in the windows and onto the tables for the Bali 9 to pack up and strap to their bodies. The Indonesian cops had the Bali 9 under surveillance from the moment they arrived in Bali...yet didn't see one person deliver all that heroin to the Bali 9 at different locations. ;D The Saudis are beheading drug smugglers at express pace...but the place is awash with drugs, in ever increasing amounts. Some people seem to think that Indonesia just loves to execution-slaughter people, including foreigners...to appear like "tough guys" and have foreigners begging them.

There are bugger all drugs in.Indonesia. Some pot, a fair bit of speed, and coffee. That’s it. If you want to score smack, go to.India or Pakistan. You can’t even buy heroin in Thailand anymore.

Alas, the good old days are long gone.

Karnal wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 2:05pm:

There are bugger all drugs in.Indonesia. Some pot, a fair bit of speed, and coffee. That’s it. If you want to score smack, go to.India or Pakistan. You can’t even buy heroin in Thailand anymore. Alas, the good old days are long gone.

Slow down old boy. I hope you have sampled those drugs you mentioned purely for research purposes. Have you ever thought of taking in the sights or perhaps doing a bit of surfing when on holidays? Try it for a change rather than getting sh!t face.

bambu wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 1:42pm:

What about the people who are found to be innocent...20 and 30 years after they were tossed onto death row? Death penalties should be abolished...and all death chambers bulldozed.

Good point.

The obvious answer is stricter and more vigorous proof of guilt required.

From a personal point of view I really don't care too much if some of these 'innocent of murder' criminals get the chop.

Most of them have long and appalling records of anti-social and criminal behaviour long before they are finally brought before a judge on charges of murder.

I couldn't give a rat's arse if some of these drug-pushing vermin get terminated before they can do any more damage to society.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 1:45pm:

bambu wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 1:38pm: It'll be no deterrent anyway. Indeed. If capital punishment is an effective deterrent, why is it still being carried out?

Answer: Because it was discovered that once these vermin are terminated they are no longer found to be up to murder, rape, and mayhem in society.

As a consequence of this astounding discovery there are still many States in the US that zap these people as a service to decent society.

salad in wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 2:19pm:

Karnal wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 2:05pm: There are bugger all drugs in.Indonesia. Some pot, a fair bit of speed, and coffee. That’s it. If you want to score smack, go to.India or Pakistan. You can’t even buy heroin in Thailand anymore. Alas, the good old days are long gone. Slow down old boy. I hope you have sampled those drugs you mentioned purely for research purposes. Have you ever thought of taking in the sights or perhaps doing a bit of surfing when on holidays? Try it for a change rather than getting sh!t face.

it does explain a lot about Karnal however.  Perhaps the persona he puts on here as the dumb fool is actually the real him.  DRAH-lite perhaps?

Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 5:13pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 1:45pm: bambu wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 1:38pm: It'll be no deterrent anyway. Indeed. If capital punishment is an effective deterrent, why is it still being carried out? Answer: Because it was discovered that once these vermin are terminated they are no longer found to be up to murder, rape, and mayhem in society.

A deterrent after the fact?  Nice one, Aunt Herbie. You're such a kidder (kidder/troll? - I'll let others make up their minds).

It does nothing to stop them from committing crimes in the first place.

Capital punishment, as an effective deterrent, is a complete failure.

Then again, I shouldn't have to tell you about complete failures.

salad in wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 2:19pm:

Karnal wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 2:05pm: There are bugger all drugs in.Indonesia. Some pot, a fair bit of speed, and coffee. That’s it. If you want to score smack, go to.India or Pakistan. You can’t even buy heroin in Thailand anymore. Alas, the good old days are long gone. Slow down old boy. I hope you have sampled those drugs you mentioned purely for research purposes. Have you ever thought of taking in the sights or perhaps doing a bit of surfing when on holidays? Try it for a change rather than getting sh!t face.

How do you think I know?

South East Asia is no longer a heroin exporter. This market now belongs to Pakistan/Afghanistan. The Bali 9 were among the last of the big heroin drug mules from.South East Asia. We occasionally hear of a haul these days, but it’s rare. The Golden Triangle is still able to produce a few kilos of heroin on consignment, but the main drug being produced there now is amphetamine pills - largely for the Chinese market.

South East Asia is not awash with drugs anymore. Mind you, for a Muslim country, alcohol in Indonesia is mercifully cheap, so you can still go to Indo and get sh!tfaced.

The cheapest drug there is tobacco. Cigarettes are about a dollar a pack.

salad in wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 2:19pm:

Karnal wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 2:05pm: There are bugger all drugs in.Indonesia. Some pot, a fair bit of speed, and coffee. That’s it. If you want to score smack, go to.India or Pakistan. You can’t even buy heroin in Thailand anymore. Alas, the good old days are long gone. Slow down old boy. I hope you have sampled those drugs you mentioned purely for research purposes. Have you ever thought of taking in the sights or perhaps doing a bit of surfing when on holidays? Try it for a change rather than getting sh!t face.

How do you think I know?

South East Asia is no longer a heroin exporter. This market now belongs to Pakistan/Afghanistan. The Bali 9 were among the last of the big heroin drug mules from.South East Asia. We occasionally hear of a haul these days, but it’s rare. The Golden Triangle is still able to produce a few kilos of heroin on consignment, but the main drug being produced there now is amphetamine pills - largely for the Chinese market.

South East Asia is not awash with drugs anymore. Mind you, for a Muslim country, alcohol in Indonesia is mercifully cheap, so you can still go to Indo and get sh!tfaced.

The cheapest drug there is tobacco. Cigarettes are about a dollar a pack.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 5:54pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 5:13pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 1:45pm: bambu wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 1:38pm: It'll be no deterrent anyway. Indeed. If capital punishment is an effective deterrent, why is it still being carried out? Answer: Because it was discovered that once these vermin are terminated they are no longer found to be up to murder, rape, and mayhem in society. A deterrent after the fact?  Nice one, Aunt Herbie. You're such a kidder (kidder/troll? - I'll let others make up their minds). It does nothing to stop them from committing crimes in the first place. Capital punishment, as an effective deterrent, is a complete failure. Then again, I shouldn't have to tell you about complete failures.

the best result capital punishment has on crime rates is the have no impact.  in far too many cases, it INCREASES it.  No, I don't understand it either, but unlike some on here, my inability to understand something doesn't automatically make it a lie.

Karnal wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 5:57pm:

South East Asia is not awash with drugs anymore. Mind you, for a Muslim country, alcohol in Indonesia is mercifully cheap, so you can still go to Indo and get sh!tfaced. The cheapest drug there is tobacco. Cigarettes are about a dollar a pack.

Ah, that explains it!

Rockatanski said he was going to Bali to pick up some fags.  I totally misunderstood him.

longweekend58 wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 6:02pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 5:54pm: Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 5:13pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 1:45pm: bambu wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 1:38pm: It'll be no deterrent anyway. Indeed. If capital punishment is an effective deterrent, why is it still being carried out? Answer: Because it was discovered that once these vermin are terminated they are no longer found to be up to murder, rape, and mayhem in society. A deterrent after the fact?  Nice one, Aunt Herbie. You're such a kidder (kidder/troll? - I'll let others make up their minds). It does nothing to stop them from committing crimes in the first place. Capital punishment, as an effective deterrent, is a complete failure. Then again, I shouldn't have to tell you about complete failures. the best result capital punishment has on crime rates is the have no impact.  in far too many cases, it INCREASES it.  No, I don't understand it either, but unlike some on here, my inability to understand something doesn't automatically make it a lie.

Check out the USA: http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterrence-states-without-death-penalty-have-had-consistently-lower-murder-rates#stateswithvwithout

Murder Rates in Death Penalty States and Non-Death Penalty States

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/files/murderratesdpvsnodp.jpg

Will they put it on YouTube? That might be a bit of a deterrent for something . . .maybe YouTube.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 6:05pm:

Karnal wrote on Dec 21st, 2014 at 5:57pm: South East Asia is not awash with drugs anymore. Mind you, for a Muslim country, alcohol in Indonesia is mercifully cheap, so you can still go to Indo and get sh!tfaced. The cheapest drug there is tobacco. Cigarettes are about a dollar a pack. Ah, that explains it! Rockatanski said he was going to Bali to pick up some fags.  I totally misunderstood him.

No no, I think he meant butts. The streets are full of them.

You really are an old bitch, Pecker.

Rocketanski wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 2:38pm:

You really are an old bitch, Pecker.

You don't like my stats?

Murder Rates in Death Penalty States and Non-Death Penalty States

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/files/murderratesdpvsnodp.jpg

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterrence-states-without-death-penalty-have-had-consistently-lower-murder-rates#stateswithvwithout

Rocketanski wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 2:38pm:

You really are an old bitch, Pecker.

Now now, ladies, keep it kleen.

You and your butt queen Karnal had to slag me off even in a forum I haven't  anything to do with. Time for a bit of euthanasia you old cosies.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 2:52pm:

You don't like my stats?

Did they ever commit another murder?

You don't like my question?

Rocketanski wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 5:00pm:

You and your butt queen Karnal had to slag me off even in a forum I haven't  anything to do with. Time for a bit of euthanasia you old cosies.

Pass the amyl first, dear.  A bit of a snort, and I'm anyone's.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 2:52pm:

Rocketanski wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:38pm: You really are an old bitch, Pecker. You don't like my stats? Murder Rates in Death Penalty States and Non-Death Penalty States http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/files/murderratesdpvsnodp.jpg http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterrence-states-without-death-penalty-have-had-consistently-lower-murder-rates#stateswithvwithout

meaningless statistics. Unless of course you have stats before the introduction of the death penalty for all those states. Which you dont.

Karnal wrote on Dec 21^st, 2014 at 5:57pm:

South East Asia is not awash with drugs anymore. Mind you, for a Muslim country, alcohol in Indonesia is mercifully cheap, so you can still go to Indo and get sh!tfaced. The cheapest drug there is tobacco. Cigarettes are about a dollar a pack.

really , where?  Id love to know.

ian wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 6:07pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:52pm: Rocketanski wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:38pm: You really are an old bitch, Pecker. You don't like my stats? Murder Rates in Death Penalty States and Non-Death Penalty States http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/files/murderratesdpvsnodp.jpg http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterrence-states-without-death-penalty-have-had-consistently-lower-murder-rates#stateswithvwithout meaningless statistics. Unless of course you have stats before the introduction of the death penalty for all those states. Which you dont.

oh we have seen your take on the DP before, pot head.  tat is where you deem to know more about the Singaporean Legal System than the Law Society.  that was one of your less brilliant moments.  too much dope that evening?

Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 5:02pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:52pm: You don't like my stats? Did they ever commit another murder? You don't like my question?

A deterrent after the fact?   ;D   ;D   ;D 

Oh boy, the Troll King's on a roll today.

Capital punishment is not an effective deterrent for potential criminals.

The fact that your brain can't process that fact, is of no surprise to anyone in this forum.

ian wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 6:07pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:52pm: Rocketanski wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:38pm: You really are an old bitch, Pecker. You don't like my stats? Murder Rates in Death Penalty States and Non-Death Penalty States http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/files/murderratesdpvsnodp.jpg http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterrence-states-without-death-penalty-have-had-consistently-lower-murder-rates#stateswithvwithout meaningless statistics.

No, it means that from 1990 to 2009, the states with capital punishment had higher rates of murder than those without.

Here, have a look again:


http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/files/murderratesdpvsnodp.jpg

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 6:55pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 5:02pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:52pm: You don't like my stats? Did they ever commit another murder? You don't like my question? A deterrent after the fact?   ;D   ;D   ;D  Oh boy, the Troll King's on a roll today. Capital punishment is not an effective deterrent for potential criminals. The fact that your brain can't process that fact, is of no surprise to anyone in this forum.

but your stats dont show that.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 7:03pm:

ian wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 6:07pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:52pm: Rocketanski wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:38pm: You really are an old bitch, Pecker. You don't like my stats? Murder Rates in Death Penalty States and Non-Death Penalty States http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/files/murderratesdpvsnodp.jpg http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterrence-states-without-death-penalty-have-had-consistently-lower-murder-rates#stateswithvwithout meaningless statistics.  No, it means that from 1990 to 2009, the states with capital punishment had higher rates of murder than those without. Here, have a look again: http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/files/murderratesdpvsnodp.jpg

No, your stats are still meaningless without a baseline or trend. What you need to do in order to attempt to prove your point is to post the stats before and after the introduction of the death penalty. Get it? Despite which i tend to think the murderers may have worked out which states have the death penalty. So the states with lower stats may just have more mobile criminals.

ian wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 7:04pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 6:55pm: Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 5:02pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:52pm: You don't like my stats? Did they ever commit another murder? You don't like my question? A deterrent after the fact?   ;D   ;D   ;D  Oh boy, the Troll King's on a roll today. Capital punishment is not an effective deterrent for potential criminals. The fact that your brain can't process that fact, is of no surprise to anyone in this forum. but your stats dont show that.

And whatever happened to judicial punishment? Whether it's a deterrent or not is an entirely different question.

I don't advocate the chop for all murderers, but I do support it for the monsters who kill for pleasure.

ian wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 7:04pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 6:55pm: Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 5:02pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:52pm: You don't like my stats? Did they ever commit another murder? You don't like my question? A deterrent after the fact?   ;D   ;D   ;D  Oh boy, the Troll King's on a roll today. Capital punishment is not an effective deterrent for potential criminals. The fact that your brain can't process that fact, is of no surprise to anyone in this forum. but your stats dont show that.

Not on their own, no.

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/facts-about-deterrence-and-death-penalty

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/discussion-recent-deterrence-studies

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/law-enforcement-views-deterrence#lawenforcement

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/study-88-criminologists-do-not-believe-death-penalty-effective-deterrent

http://deathpenaltycurriculum.org/student/c/about/arguments/argument1b.htm

http://www.amnestyusa.org/our-work/issues/death-penalty/us-death-penalty-facts/the-death-penalty-and-deterrence

ian wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 7:09pm:

No, your stats are still meaningless ...

No, they have a meaning.

They show that from 1990 to 2009, the states with capital punishment had higher rates of murder than those without.

If you wish to dispute that fact, I'm here ... and waiting.

ian wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 6:07pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:52pm: Rocketanski wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:38pm: You really are an old bitch, Pecker. You don't like my stats? Murder Rates in Death Penalty States and Non-Death Penalty States http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/files/murderratesdpvsnodp.jpg http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterrence-states-without-death-penalty-have-had-consistently-lower-murder-rates#stateswithvwithout meaningless statistics. Unless of course you have stats before the introduction of the death penalty for all those states. Which you dont.

and you don't think it is noteworthy or even compelling that the murder rate in non-DP states is consistently lower than DP states> not occasionally or for most but ALL THE TIME for EVERY STATE.

that's called PROOF.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 7:12pm:

ian wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 7:09pm: No, your stats are still meaningless ... No, they have a meaning. They show that from 1990 to 2009, the states with capital punishment had higher rates of murder than those without. If you wish to dispute that fact, I'm here ... and waiting.

Im not disputing that. Thats not the claim you made though was it now?

longweekend58 wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 7:16pm:

ian wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 6:07pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:52pm: Rocketanski wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:38pm: You really are an old bitch, Pecker. You don't like my stats? Murder Rates in Death Penalty States and Non-Death Penalty States http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/files/murderratesdpvsnodp.jpg http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterrence-states-without-death-penalty-have-had-consistently-lower-murder-rates#stateswithvwithout meaningless statistics. Unless of course you have stats before the introduction of the death penalty for all those states. Which you dont. and you don't think it is noteworthy or even compelling that the murder rate in non-DP states is consistently lower than DP states> not occasionally or for most but ALL THE TIME for EVERY STATE. that's called PROOF.

Lol, theres your answer Greg. When you have Longweekend supporting your statements you know your argument is in trouble.

ian wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 7:57pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 7:16pm: ian wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 6:07pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:52pm: Rocketanski wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:38pm: You really are an old bitch, Pecker. You don't like my stats? Murder Rates in Death Penalty States and Non-Death Penalty States http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/files/murderratesdpvsnodp.jpg http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterrence-states-without-death-penalty-have-had-consistently-lower-murder-rates#stateswithvwithout meaningless statistics. Unless of course you have stats before the introduction of the death penalty for all those states. Which you dont. and you don't think it is noteworthy or even compelling that the murder rate in non-DP states is consistently lower than DP states> not occasionally or for most but ALL THE TIME for EVERY STATE. that's called PROOF. Lol, theres your answer Greg. When you have Longweekend supporting your statements you know your argument is in trouble.

When it comes to capital punishment, Longy is 100% correct.

Only discovered recently that I have tyres on my car..."Made in Indonesia".  >:(
Aussie icon racing car driver brand.
Baaah.

That will never ever be happening again...gold plated guarantee.

Only discovered recently that I have tyres on my car..."Made in Indonesia".  >:(
Aussie iconic racing car driver brand.

Baah!
That will never ever ever be happening again.

Why don't the Indo government just extradite them here and we'll execute them according to our standards........

quick, take them off ... you can drive to the tyre shop on the rims to get new ones

longweekend58 wrote on Dec 22^nd, 2014 at 6:31pm:

ian wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 6:07pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:52pm: Rocketanski wrote on Dec 22nd, 2014 at 2:38pm: You really are an old bitch, Pecker. You don't like my stats? Murder Rates in Death Penalty States and Non-Death Penalty States http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/files/murderratesdpvsnodp.jpg http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterrence-states-without-death-penalty-have-had-consistently-lower-murder-rates#stateswithvwithout meaningless statistics. Unless of course you have stats before the introduction of the death penalty for all those states. Which you dont. oh we have seen your take on the DP before, pot head.  tat is where you deem to know more about the Singaporean Legal System than the Law Society.  that was one of your less brilliant moments.  too much dope that evening?

But i do know that someone with a psychosis isnt necassarily a psychopath. What about you?

The Indonesian government is going to execute every one of these drug smugglers while most of the terrorists who helped kill over 200 people are out and walking around. Now that's twisted.

Rocketanski wrote on Dec 23^rd, 2014 at 9:24am:

The Indonesian government is going to execute every one of these drug smugglers while most of the terrorists who helped kill over 200 people are out and walking around. Now that's twisted.

Indeed.

Then again, we're talking about Indonesia: a country well known for corruption in the justice sector.

Rocketanski wrote on Dec 23^rd, 2014 at 9:24am:

The Indonesian government is going to execute every one of these drug smugglers while most of the terrorists who helped kill over 200 people are out and walking around. Now that's twisted.

Twisted is one word to describe it...there many others.
Yes, the Indonesia most Australians love with all their hearts.  ;D
...having fallen for all the BS.

The Indonesia that's Obama's best buddy.
Not one word from the self-appointed "Pacific President" against his "childhood home" Indonesia.
Would anyone expect anything else?

John Smith wrote on Dec 23^rd, 2014 at 9:14am:

quick, take them off ... you can drive to the tyre shop on the rims to get new ones

lol

They'll need replacing soon.

It's in small print...only saw it when I was checking the year of manufacture of the tyres after seeing a segment on ACA about new tyres that are "years old" by the time they are actually fitted to our cars.

Rocketanski wrote on Dec 23^rd, 2014 at 9:24am:

The Indonesian government is going to execute every one of these drug smugglers while most of the terrorists who helped kill over 200 people are out and walking around. Now that's twisted.

incorrect. The terrorists got the death penalty. Not sure where this myth keeps coming from. Indonesia also does not execute every drug smuggler, i can think of one right now who is free and walking around.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 23^rd, 2014 at 10:00am:

Rocketanski wrote on Dec 23rd, 2014 at 9:24am: The Indonesian government is going to execute every one of these drug smugglers while most of the terrorists who helped kill over 200 people are out and walking around. Now that's twisted. Indeed. Then again, we're talking about Indonesia: a country well known for corruption in the justice sector.

almost as corrupt as Australia.

ian wrote on Dec 23^rd, 2014 at 6:20pm:

Rocketanski wrote on Dec 23rd, 2014 at 9:24am: The Indonesian government is going to execute every one of these drug smugglers while most of the terrorists who helped kill over 200 people are out and walking around. Now that's twisted. incorrect. The terrorists got the death penalty. Not sure where this myth keeps coming from. Indonesia also does not execute every drug smuggler, i can think of one right now who is free and walking around.

Every drug smuggler on death row they're gonna execution-shred...including the two Aussie boys.

Only a few terrorists got the death penalty, the others are walking free;

http://www.businessinsider.com.au/36-of-the-bali-bombings-terrorists-are-free-even-more-will-be-released-this-year-2014-5

Thirty-six of the Indonesian terrorists involved in the deadly Bali Bombings in 2002 have been released from jail, and another 100 are expected to be freed in the coming year.

#####

What does that tell you about the Muslim Indonesia you and most in Australia love?
Yes, exactly!

ian wrote on Dec 23^rd, 2014 at 6:21pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 23rd, 2014 at 10:00am: Rocketanski wrote on Dec 23rd, 2014 at 9:24am: The Indonesian government is going to execute every one of these drug smugglers while most of the terrorists who helped kill over 200 people are out and walking around. Now that's twisted. Indeed. Then again, we're talking about Indonesia: a country well known for corruption in the justice sector. almost as corrupt as Australia.

You keep telling yourself that, ian, if it makes you happy.

"The former head of Indonesia's Constitutional Court has received a life sentence for graft. That’s the heaviest penalty ever for the offense in what is considered one of the most corrupt countries in the world."

http://www.dw.de/life-sentence-for-indonesia-constitutional-court-judge-akil-mochtar/a-17747697

Check out the latest CPI, if you feel inclined.

Australia is at number 11, out of 174 countries.

Indonesia came in at 107.

http://www.transparency.org/cpi2014/results/

My sympathy for these two is zero.

bambu wrote on Dec 23^rd, 2014 at 7:02pm:

ian wrote on Dec 23rd, 2014 at 6:20pm: Rocketanski wrote on Dec 23rd, 2014 at 9:24am: The Indonesian government is going to execute every one of these drug smugglers while most of the terrorists who helped kill over 200 people are out and walking around. Now that's twisted. incorrect. The terrorists got the death penalty. Not sure where this myth keeps coming from. Indonesia also does not execute every drug smuggler, i can think of one right now who is free and walking around. Every drug smuggler on death row they're gonna execution-shred...including the two Aussie boys. Only a few terrorists got the death penalty, the others are walking free; http://www.businessinsider.com.au/36-of-the-bali-bombings-terrorists-are-free-even-more-will-be-released-this-year-2014-5 Thirty-six of the Indonesian terrorists involved in the deadly Bali Bombings in 2002 have been released from jail, and another 100 are expected to be freed in the coming year. ##### What does that tell you about the Muslim Indonesia you and most in Australia love? Yes, exactly!

You'll never convince them.

They want their cheap holidays, and they want their Bintang singlets.

That's all they care about.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Dec 24^th, 2014 at 6:07pm:

My sympathy for these two is zero.

They made a mistake.
They've been rehabilitated in prison...Chan leads Christian church services in Kerobokan prison[having been a lost soul and then mentored by the Salvation Army]...while Sukumaran has turned convicts to art classes and given them purpose.

And during that jail riot, when the authorities lost control of the prison, it was Sukumaran who prevented the rioters from gaining access to the armoury, thereby saving the lives of many women and prison guards etc.

Given what's going to happen to him now, maybe he should've done a 'Rambo' and armed himself to the teeth, then shot his way to freedom and made his way home.

have they shot them yet?

why do they take so long, just get it over and done with .....

http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2014/12/26/muslim-organizations-support-death-penalty.html

Muslim organizations support death penalty

Looking for support: President Joko “Jokowi” Widodo (second right), accompanied by Religious Affairs Minister Lukman Hakim Saifuddin (left) and chairman of the country’s largest Muslim organization Nahdlatul Ulama (NU) Said Aqil Siradj (right), arrives at the organization’s headquarters in Kramat, Central Jakarta, on Thursday. Jokowi visited NU to rally support for his call to expedite the executions of drug convicts.

The country’s two largest Muslim organizations, Nahdlatul Ulama (NU) and Muhammadiyah, have given their support to President Joko “Jokowi” Widodo’s call for the swift execution of death-row inmates despite criticism from human rights campaigners.

Citing the Koran and the State Constitution, NU chairman Said Aqil Siradj said drug trafficking was a serious crime punishable by death.Muhammadiyah deputy chairman Malik Fadjar meanwhile said the country’s second biggest Muslim organization “fully supports” the execution of drug convicts, ...

Jokowi maintained that the call for the execution of drug convicts, including some foreigners, would not trouble Indonesia’s diplomatic ties with other countries.

#####

Abbott, Bishop, Hockey and co must tell Indonesia differently...that if Indonesia execution-slaughters Australian citizens Chan and Sukumaran it will trouble the Australian govt...trouble it enough to make Indonesia pay bigtime!

If Abbott, Bishop, Hockey and co do not tell Indonesia, and Chan and Sukumaran are execution-shredded, ...and then Abbott, Bishop, Hockey and co don't exact severe and lasting revenge on Indonesia...no one in Australia should ever vote for them or the Liberal Party again!

bambu wrote on Dec 26^th, 2014 at 2:17pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Dec 24th, 2014 at 6:07pm: My sympathy for these two is zero. They made a mistake. They've been rehabilitated in prison...Chan leads Christian church services in Kerobokan prison[having been a lost soul and then mentored by the Salvation Army]...while Sukumaran has turned convicts to art classes and given them purpose.

Of course they haver, sociopaths always are. Until they get out. Dont be a fool


Quote:

And during that jail riot, when the authorities lost control of the prison, it was Sukumaran who prevented the rioters from gaining access to the armoury, thereby saving the lives of many women and prison guards etc.

complete fabricated nonsense


Quote:

Given what's going to happen to him now, maybe he should've done a 'Rambo' and armed himself to the teeth, then shot his way to freedom and made his way home.

keep watching those hollywood movies

bambu wrote on Dec 23^rd, 2014 at 7:02pm:

ian wrote on Dec 23rd, 2014 at 6:20pm: Rocketanski wrote on Dec 23rd, 2014 at 9:24am: The Indonesian government is going to execute every one of these drug smugglers while most of the terrorists who helped kill over 200 people are out and walking around. Now that's twisted. incorrect. The terrorists got the death penalty. Not sure where this myth keeps coming from. Indonesia also does not execute every drug smuggler, i can think of one right now who is free and walking around. Every drug smuggler on death row they're gonna execution-shred...including the two Aussie boys. Only a few terrorists got the death penalty, the others are walking free; http://www.businessinsider.com.au/36-of-the-bali-bombings-terrorists-are-free-even-more-will-be-released-this-year-2014-5 Thirty-six of the Indonesian terrorists involved in the deadly Bali Bombings in 2002 have been released from jail, and another 100 are expected to be freed in the coming year. ##### What does that tell you about the Muslim Indonesia you and most in Australia love? Yes, exactly!

it tells me that the people who actually committed the bombings got the death penalty while those convicted of being involved in the planning got a far greater sentence than they would have received in Australia.
Next!

bambu wrote on Dec 26^th, 2014 at 2:32pm:

http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2014/12/26/muslim-organizations-support-death-penalty.html Muslim organizations support death penalty Looking for support: President Joko “Jokowi” Widodo (second right), accompanied by Religious Affairs Minister Lukman Hakim Saifuddin (left) and chairman of the country’s largest Muslim organization Nahdlatul Ulama (NU) Said Aqil Siradj (right), arrives at the organization’s headquarters in Kramat, Central Jakarta, on Thursday. Jokowi visited NU to rally support for his call to expedite the executions of drug convicts. The country’s two largest Muslim organizations, Nahdlatul Ulama (NU) and Muhammadiyah, have given their support to President Joko “Jokowi” Widodo’s call for the swift execution of death-row inmates despite criticism from human rights campaigners. Citing the Koran and the State Constitution, NU chairman Said Aqil Siradj said drug trafficking was a serious crime punishable by death.Muhammadiyah deputy chairman Malik Fadjar meanwhile said the country’s second biggest Muslim organization “fully supports” the execution of drug convicts, ... Jokowi maintained that the call for the execution of drug convicts, including some foreigners, would not trouble Indonesia’s diplomatic ties with other countries. ##### Abbott, Bishop, Hockey and co must tell Indonesia differently...that if Indonesia execution-slaughters Australian citizens Chan and Sukumaran it will trouble the Australian govt...trouble it enough to make Indonesia pay bigtime! If Abbott, Bishop, Hockey and co do not tell Indonesia, and Chan and Sukumaran are execution-shredded, ...and then Abbott, Bishop, Hockey and co don't exact severe and lasting revenge on Indonesia...no one in Australia should ever vote for them or the Liberal Party again!

the main  problem you have is that the vast majority of australians actually support these sociopathic hard drug smugglers getting the death penalty.  Congrats to hard man Jokowi, I supported him in the last election.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 24^th, 2014 at 7:29pm:

You'll never convince them. They want their cheap holidays, and they want their Bintang singlets. That's all they care about.

the only time I go to Bali is when it is necassary to pass through Denpasar airport, i wouldnt be caught dead in the place. pardon the pun. People who wear bintang singlets dont have politcal opinions Greggary, you should know that.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Dec 24^th, 2014 at 6:07pm:

My sympathy for these two is zero.

wow, youre a softcck, mine is much less than zero. If only we could volunteer to fire the bullet........

bambu wrote on Dec 26^th, 2014 at 2:17pm:

They made a mistake.

NO THEY DIDNT..

they were in fact organisers of the drugs and had being doing it for some time..not only taking the drugs out of Bali but bringing them in in the first instance.

.
ian wrote on Dec 26^th, 2014 at 3:35pm:

They've been rehabilitated in prison...Chan leads Christian church services in Kerobokan prison[having been a lost soul and then mentored by the Salvation Army]...while Sukumaran has turned convicts to art classes and given them purpose.

well done to them.. it passes the time I have been told..
most prisoners find god when their own lives are threatened.. I am sure they didnt even know he existed when they were selling their drugs to all and sundry not giving a sh!t if it killed them.

.
bambu wrote on Dec 26^th, 2014 at 2:17pm:

And during that jail riot, when the authorities lost control of the prison, it was Sukumaran who prevented the rioters from gaining access to the armoury, thereby saving the lives of many women and prison guards etc.

that is news to me.. I heard none of the AUstralians tried to escape..


however neither here nor there.

I dont think they deserve death...

but it isnt our LAWS.... and EVERYONE including them knew of these risks when they took..

the risk....

had they not been caught... they would still be flying the drugs in..... I am thinking more about those young people that are yet to be hooked on these drugs that these people seem to have endless access too...


death NO.. but a LONG SENTENCE YES..

change your post cods, i didnt write what you are quotng me.

cods wrote on Dec 26^th, 2014 at 4:19pm:

And during that jail riot, when the authorities lost control of the prison, it was Sukumaran who prevented the rioters from gaining access to the armoury, thereby saving the lives of many women and prison guards etc. These people should be let out now., heroin is a harmless drug and no threat to anyone.

really?

ian wrote on Dec 26^th, 2014 at 3:35pm:

bambu wrote on Dec 26th, 2014 at 2:17pm: Andrei.Hicks wrote on Dec 24th, 2014 at 6:07pm: My sympathy for these two is zero. They made a mistake. They've been rehabilitated in prison...Chan leads Christian church services in Kerobokan prison[having been a lost soul and then mentored by the Salvation Army]...while Sukumaran has turned convicts to art classes and given them purpose. Of course they haver, sociopaths always are. Until they get out. Dont be a fool Quote: And during that jail riot, when the authorities lost control of the prison, it was Sukumaran who prevented the rioters from gaining access to the armoury, thereby saving the lives of many women and prison guards etc. complete fabricated nonsense [quote]Given what's going to happen to him now, maybe he should've done a 'Rambo' and armed himself to the teeth, then shot his way to freedom and made his way home.

keep watching those hollywood movies[/quote]

They did make a mistake, thought they knew it al at 21/22.
Thought they'd make some easy money like the guys in the niteclubs they frequented were.....nice cars, all the girls, money to spend.
Who could blame them for thinking that smuggling/selling heroin in Kings Cross was no big deal anymore, given the Heroin Injecting Room there run and staffed by the govt doctors.
The drug dealers pulling up outside in luxury cars to sell the drugs and the govt having changed the law so that the cops can just look the other way with impunity.
All shown on 60 Minutes.


They have been rehabilitated, including having seen what it's all done to their mothers/families/siblings.
Not the first 21/22 yr olds to think they knew it all, and that the laws of the land didn't apply to them.

_____________________________________
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

http://www.smh.com.au/world/bali-nine-find-safety-behind-prison-walls-20120303-1u9os.html

Myuran Sukumaran explains why he defended the jail armoury during a riot,

THE riot's most destructive phase had passed, and most of the combatants inside Bali's Kerobokan prison were calming down when 25 inmates hatched a new and dangerous plan.
They decided to break into the armoury, where pistols, shotguns and ammunition were kept so the normally unarmed guards could defend the prison against just such an uprising.

But there were no guards left. It was 4am on February 22, and hours earlier, confronted by hundreds of prisoners throwing stones and setting fires, they had fled, ceding control to the inmates.

Myuran Sukumaran - convicted drug smuggler, member of the Bali nine, death row inmate - saw the group heading for the armoury and decided to stop them. He concealed a crowbar and stood guard near the door.

''If they'd got hold of those weapons, it could have been a whole different story,''

He had earlier been part of a larger group (including the one guard brave enough to stay in the prison) preventing any incursions by the rioters into Block W, where the women prisoners live.

bambu wrote on Dec 26^th, 2014 at 6:21pm:

They did make a mistake, thought they knew it al at 21/22. Thought they'd make some easy money like the guys in the niteclubs they frequented were.....nice cars, all the girls, money to spend. Who could blame them for thinking that smuggling/selling heroin in Kings Cross was no big deal anymore, given the Heroin Injecting Room there run and staffed by the govt doctors. The drug dealers pulling up outside in luxury cars to sell the drugs and the govt having changed the law so that the cops can just look the other way with impunity. All shown on 60 Minutes.

sociopathic predators who engaged in a  calcualated plan to smuggle hard drugs into Australia regardless of the consequences of thiose drugs. A bulllet will solve their issues.



Quote:

They have been rehabilitated, including having seen what it's all done to their mothers/families/siblings. Not the first 21/22 yr olds to think they knew it all, and that the laws of the land didn't apply to them.

how cute, i didnt think there was anyone around as gullible and naive as you

_____________________________________

Quote:

http://www.smh.com.au/world/bali-nine-find-safety-behind-prison-walls-20120303-1u9os.html Myuran Sukumaran explains why he defended the jail armoury during a riot, THE riot's most destructive phase had passed, and most of the combatants inside Bali's Kerobokan prison were calming down when 25 inmates hatched a new and dangerous plan. They decided to break into the armoury, where pistols, shotguns and ammunition were kept so the normally unarmed guards could defend the prison against just such an uprising. But there were no guards left. It was 4am on February 22, and hours earlier, confronted by hundreds of prisoners throwing stones and setting fires, they had fled, ceding control to the inmates. Myuran Sukumaran - convicted drug smuggler, member of the Bali nine, death row inmate - saw the group heading for the armoury and decided to stop them. He concealed a crowbar and stood guard near the door. ''If they'd got hold of those weapons, it could have been a whole different story,''

Prison armouries are never kept inside prison walls. also this isnt the story anyone else is giving out and is highly improbable for a number of other reasons. Do you possibly think that he might be making this up a little bit because of ulterior motives? Lol. gullible and naive.

Brains aren't fully developed as to risk taking until age 25...psychologists explained it all to radio hosts.

The armoury?
Given that I'd never ever ever set one foot in Indonesia or anywhere else in Asia, let alone both feet, I have no idea where the armoury in this prison was/is.
The smh article states that it was indeed in the prison;

Sukumaran and another prisoner, an Iranian drug smuggler, held out in front of the armoury for two hours, until 6am, as their fellow inmates tried to break down the metal doors keeping them from the weapons. ''I was hoping they wouldn't succeed,'' Sukumaran says.

Why? ''Because then I'd have to fight them.''

The AFP could have, and should have, arrested the Bali 9 in Australia upon their return.
They didn't, and forever stand condemned for not doing so.

http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2014/12/26/muslim-organizations-support-death-penalty.html.

#####

Got short memories, those Muslim organisations in Indonesia supporting the execution-shredding of the two Australian citizens Chan and Sukumaran.

http://www.news.com.au/national/breaking-news/pm-remembers-boxing-day-tsunami-victims/story-e6frfku9-1227166834073

PM remembers Boxing Day tsunami victims

AUSTRALIA pledged $1 billion in humanitarian funds and played a key role helping with the overwhelming task of identifying thousands of victims of the Indian Ocean tsunamis that killed 227,898 people across the region.

#####

Also all the practical help our military etc gave, providing clean drinking water etc etc etc etc.
9 of our best military doctors/nurses died in a chopper crash, helping.

"Muslim organisations in Indonesia".....BAAAH!

Next time I won't be giving one cent to any appeal.
In fact I should be asking for a refund for what I gave last time.

bambu wrote on Dec 26^th, 2014 at 7:00pm:

Brains aren't fully developed as to risk taking until age 25...psychologists explained it all to radio hosts.

So? A  sociopath is a  sociopath, regardless of the stage of brain development, born that way most of the time.

Quote:

The armoury? Given that I'd never ever ever set one foot in Indonesia or anywhere else in Asia, let alone both feet, I have no idea where the armoury in this prison was/is. The smh article states that it was indeed in the prison; [I]Sukumaran and another prisoner, an Iranian drug smuggler, held out in front of the armoury for two hours, until 6am, as their fellow inmates tried to break down the metal doors keeping them from the weapons. ''I was hoping they wouldn't succeed,'' Sukumaran says.

Horses mouth, no prison armoury is ever kept inside prison walls in any prison in the world. The reasons are very obvious. This is not to say that weapons are not kept inside prison walls but armouries are never. The man is a liar.


Quote:

The AFP could have, and should have, arrested the Bali 9 in Australia upon their return. They didn't, and forever stand condemned for not doing so.

So they could be subject to weak australian penalties?  Im glad they got arrested in Indonesia, and so should we all be, at least those of us with empathy for our fellow human beings should be gald of it. 2 less sociopaths in this world is a good thing in my opinion, the drugs they were intending to take to australia would have ruined thousands of lives, they have and would have had no remorse, the only thing they are sorry about is that they  they got caught. There are no atheists in foxholes, remember that. Those drugs would have ruined possibly thousands of lives, they are the people we should be protecting, not these subhumans. Get a grip

bambu wrote on Dec 26^th, 2014 at 7:06pm:

http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2014/12/26/muslim-organizations-support-death-penalty.html. ##### Got short memories, those Muslim organisations in Indonesia supporting the execution-shredding of the two Australian citizens Chan and Sukumaran. http://www.news.com.au/national/breaking-news/pm-remembers-boxing-day-tsunami-victims/story-e6frfku9-1227166834073 PM remembers Boxing Day tsunami victims AUSTRALIA pledged $1 billion in humanitarian funds and played a key role helping with the overwhelming task of identifying thousands of victims of the Indian Ocean tsunamis that killed 227,898 people across the region. ##### Also all the practical help our military etc gave, providing clean drinking water etc etc etc etc. 9 of our best military doctors/nurses died in a chopper crash, helping. "Muslim organisations in Indonesia".....BAAAH! Next time I won't be giving one cent to any appeal. In fact I should be asking for a refund for what I gave last time.

  ::)

ian wrote on Dec 26^th, 2014 at 7:25pm:

bambu wrote on Dec 26th, 2014 at 7:06pm: http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2014/12/26/muslim-organizations-support-death-penalty.html. ##### Got short memories, those Muslim organisations in Indonesia supporting the execution-shredding of the two Australian citizens Chan and Sukumaran. http://www.news.com.au/national/breaking-news/pm-remembers-boxing-day-tsunami-victims/story-e6frfku9-1227166834073 PM remembers Boxing Day tsunami victims AUSTRALIA pledged $1 billion in humanitarian funds and played a key role helping with the overwhelming task of identifying thousands of victims of the Indian Ocean tsunamis that killed 227,898 people across the region. ##### Also all the practical help our military etc gave, providing clean drinking water etc etc etc etc. 9 of our best military doctors/nurses died in a chopper crash, helping. "Muslim organisations in Indonesia".....BAAAH! Next time I won't be giving one cent to any appeal. In fact I should be asking for a refund for what I gave last time.   ::)

Any appeal for Indonesia that is.
...because it obviously wouldn't be appreciated.

Give the "Muslim Organisations" in Indonesia tsunami aid/donation money...and in return here they are basically cheering for our citizens to be execution-shredded.
Where is their gratitude?

http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2014/12/26/muslim-organizations-support-death-penalty.html

The country’s two largest Muslim organizations, Nahdlatul Ulama (NU) and Muhammadiyah, have given their support to President Joko “Jokowi” Widodo’s call for the swift execution of death-row inmates despite criticism from human rights campaigners. -

#####

You take money out of your bank account and give to them...I won't be.

http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2014/12/27/decade-later-aceh-moves.html

For Vice President Jusuf Kalla, who played a leading role in the relief efforts during the tsunami, there was no other bigger lesson from the disaster than that Aceh had transformed itself and achieved unimaginable progress.
“But when I saw that footage [of the devastation], I could not help myself [from shedding tears],” he said.

“I’ve never seen social solidarity shown on a such large scale,” said Kalla. “Aceh would not be able to move on without all your support and participation.”

#####

Hollow words given that 'he' and his govt will be execution- shredding children of the 'support and participation' nations soon...thereby terrorising the death row inmates that'll be killed, and their families.

Wonder if he'll be shedding tears for them too?

grow up and stop behaving like a petulant 12 year old who didnt get what he wanted for xmas. You either donate because you have empathy for these human beings  who lost everything or not, your choice, trying to connect donations to victims of natural disasters to the fact that foreign countries need to enforce their own laws is one of the most extremely childish  things you can do.

bambu wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 8:06pm:

Aussie wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:54pm: No need to get wound up.  I am and always have been bitterly opposed to capital punishment.  My point is that there is no need to focus just on Indonesia, when there are many so called 'civilised States' where it exists among one of our closest allies Not wound up. I'm posting in a cool, calm, rational, and quiet voice. ;) Yes, our closest ally USA, ...but its death chambers are still 'barbaric' and 'uncivilised'. Indonesia is a disgrace...time we/our govt treated it as such.

Don't know why you'd think the Australian Government would care about this?  But since you've mentioned our friends in the US, perhaps if Jokowi doesn't play ball with the IMF we could invade for their oil reserves.  After all they are Muslims with oil.  That's what we do!

ColdFact wrote on Dec 27^th, 2014 at 9:09pm:

bambu wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 8:06pm: Aussie wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:54pm: No need to get wound up.  I am and always have been bitterly opposed to capital punishment.  My point is that there is no need to focus just on Indonesia, when there are many so called 'civilised States' where it exists among one of our closest allies Not wound up. I'm posting in a cool, calm, rational, and quiet voice. ;) Yes, our closest ally USA, ...but its death chambers are still 'barbaric' and 'uncivilised'. Indonesia is a disgrace...time we/our govt treated it as such. Don't know why you'd think the Australian Government would care about this?

Abbott, Bishop, and Co should care...as billions of taxpayers' dollars are shovelled up to Indonesia every few years, plus special billion-dollar grants.

Abbott rushed up to Joko's inauguration, uninvited.
Why wasn't he invited?
Yes, exactly...gives a clue to what's going on.

The Indonesia they 'worship', their/our supposed friend, is about to execution-shred two of our citizens.
A total and inhumane outrage, and human rights abuse.

Not one word from Abbott and Co in protest...no wonder they're fast sliding down, down, down, in the polls.
They need to go to 'war' with Indonesia over this, and stand for something...of forever stand condemned.

Seeing as how our govt won't do anything, this will be Andrew Chan's and Myuran Sukumaran's last Christmas on earth.
No more church services in Kerobokan prison.
No more Carols and Santa for them.

This is basically their fate;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-c3WIL4JSAU
Bangkok Hilton - The Execution

good stuff. Thousands of lives saved

ian wrote on Dec 29^th, 2014 at 10:55am:

good stuff. Thousands of lives saved

Bunkum!

All it will be is human rights abuse, ...and the barbaric, premeditated, cold-blooded killing of human beings.
"Auschwitz" rings a bell.
You'd think Indonesia would've had enough of killing/dead bodies by now...obviously not.

Chan and Sukumaran are in a prison and not going anywhere, and not adversely affecting anyone on the outside.
They should be left alive to serve a long sentence.

http://deathpenaltynews.blogspot.com.au/2014/12/capital-punishment-no-violation-of.html

"Capital Punishment No Violation of Human Rights": Indonesia Narcotics Chief

Jakarta. Executing people for drug-related crimes is not a violation of human rights, the chief of National Narcotics Agency (BNN) said on Tuesday at a discussion on the matter.

Admitting that the measure continues to be controversial, Comr. Gen. Anang Iskandar said that as long as the punishment was based on a court order, “there is nothing wrong about sentencing a drug convict to death,” Tempo.co reported.

#####

There's plenty wrong with sentencing a drug convict to death.
It most certainly is a violation of human rights.

He should be given another job and replaced with someone who understands the modern world and the UN Declaration of Human Rights.

_____________________________
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


Tedjo Edhy Purdjianto, the coordinating minister for political, legal and security affairs, explained that many people simply do not understand the reasons why someone is sentenced to death.

#####

Yes they do, they understand only too well.
'Hate', 'revenge', 'defiance', 'totally misguided ideas' etc.

He should be replaced by someone who understands what's required of nations professing not to be human rights wastelands today.

Ive got the champagne  ready, if only we were allowed to apply to fire the bullet

ian wrote on Dec 29^th, 2014 at 7:53pm:

Ive got the champagne  ready, if only we were allowed to apply to fire the bullet

Thought you might have.
You won't have to wait long, they're going to execution-slaughter within days some Africans from grinding poverty who made a mistake smuggling drugs.

Maybe Chan and Sukumaran too, although they seem to be in line for shredding early in January.
Not one word or action of protest from Abbott, Bishop and Co.

ian wrote on Dec 29^th, 2014 at 7:53pm:

Ive got the champagne  ready, if only we were allowed to apply to fire the bullet

Be careful what you wish for...it could be you one day on death row awaiting the noose or bullets.

Good luck with your travel in Asia.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/816589.stm

2000

A British nurse charged with drug smuggling in Malaysia has been sentenced to death by hanging.

Father-of-two David Chell, 57, from Stoke-on-Trent, Staffordshire, was found guilty of possession of more than half a kilo of heroin.

Mr Chell, who says the heroin was planted on him, is to appeal against the sentence.
Mr Chell, a psychiatric nurse, was charged after an airport guard claimed to have discovered drugs on him as he prepared to board a flight to Australia in October 1998.

Customs officers at Penang Airport in northern Malaysia say they found the drugs in Mr Chell's underwear.
But Mr Chell said one of the security officers produced the bag of heroin from underneath a cushion in the airport examination room where he was taken.

Mr Chell's appeal could take several years.
In 1986 Malaysia executed two Australians, Kevin Barlow and Brian Chambers, for drug trafficking.


   

Abbott, Bishop, Hockey, Pine and the rest of the Abbott govt must be booted out at the next election...as useless they are...are just gonna do nothing to Joko and his cohorts and the 'Muslim organisations' in Indonesia when Chan and Sukumaran are execution-slaughtered by Muslim Indonesia soon.
I most certainly won't ever be voting for them again.

http://www.news.com.au/world/bali-nine-australians-andrew-chan-and-myuran-sukumaran-to-be-executed-together-in-bali/story-fndir2ev-1227186440288

Bali Nine Australians Andrew Chan and Myuran Sukumaran to be executed together in Bali


_______________

Abbott govt, para;

"We wrote a letter to the Indonesia govt thru the highest diplomatic channels...they wrote back saying "NO" to our request".

NOW you should be picking up the phone and TELLING them that you'll MAKE them sorry if they execution shred our two citizens!

Abbott govt is useless, boot them out!
I had high hopes when they were elected, they've let me down terribly.

bambu wrote on Dec 30^th, 2014 at 6:22am:

ian wrote on Dec 29th, 2014 at 7:53pm: Ive got the champagne  ready, if only we were allowed to apply to fire the bullet Be careful what you wish for...it could be you one day on death row awaiting the noose or bullets. Good luck with your travel in Asia.

rubbish. I dont smuggle drugs and everyone always claims the were "planted on them" when caught at the airport. Dont smuggle drugs, nil issues. End of story.

ian wrote on Jan 16^th, 2015 at 3:56pm:

bambu wrote on Dec 30th, 2014 at 6:22am: ian wrote on Dec 29th, 2014 at 7:53pm: Ive got the champagne  ready, if only we were allowed to apply to fire the bullet Be careful what you wish for...it could be you one day on death row awaiting the noose or bullets. Good luck with your travel in Asia. rubbish. I dont smuggle drugs and everyone always claims the were "planted on them" when caught at the airport. Dont smuggle drugs, nil issues. End of story.

David Chell didn't smuggle drugs either...and he wound up on death row in Asia;

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/816589.stm

British nurse sentenced to death

A British nurse charged with drug smuggling in Malaysia has been sentenced to death by hanging.
Father-of-two David Chell, 57, from Stoke-on-Trent, Staffordshire, was found guilty of possession of more than half a kilo of heroin.

Mr Chell, who says the heroin was planted on him, is to appeal against the sentence.

Customs officers at Penang Airport in northern Malaysia say they found the drugs in Mr Chell's underwear.

But Mr Chell said one of the security officers produced the bag of heroin from underneath a cushion in the airport examination room where he was taken.

_________________________________________
*****************************************

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1311588/Death-row-Briton-freed-after-appeal-judges-condemn-trial.html

Death row Briton freed after appeal judges condemn trial

#####

Wonder how many other people have been set up in the same way in Asia and execution-slaughtered etc?
It will never happen to me...as I'll never ever ever ever be setting foot in Asia/SE Asia anywhere.
You're welcome to Asia/SE Asia.

People should stay right out of Asia/SE Asia...there's absolutely nothing there worth risking one's happiness for.

bambu wrote on Jan 16^th, 2015 at 6:25pm:

ian wrote on Jan 16th, 2015 at 3:56pm: bambu wrote on Dec 30th, 2014 at 6:22am: ian wrote on Dec 29th, 2014 at 7:53pm: Ive got the champagne  ready, if only we were allowed to apply to fire the bullet Be careful what you wish for...it could be you one day on death row awaiting the noose or bullets. Good luck with your travel in Asia. rubbish. I dont smuggle drugs and everyone always claims the were "planted on them" when caught at the airport. Dont smuggle drugs, nil issues. End of story. David Chell didn't smuggle drugs either...and he wound up on death row in Asia; http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/816589.stm British nurse sentenced to death A British nurse charged with drug smuggling in Malaysia has been sentenced to death by hanging. Father-of-two David Chell, 57, from Stoke-on-Trent, Staffordshire, was found guilty of possession of more than half a kilo of heroin. Mr Chell, who says the heroin was planted on him, is to appeal against the sentence. Customs officers at Penang Airport in northern Malaysia say they found the drugs in Mr Chell's underwear. But Mr Chell said one of the security officers produced the bag of heroin from underneath a cushion in the airport examination room where he was taken. _________________________________________ ***************************************** http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1311588/Death-row-Briton-freed-after-appeal-judges-condemn-trial.html Death row Briton freed after appeal judges condemn trial ##### Wonder how many other people have been set up in the same way in Asia and execution-slaughtered etc? It will never happen to me...as I'll never ever ever ever be setting foot in Asia/SE Asia anywhere. You're welcome to Asia/SE Asia. People should stay right out of Asia/SE Asia...there's absolutely nothing there worth risking one's happiness for.

Well.. there's always excellent poontang....

And young women happy to shack up with an older guy for a better life!

.. and the curries..

(Yeah - the curries!).....




"

Quote:

Well.. there's always excellent poontang.... And young women happy to shack up with an older guy for a better life! .. and the curries.. (Yeah - the curries!).....

Ah yes, the 'third world' lifestyle.
Ok if one likes that sort of thing, as a foreigner.

When it's time to go home...as it is in most cases...there's much misery and also suicides.

I do not and will not support the DP for drugs, and have no time for those who do.

And now we come right down to it...death day.
The premeditated, cold-blooded killing of human beings in [outdoor] death chambers by Muslim Indonesia.

The day when Muslim Indonesia, to whom Australia gives billions of its tax dollars every few years, and billions more in special grants...Australia's so called "great future together" good friend........will drag the two Aussie boys from their cells for execution-slaughter.

http://www.news.com.au/world/asia/grim-execution-awaits-bali-nine-australians-andrew-chan-and-myuran-sukumaran/story-fnh81fz8-1227187847674


TAKEN to a remote floodlit clearing in the dead of night, strapped to a wooden cross with only a dark bag over their heads to stop them staring down the barrel of a gun. 
 
This is the grim fate Bali Nine ringleaders Myuran Sukumaran and Andrew Chan may have ahead of them as the Indonesian government warns the pair will be executed together once both their clemency pleas have been rejected.
THE first executions under Indonesia’s new government will take place shortly after midnight, in a chilling portent of the fate awaiting Bali Nine masterminds Andrew Chan and Myuran Sukumaran. 

Five foreigners are among the six condemned, all of whom are on drugs charges.
Chan and Sukumaran’s destiny now hangs on a clemency bid currently before Indonesian President Jokowi Widodo, after authorities confirmed on Thursday night the pair would be executed together.

Like Brazillian inmate Marco Moreira, who is listed for execution tonight, this is the moment that awaits the two Bali Nine Australians.
When Moreira found out about his fate, he was sitting in front of three Indonesian officials who delivered him the news.

Condemned ... Brazillian Marco Moreira learns that his execution is pending. He is one of six people to be executed at midnight. Picture: Supplied Source: Supplied

Sukumaran and Chan’s Australian lawyer, Julian McMahon, said yesterday this weekend’s executions were chilling.
“It seemed impossible to be true that they would take out these people on the weekend and just shoot them. That was my first reaction,” Mr McMahon said.

“And if that seemed impossible, it also seemed impossible that the two clients whose stories I know so well, that there could be the possibility of such an unjust execution.”

Mr McMahon said he had confidence Tony Abbott or foreign minister Julie Bishop would fight to save the lives of the two young Australians. However, the Prime Minister said earlier this month that while he would make “the strongest possible diplomatic representations” his government was not going to jeopardise relations with Indonesia.

ANDREW CHAN: Crushed by news of Myuran Sukumaran facing firing squad

MYURAN’S MOTHER: Shocked by news of her son’s execution

Bali Nine mother's desperate heartache for a son on death row.
video

http://www.msn.com/en-au/news/australia/tony-abbotts-mercy-plea-to-indonesian-president-joko-widodo-dont-kill-australians/ar-AA8f7Tk?ocid=AARDHP

Tony Abbott's mercy plea to Indonesian President Joko Widodo - don't kill Australians

Prime Minister Tony Abbott has urged Joko Widodo to show mercy to Myuran Sukumaran, who faces death by firing squad after his appeal for clemency was rejected by the Indonesian leader.

Part of an ongoing campaign to save the life of Sukumaran and fellow heroin smuggler Andrew Chan, the revelation of Mr Abbott's plea comes as six drug offenders, including five foreigners, are slated to be killed by the Indonesian government on Sunday.

"The Australian government will continue to make representations to seek to avoid the execution of the two Australians on death row in Indonesia," a spokesperson for Mr Abbott said.
Indonesian officials confirmed Australia had made "several approaches to all levels [of the Indonesian government]".

"Basically they tried their utmost, they asked us to reconsider our decisions because their citizens have shown remorse, have expressed their deepest regrets," said foreign ministry spokesman Arrmanatha Nasir.

He added the Australian government had reassured Indonesia that this would not disturb bilateral diplomatic relations.

#####

Pathetic!
You don't tell them THAT!
You tell them that you'll cross them off our friends list forever, ...that they'll never get one more cent in aid money, never get one more head of cattle, not one more cent to build Islamic schools, not anymore anything.

You tell them the phone will be cut off, and that they can forget about defence pacts, free trade agreements and even one more grain of love coming from Australia.

You tell them that their ambassador will be booted out, ...along with all their nationals, including students...and all flights to and from Bali will be banned.

And mean it!

I'll be happy to see both Chan and Sukumuran dead.
However the other ones caught should be allowed to return to Australia following a jail term.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17^th, 2015 at 7:04pm:

I'll be happy to see both Chan and Sukumuran dead.

Then you really should hand in your Australian citizenship and passport and go live somewhere else.

Kat wrote on Jan 17^th, 2015 at 7:09am:

I do not and will not support the DP for drugs, and have no time for those who do.

Well, if you were an uneducated, ignorant fool, who thrives on bloodlust, you'd certainly think differently.

bambu wrote on Jan 17^th, 2015 at 7:18pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17th, 2015 at 7:04pm: I'll be happy to see both Chan and Sukumuran dead. Then you really should hand in your Australian citizenship and passport and go live somewhere else.

I do live somewhere else but I refuse to give up my Australian citizenship because I refuse to support drug dealers and smugglers.
They knew the risk and they knew the consequences.
The others were dumb mules. Those two were the planners.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17^th, 2015 at 7:21pm:

bambu wrote on Jan 17th, 2015 at 7:18pm: Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17th, 2015 at 7:04pm: I'll be happy to see both Chan and Sukumuran dead. Then you really should hand in your Australian citizenship and passport and go live somewhere else. I do live somewhere else but I refuse to give up my Australian citizenship because I refuse to support drug dealers and smugglers. They knew the risk and they knew the consequences. The others were dumb mules. Those two were the planners.

Nobody else here is supporting drug dealers and smugglers either.

Opposing the death penalty isn't the same as supporting drug dealers.  You do understand that, don't you?

Or, are you one of these ignorant fools who "thinks" it's either 'kill them', or 'let them go'?

::)

The real tragedy is Carlton and United brewery has destroyed a thousand times more lives than any drug dealer ever will.
Unfortunately we live our lives inside a government approved gladiator arena where they get to decide who the villians and heros are and who we should hate.
One day peoples minds will really be set free, unfortunately that day is no going to be any time soon.   :'(

Nope I don't think anyone should be let go.

I think those two should die. The others should serve considerable time in jail.

Pretty much in sync with what the justice system has decide.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17^th, 2015 at 7:29pm:

Nope I don't think anyone should be let go.

Neither does anyone else.

You seem to be arguing with yourself.

greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 17^th, 2015 at 7:30pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17th, 2015 at 7:29pm: Nope I don't think anyone should be let go. Either does anyone else. You seem to be arguing with yourself.

Hardly. Some of softies want us to give a pass to those two on their sentence.
Nope. They are being executed and I for one applaud the stance of Indonesia.

Your stance coupled with allowing anyone to claim to be a refugee shows you're one for a sob story.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17^th, 2015 at 7:34pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 17th, 2015 at 7:30pm: Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17th, 2015 at 7:29pm: Nope I don't think anyone should be let go. Neither does anyone else. You seem to be arguing with yourself. Hardly. Some of softies want us to give a pass to those two on their sentence.

No, you're telling lies.

Absolutely nobody has said that they should be "let go".

Stop telling lies.

What do you hope to gain from telling these lies?

greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 17^th, 2015 at 7:36pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17th, 2015 at 7:34pm: greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 17th, 2015 at 7:30pm: Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17th, 2015 at 7:29pm: Nope I don't think anyone should be let go. Neither does anyone else. You seem to be arguing with yourself. Hardly. Some of softies want us to give a pass to those two on their sentence. No, you're telling lies. Absolutely nobody has said that they should be "let go". Stop telling lies. What do you hope to gain from telling these lies?

They no longer deserve to live. That is their sentence.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17^th, 2015 at 7:34pm:

Your stance coupled with allowing anyone to claim to be a refugee shows you're one for a sob story.

Thank you for displaying your astounding ignorance.

Anybody can claim asylum (that's a fact), however, that doesn't mean that they are necessarily refugees.

Perhaps you should learn the difference between 'asylum seekers' and 'refugees' before you post another comment on that subject.

Moreover, you should also learn that opposing the death penalty isn't the same as opposing all punishment.

You're rarely taken seriously in this forum, and your last couple of posts have done you no favours.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17^th, 2015 at 7:34pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 17th, 2015 at 7:30pm: Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17th, 2015 at 7:29pm: Nope I don't think anyone should be let go. Either does anyone else. You seem to be arguing with yourself. Hardly. Some of softies want us to give a pass to those two on their sentence. Nope. They are being executed and I for one applaud the stance of Indonesia. Your stance coupled with allowing anyone to claim to be a refugee shows you're one for a sob story.

Well said, he is just trying to rile you, you are correct in what you say and how you say it, keep up  the good posts.

greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 17^th, 2015 at 7:40pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17th, 2015 at 7:34pm: Your stance coupled with allowing anyone to claim to be a refugee shows you're one for a sob story. Thank you for displaying your astounding ignorance. Anybody can claim asylum (that's a fact), however, that doesn't mean that they are necessarily refugees. Perhaps you should learn the difference between 'asylum seekers' and 'refugees' before you post another comment on that subject. Moreover, you should also learn that opposing the death penalty isn't the same as opposing all punishment. You're rarely taken seriously in this forum, and your last couple of posts have done you no favours.

I'm not certain you reflect the learned experience of the forum, you appear to be the one out of step with the broader consensus. The ignorance you make reference to is not warranted,  back off. All is well if all came make their posts without thinking that they are out of step. Be well.

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20^th, 2014 at 7:09pm:

John Smith wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:06pm: you certainly can't blame the Indonesians for enforcing their laws. We can certainly criticise them for having barbaric laws.

Everyone knows the penalties with regard to drugs in Indonesia. It's no secret that they have and use the death penalty. Only a complete fool would even contemplate having anything to do with drugs in Indonesia. I have zero sympathy for those on death row.

Armchair_Politician wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 5:56am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:09pm: John Smith wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:06pm: you certainly can't blame the Indonesians for enforcing their laws. We can certainly criticise them for having barbaric laws. Everyone knows the penalties with regard to drugs in Indonesia. It's no secret that they have and use the death penalty. Only a complete fool would even contemplate having anything to do with drugs in Indonesia. I have zero sympathy for those on death row.

People make foolish decisions all the time.
Some make more foolish decisions than others.

The only perfect person who ever walked on earth was the man with the holes in His hands and feet.
Everyone else has sinned.

Gee, the way Indonesia carries on, cold-bloodedly killing human beings in death chambers...you'd think it was sinless itself.
Far from it;
Kerobokan prison in Bali is reportedly awash with drugs...year, after year, after year.
Wonder how that happens exactly?

Indonesia...ranked one of the most corrupt countries on earth;

http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2012/dec/05/corruption-index-2012-transparency-international

#####

When they execution-slaughter/torture to death the two Aussie boys, Australia should sever all ties with Indonesia forever...and never again be associated with such a place.

I'm a bit busy to read this thread but basically, whatever Gweggy has said, just take it that I have the exact opposite view.

That is all :D

bambu wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 7:20am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 5:56am: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:09pm: John Smith wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:06pm: you certainly can't blame the Indonesians for enforcing their laws. We can certainly criticise them for having barbaric laws. Everyone knows the penalties with regard to drugs in Indonesia. It's no secret that they have and use the death penalty. Only a complete fool would even contemplate having anything to do with drugs in Indonesia. I have zero sympathy for those on death row. People make foolish decisions all the time. Some make more foolish decisions than others. The only perfect person who ever walked on earth was the man with the holes in His hands and feet. Everyone else has sinned. Gee, the way Indonesia carries on, cold-bloodedly killing human beings in death chambers...you'd think it was sinless itself. Far from it; Kerobokan prison in Bali is reportedly awash with drugs...year, after year, after year. Wonder how that happens exactly? Indonesia...ranked one of the most corrupt countries on earth; http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2012/dec/05/corruption-index-2012-transparency-international ##### When they execution-slaughter/torture to death the two Aussie boys, Australia should sever all ties with Indonesia forever...and never again be associated with such a place.

I'm not saying Indonesia is right or wrong regarding the death penalty, just that the Bali 9 knew the punishment that awaited them if caught and still went through with it. I have zero sympathy.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 17^th, 2015 at 7:29pm:

Nope I don't think anyone should be let go. I think those two should die. The others should serve considerable time in jail. Pretty much in sync with what the justice system has decide.

Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

Yes, torture to death.
Muslim Indonesia is going to torture to death Australian citizens...

http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/world/grim-execution-awaits-bali-nine-australians-andrew-chan-and-myuran-sukumaran/story-fnhrvhol-1227187847674?sv=a8b2c4199dd87f6b3d26b82a115cd40e&nk=27176284b3047ecac902300757f30c6d

One night, in 2008, in a remote area on the Indonesian island of Nusa Kambangan, Nigerian nationals Samuel Iwuchukwu Okoye and Hansen Antonious Nwaolisa were executed by firing squad after being sentenced to death for smuggling more than 3kg of heroin each.

Their execution took seven minutes, and the days leading up were punctuated by final meetings with families, medical check-ups and a lot of paperwork.
They each had to be measured, standing tall, for their coffins to be made to fit.

An account given in 2008 by Irish Catholic priest Charlie Burrows, who was present at the executions of Okoye and Nwaolisa, says their deaths were neither quick nor painless; that they were being tortured, “moaning again and again for seven minutes” as they slowly died.

“I think it is cruel, the torture,” he said at the time in testimony before Indonesia’s Constitutional Court.
Okoye and Nwaolisa had been strapped to crucifixes with inner-tubes. Black hoods were placed over their heads.

“It was simple: one, two, three, then ‘bang’,” Father Burrows said.
“The blood came out slowly; they were in pain. After 10 minutes, a doctor came to inspect them and pronounced them dead.”

_________________________________________
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


...with Andrew Chan now a Christian, having been mentored by the Salvation Army.;

http://christianitymalaysia.com/wp/mercy-andrew-chan/

This is a story written by Lennie Chua who used to work as a country manager for her company in Kuala Lumpur but quit her job to follow God’s leading into the prison ministry in Bali, Indonesia. She is also working part-time while serving God in Bali.

And Andrew is in charge of the church in prison and has been helping other inmates to know Christ. He is also completing his theology studies and plans to become a pastor if The Lord gives him a second chance.

Quote:

I'm not saying Indonesia is right or wrong regarding the death penalty, just that the Bali 9 knew the punishment that awaited them if caught and still went through with it. I have zero sympathy.

Time for fence-sitting is over.

The Bali9 were kids...Chan and Sukumaran only 22 and 23 or so.
That aside...Australia has asked Indonesia nicely, basically begged [which many in Indonesia seem to enjoy] not to execution-slaughter her children.
Indonesia has basically told Australia to f off.
So much for all those ASEAN/APEC hugs!  LOL ;D

Bishop wrote a letter and Abbott has made a personal plea for mercy.
Indonesia has basically just swatted them away...blown them off in the wind.
...made fools of them in front of the world.
What are Bishop and Abbott gonna do about it?
Absolutely nothing.
Hopefully they'll get booted out of office at the next election...and Newman will be booted out of office in Qld in 2 weeks time.
Newman has been an even bigger disappointment that the Abbott govt.

Armchair_Politician wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 7:28am:

bambu wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 7:20am: Armchair_Politician wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 5:56am: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:09pm: John Smith wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:06pm: you certainly can't blame the Indonesians for enforcing their laws. We can certainly criticise them for having barbaric laws. Everyone knows the penalties with regard to drugs in Indonesia. It's no secret that they have and use the death penalty. Only a complete fool would even contemplate having anything to do with drugs in Indonesia. I have zero sympathy for those on death row. People make foolish decisions all the time. Some make more foolish decisions than others. The only perfect person who ever walked on earth was the man with the holes in His hands and feet. Everyone else has sinned. Gee, the way Indonesia carries on, cold-bloodedly killing human beings in death chambers...you'd think it was sinless itself. Far from it; Kerobokan prison in Bali is reportedly awash with drugs...year, after year, after year. Wonder how that happens exactly? Indonesia...ranked one of the most corrupt countries on earth; http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2012/dec/05/corruption-index-2012-transparency-international ##### When they execution-slaughter/torture to death the two Aussie boys, Australia should sever all ties with Indonesia forever...and never again be associated with such a place. I'm not saying Indonesia is right or wrong regarding the death penalty, just that the Bali 9 knew the punishment that awaited them if caught and still went through with it. I have zero sympathy.

In my view the AFP acted improperly to have informed the Indonesians about these people when they were aware that the Indonesian penalty is incompatible with the legal system that they represent.

In my view it is outrageous for the AFP to be taking a lead role in providing information leading to a death penalty of any Australian. It would seem likely to me that this is acting outside their legitimate area of responsibility or even possibly in breach of it.

We now have the Australian government begging for clemency when it should have never been necessary, they could have more easily been taken in Australia and properly subject to our laws. 

The AFP have needlessly embarrassed Australia in this case.

bambu wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 10:29am:

Quote: I'm not saying Indonesia is right or wrong regarding the death penalty, just that the Bali 9 knew the punishment that awaited them if caught and still went through with it. I have zero sympathy. Time for fence-sitting is over. The Bali9 were kids...Chan and Sukumaran only 22 and 23 or so. That aside...Australia has asked Indonesia nicely, basically begged [which many in Indonesia seem to enjoy] not to execution-slaughter her children. Indonesia has basically told Australia to f off. So much for all those ASEA/APEC hugs!  LOL ;D Bishop wrote a letter and Abbott has made a personal plea for mercy. Indonesia has basically just swatted them away...blown them off in the wind. ...made fools of them in front of the world. What are Bishop and Abbott gonna do about it? Absolutely nothing. Hopefully they'll get booted out of office at the next election...and Newman will be booted out of office in Qld in 2 weeks time. Newman has been an even bigger disappointment that the Abbott govt.

what more can they do?? what would you do????...maybe they will get the hint..

as it is....

its a bit ,like the Charlie Hebdo....consequences.....

these guys were warned.. they KNEW the risk it wasnt a surprise to them... I have never been to Bali but I understand warnings are all around.. and even other countries warn you when you book your tickets.....

respect other countries LAWS....

it really is that simple....like them or not Indonesaia has as much right to their LAWS as we are without interference....

every PM Australia has had has done what they can for these stupid people...who thought they were above the LAW...

as it is we are lucky that all 9 are not on death row....

maybe you didnt see the SBS film A Better Man.. it was cruel....and heartbreaking...and not a thing the govt could do to stop it....

but at the end of the day..

the blame lies fair and square at the feet of the people that TAKE THAT RISK..

another way to look at it is...

when these boys were doing their drug runs and getting away with it.. did they care for those that would die because of the drugs they brought into this country?????????....or even the lives they wrecked.

Dnarever wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 10:30am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 7:28am: bambu wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 7:20am: Armchair_Politician wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 5:56am: greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:09pm: John Smith wrote on Dec 20th, 2014 at 7:06pm: you certainly can't blame the Indonesians for enforcing their laws. We can certainly criticise them for having barbaric laws. Everyone knows the penalties with regard to drugs in Indonesia. It's no secret that they have and use the death penalty. Only a complete fool would even contemplate having anything to do with drugs in Indonesia. I have zero sympathy for those on death row. People make foolish decisions all the time. Some make more foolish decisions than others. The only perfect person who ever walked on earth was the man with the holes in His hands and feet. Everyone else has sinned. Gee, the way Indonesia carries on, cold-bloodedly killing human beings in death chambers...you'd think it was sinless itself. Far from it; Kerobokan prison in Bali is reportedly awash with drugs...year, after year, after year. Wonder how that happens exactly? Indonesia...ranked one of the most corrupt countries on earth; http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2012/dec/05/corruption-index-2012-transparency-international ##### When they execution-slaughter/torture to death the two Aussie boys, Australia should sever all ties with Indonesia forever...and never again be associated with such a place. I'm not saying Indonesia is right or wrong regarding the death penalty, just that the Bali 9 knew the punishment that awaited them if caught and still went through with it. I have zero sympathy. In my view the AFP acted improperly to have informed the Indonesians about these people when they were aware that the Indonesian penalty is incompatible with the legal system that they represent. In my view it is outrageous for the AFP to be taking a lead role in providing information leading to a death penalty of any Australian. It would seem likely to me that this is acting outside their legitimate area of responsibility or even possibly in breach of it. We now have the Australian government begging for clemency when it should have never been necessary, they could have more easily been taken in Australia and properly subject to our laws.  The AFP have needlessly embarrassed Australia in this case.

teh AFP and the Indonesia Police have an agreement to work together on this drug problem....

it is what it is...you seem to forget this gang had been running back and forward to bring drugs for our kids into this country...killing we dont know how many.. and did they care... not a scrap.....but a lot of families out there have been destroyed because of those ugly drugs they saw fit to bring into Australia...np conscience for them.....

why do you expect the law enforcers to play games to protect them???????????... their job is to prtect US... not drug runners...


no the.govt is not BEGGING FOR CLEMENCY.. they are against the DEATH PENALTY which is in our LEGISLATION>....NO DEATH PENALTY... we do not extradite anyone to a country that has the death penalty either.....

to me you are as per usual blaming the wrong people for the position they find themselves in....

and I for one am embarrassed by your comments.

not the AFP.who were protecting ME and the kids in THIS COUNTRY

cods wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 10:37am:

bambu wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 10:29am: Quote: I'm not saying Indonesia is right or wrong regarding the death penalty, just that the Bali 9 knew the punishment that awaited them if caught and still went through with it. I have zero sympathy. Time for fence-sitting is over. The Bali9 were kids...Chan and Sukumaran only 22 and 23 or so. That aside...Australia has asked Indonesia nicely, basically begged [which many in Indonesia seem to enjoy] not to execution-slaughter her children. Indonesia has basically told Australia to f off. So much for all those ASEA/APEC hugs!  LOL ;D Bishop wrote a letter and Abbott has made a personal plea for mercy. Indonesia has basically just swatted them away...blown them off in the wind. ...made fools of them in front of the world. What are Bishop and Abbott gonna do about it? Absolutely nothing. Hopefully they'll get booted out of office at the next election...and Newman will be booted out of office in Qld in 2 weeks time. Newman has been an even bigger disappointment that the Abbott govt. what more can they do?? what would you do????...maybe they will get the hint.. as it is.... its a bit ,like the Charlie Hebdo....consequences..... these guys were warned.. they KNEW the risk it wasnt a surprise to them... I have never been to Bali but I understand warnings are all around.. and even other countries warn you when you book your tickets..... respect other countries LAWS.... it really is that simple....like them or not Indonesaia has as much right to their LAWS as we are without interference.... every PM Australia has had has done what they can for these stupid people...who thought they were above the LAW... as it is we are lucky that all 9 are not on death row.... maybe you didnt see the SBS film A Better Man.. it was cruel....and heartbreaking...and not a thing the govt could do to stop it.... but at the end of the day.. the blame lies fair and square at the feet of the people that TAKE THAT RISK.. another way to look at it is... when these boys were doing their drug runs and getting away with it.. did they care for those that would die because of the drugs they brought into this country?????????....or even the lives they wrecked.

http://www.msn.com/en-au/news/world/indonesia-executes-six-drug-convicts-including-foreigners/ar-AA8hzKe?ocid=AARDHP

Indonesia has put to death six people convicted of drugs offences, including five foreigners, in the first executions carried out under new President Joko Widodo.

Two women were among those executed by firing squad, in a move swiftly condemned by Amnesty International as "seriously regressive".
The foreigners hailed from Brazil, the Netherlands, Vietnam, Malawi and Nigeria.

The European Union had earlier urged Jakarta not to go ahead with the executions, with foreign policy chief Federica Mogherini calling the plan "deeply regrettable".

Before the executions, the EU's Mogherini had sought to ramp up pressure on Jakarta, describing the death penalty as "a cruel and inhumane punishment, which fails to act as a deterrent and represents an unacceptable denial of human dignity and integrity".

Dutch Foreign Affairs spokesman Friso Wijnen last week insisted the Netherlands would "go to the highest levels" to prevent Ang being put to death.

#####

All the 'BS' rhetoric failed, as it was always going to...as Indonesia has worked out that the UN, Holland, Britain, Australia etc are not actually going to DO anything in revenge against it for execution-homiciding their citizens.
Indonesia has worked out that 'plastic spines' abound in the 'Christian' West.

Indonesia won't change until it's made change.
There must be consequences, major consequences, for Indonesia if it kills Chan and Sukumaran.

Abbott professes to be a Christian...and as such he should be making it very clear to Muslim Indonesia that there will be serious consequences if it kills Australians.

. No more aid money ever.
. No more live cattle exports [which should be stopped anyway].
. No more dead cattle and other food exports.
. All Indonesian nationals booted out of Australia.
. The Indonesian ambassador made pack up all his belongings days before the execution-homicides...and the secret police on standby to kick him out as soon as the bullets are fired.
No secret police?
About time we got some!
. All flights to Bali banned.

...for starters.

Trying to smuggle 8.2kg of heroin into Australia when they knew the risks will see no sympathy from me.....The other 7 are lucky not to be given the same fate.....2 less scum bags to worry about IMO!!!

:) :) :)

philperth2010 wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 11:09am:

Trying to smuggle 8.2kg of heroin into Australia when they knew the risks will see no sympathy from me.....The other 7 are lucky not to be given the same fate.....2 less scum bags to worry about IMO!!! :) :) :)

You're missing the whole point.
Indonesia is treating Australia and our leaders with utter contemp...and it's about time our leaders did something about it, not just speak words that amount to nothing much.

http://rt.com/news/223759-ambassadors-recall-indonesia-executions/

Brazil, Netherlands recall Indonesia ambassadors after citizens executed on drug charges

Brazil has condemned the executions and recalled its ambassador in Jakarta for consultations, adding that the event may affect bilateral relations between the two countries.

“The use of the death penalty, which the world society increasingly condemns, affects severely the relationship of our countries,” the Brazilian presidency said in a statement, as quoted by Reuters.

#####

Good.
Finally some leaders with some steel spine who'll stand up to Muslim Indonesia.
Not Abbott and Co though, they're obviously happy to just let Indonesia to treat us with utter contempt.
The way Abbott's going he won't likely last another month as PM...all his own fault.
He's living in the past. He needs to get with the 2015 program.

He also needs to start a 'war' with Indonesia over the death sentences and impending execution-slaughtering of Australian citizens.
He needs to stand for something, stand up and be counted...fire up!

a recent poll had 92 percent of australians supporting the death penalty for these 2

ian wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 6:50pm:

a recent poll had 92 percent of australians supporting the death penalty for these 2

I'd like to see the link to that, please.

bambu wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 6:26pm:

You're missing the whole point. Indonesia is treating Australia and our leaders with utter contemp...,

No its not at all.

Indonesia - along with Malaysia and Singapore - have a well publicised policy of zero tolerance and the death sentence for drug traffiking.

They are not putting these people on death row for their nationality - they are putting them up for execution because that is the rule of law there.

Who on earth is Australia or its leaders to tell Indonesia what to hand down as a sentence in its own country for crimes committed in its own country?

How would Australia like it if an Indonesian man committed a rape in Sydney and was sentenced to prison but Indonesia intervened and said it would like the sentence reduced?

The arrogance here that Australians think it can tell Indonesia what to hand down as a sentence is quite breath-taking.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 7:16pm:

bambu wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 6:26pm: You're missing the whole point. Indonesia is treating Australia and our leaders with utter contemp..., No its not at all. Indonesia - along with Malaysia and Singapore - have a well publicised policy of zero tolerance and the death sentence for drug traffiking. They are not putting these people on death row for their nationality - they are putting them up for execution because that is the rule of law there. Who on earth is Australia or its leaders to tell Indonesia what to hand down as a sentence in its own country for crimes committed in its own country? How would Australia like it if an Indonesian man committed a rape in Sydney and was sentenced to prison but Indonesia intervened and said it would like the sentence reduced? The arrogance here that Australians think it can tell Indonesia what to hand down as a sentence is quite breath-taking.

Yet the Australian Government has been quite brazenly attempting to influence the course of Justice in another Country.

Aussie wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 6:51pm:

ian wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 6:50pm: a recent poll had 92 percent of australians supporting the death penalty for these 2 I'd like to see the link to that, please.

Links take all the fun out of the conservative sport of making up random numbers to support whatever they like.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 7:16pm:

How would Australia like it if an Indonesian man committed a rape in Sydney and was sentenced to prison but Indonesia intervened and said it would like the sentence reduced?

Indonesia doesn't even have to intervene.   We have half wits like Gillian Triggs lobbying to get (Indonesian and other) murderers out of jail and demanding they be paid compensation.

Dnarever wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 7:22pm:

Aussie wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 6:51pm: ian wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 6:50pm: a recent poll had 92 percent of australians supporting the death penalty for these 2 I'd like to see the link to that, please. Links take all the fun out of the conservative sport of making up random numbers to support whatever they like.

You mean like just conjuring up a $1.5bn surplus that will be delivered come hell or high water?
:)

Aussie wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 7:20pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 7:16pm: bambu wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 6:26pm: You're missing the whole point. Indonesia is treating Australia and our leaders with utter contemp..., No its not at all. Indonesia - along with Malaysia and Singapore - have a well publicised policy of zero tolerance and the death sentence for drug traffiking. They are not putting these people on death row for their nationality - they are putting them up for execution because that is the rule of law there. Who on earth is Australia or its leaders to tell Indonesia what to hand down as a sentence in its own country for crimes committed in its own country? How would Australia like it if an Indonesian man committed a rape in Sydney and was sentenced to prison but Indonesia intervened and said it would like the sentence reduced? The arrogance here that Australians think it can tell Indonesia what to hand down as a sentence is quite breath-taking. Yet the Australian Government has been quite brazenly attempting to influence the course of Justice in another Country.

So did the AFP only the other way.

Aussie wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 7:20pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 7:16pm: bambu wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 6:26pm: You're missing the whole point. Indonesia is treating Australia and our leaders with utter contemp..., No its not at all. Indonesia - along with Malaysia and Singapore - have a well publicised policy of zero tolerance and the death sentence for drug traffiking. They are not putting these people on death row for their nationality - they are putting them up for execution because that is the rule of law there. Who on earth is Australia or its leaders to tell Indonesia what to hand down as a sentence in its own country for crimes committed in its own country? How would Australia like it if an Indonesian man committed a rape in Sydney and was sentenced to prison but Indonesia intervened and said it would like the sentence reduced? The arrogance here that Australians think it can tell Indonesia what to hand down as a sentence is quite breath-taking. Yet the Australian Government has been quite brazenly attempting to influence the course of Justice in another Country.

What you mean like Indonesia does with other countries who sentence its citizens to death?

https://ronabbass.wordpress.com/2011/06/29/beheaded-saudi-arabia-executes-indonesian-maid/

Siradj slammed Riyadh for indicting and then executing the Indonesian national without giving her a chance to defend herself, and described the Saudis as uncivilized.

Sapubi, 54, was beheaded on June 18 in Saudi Arabia after confessing to killing her employer, saying he had abused her.
Saudi officials executed her by sword and then dangled her corpse from a helicopter to make sure the public could see the result of the execution.

In reaction to Riyadh’s punishment measure, Indonesian protesters staged a demonstration in front of Indonesia’s presidential palace in the capital Jakarta, slamming the government for failing to protect its migrant workers in Saudi Arabia.

The execution of Sapubi also prompted the government of Indonesian President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono to take stern action against Riyadh.

#####

As Abbott should, but won't, do against Muslim Indonesia...as he seems besotted.
Australia needs Muslim Indonesia for nothing.

Indonesia also pays 'blood money' so its citizens won't be execution-slaughtered in other countries.

'Uncivilized', now there's a good word.

Indonesia/ns must be close to the world's biggest hypocrite/s.

Indonesia already interferes in our justice system when it suits it to;

http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/indonesia-talks-sink-new-hope-on-boats-20120703-21flq.html

THE steady arrival of asylum seeker boats is unlikely to abate any time soon with the Indonesian President, Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono, demanding the release of crew members from Australian jails while offering little new in return for helping to stop the trade.

#####

Demanding!

Demanding the release of Indonesian criminals from our jails.

Here's an idea...what about we execution-slaughter all the Indonesian criminals in our jails...or some of them and increase the sentences of all the others to life or 50 years.
Feed them to crocodiles in the NT?
That should be ok..."Our sovereign nation...our justice system".
Oh that's right, we're civilized. 

These two were found guilty of organising and leading drug trafficking through Indonesia knowing full well the penalty.

Adios gentlemen. Your time is up!

A crime against humanity - these two should have been granted a bonus for taking drugs OUT of Indonesia - one of the darkest states in the dark state lexicon....

(rants)  primitives, low-lives, animals with no human values and little to no culture and intellect.. should be hung from the yardarm or handed a bombardment from a gunboat at whim..... peasants....

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 8:03pm:

These two were found guilty of organising and leading drug trafficking through Indonesia knowing full well the penalty. Adios gentlemen. Your time is up!

The people who really done that would not have been in Indonesia at the time.

Dnarever wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 8:05pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 18th, 2015 at 8:03pm: These two were found guilty of organising and leading drug trafficking through Indonesia knowing full well the penalty. Adios gentlemen. Your time is up! The people who really done that would not have been in Indonesia at the time.

Ah so let's just let them off eh?

Amazing that we deplore the drug dealers and smugglers who cause so much misery.
We put huge pressure on Asian nations to stop the smuggling yet when they do and take a tough stance we moan when "our" people get stung....

None more hypocritical than the western world.

Thing is - these guys could have been arrested on IMPoRT in Australia - it was all under control - yet they are handed to the killers in Indonesia.

No wonder people think life is cheap in Asia, and that therefore an Asian has less value than a ..(searches for word) Westerner......

You see where I'm going yet?

We STILL despise these Untermenschen in the 'Orient' or the East'...... but it is hidden and hardly acknowledged.....

Andrei the Giant should know that mit der Afrkaans und der 'munt' - dar enemis off mein bludt!

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 8:18pm:

Thing is - these guys could have been arrested on IMPoRT in Australia - it was all under control - yet they are handed to the killers in Indonesia. No wonder people think life is cheap in Asia, and that therefore an Asian has less value than a ..(searches for word) Westerner...... You see where I'm going yet? We STILL despise these Untermenschen in the 'Orient' or the East'...... but it is hidden and hardly acknowledged..... Andrei the Giant should know that mit der Afrkaans und der 'munt' - dar enemis off mein bludt!

Neither of the two men are westerners though.
So your argument falls down there.