Putin signed an Executive Order for foreigners tired of the frenzy of their governments regarding the introduction of neoliberal values.



Executive Order on providing humanitarian support to individuals sharing traditional Russian spiritual and moral values

August 19, 2024 - 16:00

The Executive Order has been issued to protect the fundamental human rights and freedoms and support individuals who made a free choice in favour of spiritual, cultural and legal ties with the Russian Federation, and in accordance with Federal Law No 114-FZ, On the Procedure for Exit From and Entry Into the Russian Federation, of August 15, 1996, and Federal Law No 115-FZ, On the Legal Status of Foreign Citizens in the Russian Federation, of July 25, 2002.

Under the Executive Order, the right to apply for a temporary residence permit without taking into account the quota approved by the Russian Government and without submitting a document confirming proficiency in the Russian language and knowledge of the history and fundamentals of Russian legislation is granted to foreign citizens and stateless persons who have expressed a desire to move to the Russian Federation from the countries of their citizenship or permanent residence due to their rejection of the policy implemented by these states that imposes destructive neoliberal ideological attitudes that contradict traditional Russian spiritual and moral values, as provided for in the Fundamentals of State Policy for the Preservation and Strengthening of Traditional Russian Spiritual and Moral Values.

The list of foreign countries implementing a policy that imposes destructive neoliberal ideological attitudes that contradict traditional Russian spiritual and moral values ​​is approved by the Russian Government upon submission by the Foreign Ministry.

Corresponding instructions have been given to the Russian Government, the Foreign Ministry and the Interior Ministry.

http://en.kremlin.ru/acts/news/74888

What are Russian spiritual and moral values?

This question is answered the Executive Order On approving the Fundamentals of State Policy to Preserve and Strengthen Traditional Russian Spiritual and Moral Values

November 12, 2022

...
4. Traditional values are the moral precepts shaping Russian citizens’ worldview, handed down from one generation to another and forming the foundation of Russia’s national civic identity and the country’s single cultural space, as well as reinforcing civic unity, and they are reflected in the unique and authentic spiritual, historical and cultural development path of Russia’s multi-ethnic people.

5. Traditional values include life, dignity, human rights and freedoms, patriotism, civic consciousness, service to the Fatherland and responsibility for its destiny, high moral ideals, strong families, productive labour, the primacy of the spiritual over corporeal, humanism, charity, justice, collectivism, mutual assistance and mutual respect, historical memory and the continuity of generations, as well as the unity of Russia’s peoples.

6. Christianity, Islam, Buddhism, Judaism, and other religions which are an integral part of Russia’s historical and spiritual heritage have had a considerable influence on the emergence of the traditional values shared by believers and non-believers alike. The Orthodox faith has played a special role in the emergence and strengthening of traditional values.
...

13. Threats to traditional values come from extremist and terrorist organisations, some news media and communication platforms, the actions of the United States and other unfriendly foreign states, several transnational corporations and foreign NGOs, as well as the activities of some organisations and individuals in the territory of Russia.

14. Ideological and psychological influences on citizens are leading to the dissemination of a system of ideas and values that are alien to the Russian people and destructive for Russian society (hereinafter referred to as “destructive ideology”), such as the fostering of egoism, permissiveness and immorality, rejection of the ideals of patriotism, service to the Fatherland, the natural progression of life, the values of a strong family, marriage, raising multiple children, productive labour, and Russia’s positive contribution to global history and culture, as well as the erosion of the traditional family through the promotion of non-traditional sexual identities.
...
17. The dissemination of destructive ideology entails the following risks:

a) emergence of conditions for the self-destruction of society and the erosion of family, friendship and other social ties;

b) accelerated socio-cultural stratification, decline of the role of social partnership, and devaluation of the ideas of productive labour and mutual assistance;

c) damage to the moral health of the people, imposition of concepts that disregard human dignity and the value of human life;

d) promotion of antisocial behaviour, dissolute lifestyles, permissiveness and violence, growing alcoholism and drug addiction;

e) emergence of a society that rejects spiritual and moral values;

f) distortion of historical truth and erosion of historical memory;

g) rejection of Russian authenticity, weakening of the national civic identity and cohesion of the multi-ethnic Russian people, development of conditions for interethnic and interfaith conflicts;

h) erosion of confidence in government institutions, discreditation of the idea of service to the Fatherland, and development of a negative attitude to military service and government service in general.
...

https://senegal.mid.ru/en/press-centre/news/on_approving_the_fundamentals_of_state_policy_to_preserve_and_strengthen_traditional_russian_spiritu/

'foreign citizens who desire to move to Russia due to their rejection of destructive neoliberal ideological attitudes'.

Russia immigration 470,000 in 2023. All leading 10 origins were former republics of the Soviet Union.

Emigration February-October 2022 approximately 900,000.
Russian emigration 2023 estimated at 500,000–600,000.

Immigrants desire to be Russian because Putin values life, dignity, human rights and freedoms, high moral ideals, humanism, charity, justice, mutual assistance and mutual respect.
_ signed V Putin.

chimera wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 7:16am:

'foreign citizens who desire to move to Russia due to their rejection of destructive neoliberal ideological attitudes'. Russia immigration 470,000 in 2023. All leading 10 origins were former republics of the Soviet Union. Emigration February-October 2022 approximately 900,000. Russian emigration 2023 estimated at 500,000–600,000. Immigrants desire to be Russian because Putin values life, dignity, human rights and freedoms, high moral ideals, humanism, charity, justice, mutual assistance and mutual respect. _ signed V Putin.

Well, at least the ark of salvation from LGBT and other Western social inventions has appeared in the world.

As far as I know, there are no other countries in the world ready to accept you just because you are running away from LGBT people in horror.

However, we must wait until the Russian Foreign Ministry provides a list of countries from which we are ready to accept such people.

Does this mean he is anticipating losing in Ukraine and inviting his supporters there to move to Russia?

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 7:39am:

As far as I know, there are no other countries in the world ready to accept you just because you are running away from LGBT people in horror.

I think I just found Franks new home :D :D :D

freediver wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 8:45am:

Does this mean he is anticipating losing in Ukraine and inviting his supporters there to move to Russia?

Wouldn't it be nice to see good 'ol Vlad lose to Ukraine? Probably won't happen, but one can dream. Glad to see Ukraine taking it to the Russians. They've captured more Russian territory in a week than the Russians did in Ukraine in over a year. That's gotta sting, Putin!

Quote:

Executive Order on providing humanitarian support to individuals sharing traditional Russian spiritual and moral values

Does that include 1 billion Africans and a few 100 million Muslims who
would like to move to Russia?

Armchair_Politician wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 9:34am:

freediver wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 8:45am: Does this mean he is anticipating losing in Ukraine and inviting his supporters there to move to Russia? Wouldn't it be nice to see good 'ol Vlad lose to Ukraine? Probably won't happen, but one can dream. Glad to see Ukraine taking it to the Russians. They've captured more Russian territory in a week than the Russians did in Ukraine in over a year. That's gotta sting, Putin!

Seems they are going to stay there, make the Kursk Oblast a bargaining chip for negotiations to end the fighting.

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 11:19am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 9:34am: freediver wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 8:45am: Does this mean he is anticipating losing in Ukraine and inviting his supporters there to move to Russia? Wouldn't it be nice to see good 'ol Vlad lose to Ukraine? Probably won't happen, but one can dream. Glad to see Ukraine taking it to the Russians. They've captured more Russian territory in a week than the Russians did in Ukraine in over a year. That's gotta sting, Putin! Seems they are going to stay there, make the Kursk Oblast a bargaining chip for negotiations to end the fighting.

Yes, they will stay as fertiliser unless Ukrainian dictator Zelensky exchange them for civilian hostages.

https://iili.io/dVGL6Ux.png

Some Immigrants to Russia (google translation)

freediver wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 8:45am:

Does this mean he is anticipating losing in Ukraine and inviting his supporters there to move to Russia?

No.

This means that Russia is now becoming a defender of Christian values against the new liberal values in the world.

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 11:00am:

Quote: Executive Order on providing humanitarian support to individuals sharing traditional Russian spiritual and moral values Does that include 1 billion Africans and a few 100 million Muslims who would like to move to Russia?

"The list of foreign states implementing policies that impose destructive neoliberal ideological attitudes that contradict traditional Russian spiritual and moral values is approved by the Government of the Russian Federation on the recommendation of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation" - a fragment of the text of the Executive Order.

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 3:53pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 8:45am: Does this mean he is anticipating losing in Ukraine and inviting his supporters there to move to Russia? No. This means that Russia is now becoming a defender of Christian values against the new liberal values in the world.

I doubt he is fooling anyone. Putting aside the issue of starting a pointless war, there is also plenty of direct persecution of Christians:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_the_Soviet_Union

Throughout the history of the Soviet Union (1917–1991), there were periods when Soviet authorities suppressed and persecuted various forms of Christianity to different extents depending on state interests.[1] Soviet Marxist-Leninist policy consistently advocated the control, suppression, and ultimately, the elimination of religious beliefs, and it actively encouraged the propagation of Marxist-Leninist atheism in the Soviet Union.

https://time.com/6969273/russias-war-against-evangelicals/

Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is accompanied with a strategic effort to repress, control, and crush religious groups outside of the Kremlin controlled Moscow Patriarchate, the Russian Orthodox Church. There are over thirty cases of religious clergy killed and kidnapped. 109 known cases of interrogations, forced expulsions, imprisonments, arrests. 600 houses of worship destroyed. And these are just the confirmed numbers, with the real ones in information blackout of the occupied territories will much likely be higher.

freediver wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 4:28pm:

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 3:53pm: freediver wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 8:45am: Does this mean he is anticipating losing in Ukraine and inviting his supporters there to move to Russia? No. This means that Russia is now becoming a defender of Christian values against the new liberal values in the world. I doubt he is fooling anyone. Putting aside the issue of starting a pointless war, there is also plenty of direct persecution of Christians: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_the_Soviet_Union Throughout the history of the Soviet Union (1917–1991), there were periods when Soviet authorities suppressed and persecuted various forms of Christianity to different extents depending on state interests.[1] Soviet Marxist-Leninist policy consistently advocated the control, suppression, and ultimately, the elimination of religious beliefs, and it actively encouraged the propagation of Marxist-Leninist atheism in the Soviet Union. https://time.com/6969273/russias-war-against-evangelicals/ Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is accompanied with a strategic effort to repress, control, and crush religious groups outside of the Kremlin controlled Moscow Patriarchate, the Russian Orthodox Church. There are over thirty cases of religious clergy killed and kidnapped. 109 known cases of interrogations, forced expulsions, imprisonments, arrests. 600 houses of worship destroyed. And these are just the confirmed numbers, with the real ones in information blackout of the occupied territories will much likely be higher.

Justus Walker is a farmer who lives in the region of Altai, Russia. He has lived in Russia for over 20 years now. Born in US to evangelical missionary parents he looks after his farm but also ran his small church without any problems from authorities. So much for fake news from time.com

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ko-kAyiIV4

Piers Morgan getting absolutely schooled on Geo-Politics by scholar Jeffrey Sachs.

Have never seen Piers Morgan so quiet.

https://x.com/BGatesIsaPyscho/status/1825982159598874931

tallowood wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 4:58pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 4:28pm: RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 3:53pm: freediver wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 8:45am: Does this mean he is anticipating losing in Ukraine and inviting his supporters there to move to Russia? No. This means that Russia is now becoming a defender of Christian values against the new liberal values in the world. I doubt he is fooling anyone. Putting aside the issue of starting a pointless war, there is also plenty of direct persecution of Christians: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_the_Soviet_Union Throughout the history of the Soviet Union (1917–1991), there were periods when Soviet authorities suppressed and persecuted various forms of Christianity to different extents depending on state interests.[1] Soviet Marxist-Leninist policy consistently advocated the control, suppression, and ultimately, the elimination of religious beliefs, and it actively encouraged the propagation of Marxist-Leninist atheism in the Soviet Union. https://time.com/6969273/russias-war-against-evangelicals/ Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is accompanied with a strategic effort to repress, control, and crush religious groups outside of the Kremlin controlled Moscow Patriarchate, the Russian Orthodox Church. There are over thirty cases of religious clergy killed and kidnapped. 109 known cases of interrogations, forced expulsions, imprisonments, arrests. 600 houses of worship destroyed. And these are just the confirmed numbers, with the real ones in information blackout of the occupied territories will much likely be higher. Justus Walker is a farmer who lives in the region of Altai, Russia. He has lived in Russia for over 20 years now. Born in US to evangelical missionary parents he looks after his farm but also ran his small church without any problems from authorities. So much for fake news from time.com https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ko-kAyiIV4

What exactly do you think one counter-example proves? Is that any less idiotic that pointing to a Jew who survived WWII in Germany and insisting the holocaust is fake news?

Quote:

What exactly do you think one counter-example proves? Is that any less idiotic that pointing to a Jew who survived WWII in Germany and insisting the holocaust is fake news?

Quote:

He is not the only one

There is plenty of other evidence proving that many people here being brainwashed by fake news "Western" media.

Where have all these Russian spies come from?

RussiAnVetEraN,  Tallowood.      :o

tallowood wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 5:12pm:

Quote: What exactly do you think one counter-example proves? Is that any less idiotic that pointing to a Jew who survived WWII in Germany and insisting the holocaust is fake news? [quote]He is not the only one

There is plenty of other evidence proving that many people here being brainwashed by fake news "Western" media.[/quote]

Is it all as idiotic as the 'evidence' you chose to post?

Are you suggesting the the Russian government does not openly and systematically persecute people based on their religion?

freediver wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 5:23pm:

tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:12pm: Quote: What exactly do you think one counter-example proves? Is that any less idiotic that pointing to a Jew who survived WWII in Germany and insisting the holocaust is fake news? [quote]He is not the only one There is plenty of other evidence proving that many people here being brainwashed by fake news "Western" media.

Is it all as idiotic as the 'evidence' you chose to post?

Are you suggesting the the Russian government does not openly and systematically persecute people based on their religion?[/quote]

It is less idiotic then russophobic posts here.

You keep mixing soviet and post soviet periods. Why?

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 5:15pm:

Where have all these Russian spies come from? RussiAnVetEraN,  Tallowood.      :o

https://iili.io/d0S9uyl.png

tallowood wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 5:47pm:

It is less idiotic then russophobic posts here. You keep mixing soviet and post soviet periods. Why?

I'll answer for FD,

Putin wants Russia to return to its former Soviet glory when it owned half of Europe
and forced it into communist slavery.

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 5:53pm:

tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:47pm: It is less idiotic then russophobic posts here. You keep mixing soviet and post soviet periods. Why? I'll answer for FD, Putin wants Russia to return to its former Soviet glory when it owned half of Europe and forced it into communist slavery.

Putin tells you so every night?

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 3:53pm:

This means that Russia is now becoming a defender of Christian values against the new liberal values in the world.

Yes, the more Orthodox people that Putin can kill, the better.

tallowood wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 5:56pm:

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:53pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:47pm: It is less idiotic then russophobic posts here. You keep mixing soviet and post soviet periods. Why? I'll answer for FD, Putin wants Russia to return to its former Soviet glory when it owned half of Europe and forced it into communist slavery. Putin tells you so every night?

The Soviets made everyone in Europe hate and fear them.
They lived lives of communist misery until Dec.1991.
No wonder they all wanted to join NATO to keep the Russians out -
they were right as Putin invaded in February 2022.
The Russian bastards can go to hell - all of them.

tallowood wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 5:56pm:

Putin tells you so every night?

No, not often. 'In his annual state of the nation address on Monday, Russian President Vladimir Putin called the collapse of the Soviet empire “the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the century.”
Half of Europe escaped from mother Russia and will be dealt with by Holy Slavs.

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 6:00pm:

tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:56pm: Bobby. wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:53pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:47pm: It is less idiotic then russophobic posts here. You keep mixing soviet and post soviet periods. Why? I'll answer for FD, Putin wants Russia to return to its former Soviet glory when it owned half of Europe and forced it into communist slavery. Putin tells you so every night? The Soviets made everyone in Europe hate and fear them. They lived lives of communist misery until Dec.1991. No wonder they all wanted to join NATO to keep the Russians out - they were right as Putin invaded in February 2022. The Russian bastards can go to hell - all of them.

Bobby, you sound like you are already in hell most of your nights and now in during day light as well  ;D

chimera wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 6:03pm:

tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:56pm: Putin tells you so every night? Vladimir Putin called the collapse of the Soviet empire “the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the century.”

Judging by Bobby he wasn't wrong  ;)

tallowood wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 6:06pm:

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 6:00pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:56pm: Bobby. wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:53pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:47pm: It is less idiotic then russophobic posts here. You keep mixing soviet and post soviet periods. Why? I'll answer for FD, Putin wants Russia to return to its former Soviet glory when it owned half of Europe and forced it into communist slavery. Putin tells you so every night? The Soviets made everyone in Europe hate and fear them. They lived lives of communist misery until Dec.1991. No wonder they all wanted to join NATO to keep the Russians out - they were right as Putin invaded in February 2022. The Russian bastards can go to hell - all of them. Bobby, you sound like you are already in hell most of your nights and now in during day light as well  ;D

I met people who told me what it was like under communism -
in Poland people lined up for 3 hours to get a loaf of bread for their family - if they were lucky.
Communism brought misery to Europe.

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 6:14pm:

tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 6:06pm: Bobby. wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 6:00pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:56pm: Bobby. wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:53pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:47pm: It is less idiotic then russophobic posts here. You keep mixing soviet and post soviet periods. Why? I'll answer for FD, Putin wants Russia to return to its former Soviet glory when it owned half of Europe and forced it into communist slavery. Putin tells you so every night? The Soviets made everyone in Europe hate and fear them. They lived lives of communist misery until Dec.1991. No wonder they all wanted to join NATO to keep the Russians out - they were right as Putin invaded in February 2022. The Russian bastards can go to hell - all of them. Bobby, you sound like you are already in hell most of your nights and now in during day light as well  ;D I met people who told me what it was like under communism - in Poland people lined up for 3 hours to get a loaf of bread for their family - if they were lucky. Communism brought misery to Europe.

Europe and particular France and Germany is the birthplace of communism while Britain was it's cradle.

https://iili.io/dVXPeVt.md.png

Europe doesn't want the Russians to ever return.

The only way is to fight them to the death if necessary.
The Russians must be the most hated people on earth.

tallowood wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 5:47pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:23pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:12pm: Quote: What exactly do you think one counter-example proves? Is that any less idiotic that pointing to a Jew who survived WWII in Germany and insisting the holocaust is fake news? [quote]He is not the only one There is plenty of other evidence proving that many people here being brainwashed by fake news "Western" media. Is it all as idiotic as the 'evidence' you chose to post? Are you suggesting the the Russian government does not openly and systematically persecute people based on their religion?

It is less idiotic then russophobic posts here.

You keep mixing soviet and post soviet periods. Why?
[/quote]

So where is all this evidence? Is it all as idiotic as the 'evidence' you chose to post? Are you suggesting the the Russian government does not openly and systematically persecute people based on their religion?

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 6:33pm:

Europe doesn't want the Russians to ever return. The only way is to fight them to the death if necessary. The Russians must be the most hated people on earth.

Zelensky  needs fresh cannon fodder, he'll pay you American money and give you underage girls or boys and famous Ukrainian salo (salted pig fat) if you so inclined. Don' miss your chance. Ask Joel Stremsky, Mathew Japson, "Digby" Lincoln, O'Donald, "Ninja" Keldal, Charlse O'Neil, Jed Danahey and "Chippy" Greenwood.  Be brave and stupid like them.

freediver wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 6:37pm:

tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:47pm: freediver wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:23pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:12pm: Quote: What exactly do you think one counter-example proves? Is that any less idiotic that pointing to a Jew who survived WWII in Germany and insisting the holocaust is fake news? [quote]He is not the only one There is plenty of other evidence proving that many people here being brainwashed by fake news "Western" media. Is it all as idiotic as the 'evidence' you chose to post? Are you suggesting the the Russian government does not openly and systematically persecute people based on their religion? It is less idiotic then russophobic posts here. You keep mixing soviet and post soviet periods. Why?

So where is all this evidence? Is it all as idiotic as the 'evidence' you chose to post? Are you suggesting the the Russian government does not openly and systematically persecute people based on their religion?
[/quote]

You made the assumption so you have to provide evidence.

tallowood wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 7:02pm:

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 6:33pm: Europe doesn't want the Russians to ever return. The only way is to fight them to the death if necessary. The Russians must be the most hated people on earth. Zelensky  needs fresh cannon fodder, he'll pay you American money and give you underage girls or boys and famous Ukrainian salo (salted pig fat) if you so inclined. Don' miss your chance. Ask Joel Stremsky, Mathew Japson, "Digby" Lincoln, O'Donald, "Ninja" Keldal, Charlse O'Neil, Jed Danahey and "Chippy" Greenwood.  Be brave and stupid like them.

Don't make fun of all the poor people who have lost their
lives trying to get rid of the filthy Russians.

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 7:06pm:

tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 7:02pm: Bobby. wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 6:33pm: Europe doesn't want the Russians to ever return. The only way is to fight them to the death if necessary. The Russians must be the most hated people on earth. Zelensky  needs fresh cannon fodder, he'll pay you American money and give you underage girls or boys and famous Ukrainian salo (salted pig fat) if you so inclined. Don' miss your chance. Ask Joel Stremsky, Mathew Japson, "Digby" Lincoln, O'Donald, "Ninja" Keldal, Charlse O'Neil, Jed Danahey and "Chippy" Greenwood.  Be brave and stupid like them. Don't make fun of all the poor people who have lost their lives trying to get rid of the filthy Russians.

I feel sorry for them, they become victims to fake news media just like you.

tallowood wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 7:12pm:

I feel sorry for them, they become victims to fake news media just like you.

No you don't - you're a communist Russian spy
who wants the old Soviet Union to return and rule the world.

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 7:28pm:

tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 7:12pm: I feel sorry for them, they become victims to fake news media just like you. No you don't - you're a communist Russian spy who wants the old Soviet Union to return and rule the world.

Bobby, you really need a psychiatrist to remove Putin out of your poor head  :(

tallowood wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 7:34pm:

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 7:28pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 7:12pm: I feel sorry for them, they become victims to fake news media just like you. No you don't - you're a communist Russian spy who wants the old Soviet Union to return and rule the world. Bobby, you really need a psychiatrist to remove Putin out of your poor head  :(

I've got no time for Russian communists - it's better that we all die
than live in a world controlled by Putin.
That might happen too - WW3 is on the cards right now thanks to Putin's aggression.
One mistake - one miscalculation, and it's the end of all of us.
The Yanks and the Russians have enough nukes to wipe
the whole world out many times over.

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 7:38pm:

tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 7:34pm: Bobby. wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 7:28pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 7:12pm: I feel sorry for them, they become victims to fake news media just like you. No you don't - you're a communist Russian spy who wants the old Soviet Union to return and rule the world. Bobby, you really need a psychiatrist to remove Putin out of your poor head  :( I've got no time for Russian communists - it's better that we all die than live in a world controlled by Putin. That might happen too - WW3 is on the cards right now thanks to Putin's aggression. One mistake - one miscalculation, and it's the end of all of us. The Yanks and the Russians have enough nukes to wipe the whole world out many times over.

So why don't you go to fight for Zelensky and his puppeteers?

tallowood wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 7:42pm:

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 7:38pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 7:34pm: Bobby. wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 7:28pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 7:12pm: I feel sorry for them, they become victims to fake news media just like you. No you don't - you're a communist Russian spy who wants the old Soviet Union to return and rule the world. Bobby, you really need a psychiatrist to remove Putin out of your poor head  :( I've got no time for Russian communists - it's better that we all die than live in a world controlled by Putin. That might happen too - WW3 is on the cards right now thanks to Putin's aggression. One mistake - one miscalculation, and it's the end of all of us. The Yanks and the Russians have enough nukes to wipe the whole world out many times over. So why don't you go to fight for Zelensky and his puppeteers?

I'm too old.
I hope it will all be settled soon over a negotiating table.

Trump said he can end it in 24 hours.

tallowood wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 7:03pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 6:37pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:47pm: freediver wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:23pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:12pm: Quote: What exactly do you think one counter-example proves? Is that any less idiotic that pointing to a Jew who survived WWII in Germany and insisting the holocaust is fake news? [quote]He is not the only one There is plenty of other evidence proving that many people here being brainwashed by fake news "Western" media. Is it all as idiotic as the 'evidence' you chose to post? Are you suggesting the the Russian government does not openly and systematically persecute people based on their religion? It is less idiotic then russophobic posts here. You keep mixing soviet and post soviet periods. Why? So where is all this evidence? Is it all as idiotic as the 'evidence' you chose to post? Are you suggesting the the Russian government does not openly and systematically persecute people based on their religion?

You made the assumption so you have to provide evidence.[/quote]

What assumption do you think I made? What is this evidence you brought up? Is it all as idiotic as the 'evidence' you chose to post? Are you suggesting the the Russian government does not openly and systematically persecute people based on their religion?

John Smith wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 8:47am:

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 7:39am: As far as I know, there are no other countries in the world ready to accept you just because you are running away from LGBT people in horror. I think I just found Franks new home :D :D :D

Why not?

There are already Australians in Russia.


Alone in the city

July 13, 2024

(Turn on English subtitles)
https://youtu.be/jlSLUYJI_A4?si=vzMulfrqYaRBuHPe

freediver wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 4:28pm:

I doubt he is fooling anyone. Putting aside the issue of starting a pointless war, there is also plenty of direct persecution of Christians: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_the_Soviet_Union Throughout the history of the Soviet Union (1917–1991), there were periods when Soviet authorities suppressed and persecuted various forms of Christianity to different extents depending on state interests.[1] Soviet Marxist-Leninist policy consistently advocated the control, suppression, and ultimately, the elimination of religious beliefs, and it actively encouraged the propagation of Marxist-Leninist atheism in the Soviet Union.

What does the past of another social system have to do with today's reality?

New Orthodox churches are being built and opened in Russia every day.




Quote:

https://time.com/6969273/russias-war-against-evangelicals/ Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is accompanied with a strategic effort to repress, control, and crush religious groups outside of the Kremlin controlled Moscow Patriarchate, the Russian Orthodox Church. There are over thirty cases of religious clergy killed and kidnapped. 109 known cases of interrogations, forced expulsions, imprisonments, arrests. 600 houses of worship destroyed. And these are just the confirmed numbers, with the real ones in information blackout of the occupied territories will much likely be higher.

You probably don't know that a few days ago the Ukrainian Parliament banned the Ukrainian Orthodox Church.

And more:

REPORT of the Foreign Ministry of the Russian Federation «Illegal actions by the Kiev regime targeting the Ukrainian Orthodox Church (UOC), its clergy and parishioners»

25 July 2023 - 23:06

7. Response by certain international human rights organisations

.....
"In addition to this, the UN Human Rights Council published its decision expressing concern with reports about the rights violations faced by UOC believers. In particular, it noted: “The committee is concerned at reports of violence, intimidation and acts of vandalism of places of worship in connection with the process of transitioning churches and religious communities from the Ukrainian Orthodox Church to the newly established Orthodox Church of Ukraine. The Committee is further concerned at the reported inaction of the police in such incidents and the lack of information on investigations conducted by the State party.”
.....
https://www.mid.ru/en/foreign_policy/humanitarian_cooperation/1898457/

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 5:15pm:

Where have all these Russian spies come from? RussiAnVetEraN

I'm from Russia. The city of Zelenograd. 8-)

(The year 2021)
https://youtu.be/SMHkM-LPYoo?si=rCWyw0V6eC3NEezu

chimera wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 6:00pm:

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 3:53pm: This means that Russia is now becoming a defender of Christian values against the new liberal values in the world. Yes, the more Orthodox people that Putin can kill, the better.

I don't know about Putin's future plans. He supports all the traditional religions of Russia at the moment.

From 2014 he has been killing Orthodox in Ukraine.

Doesn't look like orthodox.

https://iili.io/dVtyg49.md.png

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 5:04am:

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:15pm: Where have all these Russian spies come from? RussiAnVetEraN I'm from Russia. The city of Zelenograd. 8-) (The year 2021)

You're a Soviet infiltrator on a Western forum.

tallowood wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 11:40am:

Doesn't look like orthodox.

Putin claimed that Ukraine is “an inalienable part of our own history, culture, and spiritual space.” Nearly 80 percent of Ukrainians profess affiliation with an Orthodox denomination,

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 4:37am:

freediver wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 4:28pm: I doubt he is fooling anyone. Putting aside the issue of starting a pointless war, there is also plenty of direct persecution of Christians: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_the_Soviet_Union Throughout the history of the Soviet Union (1917–1991), there were periods when Soviet authorities suppressed and persecuted various forms of Christianity to different extents depending on state interests.[1] Soviet Marxist-Leninist policy consistently advocated the control, suppression, and ultimately, the elimination of religious beliefs, and it actively encouraged the propagation of Marxist-Leninist atheism in the Soviet Union. What does the past of another social system have to do with today's reality? New Orthodox churches are being built and opened in Russia every day. Quote: https://time.com/6969273/russias-war-against-evangelicals/ Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is accompanied with a strategic effort to repress, control, and crush religious groups outside of the Kremlin controlled Moscow Patriarchate, the Russian Orthodox Church. There are over thirty cases of religious clergy killed and kidnapped. 109 known cases of interrogations, forced expulsions, imprisonments, arrests. 600 houses of worship destroyed. And these are just the confirmed numbers, with the real ones in information blackout of the occupied territories will much likely be higher. You probably don't know that a few days ago the Ukrainian Parliament banned the Ukrainian Orthodox Church. And more: REPORT of the Foreign Ministry of the Russian Federation «Illegal actions by the Kiev regime targeting the Ukrainian Orthodox Church (UOC), its clergy and parishioners» 25 July 2023 - 23:06 7. Response by certain international human rights organisations ..... "In addition to this, the UN Human Rights Council published its decision expressing concern with reports about the rights violations faced by UOC believers. In particular, it noted: “The committee is concerned at reports of violence, intimidation and acts of vandalism of places of worship in connection with the process of transitioning churches and religious communities from the Ukrainian Orthodox Church to the newly established Orthodox Church of Ukraine. The Committee is further concerned at the reported inaction of the police in such incidents and the lack of information on investigations conducted by the State party.” ..... https://www.mid.ru/en/foreign_policy/humanitarian_cooperation/1898457/

You know that is a logical fallacy, right?

chimera wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 11:50am:

tallowood wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 11:40am: Doesn't look like orthodox. Putin claimed that Ukraine is “an inalienable part of our own history, culture, and spiritual space.” Nearly 80 percent of Ukrainians profess affiliation with an Orthodox denomination,

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 4:37am:

You probably don't know that a few days ago the Ukrainian Parliament banned the Ukrainian Orthodox Church. And more: REPORT of the Foreign Ministry of the Russian Federation «Illegal actions by the Kiev regime targeting the Ukrainian Orthodox Church (UOC), its clergy and parishioners» 25 July 2023 - 23:06 7. Response by certain international human rights organisations ..... "In addition to this, the UN Human Rights Council published its decision expressing concern with reports about the rights violations faced by UOC believers. In particular, it noted: “The committee is concerned at reports of violence, intimidation and acts of vandalism of places of worship in connection with the process of transitioning churches and religious communities from the Ukrainian Orthodox Church to the newly established Orthodox Church of Ukraine. The Committee is further concerned at the reported inaction of the police in such incidents and the lack of information on investigations conducted by the State party.” ..... https://www.mid.ru/en/foreign_policy/humanitarian_cooperation/1898457/

Number of civilian casualties in Ukraine during Russia's invasion verified by OHCHR from February 24, 2022 to July 31, 2024.
11,520.
That's 8,800 dead Orthodox, by the order of Putin.

Sounds like Zelensky and Porosenko before him are Putin's agents  :o

Yes you are making sense there.

chimera wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 8:31am:

From 2014 he has been killing Orthodox in Ukraine.

Where do you get this data from?

What does the Ukrainian Orthodox Church itself write?

(Their website blocks me, but the website of the Russian Orthodox Church regularly reprints news from their website.)

For example:


UOC church seized in Pylypy village in Ukraine

On 16th July 2024, in Pylypy village, Khmelnytskyi region, Ukraine, representatives of the local authorities, acting together with the OCU activists, seized St. Nicholas Church of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church.

“The unlawful church seizure was an audacious and coercive act. The front door was forced with police present,” Press Service of the UOC Khmelnytskyi Diocese reported. Among those who staged and carried out the raider attack were a deputy of the district council and the village headman.

The Church of St. Nicholas the Wonderworker in Pylypy, consecrated in 1907, kept functioning even during the years of the atheistic persecutions, to be closed only from 1941 to 1942.

Despite the church seizure, the entire religious community headed by the parish rector, Archpriest Valentin Savchuk, maintains affiliation to the Ukrainian Orthodox Church led by His Beatitude Metropolitan Onuphry. The liturgical life in the parish continues. This Sunday, 21st July 2024, the Divine Liturgy will be celebrated in new premises located near the seized church, adapted for that purpose.

As the Union of Orthodox Journalists reported, in May 2024 the OCU activists announced plans to seize churches in Krasyliv town and Pylypy village. However, at that time, the UOC religious community managed to defend their church.
https://mospat.ru/en/news/91987/

Bobby. wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 11:46am:

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 5:04am: Bobby. wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 5:15pm: Where have all these Russian spies come from? RussiAnVetEraN I'm from Russia. The city of Zelenograd. 8-) (The year 2021) You're a Soviet infiltrator on a Western forum.

What an absurdity!  :)

I am a spy of a non-existent country.

But I am an unusual spy who immediately announced that I am Russian.

I must be a very cunning spy.

Your Australian hospitality is amazing!  :D

freediver wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 11:59am:

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 4:37am: freediver wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 4:28pm: I doubt he is fooling anyone. Putting aside the issue of starting a pointless war, there is also plenty of direct persecution of Christians: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_the_Soviet_Union Throughout the history of the Soviet Union (1917–1991), there were periods when Soviet authorities suppressed and persecuted various forms of Christianity to different extents depending on state interests.[1] Soviet Marxist-Leninist policy consistently advocated the control, suppression, and ultimately, the elimination of religious beliefs, and it actively encouraged the propagation of Marxist-Leninist atheism in the Soviet Union. What does the past of another social system have to do with today's reality? New Orthodox churches are being built and opened in Russia every day. Quote: https://time.com/6969273/russias-war-against-evangelicals/ Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is accompanied with a strategic effort to repress, control, and crush religious groups outside of the Kremlin controlled Moscow Patriarchate, the Russian Orthodox Church. There are over thirty cases of religious clergy killed and kidnapped. 109 known cases of interrogations, forced expulsions, imprisonments, arrests. 600 houses of worship destroyed. And these are just the confirmed numbers, with the real ones in information blackout of the occupied territories will much likely be higher. You probably don't know that a few days ago the Ukrainian Parliament banned the Ukrainian Orthodox Church. And more: REPORT of the Foreign Ministry of the Russian Federation «Illegal actions by the Kiev regime targeting the Ukrainian Orthodox Church (UOC), its clergy and parishioners» 25 July 2023 - 23:06 7. Response by certain international human rights organisations ..... "In addition to this, the UN Human Rights Council published its decision expressing concern with reports about the rights violations faced by UOC believers. In particular, it noted: “The committee is concerned at reports of violence, intimidation and acts of vandalism of places of worship in connection with the process of transitioning churches and religious communities from the Ukrainian Orthodox Church to the newly established Orthodox Church of Ukraine. The Committee is further concerned at the reported inaction of the police in such incidents and the lack of information on investigations conducted by the State party.” ..... https://www.mid.ru/en/foreign_policy/humanitarian_cooperation/1898457/ You know that is a logical fallacy, right?

Please explain what you see as a logical error?

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 4:52pm:

chimera wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 8:31am: From 2014 he has been killing Orthodox in Ukraine. Where do you get this data from?

Mr Lavrov. He says his little green men from Siberia who were Russian troops but don't exist went to Crimea. There were no Russian troops except for those Russian troops. Crimea was not in Ukraine, has no Orthodox, was in Ukraine and was Orthodox (except for little green men). Vodka is now in plentiful supply. No Russians drink vodka.

chimera wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 6:10pm:

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 4:52pm: chimera wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 8:31am: From 2014 he has been killing Orthodox in Ukraine. Where do you get this data from? Mr Lavrov. He says his little green men from Siberia who were Russian troops but don't exist went to Crimea. There were no Russian troops except for those Russian troops. Crimea was not in Ukraine, has no Orthodox, was in Ukraine and was Orthodox (except for little green men). Vodka is now in plentiful supply. No Russians drink vodka.

Does Lavrov talk to you at night like Putin to Bobby?

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 5:39pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 11:59am: RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 4:37am: freediver wrote on Aug 21st, 2024 at 4:28pm: I doubt he is fooling anyone. Putting aside the issue of starting a pointless war, there is also plenty of direct persecution of Christians: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_the_Soviet_Union Throughout the history of the Soviet Union (1917–1991), there were periods when Soviet authorities suppressed and persecuted various forms of Christianity to different extents depending on state interests.[1] Soviet Marxist-Leninist policy consistently advocated the control, suppression, and ultimately, the elimination of religious beliefs, and it actively encouraged the propagation of Marxist-Leninist atheism in the Soviet Union. What does the past of another social system have to do with today's reality? New Orthodox churches are being built and opened in Russia every day. Quote: https://time.com/6969273/russias-war-against-evangelicals/ Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is accompanied with a strategic effort to repress, control, and crush religious groups outside of the Kremlin controlled Moscow Patriarchate, the Russian Orthodox Church. There are over thirty cases of religious clergy killed and kidnapped. 109 known cases of interrogations, forced expulsions, imprisonments, arrests. 600 houses of worship destroyed. And these are just the confirmed numbers, with the real ones in information blackout of the occupied territories will much likely be higher. You probably don't know that a few days ago the Ukrainian Parliament banned the Ukrainian Orthodox Church. And more: REPORT of the Foreign Ministry of the Russian Federation «Illegal actions by the Kiev regime targeting the Ukrainian Orthodox Church (UOC), its clergy and parishioners» 25 July 2023 - 23:06 7. Response by certain international human rights organisations ..... "In addition to this, the UN Human Rights Council published its decision expressing concern with reports about the rights violations faced by UOC believers. In particular, it noted: “The committee is concerned at reports of violence, intimidation and acts of vandalism of places of worship in connection with the process of transitioning churches and religious communities from the Ukrainian Orthodox Church to the newly established Orthodox Church of Ukraine. The Committee is further concerned at the reported inaction of the police in such incidents and the lack of information on investigations conducted by the State party.” ..... https://www.mid.ru/en/foreign_policy/humanitarian_cooperation/1898457/ You know that is a logical fallacy, right? Please explain what you see as a logical error?

You appear to think Ukrainian Christians intimidating each other is relevant to whether Russia is persecuting Christians. It isn't. That is how a 5 year old argues. Or someone educated in a communist regime.

tallowood wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 6:14pm:

Does Lavrov talk to you at night

Yes. His face is there on the screen and his lips move. Russia has no troops anywhere. No Ukrainians have died. Russia is destroying the Ukrainian army. Lavrov is not Russian, he speaks the truth.

chimera wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 6:37pm:

tallowood wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 6:14pm: Does Lavrov talk to you at night Yes. His face is there on the screen and his lips move. Russia has no troops anywhere. No Ukrainians have died. Russia is destroying the Ukrainian army. Lavrov is not Russian, he speaks the truth.

You can go to a psychiatrist together with Bobby, 2 patients in 1 session will save you  money.

Yes, psychiatry may explain a lot about Russia but I wouldn't want to pay for the info.

chimera wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 6:10pm:

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 4:52pm: chimera wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 8:31am: From 2014 he has been killing Orthodox in Ukraine. Where do you get this data from? Mr Lavrov. He says his little green men from Siberia who were Russian troops but don't exist went to Crimea. There were no Russian troops except for those Russian troops. Crimea was not in Ukraine, has no Orthodox, was in Ukraine and was Orthodox (except for little green men). Vodka is now in plentiful supply. No Russians drink vodka.

I still don't understand from your answer where can I see the list of 8,800 murdered Orthodox people?

Where can I look at these thousands of cases with investigations of circumstances where it is indicated who, when and where did these murders take place?

freediver wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 6:21pm:

You appear to think Ukrainian Christians intimidating each other is relevant to whether Russia is persecuting Christians. It isn't. That is how a 5 year old argues. Or someone educated in a communist regime.

You missed a certain nuance that unites these things.

The Ukrainian authorities do not consider the Orthodox Church of Ukraine as their own people. It considers its representatives to be Russian agents.

Therefore, if a certain Orthodox church is destroyed, it may be with the same degree of probability a consequence of the actions of the Ukrainian authorities.

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 9:01pm:

I still don't understand from your answer where can I see the list of 8,800 murdered Orthodox people?

post #50 80% of Ukrainians are Orthodox.
post # 53  Number of civilian casualties in Ukraine during Russia's invasion verified by OHCHR from February 24, 2022 to July 31, 2024.
11,520.
That's 8,800 dead Orthodox, by the order of Putin.
Also about 31,000 Ukrainian troops dead, 24,000 Orthodox.

RussianVeteran says 'Russia is defending Christian values'.

chimera wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 10:00pm:

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 9:01pm: I still don't understand from your answer where can I see the list of 8,800 murdered Orthodox people? post #50 80% of Ukrainians are Orthodox. post # 53  Number of civilian casualties in Ukraine during Russia's invasion verified by OHCHR from February 24, 2022 to July 31, 2024. 11,520. That's 8,800 dead Orthodox, by the order of Putin. Also about 31,000 Ukrainian troops dead, 24,000 Orthodox. RussianVeteran says 'Russia is defending Christian values'.

If 80% of Ukrainians are Orthodox Christians, then why don't they protect their church from the government that banned it?

Why aren't there mass protests by these believers who are being robbed of the most sacred thing they have?

Their church is the Ukrainian one, not the Church of Kremlin. They are defending it and dying. They don't kill the Kremlin clergy of Kyiv. Zelensky the Jew didn't say he was Christian and he didn't invade Orthodox Russia in 2014. But you say Russia is defending Christian values when it invades and kills thousands of Orthodox Christians. 

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22^nd, 2024 at 9:23pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 6:21pm: You appear to think Ukrainian Christians intimidating each other is relevant to whether Russia is persecuting Christians. It isn't. That is how a 5 year old argues. Or someone educated in a communist regime. You missed a certain nuance that unites these things. The Ukrainian authorities do not consider the Orthodox Church of Ukraine as their own people. It considers its representatives to be Russian agents. Therefore, if a certain Orthodox church is destroyed, it may be with the same degree of probability a consequence of the actions of the Ukrainian authorities.

You are still being irrational. A church is not a person. And whether it is considered a person in Ukraine still has nothing to do with whether Russia oppresses Christians. That is how a 5 year old argues. Or someone educated in a communist regime.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_the_Soviet_Union

Throughout the history of the Soviet Union (1917–1991), there were periods when Soviet authorities suppressed and persecuted various forms of Christianity to different extents depending on state interests.[1] Soviet Marxist-Leninist policy consistently advocated the control, suppression, and ultimately, the elimination of religious beliefs, and it actively encouraged the propagation of Marxist-Leninist atheism in the Soviet Union.

https://time.com/6969273/russias-war-against-evangelicals/

Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is accompanied with a strategic effort to repress, control, and crush religious groups outside of the Kremlin controlled Moscow Patriarchate, the Russian Orthodox Church. There are over thirty cases of religious clergy killed and kidnapped. 109 known cases of interrogations, forced expulsions, imprisonments, arrests. 600 houses of worship destroyed. And these are just the confirmed numbers, with the real ones in information blackout of the occupied territories will much likely be higher.

chimera wrote on Aug 24^th, 2024 at 3:02am:

Their church is the Ukrainian one, not the Church of Kremlin. They are defending it and dying. They don't kill the Kremlin clergy of Kyiv. Zelensky the Jew didn't say he was Christian and he didn't invade Orthodox Russia in 2014. But you say Russia is defending Christian values when it invades and kills thousands of Orthodox Christians.

The Ukrainian Orthodox Church was banned by the Ukrainian government. Who is protecting it? Who is dying for it? Where are these 80% percent of believers?

Throughout Zelensky's reign, shelling of civilians in Donetsk and Lugansk from cannons and MLRS continued (this was before Russia's Special Military Operation).

I remember what kind of "Christians" came out of the basements of Azovstal.

https://youtu.be/Zc3kIq31Ka0?si=-A9cv02HFlM_gK-I

freediver wrote on Aug 24^th, 2024 at 12:04pm:

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 9:23pm: freediver wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 6:21pm: You appear to think Ukrainian Christians intimidating each other is relevant to whether Russia is persecuting Christians. It isn't. That is how a 5 year old argues. Or someone educated in a communist regime. You missed a certain nuance that unites these things. The Ukrainian authorities do not consider the Orthodox Church of Ukraine as their own people. It considers its representatives to be Russian agents. Therefore, if a certain Orthodox church is destroyed, it may be with the same degree of probability a consequence of the actions of the Ukrainian authorities. You are still being irrational. A church is not a person. And whether it is considered a person in Ukraine still has nothing to do with whether Russia oppresses Christians. That is how a 5 year old argues. Or someone educated in a communist regime. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_the_Soviet_Union Throughout the history of the Soviet Union (1917–1991), there were periods when Soviet authorities suppressed and persecuted various forms of Christianity to different extents depending on state interests.[1] Soviet Marxist-Leninist policy consistently advocated the control, suppression, and ultimately, the elimination of religious beliefs, and it actively encouraged the propagation of Marxist-Leninist atheism in the Soviet Union. https://time.com/6969273/russias-war-against-evangelicals/ Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is accompanied with a strategic effort to repress, control, and crush religious groups outside of the Kremlin controlled Moscow Patriarchate, the Russian Orthodox Church. There are over thirty cases of religious clergy killed and kidnapped. 109 known cases of interrogations, forced expulsions, imprisonments, arrests. 600 houses of worship destroyed. And these are just the confirmed numbers, with the real ones in information blackout of the occupied territories will much likely be higher.

I'll try to explain it to you again.

It is a fact that the Ukrainian authorities are persecuting the Ukrainian Orthodox Church. A few days ago, the Ukrainian authorities issued a law banning it. This is a fact.

Now I ask you: if we see the destroyed building of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church, how do we understand who destroyed it? Was it destroyed by Ukrainian nationalist battalions or by Russian troops?

And what is your rationality when you point to the events that took place in the USSR decades ago, when the Communist Party of the Soviet Union ruled?

This party has been gone for a long time.

Now the Russian leadership visits Orthodox churches on the days of great church holidays.

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 25^th, 2024 at 9:21pm:

The Ukrainian Orthodox Church was banned by the Ukrainian government. Who is protecting it? Who is dying for it? Where are these 80% percent of believers?

Post by RussiAnVetEraN       Aug 15th, 2024 at 4:44am:
'However, now Ukrainians are taking away churches from this Orthodox Church and transferring them to the newly created (the tomos of Patriarch Bartholomew of Constantinople in 2019) schismatic structure.'
----
10 days is a long time...

Quote:

Now the Russian leadership visits Orthodox churches on the days of great church holidays.

Bible prophesy -

Putin is the anti-Christ who appears in the last days during the End Times.

chimera wrote on Aug 25^th, 2024 at 9:48pm:

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 25th, 2024 at 9:21pm: The Ukrainian Orthodox Church was banned by the Ukrainian government. Who is protecting it? Who is dying for it? Where are these 80% percent of believers? Post by RussiAnVetEraN       Aug 15th, 2024 at 4:44am: 'However, now Ukrainians are taking away churches from this Orthodox Church and transferring them to the newly created (the tomos of Patriarch Bartholomew of Constantinople in 2019) schismatic structure.' ---- 10 days is a long time...

Events are happening faster now than in the past.

And this is enough time to start mass protests.

Bobby. wrote on Aug 25^th, 2024 at 10:11pm:

Quote: Now the Russian leadership visits Orthodox churches on the days of great church holidays. Bible prophesy - Putin is the anti-Christ who appears in the last days during the End Times.

Okay.

Let this be one of the possible interpretations of Biblical prophecies.

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 25^th, 2024 at 11:11pm:

And this is enough time to start mass protests.

Yes 2014 was time for Putin to protest against Ukraine's Orthodox majority who voted to trade with Europe. His artillery joined the protest against democracy. Then the protests were started against the Russian Fascist Church of Kirill of All Nukes.

chimera wrote on Aug 26^th, 2024 at 2:56am:

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 25th, 2024 at 11:11pm: And this is enough time to start mass protests. Yes 2014 was time for Putin to protest against Ukraine's Orthodox majority who voted to trade with Europe. His artillery joined the protest against democracy. Then the protests were started against the Russian Fascist Church of Kirill of All Nukes.

I still don't understand where 80% of the believers of the banned church are? What are they doing? Have they decided to become atheists?

I have an indiscreet question for you, have you read the text of this agreement? Do you think it was manna from heaven for Ukraine?

Opening statement of Prime Minister of Ukraine Mykola Azarov during Government's meeting on January 15, 2014

".....
Today I will focus only on some aspects of the problem.

First of all, it is necessary to resolve the situation about agricultural products. Agricultural production is dynamically developing and, figuratively speaking, "to chip" it we can not.

Ukraine reduces fees from average 9.24% to about 1% (ie, more than in 6 times). Ukrainian agrarian producers will not be able to immediately experience the benefits of reduction of duties in connection with the incompatibility of their products to EU standards on quality and safety. Particularly sensitive areas are the production of meat and meat by-products, milk and dairy products, fruit and vegetable production, food product groups.

That is, the first thing to determine: where to get the resources and support for the rapid modernization of production capacities.

The second, there is asymmetry in the volumes of state support for agriculture between the EU and Ukraine. Subsidies to farmers in the EU are much higher that is about 10 times larger. Thus, the subsidies per 1 hectare for the EU countries are 316 euros per hectare in Poland or 200 euros per hectare in Romania. And on average - more than 300-400 euros.

What does it mean if to compared with that state support that agricultural production in Ukraine has - about 43.6 euros per hectare?

This means that the funds, which actually go to reduce the cost of production of Ukrainian agriculture, have to be increased by about 10 times to Ukrainian products compete with European. This, by the way, is the salary of million people.

Ukrainian producers simply can not compete with cheap products through grants from the European Union. A striking example of this - Bulgaria, which has been recognized as a leader in the production of tomatoes and peppers, and after joining the EU completely lost this industry.

So, we must reach an understanding of how to use additional protective measures and the terms of trade, for example, the use of input prices, that stipulated in the contract as the right of Ukraine. Does it compensate for this gap in competitiveness?

More, even zero rates from the EU, duty-free export of grain, pork, beef, poultry, etc. is possible only within quotas. Given the significant potential of Ukraine in increasing crop production and livestock products, these quotas are actual barrier to export to the EU and a direct constraint to the development of relevant domestic industries.

Reduction of Ukraine export duties on sunflower seeds, raw hides definitely reduce the export of finished goods and increase exports of agricultural products. Domestic processing industry may lose some of the manufacturers and the leading positions on the world market. And it may be completely destroyed. We need protection from such a scenario.

With regard to steel production and manufacture of fabricated metal products. Apart from the fact that the majority of duties between Ukraine and the EU were almost zero as a result of Ukraine's accession to the WTO, free trade area provides a further reduction of duties.

Given the low value-added of Ukrainian exports of steel products, it could lead to further loss of competitiveness.

In addition, steelmakers may face a sharp increase in production costs due to higher raw material costs and environmental activities. Thus, the rate of export duty on scrap of ferrous metals, non-ferrous metals and semi-finished using them, as well as stainless steel will drop from 15% to 0% after the transition period and implementation of the environmental conditions of the agreement will require significant investment.
Simply to say, if we do not foresee conditions for the protection of our industry in a few years it will be advantageous to cut all the metal in Ukraine and sell it for recasting than invest in jobs in Ukraine. This is an unacceptable way for us, as it comes to a key set of our industry, which employs hundreds of thousands of workers in coal and mining industries, energy, transport and so on. SMEs live by incomes of these workers and so on.

Therefore, we must find conditions favorable for Ukraine in implementation of this part of the agreement with the EU.

Machinery engineering. According to statistics, Machinery engineering brought Ukraine about 19% of export earnings in 2013.

But almost all engineering "can go under the knife" of unfavorable terms of trade for literally 4-5 years.
........ "
https://www.kmu.gov.ua/en/news/246976860

.

'I still don't understand where 80% of the believers of the banned church are?'
Yes you do. You wrote:

Post by RussiAnVetEraN       Aug 15th, 2024 at 4:44am:
'However, now Ukrainians are taking away churches from this Orthodox Church and transferring them to the newly created (the tomos of Patriarch Bartholomew of Constantinople in 2019) schismatic structure.'

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 25^th, 2024 at 9:41pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 24th, 2024 at 12:04pm: RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 9:23pm: freediver wrote on Aug 22nd, 2024 at 6:21pm: You appear to think Ukrainian Christians intimidating each other is relevant to whether Russia is persecuting Christians. It isn't. That is how a 5 year old argues. Or someone educated in a communist regime. You missed a certain nuance that unites these things. The Ukrainian authorities do not consider the Orthodox Church of Ukraine as their own people. It considers its representatives to be Russian agents. Therefore, if a certain Orthodox church is destroyed, it may be with the same degree of probability a consequence of the actions of the Ukrainian authorities. You are still being irrational. A church is not a person. And whether it is considered a person in Ukraine still has nothing to do with whether Russia oppresses Christians. That is how a 5 year old argues. Or someone educated in a communist regime. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_the_Soviet_Union Throughout the history of the Soviet Union (1917–1991), there were periods when Soviet authorities suppressed and persecuted various forms of Christianity to different extents depending on state interests.[1] Soviet Marxist-Leninist policy consistently advocated the control, suppression, and ultimately, the elimination of religious beliefs, and it actively encouraged the propagation of Marxist-Leninist atheism in the Soviet Union. https://time.com/6969273/russias-war-against-evangelicals/ Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is accompanied with a strategic effort to repress, control, and crush religious groups outside of the Kremlin controlled Moscow Patriarchate, the Russian Orthodox Church. There are over thirty cases of religious clergy killed and kidnapped. 109 known cases of interrogations, forced expulsions, imprisonments, arrests. 600 houses of worship destroyed. And these are just the confirmed numbers, with the real ones in information blackout of the occupied territories will much likely be higher. I'll try to explain it to you again. It is a fact that the Ukrainian authorities are persecuting the Ukrainian Orthodox Church. A few days ago, the Ukrainian authorities issued a law banning it. This is a fact. Now I ask you: if we see the destroyed building of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church, how do we understand who destroyed it? Was it destroyed by Ukrainian nationalist battalions or by Russian troops? And what is your rationality when you point to the events that took place in the USSR decades ago, when the Communist Party of the Soviet Union ruled? This party has been gone for a long time. Now the Russian leadership visits Orthodox churches on the days of great church holidays.

And during Russia's invasion of Ukraine. The point is that Russia's hostility to religion has been consistent. Your childish efforts to change the topic to Ukraine do not change those facts in any way.

So the simplified black and white picture of the conflict on global scale is traditionalists (men are  men and women are not) vs WOKE queers (72 genders).

Russians are in traditionalists team while russophobes are WOKE queers team

https://iili.io/dXmvNjt.png

chimera wrote on Aug 26^th, 2024 at 9:01am:

'I still don't understand where 80% of the believers of the banned church are?' Yes you do. You wrote: Post by RussiAnVetEraN       Aug 15th, 2024 at 4:44am: 'However, now Ukrainians are taking away churches from this Orthodox Church and transferring them to the newly created (the tomos of Patriarch Bartholomew of Constantinople in 2019) schismatic structure.'

I wrote this referring to the Ukrainian government and not the believers.

But even if these believers actually move from one church to another so easily, it tells us something about their faith.

freediver wrote on Aug 26^th, 2024 at 9:49am:

And during Russia's invasion of Ukraine. The point is that Russia's hostility to religion has been consistent. Your childish efforts to change the topic to Ukraine do not change those facts in any way.

The USSR had a reason to persecute religions, it was Marxism, now Russia has no such reason and religions are not persecuted except for destructive sects.


Meeting with representatives of religious associations

By tradition, the President met with representatives of religious confessions on National Unity Day. This year the meeting was held via videoconference.

November 4, 2020 - 16:10 - The Kremlin, Moscow

The meeting was attended by Patriarch Kirill of Moscow and All Russia, Head of the Buddhist Traditional Sangha of Russia Pandito Khambo Lama Damba Ayusheev, Chairman of the North Caucasus Muslim Coordinating Centre Ismail Berdiyev, Archbishop of the Evangelical Lutheran Church of Russia Dietrich Brauer, Chairman of the Council of Muftis of Russia, Chairman of Religious Board of Muslims of Russia Ravil Gaynutdin, First Deputy Chairman of the Euro-Asian Division of the General Conference of the Church of Christians of Seventh Day Adventists Oleg Goncharov, Head of the Russian and Novo-Nakhichevan Diocese of the Armenian Apostolic Church Archbishop Ezras, Metropolitan Kornily of Moscow and All Russia of the Old-Rite Russian Orthodox Church, Chief Rabbi of Russia, Chairman of the Centralised Religious Organisation of the Orthodox Judaism Federation of Jewish Communities of Russia Berel Lazar, Chief Bishop of Russia's Union of Evangelical Faith Christians (Pentecostals) Sergei Ryakhovsky, and Chairman of the Central Spiritual Directorate of Muslims of Russia Talgat Tadzhuddin.

Russian President Vladimir Putin:

Good afternoon, friends,

I am pleased to welcome you to our meeting; greetings to all representatives of traditional religions of Russia!

And first of all, I would like to congratulate you and all citizens of Russia, our big, multinational country, on National Unity Day!
............
The traditions of kind, respectful attitude between people of different ethnicities and religious beliefs have been left to us by our ancestors. But being proud of this living spiritual heritage, experiencing the creation of a unique civilization is not enough. Of course, we have the right to be proud and we should be. But this is not enough. These values need to be protected, strengthened and nurtured. This is our common duty, for this generation and future generations.

It is important to understand that the world is going through deep changes. Traditional values face serious challenges. Unfortunately, many difficult and sensitive issues in interethnic and interreligious relations become the subject of speculation and unscrupulous geopolitical games. Extremists and radicals grab onto this and incite mutual hatred and animosity.

I would like to repeat that interethnic and interreligious peace is the keystone for our huge country. It needs constant attention from the authorities, from society, and from the media. The work here needs to be delicate, meticulous and comprehensive. And this is how we are trying to act – in the most delicate and constructive manner.
.........
The spiritual leaders of Russia have a special role to harmonise interethnic and interreligious relations and prevent extremism and terrorism. People listen to your opinions, your words, and when you voice your position of solidarity, your clear commitment to the values of peace, kindness and mercy – this is extremely important.

I would like to point out the great potential of religious organisations in community service.
........
Friends, once again, I would like to congratulate you on National Unity Day. It is highly symbolic that this holiday was constituted on the initiative of Russia’s Interreligious Council. This is further evidence that Russia’s historical path as a great power has been defined by peaceful, fruitful cooperation between different peoples and religions.

I would like to wish you success on the path of a spiritual service.
http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/64336

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 27^th, 2024 at 12:55am:

But even if these believers actually move from one church to another so easily, it tells us something about their faith.

Constantinople is the original Church for Kievan Rus. Russia's Church supports the invasion and killing of those Ukrainian Orthodox for not being Russian nationalists, which is your faith. And as your Putin says '..Russia’s Interreligious Council. This is further evidence that Russia’s historical path as a great power..'.

He supports nationalist Russian Muslims and shoots Ukrainian Christians. You call that 'Christian values'.

chimera wrote on Aug 27^th, 2024 at 3:47am:

Constantinople is the original Church for Kievan Rus. Russia's Church supports the invasion and killing of those Ukrainian Orthodox for not being Russian nationalists, which is your faith. And as your Putin says '..Russia’s Interreligious Council. This is further evidence that Russia’s historical path as a great power..'. He supports nationalist Russian Muslims and shoots Ukrainian Christians. You call that 'Christian values'.

Here is the opinion of the Russian Orthodox Church on this.

Statement by the Holy Synod of the Russian Orthodox Church concerning the bill adopted by the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine with the aim of liquidating the Ukrainian Orthodox Church

On 20th August 2024, the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine passed in the second reading the Bill “On the Protection of the Constitutional Order in the Sphere of Activity of Religious Organizations” that allows, through judicial proceedings, to ban activities of any religious community in the territory of Ukraine if it is “affiliated” with a religious organization in Russia. For the court to give such a ruling, conclusions of a “religious expertise” will suffice, which amid the ongoing witch hunt may and will be falsified.

Those who initiated and endorsed this bill in Ukraine – highest-ranking public officials, the Verkhovna Rada deputies, radical politicians and public figures, representatives of schismatic organisations and the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church – do not conceal that the law directly targets the Ukrainian Orthodox Church, that it is aimed at liquidating it and all its communities or at forcibly transferring them to other religious organizations. Hundreds of monasteries, thousands of communities and millions of Orthodox Christians in Ukraine will find themselves outside the legal framework and lose their property and places of worship.

During 2014-2023, the Holy Synod of the Russian Orthodox Church pointed out on many occasions that the Ukrainian Orthodox Church came under pressure which was undoubtedly part of the government anti-religious policy. The adoption of the law today indicates powerlessness of the regime that throughout its political existence has been systematically, step by step trying to weaken, split and destroy the Ukrainian Orthodox Church.
...........

For many years, the policy of persecution against the Church has been carried out against a backdrop of the slanderous anti-church campaign in the Ukrainian mass media aimed at defaming the canonical Orthodoxy, as well as instigating and justifying mass seizures of churches called “voluntary transfers.” The seizures are orchestrated by the schism proponents and radical nationalists with support from the local authorities, security services and law enforcement bodies, and usually entail violence, including mass beatings of the clergy and the faithful. Attempts are being made, and some have succeeded, to seize the largest monasteries of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church and forcibly evict their coenobites.

The Ukrainian security services continue to put outright pressure on the Ukrainian Orthodox Church, its episcopate and clergy. Apart from threats and blackmail, the pressure has manifested itself in dozens of trumped-up criminal cases and unlawful verdicts on political grounds. Many archpastors and pastors of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church have been arrested, taken into custody or received unjust sentences.
...........

The adopted bill is incompatible with the rule of law principles; it is a political declaration aimed at legalizing the destruction of the religious community of the majority of the population. The law lays down criteria enabling to determine a group of people connected by their affiliation with the Ukrainian Orthodox Church and carry out targeted political repressions against them.

It embitters us to note the negative role of Patriarch Bartholomew of Constantinople and the hierarchs who hold the same views. Through their unilateral and hasty actions inconsistent with the spirit of the sacred canons, they have only exacerbated the church schism in Ukraine, having failed to heal it. The leaders of the schismatics recognized by the Phanar have been particularly rampant in demanding the adoption of the law that practically bans the Ukrainian Orthodox Church. And Patriarch Bartholomew, who earlier publicly expressed approval for the criminal prosecution against and arrests of the UOC hierarchs and clergymen, now, like high priests Annas and Caiaphas, has openly supported the government’s actions aimed at crucifying and destroying the canonical Church in Ukraine. Therefore, the Patriarch of Constantinople is personally responsible for orchestrating the persecutions against the faithful of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church.
.........

We call upon the plenitude of the world Orthodoxy to pray ever more fervently for the Ukrainian Orthodox Church which is abiding in afflictions on account of the word of God and the testimony of Jesus (Rev 1:9).

We appeal to international human rights organizations to give an immediate and unbiased response to the flagrant oppression of the faithful in Ukraine.
https://mospat.ru/en/news/92123/

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 27^th, 2024 at 4:51am:

mass beatings of the clergy and the faithful.. the government’s actions aimed at crucifying and destroying the canonical Church in Ukraine.

Zelensky the Jew didn't claim to be Christian when beating and crucifying the faithful. You say Russia is Christian for killing thousands of Orthodox Ukrainians.

'In 2021, the top partner countries from which Ukraine Imports Wood include Poland, Germany, United States, Belarus and Russian Federation.'  It's sad that Russian timber is used to make the cross on which Russians are crucified in the streets of Ukraine.

chimera wrote on Aug 27^th, 2024 at 9:18am:

Zelensky the Jew didn't claim to be Christian when beating and crucifying the faithful. You say Russia is Christian for killing thousands of Orthodox Ukrainians.

Zelensky baptized his children in the Orthodox Church.

Neither the Russian authorities nor the Russian Orthodox Church have ever called for the killing of Orthodox people.

(And the Holy Synod of the Russian Orthodox Church called on everyone to pray for the Ukrainian Orthodox Church.)

But all those who stand up to the Russian army with weapons in their hands will be considered as accomplices of the enemy at least.

Yes of course. Ukrainians in Ukraine who think their country is Ukraine are enemy. Christians kill that sort of people.  Resisting Putin in his Ukraine is an offence against Christianity.

chimera wrote on Aug 27^th, 2024 at 7:42pm:

Yes of course. Ukrainians in Ukraine who think their country is Ukraine are enemy. Christians kill that sort of people.  Resisting Putin in his Ukraine is an offence against Christianity.

Some Ukrainians may consider the governments that emerged as a result of the coup on the Maidan as authorities alien to them who do not care about the state interests of Ukraine.

Putin the Ukrainian thinks that. He doesn't do democracy.

chimera wrote on Aug 27^th, 2024 at 8:06pm:

Putin the Ukrainian thinks that. He doesn't do democracy.

Let's see what Putin thought after the overthrow of Ukrainian President Yanukovych.


Vladimir Putin answered journalists’ questions on the situation in Ukraine

March 4, 2014 - 15:40

....
Vladimir Putin:

First of all, my assessment of what happened in Kiev and in Ukraine in general. There can only be one assessment: this was an anti-constitutional takeover, an armed seizure of power. Does anyone question this? Nobody does. There is a question here that neither I, nor my colleagues, with whom I have been discussing the situation in Ukraine a great deal over these past days, as you know – none of us can answer. The question is why was this done?

I would like to draw your attention to the fact that President Yanukovych, through the mediation of the Foreign Ministers of three European countries – Poland, Germany and France ... signed an agreement with the opposition on February 21. I would like to stress that under that agreement ... Mr Yanukovych actually handed over power. He agreed to all the opposition’s demands: he agreed to early parliamentary elections, to early presidential elections, and to return to the 2004 Constitution, as demanded by the opposition. He gave a positive response to our request, the request of western countries and, first of all, of the opposition not to use force. He did not issue a single illegal order to shoot at the poor demonstrators. Moreover, he issued orders to withdraw all police forces from the capital, and they complied. He went to Kharkov to attend an event, and as soon as he left, instead of releasing the occupied administrative buildings, they immediately occupied the President’s residence and the Government building – all that instead of acting on the agreement.

I ask myself, what was the purpose of all this? I want to understand why this was done. He had in fact given up his power already, and as I believe, as I told him, he had no chance of being re-elected. Everybody agrees on this, everyone I have been speaking to on the telephone these past few days. What was the purpose of all those illegal, unconstitutional actions, why did they have to create this chaos in the country? Armed and masked militants are still roaming the streets of Kiev. This is a question to which there is no answer.
..............

Are the current authorities legitimate? The Parliament is partially, but all the others are not. The current Acting President is definitely not legitimate. There is only one legitimate President, from a legal standpoint. Clearly, he has no power. However, as I have already said, and will repeat: Yanukovych is the only undoubtedly legitimate President.

There are three ways of removing a President under Ukrainian law: one is his death, the other is when he personally steps down, and the third is impeachment. The latter is a well-deliberated constitutional  norm. It has to involve the Constitutional Court, the Supreme Court and the Rada. This is a complicated and lengthy procedure. It was not carried out. Therefore, from a legal perspective this is an undisputed fact.

Moreover, I think this may be why they disbanded the Constitutional Court, which runs counter to all legal norms of both Ukraine and Europe. They not only disbanded the Constitutional Court in an illegitimate fashion, but they also – just think about it – instructed the Prosecutor General’s Office to launch criminal proceedings against members of the Constitutional Court. What is that all about? Is this what they call free justice? How can you instruct anyone to start criminal proceedings? If a crime, a criminal offence, has been committed, the law enforcement agencies see this and react. But instructing them to file criminal charges is nonsense, it’s monkey business.
.....

After all, look at how it all began, what triggered these events. The formal reason was that he did not sign the European Union Association Agreement. Today, this seems like nonsense; it is ridiculous to even talk about. But I want to point out that he did not refuse to sign the association agreement. He said: “We have carefully analysed it, and its content does not correspond with our national interests. We cannot sharply increase energy prices for our people, because our people are already in a rather difficult position. We cannot do this, and that, and that. We cannot immediately break our economic ties with Russia, because our cooperation is very extensive.”

I have already presented these figures: out of approximately 14 billion [dollars] in export, approximately 5 billion represents second and third technological processing level products exported to Russia. In other words, just about all engineering products are exported to Russia; the West is not buying any Ukrainian products. And to take all this and break it apart, to introduce European technical standards in the Ukrainian economy ... This means the next day, our relations and cooperation ties will be broken, enterprises will come to a standstill and unemployment will increase. And what did Yanukovych say? He said, “I cannot do this so suddenly, let’s discuss this further.” He did not refuse to sign it, he asked for a chance to discuss this document some more, and then all this craziness began.
........
http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/20366

Ukraine's parliament removed Yanukovich without Putin's consent.  He published his decision to cancel Ukraine, remove the crosses with crucified Russians and bring Finland into NATO.

tallowood wrote on Aug 26^th, 2024 at 12:24pm:

So the simplified black and white picture of the conflict on global scale is traditionalists (men are  men and women are not) vs WOKE queers (72 genders). Russians are in traditionalists team while russophobes are WOKE queers team https://iili.io/dXmvNjt.png

If you go far enough back I suppose they are traditionalists. Russia is the rape and pillage team. Starting pointless wars that kill thousands just to distract the Russians from Putin's incompetence, and filling online forums with idiotic claims to be "Christian", "traditionalist" and whatever other straw they can clutch at. No sane person wants them to win. Trying to win over religious people after spending decades literally trying to wipe out religion was one of their stupider ideas.

freediver wrote on Aug 27^th, 2024 at 9:47pm:

tallowood wrote on Aug 26th, 2024 at 12:24pm: So the simplified black and white picture of the conflict on global scale is traditionalists (men are  men and women are not) vs WOKE queers (72 genders). Russians are in traditionalists team while russophobes are WOKE queers team https://iili.io/dXmvNjt.png If you go far enough back I suppose they are traditionalists. Russia is the rape and pillage team. Starting pointless wars that kill thousands just to distract the Russians from Putin's incompetence, and filling online forums with idiotic claims to be "Christian", "traditionalist" and whatever other straw they can clutch at. No sane person wants them to win. Trying to win over religious people after spending decades literally trying to wipe out religion was one of their stupider ideas.

You suggest that Russia is like so called "Western" countries but there is major difference. This days "Western" ideology is WOKE with multiple genders while Russians are homophobic. That is why russophobs are queers.
However not all westerners are russophobic and here is another example for you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEfpM-fObRc

Dooms day clock seconds to midnight
Ajax.  Aug 25th, 2024   
The incursion in to Kursk has revealed that not only was there Ukrainian soldiers but also Polish, American, French and English soldiers in sheep's clothing. Russia has taken this to mean that NATO attacked Kursk.
--------------
Americans are in the Russian army meaning NATO attacked Ukraine. 
Three Ukraine-based Russian paramilitary groups say they have crossed into Russia and are now fighting government troops there.
The Freedom of Russia Legion (FRL) and Siberian Battalion (SB) posted videos purportedly showing their fighters in Russia's Belgorod and Kursk regions. This means that Russia attacked Russia.

As Lavrov is checking his nukes then Putin is obligated to nuke NATO to defend Ukraine and nuke Russia to defend Russia. This will win the Great Homosexual War and destroy Christians, straights and testicles.
'During the first 50–60 days after moderate levels of irradiation (1.5–2 Gy dose), the sperm count is reduced up to 50%, which may even lead to azoospermia after moderate-to-high dose irradiation'. [ azoospermia : no sperm]

tallowood wrote on Aug 28^th, 2024 at 6:59am:

freediver wrote on Aug 27th, 2024 at 9:47pm: tallowood wrote on Aug 26th, 2024 at 12:24pm: So the simplified black and white picture of the conflict on global scale is traditionalists (men are  men and women are not) vs WOKE queers (72 genders). Russians are in traditionalists team while russophobes are WOKE queers team https://iili.io/dXmvNjt.png If you go far enough back I suppose they are traditionalists. Russia is the rape and pillage team. Starting pointless wars that kill thousands just to distract the Russians from Putin's incompetence, and filling online forums with idiotic claims to be "Christian", "traditionalist" and whatever other straw they can clutch at. No sane person wants them to win. Trying to win over religious people after spending decades literally trying to wipe out religion was one of their stupider ideas. You suggest that Russia is like so called "Western" countries

Where did you get that from?

chimera wrote on Aug 28^th, 2024 at 8:59am:

Dooms day clock seconds to midnight Ajax.  Aug 25th, 2024    The incursion in to Kursk has revealed that not only was there Ukrainian soldiers but also Polish, American, French and English soldiers in sheep's clothing. Russia has taken this to mean that NATO attacked Kursk. -------------- Americans are in the Russian army meaning NATO attacked Ukraine.  Three Ukraine-based Russian paramilitary groups say they have crossed into Russia and are now fighting government troops there. The Freedom of Russia Legion (FRL) and Siberian Battalion (SB) posted videos purportedly showing their fighters in Russia's Belgorod and Kursk regions. This means that Russia attacked Russia. As Lavrov is checking his nukes then Putin is obligated to nuke NATO to defend Ukraine and nuke Russia to defend Russia. This will win the Great Homosexual War and destroy Christians, straights and testicles. 'During the first 50–60 days after moderate levels of irradiation (1.5–2 Gy dose), the sperm count is reduced up to 50%, which may even lead to azoospermia after moderate-to-high dose irradiation'. [ azoospermia : no sperm]

Lavrov knows that NATO has nukes too.      ::)

Bobby. wrote on Aug 29^th, 2024 at 6:24am:

chimera wrote on Aug 28th, 2024 at 8:59am: Three Ukraine-based Russian paramilitary groups say they have crossed into Russia and are now fighting government troops there. The Freedom of Russia Legion (FRL) and Siberian Battalion (SB) posted videos purportedly showing their fighters in Russia's Belgorod and Kursk regions. This means that Russia attacked Russia. Lavrov knows that NATO has nukes too.

NATO probably won't do anything when Russia nukes Russia.

Result of US civil war 2 will depend on who have more nukes republicans or democrats.

https://i.ibb.co/bWMcmjm/nuke-nyork.png
https://i.ibb.co/ZYp61xL/nuke-nyork-chinese.png

This is part of the Russian mental dysfunction.

Nuclear civil war is part of American establishment mentality.

tallowood wrote on Aug 29^th, 2024 at 11:54am:

Nuclear civil war is part of American establishment mentality.

you can say that again
Nuclear civil war is part of American establishment mentality.

Persecution of our church brings shame on Ukraine

Tuesday August 27 2024, 9.00pm BST, The Times

Volodymyr Zelensky is considered a hero by many in the West for his skilful and active leadership of Ukraine during the war with the Russian Federation. But he is not a hero to the millions of members of my church, the Ukrainian Orthodox Church (UOC), spiritual home of the Ukrainian people for 1,000 years.
......

https://www.thetimes.com/comment/columnists/article/persecution-church-brings-shame-ukraine-9x5c7s9qf

'The Moskva River was incorporated as part of Rostov-Suzdal into the Kievan Rus in the 11th century. By CE 1100, a minor settlement had appeared on the mouth of the Neglinnaya River a 7.5 km underground river in the central part of Moscow. The first reference to Moscow dates from 1147 as a meeting place of Sviatoslav Olgovich and Yuri Dolgorukiy. At the time it was a minor town on the western border of Vladimir-Suzdal Principality.'

The Russian Church of Moscow is not the origin of the Kyiv Church.  Kirill bombs Kyiv.

chimera wrote on Aug 30^th, 2024 at 4:53am:

'The Moskva River was incorporated as part of Rostov-Suzdal into the Kievan Rus in the 11th century. By CE 1100, a minor settlement had appeared on the mouth of the Neglinnaya River a 7.5 km underground river in the central part of Moscow. The first reference to Moscow dates from 1147 as a meeting place of Sviatoslav Olgovich and Yuri Dolgorukiy. At the time it was a minor town on the western border of Vladimir-Suzdal Principality.' The Russian Church of Moscow is not the origin of the Kyiv Church.  Kirill bombs Kyiv.

Thank you.

I know the history of the Russian capital.

So for what purpose are the authorities who came to power as a result of the coup destroying their ancient Orthodox Church?

Moscow is not the spiritual home for 1000 years. Metropolitan Peter moved the residence to Moscow in 1325. In 2014 the Patriarch father declared a Special Church Invasion to kill Ukrainians.  Kyiv should pray for Moscow priests to deliver holy explosions and Russians to destroy Kyiv.  As Kirill has promised 'You crucify us, we crucify you'.

chimera wrote on Aug 30^th, 2024 at 8:44am:

Moscow is not the spiritual home for 1000 years. Metropolitan Peter moved the residence to Moscow in 1325. In 2014 the Patriarch father declared a Special Church Invasion to kill Ukrainians.  Kyiv should pray for Moscow priests to deliver holy explosions and Russians to destroy Kyiv.  As Kirill has promised 'You crucify us, we crucify you'.

If there were still large close-knit communities of believers in the West, then the persecution of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church by the puppet Kiev government could be considered as a new crusade against the Schismatics.

Do you want to re-write that? It seems mixed up.

Bobby. wrote on Aug 21^st, 2024 at 11:00am:

Quote: Executive Order on providing humanitarian support to individuals sharing traditional Russian spiritual and moral values Does that include 1 billion Africans and a few 100 million Muslims who would like to move to Russia?

Now I can answer your question.

Here is a list of states:

Australia,
Austria,
Albania,
Andorra,
the Bahamas,
Belgium,
Bulgaria,
the United Kingdom (including the crown possessions of the British Crown and British Overseas Territories),
Germany,
Greece,
Denmark,
Ireland,
Iceland,
Spain,
Italy,
Canada,
Cyprus,
Latvia,
Lithuania,
Liechtenstein,
Luxembourg,
Malta,
Micronesia,
Monaco,
Netherlands,
New Zealand,
Norway,
Poland,
Portugal,
Republic of Korea,
Romania,
San Marino,
North Macedonia,
Singapore,
Slovenia,
United States of America,
Taiwan (China),
Ukraine,
Finland,
France,
Croatia,
Montenegro,
Czech Republic,
Switzerland,
Sweden,
Estonia,
Japan.

http://publication.pravo.gov.ru/document/0001202409200036?index=1

Best solution for RuZZia is to nuke it off the map

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Aug 20^th, 2024 at 11:48pm:

individuals sharing traditional Russian spiritual and moral values

Africa seems to share Russian morality:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index#:~:text=Denmark%2C%20Finland%2C%20New%20Zealand%2C,as%20Somalia%20(scoring%2011).

Marla wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2024 at 7:50am:

Best solution for RuZZia is to nuke it off the map

I wish you all your dreams come true.

chimera wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2024 at 8:31am:

Africa seems to share Russian morality:

Of course, they share our values.

I recently gave you a list of countries that, in Russia's opinion, do not share these values.

African countries share the corruption of Putinland?
You gave a list in Russian which won't translate and can't be copied to translation.

https://i.imgflip.com/94amwq.jpg

chimera wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2024 at 4:20pm:

African countries share the corruption of Putinland?

Yes.



Quote:

You gave a list in Russian which won't translate and can't be copied to translation.

I have given the link to the official decree of the Russian government. And I have translated for you the list of countries that it contains into English.

Are you saying that African countries and Russia have low morals?
The list is in the context of African people who share Russia's values. The list is non-African countries. What are you trying to say?

chimera wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2024 at 5:13pm:

Are you saying that African countries and Russia have low morals? The list is in the context of African people who share Russia's values. The list is non-African countries. What are you trying to say?

You've probably already forgotten what this topic is about.

I quote you a fragment of the first post of the topic:
"The list of foreign countries implementing a policy that imposes destructive neoliberal ideological attitudes that contradict traditional Russian spiritual and moral values ​​is approved by the Russian Government upon submission by the Foreign Ministry."

To date, we know which countries are included in this list.

These are all European countries except Belarus, Serbia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Hungary and Slovakia.

The countries of North America, specifically the USA and Canada.

Australia, New Zealand and Micronesia.

And four Asian countries, specifically Japan, the Republic of Korea, Taiwan and Singapore.

Therefore, the answer to Bobby's question whether we will have millions of Africans and Muslims because of this presidential Executive Order sounds like NO.

Your post #110 is in Russian and you gave no explanation. You said it answers the question about Africans but it says nothing.
You claim Europeans don't have Russian values.
So how does the list mean that millions of Africans won't enter Russia?
But you agree that Russia is corrupt. Your values are of low morals?  So what exactly do you want to say?

chimera wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2024 at 7:00pm:

Your post #110 is in Russian and you gave no explanation. You said it answers the question about Africans but it says nothing. You claim Europeans don't have Russian values. So how does the list mean that millions of Africans won't enter Russia? But you agree that Russia is corrupt. Your values are of low morals?  So what exactly do you want to say?

In my opinion, everything should be clear to those who carefully read the topic.



"Under the Executive Order, the right to apply for a temporary residence permit without taking into account the quota approved by the Russian Government and without submitting a document confirming proficiency in the Russian language and knowledge of the history and fundamentals of Russian legislation is granted to foreign citizens and stateless persons who have expressed a desire to move to the Russian Federation from the countries of their citizenship or permanent residence due to their rejection of the policy implemented by these states that imposes destructive neoliberal ideological attitudes that contradict traditional Russian spiritual and moral values, as provided for in the Fundamentals of State Policy for the Preservation and Strengthening of Traditional Russian Spiritual and Moral Values."
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1724161728/0#0



"Russian Prime Minister Mikhail Mishustin approved the list of countries imposing destructive attitudes that contradict Russian spiritual and moral values. The corresponding document has been published.

The list includes 47 countries and territories that "implement policies that impose destructive neoliberal ideological attitudes that contradict traditional Russian spiritual and moral values."

It includes the United States of America, the United Kingdom, Germany, France, Japan and other states.

The EU countries that are not included in the list include Slovakia and Hungary, and the NATO countries that are not added to the list include Turkey.

According to a TASS source familiar with the preparation of the document, the list was approved in accordance with the presidential decree on providing humanitarian support to foreigners who share traditional spiritual and moral values.

The order comes into force on the day of its official publication.
.......
Currently, this list includes 46 countries and territories: all EU member states, as well as Ukraine, Montenegro, Switzerland, Albania, Andorra, Iceland, Liechtenstein, the United Kingdom, Monaco, Norway, San Marino, North Macedonia, Japan, South Korea, Australia, Micronesia, New Zealand, Singapore, and Taiwan."
https://tass.com/politics/1845935



About Russian spiritual and moral values - https://senegal.mid.ru/en/press-centre/news/on_approving_the_fundamentals_of_state_policy_to_preserve_and_strengthen_traditional_russian_spiritu/

Post #112 shows corruption in Russia.
In # 117 you agree that Africans share Russian corruption.
So for the third time, what are you saying about values?

chimera wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2024 at 8:30pm:

Post #112 shows corruption in Russia. In # 117 you agree that Africans share Russian corruption. So for the third time, what are you saying about values?

I'm sorry that you don't understand my jokes.

Got it. Africans are corrupt like Russians and won't be going to Russia. Is very good joke, da.

RussiAnVetEraN wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2024 at 8:38pm:

chimera wrote on Sep 22nd, 2024 at 8:30pm: Post #112 shows corruption in Russia. In # 117 you agree that Africans share Russian corruption. So for the third time, what are you saying about values? I'm sorry that you don't understand my jokes.

He is a dill  ;)

I guess Putin is worried about ruzzian demographics.

600,000 dead/maimed ruzzian citizens have blown a huge hole in the demographics.

One of the vilest acts by the ruzzians was stealing thousands of Ukrainian babies and giving them to ruzzian couples. Fucking disgusting act.

Jovial Monk wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2024 at 9:39am:

I guess Putin is worried about ruzzian demographics. 600,000 dead/maimed ruzzian citizens have blown a huge hole in the demographics. One of the vilest acts by the ruzzians was stealing thousands of Ukrainian babies and giving them to ruzzian couples. Fucking disgusting act.

Poofter, Putin doesn't worry about your wet dream fantasies  ;D

Looks like I was right.

Looks like you are wet and need underwear change  ::)

No, ruzzia is facing a demographic black hole. That is why the bastards stole all those Ukrainian babies. For that alone they deserve the defeat heading for them. Now 600K dead ruzzians makes the demographic hole a chasm.

Jesus Christ, losing 600K soldiers fighting the invasion by the nazis is one thing, worse would have happened if the nazis had won! But losing 600K soldiers winning a sliver of land at the cost of the economy ruined etc etc—that is clearly not sensible!

Now ruzzian infrastructure is going to be systematically flattened—and you lot started that in Ukraine so can’t cry foul now!

Your  black hole hurts because of your poof perversion.

You are a gutless wonder, apt in someone trying to justify the cowardly ruzzians.

Jovial Monk wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2024 at 9:39am:

I guess Putin is worried about ruzzian demographics. 600,000 dead/maimed ruzzian citizens have blown a huge hole in the demographics. One of the vilest acts by the ruzzians was stealing thousands of Ukrainian babies and giving them to ruzzian couples. Fucking disgusting act.

You're right. The Russian authorities are concerned about the problem of demography. And so they reject the LGBT agenda and childfree idea.

I wonder where the West, committed to this agenda, will get children from?

650,000 dead young ruzzians have blown a huge hole in ruzzian demographics, one the stolen Ukrainian babies won’t help.

poofta who can not spell word Russians got butthurt by the question about having children because all he can produce is stinking poo  ;D

You two can’t argue worth a damn.

The war has cost 651,000 ruzzian deaths, the bankruptcy of the ruzzian economy, a brain drain endangering ruzzia’s future recovery and growth etc and for what? Most of the ruzzian Black Sea fleet is at the bottom of the sea.

Definitely not worth a sliver of Ukraine. ruzzia is now irrelevant to the world, its energy sales now replaced by other sources. It will lose Crimea.

https://iili.io/dLU31pe.md.png

You are pathetic and cowardly.

You are poof who can not spell words Russia and or Russian.

Hey, who started using half a swastica, Z, on their military vehicles?

Puffta who can not spell word Russia and  does not know difference between a tank and a M548 a armored tracked cargo carrier also does not know difference between letter Z and Ukrainian nazi swastika   :o

https://theecologist.org/sites/default/files/styles/inline_l/public/NG_media/382680.jpg

ruzzia is an invader and aggressor. ruzzia stole thousands of Ukrainian children to plug a demographic hole then made that a chasm by a stupid war of aggression that caused 653,000 ruzzian young men’s deaths.

Now ruzzia is facing manpower shortages and a shortage of tanks as well.

All this while Ukraine is destroying ruzzian oil rigs, ammunition dumps and air bases etc.

ruzzians are cowards and cretins.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUh3CByHpig&ab_channel=SkyNewsAustralia