(1) Jurgen Todenhofer has been to meet with them and look for himself.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p02v9qvz

He's one of these mugs who's been everywhere and goes anywhere, but I suppose we need them.
It's interesting what he says because it gives the lie to all these people, including a lot of half-wits here, who almost plead their case.
Their Islamic view is that there is good & evil. They are the good, we are the evil. Their struggle is the culmination of a 1400 year old prediction for a war.
We are their enemy, they are our enemy. They will use all & every means to destroy us.

(2) An example of the kind of idiot who thinks we are not in a war has shown his colours here:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3148510/Labour-candidate-sparks-fury-attacking-repatriation-30-Britons-massacred-Tunisia-looks-like-country-war.html

"A Labour parliamentary candidate sparked fury today after launching an online tirade against the government for helping to repatriate the victims of last week’s Tunisian beach massacre.

William Cass, Labour’s defeated candidate in Aylesbury, said the 30 British holidaymakers gunned down by ISIS fanatic Seifiddine Rezgui should not be treated like ‘fallen soldiers’.

Mr Cass said the victims ‘died on holiday not in service’ and claimed the government was using the atrocity to ‘justify an imperialist response’ by attacking ISIS in Syria."

(3) And finally, this bloke is an Australian hero, just like the people who went to fight against the fascists in Spain in the 1930s:

" The family of a Gold Coast man is in shock after being told he was killed at the weekend helping Kurdish forces in Syria.

Reece Harding, just 23 years old, left Australia in May, telling his family he needed to get away for a while.

But it wasn't long after that when the parents feared Reece had joined Kurdish forces in their fight against Islamic State, describing the whole situation as "a parent's worst nightmare".

If the reports are true, Reece is the second Australian to have died while fighting with the Kurds."

People in this category do not deserve to be treated the same as people fighting with ISIL.
Who's side is our government on?

Well then, I have always maintained if we are adamant that it is our business then we need to stop messing about and get boots on the ground...

ISIL (ISIS, IS, or whatever other moniker they choose to go by) are fighting a conventional on the ground, in your face war at present. We are not and they are gaining ground...

Ergo, best thing to do, is take them on in conventional warfare.

The risk, we will have casualties - that's the risk in all warfare.

I have never denied it is a war, I always argue when either side claims the other started it - conflict has been going on around the globe pretty much since we invented our first tool.... Bottom line, humans started it and only humans can resolve it, if there is a genuine will to resolve differences. We are, in all likelihood, beyond discussing a resolution - that is our (Human kind) failure...

So - there is a war going on with ISIL, that is, it would seem, indisputable, as such we need to get on with fighting it instead of allowing our deeply flawed and untrustworthy politicians play it out in the media.

I would rather it be different because I would prefer us not to be at war - but that is how it is.

I think it is a good opportunity for Muslims to sort their own mess out. They need to be confronted with the reality of an Islamic State, otherwise every deluded fool across the middle east (and some further afield) will continue to blame America for all their problems and continue to hold Shariah law as the answer to all their problems.

freediver wrote on Jul 4^th, 2015 at 6:53pm:

I think it is a good opportunity for Muslims to sort their own mess out. They need to be confronted with the reality of an Islamic State, otherwise every deluded fool across the middle east (and some further afield) will continue to blame America for all their problems and continue to hold Shariah law as the answer to all their problems.

They can now hold the Saudis and the Iranians as the answer to their problems. What is happening in Iraq and Syria is the result of the geopolitical plates shifting in the Arab world.

After the US hosted their love-in in Iraq, their influence has waned.

I'm not sure how many foreign recruits ISIS attracts, but for Muslims in Iraq and Syria their conflict is about survival.