An interesting point made by Maajid Nawaz - a once Islamist (now reformed) and jailed for some time in Egypt before rejecting Islamism and violent extremism.

Discussing the rise of Islamism over the last century... His take on it was that it began initially as a reaction to colonialism after WW1 which, over time, evolved into a perverted form of Islam particularly as the ideals of European Fascism were grafted onto it. The idea of a Muslim superstate governed by a 'superior' people, with Islam as the foundation of its values.... An Islamic perversion.

Nawaz goes on to reveal the process of his radicalisation which started on the streets of his English hometown with his older brother (who was already radicalised) confronting a group of English white supremacists out to (maybe) kill them. His brother (who knew where they lived) told them that as a Muslim he didn't fear death and would be prepared to strap a bomb to himself and take out these guys with their families...

Clearly he must have looked like he meant it because (as Nawaz recounts) the whites backed down.

This was his first sense that he as a Muslim could have power over these people through the solidarity of Islamism...

His life from that point careered into the Islamist world, resulting ultimately in his arrest in Egypt... He came out of incarceration renouncing Islamism and violence.

"My journey from prison was not an easy one to make. After all, there were many reasons for why I should not leave, and very few for why I should. The one reason that I could not ignore, the one reason that grew deep inside me till it consumed me with guilt was the realisation that I was abusing my faith for a mere political project. After learning through my studies in prison that Islamism was not the religion of Islam, but rather a modern political ideology, I no longer felt guilty simply for criticising a political system inspired by 7th century norms."

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 3:03pm:

An interesting point made by Maajid Nawaz - a once Islamist (now reformed) and jailed for some time in Egypt before rejecting Islamism and violent extremism. Discussing the rise of Islamism over the last century... His take on it was that it began initially as a reaction to colonialism after WW1 which, over time, evolved into a perverted form of Islam particularly as the ideals of European Fascism were grafted onto it. The idea of a Muslim superstate governed by a 'superior' people, with Islam as the foundation of its values.... An Islamic perversion. Nawaz goes on to reveal the process of his radicalisation which started on the streets of his English hometown with his older brother (who was already radicalised) confronting a group of English white supremacists out to (maybe) kill them. His brother (who knew where they lived) told them that as a Muslim he didn't fear death and would be prepared to strap a bomb to himself and take out these guys with their families... Clearly he must have looked like he meant it because (as Nawaz recounts) the whites backed down. This was his first sense that he as a Muslim could have power over these people through the solidarity of Islamism... His life from that point careered into the Islamist world, resulting ultimately in his arrest in Egypt... He came out of incarceration renouncing Islamism and violence. "My journey from prison was not an easy one to make. After all, there were many reasons for why I should not leave, and very few for why I should. The one reason that I could not ignore, the one reason that grew deep inside me till it consumed me with guilt was the realisation that I was abusing my faith for a mere political project. After learning through my studies in prison that Islamism was not the religion of Islam, but rather a modern political ideology, I no longer felt guilty simply for criticising a political system inspired by 7th century norms."

AN interesting point, made by many people.

Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology.

Soren there are many muslims who are adamant their religion is not a political ideology. Myself included.

Soren wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 3:55pm:

Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology.

Any religious / social ideology is potentially a political ideology.

Soren wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 3:55pm:

Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology.

For all 1.6 Billion Muslims, Soren?

The reality is that for the overwhelming majority, it's a religion.  For a tiny minority, it has become a political ideology...   ::)

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 4:34pm:

Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 3:55pm: Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology. For all 1.6 Billion Muslims, Soren? The reality is that for the overwhelming majority, it's a religion.  For a tiny minority, it has become a political ideology...   ::)

Prove its a tiny minority, a cursory look at the quaran tells any half educated watermelon that islam is just an ideology.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 4:01pm:

Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 3:55pm: Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology. Any religious / social ideology is potentially a political ideology.

Has the potential to be twisted into one ignoring their doctrine. I believe the point is Islam is just an ideology not a religion according to its doctrine.

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 4:37pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 4:34pm: Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 3:55pm: Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology. For all 1.6 Billion Muslims, Soren? The reality is that for the overwhelming majority, it's a religion.  For a tiny minority, it has become a political ideology...   ::) Prove its a tiny minority, a cursory look at the quaran tells any half educated watermelon that islam is just an ideology.

Really?  Prove it.   ::)

I never thought you could prove its a tiny minority.
As expected.

Soren wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 3:55pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 3:03pm: An interesting point made by Maajid Nawaz - a once Islamist (now reformed) and jailed for some time in Egypt before rejecting Islamism and violent extremism. Discussing the rise of Islamism over the last century... His take on it was that it began initially as a reaction to colonialism after WW1 which, over time, evolved into a perverted form of Islam particularly as the ideals of European Fascism were grafted onto it. The idea of a Muslim superstate governed by a 'superior' people, with Islam as the foundation of its values.... An Islamic perversion. Nawaz goes on to reveal the process of his radicalisation which started on the streets of his English hometown with his older brother (who was already radicalised) confronting a group of English white supremacists out to (maybe) kill them. His brother (who knew where they lived) told them that as a Muslim he didn't fear death and would be prepared to strap a bomb to himself and take out these guys with their families... Clearly he must have looked like he meant it because (as Nawaz recounts) the whites backed down. This was his first sense that he as a Muslim could have power over these people through the solidarity of Islamism... His life from that point careered into the Islamist world, resulting ultimately in his arrest in Egypt... He came out of incarceration renouncing Islamism and violence. "My journey from prison was not an easy one to make. After all, there were many reasons for why I should not leave, and very few for why I should. The one reason that I could not ignore, the one reason that grew deep inside me till it consumed me with guilt was the realisation that I was abusing my faith for a mere political project. After learning through my studies in prison that Islamism was not the religion of Islam, but rather a modern political ideology, I no longer felt guilty simply for criticising a political system inspired by 7th century norms." AN interesting point, made by many people. Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology.

A disgusting one at that.

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 4:37pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 4:34pm: Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 3:55pm: Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology. For all 1.6 Billion Muslims, Soren? The reality is that for the overwhelming majority, it's a religion.  For a tiny minority, it has become a political ideology...   ::) Prove its a tiny minority, a cursory look at the quaran tells any half educated watermelon that islam is just an ideology.

All religions are an ideology... Did you not know that?

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 4:34pm:

Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 3:55pm: Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology. For all 1.6 Billion Muslims, Soren? The reality is that for the overwhelming majority, it's a religion.  For a tiny minority, it has become a political ideology...   ::)

Prove it.

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 4:38pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 4:01pm: Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 3:55pm: Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology. Any religious / social ideology is potentially a political ideology. Has the potential to be twisted into one ignoring their doctrine. I believe the point is Islam is just an ideology not a religion according to its doctrine.

If you think that Islam does not (at least) meet the criteria of being a religion, then what are your criteria for anything being a religion?

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 5:32pm:

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 4:38pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 4:01pm: Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 3:55pm: Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology. Any religious / social ideology is potentially a political ideology. Has the potential to be twisted into one ignoring their doctrine. I believe the point is Islam is just an ideology not a religion according to its doctrine. If you think that Islam does not (at least) meet the criteria of being a religion, then what are your criteria for anything being a religion?

Islam is not a religion because mohammed never even knew he was supposed to be a prophet. It was invented many decades after he was dead and buried. I suppose in a sense it was a false religion but nevertheless it was invented clearly to be simply a political ideology that sucked in an entire community who unfortunately were a bit slow in thought.

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 5:54pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 5:32pm: SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 4:38pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 4:01pm: Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 3:55pm: Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology. Any religious / social ideology is potentially a political ideology. Has the potential to be twisted into one ignoring their doctrine. I believe the point is Islam is just an ideology not a religion according to its doctrine. If you think that Islam does not (at least) meet the criteria of being a religion, then what are your criteria for anything being a religion? Islam is not a religion because mohammed never even knew he was supposed to be a prophet. It was invented many decades after he was dead and buried. I suppose in a sense it was a false religion but nevertheless it was invented clearly to be simply a political ideology that sucked in an entire community who unfortunately were a bit slow in thought.

I think you'll find Christianity was 'invented' after the death of Jesus.

Do you have any criteria for anything being a religion?

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 6:00pm:

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 5:54pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 5:32pm: SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 4:38pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 4:01pm: Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 3:55pm: Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology. Any religious / social ideology is potentially a political ideology. Has the potential to be twisted into one ignoring their doctrine. I believe the point is Islam is just an ideology not a religion according to its doctrine. If you think that Islam does not (at least) meet the criteria of being a religion, then what are your criteria for anything being a religion? Islam is not a religion because mohammed never even knew he was supposed to be a prophet. It was invented many decades after he was dead and buried. I suppose in a sense it was a false religion but nevertheless it was invented clearly to be simply a political ideology that sucked in an entire community who unfortunately were a bit slow in thought. I think you'll find Christianity was 'invented' after the death of Jesus. Do you have any criteria for anything being a religion?

I think you will find it wasn't.

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 6:07pm:

I think you will find it wasn't.

You've not read Acts then, or know the earliest dates of the existing Gospels.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 6:09pm:

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 6:07pm: I think you will find it wasn't. You've not read Acts then, or know the earliest dates of the existing Gospels.

The texts used to form the doctrine of Christianity came from people that actually knew Christ.

The Quran came from no such source regarding mohammed who knew nothing about his prophetic office that was invented. Not one iota in history for 60 years until it was all invented after his death.

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 6:18pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 6:09pm: SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 6:07pm: I think you will find it wasn't. You've not read Acts then, or know the earliest dates of the existing Gospels. The texts used to form the doctrine of Christianity came from people that actually knew Christ.

Nearly all of the stories about Jesus are based on traditions without any reference to living witnesses.

Many of the stories are clearly myths...

There is no text that demonstrates any contemporary of Jesus or his family knew of the virgin birth... That myth surfaced around the end of the 1st century.

It's the same with Buddhism... What is known of Siddhartha is based on texts written centuries after his death.

And again with Judaism Israeli archeologists have now given up on finding any evidence that Moses ever existed. The Moses story is also a myth devised centuries after he was supposed to have lived.

At least Hindus don't have pretensions towards the historicity of Brahma, Shiva or Vishnu... Although their texts are full of myths.

Maybe that's one criterion for you for something being a religion... It must be based on myth!

Soren wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 5:20pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 4:34pm: Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 3:55pm: Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology. For all 1.6 Billion Muslims, Soren? The reality is that for the overwhelming majority, it's a religion.  For a tiny minority, it has become a political ideology...   ::) Prove it.

1. How many are estimated to make up IS?
2. How many people profess to being Muslim?
3. Subtract 1 from 2 and you'll have your difference in numbers, Soren.   ::)

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 6:40pm:

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 6:18pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 6:09pm: SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 6:07pm: I think you will find it wasn't. You've not read Acts then, or know the earliest dates of the existing Gospels. The texts used to form the doctrine of Christianity came from people that actually knew Christ. Nearly all of the stories about Jesus are based on traditions without any reference to living witnesses. Many of the stories are clearly myths... There is no text that demonstrates any contemporary of Jesus or his family knew of the virgin birth... That myth surfaced around the end of the 1st century. It's the same with Buddhism... What is known of Siddhartha is based on texts written centuries after his death. And again with Judaism Israeli archeologists have now given up on finding any evidence that Moses ever existed. The Moses story is also a myth devised centuries after he was supposed to have lived. At least Hindus don't have pretensions towards the historicity of Brahma, Shiva or Vishnu... Although their texts are full of myths. Maybe that's one criterion for you for something being a religion... It must be based on myth!

Go away and do some study and then come back here and we can chat on the same level.

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 7:27pm:

Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 5:20pm: Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 4:34pm: Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 3:55pm: Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology. For all 1.6 Billion Muslims, Soren? The reality is that for the overwhelming majority, it's a religion.  For a tiny minority, it has become a political ideology...   ::) Prove it. 1. How many are estimated to make up IS? 2. How many people profess to being Muslim? 3. Subtract 1 from 2 and you'll have your difference in numbers, Soren.   ::)

Incorrect for obvious reasons.

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 7:29pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 7:27pm: Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 5:20pm: Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 4:34pm: Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 3:55pm: Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology. For all 1.6 Billion Muslims, Soren? The reality is that for the overwhelming majority, it's a religion.  For a tiny minority, it has become a political ideology...   ::) Prove it. 1. How many are estimated to make up IS? 2. How many people profess to being Muslim? 3. Subtract 1 from 2 and you'll have your difference in numbers, Soren.   ::) Incorrect for obvious reasons.

Which are?   I'm always interested in seeing my logic debunked...   ::)

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 7:31pm:

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 7:29pm: [quote author=Brian_Ross link=1425186210/19#19 date=1425202062] Incorrect for obvious reasons. Which are?   I'm always interested in seeing my logic debunked...   ::)

Not much point asking this guy...

If you had logic in the first place instead of incoherent matty rants everywhere it would actually be more interesting brain.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 7:36pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 7:31pm: SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 7:29pm: [quote author=Brian_Ross link=1425186210/19#19 date=1425202062] Incorrect for obvious reasons. Which are?   I'm always interested in seeing my logic debunked...   ::) Not much point asking this guy...

I may agree with you but do like watching Matty/et al. squirm under my boot...  ;D

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 7:44pm:

If you had logic in the first place instead of incoherent matty rants everywhere it would actually be more interesting brain.

Sorry?  Are you suggesting in your usual trollish way that I am:

1. Matty?
2. Posting incoherently?
3. Ranting?

If you are, then I'd suggest your trolling is reaching new depths!   ::)

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 7:44pm:

If you had logic in the first place instead of incoherent matty rants everywhere it would actually be more interesting brain.

Brian has his own forum, nobody posts there so he comes here.

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 7:27pm:

Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 5:20pm: Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 4:34pm: Soren wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 3:55pm: Only the naive and wilfully stupid do not realise by now that Islam is a political ideology. For all 1.6 Billion Muslims, Soren? The reality is that for the overwhelming majority, it's a religion.  For a tiny minority, it has become a political ideology...   ::) Prove it. 1. How many are estimated to make up IS? 2. How many people profess to being Muslim? 3. Subtract 1 from 2 and you'll have your difference in numbers, Soren.   ::)

I'd say about 90% of Muslims are keeping their fingers crossed for IS.   They may be queasy about the blood-thirsty brutality but they are keen on the Islamic caliphate wheeze.  They are certainly keen on ending the Western settlement of the Middle East, they are keen on the eradication of Israel and the redrawing of the map. 


Ask a 'moderate' Muslim about Israel and see the spittle fly.

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 8:34pm:

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 7:44pm: If you had logic in the first place instead of incoherent matty rants everywhere it would actually be more interesting brain. Brian has his own forum, nobody posts there so he comes here.

masterbateandrelate ?

Soren wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 9:12pm:

I'd say about 90% of Muslims are keeping their fingers crossed for IS.   They may be queasy about the blood-thirsty brutality but they are keen on the Islamic caliphate wheeze.  They are certainly keen on ending the Western settlement of the Middle East, they are keen on the eradication of Israel and the redrawing of the map.  Ask a 'moderate' Muslim about Israel and see the spittle fly.

Not sure that there'd be 90% of Muslims happy with IS... Unless you're speaking of the Kurds - whose final goal of an independent Kurdistan has been expedited by IS. Hard to imagine once IS is crushed that they'll be going back to the way things were... I think they're done with the Arabs.

Another great winner out of this will be Israel.

That's the black comedy of the Islamic perversion... Its surest target is itself... And once enough Islamic perverts have blown themselves up (although its an unknown as to how much is enough) or been exterminated, Islamism - the great Islamic perversion - Like Fascism and communism before it, will collapse.

And I think by then Israel will have declared its extended borders permanent and inviolable... And independent Kurdistan will be negotiating alliances with the west.

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 8:34pm:

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 7:44pm: If you had logic in the first place instead of incoherent matty rants everywhere it would actually be more interesting brain. Brian has his own forum, nobody posts there so he comes here.

Baron, if you can toe the ROE for the forum, you'd be welcome there!

Problem is, you can't.  Oh, and there are at last count, about 32 users.   ::)

with 31 socks ;D ;D ;D all talking to and supporting himself  ;D

Soren wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 9:12pm:

I'd say about 90% of Muslims are keeping their fingers crossed for IS.   They may be queasy about the blood-thirsty brutality but they are keen on the Islamic caliphate wheeze.  They are certainly keen on ending the Western settlement of the Middle East, they are keen on the eradication of Israel and the redrawing of the map.

And you base this claim on what evidence, exactly, Soren?   ::)


Quote:

Ask a 'moderate' Muslim about Israel and see the spittle fly.

I did.  He's Syrian actually and I work with him every day.   He's a moderate and a nice fellow and he just shrugged his shoulders and we both knew what he meant.   ::)

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 10:52pm:

with 31 socks ;D ;D ;D all talking to and supporting himself  ;D

Still trolling I see, Matty/et al.?   I suppose it's one way to pass the time...   ::)

LOL Says the biggest troll in the Islamic quadrant. Get a grip bubblehead. The day you put forward a coherent thought through argument we all will be amazed.

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 10:55pm:

LOL Says the biggest troll in the Islamic quadrant. Get a grip bubblehead. The day you put forward a coherent thought through argument we all will be amazed.

Such barbs, Matty/et al.?  I am not surprised by your use of them.  Tsk, tsk, such trollish behaviour.  Do you enjoy this activity of yours?  I suspect so, as you make so many posts, so many comments in such a vein against so many posters.    ::)

Maybe I simply know more than you and can form an argument. Forget that you wouldn't be capable of understanding it.

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 11:10pm:

Maybe I simply know more than you and can form an argument.

Really?  Haven't seen any evidence of that, Matty/et al.   ::)


Quote:

Forget that you wouldn't be capable of understanding it.

Oh, I understood it alright.  Didn't believe it as you're just a troll...   ::)

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 11:27pm:

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 11:10pm: Maybe I simply know more than you and can form an argument. Really?  Haven't seen any evidence of that, Matty/et al.   ::) Quote: Forget that you wouldn't be capable of understanding it. Oh, I understood it alright.  Didn't believe it as you're just a troll...   ::)

I rest my case, night troll.

SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1^st, 2015 at 11:29pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 11:27pm: SweetLambo wrote on Mar 1st, 2015 at 11:10pm: Maybe I simply know more than you and can form an argument. Really?  Haven't seen any evidence of that, Matty/et al.   ::) Quote: Forget that you wouldn't be capable of understanding it. Oh, I understood it alright.  Didn't believe it as you're just a troll...   ::) I rest my case, night troll.

I was wondering when you'd give up.  Or have you?  Good night troll...   ::)

Was listening to a British Islamist (Abu Rumaysah) - a schmuk who skipped bail to join ISIS - His belief that IS will soon conquer Iran (the fact that its already a self-declared Islamic Republic seems to elude him) indicates the depth of Islamist delusion.

But, given that Israel is poised to benefit greatly from the fragmentation of the Middle East (which is being hastened by IS), I'm wondering how long it will be before these soon-to-be disillusioned Islamist perverts rebadge IS as a Zionist conspiracy.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 2^nd, 2015 at 10:07am:

Was listening to a British Islamist (Abu Rumaysah) - a schmuk who skipped bail to join ISIS - His belief that IS will soon conquer Iran (the fact that its already a self-declared Islamic Republic seems to elude him) indicates the depth of Islamist delusion. I'm wondering how long it will be before these soon-to-be disillusioned Islamist perverts rebadge IS as a Zionist conspiracy.

The sunni consider the twelver shiites to be deviant heretics.

The sunni vs shia battles have been going on for about 1400 years, they started with the battle of the camel.

Everything is a Zionist conspiracy according to muslims, 6 million Israeli jewsare the cause of all the world's problems.

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 2^nd, 2015 at 11:17am:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 2nd, 2015 at 10:07am: Was listening to a British Islamist (Abu Rumaysah) - a schmuk who skipped bail to join ISIS - His belief that IS will soon conquer Iran (the fact that its already a self-declared Islamic Republic seems to elude him) indicates the depth of Islamist delusion. I'm wondering how long it will be before these soon-to-be disillusioned Islamist perverts rebadge IS as a Zionist conspiracy. The sunni consider the twelver shiites to be deviant heretics. The sunni vs shia battles have been going on for about 1400 years

Yes, I;m aware of the Shia / Sunni schism...

Its a reminder that Islam is not monolithic. In fact its as fractured and sectarian as Christianity, Judaism, Hinduism and Buddhism.

So much for that 'one god to rule us all' theory.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 2^nd, 2015 at 11:29am:

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 2nd, 2015 at 11:17am: NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 2nd, 2015 at 10:07am: Was listening to a British Islamist (Abu Rumaysah) - a schmuk who skipped bail to join ISIS - His belief that IS will soon conquer Iran (the fact that its already a self-declared Islamic Republic seems to elude him) indicates the depth of Islamist delusion. I'm wondering how long it will be before these soon-to-be disillusioned Islamist perverts rebadge IS as a Zionist conspiracy. The sunni consider the twelver shiites to be deviant heretics. The sunni vs shia battles have been going on for about 1400 years Yes, I;m aware of the Shia / Sunni schism... Its a reminder that Islam is not monolithic. In fact its as fractured and sectarian as Christianity, Judaism, Hinduism and Buddhism. So much for that 'one god to rule us all' theory.

The sunni and shia persecute the ahmadi for heretical reforms, the ahmadi cannot even call themselves muslims in Pakistan-
persecutionofahmadis.org

All muslims follow the Quran, the doctrinal differences between sects come from books that were written about 200 years after the Quran.

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 2^nd, 2015 at 11:38am:

The sunni and shia persecute the ahmadi for heretical reforms, the ahmadi cannot even call themselves muslims in Pakistan- persecutionofahmadis.org

The Ahmadis can thank Bhutto for that.

You should read of the comedy when Pakistan attempted to define what it was to be Muslim.

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 2^nd, 2015 at 11:38am:

All muslims follow the Quran, the doctrinal differences between sects come from books that were written about 200 years after the Quran.

Inevitable in all religions...

There is no religion that has not fractured into sects and none that subscribes to only one text. Even the interpretation of the primary text itself (in all religions) quickly fractures into multitudes.

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 2^nd, 2015 at 11:38am:

ll muslims follow the Quran, the doctrinal differences between sects come from books that were written about 200 years after the Quran.

The sunni-shia schism had nothing to do with the writing of the ahadith, it was a dispute over succession after Muhammad. Actual doctrinal differences are few and mostly trivial. Most sunnis would welcome a shia into their mosque and vise versa. In Iraq before the war intermarriage was common place.

Actual conflict between sunni and shia - when it occurs - is never about doctrine, but earthly, secular issues.