Australian Politics Forum
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl
General Discussion >> Thinking Globally >> using human shields in war
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1716330435

Message started by freediver on May 22nd, 2024 at 8:27am

Title: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 22nd, 2024 at 8:27am
Here we have it. John actually wants to encourage Muslims to wear their mothers into battle as a shield.


John Smith wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 9:48pm:

Quote:
What if they hide behind their mothers skirts while lobbing rockets at Israel?


You don't take the shot.  No one said it was supposed to be easy.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 22nd, 2024 at 8:49am
Here he goes again ... lets see what stupidity you can come up with today

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Yadda on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:03am

The active Mujahideen is an indefatigable wanabe killer [for Allah's Cause],
and a master propagandist,    ....and deceiver [for Allah's Cause].



.


Yadda said....
in an old post on OzPol......

Quote:


QUESTION;
Where have these ISIS 'monsters' come from ?

ANSWER;
These ISIS 'monsters', day by day, year by year, have been, and are, a creation of the philosophy known as ISLAM [and, of the moslem community].







[quote]On Facebook, Muslim cleric preaches killing of women and children

November 30, 2014 4:08 pm

Omar Bakri Muhammad.“In a section titled ‘killing women and children’ he said this was usually not permissible,

but stated: ‘Having said this, one must distinguish between killing women and children and the Mujahideen fighting the Kuffar [non-believers] enemies wherever they find them, whether that be in a school or hospital or elsewhere.’

He also gave religious authority to the killing of Muslims.

He said in a video on Facebook: ‘Anybody who allies with a taghoot regime [non-Muslims] whether Sunni or Shi’i has no sanctity and his blood is permissible.’


In another posting, he declared that Jews and Christians were ‘enemies’, adding: ‘That animosity is exposed, clear, explicit, there is no doubt about it.'”

It would be refreshing if one of the Muslim spokesmen in the West who have written articles recently explaining that the Islamic State was not Islamic because its jihadis killed women and children would take up Bakri’s argument and explaining why it is wrong on Islamic grounds.

But this probably will not happen......
WWW search

[/quote]


.



[also somewhere on OzPol....]

According to ISLAM's 'rules of war',
those who bring children into conflict areas/scenarios, are responsible for their deaths.


But hey, it is the excuse moslems use, when non-moslem children [e.g. Beslan] are intentionally murdered by moslems during Jihad 'operations'.


Quote:

There Can Be No End to Jihad'


Islamist Sheikh Omar Bakri Muhammad, in an exclusive interview, discusses the rationale for 9/11
11/05/2007
...Any weapons are legitimate in jihad. Even animals may be used as "suicide bombers"! It is not restricted by target—even Muslims or children, if used by the enemy as human shields, can be killed.
....Killing women and children never was and never will be part of the jihad in Islam, whether that be the women or children of the Muslims or non-Muslims. So if Chechen mujahedeen killed women and children in Beslan, I would condemn it. The children of non-Muslims, such as those at Beslan, who die in such circumstances go to Paradise.
....Women and children [i.e. boys under 15] or Muslims are not legitimate targets—nor are any noncombatants [clergy, disabled, insane, elderly, etc.]. Not even Israeli children or women, unless they serve in the military, which most do, or live in properties taken from dispossessed Palestinians (Muslim or Christian), which virtually all do.
However, if children are killed, the fault lies with the adult occupiers who brought them into a battlefield situation.

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2005/februaryweb-only/22.0.html




i.e.
#1,
When non-moslem children die during Jihad 'operations', it is the fault of non-moslems.

#2,
And when moslem children die in actions by non-moslems, directed against Jihad 'operations', it is the fault of non-moslems.


...according to moslems.



With moslems it is always the same 'logic', when justifying their barbarity in pursuit of Allah's paradise...

'Heads we win, tails you lose.'


.



Quote:

How Circumstance Dictates Islamic Behavior

January 18, 2012

Preach Peace When Weak, Wage War When Strong

"...all notions of peace with non-Muslims are based on circumstance.

When Muslims are weak, they should be peaceful; when strong, they should go on the offensive."

Sheikh Yassir al-Burhami - an ISLAMIC scholar and Egyptian Salafi leader
http://www.raymondibrahim.com/from-the-arab-world/how-circumstance-dictates-islamic-behavior/




Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:14am
You all forget that I had the solution ages ago:

get all the women and children out of Gaza and put them into tents
and look after them - well away from the war zone.
Include many men as well in another area in tents but hold them under suspicion.

Then the IDF could go in and have a proper war and clean up HAMAS once and for all
and not have to commit any war crimes.

Instead Israel just went in and bombed everything -
killing mostly women and children.
they are no better than HAMAS.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:16am

Quote:
get all the women and children out of Gaza and put them into tents


How?


Quote:
and look after them - well away from the war zone.


Where?

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:21am

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:16am:

Quote:
get all the women and children out of Gaza and put them into tents


How?

[quote]and look after them - well away from the war zone.


Where?[/quote]


How? - communicate via air dropped leaflets -
tell them to go to the border gate with Israel.
Get them out.


Where? -
Anywhere at least 10kms away from Gaza - set up tents.


This war would have been over 4 months ago if they would have taken my advice.


Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:26am
Israel had a chance to say -

we're better than Hamas -
we're better than terrorists -
we don't kill women and children.
We fight fairly.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:27am

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:21am:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:16am:

Quote:
get all the women and children out of Gaza and put them into tents


How?

[quote]and look after them - well away from the war zone.


Where?



How? - communicate via air dropped leaflets -
tell them to go to the border gate with Israel.
Get them out.


Where? -
Anywhere at least 10kms away from Gaza - set up tents.


This war would have been over 4 months ago if they would have taken my advice.

[/quote]

What makes you think the Gazans would take your advice and cooperate with Israel to help them kill Hamas?

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:32am

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:26am:
Israel had a chance


Israel had an excuse to proceed with their plans to get rid of the Palestians once and for all.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Yadda on May 22nd, 2024 at 10:15am

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:14am:

Instead Israel just went in......
killing mostly women and children.
they are no better than HAMAS.



bobby,

Everything which we can see in Gaza today,       ....it is the gift of Hamas.

That is my opinion.



bobby,

Whenever and wherever the IDF, identify Hamas militants, they are going to target those Hamas militants.

Q.
Then WHY are so many Gazan women and children being killed ?

A.
Because Hamas militants are hiding among Gazan civilians.



bobby,

Q.
If a militant stands behind a woman and child [some distance off],
and if the militant then shoots at   >> you [and your family], <<
are you saying that you are not justified,
if you [yourself, in turn] target the militant ?



CONSIDER;
If a militant is taking cover behind [or among] 'non-combatants',
are you going to allow the militant to continue to shoot....at yourself and at another group of 'non-combatants' [i.e. your family, with rockets and bullets, daily] ?

THE REALITY;
If you target the militant,
yes, you may hit 'non-combatants',    ....the ones behind whom, the militant shooter, is taking cover.

But you can be confident, that the militant shooter.....ALREADY KNOWS THAT COULD HAPPEN,
and that he has no care.


.


bobby,

EVERY devout moslem, wants to die for Allah's Cause.

.....THAT IS A 'RELIGIOUS' PRECEPT OF ISLAM.



It is a great blessing, for the moslem, to die for Allah's Cause.

NOT SO ????

--------- >

--------- >

--------- >


Quote:

"Our children are our glory and honor,
they were created to be fertilizer for the land of Palestine,
and for our pure land to be saturated with their blood."


"Moderate" Palestinian Authority TV: Palestinian children created to fertilize the land with their blood
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2012/02/moderate-palestinian-authority-tv-palestinian-children-created-to-fertilize-the-land-with-their-bloo.html
2023 live link......      https://www.jihadwatch.org/2012/02/moderate-palestinian-authority-tv-palestinian-children-created-to-fertilize-the-land-with-their-bloo

cited on OzPol here......
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1621945743/7#7


.


"Say: "...If ye think that ye are friends to Allah, to the exclusion of (other) men, then express your desire for Death, if ye are truthful!"  "
Koran 62.06


n.b.
Koran 62.06 is admonishing the believer, that his only true love, in this life [if he is a true moslem], is to die, fighting in Allah's cause. !!!



Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 22nd, 2024 at 3:45pm

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:27am:

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:21am:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:16am:

Quote:
get all the women and children out of Gaza and put them into tents


How?

[quote]and look after them - well away from the war zone.


Where?



How? - communicate via air dropped leaflets -
tell them to go to the border gate with Israel.
Get them out.


Where? -
Anywhere at least 10kms away from Gaza - set up tents.


This war would have been over 4 months ago if they would have taken my advice.


What makes you think the Gazans would take your advice and cooperate with Israel to help them kill Hamas?
[/quote]


Threatening to drop over 30,000 tons of bombs on their heads
would have given them some encouragement -
that's what Israel did anyway.   ::)

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Grappler Truth Teller Feller on May 22nd, 2024 at 3:53pm
You know what they say about 30,000 tons of bombs..................... not enough bombs ..............

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 22nd, 2024 at 4:32pm

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 3:53pm:
You know what they say about 30,000 tons of bombs..................... not enough bombs ..............



Israel has plenty more bombs - Biden has supplied them.

The civilians have nowhere to go because Israel never implemented the "Bobby's Tent solution."

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:03pm

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 3:45pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:27am:

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:21am:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:16am:

Quote:
get all the women and children out of Gaza and put them into tents


How?

[quote]and look after them - well away from the war zone.


Where?



How? - communicate via air dropped leaflets -
tell them to go to the border gate with Israel.
Get them out.


Where? -
Anywhere at least 10kms away from Gaza - set up tents.


This war would have been over 4 months ago if they would have taken my advice.


What makes you think the Gazans would take your advice and cooperate with Israel to help them kill Hamas?



Threatening to drop over 30,000 tons of bombs on their heads
would have given them some encouragement -
that's what Israel did anyway.   ::)[/quote]

If that were true, Hamas would not still be so popular in Gaza.

I think you are being a bit naïve here Bobby. Just like last time you made the same suggestion.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:07pm

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:03pm:
If that were true, Hamas would not still be so popular in Gaza.

I think you are being a bit naïve here Bobby. Just like last time you made the same suggestion.



maybe -
Bibi is claiming that Hamas won't allow women and children to leave areas
that are being bombed and attacked by Israel.
He even claims that Hamas has shot people trying to seek shelter elsewhere.
Is that true or is it Israeli propaganda to cover up war crimes?




Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:10pm

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:07pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:03pm:
If that were true, Hamas would not still be so popular in Gaza.

I think you are being a bit naïve here Bobby. Just like last time you made the same suggestion.



maybe -
Bibi is claiming that Hamas won't allow women and children to leave areas
that are being bombed and attacked by Israel.
He even claims that Hamas has shot people trying to seek shelter elsewhere.
Is that true or is it Israeli propaganda to cover up war crimes?


It is probably true. But then again, Muslim men there might shoot their wife for trying to leave them. I doubt it would make Hamas any less popular.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:20pm

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:10pm:

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:07pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:03pm:
If that were true, Hamas would not still be so popular in Gaza.

I think you are being a bit naïve here Bobby. Just like last time you made the same suggestion.



maybe -
Bibi is claiming that Hamas won't allow women and children to leave areas
that are being bombed and attacked by Israel.
He even claims that Hamas has shot people trying to seek shelter elsewhere.
Is that true or is it Israeli propaganda to cover up war crimes?


It is probably true. But then again, Muslim men there might shoot their wife for trying to leave them.
I doubt it would make Hamas any less popular.



So are you saying that my Captain Obvious - "Bobby's Tent Solution" -
was not even worth trying?


Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:21pm

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:20pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:10pm:

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:07pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:03pm:
If that were true, Hamas would not still be so popular in Gaza.

I think you are being a bit naïve here Bobby. Just like last time you made the same suggestion.



maybe -
Bibi is claiming that Hamas won't allow women and children to leave areas
that are being bombed and attacked by Israel.
He even claims that Hamas has shot people trying to seek shelter elsewhere.
Is that true or is it Israeli propaganda to cover up war crimes?


It is probably true. But then again, Muslim men there might shoot their wife for trying to leave them.
I doubt it would make Hamas any less popular.



So are you saying that my Captain Obvious - "Bobby's Tent Solution" -
was not even worth trying?


My position hasn't changed since last time you posted it.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:26pm

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:21pm:

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:20pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:10pm:

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:07pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:03pm:
If that were true, Hamas would not still be so popular in Gaza.

I think you are being a bit naïve here Bobby. Just like last time you made the same suggestion.



maybe -
Bibi is claiming that Hamas won't allow women and children to leave areas
that are being bombed and attacked by Israel.
He even claims that Hamas has shot people trying to seek shelter elsewhere.
Is that true or is it Israeli propaganda to cover up war crimes?


It is probably true. But then again, Muslim men there might shoot their wife for trying to leave them.
I doubt it would make Hamas any less popular.



So are you saying that my Captain Obvious - "Bobby's Tent Solution" -
was not even worth trying?


My position hasn't changed since last time you posted it.



But you ignored my point again -

Israel had a chance to say -

we're better than Hamas -
we're better than terrorists -
we don't kill women and children.
We fight fairly.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:29pm
Yeah, I ignored it. That is not what it would say. It would say that they are hopelessly naïve. It would probably offend the Muslims so much that they would use it as the excuse for their next attack.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:42pm

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:29pm:
Yeah, I ignored it. That is not what it would say. It would say that they are hopelessly naïve. It would probably offend the Muslims so much that they would use it as the excuse for their next attack.



Let's be serious.
Do you remember the 2006 war with Lebanon - and Israel bombed
suburbs in Beirut because they said Hezbollah terrorists were living there?
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2006-07-23/israel-strikes-beirut-suburbs/1808760

Israel seems to have an iron fist policy whereby
they deal out collective punishment to everyone -
even if they had nothing to do with the actions of terrorists.
That's their modus operandi - but it it left a failed state on their border - Lebanon -
and didn't get rid of Hezbollah.
Israel's iron fist policy doesn't work -
they keep repeating their failed history.

It won't work with Hezbollah either -
one day they will rise again and be worse than before.


Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:51pm

Quote:
Israel seems to have an iron fist policy whereby they deal out collective punishment to everyone


It seems that way, because they are fighting a war against an enemy that it hiding behind their mothers skirts. Every "rule of war" we have is built on the assumption that your enemy is not going to be stupid enough to deliberately bring the war to their own innocent citizenry. You are projecting a western notion of gallantry onto Muslims. Israel on the other hand is forced to confront the reality.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 22nd, 2024 at 6:01pm

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:51pm:
It seems that way, because they are fighting a war against an enemy that it hiding behind their mothers skirts.



says the cretin cheering for the side that does all their fighting from behind computer screens.  :D :D

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 22nd, 2024 at 6:06pm

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:51pm:

Quote:
Israel seems to have an iron fist policy whereby they deal out collective punishment to everyone


It seems that way, because they are fighting a war against an enemy that it hiding behind their mothers skirts. Every "rule of war" we have is built on the assumption that your enemy is not going to be stupid enough to deliberately bring the war to their own innocent citizenry. You are projecting a western notion of gallantry onto Muslims. Israel on the other hand is forced to confront the reality.



If they put those mothers in tents outside Gaza -
then Hamas couldn't hide behind their skirts.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 22nd, 2024 at 6:15pm

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:51pm:
It seems that way, because they are fighting a war against an enemy that it hiding behind their mothers skirts


in the hospitals? within the food convoys? behind the aid workers? behind the journalists?

Your crap excuse doesn't wash. Israel is killing innocents because they are just like their brothers in hamas, terrorists at heart

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 22nd, 2024 at 6:33pm

Quote:
in the hospitals? within the food convoys? behind the aid workers? behind the journalists?


Yes John. Hamas is deliberately bringing the war into Gazan cities. There is no low they will not stoop to. It is actually difficult to stop food and aid funding being diverted to supporting Hamas' terrorist activities.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 22nd, 2024 at 6:37pm

John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:59pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:55pm:
And why have you not come up with a rational explanation for why Israel is obliged to not shoot back at Muslims if they use their own mother as a human shield?


You need it explained to you?  :o :o
What's not 'rational' is shooting women and children. Not shooting innocent bystanders doesn't need an explanation. Not unless you are a terrorist.


It is perfectly rational to shoot back John. The Israeli army has an obligation to shoot back, in order to defend its citizens.

When Hamas stoops this low, there is no option in which civilians do not die. That is Hamas's choice, not Israel's. If Israel refrained from shooting back, that would actually encourage Hamas fighters to use human shields. Do you honestly not realise how stupid your position is? And can you find anyone else who agrees with you?

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 22nd, 2024 at 6:42pm

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 6:33pm:

Quote:
in the hospitals? within the food convoys? behind the aid workers? behind the journalists?


Yes John. Hamas is deliberately bringing the war into Gazan cities.
There is no low they will not stoop to.
It is actually difficult to stop food and aid funding being diverted to supporting Hamas' terrorist activities.



It's impossible to stop some of the food aid ending up in terrorist tummies.


Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 22nd, 2024 at 8:38pm

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 6:33pm:

Quote:
in the hospitals? within the food convoys? behind the aid workers? behind the journalists?


Yes John. Hamas is deliberately bringing the war into Gazan cities. There is no low they will not stoop to. It is actually difficult to stop food and aid funding being diverted to supporting Hamas' terrorist activities.


No fd,. The cowards are Israel.  Dropping bombs on cities while hiding behind their computer screens.  The ultimate keyboard warriors.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 22nd, 2024 at 8:54pm
Why do you want Israeli citizens to be slaughtered by terrorists using human shields John?

Would you change your mind if they were not Jewish?

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:22pm

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 8:54pm:
Why do you want Israeli citizens to be slaughtered by terrorists using human shields John?

Would you change your mind if they were not Jewish?


I don't want any civilians slaughtered by terrorists.  But unlike you,  I apply that rule equally to Muslims and Jews. You on the other hand only cry when it's Jewish civilians.  When it's Muslim civilians you cheer and find excuses for the terrorism

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Frank on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:35pm

John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:22pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 8:54pm:
Why do you want Israeli citizens to be slaughtered by terrorists using human shields John?

Would you change your mind if they were not Jewish?


I don't want any civilians slaughtered by terrorists.  But unlike you,  I apply that rule equally to Muslims and Jews. You on the other hand only cry when it's Jewish civilians.  When it's Muslim civilians you cheer and find excuses for the terrorism



I have never once seen you apply it to Muslims.  You constantly apply it, wrongly, to the IDF.

Your idea of " equally" is as stupid, spineless and fraudulent as most of your other utterances.


Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 22nd, 2024 at 10:37pm

Frank wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:35pm:

John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:22pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 8:54pm:
Why do you want Israeli citizens to be slaughtered by terrorists using human shields John?

Would you change your mind if they were not Jewish?


I don't want any civilians slaughtered by terrorists.  But unlike you,  I apply that rule equally to Muslims and Jews. You on the other hand only cry when it's Jewish civilians.  When it's Muslim civilians you cheer and find excuses for the terrorism



I have never once seen you apply it to Muslims.  You constantly apply it, wrongly, to the IDF.

Your idea of " equally" is as stupid, spineless and fraudulent as most of your other utterances.


I've said from the very beginning that all the Hamas terrorists that were involved in Oct 7 should be shot. You were probably to busy defending the terrorists in the idf to notice.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 23rd, 2024 at 6:39am

John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:22pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 8:54pm:
Why do you want Israeli citizens to be slaughtered by terrorists using human shields John?

Would you change your mind if they were not Jewish?


I don't want any civilians slaughtered by terrorists.  But unlike you,  I apply that rule equally to Muslims and Jews. You on the other hand only cry when it's Jewish civilians.  When it's Muslim civilians you cheer and find excuses for the terrorism


You are confused John. There is no choice in which no civilians die. Hamas has taken that choice away. You cannot stop a war, or win a war, by pouting, not matter how much effort you put into it.  The question is, whether to shoot back if they use human shields.

Do you understand that if Israel was stupid enough to follow your advice and not shoot back, it would encourage Hamas to use human shields?

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 23rd, 2024 at 6:42am

Dirty Harry deals with human shield:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7Nci-GVuHE


Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 23rd, 2024 at 4:27pm

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 6:06pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:51pm:

Quote:
Israel seems to have an iron fist policy whereby they deal out collective punishment to everyone


It seems that way, because they are fighting a war against an enemy that it hiding behind their mothers skirts. Every "rule of war" we have is built on the assumption that your enemy is not going to be stupid enough to deliberately bring the war to their own innocent citizenry. You are projecting a western notion of gallantry onto Muslims. Israel on the other hand is forced to confront the reality.



If they put those mothers in tents outside Gaza -
then Hamas couldn't hide behind their skirts.



Bump for FD  ?

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 23rd, 2024 at 4:36pm

Bobby. wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 4:27pm:

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 6:06pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:51pm:

Quote:
Israel seems to have an iron fist policy whereby they deal out collective punishment to everyone


It seems that way, because they are fighting a war against an enemy that it hiding behind their mothers skirts. Every "rule of war" we have is built on the assumption that your enemy is not going to be stupid enough to deliberately bring the war to their own innocent citizenry. You are projecting a western notion of gallantry onto Muslims. Israel on the other hand is forced to confront the reality.



If they put those mothers in tents outside Gaza -
then Hamas couldn't hide behind their skirts.



Bump for FD  ?


OK Bobby, you go round up all the Gazan women. See how that works out for you.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 23rd, 2024 at 4:41pm

freediver wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 4:36pm:

Bobby. wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 4:27pm:

Bobby. wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 6:06pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 5:51pm:

Quote:
Israel seems to have an iron fist policy whereby they deal out collective punishment to everyone


It seems that way, because they are fighting a war against an enemy that it hiding behind their mothers skirts. Every "rule of war" we have is built on the assumption that your enemy is not going to be stupid enough to deliberately bring the war to their own innocent citizenry. You are projecting a western notion of gallantry onto Muslims. Israel on the other hand is forced to confront the reality.



If they put those mothers in tents outside Gaza -
then Hamas couldn't hide behind their skirts.



Bump for FD  ?


OK Bobby, you go round up all the Gazan women. See how that works out for you.



Dear FD,
I'm making a political point not a practical solution.
If the women and children were offered a safe place in tents outside of Gaza and
Hamas prevented them from leaving then Israel could blame Hamas for their deaths.

Instead - women and children were locked in -
Israel locked the gates and then dropped bombs on them -
like shooting fish in a barrel.
Is that fair?

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 23rd, 2024 at 4:54pm
Ah, so it's not about actually fixing the problem, just having someone to blame.

We can already blame Hamas for this Bobby. Those who do not are just looking for a reason to blame the Jews for everything, and would not change their mind because of your little trick. And TGD, who supports the terrorists because he thinks it would be to the CCP's advantage.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 23rd, 2024 at 4:59pm

freediver wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 4:54pm:
Ah, so it's not about actually fixing the problem, just having someone to blame.

We can already blame Hamas for this Bobby. Those who do not are just looking for a reason to blame the Jews for everything, and would not change their mind because of your little trick. And TGD, who supports the terrorists because he thinks it would be to the CCP's advantage.



But did you notice how Dirty Harry shot the bad guy but saved the kid?

Israel would have shot both of them.


Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Yadda on May 23rd, 2024 at 5:11pm

Bobby. wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 4:41pm:


Dear FD,
I'm making a political point not a practical solution.

If the women and children were offered a safe place in tents outside of Gaza and
Hamas prevented them from leaving then Israel could blame Hamas for their deaths.

Instead .....
Israel locked the gates and then dropped bombs on them -
like shooting fish in a barrel.

Is that fair?


No bobby !!!

That is just not fair bobby !



Hmmmmmm !!

If only the nations of the whole of the world,
could just find some way to protect the women and children of Gaza,
from all of those terrible, terrible Israelis,
who are choosing.....to kill all of those women and children of Gaza !

/sarc off



Yadda said......
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1621945743/7#7

Yadda said......
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1716330435/9#9





Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Bobby. on May 23rd, 2024 at 5:19pm
Dear Yadda,
are kids responsible for being brainwashed by adults?






Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Yadda on May 23rd, 2024 at 5:31pm

Bobby. wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 5:19pm:

Dear Yadda,
are kids responsible for being brainwashed by adults?



Dear bobby,

Are adults responsible for brainwashing kids in Gaza
and in Judea, and in Samaria ?










Well, are they ???

Yadda said......
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1621945743/7#7

Yadda said......
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1716330435/9#9







Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Yadda on May 23rd, 2024 at 5:49pm


Are adults responsible for brainwashing kids in Gaza
and in Judea, and in Samaria ?











.



"Peace will come to the Middle East
when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us."

- Golda Meir






Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 23rd, 2024 at 8:36pm

freediver wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 6:39am:

John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:22pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 8:54pm:
Why do you want Israeli citizens to be slaughtered by terrorists using human shields John?

Would you change your mind if they were not Jewish?


I don't want any civilians slaughtered by terrorists.  But unlike you,  I apply that rule equally to Muslims and Jews. You on the other hand only cry when it's Jewish civilians.  When it's Muslim civilians you cheer and find excuses for the terrorism


You are confused John. There is no choice in which no civilians die. Hamas has taken that choice away. You cannot stop a war, or win a war, by pouting, not matter how much effort you put into it.  The question is, whether to shoot back if they use human shields.

Do you understand that if Israel was stupid enough to follow your advice and not shoot back, it would encourage Hamas to use human shields?


There us a difference between 'no civilians die', and deliberately targeting civilians fd.
Why do you excuse terrorism?

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 23rd, 2024 at 9:29pm

John Smith wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 8:36pm:

freediver wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 6:39am:

John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:22pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 8:54pm:
Why do you want Israeli citizens to be slaughtered by terrorists using human shields John?

Would you change your mind if they were not Jewish?


I don't want any civilians slaughtered by terrorists.  But unlike you,  I apply that rule equally to Muslims and Jews. You on the other hand only cry when it's Jewish civilians.  When it's Muslim civilians you cheer and find excuses for the terrorism


You are confused John. There is no choice in which no civilians die. Hamas has taken that choice away. You cannot stop a war, or win a war, by pouting, not matter how much effort you put into it.  The question is, whether to shoot back if they use human shields.

Do you understand that if Israel was stupid enough to follow your advice and not shoot back, it would encourage Hamas to use human shields?


There us a difference between 'no civilians die', and deliberately targeting civilians fd.
Why do you excuse terrorism?


What has that got to do with whether Israel should fight back when Hamas is hiding behind human shields? Are you saying it is the same thing?

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 23rd, 2024 at 9:52pm

freediver wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 9:29pm:

John Smith wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 8:36pm:

freediver wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 6:39am:

John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:22pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 8:54pm:
Why do you want Israeli citizens to be slaughtered by terrorists using human shields John?

Would you change your mind if they were not Jewish?


I don't want any civilians slaughtered by terrorists.  But unlike you,  I apply that rule equally to Muslims and Jews. You on the other hand only cry when it's Jewish civilians.  When it's Muslim civilians you cheer and find excuses for the terrorism


You are confused John. There is no choice in which no civilians die. Hamas has taken that choice away. You cannot stop a war, or win a war, by pouting, not matter how much effort you put into it.  The question is, whether to shoot back if they use human shields.

Do you understand that if Israel was stupid enough to follow your advice and not shoot back, it would encourage Hamas to use human shields?


There us a difference between 'no civilians die', and deliberately targeting civilians fd.
Why do you excuse terrorism?


What has that got to do with whether Israel should fight back when Hamas is hiding behind human shields? Are you saying it is the same thing?


Not a difficult concept to follow fd. If you aim at a terrorist and a ricochet kills a woman nearby , it might reasonably be seen as collateral damage.

If you have to blow up a hospital with a thousand women and children in it because you think their might be someone hiding in the basement,  that's the act of a terrorist.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by Yadda on May 23rd, 2024 at 10:38pm

@ Reply #46,


A question,    ......based upon your own premise.


John Smith,said....

Quote:

If you have to blow up a hospital with a thousand women and children in it
because you think their might be someone hiding in the basement,
that's the act of a terrorist.



Firstly,
I don't believe, that the IDF has actually destroyed an operational hospital
"with a thousand women and children in it".


BUT........

John Smith,

1/ Who is the      ....'someone hiding in the basement' ?

2/ Why did the      'someone'     choose,
to hide in the basement of an operational hospital ?




John Smith,

Are you inferring, that the   'someone'   is a Hamas militant ???

And again, i ask,       ....why would Hamas militants choose,
to hide in the basement of an operational hospital ?


PLEASE EXPLAIN.




John Smith,

PLEASE CONSIDER;

These Hamas militants,      are Allah's Holy Warriors,
who have sworn an oath to die,     .....fighting in Allah's Cause.

So please tell us all,
why are these militants choosing,
to hide in the basement of an operational hospital ?






Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 24th, 2024 at 8:57am

John Smith wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 9:52pm:

freediver wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 9:29pm:

John Smith wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 8:36pm:

freediver wrote on May 23rd, 2024 at 6:39am:

John Smith wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 9:22pm:

freediver wrote on May 22nd, 2024 at 8:54pm:
Why do you want Israeli citizens to be slaughtered by terrorists using human shields John?

Would you change your mind if they were not Jewish?


I don't want any civilians slaughtered by terrorists.  But unlike you,  I apply that rule equally to Muslims and Jews. You on the other hand only cry when it's Jewish civilians.  When it's Muslim civilians you cheer and find excuses for the terrorism


You are confused John. There is no choice in which no civilians die. Hamas has taken that choice away. You cannot stop a war, or win a war, by pouting, not matter how much effort you put into it.  The question is, whether to shoot back if they use human shields.

Do you understand that if Israel was stupid enough to follow your advice and not shoot back, it would encourage Hamas to use human shields?


There us a difference between 'no civilians die', and deliberately targeting civilians fd.
Why do you excuse terrorism?


What has that got to do with whether Israel should fight back when Hamas is hiding behind human shields? Are you saying it is the same thing?


Not a difficult concept to follow fd. If you aim at a terrorist and a ricochet kills a woman nearby , it might reasonably be seen as collateral damage.

If you have to blow up a hospital with a thousand women and children in it because you think their might be someone hiding in the basement,  that's the act of a terrorist.


And either way, the Jews are guilty?

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 24th, 2024 at 8:59am

freediver wrote on May 24th, 2024 at 8:57am:
And either way, the Jews are guilty?


of stupidity? Only if you FD are Jewish

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 24th, 2024 at 9:04am
You said Jews should not be allowed to shoot back at terrorists if they are using their mothers as human shields.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 24th, 2024 at 1:48pm

freediver wrote on May 24th, 2024 at 9:04am:
You said Jews should not be allowed to shoot back at terrorists if they are using their mothers as human shields.


see, you've proven my point

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 30th, 2024 at 8:40am

John Smith wrote on May 24th, 2024 at 1:48pm:

freediver wrote on May 24th, 2024 at 9:04am:
You said Jews should not be allowed to shoot back at terrorists if they are using their mothers as human shields.


see, you've proven my point


If a terrorist was lobbing rockets at you from behind his mother's skirt, would you volunteer to die rather than firing back? Or does this standard only apply when it is Jews being targetted?

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 30th, 2024 at 8:42am

freediver wrote on May 30th, 2024 at 8:40am:

John Smith wrote on May 24th, 2024 at 1:48pm:

freediver wrote on May 24th, 2024 at 9:04am:
You said Jews should not be allowed to shoot back at terrorists if they are using their mothers as human shields.


see, you've proven my point


If a terrorist was lobbing rockets at you from behind his mother's skirt, would you volunteer to die rather than firing back? Or does this standard only apply when it is Jews being targetted?


making up stupid scenarios to justify your stupidity fd? ;D ;D

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 30th, 2024 at 8:49am

John Smith wrote on May 30th, 2024 at 8:42am:

freediver wrote on May 30th, 2024 at 8:40am:

John Smith wrote on May 24th, 2024 at 1:48pm:

freediver wrote on May 24th, 2024 at 9:04am:
You said Jews should not be allowed to shoot back at terrorists if they are using their mothers as human shields.


see, you've proven my point


If a terrorist was lobbing rockets at you from behind his mother's skirt, would you volunteer to die rather than firing back? Or does this standard only apply when it is Jews being targetted?


making up stupid scenarios to justify your stupidity fd? ;D ;D


The scenario is real for Israel John. It is your response that is stupid.

If a terrorist was lobbing rockets at you from behind his mother's skirt, would you volunteer to die rather than firing back? Or does this standard only apply when it is Jews being targeted?

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 30th, 2024 at 9:17am

freediver wrote on May 30th, 2024 at 8:49am:
The scenario is real for Israel John.


only in your imagination. Which you often confuse with facts

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 30th, 2024 at 9:20am

John Smith wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 9:48pm:

Quote:
What if they hide behind their mothers skirts while lobbing rockets at Israel?


You don't take the shot.  No one said it was supposed to be easy.


Real or not, your response is still stupid. Incredibly stupid. Why are you happy to insist that Jews live up to your stupid standard, but are afraid to even answer the question for yourself?

If a terrorist was lobbing rockets at you from behind his mother's skirt, would you volunteer to die rather than firing back? Or does this standard only apply when it is Jews being targeted?

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 30th, 2024 at 9:30am

freediver wrote on May 30th, 2024 at 9:20am:
Real or not, your response is still stupid.


Not if you are sane. Perhaps thats why you struggle with it.

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by freediver on May 30th, 2024 at 9:38am

John Smith wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 9:48pm:

Quote:
What if they hide behind their mothers skirts while lobbing rockets at Israel?


You don't take the shot.  No one said it was supposed to be easy.


So this is the "sane" response?

If a terrorist was lobbing rockets at you from behind his mother's skirt, would you volunteer to die rather than firing back? Or does this standard for "sanity" only apply when it is Jews being targeted?

Title: Re: using human shields in war
Post by John Smith on May 30th, 2024 at 10:31am

freediver wrote on May 30th, 2024 at 9:38am:

John Smith wrote on May 21st, 2024 at 9:48pm:

Quote:
What if they hide behind their mothers skirts while lobbing rockets at Israel?


You don't take the shot.  No one said it was supposed to be easy.


So this is the "sane" response?

If a terrorist was lobbing rockets at you from behind his mother's skirt, would you volunteer to die rather than firing back? Or does this standard for "sanity" only apply when it is Jews being targeted?


Why do you persist with what you admit is pure stupidity on your part? Are you trying to lose whatever credibility you have? Cause if that's the case, rest assured, you have none left to lose.

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