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Member Run Boards >> Environment >> More from JM's tripe -IPCC
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Message started by lee on Mar 21st, 2023 at 12:09pm

Title: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Mar 21st, 2023 at 12:09pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Mar 21st, 2023 at 9:53am:
https://theconversation.com/it-can-be-done-it-must-be-done-ipcc-delivers-definitive-report-on-climate-change-and-where-to-now-201763

Grim. Possible by heroic effort to keep AGW below 1.5°C above preindustrial level.

It probably will not happen. Money before lives, esp third world lives.

Have a read.


So much in this latest instalment of AR6. But it doesn't marry up with WG1 - The Physical Science Basis.



The garudian offers this -

"Scientists deliver ‘final warning’ on climate crisis: act now or it’s too late"

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/mar/20/ipcc-climate-crisis-report-delivers-final-warning-on-15c

According to the UN 2021 was "Code Red for Humanity"

2020 "Mark Lynas’s ‘Final warning’ on climate: ‘It’s all on us, here, now,’ says reviewer "

https://yaleclimateconnections.org/2020/08/mark-lynas-final-warning-on-climate-its-all-on-us-here-now/


1989 "A senior U.N. environmental official says entire nations could be wiped off the face of the Earth by rising sea levels if the global warming trend is not reversed by the year 2000. "

https://www.apnews.com/bd45c372caf118ec99964ea547880cd0

And to date? Nada, Zip, Nothing.

::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by PZ547 on Mar 21st, 2023 at 12:22pm
;D ;D ;D ;D


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on Mar 21st, 2023 at 5:17pm
This says it all:


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Xavier on Mar 21st, 2023 at 6:00pm
Venus - the Pollution Effect
Mars - the War Effect


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by AusGeoff on Mar 22nd, 2023 at 6:09am
Coal power plant permitting, construction starts and new project
announcements accelerated dramatically in China in 2022, with new
permits reaching the highest level since 2015. The coal power
capacity starting construction in China was SIX TIMES as large
as that in all of the rest of the world combined.

China permits two new coal power plants per week in 2022.

       >:(




Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on Mar 22nd, 2023 at 3:26pm

AusGeoff wrote on Mar 22nd, 2023 at 6:09am:
Coal power plant permitting, construction starts and new project
announcements accelerated dramatically in China in 2022, with new
permits reaching the highest level since 2015. The coal power
capacity starting construction in China was SIX TIMES as large
as that in all of the rest of the world combined.

China permits two new coal power plants per week in 2022.

       >:(




But try and explain that to Monk.    :-?

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Xavier on Mar 22nd, 2023 at 7:28pm
Monk thinks he's so smart like a computer.
He needs the information punched into him.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Lisa Jones on Mar 22nd, 2023 at 8:56pm

Jasin wrote on Mar 22nd, 2023 at 7:28pm:
Monk thinks he's so smart like a computer.
He needs the information punched into him.


😂🤣😆😂🤣😆😂🤣😆😂🤣😆😂🤣😆😂🤣😆😂🤣😆😂🤣😆😂🤣😆😂🤣😆

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Lisa Jones on Mar 22nd, 2023 at 9:01pm
https://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1193232501/273#273

Speaking of Dumbarse Drunk...the tosspot has well and truly lost his marbles.

Dumbarse Drunk is posting away the following delusional confabulation: He has convinced himself that I had twins whilst posting at PA. And that I delivered said twins when they were in utero for just 6 months ffs! Oh and I had them at age 60 too 😂😂😆

He’s also chronically posting about his tea cups in the above link. He clearly has no idea what topic he’s in.


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Mar 23rd, 2023 at 3:42pm

Quote:
Keith Strong
@drkstrong
THE SUN CLIMATE CONNECTION https://youtu.be/jh2X-FREk8Y via @YouTube

THE SUN CLIMATE CONNECTION
The Sun does not affect our weather or climate (in the short term - less than millions of years) nor does it affect earthquakes or volcanic eruptions.


https://youtu.be/jh2X-FREk8Y


The coup de grace to the idiotic “GSM so Ice Age” nonsense.[/quote]

So what happens when the Sun goes dark? It will take a million years for the impact to be felt? ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on Mar 23rd, 2023 at 6:32pm

Jasin wrote on Mar 22nd, 2023 at 7:28pm:
Monk thinks he's so smart like a computer.
He needs the information punched into him.



China, India and Indonesia are doing most of the polluting and CO2 addition to our atmosphere - not us.


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Dnarever on Mar 23rd, 2023 at 9:16pm

Bobby. wrote on Mar 23rd, 2023 at 6:32pm:

Jasin wrote on Mar 22nd, 2023 at 7:28pm:
Monk thinks he's so smart like a computer.
He needs the information punched into him.



China, India and Indonesia are doing most of the polluting and CO2 addition to our atmosphere - not us.


So us adding more on top of all the others doesn't matter then?

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Lisa Jones on Mar 24th, 2023 at 8:55am

Dnarever wrote on Mar 23rd, 2023 at 9:16pm:

Bobby. wrote on Mar 23rd, 2023 at 6:32pm:

Jasin wrote on Mar 22nd, 2023 at 7:28pm:
Monk thinks he's so smart like a computer.
He needs the information punched into him.



China, India and Indonesia are doing most of the polluting and CO2 addition to our atmosphere - not us.


So us adding more on top of all the others doesn't matter then?


And once again Puddle Duck proves he is unable to grasp what’s being posted at him. 😐

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on Mar 24th, 2023 at 9:15am

Dnarever wrote on Mar 23rd, 2023 at 9:16pm:

Bobby. wrote on Mar 23rd, 2023 at 6:32pm:

Jasin wrote on Mar 22nd, 2023 at 7:28pm:
Monk thinks he's so smart like a computer.
He needs the information punched into him.



China, India and Indonesia are doing most of the polluting and CO2 addition to our atmosphere - not us.


So us adding more on top of all the others doesn't matter then?



No but we're doing our bit -

why isn't China doing their bit?

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Mar 24th, 2023 at 12:33pm

Dnarever wrote on Mar 23rd, 2023 at 9:16pm:
So us adding more on top of all the others doesn't matter then?



Australia is a NET carbon SINK. That means we don't ADD anything.  ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Mar 28th, 2023 at 12:29pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Mar 28th, 2023 at 7:09am:
Dr K Strong on the latest IPCC report:

https://youtu.be/g8FwpTcmpuU


The SREX is done through hours and hours of negotiations between politicians, not scientists. It doesn't even use AR6 WG1 - The Physical Science Basis as the basis of the report. That means it relies on the Non- Scientific Basis.

It is where the InterGOVERNMENTAL Panel on Climate Change gets its name. ::)

From the same bloke who uses a photoshopped poor poley bear on an incredibly unstable small ice floe. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 5th, 2023 at 7:23pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 4th, 2023 at 6:17am:
Note that this graph is of lower troposphere temperatures, not surface temperatures.

Up to 2012 it looks like a gentle rise in temperatures, after 2012 the rise is faster even with the three La Ninas on the trot.

I see deniers wank on all the time—oh, temperature in 2019 is lower (or same) as temperature in, say, 1980. I just wonder if they are comparing a winter temperature in 2010 with a summer temperature in 1980.

Clearly there is a trend to increasing temperatures, even in a chart giving far too much weight to seasonal fluctuations. Look at the red line. The very last temperature would not be included in the position of the ref line until April figures are known





What JM doesn't seem to know is that the NH has the bulk of the temperature increase. The Top of the graph then is the NH and the countercyclical the SH.

And the temperature for 2019 isn't the same as 1980. Anyone who can read a graph can tell. It looks like JM can't do that either. ::)

The last red figure on the 13 month trailing average is not in April, it is in March. And March is finished. And it is strange he doesn't want to talk about the plateau in temperatures.

Next he'll be on about a new super size el Nino. ::)



Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Jovial Monk on Apr 5th, 2023 at 7:30pm
Did I not say that April was not included in the red line?

The graph is of global temperatures, not part NH and part SH, like ?????????

Plateau of temperatures—the last 3, La Nina years?

We know volcanoes and La Ninas cause a temporary dip in temperatures, El Ninos cause a rise.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 5th, 2023 at 7:40pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 5th, 2023 at 7:30pm:
Did I not say that April was not included in the red line?


Nope.


lee wrote on Apr 5th, 2023 at 7:23pm:
The very last temperature would not be included in the position of the ref line until April figures are known


If your graph goes to March that is your ref.


Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 5th, 2023 at 7:30pm:
The graph is of global temperatures, not part NH and part SH, like ?????????


Ah so you believe Summer in Australia overrides Winter in the NH. Interesting. ::)


Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 5th, 2023 at 7:30pm:
Plateau of temperatures—the last 3, La Nina years?



Yes since 2016 the last 7 years. Or do you only want to consider the 7 years from 2012? ::)


Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 5th, 2023 at 7:30pm:
We know volcanoes and La Ninas cause a temporary dip in temperatures, El Ninos cause a rise.


Yes. But the Volcanoes don't rely on La Nina. And Las Nina are temporary, as are Los Ninos. ::)


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Jovial Monk on Apr 5th, 2023 at 7:46pm
I didn’t say La Ninas needed volcanoes! Are you going daft lee?

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 5th, 2023 at 7:52pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 5th, 2023 at 7:46pm:
I didn’t say La Ninas needed volcanoes! Are you going daft lee?


Well it was you that linked them. So are Los Ninos temporary also? You carefully didn't say. ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Jovial Monk on Apr 5th, 2023 at 8:05pm
La Ninas are temporary, some less so than others.

Imagine having 3 El Ninos in a row!

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 5th, 2023 at 8:50pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 5th, 2023 at 8:05pm:
La Ninas are temporary, some less so than others.

Imagine having 3 El Ninos in a row!


I guess you think they are permanent. ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 8th, 2023 at 2:30pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:48am:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/apr/08/australias-climate-battle-has-moved-on-leaving-deniers-behind


Excerpts - "Though I had come to Australia to research the impacts of climate change on extreme weather events, it instead became my lived experience."

One year here and he lived climate change. ;D ;D ;D ;D

"The governing Coalition had left a trail of death and destruction, both figuratively and literally."

The government caused the fire and destruction. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

"Thousands of homes were destroyed, dozens of lives lost, 24 million hectares burned, and Australia was shunned from an international climate summit over the then prime minister Scott Morrison’s climate intransigence."


Actually it was less than 19 million. Not good, but not as bad as said. I guess we need to make things worse than they were because...climate change. ::)

"Meanwhile, the rightwing Murdoch media machine continued to spew climate disinformation, cynically blaming the devastation on arson and “back-burning”. "

Climate change doesn't light fires. Humans cause 90% of fires directly. ::)

But hey when you have to splice, for some inexplicable reason, temperature data sets and tree ring "data" from recent periods, you have to wonder why. I mean tree rings respond more to water than temperature, proxy data has wider error bars than thermometers. But he is a "Climate Scientist"TM


"After substantial progress at Cop26 in Glasgow, the Cop27 meeting in Sharm El Sheikh late last year yielded minimal additional progress, failing to secure emissions reductions from the countries of the world that will keep warming of the planet below a catastrophic 1.5C."

There is absolutely no data that establishes 1.5c as "catastrophic". 2C was dreamed up by an economist not a Climate Scientist. 1.5 c was dreamed up by the IPCC but with no evidence. ::)

But JM believes. He would Sanctify Mann. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 8th, 2023 at 3:11pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 3:03pm:
LOL! Predictably, lee had to comment on the article by Mann.

Poor desperate lee.



Predictably JM couldn't refute so didn't respond here. ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:15pm

Bobby. wrote on Mar 21st, 2023 at 5:17pm:
This says it all:



Duuuuh perhaps because we want to reserve our coal for export. And having alternative sources of energy would be what should be powering our needs.

I am actually all for nuclear power plants being built.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:27pm

Lisa Jones wrote on Mar 24th, 2023 at 8:55am:

Dnarever wrote on Mar 23rd, 2023 at 9:16pm:

Bobby. wrote on Mar 23rd, 2023 at 6:32pm:

Jasin wrote on Mar 22nd, 2023 at 7:28pm:
Monk thinks he's so smart like a computer.
He needs the information punched into him.



China, India and Indonesia are doing most of the polluting and CO2 addition to our atmosphere - not us.


So us adding more on top of all the others doesn't matter then?


And once again Puddle Duck proves he is unable to grasp what’s being posted at him. 😐


What is wrong with what DNA wrote? Australia might contribute a small proportion of the air pollution and CO2 to the atmosphere. But it still adds to what the larger populated countries make.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:29pm

lee wrote on Mar 24th, 2023 at 12:33pm:

Dnarever wrote on Mar 23rd, 2023 at 9:16pm:
So us adding more on top of all the others doesn't matter then?



Australia is a NET carbon SINK. That means we don't ADD anything.  ::)


Despite our situation about being a carbon sink area, adding carbon to the atmosphere still adds to the atmosphere.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:45pm

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:29pm:
Despite our situation about being a carbon sink area, adding carbon to the atmosphere still adds to the atmosphere.



Not in Australia. ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Belgarion on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:49pm
Can any of you climate alarmists tell me what the optimum level of atmospheric CO2 is? 

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:54pm

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:27pm:
Australia might contribute a small proportion of the air pollution and CO2 to the atmosphere.


Might? We don't add CO2 to the atmosphere. As for pollution, it is dispersed by wind. The Blue Mountains are actually natural pollution. The terpenes emitted by Gum trees are what give the Blue Mountains the Blue effect, via the prism effect.


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Xavier on Apr 8th, 2023 at 6:19pm
That 'Blue Haze' is a very subduing narcotic effect.
No wonder Abos didn't feel like building big rubbish to imaginary gods.  :D

Title: Re: More from latest IPCC Report.
Post by Jovial Monk on Apr 8th, 2023 at 9:37pm

Belgarion wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:49pm:
Can any of you climate alarmists tell me what the optimum level of atmospheric CO2 is? 


About 320ppm be good. Milder climate than now, melting of land ice be a lot slower than now. Higher sea levels would help moderate climate—if this happens slowly populations and infrastructure etc could be moved to higher altitudes.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 8th, 2023 at 11:00pm

lee wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:45pm:

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:29pm:
Despite our situation about being a carbon sink area, adding carbon to the atmosphere still adds to the atmosphere.



Not in Australia. ::)


Yes, in Australia.  ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 8th, 2023 at 11:06pm

lee wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:54pm:

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:27pm:
Australia might contribute a small proportion of the air pollution and CO2 to the atmosphere.


Might? We don't add CO2 to the atmosphere. As for pollution, it is dispersed by wind. The Blue Mountains are actually natural pollution. The terpenes emitted by Gum trees are what give the Blue Mountains the Blue effect, via the prism effect.


I don't know where you live. But, in my small town, the cars generate enough pollution as it is to contribute to the air pollution. Cities like Brisbane (at least 25 times the population of where I live) had air pollution levels that I would suggest on par with what I breathed on a day of heavy traffic (perhaps when I rode home from school near the school). We also cut down trees and breathe. Both of which 25 million Australians add to the atmosphere of CO2 concentrations.

I bet those trees in the Blue Mountains do more to reduce CO2 levels than what you realise. If you have been to the rainforests in northeast Australia, you would see how heavy the air feels with oxygen.

Title: Re: More from latest IPCC Report.
Post by Belgarion on Apr 9th, 2023 at 9:45am

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 9:37pm:

Belgarion wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 5:49pm:
Can any of you climate alarmists tell me what the optimum level of atmospheric CO2 is? 


About 320ppm be good. Milder climate than now, melting of land ice be a lot slower than now. Higher sea levels would help moderate climate—if this happens slowly populations and infrastructure etc could be moved to higher altitudes.


So 320ppm is good....much better than the current 400ppm...a change of around 80 ppm - 8 thousandths of 1 percent - will change the climate?

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 9th, 2023 at 12:34pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 9:37pm:
About 320ppm be good.



Link?


Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 9:37pm:
Higher sea levels would help moderate climate—if this happens slowly populations and infrastructure etc could be moved to higher altitudes.



You mean we have rapid Sea Level Rise? How much and where?



Vanuata - shows cycles.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 9th, 2023 at 4:13pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 9th, 2023 at 2:21pm:
Methane in the atmosphere had its fourth-highest annual increase in 2022, the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration reported, part of an overall rise in planet-warming greenhouse gases that the agency called “alarming.”

Though carbon dioxide typically gets more attention for its role in climate change, scientists are particularly concerned about methane because it traps much more heat — about 87 times more than carbon dioxide on a 20-year timescale.


Of course JM comes up with the 87 times figure. Truthfully methane has Global Warming Potential (GWP) of 30. It is measured in parts per BILLION and lasts about 12 years.

https://www.science.org.au/curious/earth-environment/methane

Can you spot the error in this UN publication?

"To be more specific, CO2 concentrations last year reached 415.7 parts per million (ppm), methane 1908 ppm, and nitrous oxide 334.5 ppm."

https://news.un.org/en/story/2022/10/1129887

"Since 2007, global methane concentration has been increasing at an accelerating rate. The annual increases in 2020 and 2021 are the largest since systematic registry began in 1983.

However, scientists still don’t know what the causes of this increase are, but some research indicates that a large amount of this methane is coming from “biogenic sources”, such as wetlands and rice paddies."

ibid

Note: No cows, sheep etc.

"The concentration of methane in the atmosphere has risen sharply—by about 25 teragrams per year — since 2006. "

https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/images/91564/what-is-behind-rising-levels-of-methane-in-the-atmosphere

Stock levels have not increased greatly, if at all, since 2006. So it must be something else.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 10th, 2023 at 1:53pm

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 11:06pm:
Cities like Brisbane (at least 25 times the population of where I live) had air pollution levels that I would suggest on par with what I breathed on a day of heavy traffic (perhaps when I rode home from school near the school).


Yes. Brisbane has a pollution problem. Both Sydney and Brisbane have reasonably low average wind speeds. From 2m/sec or 7.2kmh in Jun to 8kmh in Dec.


UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 8th, 2023 at 11:06pm:
I bet those trees in the Blue Mountains do more to reduce CO2 levels than what you realise. If you have been to the rainforests in northeast Australia, you would see how heavy the air feels with oxygen.


Nope. I am not surprised. According to the Chief Scientist in 2009 we are a carbon sink.

"Which plants store more carbon in Australia: forests or grasses?"

https://www.chiefscientist.gov.au/2009/12/which-plants-store-more-carbon-in-australia-forests-or-grasses

A later study says grasses are more efficient.

"Grasslands more reliable carbon sink than trees"

https://phys.org/news/2018-07-grasslands-reliable-carbon-trees.html

BTW- I have lived in Brisbane and also PNG. ;)


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 11th, 2023 at 11:43am

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 11th, 2023 at 8:44am:
[quote]More CO2 in the atmosphere hurts key plants and crops more than it helps


. . .you may have heard a myth that nature’s balance doesn’t really matter. After all, CO2 is natural, and it helps plants and crops grow. That’s true. But it’s also misleading in that it’s only part of the story. A widely circulated myth suggests that adding extra CO2 to the atmosphere will fertilize plants and crops and make the world greener and better. Unfortunately, that turns out not to be true. . . .

The myth that CO2 is plant food and that “extra” CO2 therefore can’t be bad is an example of a logical fallacy. It sort of sounds right, but it’s a major oversimplification. It’s appealing because it suggests that it’s okay to emit the pollution that causes climate change. But the myth is not true.
Fertilizer alone does not make a successful garden.
A lot of myths have a grain of truth to them. That’s part of what makes them believable – at first. But it’s up to us to look beyond that single fragment of a fact. In the case of the CO2-as-fertilizer myth, you can test the idea by thinking about your own garden. Is fertilizer alone sufficient to create a healthy garden? Of course not. A garden needs the right amount of water, stable weather conditions, and plants that are suited to the local environment. These are the same factors that have been disrupted by an overload of CO2 in the atmosphere. For example, just adding more fertilizer doesn’t help plants when a garden is getting either too much or not enough water.
It’s all about balance.
Nature is like a recipe, with each ingredient needed in just the right measure. A pinch of nutmeg gives pumpkin pie a rich, warm flavor, but a tablespoon of nutmeg would ruin the pie. A car’s engine runs on a precise blend of air, fuel, and spark. Overloading one element disrupts the whole system. Many aspects of nature operate in a similarly balanced way.

For example, the atmosphere has a specific recipe. CO2 and other greenhouse gases are an essential part of the recipe because they trap heat in the atmosphere. With no CO2 Planet Earth would be in a perpetual ice age. But a small amount of CO2 keeps the planet in the famous “Goldilocks and the Three Bears” condition: not too hot, not too cold, but the “just right” zone that’s ideal for life as we know it. Too much CO2 overheats the planet.

By studying Earth’s history, scientists have learned that when there was a lot of CO2 in the atmosphere, the planet was hot. In fact, the last time the Earth had as much CO2 in the atmosphere as it now does was the Pliocene Epoch, more than 3 million years ago. At that time, Earth’s atmosphere was 3.6 to 7.2 degrees Fahrenheit warmer (2 to 4 degrees Celsius) than it is today. And global sea level was 50 to 80 feet (15 to 25 meters) higher.

Climate change is hard on plants.
The basics of climate change are actually easy to understand. Human activities emit around 100 million tons of CO2 every day, mostly by burning fossil fuels, which causes the atmosphere to trap more heat. As a result of that heat-trapping pollution, the atmosphere, land, and oceans have all become warmer. The added heat triggers side effects like more intense rainstorms, floods, prolonged heat waves, and droughts. In turn, those unpleasant conditions lead to more frequent and severe wildfires, insect outbreaks, and crop failures. Sure, today’s plants have a bit more fertilizer from the extra CO2 in the air, but that additional CO2 causes many other problems, harming many plants and crops. Climate change is disrupting plant growth.

Agricultural experiments show negative effects.
Scientists have performed many experiments to see what happens when plants and agricultural crops receive extra CO2. When supplemental CO2 was pumped into the air around plants, they grew faster. For this reason, CO2 is sometimes piped into enclosed greenhouses to boost production. But greenhouse plants also have optimal amounts of water, excellent soil, and controlled temperatures. It’s usually a different story out in the real world.

To conduct a more “real world” experiment, other studies have given plants extra CO2 plus an increase in temperature. In these conditions, many plants and crops grew poorly. In most cases, the boost from CO2 was overwhelmed by the hotter conditions. These experiments demonstrate that the myth of CO2 fertilization is false, and peer-reviewed reports find that major crops like wheat, rice, corn, and soybeans will become less productive as the world heats up.

Likewise, a landmark study in 2018 found that growing rice in high-CO2 conditions makes it less nutritious. As a basic grain, rice plays a critical role in feeding the world’s population. The extra CO2 caused an imbalance within the crop’s chemical makeup, which resulted in rice that had lower amounts of protein, iron, zinc, and B-vitamins. “The entire elemental balance is out of whack,” explained plant physiologist Lewis Ziska, an author of the study. This result is yet another example of how the recipe of nature is being disrupted by excess CO2.


https://yaleclimateconnections.org/2020/12/more-co2-in-the-atmosphere-hurts-key-plants-and-crops-more-than-it-helps/

Do plant have lower vitamins? Marginally true. Do plants have better water tolerance- true but you won't hear about it.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 11th, 2023 at 12:11pm
From the paper (clearly not read by JM)
But spot the weasel words.

"For example, harvests of staple cereal crops, such as rice and maize, could decline by 20 to 40% as a function of increased surface temperatures in tropical and subtropical regions by 2100 without considering the impacts of extreme weather and climate events (3)."

But the tropics is supposed to have the lowest temperature increase.

"As evidenced by over a hundred individual studies and several meta-analyses, projected increases in atmospheric [CO2] can result in an ionomic imbalance for most plant species whereby carbon increases disproportionally to soil-based nutrients (9–11). This imbalance, in turn, may have significant consequences for human nutrition (12, 13) including protein and micronutrients. However, at present, no information is available regarding a key constituent of nutrition, vitamin content; as a result, no integrated assessment (protein, micronutrients, and vitamins) is available."

But that isn't what the headline says.

What is missing from the study is the actual dietary requirement vs any reduction in the crop.

However they do acknowledge that.

"Specific health outcomes of consuming rice with reduced nutritional quality are also difficult to forecast."

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 12th, 2023 at 6:30pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 12th, 2023 at 6:10pm:
Cancer-causing pollution
Air pollution causes millions of deaths worldwide each year, including more than 250,000 from a type of lung cancer called adenocarcinoma. But it has been difficult to investigate how air pollution triggers cancer, in part because its effects are less pronounced than those of better-studied carcinogens such as tobacco smoke or ultraviolet light, says Nik-Zainal.

To unpick the mechanism, cancer researcher Charles Swanton at the Francis Crick Institute in London and his colleagues mined environmental and
epidemiological data from the United Kingdom, Canada, South Korea and Taiwan. To diminish the contribution of tobacco smoke to the data, the team focused on lung cancers that carried mutations in a gene called EGFR. These mutations are more common in lung cancers in people who have never smoked than in those in smokers.

The team found that lung cancers bearing EGFR mutations were associated with exposure to air pollution in the form of inhalable particles with a diameter of 2.5 micrometres or less — less than one-tenth the width of the average grain of pollen. Such pollution is emitted by internal combustion engines, coal-fired power stations and burning wood.


Now let's have a look at pm2.5 -

"In 1996, the EPA’s CASAC concluded that the agency had not demonstrated that PM2.5 kills anyone. Over the next 23 years, the EPA rigged the CASAC review process so that such a conclusion wouldn’t be drawn again. But it did happen again. In 2019 after CASAC had be purged of its political bias, CASAC concluded that EPA’s health claims from PM2.5 were without a scientific basis."

...

"In 2012, a group with which I am affiliated, sued EPA for conducting illegal human clinical research experiments involving PM2.5. By the early 2000s, EPA had concluded that any exposure to PM2.5 could kill in a matter of hours and that elderly and sick people were most at risk. To prove its point, conducted numerous experiments on elderly and sick people in which diesel exhaust from a truck was pipelined into an actual gas chamber where the human guinea pigs inhaled very high levels of PM2.5 for hours at a time.This was illegal because researchers are not allowed to conduct Nazi-like experiments where the purpose is to cause harm, especially without the informed consent of the human guinea pigs.

In its defense to our lawsuit, the EPA stated that it conducted the PM2.5 experiments because the PM2.5 epidemiology was only statistics, and as all researchers know, statistics only demonstrate correlation and correlation is not the same as causation. "

"Despite exposing hundreds of elderly (as old as 80) and sick people (with asthma and heart disease) to extraordinary levels of PM2.5 (as high as 75 times the level in average US outdoor air), not so much as a gasp, wheeze or cough, much less any death, was reported. The clinical research, in fact, provided not an ounce of biological plausibility to the (dubious) epidemiology."

"Although PM2.5 levels in Chinese and Indian cities can reach quite high levels  e.g., 100 times average outdoor levels in the US  no actual deaths are ever reported. The reason for this is that the level of acidic gases always remains in a safe range. Simply inhaling PM2.5 alone kills no one.

Coal miners don’t die earlier"

"When smokers inhale, they inhale a lot of PM2.5. If you live in the US and inhale average air, you will inhale about 240 millionths of a gram of PM2.5 every day. And EPA claims that is a potentially deadly dose of PM2.5.

Now if you are a smoker, not only will you inhale that 240 millionths-of-a-gram every 24 hours, but for every filtered cigarette you smoke, you will inhale and astounding 8,000 to 10,000 millionths-of-a-gram in the five minutes or so it takes to smoke a cigarette. But no one dies from smoking a single cigarette. "

"The EPA invented PM2.5 as the most toxic substance known to man that is, any inhalation can result in death as soon as hours. Or, alternatively, PM2.5 may kill you after a lifetime of (unavoidably) inhaling it. No other substance known to man works this way and there is no body of science to support these claims. The EPA’s own courtroom admission undercuts its claims about the epidemiology and its own human experiments fail to provide any support to the motion that PM2.5 causes adverse health impact, let alone kills.

The EPA has refused for decades to produce the data so independent scientists can try to replicate its epidemiologic studies. The agency has essentially ignored the results of a large well-conducted epidemiologic study that directly contradicts its own. All real-world data contradict EPA’s claims and the smoking epidemiology demonstrates quite clearly just how ludicrous EPA’s claims are."

http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1678438132;start=2;action=threadpagedrop;reversetopic=0


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 15th, 2023 at 1:48pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 14th, 2023 at 9:16pm:
A La Nina pushes cold water to the top of the mid Pacific. This cools the atmosphere but, like the ice in an esky, the cold water heats up. This happened three times in a row—a LOT of heat has been absorbed!


Quote:
Climate models warn of possible ‘super El Niño’ before end of year
Climate researchers say magnitude of predicted weather event uncertain but if an extreme El Niño occurs ‘we’ll need to buckle up’

Climate models around the globe continue to warn of a potential El Niño developing later this year – a pattern of ocean warming in the Pacific that can increase the risk of catastrophic weather events around the globe.

Some models are raising the possibility later this year of an extreme, or “super El Niño”, that is marked by very high temperatures in a central region of the Pacific around the equator.

The last extreme El Niño in 2016 helped push global temperatures to the highest on record, underpinned by human-caused global heating that sparked floods, droughts and disease outbreaks.

Australia’s Bureau of Meteorology said in a Tuesday update that all seven models it had surveyed – including those from weather agencies in the UK, Japan and the US – showed sea surface temperatures passing the El Niño threshold by August.


BoM advise models applied to the Southern hemisphere are less accurate:
[quote]There was a 50% chance of an El Niño developing before the end of the year, the bureau said.

A feature of El Niños is a rise in sea surface temperatures at least 0.8C above the long term average in a region of the central equatorial Pacific. Extreme El Niños feature temperatures in that region of 2C above average.


https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/apr/12/climate-models-warn-of-possible-super-el-nino-before-end-of-year

If the models are wrong we will know that later this year.

Prepare for El Nino—heat, bushfires, destruction of some infrastructure—rail lines may buckle. With three wet years be a lot of vegetation that will be drying starting August. Backburning, clearing of weeds etc etc a must for those in rural areas.[/quote]

Poor JM. Believes in the models. Bow down you heathens Models RULE. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

And all this after BoM ruled that la Nina was ending...in 2021. ;)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 17th, 2023 at 11:24am
The latest -

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 17th, 2023 at 11:06am:
A podcast. Have not listened to this myself yet.

https://theconversation.com/fear-and-wonder-podcast-how-scientists-attribute-extreme-weather-events-to-climate-change-203559


What they do is use two models of earth, one with humans and one without. If it doesn't happen on the humanless model earth, humans done it.

Models RULE ok? ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on Apr 17th, 2023 at 2:45pm
I wonder where the pollution really comes from?

Visual evidence that Australia is a pimple on the backside of the planet when it comes to population density and related CO2 emissions that are supposed to be the cause of "Climate Change".

Can you see Australia on this spike graph map??




Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 18th, 2023 at 12:18pm
https://theconversation.com/torrents-of-antarctic-meltwater-are-slowing-the-currents-that-drive-our-vital-ocean-overturning-and-threaten-its-collapse-202108

From one of the top alarmists

A model - as always ;D ;D ;D ;D

Edit: From the Methods section of E23:

“…and the multi-model ensemble mean of CMIP6 models under a high- anthropogenic-emissions scenario, Shared Socioeconomic Pathway 5-8.5 (SSP5-8.5), for the future climate component from 2020 until 2050.”

You know about even Gavin Schmidt, porogrammer extraordinaire saying don't't use RCP (SSP) 8.5. ::)

https://theconversation.com/antarcticas-heart-of-ice-has-skipped-a-beat-time-to-take-our-medicine-202729

"In 2022 the summer minimum was less than 2 million square km for the first time since satellite records began. This summer, the minimum was even lower – just 1.7 million square km."

Two years is now climate. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 18th, 2023 at 2:18pm
And again -


Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 18th, 2023 at 7:04am:



Of course, as the idiot who posted the pathetic meme in the wrong board DIDN’T realise—the main service bees provide is POLLINATION!

Bee populations are also under threat from several vectors:

1. Huge monoculture plantings, increasingly GMO crap, means the bee visits only one species, one genome of a species and may not get all its nutrients. Wildflower meadows get defoliated, robbing the bees of a healthy mix of nutritients.

2. Overworking the bees by taking too much honey out the hive late in the year

3. Varroa Mite etc predating on or parasitation of the bees, already weakened by the other factors


and -


Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 18th, 2023 at 2:09pm:
Wheat and tomatoes would be alright, pollinated by wind, but forget fruit and veg.

So let wildlflower meadows be, mix crops up a bit and apiarists should not overwork their bees!


Poor JM doesn't realise it is not only bees.

"The list of insect pollinators is long and includes many different species of bees, flies, wasps, beetles, butterflies and moths. Even species with a bad reputation such as houseflies and mosquitoes are important pollinators. "

https://www.nhm.ac.uk/discover/insect-pollination.html

I wonder if he thinks we will run out of houseflies soon. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -General
Post by lee on Apr 21st, 2023 at 1:53pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 21st, 2023 at 11:18am:

Quote:
Plastics cause wide-ranging health issues from cancer to birth defects, landmark study finds

First analysis of plastics’ hazards over life cycle – from extraction to disposal – also shows ‘deep societal injustices’ of impact


Not just BPA etc. I am buying big, widemouth preserving jars (Ball brand or Mason jars) to put stuff in that goes into the freezer, e.g. see https://rootsandboots.com/how-to-freeze-food-in-glass-jars If the jar has a shoulder measure the head space from the bottom of the shoulder, not the top of a jar. I will also preserve incl pressure canning food in these jars so they will be used heaps. Use airtight plastic lids, available from Amazon, for freezing.

[quote]Plastics are responsible for wide-ranging health impacts including cancers, lung disease and birth defects, according to the first analysis of the health hazards of plastics across their entire life cycle – from extraction for manufacturing, through to dumping into landfill and oceans.

Led by the Boston College Global Observatory on Planetary Health in partnership with Australia’s Minderoo Foundation and the Centre Scientifique de Monaco, the review found “current patterns of plastic production, use, and disposal are not sustainable and are responsible for significant harms to human health … as well as for deep societal injustices”.

“The main driver of these worsening harms is an almost exponential and still accelerating increase in global plastic production,” the analysis, published in the medical journal Annals of Global Health, found. “Plastics’ harms are further magnified by low rates of recovery and recycling and by the long persistence of plastic waste in the environment.”


The Great Pacific Garbage Dump, two floating rafts of plastic crap!


Quote:
“Plastic production workers are at increased risk of leukaemia, lymphoma … brain cancer, breast cancer, mesothelioma … and decreased fertility. Plastic recycling workers have increased rates of cardiovascular disease, toxic metal poisoning, neuropathy, and lung cancer.”

Meanwhile, residents of communities adjacent to plastic production and waste disposal sites experience increased risks of premature birth, low birth weight, asthma, childhood leukaemia, cardiovascular disease, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, and lung cancer. The report referred to evidence that infants in the womb and young children were at particularly high risk.


https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/mar/29/plastics-cause-wide-ranging-health-issues-from-cancer-to-birth-defects-landmark-study-finds

Study the article is based on:
https://annalsofglobalhealth.org/articles/10.5334/aogh.4056/[/quote]


Except -

" Epidemiological studies have found both acute and chronic health impacts [123"

"This finding is consistent with broader epidemiological evidence of an association between phthalate exposure and increased blood pressure in children [298]."

"There is also extensive epidemiological information linking exposure to effects in humans, reviewed in Landrigan et al. [21] and in the Human Health section of this report (Section 4)."

"Epidemiological studies conducted among children born or living near fracking sites have found elevated rates of childhood cancer, especially leukemia, and congenital heart defects [996, 998]."

https://annalsofglobalhealth.org/articles/10.5334/aogh.4056

Epidemiological studies provide correlation. They DON'T provide causation. ::)

The inverse correlation of pirates and temperature -


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -General
Post by lee on Apr 21st, 2023 at 5:30pm
And again -
Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 21st, 2023 at 5:05pm:
In 2022 and likely again in 2023.


Quote:
The climate crisis had “frightening” impacts in Europe last year, with heatwaves killing more than 20,000 people and drought withering crops, an EU report has found.

Its writers said drought was already baked in for many farmers in 2023. The only way to limit the rising damages of global heating was rapidly to cut carbon emissions, they said.

The report, from the Copernicus Climate Change Service (C3S), said widespread heatwaves had led to Europe suffering its hottest summer on record in 2022, by a large margin. These would have been virtually impossible without global heating and had led to many premature deaths.

People in southern Europe endured 70-100 days of heat stress, where the temperature felt like at least 32C, accounting for wind and other factors. In the UK, temperatures passed 40C for the first time.

The heat, plus low rainfall, caused drought that affected more than a third of the continent at its peak, the report said, making it the driest year on record. Flows in almost two-thirds of Europe’s rivers were lower than average. High temperatures also meant that the carbon emissions from summer wildfires were the highest in 15 years and the European Alps lost record amounts of ice from glaciers.

Overall, Europe experienced its second-warmest year ever recorded, with temperatures rising at twice the global average rate – faster than on any other continent. Over the past five years, the average temperature has been 2.2C higher than in the pre-industrial era.


https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/apr/20/frightening-record-busting-heat-and-drought-hit-europe-in-2022

This sort of thing is what was predicted for high latitude areas. How are you going to shift agriculture to these regions from lower latitudes? Irrigation canals, rivers way down on normal levels? The Alps losing record ice—exposing dark ground to absorb the sunlight and be warmed by it, causing more melting etc. Positive feedback, read up on it.


Strangely the report only goes back to 1950. I guess they never had reliable temperatures before that. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

"The temperature reached 48 °C (118.4 °F) in both Athens and Elefsina, Greece on July 10, 1977, setting the official European record high. There's also an unofficial record of the temperature climbing to 50 °C (122 °F) in Seville, Spain on August 4, 1881."

https://www.currentresults.com/Weather-Extremes/europe.php

Fancy temperature reaching over 40C at Heathrow. "Acres and acres tar and cement"

Perhaps he can tell us what the normal level is in rivers? Does it vary? By how much?  Strangely the photo doesn't say when this low level is.

From the report "River discharge in 2022 was the second lowest on record across Europe, and marked the sixth consecutive year of below-average flows." The report limits itself here to being from 1991.  ::)

Precipitation can't have been that bad. The report merely notes it being "below average".

As for JM's bedwetting about moving crops north..."Winter was generally wetter than average in northern and eastern Europe, while drier-than-average conditions occurred in southwestern Europe." ::)


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on Apr 23rd, 2023 at 7:39am

Quote:
As for JM's bedwetting about moving crops north..."Winter was generally wetter than average in northern and eastern Europe, while drier-than-average conditions occurred in southwestern Europe."  ::)


Monk doesn't know.  ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 23rd, 2023 at 12:38pm

Bobby. wrote on Apr 23rd, 2023 at 7:39am:
Monk doesn't know


That's because he gets his science from the Guardian. ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -General
Post by lee on Apr 24th, 2023 at 2:06pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 24th, 2023 at 5:30am:
Jesus! A super El Nino is forecast and what do we see in the so–called Environment board?


But not from BoM-

"The ENSO Outlook remains at El Niño WATCH. This means that while the El Niño–Southern Oscillation is currently neutral, there is approximately a 50% chance that El Niño may develop later in 2023. This is about twice the normal likelihood.

A significant amount of warmer than average water exists in the sub-surface of the western and central tropical Pacific Ocean, and warm sea surface temperatures (SST) anomalies continue to strengthen in the eastern tropical Pacific. The Southern Oscillation Index (SOI) has decreased to negative values over the past fortnight. Warming ocean temperatures in the eastern and central tropical Pacific and decreasing SOI values can be a precursor of El Niño development.

El Niño WATCH is not a guarantee that El Niño will occur, rather an indication that some of the typical precursors are currently occurring. All climate models surveyed by the Bureau suggest that El Niño thresholds are likely to be approached or exceeded during the southern hemisphere winter.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 24th, 2023 at 3:38pm
Even if we use the 8th of April for the Bureau's model on the southern oscillation index gives us the impression that we have been in El Nino conditions since April. And although graphs claim that it is an El Nino watch, those graphs are close enough to El Nino conditions, we might as well start calling the climate we are experiencing as El Nino.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 24th, 2023 at 4:20pm
Yes. When it doesn't agree with the definition...change the definition. ::)

And of course make it a SUPER El Nino at the same time.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 24th, 2023 at 5:28pm
There is a forecast of strong El Nino conditions by June to August. Possibly severe from then onwards, or a return to neutral by September (depending on BOM's report later during the winter).

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 24th, 2023 at 6:51pm
There may or may not be. Anything other than that is not science. It is ok in science to say you don't know. ::)

Of course it is the climate models (bow down you climate heathens) that predict a SUPER El Nino. ;D ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 25th, 2023 at 5:18pm

lee wrote on Apr 24th, 2023 at 6:51pm:
There may or may not be. Anything other than that is not science. It is ok in science to say you don't know. ::)

Of course it is the climate models (bow down you climate heathens) that predict a SUPER El Nino. ;D ;D ;D ;D


The Bureau creates models of forecasting, based on previous historical data that matches the prevailing weather patterns. The Bureau uses forecast models from various sources around the world. It is up to the researcher to decide which model is the most likely accurate forecast.

And if living a life of 4 decades does not give you experience to sense cold, dry wintery weather reminiscent of El Nino conditions, you are always welcome to rely on Bureau forecasts to say that we will experience El Nino conditions. But don't "tsk, tsk" the Bureau just because you don't want to call it a strong El Nino.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on Apr 25th, 2023 at 5:28pm
Well - Monk is a Marxist:



Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 25th, 2023 at 5:33pm

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 25th, 2023 at 5:18pm:
It is up to the researcher to decide which model is the most likely accurate forecast.


Seeing as weather models are only good for 7-10 days and climate models have shown no propensity for forecast, use them at your own risk.


UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 25th, 2023 at 5:18pm:
But don't "tsk, tsk" the Bureau just because you don't want to call it a strong El Nino.


The Bureau have said NOTHING about a strong El Nino.

"All climate models surveyed by the Bureau suggest that El Niño thresholds are likely to be approached or exceeded during the southern hemisphere winter. "

Nothing about a SUPER El Nino. So an El Nino is likely, nothing about its strength.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 26th, 2023 at 12:32pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 26th, 2023 at 10:20am:
Dr Strong references the BBC. Have to go out now, but I will search the BBC for their article and for the paper that sparked the article.

We see tho, that AGW is real—it is not the sun doing this because the sun left the mid century maximum in the 1980s and we have kept on warming.

Not even a GSM of Maunder scale would do more than put a blip on the temperature record.


Poor JM doesn't realise the differing properties of air and water. Water heats and cools much more slowly. ::)

He still hasn't answered the question of what happens when the Sun goes dark, as he insists it has no bearing on weather or climate. ::) ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Sophia on Apr 26th, 2023 at 1:25pm
Speaking of China and India…
Did anyone see on a  report last night… India’s population is exceeding China.
China has gone backward with population due to one child policy back in 80s I think it was.
And the majority born were boys (hence many abortions of girls making it so).
So China has an in balance leading to less breeding.

I haven’t been to I India…. I have seen China… it’s a clean country… the living standard is good with a lot of high rise apartments for the masses to lease, when I look at films of India… it looks like living conditions are dirtier or poorer. I could be wrong.
But I said to the other half, at least India is no threat to world peace as the impression with power mad CCP are.
Their populations both exceed 1 billion …. Here we are in Oz with a mere 26-27 million.
Why are we being made to feel guilty about world pollution?


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 26th, 2023 at 2:22pm

lee wrote on Apr 25th, 2023 at 5:33pm:
The Bureau have said NOTHING about a strong El Nino.


http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/enso/#tabs=Pacific-Ocean

I would say this would suggest otherwise.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 26th, 2023 at 2:56pm

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 26th, 2023 at 2:22pm:
I would say this would suggest otherwise.



That merely suggests an El Nino is likely, not how SUPER it will be.

"While all models suggest continued warming in the central to eastern Pacific, and possible development of El Niño later in 2023, model accuracy when forecasting through autumn is lower than at other times of the year, and therefore ENSO outlooks that extend beyond autumn should be viewed with some caution."


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on Apr 26th, 2023 at 2:58pm

lee wrote on Apr 26th, 2023 at 2:56pm:

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 26th, 2023 at 2:22pm:
I would say this would suggest otherwise.



That merely suggests an El Nino is likely, not how SUPER it will be.

"While all models suggest continued warming in the central to eastern Pacific, and possible development of El Niño later in 2023, model accuracy when forecasting through autumn is lower than at other times of the year, and therefore ENSO outlooks that extend beyond autumn should be viewed with some caution."



It's still very humid and wet in the southern states.
It's cloudy nearly all the time.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 26th, 2023 at 3:11pm

lee wrote on Apr 26th, 2023 at 2:56pm:

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 26th, 2023 at 2:22pm:
I would say this would suggest otherwise.



That merely suggests an El Nino is likely, not how SUPER it will be.

"While all models suggest continued warming in the central to eastern Pacific, and possible development of El Niño later in 2023, model accuracy when forecasting through autumn is lower than at other times of the year, and therefore ENSO outlooks that extend beyond autumn should be viewed with some caution."


I do not know if you were paying attention to the year 2019, but the rainfall was very little for the year. Looking at the ENSO, they are similar to what is and what is forecasted for the remainder of the year. Unless there is a drastic change in sea temperature for September onwards, we will see a very dry winter followed by a very dry spring. I figure summer will be wet.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 26th, 2023 at 4:31pm

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 26th, 2023 at 3:11pm:
I do not know if you were paying attention to the year 2019, but the rainfall was very little for the year.


"The Great Puny El Niño of 2018­–19 continued through March, and forecasters predict it will likely remain through the summer and possibly continue into the fall."

https://www.climate.gov/news-features/blogs/enso/april-2019-el-ni%C3%B1o-update-you-are-here

So not a SUPER El Nino year.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -General
Post by lee on Apr 27th, 2023 at 12:54pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 27th, 2023 at 8:29am:

Quote:
The most at-risk regions in the world for high-impact heatwaves

Heatwaves are becoming more frequent under climate change and can lead to thousands of excess deaths.


The BoM Max and Min temperature distributions and their global counterparts demonstrate that not only have the night temperature distributions moved to the hot side they have developed a skew to the hot side—it doesn’t form a nice symmetrical bell curve anymore (by contrast, low temperatures are now more like the classic bell shape—any skew to the cold side has gone.)

[quote]ABSTRACT

Using extreme value statistics, here we show where regional temperature records are statistically likely to be exceeded, and therefore communities might be more at-risk. In 31% of regions examined, the observed daily maximum temperature record is exceptional. Climate models suggest that similar behaviour can occur in any region. In some regions, such as Afghanistan and parts of Central America, this is a particular problem - not only have they the potential for far more extreme heatwaves than experienced, but their population is growing and increasingly exposed because of limited healthcare and energy resources. We urge policy makers in vulnerable regions to consider if heat action plans are sufficient for what might come.


Do the authorities in those two regions have the resources to do anything about extreme heat?


Quote:
INTRODUCTION

Record-breaking temperature extremes can cause severe impacts on society and the environment, as was seen in western North America in June 2021. Identifying which regions globally have perhaps been lucky not to have experienced higher temperature extremes so far is important and is the focus of this study. Often, regions are only prepared for events as extreme as they have already experienced, with planning initiated by past disasters. Policymakers and governments need to prepare for events beyond current records – particularly with trends caused by anthropogenic climate change enhancing the probability of extremes.


This is where planting trees on public and helping with big trees on private land, making roads, footpaths, roofs of a lighter color. In Adelaide, heat capital of Australia, BLACK bricks are being used on new units! Black! Lot of roofs are dark too, stupid! Sure there MIGHT be ceiling/wall insulation but you do EVERYTHING to keep residences, offices etc cool in increasingly hot summers!


Quote:
RESULTS

WEST America heatwave, June 2021
In June 2021, western North America experienced a record-breaking heatwave. In Lytton, British Columbia, temperatures of 49.6 °C were observed on June 29th, breaking the previous record by almost 5 °C28. The heatwave was associated with an unusual circulation pattern, with a blocking anticyclone leading to a stagnant warm air mass. A rapid attribution study found the event was so far beyond what had been previously observed that it was deemed virtually impossible without climate chang


Blocking weather systems can make extreme weather hang around instead of moving. Usually these are high pressure systems, anticyclones.

The paper includes a table of regions most likely to experience extreme heat. Too large to reproduce here it is at https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-023-37554-1/tables/1

VERY surprised Adelaide is not in that table! Perhaps because Adelaide has experienced so many heat wave records already?


Worth reading this paper tho it gets a bit abstruse here and there!  ;D. Still enough can be gleaned from it by a reader of average intelligence and education.

Many critters are in for a rough time. Humans will have it bad—what about unprotected animals in the fields? Can they find shade?[/quote]

So let's look at these alarming figures. -

Australia, Queensland  - up by 0.1C, population up projected 1.66. Nope doesn't seem drastic at all

PNG? In the tropics and according to CO2 theory the least affected area.

" As in30, we use ERA5, a reanalysis dataset, as a proxy for observations10 (see Methods)."

Say what, they don't use observations? Apparently re-analysis can do anything. And although Australia is mentioned in the table posted by JM, not ONE single reference in the paper.

Under "data availability" - "CanESM5 and MIROC6 data are available from the CMIP6 search interface (https://esgf-node.llnl.gov/search/cmip6/)."

You know CMIP6 group of models that run too hot. (Hausfather, Schmidt)

"Table 1 Regions where a record-breaking event is most likely

From: The most at-risk regions in the world for high-impact heatwaves"

Clicking on the link takes you back to the main article. Circular reasoning at its finest.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 27th, 2023 at 1:12pm

lee wrote on Apr 26th, 2023 at 4:31pm:

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 26th, 2023 at 3:11pm:
I do not know if you were paying attention to the year 2019, but the rainfall was very little for the year.


"The Great Puny El Niño of 2018­–19 continued through March, and forecasters predict it will likely remain through the summer and possibly continue into the fall."

https://www.climate.gov/news-features/blogs/enso/april-2019-el-ni%C3%B1o-update-you-are-here

So not a SUPER El Nino year.


Getting 290mm of rainfall for the year would not be a low-end El Nino. That was a severe drought brought about by a super El Nino. bugger, you really are ignorant.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 27th, 2023 at 2:38pm

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 27th, 2023 at 1:12pm:
Getting 290mm of rainfall for the year would not be a low-end El Nino.



Tell that to NOAA the author of climate.gov.


UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 27th, 2023 at 1:12pm:
That was a severe drought brought about by a super El Nino.


Not according to NOAA.

So let's look at BoM -

2019 - El Nino Watch and Alert - no El Nino.

http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/enso/outlook/#tabs=ENSO-Forecast-history

I just go where the data leads me. ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 27th, 2023 at 3:34pm
http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/history/rainfall/

http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/enso/#tabs=Pacific-Ocean&pacific=History&enso-impacts=La-Ni%C3%B1a-impacts

Let us have a look. A lack of rainfall over a considerable area of Australia in the year 2019 would indicate an El Nino pattern. And according to the graphs, the southern oscillation index indicated a mild El Nino pattern. Not as significant as the year 2015/2016 El Nino. But, definitely enough to help bring about the wildfires of the year 2019/2020 around the eastern states of Australia.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 27th, 2023 at 3:44pm

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 27th, 2023 at 3:34pm:
A lack of rainfall over a considerable area of Australia in the year 2019 would indicate an El Nino pattern.



No that is a logical fallacy. Lack of rainfall is only one indicator. ::)


The majhor one is oceanic temerature in ENSO 3.4 area.

"But a look at records reveals that, in Australia, the rain and temperatures during El Niño and neutral years are now almost identical.

This was no more apparent than 2018 and 2019 when record drought and temperatures occurred without the presence of El Niño."

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-03-11/what-follows-la-nina-weather-pattern-in-australia/102076404


UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 27th, 2023 at 3:34pm:
But, definitely enough to help bring about the wildfires of the year 2019/2020 around the eastern states of Australia.


Not even close. Los Ninos don't bring wildfire. Humans bring about 90% of wildfire. Now, if you were arguing that people cause more wildfire due to Los Ninos, I would like to see the study.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 27th, 2023 at 3:58pm
WTF?? Are you suggesting that the Bureau has to declare the year an El Nino event before we can call it El Nino? I figure that we only need about 3 months of a negative southern oscillation index, beyond neutral conditions, before we can call the climate in an El Nino situation.

Geez, you are starting to sound like one of those facebook experts that think 30 years of observations in climate change is not long enough and "weather is not climate".

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 27th, 2023 at 4:22pm

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 27th, 2023 at 3:58pm:
Are you suggesting that the Bureau has to declare the year an El Nino event before we can call it El Nino? I figure that we only need about 3 months of a negative southern oscillation index, beyond neutral conditions, before we can call the climate in an El Nino situation.


And if NOAA doesn't declare it as well? ::)

If it doesn't fit the definition, change the definition. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D


UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 27th, 2023 at 3:58pm:
Geez, you are starting to sound like one of those facebook experts that think 30 years of observations in climate change is not long enough and "weather is not climate".


Well, according to the WMO (World Meteorological Society), climate is the average of 30 years weather. That is one cycle. You can't pull much information about trends out of one cycle.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 27th, 2023 at 4:40pm
There never is a definition that people all agree upon about the word "climate". One such definition, taken from dictionary.com, states: "the composite or generally prevailing weather conditions of a region, as temperature, air pressure, humidity, precipitation, sunshine, cloudiness, and winds, throughout the year, averaged over a series of years". How many years to average the climatic conditions, it does not say.

I have actually debated with the Chicken Little Climate Alarmists about how my area of the world has not seen great expansions of hottest or coldest temperatures in a 30 year period. In 1990, we had the hottest day on record in my town -- 45.3°C. That record has not been bettered. We have had a few days where the temperature has reached 44°C. But, we do not seem to see many days get above 40°C. Again with minimum temperatures -- our record being -1°C, back in 1949. The lowest temperature I have observed was about 1°C, sometime recently.

The response I got: "It is a good thing (UnSubRocky's) town is not what we base climactic change research upon".

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 27th, 2023 at 6:20pm
All science relies on definitions. You can't just choose a metric that you want. ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 27th, 2023 at 10:14pm

lee wrote on Apr 27th, 2023 at 6:20pm:
All science relies on definitions. You can't just choose a metric that you want. ::)


That misses my point completely.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 28th, 2023 at 12:21pm

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 27th, 2023 at 10:14pm:
That misses my point completely.


Nope. BoM, NOAA etc are supposed to be scientists. It is their definition.

You can, make up your own definition if you like, with the parameters you like. It will only be a definition with meaning to you, not others.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on Apr 28th, 2023 at 4:07pm
So, basically, I am ALSO right.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 28th, 2023 at 5:56pm
https://www.eumetsat.int/tropospheric-warming-and-stratospheric-cooling-21st-century


Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 28th, 2023 at 4:31pm:
lee is going to post a “refutation” of this paper? I can’t wait to see what that idiot comes up with! LOL!


There is nothing to refute. They mention GHG's plural. They don't say if it is increased water vapour (as postulated by CO2 theory) or CO2 itself. ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 28th, 2023 at 6:53pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 28th, 2023 at 4:31pm:
It is SO nice I don’t have to respond to his idiocy.



Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 28th, 2023 at 5:59pm:
It seems the paper I quoted here was too sciency for poor old lee.  ;)

Water vapor gets a mention you old fraud!  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D


Poor JM couldn't help himself. The paper doesn't distinguish between GHG's. Perhaps he confused CDR (CO2 Removal) with CDR (Climate Data Retrieval) ::)

So sad to see him denying CO2 theory. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D


Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 28th, 2023 at 4:17pm:
In the tropics, since at least 2001 (when new techniques permit more robust quantification), the upper troposphere has warmed faster than the near-surface (medium confidence). There is medium confidence that most CMIP5 and CMIP6 models overestimate the observed warming in the upper tropical troposphere .


So medium confidence that they are right and that CMIP5 and CMIP6 run hot. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 30th, 2023 at 1:18pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 30th, 2023 at 6:37am:
And lee mixes up observations with model output.


Nope. According to CO2 theory water vapour has already increased by 7%.

"(The United Nations’ Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change Sixth Assessment Report states total atmospheric water vapor is increasing 1 to 2% per decade.) For every degree Celsius that Earth’s atmospheric temperature rises, the amount of water vapor in the atmosphere can increase by about 7%, according to the laws of thermodynamics."

https://climate.nasa.gov/explore/ask-nasa-climate/3143/steamy-relationships-how-atmospheric-water-vapor-amplifies-earths-greenhouse-effect/

So as NASA must agree with the IPCC, else they wouldn't report it, we can see increased water vapour. ::)

The responders are purely looking at delay in the readings due to the prismatic effect. That delay occurs for ALL GHG's.

No models here. TPW fro m satellites. Or do you only believe them when it suits? ::)

Also there is nothing in the actual paper on instrument accuracy.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 30th, 2023 at 2:52pm

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 30th, 2023 at 1:26pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 30th, 2023 at 6:37am:
And lee mixes up observations with model output.


Are you and lee banned from each other's board?


I am banned. He doesn't like his hypotheses questioned. ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on Apr 30th, 2023 at 4:12pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 30th, 2023 at 2:59pm:
After I realised lee was arguing the same stupid point we had already argued three times I banned him from here. lee cannot abide change happening and AGW is change.


Climate is change whether it is AGW or not. He cannot abide a differing view on how good (or bad) any AGW is. He only sees bad. Posts from the Guardian instead of papers. Mis-attributes stuff to AGW.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on Apr 30th, 2023 at 4:17pm

lee wrote on Apr 30th, 2023 at 2:52pm:

UnSubRocky wrote on Apr 30th, 2023 at 1:26pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Apr 30th, 2023 at 6:37am:
And lee mixes up observations with model output.


Are you and lee banned from each other's board?


I am banned. He doesn't like his hypotheses questioned. ::)



It's better to keep Environment topics here not
at Cats, Critters and Dicks.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on Apr 30th, 2023 at 4:59pm


Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on May 1st, 2023 at 9:01pm
If Monk is still banned, the ban should be lifted. I have a kind of obsessive compulsion about keeping environmental topics in their forum.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on May 2nd, 2023 at 5:02pm
You are bitching to the wrong person.

"
Re: Rules and banned members.
Reply #9 - Apr 14th, 2023 at 5:49pm 
Monk,
you are now banned for 1 week from the environment MRB.
You can return on the 22nd of April 2023.
PMs sent to mods and you.

You were given ample warnings. "

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by UnSubRocky on May 2nd, 2023 at 6:29pm
Not bitching to anyone. I just figure that the issue could be resolved. But, since you guys seem more interesting doing the "not talking to you" in your own forums, I suppose this is the best course of action.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on May 2nd, 2023 at 6:33pm
I would but he would impose a total ban for me posting on his thread. ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on May 2nd, 2023 at 6:38pm

lee wrote on May 2nd, 2023 at 6:33pm:
I would but he would impose a total ban for me posting on his thread. ::)



Monk banned you permanently - me too:



Quote:
Re: Board bans
Reply #12 - Apr 17th, 2023 at 7:13am Quote
Bans at this time:

1. Permanent bans

lee
Gordon
BaronOfRort
Booby

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on May 2nd, 2023 at 6:39pm

Jovial Monk wrote on May 1st, 2023 at 5:36pm:
In the US the Supreme Court has ruled that oil majors cannot refer cases to it, that they must be heard in state courts. State courts are thought to be more receptive to the plaintiffs, cities etc, bringing these cases.

A similar ruling on tobacco cases changed the whole way cigarettes/tobacco was marketed and sold in the US.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/apr/25/experts-hail-decision-us-climate-lawsuits-advance



Nope. Think about it. The move makes the complainant fight through the state courts first and then the Supreme Court.

The question is "who has the deepest pockets"?

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on May 2nd, 2023 at 6:39pm

lee wrote on May 2nd, 2023 at 5:02pm:
You are bitching to the wrong person.

"
Re: Rules and banned members.
Reply #9 - Apr 14th, 2023 at 5:49pm 
Monk,
you are now banned for 1 week from the environment MRB.
You can return on the 22nd of April 2023.
PMs sent to mods and you.

You were given ample warnings. "



Monk only got a 1 week ban but
after what he's done since then he deserves a permanent ban.   :-/

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Jovial Monk on May 2nd, 2023 at 6:42pm
Apart from lee happy to talk about some point for the 3rd. .. 5th. . .10th time there is the Mod here.

He is not stable.

He banned me and JohnSmith for a couple years, saying he had to “delete page after page of abuse” which was a lie. If I were to start a long-running thread like my “Sun” thread I know I could be banned for months any morment.

I don’t chew the cud, that lee does is no enticement to me.

That Booby is not mentally stable is no enticement to me.

Off topic threads seem to be the thing nowadays—Relationshits is really Games II MRB now.

Booby started that when, encouraged by Setanta he started the “Cats and Critters topics now here” thread. He copied and posts from Cats and Critters to his C&Cs thread, copied stuff from the Cats and Critters board on my fine forum. That was all fine for Booby, he enjoyed stealing my topics from here and my fine forum, that was fun.

The idiot did not like me copying his posts to the the rightful MRB, that wasn’t fun, apparently.

The idiot STOLE videos I had taken of my dog, Socks! Idiot tried to blackmail me into letting him post them on vile ShitShute.


I cannot trust the idiot. It is time someone else was given a chance to Mod Environment.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on May 2nd, 2023 at 6:50pm

Jovial Monk wrote on May 2nd, 2023 at 6:42pm:
Apart from lee happy to talk about some point for the 3rd. .. 5th. . .10th time there is the Mod here.

He is not stable.

He banned me and JohnSmith for a couple years, saying he had to “delete page after page of abuse” which was a lie. If I were to start a long-running thread like my “Sun” thread I know I could be banned for months any morment.

I don’t chew the cud, that lee does is no enticement to me.

That Booby is not mentally stable is no enticement to me.

Off topic threads seem to be the thing nowadays—Relationshits is really Games II MRB now.

Booby started that when, encouraged by Setanta he started the “Cats and Critters topics now here” thread. He copied and posts from Cats and Critters to his C&Cs thread, copied stuff from the Cats and Critters board on my fine forum. That was all fine for Booby, he enjoyed stealing my topics from here and my fine forum, that was fun.

The idiot did not like me copying his posts to the the rightful MRB, that wasn’t fun, apparently.

The idiot STOLE videos I had taken of my dog, Socks! Idiot tried to blackmail me into letting him post them on vile ShitShute.


I cannot trust the idiot. It is time someone else was given a chance to Mod Environment.



Monk,
have you read my rules?



https://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1612043899

I can add that at least a modicum of respect is to be shown to other posters.
Posters should attack the argument and not the person posting.

Repeated ad hominem attacks as per here:

http://www.ozpolitic.com/articles/logical-fallacies.html#ad%20hominem

could result in global moderator intervention.

I also add:
don't post disgusting pictures.

Don't use this forum - this MRB - to denigrate me -
or anyone else.

I reserve the right to delete, or modify any post here
if it contains abuse.
Abuse is not allowed here.

Any other rules could be added as needed in the future.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Jovial Monk on May 2nd, 2023 at 6:55pm
Respect is earned. It cannot be commanded.


Tell me where I was wrong, but I wasn’t.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on May 2nd, 2023 at 7:01pm

Jovial Monk wrote on May 2nd, 2023 at 6:55pm:
Respect is earned. It cannot be commanded.


Tell me where I was wrong, but I wasn’t.



Monk,
you have shown no remorse.
Cease posting.
You are hereby banned for 2 weeks.
You can post again on the 17th May 2023.
PM to be sent to you and the Mods now.

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on May 2nd, 2023 at 7:02pm

Jovial Monk wrote on May 2nd, 2023 at 6:42pm:
I don’t chew the cud, that lee does is no enticement to me.


Yeah you just lie. Tell us how a greenhouse generates heat from the CO2 trapped inside again, when the same CO2 level is present both in and out. I like a good laugh. ::)


Jovial Monk wrote on May 2nd, 2023 at 6:42pm:
The idiot did not like me copying his posts to the the rightful MRB, that wasn’t fun, apparently.



But you have said they were boring as bat sh1t. I guess you prefer bat sh1t on your forum. ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by lee on May 3rd, 2023 at 5:54pm

Jovial Monk wrote on May 3rd, 2023 at 1:38pm:
lee misses the point of these articles, as I expected him to.

Farming in a drought?


Obviously JM has comprehension issues.



lee wrote on Apr 21st, 2023 at 5:30pm:
As for JM's bedwetting about moving crops north..."Winter was generally wetter than average in northern and eastern Europe, while drier-than-average conditions occurred in southwestern Europe."


That is where the tundra is. Not down south. So not in drought. ::)

Title: Re: More from JM's tripe -IPCC
Post by Bobby. on May 3rd, 2023 at 10:44pm
Listen Guys,
please don't quote from Monk's - Cats, Critters and Dicks MRB here.
I don't want his filth here - he's banned for 2 weeks.
Go instead to his MRB to comment directly.

I will delete the quoted posts soon.

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