Can anyone explain it?

Ajax wrote on Sep 12^th, 2015 at 1:41pm:

Can anyone explain it?

Because man created him -

we made it up!

Who cares about some non-existent person? Fairy stories!

Maybe he didn't like his birth family too much...

I'm used to him being referred to as the "son of god".  Can you site the reference where he called himself the son of man. I'm not saying its not there, I just can't remember it. 

Dissociative Identity Disorder

Ajax wrote on Sep 12^th, 2015 at 1:41pm:

Can anyone explain it?

In the Gospels the title occurs eighty-one times. Most of the recent writers (among them being II. Lietzmann) have come to the conclusion that Jesus, speaking Aramaic, could never have designated himself as the "son of man" in a Messianic, mystic sense, because the Aramaic term never implied this meaning. Greek translators coined the phrase, which then led, under the influence of Dan. vii. 13 and the Logos gospel, to the theological construction of the title which is basic to the Christology of the Church. To this construction reference is made in Abbahu's controversial saying in Ta'an. 65b. Indeed, examination of many of the passages shows that in the mouth of Jesus the term was an equivalent for the personal pronoun "I."
http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/13913-son-of-man

It is a Greek rendering of an Aramaic personal pronoun.

Bobby. wrote on Sep 12^th, 2015 at 2:23pm:

Ajax wrote on Sep 12th, 2015 at 1:41pm: Can anyone explain it? Because man created him - we made it up!

Yes, some people behave themselves when they're threatened with hellfire forever more, others act like r soles all their lives and beg forgiveness at the last minute ( if they're lucky to have prior warning of coming death).

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Sep 12^th, 2015 at 5:50pm:

Yes, some people behave themselves when they're threatened with hellfire forever more, others act like r soles all their lives and beg forgiveness at the last minute ( if they're lucky to have prior warning of coming death).

I'm sure all those pedo priests will be grateful for your views

ohh, you forgot to add that some people (in fact the majority) behave themselves regardless of what it says i the bible.

Johnsmith wrote on Sep 12^th, 2015 at 5:56pm:

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Sep 12th, 2015 at 5:50pm: Yes, some people behave themselves when they're threatened with hellfire forever more, others act like r soles all their lives and beg forgiveness at the last minute ( if they're lucky to have prior warning of coming death). I'm sure all those pedo priests will be grateful for your views ohh, you forgot to add that some people (in fact the majority) behave themselves regardless of what it says i the bible.

The thick fog of stupid is rising rapidly, once again....

Soren wrote on Sep 12^th, 2015 at 6:38pm:

Johnsmith wrote on Sep 12th, 2015 at 5:56pm: Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Sep 12th, 2015 at 5:50pm: Yes, some people behave themselves when they're threatened with hellfire forever more, others act like r soles all their lives and beg forgiveness at the last minute ( if they're lucky to have prior warning of coming death). I'm sure all those pedo priests will be grateful for your views ohh, you forgot to add that some people (in fact the majority) behave themselves regardless of what it says i the bible. The thick fog of stupid is rising rapidly, once again....

then lay down and go back to sleep ... afterall,  no one told you to rise.

Ajax wrote on Sep 12^th, 2015 at 1:41pm:

Can anyone explain it?

Because he *was a son of man.

Let's not go into this tired old debate about whether he did or did not exist. Because, evidently, Jesus was nothing more than a concept of some Jew's imagination that he allowed to embellished into public life.

1700 years after the establishment of Christianity to be the official religion, we still have nut jobs about the place that consider him an actual person. Unfortunately, we don't have enough people out there that want to oppose religion as a meddling part of our life. But, fortunately, we do have enough people that go about their lives, living in tolerant ways, to be able to keep the religious fanatics in check.

I try and convince people that there was no Jesus. But to the obstinate the do not listen to what I say, I just let them believe what they want to believe. Even if it means believing in imaginary friends.

Johnsmith wrote on Sep 12^th, 2015 at 5:56pm:

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Sep 12th, 2015 at 5:50pm: Yes, some people behave themselves when they're threatened with hellfire forever more, others act like r soles all their lives and beg forgiveness at the last minute ( if they're lucky to have prior warning of coming death). I'm sure all those pedo priests will be grateful for your views ohh, you forgot to add that some people (in fact the majority) behave themselves regardless of what it says i the bible.

You are quite right john smith but in days of old, the emperors and rulers needed a way to prevent anarchy and wars so they wrote that book and just kept adding to it over the centuries.

Phemanderac wrote on Sep 12^th, 2015 at 2:54pm:

Maybe he didn't like his birth family too much...

For an alleged person to be alleging he is the son of Mr Man in the sky, he sure spent a lot of time around his birth parents. Did not wading through water, and making people believe in satiating their diets with fish sandwiches convince him that he was too good for Mary and Jo?

Jesus was a man, born of woman.

As we all are.       .....except you girls of course.


Matthew 20:28
Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.


Hebrews 2:5
For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak.
6  But one in a certain place testified, saying, What is man, that thou art mindful of him? or the son of man, that thou visitest him?
7  Thou madest him a little lower than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands:
8  Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him.
9  But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.


Hebrews 2:14
Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
15  And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.
16  For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.
17  Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.
18  For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.


1 John 5:6
This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.

Soren wrote on Sep 12^th, 2015 at 4:05pm:

Ajax wrote on Sep 12th, 2015 at 1:41pm: Can anyone explain it? In the Gospels the title occurs eighty-one times. Most of the recent writers (among them being II. Lietzmann) have come to the conclusion that Jesus, speaking Aramaic, could never have designated himself as the "son of man" in a Messianic, mystic sense, because the Aramaic term never implied this meaning. Greek translators coined the phrase, which then led, under the influence of Dan. vii. 13 and the Logos gospel, to the theological construction of the title which is basic to the Christology of the Church. To this construction reference is made in Abbahu's controversial saying in Ta'an. 65b. Indeed, examination of many of the passages shows that in the mouth of Jesus the term was an equivalent for the personal pronoun "I." http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/13913-son-of-man It is a Greek rendering of an Aramaic personal pronoun.

Correct!

Good work!

Does that mean he claimed to be his own son?

So sad for the Jesus Knockers.
So much knowlege to be gained.

But as jesus said "there are none so blind as those who will not see"

Jesus was born into a very very highly developed spiritual community.
If you watched the movie "last samurai" it appears that the "community" jesus was born into functioned at this sort of level of "ego death".

Jesus went into the desert for 40 days before he started his teaching.
It would appear that he reached "spiritual enlightenment" in the desert.

This is similar to the spiritual enlightenment reached by the budddha who also sat under the tree for many days until he was enlightened.

The enlightenment process  (which i do some work on and have had the very tiniest of glimpses of) is probably the only journey in life worth taking.

I love to study the teaching of jesus.

Enlightenment is a search for the truth and i believe jesus preached the truth.
Jesus had killed off his ego.
This is a scarey thing, and most people  will not be able to become enlightened because they are not willing to do the hard work associated with ego death.

One must "unplug" from the mattrix (which both jesus and the buddha did).

If you are attached to "yourself" and "your thoughts" you cannot get there.
No one can give it to you, not a priest or a guru or a scientist or a professor.
And the enlightenment jesus attained cannot be communicated in thought .
This is the whole problem with organised religion.
That people think they can become enlightened by thinking about it.

No, No, No

it can only be experienced.

both jesus and the buddha have constructed an awesome highway to drive down to reach enlightenment but you still have to go on the journey "by yourself"

Those who criticize jesus, i see as people who have decided to go on lifes journy, not driving down this highway , but , instead, hacking through the undergrowth and clawing thorough the dirt on their hands and knees.

Get in touch with jesus.
It will change your life, whether you are a christian or not, he was possibly one of the most spiritually divine people to ever live.
Only your own ego defence prevents you from seeing this and if this is the case, your life will be fairly mediocre

Thanks to all, from the very obvious to the inquisitive to the non believers to the educational to the enlightened.

In the Greek Orthodox Religion (GOR) he refers to himself as the son of man to show that he was truly a human being as well as a Devine entity.

Also in the GOR when everyone dies from murderers to the most enlightened they first go before God before going to where ever it is they are meant to go.

Hypothetically I always pictured it this way, once you die and go before God, if you had great sins and the devil was waiting for your soul you could no longer say to God,

How would you know what its like to be human you are God.

I guess no one can use that excuse anymore.

Well that's my 2 cents worth.


Quote:

Let us now look a bit at the human nature of Christ. We must first emphasize that He is the Son and Word of God made man. St. John clearly tells us, “The Word was made flesh” (John, I:14). St. Paul tells us, that the Incarnate Word is in all things like us human beings, with a soul, body, rationality uncorrupted passion, hunger, thirst, fatigue, etc. “similar in all things to us” but “without sin” (Hebrews, 4:15). Christ Himself calls Himself “the Son of Man,” in this way declaring that He is perfect man. He also acknowledges that He is descended from David. In the Epistle to the Hebrews (2:10-15), St. Paul tells us, among other things, “since therefore the children share in flesh and blood, He Himself likewise partook of the same nature, that through death He might destroy him who had dominion over death, that is the Devil, and deliver all those who through fear of death were subject to lifelong bondage.” Since human beings are comprised of flesh and blood, so likewise the Son and Word of God assumed the same elements. St. Paul tells us further that Christ assumed flesh and blood so that by His death as man, He could defeat the Devil, who has the power of death; so that He could destroy death, “by death trampling down death.” http://www.gometropolis.org/orthodox-faith/the-incarnation-of-the-logos/the-divine-and-human-nature-of-christ/

Because he repudiated the claim of his disciples that he was the Son of God...

When he asked Peter to state who he, Jesus was, and Peter replied - "You are The Son Of God!"... Jesus replied:-  "You said it."

At another time he said he was the Son of Man - and therefore was not accepting the title of Son of God - any more than any other person was.....

Nor did he need to be any more...

Thou Art God!

aquascoot wrote on Sep 13^th, 2015 at 9:15am:

........ ........ Jesus went into the desert for 40 days before he started his teaching. It would appear that he reached "spiritual enlightenment" in the desert. This is similar to the spiritual enlightenment reached by the budddha who also sat under the tree for many days until he was enlightened. The enlightenment process  (which i do some work on and have had the very tiniest of glimpses of) is probably the only journey in life worth taking. I love to study the teaching of jesus. Enlightenment is a search for the truth and i believe jesus preached the truth. Jesus had killed off his ego. This is a scarey thing, and most people  will not be able to become enlightened because they are not willing to do the hard work associated with ego death. One must "unplug" from the mattrix (which both jesus and the buddha did). If you are attached to "yourself" and "your thoughts" you cannot get there. No one can give it to you, not a priest or a guru or a scientist or a professor. And the enlightenment jesus attained cannot be communicated in thought . This is the whole problem with organised religion. That people think they can become enlightened by thinking about it.

Thoughtful post, aquascoot.




Living in the world, day after day, defeats me.

Again, and again.

I believe that the 'arduous' nature of the world [acting upon us, acting upon our psyche, and we engaging with all of our desires in this world] was intended to do this.     [i.e. the purpose of this world is to defeat us!]

'Unplugging' from the 'mattrix' seems [to me] to be unattainable to almost all men and women.



This life, the journey, the trials we all must undergo here, simply ['in the end'] reveal to our creator [and to ourself!!], who and what we are.

Enlightenment is not our [intended] end, not here [imo].

This is a place where we merely reveal who and what we are [imo].




.




Hebrews 9:27
......it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:



I believe this ------- >

Matthew 13:47
Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net, that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind:
48  Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away.
49  So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just,
50  And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.


Luke 3:8
Bring forth therefore fruits worthy of repentance, and begin not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, That God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.
9  And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: every tree therefore which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

Sitting looking at your navel for days on end brings enlightenment?  :D :D :D Brings on hallucinations more like!

But who said he did?
Don't the things he is supposed to have said mostly come from written statements made long after he was dead, sometimes decades or longer?

bogarde73 wrote on Sep 14^th, 2015 at 3:36pm:

But who said he did? Don't the things he is supposed to have said mostly come from written statements made long after he was dead, sometimes decades or longer?

yes, i believe the first gospels were written 30 yrs after Jesus died...

could you imagine how much of it would be right if 30 yrs from now we start telling people what you said today? Keep in mind it was all word of mouth, no googling.

Plus the fact they were translated out of Aramaic (?) into Greek into Latin.
Have you seen some of the translations Google does?

Jovial Monk wrote on Sep 14^th, 2015 at 6:52am:

Sitting looking at your navel for days on end brings enlightenment?  :D :D :D Brings on hallucinations more like!

someones ego defence mechanism is determined to preserve the ego at all costs.  this stuff isnt easy  ;)

Nah, it is all physiological.