I got the idea from something Phillip Adams said the other day during a program about the Judas character in the bible.

Who would be in your opinion, say the three most hated people in history?
There's no shortage to choose from. I guess there will be an immediate response of "abbott" but he's hardly a historical figure is he.

Phillip Adams suggested that Judas might be because after 2000 years everybody still knows what it means to call someone a Judas.
But you might have some interesting ideas - examples might be:
Hitler
Stalin
George W Bush
Tony Blair
Nero
Mohamed
Rothschild Rockefeller
Napoleon

There might even be someone we don't think of in those terms today who in generations to come will be looked back on as a sinister figure, for instance because of some invention - Mark Zuckeberg?

mohammad

It really comes down to what period of history we look at and from whos perpective!

there goes that word again HATE. >:(

an awful lot of people admired and probably think Hitler was the best Chancellor they ever had...

most of that list had followers a large contingent of followers..

balance would be nice...but I doubt we will ever get that.

I think quite a few hate cods if you look around.

cods wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 11:28am:

I think quite a few hate cods if you look around

We all love you codsy!

Settle petal, who would we have to argue with if you werent around!  :)

Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 11:21am:

mohammad

The wrongest answer there could be. Sprintcyclist is just a hate propagator.

There are ~1.6 billion Muslims that love Mohammed compared to the handful of sorry hate propagators that hate him.

From Wikipedia:


Quote:

1.6 billion As of 2010, over 1.6 billion or about 23.4% of the world population are Muslims. By the percentage of the total population in a region considering themselves Muslim, 24.8% in Asia-Oceania do, 91.2% in the Middle East-North Africa, 29.6% in Sub-Saharan Africa, around 6.0% in Europe, and 0.6% in the Americas.

3 most hated:

Hitler , Stalin & Pol Pot.

What was Napoleon's legacy?

Bobby. wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 11:38am:

3 most hated: Hitler , Stalin & Pol Pot.

Evidence?

that answer  varies depending on your own circumstances ... for many religious Christians who grew up in politically stable countries it probably is Judas, for Russians there's a good chance it is Stalin, Romania it's ceausescu, Chinese Mao, for righties it's brown people etc

freediver wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 12:16pm:

What was Napoleon's legacy?

not to weld tins with  food in them  with lead. :(

freediver wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 12:16pm:

What was Napoleon's legacy?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleonic_Wars_casualties


Quote:

Total dead and missing 2,500,000 military personnel in Europe 1,000,000 civilians were killed in Europe and in rebellious French overseas colonies. Total: 3,500,000 casualties David Gates estimated that 5,000,000 died in the Napoleonic Wars. He does not specify if this number includes civilians or is just military. Charles Esdaile says 5,000,000–7,000,000 died overall, including civilians. These numbers are subject to considerable variation. Erik Durschmied, in his book The Hinge Factor, gives a figure of 1.4 million French military deaths of all causes. Adam Zamoyski estimates that around 400,000 Russian soldiers died in the 1812 campaign alone—a figure backed up by other sources.[who?] Civilian casualties in the 1812 campaign were probably comparable. Alan Schom estimates some 3 million military deaths in the Napoleonic wars and this figure, once again, is supported elsewhere.[where?] Common estimates of more than 500,000 French dead in Russia in 1812 and 250,000–300,000 French dead in Iberia between 1808 and 1814 give a total of at least 750,000, and to this must be added hundreds of thousands of more French dead in other campaigns—probably around 150,000 to 200,000 French dead in the German campaign of 1813, for example. Thus, it is fair to say that the estimates above are highly conservative. Civilian deaths are impossible to accurately estimate. Whilst military deaths are invariably put at between 2.5 million and 3.5 million, civilian death tolls vary from 750,000 to 3 million. Thus estimates of total dead, both military and civilian, can reasonably range from 3,250,000 to 6,500,000.

Swagman wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 12:40pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 12:16pm: What was Napoleon's legacy? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleonic_Wars_casualties Quote: Total dead and missing 2,500,000 military personnel in Europe 1,000,000 civilians were killed in Europe and in rebellious French overseas colonies. Total: 3,500,000 casualties David Gates estimated that 5,000,000 died in the Napoleonic Wars. He does not specify if this number includes civilians or is just military. Charles Esdaile says 5,000,000–7,000,000 died overall, including civilians. These numbers are subject to considerable variation. Erik Durschmied, in his book The Hinge Factor, gives a figure of 1.4 million French military deaths of all causes. Adam Zamoyski estimates that around 400,000 Russian soldiers died in the 1812 campaign alone—a figure backed up by other sources.[who?] Civilian casualties in the 1812 campaign were probably comparable. Alan Schom estimates some 3 million military deaths in the Napoleonic wars and this figure, once again, is supported elsewhere.[where?] Common estimates of more than 500,000 French dead in Russia in 1812 and 250,000–300,000 French dead in Iberia between 1808 and 1814 give a total of at least 750,000, and to this must be added hundreds of thousands of more French dead in other campaigns—probably around 150,000 to 200,000 French dead in the German campaign of 1813, for example. Thus, it is fair to say that the estimates above are highly conservative. Civilian deaths are impossible to accurately estimate. Whilst military deaths are invariably put at between 2.5 million and 3.5 million, civilian death tolls vary from 750,000 to 3 million. Thus estimates of total dead, both military and civilian, can reasonably range from 3,250,000 to 6,500,000.

I'd not seen figures as high as that before. I wonder does that include the wars he fought in Italy & Egypt, as a servant of the State let's say, before he became a dictator. I don't know how accurate any figures of Russian military or civilian deaths in 1812 could possibly be.
Still, with figures anywhere near that he would have to be on the list.
His legacy was not all negative though. He spread revolutionary principles throughout Europe, including his legal code. The ancien regime would never be the same, even after 1815.

What was Stalin's tally? 20 million?

Of course Judas is not the oldest remembered figure, maybe just the most castigated, though that may be a matter for rethinking.
Midas of "the Midas touch" would be an older and frequently remembered figure.

Unforgiven wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 11:33am:

Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 11:21am: mohammad The wrongest answer there could be. Sprintcyclist is just a hate propagator. There are ~1.6 billion Muslims that love Mohammed compared to the handful of sorry hate propagators that hate him. From Wikipedia: Quote: 1.6 billion As of 2010, over 1.6 billion or about 23.4% of the world population are Muslims. By the percentage of the total population in a region considering themselves Muslim, 24.8% in Asia-Oceania do, 91.2% in the Middle East-North Africa, 29.6% in Sub-Saharan Africa, around 6.0% in Europe, and 0.6% in the Americas.

the thread was 'most hated', not 'most net hated'.
with the millions killed by muslims over the centuries moh would be far and away the most hated.

Noone would even be in the same league as moh.
the damage islam has caused.

Stalin by a country mile.

He was hated by the ordinary citizens - and was also hated by those who served him. Even his closest associates hated him.

By contrast, Hitler was not only loved by the bulk of the ordinary citizenry, but was also worshipped by those most close him.

And make no mistake about Hitler and the Jews --- I worked for years with Russians, Ukrainians, Hungarians, Croatians and others who hated 'the Jews' - and who had absolutely no sympathy whatsoever for them because of the extermination camps.

Vast swathes of the European and Russian people at the time of Hitler, hated the Jews. 

The Jews hated Hitler - but not so the Arabs, and many in the West who still 'despise' them.

Swagman wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 12:40pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 12:16pm: What was Napoleon's legacy? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleonic_Wars_casualties Quote: Total dead and missing 2,500,000 military personnel in Europe 1,000,000 civilians were killed in Europe and in rebellious French overseas colonies. Total: 3,500,000 casualties David Gates estimated that 5,000,000 died in the Napoleonic Wars. He does not specify if this number includes civilians or is just military. Charles Esdaile says 5,000,000–7,000,000 died overall, including civilians. These numbers are subject to considerable variation. Erik Durschmied, in his book The Hinge Factor, gives a figure of 1.4 million French military deaths of all causes. Adam Zamoyski estimates that around 400,000 Russian soldiers died in the 1812 campaign alone—a figure backed up by other sources.[who?] Civilian casualties in the 1812 campaign were probably comparable. Alan Schom estimates some 3 million military deaths in the Napoleonic wars and this figure, once again, is supported elsewhere.[where?] Common estimates of more than 500,000 French dead in Russia in 1812 and 250,000–300,000 French dead in Iberia between 1808 and 1814 give a total of at least 750,000, and to this must be added hundreds of thousands of more French dead in other campaigns—probably around 150,000 to 200,000 French dead in the German campaign of 1813, for example. Thus, it is fair to say that the estimates above are highly conservative. Civilian deaths are impossible to accurately estimate. Whilst military deaths are invariably put at between 2.5 million and 3.5 million, civilian death tolls vary from 750,000 to 3 million. Thus estimates of total dead, both military and civilian, can reasonably range from 3,250,000 to 6,500,000.

That's it? Nothing else?

How can anyone be hated from history considering we stand on the shoulders of those who came before. Every single one of them.

Karl Marx would be up there - hated by most citizens of the former FSU AND most of the western world for the last 100 years.  It was his influence that enabled the horrors or Mao, Stalin and pol pot - 3 previously mentioned contenders.  They are mere sidekicks to the big boss Marx.

The peasants!

... wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 2:48pm:

Karl Marx would be up there - hated by most citizens of the former FSU AND most of the western world for the last 100 years.  It was his influence that enabled the horrors or Mao, Stalin and pol pot - 3 previously mentioned contenders.  They are mere sidekicks to the big boss Marx.

Not true.

Marx never advocated for a Police State Tyranny as part of his Communist Manifesto.

It's just that the born-to-rule elitists - (hello Malcolm Turnbull) - always get in the way of a True communist state being developed as one giant national kumbayah commune. There's always been someone who comes along to reshape this political cake into a pyramid.

Lord Herbert wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 2:58pm:

... wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 2:48pm: Karl Marx would be up there - hated by most citizens of the former FSU AND most of the western world for the last 100 years.  It was his influence that enabled the horrors or Mao, Stalin and pol pot - 3 previously mentioned contenders.  They are mere sidekicks to the big boss Marx. Not true. Marx never advocated for a Police State Tyranny as part of his Communist Manifesto. It's just that the born-to-rule elitists - (hello Malcolm Turnbull) - always get in the way of a True communist state being developed as one giant national kumbayah commune. There's always been someone who comes along to reshape this political cake into a pyramid.

Come on mate, the ten tenets have a common theme - the state having total power.  The police is the enforcement arm of that all-powerful state, so how could it be any different? 

____ wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 2:43pm:

How can anyone be hated from history considering we stand on the shoulders of those who came before. Every single one of them.

that is so gobsmackingly stupid that I was expecting to see SOB as the author.

... wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 3:04pm:

Come on mate, the ten tenets have a common theme - the state having total power.  The police is the enforcement arm of that all-powerful state, so how could it be any different?

Communism is based upon ... trust ... and that's where the whole edifice falls down.

You simply cannot trust people to forgo self-interest for the Common Good. Where there's a personal advantage to be had - people will take it.

Considering that without Judas' betrayal there would have been no crucifixion, no Jesus waking up on the Monday and scooting off to heaven, Christians should be saying big thank yous to his memory...

In fact, it could be said that Judas was the major facilitator of Christianity.

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 3:11pm:

____ wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 2:43pm: How can anyone be hated from history considering we stand on the shoulders of those who came before. Every single one of them. that is so gobsmackingly stupid that I was expecting to see SOB as the author.

As our circle of knowledge expands, so does the circumference of darkness surrounding it.
ALBERT EINSTEIN

____ wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 3:27pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 3:11pm: ____ wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 2:43pm: How can anyone be hated from history considering we stand on the shoulders of those who came before. Every single one of them. that is so gobsmackingly stupid that I was expecting to see SOB as the author. As our circle of knowledge expands, so does the circumference of darkness surrounding it. ALBERT EINSTEIN

Good one.

____ wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 3:27pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 3:11pm: ____ wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 2:43pm: How can anyone be hated from history considering we stand on the shoulders of those who came before. Every single one of them. that is so gobsmackingly stupid that I was expecting to see SOB as the author. As our circle of knowledge expands, so does the circumference of darkness surrounding it. ALBERT EINSTEIN

"I am so smat, I am so smat... S M A... I mean  S M A R T"
Homer Simpson

The Heartless Felon wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 3:25pm:

Considering that without Judas' betrayal there would have been no crucifixion, no Jesus waking up on the Monday and scooting off to heaven, Christians should be saying big thank yous to his memory... In fact, it could be said that Judas was the major facilitator of Christianity.

it could be said that.
also the jews had a big hand in it.
As was foretold, and as what had to happen to Jesus to become the Christ.
He had to fulfill ALL the prophecies.

even the guards that mocked him as he perished, divided his clothes, the criminals that died beside him

Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 1:14pm:

Unforgiven wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 11:33am: Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 11:21am: mohammad The wrongest answer there could be. Sprintcyclist is just a hate propagator. There are ~1.6 billion Muslims that love Mohammed compared to the handful of sorry hate propagators that hate him. From Wikipedia: Quote: 1.6 billion As of 2010, over 1.6 billion or about 23.4% of the world population are Muslims. By the percentage of the total population in a region considering themselves Muslim, 24.8% in Asia-Oceania do, 91.2% in the Middle East-North Africa, 29.6% in Sub-Saharan Africa, around 6.0% in Europe, and 0.6% in the Americas. the thread was 'most hated', not 'most net hated'. with the millions killed by muslims over the centuries moh would be far and away the most hated. Noone would even be in the same league as moh. the damage islam has caused.

the followers of moh have murdered 100's this month.

mod is by far the most hated

This hatred of Islam and Moslims and the rise of jihadists is only a modern day thing right.

Every since Israel was formed and the west realised that the middle east had oil to burn.

Imo if the west didn't meddle in the affairs of the middle east we would have a different world today.

Like I said in another thread the demonising of the Middle east and the west filling it up with cut throats and murderers is all because of OIL.

Once upon a time the middle east was an exotic place full of mystery.   

Hey sprint cyclist how many Irakies have died since the invasion.......??????

Quote:

This hatred of Islam and Moslims and the rise of jihadists is only a modern day thing right.

Hardly. It has been happening for 1400 years. They nearly took over the entire western civilisation. Getting rid of the Muslims is what the Spanish Inquisition was all about, and we have been chipping away at their empire ever since. Now we are trying to build a functioning democracy right in the middle of it.


Quote:

Considering that without Judas' betrayal there would have been no crucifixion, no Jesus waking up on the Monday and scooting off to heaven, Christians should be saying big thank yous to his memory... In fact, it could be said that Judas was the major facilitator of Christianity.

It is my understanding that Jesus made peace with him.

Napoleon was a fairly good chap wasnt he.
introduced the napoleonic code. lots of good laws, libraries, great builder,workaholic.
I'd follow him

The footprint of Napoleon's empire on Continental Europe are the rich liberal democracies.

freediver wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 6:45pm:

The footprint of Napoleon's empire on Continental Europe are the rich liberal democracies.

yeah, i didnt think he was too bad at all. just liked war and was good at it. a modern day Alexander the great .

freediver wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 12:16pm:

What was Napoleon's legacy?

Off the top of my head:

The modern French legal system; the metric system; the near-conquest of Europe...

aquascoot wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 6:50pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 6:45pm: The footprint of Napoleon's empire on Continental Europe are the rich liberal democracies. yeah, i didnt think he was too bad at all. just liked war and was good at it. a modern day Alexander the great .

Please don't compare Napoleon with Alexander.  Alexander was a more able general and his empire stretched from the Mediterranean Sea to India.  He defeated the largest empire the world had seen at that point, the Persians.   

Brian Ross wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 8:35pm:

aquascoot wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 6:50pm: freediver wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 6:45pm: The footprint of Napoleon's empire on Continental Europe are the rich liberal democracies. yeah, i didnt think he was too bad at all. just liked war and was good at it. a modern day Alexander the great . Please don't compare Napoleon with Alexander.  Alexander was a more able general and his empire stretched from the Mediterranean Sea to India.  He defeated the largest empire the world had seen at that point, the Persians.

Yes Brian, and all the while he was being shagged cross-eyed by his closest male associates. There was no 'Josephine' in his life.

Generals come and go. Bonaparte was very effective against the Austrians, and the English supported Royalists at Toulon. He just should have had the good grace to die in a last stand at Waterloo. That way British school boy histories would have remembered him better.

issuevoter wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 10:30pm:

Generals come and go. Bonaparte was very effective against the Austrians, and the English supported Royalists at Toulon. He just should have had the good grace to die in a last stand at Waterloo. That way British school boy histories would have remembered him better.

His greatest shame and the beginning of the end was the retreat from Moscow.. he bolted on to a warm fire, a good brandy, and a quickie with Josie while his troops continued to die of cold etc....

freediver wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 6:20pm:

Quote: This hatred of Islam and Moslims and the rise of jihadists is only a modern day thing right. Hardly. It has been happening for 1400 years. They nearly took over the entire western civilisation. Getting rid of the Muslims is what the Spanish Inquisition was all about, and we have been chipping away at their empire ever since. Now we are trying to build a functioning democracy right in the middle of it. [quote]Considering that without Judas' betrayal there would have been no crucifixion, no Jesus waking up on the Monday and scooting off to heaven, Christians should be saying big thank yous to his memory... In fact, it could be said that Judas was the major facilitator of Christianity.

It is my understanding that Jesus made peace with him.[/quote]

If I could spell 'non-sequitur', I'd say that was one...

The Heartless Felon wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 5:13am:

freediver wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 6:20pm: Quote: This hatred of Islam and Moslims and the rise of jihadists is only a modern day thing right. Hardly. It has been happening for 1400 years. They nearly took over the entire western civilisation. Getting rid of the Muslims is what the Spanish Inquisition was all about, and we have been chipping away at their empire ever since. Now we are trying to build a functioning democracy right in the middle of it. [quote]Considering that without Judas' betrayal there would have been no crucifixion, no Jesus waking up on the Monday and scooting off to heaven, Christians should be saying big thank yous to his memory... In fact, it could be said that Judas was the major facilitator of Christianity. It is my understanding that Jesus made peace with him.

If I could spell 'non-sequitur', I'd say that was one...
[/quote]



Quote:

............It is my understanding that Jesus made peace with him..........

Yes, I would more agree with that than disagree.
Jesus accepted Judas actions. It had to happen, it was foretold.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 11:21am:

mohammad

jesus christ.

Swagman wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 12:40pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 12:16pm: What was Napoleon's legacy? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleonic_Wars_casualties Quote: Total dead and missing 2,500,000 military personnel in Europe 1,000,000 civilians were killed in Europe and in rebellious French overseas colonies. Total: 3,500,000 casualties David Gates estimated that 5,000,000 died in the Napoleonic Wars. He does not specify if this number includes civilians or is just military. Charles Esdaile says 5,000,000–7,000,000 died overall, including civilians. These numbers are subject to considerable variation. Erik Durschmied, in his book The Hinge Factor, gives a figure of 1.4 million French military deaths of all causes. Adam Zamoyski estimates that around 400,000 Russian soldiers died in the 1812 campaign alone—a figure backed up by other sources.[who?] Civilian casualties in the 1812 campaign were probably comparable. Alan Schom estimates some 3 million military deaths in the Napoleonic wars and this figure, once again, is supported elsewhere.[where?] Common estimates of more than 500,000 French dead in Russia in 1812 and 250,000–300,000 French dead in Iberia between 1808 and 1814 give a total of at least 750,000, and to this must be added hundreds of thousands of more French dead in other campaigns—probably around 150,000 to 200,000 French dead in the German campaign of 1813, for example. Thus, it is fair to say that the estimates above are highly conservative. Civilian deaths are impossible to accurately estimate. Whilst military deaths are invariably put at between 2.5 million and 3.5 million, civilian death tolls vary from 750,000 to 3 million. Thus estimates of total dead, both military and civilian, can reasonably range from 3,250,000 to 6,500,000.

Apparently Napoleon used to boast that he sent 30,000 soldiers to their deaths per month. 

Lord Herbert wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 1:26pm:

Stalin by a country mile. He was hated by the ordinary citizens - and was also hated by those who served him. Even his closest associates hated him. By contrast, Hitler was not only loved by the bulk of the ordinary citizenry, but was also worshipped by those most close him. And make no mistake about Hitler and the Jews --- I worked for years with Russians, Ukrainians, Hungarians, Croatians and others who hated 'the Jews' - and who had absolutely no sympathy whatsoever for them because of the extermination camps. Vast swathes of the European and Russian people at the time of Hitler, hated the Jews.  The Jews hated Hitler - but not so the Arabs, and many in the West who still 'despise' them.

You're assumeing that he is hated more because he killed more people. A lot of people love stalin because to them he was a man of strength. Its like Sprint and Aqua loving Putin for his "apparent" strength

freediver wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 1:40pm:

Swagman wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 12:40pm: freediver wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 12:16pm: What was Napoleon's legacy? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleonic_Wars_casualties Quote: Total dead and missing 2,500,000 military personnel in Europe 1,000,000 civilians were killed in Europe and in rebellious French overseas colonies. Total: 3,500,000 casualties David Gates estimated that 5,000,000 died in the Napoleonic Wars. He does not specify if this number includes civilians or is just military. Charles Esdaile says 5,000,000–7,000,000 died overall, including civilians. These numbers are subject to considerable variation. Erik Durschmied, in his book The Hinge Factor, gives a figure of 1.4 million French military deaths of all causes. Adam Zamoyski estimates that around 400,000 Russian soldiers died in the 1812 campaign alone—a figure backed up by other sources.[who?] Civilian casualties in the 1812 campaign were probably comparable. Alan Schom estimates some 3 million military deaths in the Napoleonic wars and this figure, once again, is supported elsewhere.[where?] Common estimates of more than 500,000 French dead in Russia in 1812 and 250,000–300,000 French dead in Iberia between 1808 and 1814 give a total of at least 750,000, and to this must be added hundreds of thousands of more French dead in other campaigns—probably around 150,000 to 200,000 French dead in the German campaign of 1813, for example. Thus, it is fair to say that the estimates above are highly conservative. Civilian deaths are impossible to accurately estimate. Whilst military deaths are invariably put at between 2.5 million and 3.5 million, civilian death tolls vary from 750,000 to 3 million. Thus estimates of total dead, both military and civilian, can reasonably range from 3,250,000 to 6,500,000. That's it? Nothing else?

That was funny ;D

... wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 3:04pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 2:58pm: ... wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 2:48pm: Karl Marx would be up there - hated by most citizens of the former FSU AND most of the western world for the last 100 years.  It was his influence that enabled the horrors or Mao, Stalin and pol pot - 3 previously mentioned contenders.  They are mere sidekicks to the big boss Marx. Not true. Marx never advocated for a Police State Tyranny as part of his Communist Manifesto. It's just that the born-to-rule elitists - (hello Malcolm Turnbull) - always get in the way of a True communist state being developed as one giant national kumbayah commune. There's always been someone who comes along to reshape this political cake into a pyramid. Come on mate, the ten tenets have a common theme - the state having total power.  The police is the enforcement arm of that all-powerful state, so how could it be any different?

What's this ten tenents thing and the state having total power.Where do you get this?

Brian Ross wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 8:35pm:

aquascoot wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 6:50pm: freediver wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 6:45pm: The footprint of Napoleon's empire on Continental Europe are the rich liberal democracies. yeah, i didnt think he was too bad at all. just liked war and was good at it. a modern day Alexander the great . Please don't compare Napoleon with Alexander.  Alexander was a more able general and his empire stretched from the Mediterranean Sea to India.  He defeated the largest empire the world had seen at that point, the Persians.

The Athenians defeated the Persians well before Alexander in 490 and again in 480 BC 

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 8:49am:

Brian Ross wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 8:35pm: aquascoot wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 6:50pm: freediver wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 6:45pm: The footprint of Napoleon's empire on Continental Europe are the rich liberal democracies. yeah, i didnt think he was too bad at all. just liked war and was good at it. a modern day Alexander the great . Please don't compare Napoleon with Alexander.  Alexander was a more able general and his empire stretched from the Mediterranean Sea to India.  He defeated the largest empire the world had seen at that point, the Persians.    The Athenians defeated the Persians well before Alexander in 490 and again in 480 BC

The Greeks (& the Romans for that matter) were absolutely amazing ------->  WTF HAPPENED TO US ????

Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 9:04am:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 8:49am: Brian Ross wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 8:35pm: aquascoot wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 6:50pm: freediver wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 6:45pm: The footprint of Napoleon's empire on Continental Europe are the rich liberal democracies. yeah, i didnt think he was too bad at all. just liked war and was good at it. a modern day Alexander the great . Please don't compare Napoleon with Alexander.  Alexander was a more able general and his empire stretched from the Mediterranean Sea to India.  He defeated the largest empire the world had seen at that point, the Persians.    The Athenians defeated the Persians well before Alexander in 490 and again in 480 BC  The Greeks (& the Romans for that matter) were absolutely amazing ------->  WTF HAPPENED TO US ????

They grew up. America/Aust etc are still in that adolescent stage still needing to prove themselves and bullying everybody. 

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 8:39am:

Lord Herbert wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 1:26pm: Stalin by a country mile. He was hated by the ordinary citizens - and was also hated by those who served him. Even his closest associates hated him. By contrast, Hitler was not only loved by the bulk of the ordinary citizenry, but was also worshipped by those most close him. And make no mistake about Hitler and the Jews --- I worked for years with Russians, Ukrainians, Hungarians, Croatians and others who hated 'the Jews' - and who had absolutely no sympathy whatsoever for them because of the extermination camps. Vast swathes of the European and Russian people at the time of Hitler, hated the Jews.  The Jews hated Hitler - but not so the Arabs, and many in the West who still 'despise' them. You're assumeing that he is hated more because he killed more people. A lot of people love stalin because to them he was a man of strength. Its like Sprint and Aqua loving Putin for his "apparent" strength

I lived with my Russian aunt for 4 years. Trust me, Stalin was feared and hated.

... dear o dear o dear ... where do we get these Ozpol members from?

Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 9:04am:

The Greeks (& the Romans for that matter) were absolutely amazing ------->  WTF HAPPENED TO US ????

Too much Ouzo?  ::) :P

Lord Herbert wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 10:42am:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 8:39am: Lord Herbert wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 1:26pm: Stalin by a country mile. He was hated by the ordinary citizens - and was also hated by those who served him. Even his closest associates hated him. By contrast, Hitler was not only loved by the bulk of the ordinary citizenry, but was also worshipped by those most close him. And make no mistake about Hitler and the Jews --- I worked for years with Russians, Ukrainians, Hungarians, Croatians and others who hated 'the Jews' - and who had absolutely no sympathy whatsoever for them because of the extermination camps. Vast swathes of the European and Russian people at the time of Hitler, hated the Jews.  The Jews hated Hitler - but not so the Arabs, and many in the West who still 'despise' them. You're assumeing that he is hated more because he killed more people. A lot of people love stalin because to them he was a man of strength. Its like Sprint and Aqua loving Putin for his "apparent" strength I lived with my Russian aunt for 4 years. Trust me, Stalin was feared and hated. ... dear o dear o dear ... where do we get these Ozpol members from?

I don't know if the penny's dropped yet Herb but your aunt accounts for 1 person in a population of how many, 200 million??? Are you saying you have never heard and/or heard of people lamenting "the good ol days" when Stalin ruled and Russia was great. You must have been living under a rock. You know a lot of Russians attribute their narrow escape from annihilation by the Nazis to Stalin. Herb, you really got that cold war propaganda embedded deep in your brain   

Lord Herbert wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 10:43am:

Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 9:04am: The Greeks (& the Romans for that matter) were absolutely amazing ------->  WTF HAPPENED TO US ???? Too much Ouzo?  ::) :P

Yeah right Herb the problem is that the Greeks drink too much

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnJWnlJEdk8

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 4:31pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 10:43am: Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 9:04am: The Greeks (& the Romans for that matter) were absolutely amazing ------->  WTF HAPPENED TO US ???? Too much Ouzo?  ::) :P Yeah right Herb the problem is that the Greeks drink too much https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnJWnlJEdk8

You've shot yourself in the foot again.

Read the title of the video. These girls were drunk in someone else's country, not in the UK.

They had the good sense to vomit on someone else's pavements -- unlike your own lot.

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 9:08am:

Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 9:04am: The Greeks (& the Romans for that matter) were absolutely amazing ------->  WTF HAPPENED TO US ???? They grew up. America/Aust etc are still in that adolescent stage still needing to prove themselves and bullying everybody.

;D ;D ;D

I've just realised you're just a kid, aren't you?

"Greece grew up". Riiiiiiight - The adults were put in charge.  ;D

Lord Herbert wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 8:34pm:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 4:31pm: Lord Herbert wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 10:43am: Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 9:04am: The Greeks (& the Romans for that matter) were absolutely amazing ------->  WTF HAPPENED TO US ???? Too much Ouzo?  ::) :P Yeah right Herb the problem is that the Greeks drink too much https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnJWnlJEdk8 You've shot yourself in the foot again. Read the title of the video. These girls were drunk in someone else's country, not in the UK. They had the good sense to vomit on someone else's pavements -- unlike your own lot.

And yet you always whinge that too many foreigners go to the UK to throw up there. Make up your mind. I think you just shot yourself in the foot, AGAIN!!!  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D 

Lord Herbert wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 8:43pm:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 9:08am: Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 9:04am: The Greeks (& the Romans for that matter) were absolutely amazing ------->  WTF HAPPENED TO US ???? They grew up. America/Aust etc are still in that adolescent stage still needing to prove themselves and bullying everybody.  "Greece grew up". Riiiiiiight - The adults were put in charge.

Great, I'm glad that we agree. 

Ajax wrote on Jul 19^th, 2015 at 4:26pm:

This hatred of Islam and Moslims and the rise of jihadists is only a modern day thing right. Every since Israel was formed and the west realised that the middle east had oil to burn. Imo if the west didn't meddle in the affairs of the middle east we would have a different world today. Like I said in another thread the demonising of the Middle east and the west filling it up with cut throats and murderers is all because of OIL. Once upon a time the middle east was an exotic place full of mystery.    Hey sprint cyclist how many Irakies have died since the invasion.......??????

oh please...

in what century was that??  ::)

President Elect, The Mechanic wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 9:04pm:

Ajax wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 4:26pm: This hatred of Islam and Moslims and the rise of jihadists is only a modern day thing right. Every since Israel was formed and the west realised that the middle east had oil to burn. Imo if the west didn't meddle in the affairs of the middle east we would have a different world today. Like I said in another thread the demonising of the Middle east and the west filling it up with cut throats and murderers is all because of OIL. Once upon a time the middle east was an exotic place full of mystery.    Hey sprint cyclist how many Irakies have died since the invasion.......?????? oh please... in what century was that??  ::)

Europe has been in a constant state of war for God knows how many hundreds of years and between 1914 and 1945 staged 2 of the biggest bloodbaths in human history and you accuse the muslims of being barbarians? Hopeless!!!   

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 9:22pm:

President Elect, The Mechanic wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 9:04pm: Ajax wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 4:26pm: This hatred of Islam and Moslims and the rise of jihadists is only a modern day thing right. Every since Israel was formed and the west realised that the middle east had oil to burn. Imo if the west didn't meddle in the affairs of the middle east we would have a different world today. Like I said in another thread the demonising of the Middle east and the west filling it up with cut throats and murderers is all because of OIL. Once upon a time the middle east was an exotic place full of mystery.    Hey sprint cyclist how many Irakies have died since the invasion.......?????? oh please... in what century was that??  ::) Europe has been in a constant state of war for God knows how many hundreds of years and between 1914 and 1945 staged 2 of the biggest bloodbaths in human history and you accuse the muslims of being barbarians? Hopeless!!!

wait, what??  :-?

who accused who of being what???  :-/

President Elect, The Mechanic wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 9:47pm:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 9:22pm: President Elect, The Mechanic wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 9:04pm: Ajax wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 4:26pm: This hatred of Islam and Moslims and the rise of jihadists is only a modern day thing right. Every since Israel was formed and the west realised that the middle east had oil to burn. Imo if the west didn't meddle in the affairs of the middle east we would have a different world today. Like I said in another thread the demonising of the Middle east and the west filling it up with cut throats and murderers is all because of OIL. Once upon a time the middle east was an exotic place full of mystery.    Hey sprint cyclist how many Irakies have died since the invasion.......?????? oh please... in what century was that??  ::) Europe has been in a constant state of war for God knows how many hundreds of years and between 1914 and 1945 staged 2 of the biggest bloodbaths in human history and you accuse the muslims of being barbarians? Hopeless!!!    wait, what??  :-? who accused who of being what???  :-/

Sorry, misread your post. My apologies.

President Elect, The Mechanic wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 9:04pm:

Ajax wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 4:26pm: This hatred of Islam and Moslims and the rise of jihadists is only a modern day thing right. Every since Israel was formed and the west realised that the middle east had oil to burn. Imo if the west didn't meddle in the affairs of the middle east we would have a different world today. Like I said in another thread the demonising of the Middle east and the west filling it up with cut throats and murderers is all because of OIL. Once upon a time the middle east was an exotic place full of mystery.    Hey sprint cyclist how many Irakies have died since the invasion.......?????? oh please... in what century was that??  ::)

Port Out - Starboard Home - and toss a few coins to those near naked little beggars on the wharf, would you Sidney?  I do like to see them dive to the bottom for a copper or two (shades of the odd Royal Commission there), but I'm just too tired for that today, too warm, you see... must be .. what.. seventy five degrees FAHRENHEIT.... give or take one or two?

Ship's Purser says only seventy four today, ma'am... we'll fix you right with a nice bath and a gin and tonic with ice... there's the go.... here you little fellaheen darkie beggars... here's some coins for you!

(splink, splink into the water.... ker-splash as the children dive in.... laughter from the Memsahibs and Sahibs on deck....)

I say, Sidney.. no sharks are there?

Not many, ma'am... some chap named.. ah.. Fanning took them all on.. and won it seems!  Look, though - there's a big one!

Genghis Khan.
Vidkun Quisling

Not necessarily in that order.

John_Taverner wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 6:51am:

Genghis Khan. Vidkun Quisling Not necessarily in that order.

I like Genghis Khan

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 10:40pm:

Port Out - Starboard Home - and toss a few coins to those near naked little beggars on the wharf, would you Sidney?  I do like to see them dive to the bottom for a copper or two (shades of the odd Royal Commission there), but I'm just too tired for that today, too warm, you see... must be .. what.. seventy five degrees FAHRENHEIT.... give or take one or two? Ship's Purser says only seventy four today, ma'am... we'll fix you right with a nice bath and a gin and tonic with ice... there's the go.... here you little fellaheen darkie beggars... here's some coins for you! (splink, splink into the water.... ker-splash as the children dive in.... laughter from the Memsahibs and Sahibs on deck....) I say, Sidney.. no sharks are there? Not many, ma'am... some chap named.. ah.. Fanning took them all on.. and won it seems!  Look, though - there's a big one!

You've got a great sense of humour Grappler and I admire the way you put it into words.

bogarde73 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 1:45pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 10:40pm: You've got a great sense of humour Grappler and I admire the way you put it into words. More a twisted sense of humour I think.... many hate it... Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by gandalf on Jul 21st, 2015 at 5:48pm Eve - she robbed us all of paradise on earth  ;) Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by mothra on Jul 21st, 2015 at 5:52pm polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 21st, 2015 at 5:48pm: Eve - she robbed us all of paradise on earth  ;) Nah, blame Adam. He had a smart one to start with but he refused to let her be on top. Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by Lisa Jones on Jul 21st, 2015 at 5:57pm polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 21st, 2015 at 5:48pm: Eve - she robbed us all of paradise on earth  ;) Excuse me! Where was Adam? He should have been taking good care of his wife. Instead, he neglected her needs and trotted off elsewhere,  leaving her vulnerable. In short? Adam is the nong here. And, as a result of Adam's nongery, women everywhere now know that men are indeed class A nongs and as such, should never be fully trusted. Ever. Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by Unforgiven on Jul 21st, 2015 at 6:17pm Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 21st, 2015 at 5:57pm: polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 21st, 2015 at 5:48pm: Eve - she robbed us all of paradise on earth  ;) Excuse me! Where was Adam? He should have been taking good care of his wife. Instead, he neglected her needs and trotted off elsewhere,  leaving her vulnerable. In short? Adam is the nong here. And, as a result of Adam's nongery, women everywhere now know that men are indeed class A nongs and as such, should never be fully trusted. Ever. They didn't have lodgers in those days. In prior centuries the lodger was the means to make housewives happy. Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by gandalf on Jul 21st, 2015 at 6:25pm Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 21st, 2015 at 5:57pm: polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 21st, 2015 at 5:48pm: Eve - she robbed us all of paradise on earth  ;) Excuse me! Where was Adam? He should have been taking good care of his wife. Instead, he neglected her needs and trotted off elsewhere,  leaving her vulnerable. In short? Adam is the nong here. And, as a result of Adam's nongery, women everywhere now know that men are indeed class A nongs and as such, should never be fully trusted. Ever. Funny thing is, I started to type Adam, but then remembered the biblical version. Genesis is in no doubt as to who was really to blame. And as punishment women now have the agony of child birth  :P The Quranic version on the other hand blames Adam. Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by mothra on Jul 21st, 2015 at 6:29pm Is Lilith in the Quranic version Gandy? Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by The Grappler on Jul 21st, 2015 at 10:12pm Only a woman could organise the whole gig, rob the bank of apples, side track the police onto a snake, and then have a man do the time for the crime.... **God arrives in the Garden of Eden** "Evie.. Adam, mah man - where you all hiding?" Eve comes running out teary-eyed... "Oh Poppa - Adam's been treating me bad, drinking and chasing other women..." "Other... women?  ??  ??" "Yeah, well, you know he's THINKING about it... anyway - he went and pinched one of those big juicy apples you said to leave alone.  And there was this snake with him..." "Oh, Lord!  I KNEW that boy would end up no good!  Running with that snake now.  Well - I'll soon fix that!  You just wait here, little darling, and dry up them tears - I'll be right back!" Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by mothra on Jul 21st, 2015 at 10:38pm Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Jul 21st, 2015 at 10:12pm: Only a woman could organise the whole gig, rob the bank of apples, side track the police onto a snake, and then have a man do the time for the crime.... **God arrives in the Garden of Eden** "Evie.. Adam, mah man - where you all hiding?" Eve comes running out teary-eyed... "Oh Poppa - Adam's been treating me bad, drinking and chasing other women..." "Other... women?  ??  ??" "Yeah, well, you know he's THINKING about it... anyway - he went and pinched one of those big juicy apples you said to leave alone.  And there was this snake with him..." "Oh, Lord!  I KNEW that boy would end up no good!  Running with that snake now.  Well - I'll soon fix that!  You just wait here, little darling, and dry up them tears - I'll be right back!" I'm telling you, Eve was an idiot but what do you expect? She was made to follow orders. Lilith on the other hand never would have fallen for it. Humankind is damned because Adam didn't want an equal. Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by Lisa Jones on Jul 21st, 2015 at 10:41pm Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Jul 21st, 2015 at 10:12pm: Only a woman could organise the whole gig, rob the bank of apples, side track the police onto a snake, and then have a man do the time for the crime.... **God arrives in the Garden of Eden** "Evie.. Adam, mah man - where you all hiding?" Eve comes running out teary-eyed... "Oh Poppa - Adam's been treating me bad, drinking and chasing other women..." "Other... women?  ??  ??" "Yeah, well, you know he's THINKING about it... anyway - he went and pinched one of those big juicy apples you said to leave alone.  And there was this snake with him..." "Oh, Lord!  I KNEW that boy would end up no good!  Running with that snake now.  Well - I'll soon fix that!  You just wait here, little darling, and dry up them tears - I'll be right back!" You've clearly never read the Holy Bible. Pity. Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by mothra on Jul 21st, 2015 at 10:58pm I've read the Bible. Eve was an idiot. Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by Sprintcyclist on Jul 22nd, 2015 at 8:01am moh is the most hated person in history. Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by ImSpartacus2 on Jul 22nd, 2015 at 8:06am Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 22nd, 2015 at 8:01am: moh is the most hated person in history. You can wish it as much as you want but it's just no so.    Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by Sprintcyclist on Jul 22nd, 2015 at 8:10am how many billions have muslims mudered while citing the koran ? Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by ImSpartacus2 on Jul 22nd, 2015 at 8:24am Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 22nd, 2015 at 8:10am: how many billions have muslims mudered while citing the koran ? How many billions did christians murder whilst citing the bible.  I tell you what, you want to inform yourself about barbarism.  Go on wikipedia and read about the invasion of South America by the conquistadors who, in addition to enriching themselves, were on a mission to bring "the true religion" to the natives. Christianity is older and bigger then islam and consequently has done more harm for longer.     Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by Stratos on Jul 22nd, 2015 at 8:32am A billion is a lot of people, and I highly doubt any one cause would come close. So in answer to: Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 22nd, 2015 at 8:10am: how many billions have muslims mudered while citing the koran ? I guess the answer is probably zero billions ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 22nd, 2015 at 8:24am: How many billions did christians murder whilst citing the bible. Also probably zero billions. Title: Re: The most hated people in history Post by ImSpartacus2 on Jul 22nd, 2015 at 9:06am Stratos wrote on Jul 22nd, 2015 at 8:32am: A billion is a lot of people, and I highly doubt any one cause would come close. So in answer to: Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 22nd, 2015 at 8:10am: how many billions have muslims mudered while citing the koran ? I guess the answer is probably zero billions ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 22nd, 2015 at 8:24am: How many billions did christians murder whilst citing the bible. Also probably zero billions. Yes I take your point but it wasn't the number so much as the comparison I was seeking to make.    Australian Politics Forum » Powered by YaBB 2.5.2! YaBB Forum Software © 2000-2024. All Rights Reserved.