If we are going ahead with the referendum, they should take the opportunity to close the constitutional loophole that allows whatever party gets control of the senate after a double dissolution election to grant themselves extra seats.

https://www.ozpolitic.com/electoral-reform/broken-promises-stolen-senate-seats.html

https://www.ozpolitic.com/electoral-reform/electoral-fraud-bipartisan-support-senators.html

Hear, hear .....

Of course, when mutual benefit is available, bi-partisan support is endless....

Please contact your local rep and senators and put the suggestion to them:


Quote:

https://www.aph.gov.au/Senators_and_Members/Guidelines_for_Contacting_Senators_and_Members

OP......

Electoral/parliamentary reform in Australia ?          Dracula.....blood bank.



'Tell him he's dreaming!'


.


A bureaucrat is said to oppose any change, except that which increases his own power.
- ???

freediver wrote on Aug 10^th, 2022 at 12:44pm:

If we are going ahead with the referendum, they should take the opportunity to close the constitutional loophole that allows whatever party gets control of the senate after a double dissolution election to grant themselves extra seats. https://www.ozpolitic.com/electoral-reform/broken-promises-stolen-senate-seats.html https://www.ozpolitic.com/electoral-reform/electoral-fraud-bipartisan-support-senators.html

Leeetle bit obscure and... er... peripheral.

It changes the election outcome.

freediver wrote on Aug 11^th, 2022 at 8:53pm:

It changes the election outcome.

Meh...

Not really.

An example of the type of political reform in Australia which i would like to see....

If any Federal government can't balance its [our] budget, then    retired    politicians [at that time] will only be entitled to the [exact] same pension payments as other Australians.



p.s.
'Tell him he's dreaming!'

;D

Frank wrote on Aug 11^th, 2022 at 9:02pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 11th, 2022 at 8:53pm: It changes the election outcome. Meh... Not really.

It changes the number of seats held by different groups. It can change the balance of power in the Senate, and what legislation is able to be passed.

Yadda wrote on Aug 11^th, 2022 at 9:09pm:

If any Federal government can't balance its [our] budget, then    retired    politicians [at that time] will only be entitled to the [exact] same pension payments as other Australians.

i.e.
In those circumstances, retired politicians should be entitled to [the calculation of the] super contributions which they themselves have paid in.

But not entitled to the top-up super contributions which were paid in by their employer, i.e. contributions from the taxpayer.

Yadda wrote on Aug 11^th, 2022 at 9:22pm:

Yadda wrote on Aug 11th, 2022 at 9:09pm: If any Federal government can't balance its [our] budget, then    retired    politicians [at that time] will only be entitled to the [exact] same pension payments as other Australians. i.e. In those circumstances, retired politicians should be entitled to [the calculation of the] super contributions which they themselves have paid in. But not entitled to the top-up super contributions which were paid in by their employer, i.e. contributions from the taxpayer.

Yes - put 'em on the same as everyone else... I worked for the CPS and it was dollar for dollar.... going through recruitment right now, at age 73, to save their arses again when the spoiler hits the fan in Europe and the Asia Pacific Basin and they're gonna need all the help they can get ...... as looks likely... this time I expect a bit of tit-for-tat for saving their arses as I've done all my life....

freediver wrote on Aug 11^th, 2022 at 9:16pm:

Frank wrote on Aug 11th, 2022 at 9:02pm: freediver wrote on Aug 11th, 2022 at 8:53pm: It changes the election outcome. Meh... Not really. It changes the number of seats held by different groups. It can change the balance of power in the Senate, and what legislation is able to be passed.

Yes - and so wrong..... on all fronts...

The ALP and UAP were the only parties to get back to me on this. The UAP seemed interested.

The ALP did their best to insist it was too late to add any other questions to the referendum (BS, they are basically back to the drawing board on "the voice"), but kept saying it might happen in the future if more work is done. In particular, they seem to think more consultation is needed, even though it has been written into (non-binding) legislation already and both major parties have repeatedly made public commitments to it.

All the details are already sorted out and agreed with pretty much unanimous support. The ALP just wants to be able to take advantage of the current situation to steal more senate seats.

Just got another feeble excuse from Labor - they do not need to fix this problem because one day they will make Australia a republic. Not sure what they plan to do with the Senate if we do become a republic, or when they plan to make it happen.

Still no response from the other parties.

freediver wrote on Aug 15^th, 2022 at 6:26pm:

The ALP and UAP were the only parties to get back to me on this. The UAP seemed interested. The ALP did their best to insist it was too late to add any other questions to the referendum (BS, they are basically back to the drawing board on "the voice"), but kept saying it might happen in the future if more work is done. In particular, they seem to think more consultation is needed, even though it has been written into (non-binding) legislation already and both major parties have repeatedly made public commitments to it. All the details are already sorted out and agreed with pretty much unanimous support. The ALP just wants to be able to take advantage of the current situation to steal more senate seats.

I'd take any interest from Palmers UAP with a grain of salt.

Palmer & Craig Kelly?  ;D ;D Pair of self serving clowns.

UAP didn't win any seats in the lower house last election.

UAP candidate Ralph Babet picked up Victoria’s sixth Senate seat – thanks to preferences from the LNP.

That's all Palmer got for his obscene campaign spending of $100 million.

UAP leader Craig Kelly lost his seat of Hughes, and Palmer failed in his bid for a Queensland Senate seat. ;D

1 Senator - why would you waste the effort sending them any correspondence?

freediver wrote on Aug 30^th, 2022 at 6:46am:

Just got another feeble excuse from Labor - they do not need to fix this problem because one day they will make Australia a republic. Not sure what they plan to do with the Senate if we do become a republic, or when they plan to make it happen.

That truly is a pathetic response.

Who sent you the response? Peter Fitzsimons?

Quote:

1 Senator - why would you waste the effort sending them any correspondence?

All it takes is 1.

A hung Parliment is better.
"Hang em High"
...it might force them to 'work together' for once.

freediver wrote on Aug 30^th, 2022 at 6:46am:

Just got another feeble excuse from Labor - they do not need to fix this problem because one day they will make Australia a republic. Not sure what they plan to do with the Senate if we do become a republic, or when they plan to make it happen. Still no response from the other parties.

And how do you suppose they will do that?
The Aborigines won't be happy about some USURPER Republic displacing this country being returned to them when the USA voids and the British capitulate here.

Wanna Republic? Well the price to pay for it will be BLOOD.
...and who's blood does the ALP think they will sacrifice for it?

Labor got back to me again, to reassure me that:

1) They have no intention to steal senate seats. No explanation of why they stole them last time and why we should believe they won't keep doing it. Or even any acknowledgement that Labor stealing senate seats is a reality.

2) There is no prospect of a DD election in the short term - not sure how they can predict this either, given that they only hold 26 of the 76 Senate seats, and even with the Greens do not hold a majority.

3) There is still time to find other ways to allocate senate seats after a DD election - again, no explanation of what is wrong with the method that they have already publicly committed themselves to on multiple occasions, other than the fact that they keep breaking their promises and refuse to write it into the constitution.

ALP & NLP (Blue collars and White Collars - both = 'workers')
are just a fart-version of the American North/South (neither East or West).

Both ALP & NLP will fizz out in under 30 years.
They won't have the power in a few decades to make these big decisions anymore.

Both will be caught in bed together having Politically Correct  Homosex while dressed in Media Women's clothes.

Say no to drugs Jasin.

freediver wrote on Sep 3^rd, 2022 at 8:56pm:

Say no to drugs Jasin.

America - the conquest of space (across an ocean)
Australia - the conquest of time (in a 40,000 year prison)

Not my fault the future is plain to see and you're still stuck at the End of the World for America. ;)

Btw - Australia will fracture into many 'independent' nations.
How's that for you FD? ;)

PS: I'm the one member you'll never catch FD. ;)
Night.

Far out, man.

freediver wrote on Sep 3^rd, 2022 at 9:17pm:

Far out, man.

Sometimes JaSin sounds like Dennis Hopper:


https://www.bitchute.com/video/3QXuh2t5tKsv/

FD has plans for you Bobby.
He is clear in his mind.
But his soul is mad.

Jasin wrote on Sep 4^th, 2022 at 2:53am:

FD has plans for you Bobby. He is clear in his mind. But his soul is mad.

What are they gunna say?
That he was wise man?
that he was a brave man?
that he had plans?
that he had wisdom?

Bobby. wrote on Sep 4^th, 2022 at 6:49am:

Jasin wrote on Sep 4th, 2022 at 2:53am: FD has plans for you Bobby. He is clear in his mind. But his soul is mad. What are they gunna say? That he was wise man? that he was a brave man? that he had plans? that he had wisdom?

;D

Jasin wrote on Sep 4^th, 2022 at 8:35am:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 4th, 2022 at 6:49am: Jasin wrote on Sep 4th, 2022 at 2:53am: FD has plans for you Bobby. He is clear in his mind. But his soul is mad. What are they gunna say? That he was wise man? that he was a brave man? that he had plans? that he had wisdom? ;D

Am I gunna be the one to set him straight?

Look at me wrong.


https://www.bitchute.com/video/3QXuh2t5tKsv/

Jasin wrote on Sep 3^rd, 2022 at 9:08pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 3rd, 2022 at 8:56pm: Say no to drugs Jasin. America - the conquest of space (across an ocean) Australia - the conquest of time (in a 40,000 year prison) Not my fault the future is plain to see and you're still stuck at the End of the World for America. ;) Btw - Australia will fracture into many 'independent' nations. How's that for you FD? ;)

A House divided against itself cannot stand - clearly that is the full aim and intention of New International Labor.... that Australia must fall.....

"...... and so it came to pass, in the year 2027, the the Old Abo South passed away forever..... remember it only in Pascoe's books of wild fantasy and in fiction ... for it is a life and times, a civilisation..... Gone With The Wind........

....as the seemingly endless lists of casualties from the battle of Maccasburgers were posted on the post office wall.... amidst the wailing of the Aboriginal women and children left alone...... Yothu Yindi struck up the anthem Solid Rock ........"

Australia Has Fallen

starring Gerard Butler

A Grappler Studios Production

........ coming soon to a theatre near you .......................

It's more a case Grapps.
That American Politics 'rises' from the weak many States into a 'One God' individual President as the empowerment.

Australia on the other hand, is the weak individual PM on behalf of the international arena - specifically being a 'deputy' for the USA. 'Falling' down through the States into Provincials into many independent nations of their own.
The empowerment of the 'many'.

USA = President, individual
Aust = Nations, the mass

Bobby. wrote on Sep 4^th, 2022 at 3:42pm:

Jasin wrote on Sep 4th, 2022 at 8:35am: Bobby. wrote on Sep 4th, 2022 at 6:49am: Jasin wrote on Sep 4th, 2022 at 2:53am: FD has plans for you Bobby. He is clear in his mind. But his soul is mad. What are they gunna say? That he was wise man? that he was a brave man? that he had plans? that he had wisdom? ;D Am I gunna be the one to set him straight? Look at me wrong. https://www.bitchute.com/video/3QXuh2t5tKsv/

FD has plans for you Bobby. ;)

freediver wrote on Aug 10^th, 2022 at 12:44pm:

If we are going ahead with the referendum, they should take the opportunity to close the constitutional loophole that allows whatever party gets control of the senate after a double dissolution election to grant themselves extra seats. https://www.ozpolitic.com/electoral-reform/broken-promises-stolen-senate-seats.html https://www.ozpolitic.com/electoral-reform/electoral-fraud-bipartisan-support-senators.html

I'd like a referendum on the idea of votes being weighted by IQ.  The right wing would disappear overnight.  The alternative is a quiz that denies people the vote if they believe right wing conspiracy theories

Yardle Award Contender - sadly in our form of democracy even the abysmally stupid and craven can vote on equal terms..... IQ is a false measure of true intelligence....

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 9:20am:

Yardle Award Contender - sadly in our form of democracy even the abysmally stupid and craven can vote on equal terms..... IQ is a false measure of true intelligence....

IQ is not perfect but it would have the same effect.  Why should the future of my country be decided in part by people who think vaccines kill and there's kids kidnapped in tunnels?

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 9:31am:

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 9:20am: Yardle Award Contender - sadly in our form of democracy even the abysmally stupid and craven can vote on equal terms..... IQ is a false measure of true intelligence.... IQ is not perfect but it would have the same effect.  Why should the future of my country be decided in part by people who think vaccines kill and there's kids kidnapped in tunnels?

... or by people who imagine that changing the constitution to offer some inside running to a minority group of one sort only will actually make any positive difference to this nation or to the real problems of that group and will result in anything more than encouraging them to go for more and more endlessly, or that acceding to every wish of a religious minority will somehow keep the lid on any extremism from that group......

Most people just walk on by when the anti-vaccers get on their band wagon, and what's the story on these kids kidnapped in tunnels?  Haven't heard that theory....

Is that some new fantastic theory?

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 9:38am:

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 9:31am: Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 9:20am: Yardle Award Contender - sadly in our form of democracy even the abysmally stupid and craven can vote on equal terms..... IQ is a false measure of true intelligence.... IQ is not perfect but it would have the same effect.  Why should the future of my country be decided in part by people who think vaccines kill and there's kids kidnapped in tunnels? ... or by people who imagine that changing the constitution to offer some inside running to a minority group of one sort only will actually make any positive difference to this nation or to the real problems of that group and will result in anything more than encouraging them to go for more and more endlessly, or that acceding to every wish of a religious minority will somehow keep the lid on any extremism from that group...... Most people just walk on by when the anti-vaccers get on their band wagon, and what's the story on these kids kidnapped in tunnels?  Haven't heard that theory.... Is that some new fantastic theory?

You've not heard of Q Anon? But you're far right? HAHAHAHAA!!!

I'll ignore the racist BS.  Yes, we're making society better.  Cry.

What religious minority is being pandered to, if not Christians? HAHAHAHAA!!!!

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 9:43am:

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 9:38am: FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 9:31am: Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 9:20am: Yardle Award Contender - sadly in our form of democracy even the abysmally stupid and craven can vote on equal terms..... IQ is a false measure of true intelligence.... IQ is not perfect but it would have the same effect.  Why should the future of my country be decided in part by people who think vaccines kill and there's kids kidnapped in tunnels? ... or by people who imagine that changing the constitution to offer some inside running to a minority group of one sort only will actually make any positive difference to this nation or to the real problems of that group and will result in anything more than encouraging them to go for more and more endlessly, or that acceding to every wish of a religious minority will somehow keep the lid on any extremism from that group...... Most people just walk on by when the anti-vaccers get on their band wagon, and what's the story on these kids kidnapped in tunnels?  Haven't heard that theory.... Is that some new fantastic theory? You've not heard of Q Anon? But you're far right? HAHAHAHAA!!! I'll ignore the racist BS.  Yes, we're making society better.  Cry. What religious minority is being pandered to, if not Christians? HAHAHAHAA!!!!

Total delusion....... HAHAHAHAHAA!!!

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 9:48am:

Total delusion....... HAHAHAHAHAA!!!

This must be the fabled debating ability of the right wing. Why would I care about being banned from a group where those who oppose me cannot prove me wrong, or explain why they believe the nonsense they do?

Who gets more special treatment in this country than Christians? Muslims? Because we allow them to what? Live here without being threatened too often?

Just like arbitrarily labeling anyone with a different view as 'extreme right' and a Fascist... well, well... that boot on the other foot hurts, eh?

What preferential treatment do Christians get?  I mean - they are the majority religious group here and have been for centuries, so where are there, for example, 'other' schools that do not receive funding etc?

Give us some clear examples..... empty words are meaningless and are the province of the extremist desperately seeking to dance outside the circle of reality so that he/she doesn't get burned by the fire of truth around which all others gather...

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 10:01am:

Just like arbitrarily labeling anyone with a different view as 'extreme right' and a Fascist... well, well... that boot on the other foot hurts, eh? What preferential treatment do Christians get?  I mean - they are the majority religious group here and have been for centuries, so where are there, for example, 'other' schools that do not receive funding etc? Give us some clear examples..... empty words are meaningless and are the province of the extremist desperately seeking to dance outside the circle of reality so that he/she doesn't get burned by the fire of truth around which all others gather...

What I love most is that SOMEONE must have called you a fascist, because I'm not saying that :)

They are not the majority any more but they've had plenty of free passes, free land, etc.  No other religious group comes close.

The defence of Pell after he raped children was a clear example of the church being untouchable in this country.  All the money that Christian schools get from taxpayers to teach kids hate is another.  My son went to a Catholic school and I was only told later all the ignorant poo they were told

Well they have been here the longest - the wondering/wandering little groups had no real society to speak of and thus all those things naturally accrued to the developing majority.

You called me 'extreme right' - showing that you have little connection with reality.... lovely to watch your constantly self-destruct while trying desperately to push some mythical barrow.

What was that about kids in tunnels? 

Pell didn't rape children.... his offence was in a different category, and he should have taken action against perverts, but he didn't personally rape them, unless you are speaking of rights, the rape of rights is a very pervasive area - and one which I doubt you want to enter.

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 10:15am:

Well they have been here the longest - the wondering/wandering little groups had no real society to speak of and thus all those things naturally accrued to the developing majority. You called me 'extreme right' - showing that you have little connection with reality.... lovely to watch your constantly self-destruct while trying desperately to push some mythical barrow. What was that about kids in tunnels?  Pell didn't rape children.... his offence was in a different category, and he should have taken action against perverts, but he didn't personally rape them, unless you are speaking of rights, the rape of rights is a very pervasive area - and one which I doubt you want to enter.

In fact they had rich societies.  You confuse the ones who live in the desert (because it's all we left them) with all of them

You have never seen me self destruct.  You have cried and run from debate.  LOL!!!

Q Anon.

"Pell, who is on leave from his role in Rome as Vatican treasurer, was found guilty of sexually penetrating a child under the age of 16 "

First google hit

Course they did - kangaroo on the barbie, all the yams they could eat.... peace and tranquility all through the land..... zero cannibalism ... sharing everything in true brotherly love ...... short lifespan ... massive child mortality ...

You were there, I take it?  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D

I love a daily dose of ideologue...

You..... errr... got any references for that?

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 12:01pm:

Course they did - kangaroo on the barbie, all the yams they could eat.... peace and tranquility all through the land..... zero cannibalism ... sharing everything in true brotherly love ...... short lifespan ... massive child mortality ... You were there, I take it?  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D I love a daily dose of ideologue... You..... errr... got any references for that?

It would involve books, which you despise.  Of course they were not cannibals.  Of course they had similar infant mortality to the west at the time, I would expect..../.

The average lifespan in the west was what, 40, at the time? Mostly due to child mortality

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 9:15am:

freediver wrote on Aug 10th, 2022 at 12:44pm: If we are going ahead with the referendum, they should take the opportunity to close the constitutional loophole that allows whatever party gets control of the senate after a double dissolution election to grant themselves extra seats. https://www.ozpolitic.com/electoral-reform/broken-promises-stolen-senate-seats.html https://www.ozpolitic.com/electoral-reform/electoral-fraud-bipartisan-support-senators.html I'd like a referendum on the idea of votes being weighted by IQ.  The right wing would disappear overnight.  The alternative is a quiz that denies people the vote if they believe right wing conspiracy theories

No-one is surprised by your eagerness to disenfranchise people. You would have us ruled by the CCP in no time.

freediver wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 1:03pm:

No-one is surprised by your eagerness to disenfranchise people. You would have us ruled by the CCP in no time.

I love the right crying about China.

I don't think people with no connection to reality should vote.  If we had proper mental health services, 20% of the right would be locked up

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 1:05pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:03pm: No-one is surprised by your eagerness to disenfranchise people. You would have us ruled by the CCP in no time. I love the right crying about China. I don't think people with no connection to reality should vote.  If we had proper mental health services, 20% of the right would be locked up

Are your ideas for putting a large chunk of the population behind bars for their own good inspired by the CCP?

It's kind of ironic that someone with ideas as loony as yours is saying these things.

freediver wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 1:10pm:

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:05pm: freediver wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:03pm: No-one is surprised by your eagerness to disenfranchise people. You would have us ruled by the CCP in no time. I love the right crying about China. I don't think people with no connection to reality should vote.  If we had proper mental health services, 20% of the right would be locked up Are your ideas for putting a large chunk of the population behind bars for their own good inspired by the CCP? It's kind of ironic that someone with ideas as loony as yours is saying these things.

It's weird how you can't read English

The far right think there's kids in tunnels, vaccines kill people and Trump won.  These are delusions that prevent them functioning in society and they should be in some sort of assisted living facility

Please list my loony ideas, in contrast to all the times you've run from debating me?

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 1:11pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:10pm: FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:05pm: freediver wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:03pm: No-one is surprised by your eagerness to disenfranchise people. You would have us ruled by the CCP in no time. I love the right crying about China. I don't think people with no connection to reality should vote.  If we had proper mental health services, 20% of the right would be locked up Are your ideas for putting a large chunk of the population behind bars for their own good inspired by the CCP? It's kind of ironic that someone with ideas as loony as yours is saying these things. It's weird how you can't read English The far right think there's kids in tunnels, vaccines kill people and Trump won.  These are delusions that prevent them functioning in society and they should be in some sort of assisted living facility Please list my loony ideas, in contrast to all the times you've run from debating me?

Denying people the right to vote because you don't like what they think.

Like I said, it is no surprise. You have been ranting against democracy in your efforts to support the CCP.

freediver wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 1:13pm:

Denying people the right to vote because you don't like what they think. Like I said, it is no surprise. You have been ranting against democracy in your efforts to support the CCP.

I can't tell if you are illiterate or lying.  You are certainly not responding to anything I said.  That you refuse to back your spurious claims is no surprise

Jim Crow 2.0, innit? If'n them ain;t lit-rate enuff ter read thu paper wot we gives 'em - they cain't vote sensible!!

Amazing how those who rail against the 'right' so often adhere to the philosophies of the Oppressive 'right' in their pursuit of truth, justice and the Australian Way (RIP)... the Australian Way would have been all over that arsehole with his rip off the Abos over their funeral fund nonsense, and had him cutting rocks for a new Parliament House or a new prison to house all the politicians bent...

We're gonna need a bigger Big House...

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 1:32pm:

*snip all the ignorant BS

Would you look at that!!!!

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 1:17pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:13pm: Denying people the right to vote because you don't like what they think. Like I said, it is no surprise. You have been ranting against democracy in your efforts to support the CCP. I can't tell if you are illiterate or lying.  You are certainly not responding to anything I said.  That you refuse to back your spurious claims is no surprise

You want to systematically deny people that you identify as right wing the right to vote. By locking them up. And just like the CCP, you insist it is for their own good. This is loony tunes stuff, and you do not even realise it. It's like you cannot even see daylight from where you are posting.

freediver wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 1:46pm:

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:17pm: freediver wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:13pm: Denying people the right to vote because you don't like what they think. Like I said, it is no surprise. You have been ranting against democracy in your efforts to support the CCP. I can't tell if you are illiterate or lying.  You are certainly not responding to anything I said.  That you refuse to back your spurious claims is no surprise You want to systematically deny people that you identify as right wing the right to vote. By locking them up. This is loony tunes stuff, and you do not even realise it. It's like you cannot even see daylight from where you are posting.

Look, I can see you are simple.  I didn't suggest any of this.  Keep projecting.

I suggested that people who fall for far right conspiracies like Q Anon are clearly not competent enough to vote.  And that only idiots vote to the right, I don't want to deny them a vote, just weigh it by their ability to think rationally

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 1:05pm:

I love the right crying about China. I don't think people with no connection to reality should vote.  If we had proper mental health services, 20% of the right would be locked up

Like I said, loony tunes stuff.

freediver wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 1:48pm:

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:05pm: I love the right crying about China. I don't think people with no connection to reality should vote.  If we had proper mental health services, 20% of the right would be locked up Like I said, loony tunes stuff.

"20% of the right"  Yes, that's what I said.

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 1:48pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:48pm: FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:05pm: I love the right crying about China. I don't think people with no connection to reality should vote.  If we had proper mental health services, 20% of the right would be locked up Like I said, loony tunes stuff. "20% of the right"  Yes, that's what I said.

And like I said, you do not even realise how loony it is. Or ironic.

No wonder you are such a fan of the CCP. Totally detached from reality, but you believe your own spin.

freediver wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 1:49pm:

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:48pm: freediver wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:48pm: FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:05pm: I love the right crying about China. I don't think people with no connection to reality should vote.  If we had proper mental health services, 20% of the right would be locked up Like I said, loony tunes stuff. "20% of the right"  Yes, that's what I said. And like I said, you do not even realise how loony it is. Or ironic. No wonder you are such a fan of the CCP. Totally detached from reality, but you believe your own spin.

In the first instance I've never particularly praised the CCP.  China just triggers boomer racists

In the second, I am pointing out that a portion of the right are not mentally competent and should not decide how society works.  Why is this wrong?

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 1:58pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:49pm: FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:48pm: freediver wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:48pm: FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:05pm: I love the right crying about China. I don't think people with no connection to reality should vote.  If we had proper mental health services, 20% of the right would be locked up Like I said, loony tunes stuff. "20% of the right"  Yes, that's what I said. And like I said, you do not even realise how loony it is. Or ironic. No wonder you are such a fan of the CCP. Totally detached from reality, but you believe your own spin. In the first instance I've never particularly praised the CCP.  China just triggers boomer racists In the second, I am pointing out that a portion of the right are not mentally competent and should not decide how society works.  Why is this wrong?

Nazi sympathisers don't tend to go round praising Hitler either. They have to be slightly more subtle. For example, they might start by thinking up excuses for denying people they don't like the right to vote. They don't open with gas chambers.

Are you suggesting that left wing people generally do not have a problem with the CCP starving 50 million people to death by trying to feed them? I think you are vastly overestimating the number of people who agree with you.

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 1:58pm:

In the first instance I've never particularly praised the CCP.  China just triggers boomer racists In the second, I am pointing out that a portion of the right are not mentally competent and should not decide how society works.  Why is this wrong?

If 'boomers' - by no means a contiguous group - were 'racist' - most of the newbies wouldn't even be here... we are the generation that opened the flood gates to subsumation by the Third World...... stupid, I agree... but there it is.

What factual data do you have to support the view that 20% of the 'right' (a by no means contiguous group by any means) would be mentally incompetent?

You bin readin' 'bout Young Jethro down on thet bridge playin' thet banjo to passin' canoes o' city slicker tourists again, boy?  No gits you hands off'n you sistah there an' git on down thet bridge an' tell Jethro it's his schoolin' time, an' if he don' make third grade he'll never be Town Mayor here... or Sheriff or Judge or anythung normal.....

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 2:20pm:

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 1:58pm: In the first instance I've never particularly praised the CCP.  China just triggers boomer racists In the second, I am pointing out that a portion of the right are not mentally competent and should not decide how society works.  Why is this wrong? If 'boomers' - by no means a contiguous group - were 'racist' - most of the newbies wouldn't even be here... we are the generation that opened the flood gates to subsumation by the Third World...... stupid, I agree... but there it is. What factual data do you have to support the view that 20% of the 'right' (a by no means contiguous group by any means) would be mentally incompetent? You bin readin' 'bout Young Jethro down on thet bridge playin' thet banjo to passin' canoes o' city slicker tourists again, boy?  No gits you hands off'n you sistah there an' git on down thet bridge an' tell Jethro it's his schoolin' time, an' if he don' make third grade he'll never be Town Mayor here... or Sheriff or Judge or anythung normal.....

So you're a racist. Cool.

At least 20% of the right wing scum I see believe the things I listed.  I am not suggesting 20% is a rule, the things i listed are the rule

I can't even make sense of the last brain fart you posted

Nothing racist about a fair comment on immigration..... racism is if a person says all those brought in deserve to be hated as a group....

Immigration here needs a full review and consultation with all stakeholders..... the past forty years or so under a darkening social science sky have not been very encouraging, to say the least.

I'm in favour of stopping all immigration, not just that from the turd factories of the world...... we need to stabilise and restore sanity here first before we can become the Mother Takerina of everywhere else...

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 3:37pm:

Nothing racist about a fair comment on immigration..... racism is if a person says all those brought in deserve to be hated as a group.... Immigration here needs a full review and consultation with all stakeholders..... the past forty years or so under a darkening social science sky have not been very encouraging, to say the least. I'm in favour of stopping all immigration, not just that from the turd factories of the world...... we need to stabilise and restore sanity here first before we can become the Mother Takerina of everywhere else...

Turd factories is certainly not racist, lol!!!

Grapps - stop encouraging the wanker. ::)

Jasin wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 4:29pm:

Grapps - stop encouraging the wanker. ::)

I love when y'all point out my post count and I'm just answering your bs....

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 4:43pm:

Jasin wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 4:29pm: Grapps - stop encouraging the wanker. ::) I love when y'all point out my post count and I'm just answering your bs....

Funny thing is - that's what we keep doing with you...

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 4:22pm:

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 3:37pm: Nothing racist about a fair comment on immigration..... racism is if a person says all those brought in deserve to be hated as a group.... Immigration here needs a full review and consultation with all stakeholders..... the past forty years or so under a darkening social science sky have not been very encouraging, to say the least. I'm in favour of stopping all immigration, not just that from the turd factories of the world...... we need to stabilise and restore sanity here first before we can become the Mother Takerina of everywhere else... Turd factories is certainly not racist, lol!!!

If it produces turd, it is a turd factory.... it's a nice way of saying sh1thole.

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 5:02pm:

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 4:43pm: Jasin wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 4:29pm: Grapps - stop encouraging the wanker. ::) I love when y'all point out my post count and I'm just answering your bs.... Hahahahaha!!! *Gasp* Hahahaha!!! All you've ever done is cry and run from debate. I get bans when I shame you too much Funny thing is - that's what we keep doing with you...

Funny thing is - that's what we keep doing with you...

Learn to quote, software genius etc...... 

https://media2.giphy.com/media/WdGdQrIHTDXQA/giphy.gif

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 7:21pm:

Funny thing is - that's what we keep doing with you... Learn to quote, software genius etc......  https://media2.giphy.com/media/WdGdQrIHTDXQA/giphy.gif

It's actually entertaining that you can't see what ever sane person sees, that I expose and shame you all you do is cry

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 7:56pm:

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 7:21pm: Funny thing is - that's what we keep doing with you... Learn to quote, software genius etc......  https://media2.giphy.com/media/WdGdQrIHTDXQA/giphy.gif It's actually entertaining that you can't see what ever sane person sees, that I expose and shame you all you do is cry

He needs to learn quite a few things, by the look of it.  ::)

Jasin wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 8:14pm:

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 7:56pm: Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7th, 2022 at 7:21pm: Funny thing is - that's what we keep doing with you... Learn to quote, software genius etc......  https://media2.giphy.com/media/WdGdQrIHTDXQA/giphy.gif It's actually entertaining that you can't see what ever sane person sees, that I expose and shame you all you do is cry He needs to learn quite a few things, by the look of it.  ::)

It's pathetic . Why reply when all you're going to do is cry??!

Wasn't posting to you Mr Illiterate.

Jasin wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 8:17pm:

Wasn't posting to you Mr Illiterate.

New to the internet? Cool

Anyway - I like the original idea posted here... pity we stray so far at times... too much static... white noise..... you know..

Political parties need to be brought to heel..... not more heels brought to them....

All I do is laugh..... such puerile nonsense .... tantrum ...

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 8:58pm:

Anyway - I like the original idea posted here... pity we stray so far at times... too much static... white noise..... you know.. Political parties need to be brought to heel..... not more heels brought to them.... All I do is laugh..... such puerile nonsense .... tantrum ...

Take your meds, mate. Let the pretty lady last you to bed.....

Grasping again... desperate and triggered..... got 'im!  Always his master in every move...

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 7^th, 2022 at 11:15pm:

Grasping again... desperate and triggered..... got 'im!  Always his master in every move...

You don't get it, do you? You never debate me.  If you raise a point, it's not one I made.  You are not an interesting person to debate on the internet, you're a sad lonely hateful old man.  I answer you for the same reason young boys poke an ants nest with a stick.  To enjoy their pain.

" If you raise a point, it's not one I made. "

Ego much - so you are now admitting that YOU will not debate me about anything too factual for you to handle?  If you design software, sonny - stay away from payroll and other important issues for people's lives - you'd be the kind that developed paradigms for Robodebt.

You are what I'd call a hack - as opposed to a scientifically based software engineer.

Oh - sorry - I did do a course in that as well...

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 8^th, 2022 at 8:10am:

" If you raise a point, it's not one I made. " Ego much - so you are now admitting that YOU will not debate me about anything too factual for you to handle?  If you design software, sonny - stay away from payroll and other important issues for people's lives - you'd be the kind that developed paradigms for Robodebt. You are what I'd call a hack - as opposed to a scientifically based software engineer. Oh - sorry - I did do a course in that as well...

I did in fact answer your ignorant bullshit.  It was simply not a counter to my claim, but to a claim you made up

Get your glasses checked, old man

yes, the left love Robodebt.  LOL!!!

Which particular sciences are pertinent to my software development?  What about me having morals and shaming right wing filth on the internet educates you on my knowledge of C#, SQL and Typescript?

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 8^th, 2022 at 8:27am:

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 8th, 2022 at 8:10am: " If you raise a point, it's not one I made. " Ego much - so you are now admitting that YOU will not debate me about anything too factual for you to handle?  If you design software, sonny - stay away from payroll and other important issues for people's lives - you'd be the kind that developed paradigms for Robodebt. You are what I'd call a hack - as opposed to a scientifically based software engineer. Oh - sorry - I did do a course in that as well... I did in fact answer your ignorant bullshit.  It was simply not a counter to my claim, but to a claim you made up Get your glasses checked, old man yes, the left love Robodebt.  LOL!!! Which particular sciences are pertinent to my software development?  What about me having morals and shaming right wing filth on the internet educates you on my knowledge of C#, SQL and Typescript?

Utterly missed the realities, as usual... and now we descend into the usual that will get you banned - the ad homs and personal slights in place of any valid argument..

Go back and read the links on AWE and AHW - try again, child.  If your treatment of Elders is anything to go by, and your handling of facts - you have zero morals.

You have to understand the REALITY of how any science or issue works before you can develop adequate and relevant software for it.  Easy-peasy ... you can't even work out the simple figures for AWE/Hours worked and come up with figures.... and your total unwillingness to read relevant documents speaks for itself.

Make sure you stay away from other people's money, sonny.... stick to writing kid's games....

;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D

I am your master at every step.    ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D

freediver wrote on Aug 10^th, 2022 at 12:44pm:

If we are going ahead with the referendum, they should take the opportunity to close the constitutional loophole that allows whatever party gets control of the senate after a double dissolution election to grant themselves extra seats. https://www.ozpolitic.com/electoral-reform/broken-promises-stolen-senate-seats.html https://www.ozpolitic.com/electoral-reform/electoral-fraud-bipartisan-support-senators.html

Now, infants - do you think for one moment you could actually discuss the issue raised here by Fearless Leader?  Or would you rather piss on his parade and wonder aimlessly in your personal fantasy land?

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 8^th, 2022 at 8:31am:

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 8th, 2022 at 8:27am: Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 8th, 2022 at 8:10am: " If you raise a point, it's not one I made. " Ego much - so you are now admitting that YOU will not debate me about anything too factual for you to handle?  If you design software, sonny - stay away from payroll and other important issues for people's lives - you'd be the kind that developed paradigms for Robodebt. You are what I'd call a hack - as opposed to a scientifically based software engineer. Oh - sorry - I did do a course in that as well... I did in fact answer your ignorant bullshit.  It was simply not a counter to my claim, but to a claim you made up Get your glasses checked, old man yes, the left love Robodebt.  LOL!!! Which particular sciences are pertinent to my software development?  What about me having morals and shaming right wing filth on the internet educates you on my knowledge of C#, SQL and Typescript? Utterly missed the realities, as usual... and now we descend into the usual that will get you banned - the ad homs and personal slights in place of any valid argument.. Go back and read the links on AWE and AHW - try again, child.  If your treatment of Elders is anything to go by, and your handling of facts - you have zero morals. You have to understand the REALITY of how any science or issue works before you can develop adequate and relevant software for it.  Easy-peasy ... you can't even work out the simple figures for AWE/Hours worked and come up with figures.... and your total unwillingness to read relevant documents speaks for itself. Make sure you stay away from other people's money, sonny.... stick to writing kid's games.... ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D I am your master at every step.    ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D

I agree, you can insult me and post racist hate, but I'll get a ban for answering.  Have you not worked out I don't care?

I have lots of morals.  I treat old people with respect when they are not human garbage.

That's not really true LOL!! I don't deeply understand the businesses I write software for.  I get given one PBI at a time and I follow those business rules without ever getting a broader picture, I don't need one.  I often write systems for things and don't understand WHY they exist, only how they work. 

The fact is, women are paid less.  This is literally maths.  No, you are a worthless old man spewing hate.  You never answer me or debate me, why would I give you the time of day? I'm just having fun laughing at you

Can't begin to discuss the issue in this strand, eh?

;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 8^th, 2022 at 8:48am:

Can't begin to discuss the issue in this strand, eh? ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D

I've answered every moronic thing you said, boomer.  List the things I've not answered?

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 8^th, 2022 at 8:36am:

I agree, you can insult me and post racist hate, but I'll get a ban for answering.  Have you not worked out I don't care? I have lots of morals.  I treat old people with respect when they are not human garbage. That's not really true LOL!! I don't deeply understand the businesses I write software for.  I get given one PBI at a time and I follow those business rules without ever getting a broader picture, I don't need one.  I often write systems for things and don't understand WHY they exist, only how they work.  The fact is, women are paid less.  This is literally maths.  No, you are a worthless old man spewing hate.  You never answer me or debate me, why would I give you the time of day? I'm just having fun laughing at you

;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D

Clearly your understanding of maths is on a par with your morals and your intellectual capacity....

Too scared to do the actual figures, eh?    ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D

You are so weak and ineffectual.

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 8^th, 2022 at 8:50am:

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 8th, 2022 at 8:48am: Can't begin to discuss the issue in this strand, eh? ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D I've answered every moronic thing you said, boomer.  List the things I've not answered?

The issue raised here - you've spent pages trying to drag me down to your level and spiting anyone else with any different view .... you are incompetent in life.

;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 8^th, 2022 at 8:51am:

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 8th, 2022 at 8:50am: Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 8th, 2022 at 8:48am: Can't begin to discuss the issue in this strand, eh? ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D I've answered every moronic thing you said, boomer.  List the things I've not answered? The issue raised here - you've spent pages trying to drag me down to your level and spiting anyone else with any different view .... you are incompetent in life. ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D

Two replies.  I've triggered you again.

Women are paid less.  This is SIMPLE maths.  LOL!! You are just crying

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 8^th, 2022 at 8:36am:

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 8th, 2022 at 8:31am: FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 8th, 2022 at 8:27am: Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 8th, 2022 at 8:10am: " If you raise a point, it's not one I made. " Ego much - so you are now admitting that YOU will not debate me about anything too factual for you to handle?  If you design software, sonny - stay away from payroll and other important issues for people's lives - you'd be the kind that developed paradigms for Robodebt. You are what I'd call a hack - as opposed to a scientifically based software engineer. Oh - sorry - I did do a course in that as well... I did in fact answer your ignorant bullshit.  It was simply not a counter to my claim, but to a claim you made up Get your glasses checked, old man yes, the left love Robodebt.  LOL!!! Which particular sciences are pertinent to my software development?  What about me having morals and shaming right wing filth on the internet educates you on my knowledge of C#, SQL and Typescript? Utterly missed the realities, as usual... and now we descend into the usual that will get you banned - the ad homs and personal slights in place of any valid argument.. Go back and read the links on AWE and AHW - try again, child.  If your treatment of Elders is anything to go by, and your handling of facts - you have zero morals. You have to understand the REALITY of how any science or issue works before you can develop adequate and relevant software for it.  Easy-peasy ... you can't even work out the simple figures for AWE/Hours worked and come up with figures.... and your total unwillingness to read relevant documents speaks for itself. Make sure you stay away from other people's money, sonny.... stick to writing kid's games.... ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D I am your master at every step.    ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D I agree, you can insult me and post racist hate, but I'll get a ban for answering.  Have you not worked out I don't care? I have lots of morals.  I treat old people with respect when they are not human garbage. That's not really true LOL!! I don't deeply understand the businesses I write software for.  I get given one PBI at a time and I follow those business rules without ever getting a broader picture, I don't need one.  I often write systems for things and don't understand WHY they exist, only how they work.  The fact is, women are paid less.  This is literally maths.  No, you are a worthless old man spewing hate.  You never answer me or debate me, why would I give you the time of day? I'm just having fun laughing at you

That is 100% pure fantasy ... in "fact" it's a bloody lie.

Women are not paid less.

##

Gnads wrote on Sep 8^th, 2022 at 9:02am:

That is 100% pure fantasy ... in "fact" it's a bloody lie. Women are not paid less.

Did you get tagged?

Why are women paid less then?

Yadda wrote on Aug 11^th, 2022 at 9:09pm:

An example of the type of political reform in Australia which i would like to see.... If any Federal government can't balance its [our] budget, then    retired    politicians [at that time] will only be entitled to the [exact] same pension payments as other Australians.

well.....speaking of reform: the currency-issuing government ought be free from usurious private sector money lenders.....so government (the public sector) can oversee resource mobilization on behalf of the <commonwealth>, rather than being constrained  by private sector greed.

...ie, currency-issuing government are  constrained by the nation's available resources, not money which is created solely by self-interested  private sector financiers. 

Balanced budgets are necessary for USERS of the currency (you and me), not the ISSUER (private or public) of the currency. 

freediver wrote on Aug 30^th, 2022 at 6:46am:

Just got another feeble excuse from Labor - they do not need to fix this problem because one day they will make Australia a republic. Not sure what they plan to do with the Senate if we do become a republic, or when they plan to make it happen. Still no response from the other parties.

It just occurred to me that maybe the real reason Labor is stalling on the voice referendum is because they were anticipating the Queen's death, and want to throw in a republic referendum sooner than they have been letting on.

Both ideas seem to have the same problem - lack of detail. And both ideas lack detail because no-one likes what they see, if they ever get to see it.

All that they can comprehend is a copycat of the Irish Republic cliche.

Think of this Forum becoming a Republic FD.
It means that you - as leader, becomes the 'sacrificial goat' on behalf of the people.
Unlike the Northern Hemisphere Politics, regardless of format - where the 'People' are the sacrifice, not the leader.

Come FD, die for our 'political' sins. ;)

...those Trolls here want your blood anyway.

freediver wrote on Sep 9^th, 2022 at 9:55pm:

Both ideas seem to have the same problem - lack of detail. And both ideas lack detail because no-one likes what they see, if they ever get to see it.

see how conservatives fuss about the letter of the law;

a voice is just that, an advice from black communities to Parliament - which may or may not be taken; and removal of the UK monarch as head of state in Oz.   (The issue of electing an Oz head of state is minor, though people think their "freedom" is at stake)

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 8:32am:

freediver wrote on Sep 9th, 2022 at 9:55pm: Both ideas seem to have the same problem - lack of detail. And both ideas lack detail because no-one likes what they see, if they ever get to see it. see how conservatives fuss about the letter of the law; a voice is just that, an advice from black communities to Parliament - which may or may not be taken; and removal of the UK monarch as head of state in Oz.   (The issue of electing an Oz head of state is minor, though people think their "freedom" is at stake)

It is not a change to the law. It is a change to the constitution. It would be incredibly stupid and naïve (like supporting the CCP) to ignore the detail and hope for the best.

FutureTheLeftWant wrote on Sep 8^th, 2022 at 9:23am:

Gnads wrote on Sep 8th, 2022 at 9:02am: That is 100% pure fantasy ... in "fact" it's a bloody lie. Women are not paid less. Did you get tagged? Why are women paid less then?

They aren't.

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 8:32am:

freediver wrote on Sep 9th, 2022 at 9:55pm: Both ideas seem to have the same problem - lack of detail. And both ideas lack detail because no-one likes what they see, if they ever get to see it. see how conservatives fuss about the letter of the law; a voice is just that, an advice from black communities to Parliament - which may or may not be taken; and removal of the UK monarch as head of state in Oz.   (The issue of electing an Oz head of state is minor, though people think their "freedom" is at stake)

Phark me hooray - they already have a voice & the mechanisms to be heard in Parliament ...

that's what 15 plus elected Aboriginal MPs and Senators are there for.......

how does this continually escape you?

They do not need a duplication or a non elected voice directly to PARLIAMENT.

It's a nonsense.

Gnads wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 8:49am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 8:32am: freediver wrote on Sep 9th, 2022 at 9:55pm: Both ideas seem to have the same problem - lack of detail. And both ideas lack detail because no-one likes what they see, if they ever get to see it. see how conservatives fuss about the letter of the law; a voice is just that, an advice from black communities to Parliament - which may or may not be taken; and removal of the UK monarch as head of state in Oz.   (The issue of electing an Oz head of state is minor, though people think their "freedom" is at stake) Phark me hooray - they already have a voice & the mechanisms to be heard in Parliament ...

No they have c 15 separate voices (according to you) in Parliament, displaying the usual L-R divide.


Quote:

that's what 15 plus elected Aboriginal MPs and Senators are there for....... how does this continually escape you?

Addressed above. A consensus voice as opposed to the 15 separate voices currently in Parliament.


Quote:

They do not need a duplication or a non elected voice directly to PARLIAMENT.

The voice would represent a 'black party' (though without actually existing as a party in parliament), as the ALP represents the voice of the Oz centre left, for exmple.


Quote:

It's a nonsense.

Refuted above.

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 9:07am:

Gnads wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 8:49am: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 8:32am: freediver wrote on Sep 9th, 2022 at 9:55pm: Both ideas seem to have the same problem - lack of detail. And both ideas lack detail because no-one likes what they see, if they ever get to see it. see how conservatives fuss about the letter of the law; a voice is just that, an advice from black communities to Parliament - which may or may not be taken; and removal of the UK monarch as head of state in Oz.   (The issue of electing an Oz head of state is minor, though people think their "freedom" is at stake) Phark me hooray - they already have a voice & the mechanisms to be heard in Parliament ... No they have c 15 separate voices (according to you) in Parliament, displaying the usual L-R divide. Quote: that's what 15 plus elected Aboriginal MPs and Senators are there for....... how does this continually escape you? Addressed above. A consensus voice as opposed to the 15 separate voices currently in Parliament. [quote]They do not need a duplication or a non elected voice directly to PARLIAMENT.

The voice would represent a 'black party' (though without actually existing as a party in parliament), as the ALP represents the voice of the Oz centre left, for exmple.


Quote:

It's a nonsense.

Refuted above.
[/quote]

Your refutation isn't worth squat.

Does everyone else get a consensus voice?

Or does the plethora of separate voices above the Aboriginal 15 ..... all they have to make do with? ::)

What you say is a discriminatory race based notion.... and not workable.

It's nothing more than symbolic appeasement based on race.

Well - only a fool would buy a pig in a poke, and one that is subject to change at any time by the incumbent government - meaning, in this case, that New Labor International will slowly but surely give this 'voice' more and more power and control.

No, thanks.  they can take their place with the rest of us - and that applies to everything else as well.

When do I get back lands held by my ancestors?

Finalise all this land claims nonsense, get it over and end it now.  Give 'em enough to make a fair go of it - rise or fall on their own merits and efforts.

It's 2022 - and most people are struggling to own a block of land let alone a huge swathe of it given for nothing.

Enough!!

'dividie' doesn't 'refute' anything - he simply offers a rhetorical different opinion - that is not refuting - it is merely offering an opinion.

A few here make that mistake, some deliberately, since they are both uneducated and essentially childish in their approach to life and discussion.

Their 'refutation' is like that Monty Python sketch...

"No it's not..."

Gnads wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 9:50am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 9:07am: Gnads wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 8:49am: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 8:32am: freediver wrote on Sep 9th, 2022 at 9:55pm: Both ideas seem to have the same problem - lack of detail. And both ideas lack detail because no-one likes what they see, if they ever get to see it. see how conservatives fuss about the letter of the law; a voice is just that, an advice from black communities to Parliament - which may or may not be taken; and removal of the UK monarch as head of state in Oz.   (The issue of electing an Oz head of state is minor, though people think their "freedom" is at stake) Phark me hooray - they already have a voice & the mechanisms to be heard in Parliament ... No they have c 15 separate voices (according to you) in Parliament, displaying the usual L-R divide. Quote: that's what 15 plus elected Aboriginal MPs and Senators are there for....... how does this continually escape you? Addressed above. A consensus voice as opposed to the 15 separate voices currently in Parliament. [quote]They do not need a duplication or a non elected voice directly to PARLIAMENT. The voice would represent a 'black party' (though without actually existing as a party in parliament), as the ALP represents the voice of the Oz centre left, for exmple. [quote]It's a nonsense.

Refuted above.
[/quote]

Your refutation isn't worth squat.

Does everyone else get a consensus voice?[/quote]

The point is blacks need a 'consensus voice' to advise parliament, so long as the gap exists; whereas non-blacks are catered for, by centre Left and centre Right parties who fight it out over disadvantage within the non-black community.


Quote:

Or does the plethora of separate voices above the Aboriginal 15 ..... all they have to make do with? ::) What you say is a discriminatory race based notion.... and not workable.

Addressed above; as long as a black 'gap' exists, we ARE dealing with a "race-based notion".


Quote:

It's nothing more than symbolic appeasement based on race.

Refuted above - if no black gap existed, there would be no need for a voice, symbolic or not. 

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 9:58am:

'dividie' doesn't 'refute' anything - he simply offers a rhetorical different opinion - that is not refuting - it is merely offering an opinion. A few here make that mistake, some deliberately, since they are both uneducated and essentially childish in their approach to life and discussion. Their 'refutation' is like that Monty Python sketch... "No it's not..."

refuted in #104. The BLACK gap is real, not opinion.

..

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 10:43am:

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 9:58am: 'dividie' doesn't 'refute' anything - he simply offers a rhetorical different opinion - that is not refuting - it is merely offering an opinion. A few here make that mistake, some deliberately, since they are both uneducated and essentially childish in their approach to life and discussion. Their 'refutation' is like that Monty Python sketch... "No it's not..." refuted in #104. The BLACK gap is real, not opinion.

We are not having a referendum on whether the gap exists TGD. You still have to think for yourself. Try it.

freediver wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 11:41am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 10:43am: Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 9:58am: 'dividie' doesn't 'refute' anything - he simply offers a rhetorical different opinion - that is not refuting - it is merely offering an opinion. A few here make that mistake, some deliberately, since they are both uneducated and essentially childish in their approach to life and discussion. Their 'refutation' is like that Monty Python sketch... "No it's not..." refuted in #104. The BLACK gap is real, not opinion. We are not having a referendum on whether the gap exists TGD. You still have to think for yourself. Try it.

We ARE having a referendum owing to the nation's  disgraceful black gap. If the race-based gap didn't exist, we wouldn't be having a referndum for a black voice.

Of course you ignored #104 which highlighted the fact.

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 12:57pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 11:41am: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 10:43am: Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 9:58am: 'dividie' doesn't 'refute' anything - he simply offers a rhetorical different opinion - that is not refuting - it is merely offering an opinion. A few here make that mistake, some deliberately, since they are both uneducated and essentially childish in their approach to life and discussion. Their 'refutation' is like that Monty Python sketch... "No it's not..." refuted in #104. The BLACK gap is real, not opinion. We are not having a referendum on whether the gap exists TGD. You still have to think for yourself. Try it. We ARE having a referendum owing to the nation's  disgraceful black gap. If the race-based gap didn't exist, we wouldn't be having a referndum for a black voice. Of course you ignored #104 which highlighted the fact.

Probably, but that wouldn't actually refute what anyone else is saying. You still have to think for yourself. Try it.

freediver wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 1:55pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 12:57pm: freediver wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 11:41am: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 10:43am: Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 9:58am: 'dividie' doesn't 'refute' anything - he simply offers a rhetorical different opinion - that is not refuting - it is merely offering an opinion. A few here make that mistake, some deliberately, since they are both uneducated and essentially childish in their approach to life and discussion. Their 'refutation' is like that Monty Python sketch... "No it's not..." refuted in #104. The BLACK gap is real, not opinion. We are not having a referendum on whether the gap exists TGD. You still have to think for yourself. Try it. We ARE having a referendum owing to the nation's  disgraceful black gap. If the race-based gap didn't exist, we wouldn't be having a referndum for a black voice. Of course you ignored #104 which highlighted the fact. Probably, but that wouldn't actually refute what anyone else is saying. You still have to think for yourself. Try it.

You asked for it - frauddiver -

Say what "others are saying", and what I must refute, and why " it wouldn't refute what others are saying".

Go on, now it's your chance  to pin me down on your terms of the debate, frauddiver, while you refuse to address #104.

You don't have to refute anything. I just wanted you to realise that actually refuting what someone else says is not as simple as offering a tangentially relevant opinion that you think they might disagree with.

freediver wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 2:13pm:

You don't have to refute anything. I just wanted you to realise that actually refuting what someone else says is not as simple as offering a tangentially relevant opinion that you think they might disagree with.

Addressed in #104. Refutation with facts makes it simple. ...the race-based gap exists,  how we eradicate it is up for debate.

Grapps and Gnads reckon 'personal responsibility' is the beginning and end of the matter, so we just have to accept living with the gap.

Losers.

Quote:

Addressed in #104.

Ah. You win because you have won.

Perhaps it is best if you don't try to refute anything.

freediver wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 2:48pm:

Quote: Addressed in #104. Ah. You win because you have won. Perhaps it is best if you don't try to refute anything.

That's not debate; you need to quote what I said, and then refute it...

Would you agree that in order to refute what someone is saying, you must first understand what they are saying?

freediver wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 4:15pm:

Would you agree that in order to refute what someone is saying, you must first understand what they are saying?

No, I'm saying you are a fraud, who prefers to divert when he can't/won't debate.

Frauddiver, quote from #104 (anything will do), and then attempt to refute it, or confirm your obviously fraudulent nature.   

Oh..and point out where/how I "haven't understood what someone was saying"....

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 8:56pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 4:15pm: Would you agree that in order to refute what someone is saying, you must first understand what they are saying? No

Yeah, I didn't think you would.

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 8:56pm:

No, I'm saying you are a fraud, who prefers to divert when he can't/won't debate.

That pretty much sums FD up.

freediver wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 9:23pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 8:56pm: freediver wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 4:15pm: Would you agree that in order to refute what someone is saying, you must first understand what they are saying? No Yeah, I didn't think you would.

I see John Smith has you sorted...

so.... last chance:

Frauddiver, quote from #104 (anything will do), and then attempt to refute it, or confirm your obviously fraudulent nature.   

Oh..and point out where/how I "haven't understood what someone was saying"..

It is meaningless gibberish. Why would I try to refute what you say? You would have to actually say something first.

Here is a question for the Referendum:

How do you feel about a people who rape murder and eat children?

Grow a pair, Australia. Legalize weed.

*sprays Marla with Round-Up

This 'black gap' is irrelevant to a referendum to alter the constitution to create a separate body for one group = racism, especially when there are already countless bodies that do exactly that.

You have already agreed that any 'voice' would not help any of those problems.

You need to separate your emotion from reality and consider the referendum idea in isolation on its merits - not on some hankey-waving tear jerking idea of somehow elevating the cheers.

Stick to the referendum and stop muddying the waters with stories of how badly done Jackie-Jackie is out there with his aluminium boat and fishing gear and his dole money.... where he CHOOSES to be... at your expense.

Sandy beaches - drinking rum every night.....

They're acknowledged as having been here first in the long ago past - now get 'em out to work... or they can WISP all their lives.  It's 2022, not 1787 and they are a small minority.

One Law For All - All Laws For One!!

freediver wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 9:47pm:

It is meaningless gibberish. Why would I try to refute what you say? You would have to actually say something first.

Your contention I haven't said anything is false.

I'll take #104 slowly for you, one line at a time:

"The point is blacks need a 'consensus voice' to advise parliament, so long as the gap exists".

You can't refute it?

I see Grapps has had a go, lets see what he has to say..

;D

So whether Australian political parties can cater for you depends on the colour of your skin. Is this the "fact" you are asking me to refute?

Why did you edit out of your post the bit about the political parties not catering to people of certain skin colours?

You almost said something, but then you got scared of your own words. You're not exactly the bravest little pink, are you?

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 11^th, 2022 at 11:38am:

This 'black gap' is irrelevant to a referendum to alter the constitution to create a separate body for one group = racism, especially when there are already countless bodies that do exactly that.

Obviously the countless bodies are failing to close the black gap which is why we need to try somethibg else (in short, bring back CDEP-type programs). But the point is we are talking about a BLACK gap, so of course the voice will be race based. 


Quote:

You have already agreed that any 'voice' would not help any of those problems.

Yes, but on further reflection  I have modified my stance; the search for a consensus voice among blacks themselves might be useful for getting blacks to face aspects of the problem they are not facing at present.   


Quote:

You need to separate your emotion from reality and consider the referendum idea in isolation on its merits - not on some hankey-waving tear jerking idea of somehow elevating the cheers.

I think if it's made clear the black - consensus - voice will have an advisory role only, you can indeed separate emotion and reality.  (The lack of black consensus itself will be informative...)


Quote:

One Law For All - All Laws For One!!

When there is no race-based gap.....

freediver wrote on Sep 11^th, 2022 at 4:27pm:

;D So whether Australian political parties can cater for you depends on the colour of your skin. Is this the "fact" you are asking me to refute?

Yes. Obviously Oz political parties are failing to eradicate the (black) gap.


Quote:

Why did you edit out of your post the bit about the political parties not catering to people of certain skin colours?

Because you apparently cannot cope with more than one idea at a time....the 2nd point being:

"whereas non-blacks are catered for by centre Left and centre Right parties who fight it out over disadvantage within the non-black community".

Interestingly, there is also a gap - between rich and poor - in the non-black community, but the political parties DO address ('fight it out') this issue, meaning the political contest is NOT race-based , cf the black gap which IS race based; eg non blacks have a ten-year longer life span than blacks...aka 'the gap'.


Quote:

Why did you edit out of your post the bit about the political parties not catering to people of certain skin colours?

Explained above, your capacity to consider more than one idea at a time is obviously severely challenged.

So after I took it one line at a time, lo and behold you have joined the debate...


Quote:

You almost said something, but then you got scared of your own words. You're not exactly the bravest little pink, are you?

Addressed ...and refuted above.

freediver wrote on Sep 11^th, 2022 at 4:28pm:

Why did you edit out of your post the bit about the political parties not catering to people of certain skin colours? You almost said something, but then you got scared of your own words. You're not exactly the bravest little pink, are you?

Like I said, trolling shills end nearly every post with a ?.

Count em.

https://i.gifer.com/HCj0.gif

freediver wrote on Sep 11^th, 2022 at 4:27pm:

;D So whether Australian political parties can cater for you depends on the colour of your skin. Is this the "fact" you are asking me to refute?

Why would that be?

Please Explain? 

Why is it 'troll schills' who end with a question? 

What makes you think that?

Is it not more likely and most likely that they raise questions so as to make you think about the subject matter?

Is this not instead a way of your getting out from under the terrible burden of actually answering to the issue?

In 2015–2017, life expectancy at birth was 71.6 years for Indigenous males
and 75.6 years for Indigenous females. In comparison, the non-Indigenous
life expectancy at birth was 80.2 years for males and 83.4 years for females.
This is a gap of 8.6 years for males and 7.8 years for females.

Life expectancy is an overarching target, which is dependent not only on health,
but the social determinants (such as education, employment status, housing
and income). Social determinants are estimated to be responsible for at least
34% of the health gap between Indigenous and non‑Indigenous Australians.
Behavioural risk factors, such as smoking, obesity, alcohol use and diet,
accounted for around 19% of that gap.

Over the period 2006 to 2018, there was an improvement of almost 10% in
Indigenous age‑standardised mortality rates. However, non‑Indigenous mortality
rates improved at a similar rate, so the gap has not narrowed.

—Australian Health Ministers' Advisory Council (AHMAC), Closing The Gap Report 2020.

They lived for 40,000 to 100,000+ years.
Europeans have only been alive for just 6,000 years.

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 11^th, 2022 at 8:36pm:

Why would that be? Please Explain?  Why is it 'troll schills' who end with a question?  What makes you think that? Is it not more likely and most likely that they raise questions so as to make you think about the subject matter? Is this not instead a way of your getting out from under the terrible burden of actually answering to the issue?

Random doesn't like questions. He likes memes. They require less thought.

Jasin wrote on Sep 11^th, 2022 at 9:01pm:

They lived for 40,000 to 100,000+ years. Europeans have only been alive for just 6,000 years.

Rubbish .... everyone here is the descendant of millions of years of evolution....  grow a life .... it's good for you.

Aborigines were never a contiguous group, so Europeans far outweigh them when it comes to the (gasps) Identity Stakes.....

"Hi - I'm a Ngunnawalla!"

"What's that mean?"

"The six of us down by the creek..... we're organising a resistance - you wanna come down and listen in?  Women can't come - men's business, you know."

AusGeoff wrote on Sep 11^th, 2022 at 8:50pm:

In 2015–2017, life expectancy at birth was 71.6 years for Indigenous males and 75.6 years for Indigenous females. In comparison, the non-Indigenous life expectancy at birth was 80.2 years for males and 83.4 years for females. This is a gap of 8.6 years for males and 7.8 years for females. Life expectancy is an overarching target, which is dependent not only on health, but the social determinants (such as education, employment status, housing and income). Social determinants are estimated to be responsible for at least 34% of the health gap between Indigenous and non‑Indigenous Australians. Behavioural risk factors, such as smoking, obesity, alcohol use and diet, accounted for around 19% of that gap. Over the period 2006 to 2018, there was an improvement of almost 10% in Indigenous age‑standardised mortality rates. However, non‑Indigenous mortality rates improved at a similar rate, so the gap has not narrowed. —Australian Health Ministers' Advisory Council (AHMAC), Closing The Gap Report 2020.

No gap at all - you get what your genes and your lifestyle give you.

How is their infant mortality rate and their woman murder rate compared to the rest?  We Wharteys have got a long way to catch up in both of those.

Being as how Indigenous men are less likely to die in prison than in their own communities, it appears the lifestyle and the food suit them better in prison.... maybe the great divide has a point about extreme government imposition amounting to Intervention™ and a New Invasion™ ... and maybe a few more New Stolen Generations™.

Slip 'em all into that Great Gulag up Cape York, provided by the Queenslund Government in its stupidity and cupidity... force 'em to a healthy lifestyle and into not killing one another ....no booze, no drugs, no petrol to sniff, no fast food.... just remove all the risk factors and force 'em into training and jobs ... and problem solved!!

Well, well - it irritates me to the core to see 'governments' paying dick-heads hundreds of thousands a year to come up with these utterly stupid comments without offering any genuine solutions - when the solutions are right there for the asking of the general public... you could ask the average person in a pub how to resolve many of these issues - but a government minister or a 'chief health officer' is only good for mumbling what sounds like meaningful words at huge expense.

What to you do with a chief health officer who stuffs up the Corona Princess and lets Covid loose on the land?

Give 'em a medal.....  FFS....

freediver wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 6:47am:

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 11th, 2022 at 8:36pm: Why would that be? Please Explain?  Why is it 'troll schills' who end with a question?  What makes you think that? Is it not more likely and most likely that they raise questions so as to make you think about the subject matter? Is this not instead a way of your getting out from under the terrible burden of actually answering to the issue? Random doesn't like questions. He likes memes. They require less thought.

I was waiting for someone to note that I'd ended every sentence with a ? .....  ;D  ;D  ;D  ;D

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 9:43am:

Jasin wrote on Sep 11th, 2022 at 9:01pm: They lived for 40,000 to 100,000+ years. Europeans have only been alive for just 6,000 years. Rubbish .... everyone here is the descendant of millions of years of evolution....  grow a life .... it's good for you. Aborigines were never a contiguous group, so Europeans far outweigh them when it comes to the (gasps) Identity Stakes..... "Hi - I'm a Ngunnawalla!" "What's that mean?" "The six of us down by the creek..... we're organising a resistance - you wanna come down and listen in?  Women can't come - men's business, you know."

You whiteys inherited 'permanency' in Europe only 6,000 years ago after the last ice age.
From that - you whiteys are just a 'recent' offshoot from 'caucasoid' Middle-Easterner Brownies, Black 'caucasoid' Aryan Indians and even the Abos have Caucasoid in them.
All far older than Whiteys.

Yep - there was a world for 100,000 years of Sapien history, where there was NO WHITEYS AT ALL.  ;D ;D ;D

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 11^th, 2022 at 8:36pm:

Why would that be? Please Explain?  Why is it 'troll schills' who end with a question?  What makes you think that? Is it not more likely and most likely that they raise questions so as to make you think about the subject matter? Is this not instead a way of your getting out from under the terrible burden of actually answering to the issue?

Not in fraudiver's case..

Now you both need to acknowledge the usefulness of a consensus, black, race-based voice to advise parliament, while the black gap exists.

If you want to pass GO and collect $200
You've got to bend the knee
to the Aborigine.
;D :D

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 10:39am:

Gnads wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 9:50am: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 9:07am: Gnads wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 8:49am: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 8:32am: freediver wrote on Sep 9th, 2022 at 9:55pm: Both ideas seem to have the same problem - lack of detail. And both ideas lack detail because no-one likes what they see, if they ever get to see it. see how conservatives fuss about the letter of the law; a voice is just that, an advice from black communities to Parliament - which may or may not be taken; and removal of the UK monarch as head of state in Oz.   (The issue of electing an Oz head of state is minor, though people think their "freedom" is at stake) Phark me hooray - they already have a voice & the mechanisms to be heard in Parliament ... No they have c 15 separate voices (according to you) in Parliament, displaying the usual L-R divide. Quote: that's what 15 plus elected Aboriginal MPs and Senators are there for....... how does this continually escape you? Addressed above. A consensus voice as opposed to the 15 separate voices currently in Parliament. [quote]They do not need a duplication or a non elected voice directly to PARLIAMENT. The voice would represent a 'black party' (though without actually existing as a party in parliament), as the ALP represents the voice of the Oz centre left, for exmple. [quote]It's a nonsense. Refuted above.

Your refutation isn't worth squat.

Does everyone else get a consensus voice?[/quote]

The point is blacks need a 'consensus voice' to advise parliament, so long as the gap exists; whereas non-blacks are catered for, by centre Left and centre Right parties who fight it out over disadvantage within the non-black community.


Quote:

Or does the plethora of separate voices above the Aboriginal 15 ..... all they have to make do with? ::) What you say is a discriminatory race based notion.... and not workable.

Addressed above; as long as a black 'gap' exists, we ARE dealing with a "race-based notion".


Quote:

It's nothing more than symbolic appeasement based on race.

Refuted above - if no black gap existed, there would be no need for a voice, symbolic or not. 
[/quote]


;D The fictitious gender pay gap .... now you're pedalling a "black gap" as a reason for the duplication of representation to Parliament.

everything you're barrowing here is race based bullshyte.   

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10^th, 2022 at 10:43am:

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 9:58am: 'dividie' doesn't 'refute' anything - he simply offers a rhetorical different opinion - that is not refuting - it is merely offering an opinion. A few here make that mistake, some deliberately, since they are both uneducated and essentially childish in their approach to life and discussion. Their 'refutation' is like that Monty Python sketch... "No it's not..." refuted in #104. The BLACK gap is real, not opinion.

Rubbish ... is what it is.

Marla wrote on Sep 11^th, 2022 at 8:43am:

Grow a pair, Australia. Legalize weed.

You've got plenty for everyone. ;D

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 10:08am:

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 11th, 2022 at 8:36pm: Why would that be? Please Explain?  Why is it 'troll schills' who end with a question?  What makes you think that? Is it not more likely and most likely that they raise questions so as to make you think about the subject matter? Is this not instead a way of your getting out from under the terrible burden of actually answering to the issue? Not in fraudiver's case.. Now you both need to acknowledge the usefulness of a consensus, black, race-based voice to advise parliament, while the black gap exists.

No way, Jose` - they already have more representation than they need - what they need is the willingness to get out of 'living their way' or go that way exclusively without us, and take their chances.

I 'need' to acknowledge no such thing... is it a racist, Apartheidist lie from start to finish and has no beneficial outcomes ...

I'd like to see the one time in my life, as a 'White' - that I've been catered to.... FFS...

This country needs to stop right now in its tracks and get itself back on the rails....and the first step, as I told Albo pre-election - is to get away from the politics of division and the policies of exclusion.... clearly Albo is incapable of listening... I cannot reason with this man ....

You cannot, by definition, include one small group by excluding the majority.

Get over it.

Gnads wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 10:21am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 10:39am: Gnads wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 9:50am: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 9:07am: Gnads wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 8:49am: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 8:32am: freediver wrote on Sep 9th, 2022 at 9:55pm: Both ideas seem to have the same problem - lack of detail. And both ideas lack detail because no-one likes what they see, if they ever get to see it. see how conservatives fuss about the letter of the law; a voice is just that, an advice from black communities to Parliament - which may or may not be taken; and removal of the UK monarch as head of state in Oz.   (The issue of electing an Oz head of state is minor, though people think their "freedom" is at stake) Phark me hooray - they already have a voice & the mechanisms to be heard in Parliament ... No they have c 15 separate voices (according to you) in Parliament, displaying the usual L-R divide. Quote: that's what 15 plus elected Aboriginal MPs and Senators are there for....... how does this continually escape you? Addressed above. A consensus voice as opposed to the 15 separate voices currently in Parliament. [quote]They do not need a duplication or a non elected voice directly to PARLIAMENT. The voice would represent a 'black party' (though without actually existing as a party in parliament), as the ALP represents the voice of the Oz centre left, for exmple. [quote]It's a nonsense. Refuted above. Your refutation isn't worth squat. Does everyone else get a consensus voice?

The point is blacks need a 'consensus voice' to advise parliament, so long as the gap exists; whereas non-blacks are catered for, by centre Left and centre Right parties who fight it out over disadvantage within the non-black community.


Quote:

Or does the plethora of separate voices above the Aboriginal 15 ..... all they have to make do with? ::) What you say is a discriminatory race based notion.... and not workable.

Addressed above; as long as a black 'gap' exists, we ARE dealing with a "race-based notion".


Quote:

It's nothing more than symbolic appeasement based on race.

Refuted above - if no black gap existed, there would be no need for a voice, symbolic or not. 
[/quote]


;D The fictitious gender pay gap .... [/quote]

Not ficticious, most women are employed in underpaid caring professions, hence "the gender pay gap", and all the flow-on effects: super, housing, poverty levels.


Quote:

now you're pedalling a "black gap" as a reason for the duplication of representation to Parliament.

Yes, a voice may help to  identify the nature of the problem which thus far have proved intractable.


Quote:

everything you're barrowing here is race based bullshyte.

So long as a 'black gap' exists, necessary solutions ARE 'race-based'.

Gnads wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 10:21am:

;D The fictitious gender pay gap .... now you're pedalling a "black gap" as a reason for the duplication of representation to Parliament. everything you're barrowing here is race based bullshyte.

Well, no. It's anything but 'fictitious'.

It's not universal, by any means - I've worked with women in some of my jobs and we've
received the same wage for the same work.

But it DOES exist in some fields - mostly 'professional', for some reason.

Look - you can lead a cheer to a public bar, but you can't force him to drink beer all night... he can only drink that beer if he chooses to do so, OK?

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 10:49am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 10:08am: Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 11th, 2022 at 8:36pm: Why would that be? Please Explain?  Why is it 'troll schills' who end with a question?  What makes you think that? Is it not more likely and most likely that they raise questions so as to make you think about the subject matter? Is this not instead a way of your getting out from under the terrible burden of actually answering to the issue? Not in fraudiver's case.. Now you both need to acknowledge the usefulness of a consensus, black, race-based voice to advise parliament, while the black gap exists. No way, Jose` - they already have more representation than they need - what they need is the willingness to get out of 'living their way' or go that way exclusively without us, and take their chances.

In any case we need to close the gap...which you of course deny even exists:

https://www.iwgia.org/en/news/4344-aboriginal-people-in-australia-the-most-imprisoned-people-on-earth.html

Aboriginal people in Australia: the most imprisoned people on Earth

HOW we close the gap is up for debate; but the idea of blacks reverting to the hunter gatherer culture in modern Oz is obviously absurd.

btw, blacks didn't display the social dysfunction  pre 1770s they are now experiencing...consider: why is that? 


Quote:

I 'need' to acknowledge no such thing... is it a racist, Apartheidist lie from start to finish and has no beneficial outcomes ...

Well, given you deny the black gap exists, we have this typical GIGO proposition from you.


Quote:

I'd like to see the one time in my life, as a 'White' - that I've been catered to.... FFS...

If you are 'working class', the ALP is 'here to help' (!...except the ALP has turned into a neoliberal toad, so you are abandoned..); if you are small business or wealthy, you are "catered to" by the Coalition.


Quote:

This country needs to stop right now in its tracks and get itself back on the rails....and the first step, as I told Albo pre-election - is to get away from the politics of division and the policies of exclusion.... clearly Albo is incapable of listening... I cannot reason with this man ....

I feel your pain...he rejected my copy of 'The Deficit Myth' which actually contains the key to allowing re-establishment and enlargement of the highly successful CDEP trashed by the neoliberal toad Howard


Quote:

You cannot, by definition, include one small group by excluding the majority. Get over it.

An advisory - presumbly consensus -  black voice to parliament (existing outside parliamnet), which may  assist in closing the gap,  is NOT equivalent to  'including one small group by excluding the majority", because the proposed voice will exist outside parliament.

Kat wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 11:13am:

Gnads wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 10:21am: ;D The fictitious gender pay gap .... now you're pedalling a "black gap" as a reason for the duplication of representation to Parliament. everything you're barrowing here is race based bullshyte.    Well, no. It's anything but 'fictitious'. It's not universal, by any means - I've worked with women in some of my jobs and we've received the same wage for the same work. But it DOES exist in some fields - mostly 'professional', for some reason.

Follow the arguments and the figures - they tell the whole story.

As long as people are paid what is required for the job - they cannot complain that they are suffering any 'wage gap' because they do a Lisa Wilkinson and proclaim that they are being treated badly for having negotiated only $1.8m as opposed to a bloke negotiating $2m for the same job...  paid journo rates and they'd be on maybe $2-3k a week.

NOWHERE is anyone legally paid less for the same job - and if you wish to look at sectors - women far outweigh men in earnings and super in the nursing business, for a start, and receive massive preference there as well.

Are you arguing for equal payment there across the board?

The figures real show that it is men who are paid an hourly rate less than women overall.  Next!

Kat wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 11:13am:

Gnads wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 10:21am: ;D The fictitious gender pay gap .... now you're pedalling a "black gap" as a reason for the duplication of representation to Parliament. everything you're barrowing here is race based bullshyte.    Well, no. It's anything but 'fictitious'. It's not universal, by any means - I've worked with women in some of my jobs and we've received the same wage for the same work. But it DOES exist in some fields - mostly 'professional', for some reason.

The feminized nature of the low-paid  caring professions (child care, health and age care) is also a factor in '"the gender pay gap" (ie men on average earn more than women).

"In any case we need to close the gap...which you of course deny even exists:"

Another ridiculous and presumptuous statement signifying your lack of connection with reality and your inability too distinguish between rhetoric and reality.

Nobody says there is no gap - the real issue is WHY there is and remains a gap despite billions of dollars and decades of effort.... when people CHOOSE to live a Gap - that is their personal choice and nobody else's.

As for Indigenous incarceration they just need to accept personal sovereignty and choose to not engage in criminal actions...

I've invited you before to get out there in the Outback and go around selling your ideas to the Cheers - see if you come back in one piece and an unchanged person.

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 11^th, 2022 at 5:07pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 11th, 2022 at 4:27pm: ;D So whether Australian political parties can cater for you depends on the colour of your skin. Is this the "fact" you are asking me to refute? Yes. Obviously Oz political parties are failing to eradicate the (black) gap. Quote: Why did you edit out of your post the bit about the political parties not catering to people of certain skin colours? Because you apparently cannot cope with more than one idea at a time....the 2nd point being: "whereas non-blacks are catered for by centre Left and centre Right parties who fight it out over disadvantage within the non-black community". Interestingly, there is also a gap - between rich and poor - in the non-black community, but the political parties DO address ('fight it out') this issue, meaning the political contest is NOT race-based , cf the black gap which IS race based; eg non blacks have a ten-year longer life span than blacks...aka 'the gap'. [quote]Why did you edit out of your post the bit about the political parties not catering to people of certain skin colours?

Explained above, your capacity to consider more than one idea at a time is obviously severely challenged.

So after I took it one line at a time, lo and behold you have joined the debate...


Quote:

You almost said something, but then you got scared of your own words. You're not exactly the bravest little pink, are you?

Addressed ...and refuted above.


[/quote]


Absolute bullshye..... Bob Hawke made this statement 35 years ago ....

"By 1990, no Australian child will be living in poverty,"

the then-prime minister told Labor's election campaign launch on June 23, 1987.

So was Hawke only referring to non Indigenous children?

Or was he referring to all Australian children?

2 years ago the Australian Council of Social Service & the UNSW Sydney did a study that found out of 4.7million children 17.7% of all Australian children under 15 i.e. 774,000 of them are living in poverty. 

https://apo.org.au/node/276246

All Australian children ..... NO RACE GAP.

Of that 4.7 million children 5.9% or 278,000 are ATSI.

Not all of those ATSI children are living in poverty.

You see where the numbers are going?

So if you applied a similar % of the 17.7% "all" figure you'd have 49,000 ATSI children living in poverty.

The issue needs to be tackled nationally as a whole ..... not based on race.

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 11:00am:

Gnads wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 10:21am: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 10:39am: Gnads wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 9:50am: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 9:07am: Gnads wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 8:49am: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 10th, 2022 at 8:32am: freediver wrote on Sep 9th, 2022 at 9:55pm: Both ideas seem to have the same problem - lack of detail. And both ideas lack detail because no-one likes what they see, if they ever get to see it. see how conservatives fuss about the letter of the law; a voice is just that, an advice from black communities to Parliament - which may or may not be taken; and removal of the UK monarch as head of state in Oz.   (The issue of electing an Oz head of state is minor, though people think their "freedom" is at stake) Phark me hooray - they already have a voice & the mechanisms to be heard in Parliament ... No they have c 15 separate voices (according to you) in Parliament, displaying the usual L-R divide. Quote: that's what 15 plus elected Aboriginal MPs and Senators are there for....... how does this continually escape you? Addressed above. A consensus voice as opposed to the 15 separate voices currently in Parliament. [quote]They do not need a duplication or a non elected voice directly to PARLIAMENT. The voice would represent a 'black party' (though without actually existing as a party in parliament), as the ALP represents the voice of the Oz centre left, for exmple. [quote]It's a nonsense. Refuted above. Your refutation isn't worth squat. Does everyone else get a consensus voice? The point is blacks need a 'consensus voice' to advise parliament, so long as the gap exists; whereas non-blacks are catered for, by centre Left and centre Right parties who fight it out over disadvantage within the non-black community. [quote]Or does the plethora of separate voices above the Aboriginal 15 ..... all they have to make do with? ::) What you say is a discriminatory race based notion.... and not workable.

Addressed above; as long as a black 'gap' exists, we ARE dealing with a "race-based notion".


Quote:

It's nothing more than symbolic appeasement based on race.

Refuted above - if no black gap existed, there would be no need for a voice, symbolic or not. 
[/quote]


;D The fictitious gender pay gap .... [/quote]

Not ficticious, most women are employed in underpaid caring professions, hence "the gender pay gap", and all the flow-on effects: super, housing, poverty levels.


Quote:

now you're pedalling a "black gap" as a reason for the duplication of representation to Parliament.

Yes, a voice may help to  identify the nature of the problem which thus far have proved intractable.


Quote:

everything you're barrowing here is race based bullshyte.

So long as a 'black gap' exists, necessary solutions ARE 'race-based'.
[/quote]


Here's where you're still wrong ..... they are not underpaid.

They are paid for hours worked.

What they may be is "under employed". Not enough hours.

There are many males in that sort of employment as well.

CASUAL/PART TIME & UNDER EMPLOYED.

It isn't under paid ... unless the employer is stooping to breaking the law.

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 11:44am:

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 10:49am: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 10:08am: Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 11th, 2022 at 8:36pm: Why would that be? Please Explain?  Why is it 'troll schills' who end with a question?  What makes you think that? Is it not more likely and most likely that they raise questions so as to make you think about the subject matter? Is this not instead a way of your getting out from under the terrible burden of actually answering to the issue? Not in fraudiver's case.. Now you both need to acknowledge the usefulness of a consensus, black, race-based voice to advise parliament, while the black gap exists. No way, Jose` - they already have more representation than they need - what they need is the willingness to get out of 'living their way' or go that way exclusively without us, and take their chances. In any case we need to close the gap...which you of course deny even exists: https://www.iwgia.org/en/news/4344-aboriginal-people-in-australia-the-most-imprisoned-people-on-earth.html Aboriginal people in Australia: the most imprisoned people on Earth HOW we close the gap is up for debate; but the idea of blacks reverting to the hunter gatherer culture in modern Oz is obviously absurd. btw, blacks didn't display the social dysfunction  pre 1770s they are now experiencing...consider: why is that?  Quote: I 'need' to acknowledge no such thing... is it a racist, Apartheidist lie from start to finish and has no beneficial outcomes ... Well, given you deny the black gap exists, we have this typical GIGO proposition from you. [quote]I'd like to see the one time in my life, as a 'White' - that I've been catered to.... FFS...

If you are 'working class', the ALP is 'here to help' (!...except the ALP has turned into a neoliberal toad, so you are abandoned..); if you are small business or wealthy, you are "catered to" by the Coalition.


Quote:

This country needs to stop right now in its tracks and get itself back on the rails....and the first step, as I told Albo pre-election - is to get away from the politics of division and the policies of exclusion.... clearly Albo is incapable of listening... I cannot reason with this man ....

I feel your pain...he rejected my copy of 'The Deficit Myth' which actually contains the key to allowing re-establishment and enlargement of the highly successful CDEP trashed by the neoliberal toad Howard


Quote:

You cannot, by definition, include one small group by excluding the majority. Get over it.

An advisory - presumbly consensus -  black voice to parliament (existing outside parliamnet), which may  assist in closing the gap,  is NOT equivalent to  'including one small group by excluding the majority", because the proposed voice will exist outside parliament.
[/quote]

more Deadly Choices ey?  ;D

Stop being a patronising excuse maker.

Gnads wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 1:01pm:

Here's where you're still wrong ..... they are not underpaid.

Yes they are, that's why age care workers are leaving in droves. 


Quote:

They are paid for hours worked.

..and full time pay is inadequate, for the skills required. 


Quote:

What they may be is "under employed". Not enough hours.

 

That too.....


Quote:

There are many males in that sort of employment as well.

(guick google):

"Male workers currently account for 13.0% of the residential and 11.2% of the community aged care workforces".28 Feb 2019


Quote:

CASUAL/PART TIME & UNDER EMPLOYED. It isn't under paid ... unless the employer is stooping to breaking the law.

Involuntary underemployment is another topic; low full-time wages in the caring professions is the major cause of the "gender pay gap" i

Imprisoned because of crimes committed

They just need to stop breaking the laws

Gnads wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 1:04pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 11:44am: Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 10:49am: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 10:08am: Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Sep 11th, 2022 at 8:36pm: Why would that be? Please Explain?  Why is it 'troll schills' who end with a question?  What makes you think that? Is it not more likely and most likely that they raise questions so as to make you think about the subject matter? Is this not instead a way of your getting out from under the terrible burden of actually answering to the issue? Not in fraudiver's case.. Now you both need to acknowledge the usefulness of a consensus, black, race-based voice to advise parliament, while the black gap exists. No way, Jose` - they already have more representation than they need - what they need is the willingness to get out of 'living their way' or go that way exclusively without us, and take their chances. In any case we need to close the gap...which you of course deny even exists: https://www.iwgia.org/en/news/4344-aboriginal-people-in-australia-the-most-imprisoned-people-on-earth.html Aboriginal people in Australia: the most imprisoned people on Earth HOW we close the gap is up for debate; but the idea of blacks reverting to the hunter gatherer culture in modern Oz is obviously absurd. btw, blacks didn't display the social dysfunction  pre 1770s they are now experiencing...consider: why is that?  Quote: I 'need' to acknowledge no such thing... is it a racist, Apartheidist lie from start to finish and has no beneficial outcomes ... Well, given you deny the black gap exists, we have this typical GIGO proposition from you. [quote]I'd like to see the one time in my life, as a 'White' - that I've been catered to.... FFS... If you are 'working class', the ALP is 'here to help' (!...except the ALP has turned into a neoliberal toad, so you are abandoned..); if you are small business or wealthy, you are "catered to" by the Coalition. [quote]This country needs to stop right now in its tracks and get itself back on the rails....and the first step, as I told Albo pre-election - is to get away from the politics of division and the policies of exclusion.... clearly Albo is incapable of listening... I cannot reason with this man ....

I feel your pain...he rejected my copy of 'The Deficit Myth' which actually contains the key to allowing re-establishment and enlargement of the highly successful CDEP trashed by the neoliberal toad Howard


Quote:

You cannot, by definition, include one small group by excluding the majority. Get over it.

An advisory - presumbly consensus -  black voice to parliament (existing outside parliamnet), which may  assist in closing the gap,  is NOT equivalent to  'including one small group by excluding the majority", because the proposed voice will exist outside parliament.
[/quote]

more Deadly Choices ey?  ;D[/quote]

Not "choices", an advisory voice (outside Parliament) arrived at by consensus.   


Quote:

Stop being a patronising excuse maker.

Action, not "excuse making" is required to  close the gap.  You need to follow your own advice, and stop making excuses for NOT closing the gap.

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 11:49am:

Kat wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 11:13am: Gnads wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 10:21am: ;D The fictitious gender pay gap .... now you're pedalling a "black gap" as a reason for the duplication of representation to Parliament. everything you're barrowing here is race based bullshyte.    Well, no. It's anything but 'fictitious'. It's not universal, by any means - I've worked with women in some of my jobs and we've received the same wage for the same work. But it DOES exist in some fields - mostly 'professional', for some reason. The feminized nature of the low-paid  caring professions (child care, health and age care) is also a factor in '"the gender pay gap" (ie men on average earn more than women).

That's an oversimplified generality.

Men on average earn more than women?

Doing what?

All you are trying to do is compare apples to rockmelons.

A man doing the same job would be paid the same.


You're like this journo - who had rings run around her with logic, composure & professionalism.

https://youtu.be/aMcjxSThD54

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 1:11pm:

Gnads wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 1:01pm: Here's where you're still wrong ..... they are not underpaid. Yes they are, that's why age care workers are leaving in droves.  Quote: They are paid for hours worked. ..and full time pay is inadequate, for the skills required.  [quote]What they may be is "under employed". Not enough hours.

 

That too.....


Quote:

There are many males in that sort of employment as well.

(guick google):

"Male workers currently account for 13.0% of the residential and 11.2% of the community aged care workforces".28 Feb 2019


Quote:

CASUAL/PART TIME & UNDER EMPLOYED. It isn't under paid ... unless the employer is stooping to breaking the law.

Involuntary underemployment is another topic; low full-time wages in the caring professions is the major cause of the "gender pay gap" i
[/quote]


No ... they are not getting under paid. They are leaving because they aren't getting enough hours & they are being expected to do the work of 2 or more people because of staff shortages.

They are low paid jobs but they are not underpaid.

You're still wrong - because if you're a male working in one of those jobs in Child or Aged Care ... and there are some ....

they get the same low salary/ rate of pay.

To say different is lying.

Gnads wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 1:54pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 11:49am: Kat wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 11:13am: Gnads wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 10:21am: ;D The fictitious gender pay gap .... now you're pedalling a "black gap" as a reason for the duplication of representation to Parliament. everything you're barrowing here is race based bullshyte.    Well, no. It's anything but 'fictitious'. It's not universal, by any means - I've worked with women in some of my jobs and we've received the same wage for the same work. But it DOES exist in some fields - mostly 'professional', for some reason. The feminized nature of the low-paid  caring professions (child care, health and age care) is also a factor in '"the gender pay gap" (ie men on average earn more than women). That's an oversimplified generality. Men on average earn more than women? Doing what?

Trades like building/electrical  etc etc,  more highly paid than carers in age care etc.


Quote:

All you are trying to do is compare apples to rockmelons.

Refuted above.


Quote:

A man doing the same job would be paid the same.

Correct....but women on average do different work to men. 


Quote:

You're like this journo - who had rings run around her with logic, composure & professionalism. https://youtu.be/aMcjxSThD54

Oh no..the awful Jordan Peterson, I'd make a fool of him in 10 minutes or less.

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 4:08pm:

Oh no..the awful Jordan Peterson, I'd make a fool of him in 10 minutes or less.

No, you wouldn't.

Don't mistake Peterson's fractured personality for stupidity.

Peterson's very first stupidity:

journo: " women earn less than men"

peterson: "no they dont"

journo: "The pay gap is 9 percent less on average"

peterson:Yes but there are multiple reasons for that..."

So he agreed there IS a pay gap..... contradicting his earlier statement....

Admittedly, we can see the female journo is oblivious to the disadvantages of bearing children, vis a vis full time careers, but Peterson is also confused by "multi varied analysis which shows the pay gap doesn't exist", when 50 % of the population - by gender -  are earning 9% less on average.   

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 4:08pm:

Gnads wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 1:54pm: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 11:49am: Kat wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 11:13am: Gnads wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 10:21am: ;D The fictitious gender pay gap .... now you're pedalling a "black gap" as a reason for the duplication of representation to Parliament. everything you're barrowing here is race based bullshyte.    Well, no. It's anything but 'fictitious'. It's not universal, by any means - I've worked with women in some of my jobs and we've received the same wage for the same work. But it DOES exist in some fields - mostly 'professional', for some reason. The feminized nature of the low-paid  caring professions (child care, health and age care) is also a factor in '"the gender pay gap" (ie men on average earn more than women). That's an oversimplified generality. Men on average earn more than women? Doing what? Trades like building/electrical  etc etc,  more highly paid than carers in age care etc. Quote: All you are trying to do is compare apples to rockmelons. Refuted above. [quote]A man doing the same job would be paid the same.

Correct....but women on average do different work to men. 


Quote:

You're like this journo - who had rings run around her with logic, composure & professionalism. https://youtu.be/aMcjxSThD54

Oh no..the awful Jordan Peterson, I'd make a fool of him in 10 minutes or less.
[/quote]




Bwahahahahahaha.

So out of everyone that's tried, you think you can....... and you're telling an internet forum.
How come you're not leading one of these crazy terrorist lefty groups who are trying oh so desperately to "make a fool of him" .
Even news anchors get left high and dry.
It's smacking hilarious.
And ya's label him far right, well your media does and you just parrot it.

Good luck
Hope to see you one day try and pull this off.

When nations, cultures and races place importance upon 'youth' - it generates a faster breeding practice of mass production population growth.
If you can't over-power your enemies, then just out-breed them.

These nations, cultures and races could be said to have "Not grown up" so to speak. Just breed without the responsibility to take responsibility. They become resentful of wealthier nations with better quality of life and they seek to sponge 'easy' of such neighbours. Etc, etc. You all know the score.

Peterson is right in "Growing Up" - but the most 'adult' male character possible is the one that has never experience sex and gives himself totally to the greater good of the people and thus inherits or creates a Position of Power and Privilege for his sacrifice.

So its a double edged sword.
Being a Man isn't just a universal standard - there is at least x8 variations of being a Man.
With advantages and disadvantages for each.

Another Black or White clip of absolutism.  ::)
Peterson is smart, but he's just replicating what's already known. Nothing really new.

Here's just x4 types of Males which are BETA's (ie: they serve the Alpha Females).
Gays
Yobbos
Wankers
Rednecks

These four could easily sum up the x4 Middle-Eastern Religions of
Zarathustrianism
Judaism
Christianity
Mohommedism


Grow Up?
Well there is also x8 Regions of the World and Dear Peterson: Which way should Men grow up as?

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 4:39pm:

Peterson's very first stupidity: journo: " women earn less than men" peterson: "no they dont" journo: "The pay gap is 9 percent less on average" peterson:Yes but there are multiple reasons for that..." So he agreed there IS a pay gap..... contradicting his earlier statement....

That's not even close to the transcript.

Read it before you put words in his mouth.

https://scrapsfromtheloft.com/psychology/jordan-petersons-channel-4-interview-cathy-newman-transcript/

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 4:08pm:

Gnads wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 1:54pm: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 11:49am: Kat wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 11:13am: Gnads wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 10:21am: ;D The fictitious gender pay gap .... now you're pedalling a "black gap" as a reason for the duplication of representation to Parliament. everything you're barrowing here is race based bullshyte.    Well, no. It's anything but 'fictitious'. It's not universal, by any means - I've worked with women in some of my jobs and we've received the same wage for the same work. But it DOES exist in some fields - mostly 'professional', for some reason. The feminized nature of the low-paid  caring professions (child care, health and age care) is also a factor in '"the gender pay gap" (ie men on average earn more than women). That's an oversimplified generality. Men on average earn more than women? Doing what? Trades like building/electrical  etc etc,  more highly paid than carers in age care etc. Quote: All you are trying to do is compare apples to rockmelons. Refuted above. [quote]A man doing the same job would be paid the same.

Correct....but women on average do different work to men. 


Quote:

You're like this journo - who had rings run around her with logic, composure & professionalism. https://youtu.be/aMcjxSThD54

Oh no..the awful Jordan Peterson, I'd make a fool of him in 10 minutes or less.
[/quote]


There's your answer right there.

And regardless of gender tradesmen & trades women, who do a 4 year apprenticeship and are proficient in their trade are always going to earn more than someone unskilled working in Aged Care or an Assistant in Childcare.

My sister in law was  an Early Childhood teacher at Govt & private Kindies & Preps. She also had 2 children during her career.

She was always well paid & before she retired was head of a  large Early Childhood unit in Toowoomba.

She had a generous salary & a large super when she finished.

The Gender Pay gap is a furphy & so is your racist "black Gap".

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 4:08pm:

Gnads wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 1:54pm: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 11:49am: Kat wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 11:13am: Gnads wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 10:21am: ;D The fictitious gender pay gap .... now you're pedalling a "black gap" as a reason for the duplication of representation to Parliament. everything you're barrowing here is race based bullshyte.    Well, no. It's anything but 'fictitious'. It's not universal, by any means - I've worked with women in some of my jobs and we've received the same wage for the same work. But it DOES exist in some fields - mostly 'professional', for some reason. The feminized nature of the low-paid  caring professions (child care, health and age care) is also a factor in '"the gender pay gap" (ie men on average earn more than women). That's an oversimplified generality. Men on average earn more than women? Doing what? Trades like building/electrical  etc etc,  more highly paid than carers in age care etc. Quote: All you are trying to do is compare apples to rockmelons. Refuted above. [quote]A man doing the same job would be paid the same.

Correct....but women on average do different work to men. 


Quote:

You're like this journo - who had rings run around her with logic, composure & professionalism. https://youtu.be/aMcjxSThD54

Oh no..the awful Jordan Peterson, I'd make a fool of him in 10 minutes or less.
[/quote]

In your deluded lefty dreams. ::)

He'd eat you for breakfast

You wouldn't make a 5 min smoko let alone 10.

Gnads wrote on Sep 12^th, 2022 at 5:51pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 4:08pm: Gnads wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 1:54pm: thegreatdivide wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 11:49am: Kat wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 11:13am: Gnads wrote on Sep 12th, 2022 at 10:21am: ;D The fictitious gender pay gap .... now you're pedalling a "black gap" as a reason for the duplication of representation to Parliament. everything you're barrowing here is race based bullshyte.    Well, no. It's anything but 'fictitious'. It's not universal, by any means - I've worked with women in some of my jobs and we've received the same wage for the same work. But it DOES exist in some fields - mostly 'professional', for some reason. The feminized nature of the low-paid  caring professions (child care, health and age care) is also a factor in '"the gender pay gap" (ie men on average earn more than women). That's an oversimplified generality. Men on average earn more than women? Doing what? Trades like building/electrical  etc etc,  more highly paid than carers in age care etc. Quote: All you are trying to do is compare apples to rockmelons. Refuted above. [quote]A man doing the same job would be paid the same. Correct....but women on average do different work to men.  [quote]You're like this journo - who had rings run around her with logic, composure & professionalism. https://youtu.be/aMcjxSThD54

Oh no..the awful Jordan Peterson, I'd make a fool of him in 10 minutes or less.
[/quote]


There's your answer right there.

And regardless of gender tradesmen & trades women, who do a 4 year apprenticeship and are proficient in their trade are always going to earn more than someone unskilled working in Aged Care or an Assistant in Childcare.

My sister in law was  an Early Childhood teacher at Govt & private Kindies & Preps. She also had 2 children during her career.

She was always well paid & before she retired was head of a  large Early Childhood unit in Toowoomba.

She had a generous salary & a large super when she finished.

The Gender Pay gap is a furphy & so is your racist "black Gap".[/quote]

Yet even the obnoxious Peterson admits in the link you shared and claimed to have watched, that the pay gap is a real thing. He just claims that it is multifaceted.

In true Peterson style, he thinks he's being cleverer than everyone else when he says this ... the fact is of course that feminists have been saying the exact same thing for generations.