Why is Australian politics grappling with the right to protest?

New Daily
Oct 14, 2024


Attempts to stifle protests of particular causes could damage Australian's right to protest, according to experts.   :(



A push by New South Wales Premier Chris Minns to restrict protests if they prove too expensive or disruptive is another move in a long list of challenges to Australia’s right to protests, experts say.

Before pro-Palestinian protests in Sydney this month, Minns said police should be allowed to reject public assembly applications if the event will be too expensive for the state.


“It’s my view that police should be able to be in a position to deny a request for a march due to stretched police resourcing,” Minns told 2GB radio.

“Ultimately, this is taxpayer funds. It can only be distributed in a certain way.”

NSW originally applied to the state’s supreme court to block the protest from taking place, just one day before the anniversary of the October 7 attack on Israel, before reaching an agreement with organisers at the last minute.

Unions, including the police association, have pushed back against Minns’ assertion, with the head of Unions NSW stating that “democracy should not be monetised” by making organisers pay for police presence.


Unions and the police association have rebuked NSW Premier Chris Minns.

Do Australians have the right to protest?
Luke McNamara, a professor of law and justice at the University of New South Wales, said over the past decade various jurisdictions in Australia have created new offences, higher penalties and increased police power to restrict the right to protest.

“Increasingly, pressure is being brought to bear on Attorney Generals, Premiers and Chief Ministers of states and territories to do something about disruptive behaviour,” he said.



“If you are committed in a democracy to the right to protest, you have to accept that peaceful assembly, for it to be in any way effective or meaningful, has to have the capacity to grab attention, get people to listen to the message, whether they agree or not, and that inevitably involves a level of disruption.”

A report from the Human Rights Law Centre, examining bills across Australia over the past two decades that have affected the right to protest, found that Australians’ right to peacefully protest “is being steadily eroded”.

NSW, South Australia, Tasmania, Victoria and Queensland have all legislated anti-protest laws within the past five years, imposing penalties on people engaging in peaceful protest.

Civil disobedience
These laws have targeted a range of different interest groups, ranging from environmentalists to pro-Palestinian advocates, but have all served to stifle the right to protest.

McNamara said the issue is that knee-jerk laws, such as having protest organisers pay for the police presence required, can be “deeply anti-democratic”.

“I’m troubled when there’s talk of large-scale change of parameters to a particular right, like the right to protest, based on discomfort with the particular content of a protest movement,” he said.

“The mere fact that Chris Minns has decided that those particular protesters and their cause is a problem is not an adequate justification for changing the parameters or the strength of the right to protest.”

Protest, as an act of civil disobedience, doesn’t necessarily require legality.

Most of the world’s most effective protests weren’t endorsed by the state or government they targeted.

McNamara said that Australia and liberal democracies can be hypocritical on civil disobedience.

“We celebrate those historical moments like when the Springboks were the subject of protests against South African apartheid and applaud the Martin Luther King-led civil rights protesters,” he said.

“We need some historical perceptive and to recognise that at the moment there is going to be a level of discomfort, disruption and unhappiness, but accept the right to protest.”

People should have a right to protest.   :(

Australians have never had the right to protest in any way except the false claims of such. Across my whole lifetime the police have acted aggressively, violently and without respect to people's rights during peaceful protests. Very often the police will attack protesters and then claim that there was violence. They are correct but all the violence is typically exerted by the police. The action of police in protests is always supported in the courts. So people not only find themselves assaulted by the police but prosecuted and fined or imprisoned as well.

Australians have no right or ability to peacefully protest at all and never have. A protest is little more than an opportunity for the police to forcefully exercise their crowd control methods. There are exceptions and periods where it is done better but the risk of protest is huge.

The appropriate term is 'PEACEFUL protest' - to which I say YES - and the question of the day is whether or not protests in support of the world's most vile terrorists are in any way peaceful - or if they are instigating hate against specific groups = hate crimes in disguise.

We have not yet come to the point of declaring Hate Thought a crime - though the Lee decision over The Deuce comes mighty close to that principle (commonly called bias or prejudice or discrimination) in that it declared that an unproven event took place purely on assumption.

How easy is it to step from there to saying that 'belonging to a specified group in society' is also an offence in the public mind?  To 'the Jews are the enemy of the people'?  Does this not ring bells for you, Quasimodos?  We see several here ranting anti-Judaism on a daily basis, and exercising freediver's freedom of thought which permits them free speech.... of course nobody really expects Village Idiot #1 to go out and attack Jews - he'd be hammered, methinks .. all gutless clowns hide behind hyperbole on the internet.... and there are others here.

At what point does permitting vastly one-sided and aggressive protest become permitting the incitement of hatred and violence against members of OUR community, such as took place against Jewish students without reason?  The same people who did and/or allowed that were prepared to hang Trump for saying:- 'We're gonna go down to that Capitol and make our voices heard' or similar.... and yet are not prepared to apply the same standard to any 'politically acceptable' jihad from any group who think they feel aggrieved over issues far away and/or of the making of their own group.

I say any protest that holds a whiff of potential for violence should be licenced, and the principals named on paper, and having signed an agreement to accept responsibility for any outcomes and for the behaviour of their crowds.  Any acts of direct violence stemming from protests must be treated as hate crimes and all those responsible for promoting or actually performing must be punished severely.  Students parked outside universities in tent cities who assault other students must be dismissed from uni and arrested and charged and ordered to stay away.

At some point common sense and common decency and respect have to prevail.... and be enforced.

J'accuse!!

Dnarever wrote on Oct 15^th, 2024 at 6:53am:

Australians have never had the right to protest in any way except the false claims of such. Across my whole lifetime the police have acted aggressively, violently and without respect to people's rights during peaceful protests. Very often the police will attack protesters and then claim that there was violence. They are correct but all the violence is typically exerted by the police. The action of police in protests is always supported in the courts. So people not only find themselves assaulted by the police but prosecuted and fined or imprisoned as well. Australians have no right or ability to peacefully protest at all and never have. A protest is little more than an opportunity for the police to forcefully exercise their crowd control methods. There are exceptions and periods where it is done better but the risk of protest is huge.

That's correct - we live in a police state.

They can spray you in the eyes with pepper spray - a form of dangerous torture - and get a way with it.

They can beat you to a pulp with a baton and get away with that too.

whiteknight wrote on Oct 15^th, 2024 at 6:36am:

People should have a right to protest.   :(

Not if they're chanting terrorist slogans and wearing terrorist headbands, waving the flags of terrorist organisations like Hamas or Hezbollah or waving photos of terrorist leaders.

Not if they're harassing, racially or religiously vilifying other Australians because they're Jewish & calling for the destruction of a democratic country that is our ally.

Not if they are any of the Palestinians that have been granted temporary visas into Australia. 

A protest itself may at times be the subject of a counter-protest.
If protests are allowed so should be counter-protests?

People seem unable to apply the principles to all religious, all ethicities, all sexual preferences, basically all differences between individuals.  That includes trans people, Muslims, gay people, Jews, etc.  They like to reserve their hatreds for whomever they dislike and they like to express them violently.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...   ::) ::)

Yes out of that lot, a significant number of trans and Muslim people do like to express their difference in violence.  Gays not so much and Australian Jews hardly at all... they strive to be civilised ....

tallowood wrote on Oct 15^th, 2024 at 11:32am:

A protest itself may at times be the subject of a counter-protest. If protests are allowed so should be counter-protests?

Of course - as long as they are separate and peaceful - if not separate but equal...

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Oct 15^th, 2024 at 12:24pm:

Yes out of that lot, a significant number of trans and Muslim people do like to express their difference in violence.  Gays not so much and Australian Jews hardly at all... they strive to be civilised ....

There is no evidence of that...at all.  Graps you're reserving your hatreds just to yourself.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...   ::) ::)

whiteknight wrote on Oct 15^th, 2024 at 6:36am:

People should have a right to protest.   :(

we want the doctor who does the bulk billing

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Oct 15^th, 2024 at 12:24pm:

Yes out of that lot, a significant number of trans and Muslim people do like to express their difference in violence.  Gays not so much and Australian Jews hardly at all... they strive to be civilised ....

My top picks would be junkies and Nazis.

tickleandrose wrote on Oct 15^th, 2024 at 2:05pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 12:24pm: Yes out of that lot, a significant number of trans and Muslim people do like to express their difference in violence.  Gays not so much and Australian Jews hardly at all... they strive to be civilised .... My top picks would be junkies and Nazis.

Not surprised you'd say that - the only people acting like Nazis are the Palestinian protesters.

tickleandrose wrote on Oct 15^th, 2024 at 2:05pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 12:24pm: Yes out of that lot, a significant number of trans and Muslim people do like to express their difference in violence.  Gays not so much and Australian Jews hardly at all... they strive to be civilised .... My top picks would be junkies and Nazis.

Them too - I can't include everyone.... a broad scale and semi-civilised or theoretically civilised society has many dead end or blind canyons... it is the movement of the mass of the ocean of humanity that creates the weather... the rest are just local disturbances.

aquascoot wrote on Oct 15^th, 2024 at 1:42pm:

whiteknight wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 6:36am: People should have a right to protest.   :( we want the doctor who does the bulk billing

Some need the psychiatrist who does bulk billing.

Gnads wrote on Oct 15^th, 2024 at 5:28pm:

tickleandrose wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 2:05pm: Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 12:24pm: Yes out of that lot, a significant number of trans and Muslim people do like to express their difference in violence.  Gays not so much and Australian Jews hardly at all... they strive to be civilised .... My top picks would be junkies and Nazis. Not surprised you'd say that - the only people acting like Nazis are the Palestinian protesters.

And the Islamophobes, and the homophobes and the anti-trans people, just like you.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  ::) ::)

https://imageshack.com/a/img641/9394/yawnr.gif

I like the posts that say everyone should have the right except........

It rather gives the game away.

It's a bit like Trump saying that he only wants to be authoritarian for one day.

Does he really think people forgot his authoritarian first term ?

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 15^th, 2024 at 7:09pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 5:28pm: tickleandrose wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 2:05pm: Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 12:24pm: Yes out of that lot, a significant number of trans and Muslim people do like to express their difference in violence.  Gays not so much and Australian Jews hardly at all... they strive to be civilised .... My top picks would be junkies and Nazis. Not surprised you'd say that - the only people acting like Nazis are the Palestinian protesters. And the Islamophobes, and the homophobes and the anti-trans people, just like you.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  ::) ::)

Old made up words wanker Bwyan

---

Dnarever wrote on Oct 15^th, 2024 at 9:00pm:

I like the posts that say everyone should have the right except........ It rather gives the game away. It's a bit like Trump saying that he only wants to be authoritarian for one day. Does he really think people forgot his authoritarian first term ?

OK which ones were they?

And FFS forget about Trump.

You're getting as bad as Peccar.

We live in a police state.

They can spray you in the eyes with pepper spray - a form of dangerous torture - and get a way with it.

They can beat you to a pulp with a baton and get away with that too.

Gnads wrote on Oct 16^th, 2024 at 11:47am:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 7:09pm: Gnads wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 5:28pm: tickleandrose wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 2:05pm: Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 12:24pm: Yes out of that lot, a significant number of trans and Muslim people do like to express their difference in violence.  Gays not so much and Australian Jews hardly at all... they strive to be civilised .... My top picks would be junkies and Nazis. Not surprised you'd say that - the only people acting like Nazis are the Palestinian protesters. And the Islamophobes, and the homophobes and the anti-trans people, just like you.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  ::) ::) Old made up words wanker Bwyan

Truthful words where you are concerned.  You hate, you hate anybody not like you.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  ::) ::)

Bobby. wrote on Oct 16^th, 2024 at 11:49am:

We live in a police state. They can spray you in the eyes with pepper spray - a form of dangerous torture - and get a way with it. They can beat you to a pulp with a baton and get away with that too.

Bobby, don't you have a public loo to haunt?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  ::) ::)

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 16^th, 2024 at 3:44pm:

Gnads wrote on Oct 16th, 2024 at 11:47am: Brian Ross wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 7:09pm: Gnads wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 5:28pm: tickleandrose wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 2:05pm: Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Oct 15th, 2024 at 12:24pm: Yes out of that lot, a significant number of trans and Muslim people do like to express their difference in violence.  Gays not so much and Australian Jews hardly at all... they strive to be civilised .... My top picks would be junkies and Nazis. Not surprised you'd say that - the only people acting like Nazis are the Palestinian protesters. And the Islamophobes, and the homophobes and the anti-trans people, just like you.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  ::) ::) Old made up words wanker Bwyan Truthful words where you are concerned.  You hate, you hate anybody not like you.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...  ::) ::)

bwian

i hate yawning.

its rude

In my experience we have the right to protest.

However if the people you are protesting against can gain your name you will suffer long term trouble.

Everything you say or buy goes on your permanent record.

People have the right to protest. They should not object violently, if there is a counterprotest to their cause. That includes the police insisting that they move on from an illegal march or violent chanting.

I always thought that us not having a bill of rights in our constitution like the US do was a good thing I am not so sure anymore. it seems that in most respects the ultimate result is that we have no rights.Our trespass laws are a joke, Our identify laws are very loose, police can almost walk up to anyone with the slimmest excuse to require ID. While I don't think most Australian police abuse their authority they easily could and at least some do.

Dnarever wrote on Oct 16^th, 2024 at 6:46pm:

I always thought that us not having a bill of rights in our constitution like the US do was a good thing I am not so sure anymore. it seems that in most respects the ultimate result is that we have no rights.Our trespass laws are a joke, Our identify laws are very loose, police can almost walk up to anyone with the slimmest excuse to require ID. While I don't think most Australian police abuse their authority they easily could and at least some do.

If you have ever read the Criminal Code of Australia, you will find that Australians have more rights and freedoms than the average American. In Australia, it is very equitable to live however you like and within reason, as long as there are no laws that forbid you doing what you want to do.

In the United States of America, you are given a bill of rights. But the state by state variations of laws are so profound, that it is not surprising why each state has a problem with bordering states of their's. Can you imagine why the crime rates over in the United States are so high in their cities? I know why. And it has nothing to do with how much rights Americans have. It has to do with how much "freedoms" are available.

Upon the freedom index and human development scales, Australia ranks much higher than the USA. Imagine what will happen to the USA when the demographics are changed, due to the low-birth rates of American-born people catches up with them. They better start buying gold bullion inside the next 10 years.

Trouble with not having a codified Bill of Rights, Rocky, is that nothing is guaranteed - meaning that every single time an individual is forced to resolve an issue with government, for best example, there is a need to obtain an 'interpretation' - and guess who does the 'interpreting'..... the government body in question.

Let us look at the Queenslund Land Grabs - someone comes along - maybe some Chinaman whose ancestor dropped by and stayed for a while in the 14th century or something rooting the local sheilas - and lays claim to his Ancestral Lands...... some dork steeped in New Age Sinophilia (which does not mean sticking it up their nose) and under the direct command of an Appointed Old Mate With The Right Ideas And Obedient To The Approved Narrative Who Takes Orders Directly From The Government makes the decision, after consultation with said government, that Wong Wey (the applicant) MUST be given that swathe of land because the descendants of his 14th Century ancestor remained in continued occupation of it by merely wandering around it ... unbroken even though diluted by generations of others from local and also imports over more generations...... and in no way these days even remotely resembling Wong Wey or any other Chinaman....

With me so far?

Harry Bloggs - descendant of Joe Bloggs - whose family have held a significant portion of the new Wong Weyland for generations - complains and is told:- "No Way With Wong Wey For You!"  So he takes it up the chain of command, where a Senor Executioner determines/interprets that Harry has no right to claim based on his purchased possession of that land and his claim is interpreted to be lower down the scale than Wong Wey's ancestral claim.

So Harry flings it before a 'court' at huge expense ... the 'court' ruminates (but secretly, being illegally under the orders of said government and being influenced by 'authority' while siding with the Old Mates' Club, has already sided with Ancestral Wong Wey and The Department Senor) - reserves its opinion to make it look good - and then three months down the track does a Lee Decision and finds that Wong Wey, on opinion only, was the right way all along, and Harry has no claim.... and must piss orf forthwith taking what he can get into his ute, to make way for Wong Wey.

Harry,  desperately seeking justice, appeals to a higher 'court' - and the way they drink there is no higher court in the land - as his last desperate bid - again at huge expense while Wong Wey has to pay nothing and hasn't done so to date since The Department is handling it on his behalf - only to receive the same result - made even stronger by the 'fact' that both the Senor Executioner and the lower 'court' found against Harry.... so out he goes, broke, starving and homeless after generations of lifetimes of toil while Wong Wey The Indolent Billionaire Passing Chinaman Descended From Someone Who Stayed Here And Wandered About Six Hundred Or More Years Ago And Impregnated Many Native Women takes over his land, home and everything else Harry can't carry away with him.....

And that Poppets - is what they call Justice In Australia these days, along with Interpretation and Dictatorial Rule By Public Servant = Neo-Feudalism, Racism, Apartheid, Segregation, Assaults on Rights And Liberties and Equalities, Falsified Jurisprudence, Breakdown Of The Fundamentals Of Rule Of Law And Of Law And Order, and on and on and on.....

That's it in a nutsack ... tune in next week for The Fable Of The Prime Minister's Response To Wong Wey (not to be confused with Wang Wey, dig?)...