From the news-story I previously posted:
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,21361640-1702,00.html

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What a hypocrite!  

So couldn't I say that the Pakistani earthquakes, the wars in the Middle East, the famines in Africa, the Tsunami in Indonesia, were all as a result of the fact that they were all MUSLIM and that God/Allah was pissed off with Muslims?

What a joke these people really are!

Any religion will keep you in the dark ages.
Theres nothing more that fundamentalist religious nuts are scared of than technology which with each passing day is coming closer to proving the fact that there is no god.

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What gives you that idea mantra? 

Because Iemma the multiculturalism bigot disagrees with him?

For me... ANYWHERE BUT the Middle East or Africa!!!

ANYWHERE.

Did you all hear?

El-hilaly and keysar trad are going to start an islamic party this year.

The moron reckons he's going to get seats at every level!

"they consider paying income tax contrary to Sharia law."

i think that's enough to encourage everyone to convert to islam since u could then push for all income tax to be abolished. i pay too much tax.

but it makes me wonder, if income tax is an illegal concept according to sharia law, then how do islamic government's operate?

they have to pay some tax, i highly doubt the tax office is that unorganised to the point these people aren't paying anything.

by the way, why would ur children submit tax returns at the age of 13 when they weren't working? i thought u only submit a tax return when u are earning an income.

Aloof - both my children have had part time jobs from the age of 15 until they finished their schooling.  Tax returns have always been lodged.

A couple of months ago (even though my son doesn't live here) the taxation department sent letters saying that unless they declared their incomes from year....s to year...s they would be subject to a heavy penalty.

For both of them the request dated back to the years both of them were 13.  I have no idea why this happened.  After phoning the tax department they told me  these requests were computer generated, but regardless of this - they both had to sign declarations or would be subject to a penalty.

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Another 'benefit' spawning from Islam. Ah... the pleasures of 'diversity.'  

Lets not forget the dvd thats been circulated by the leader of the ''global islamic youth'' movement based in liverpool- MY HOME REGION!

"We are facing an enemy that uses children as human bombs, mothers as suicide bombers, and men driven by the glory of death .... With the spread of radical Islamic fundamentalism throughout the world, it is important for the people of the West to know and understand what to expect and what to do about it."

I think Trump..there are a l;ot of pple including me, who dont fully appreciate exactly what Islam is..Its a word we hear a lot, but what is the actual defintion of Islam?

I think for those who already are in your corner its abunadantly clear..is Islam a religion?,  or race of pple..or what.?

For the discussion to pick up more posters who better understand the topic, it might be useful to clarify this point.


If Im really dense and you couldnt b bothered, thats fine..I understand

ex-member DonaldTrump wrote on Mar 26^th, 2007 at 2:53pm:

My apologies for my remark, I was actually on topic and trying to make a point, and you didn't answer my question either which would have kept us a lot more on topic. Now I would like to believe that you are above cheap shots... unfortunately this slipped out:
Quote:

Exactly when have I said anything along these lines? Our arguments have always been about cultural differences inherent in the religion of Islam? I do not believe you are racist, I think maybe AN is but we have settled our differences and that is irrelevant. I think you are a cultural bigot... simple. I do not even believe in the existence of 'biological races'...

Cheap shot indeed.

So can you answer my original question: "does any of it look like its about to become Australian law?? "

Sprintcyclist wrote on Mar 26^th, 2007 at 4:21pm:

Why do you imply the two mutually exclusive? I would have thought they are one in the same?

donald - uhuh, I agree basically with that.
VERY hard to ... disperse people who are fanatical extremists.
Only have to look at the laws under muslims, to see the .. stranglehold it can put on people.
70 lashes for drinking or listening to music under sharia law. 4 men to testify against another man in a rape case. 2 years jail for carrying a bible.


In the hope of being called a "fundamental christian" again  , there is no other belief that has anywhere near similar "rules."


It is the only belief that defines itself as being incompatible with anyone who is not of that belief.

There is no "do not judge others", or "helping a samaritan woman at a well",  "dining with prostitutes', "enlisting tax collectors"" or  "turning the other cheek", being against religion and for spirituality.

the koran is convert to muslim or be beheaded. Sometimes lose your feet and hands too !!
It is kill all the jews and the christians.
That is all stated in the koran.


allah means submission.

"Al Shawany has pleaded not guilty to two counts of having sexual intercourse without consent between September 1 and 27, 2002."

yeah, i heard about this earlier today, apparently this guy raped this woman in her apartment on the 1st September and then did it again in her apartment on the 27th September. but here is the weird part, on the 2nd occassion there was no evidence of the guy breaking into her apartment.

now, call me a skeptic, but if a woman was raped, would she let the guy into her apartment 3 weeks later so that he would do it again?

i reckon it's more a case of a relationship gone sour, so this woman is using the allegation of rape.

Since when are rapists supposed to  make sense?

So now rape victims are supposed to make sense? Haven't you seen Law and Order?

Muslim women are trained for life to do as they are told. If they disobey they are stoned to death. Plus, there are plenty of ways to gain entry to someone's house against their will without leaving evidence. The lack of evidence is meaningless.

The lack of evidence for break and enter is meaningless.

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So this guy knows the attacker, but isn't naming him? And they're ONLY giving him 13 months???

They could have easily said if he didn't name the attacker, they would give him 10 years... but no... they decided to be 'politically correct' about it so not to 'upset' the large Sydney Islamic community... oh diddums.


Man... did anyone see that parasite smirking about it on tv tonight? That's up there with one of the most sickening images I've seen all year. No wonder these basterds are so hated in Sydney.

This mirrors what's happening all over Europe. Coincidence? Or is there a pattern emerging here?

ex-member DonaldTrump wrote on Apr 12^th, 2007 at 11:58pm:


The guy claims he was high on crystal meth at the time and can't remember the incident, very convenient i know, but unless he confesses to who did it the police can't charge him with the attack. Also, the judge can't increase his sentence, since they cannot prove he really knows who the attacker was (unless they have the ability to read his mind).

The police could only charge him with being an accessory since they could prove he was the getaway driver.

And i don't think this is a case of being politically correct, just another case of the judicial system failing again. If u cast ur memory back to a couple of months ago, the Australian rioter involved in the Cronulla riots got 11 months, so this sentence is on par. I reckon both sentences were light, and both the Australian and Lebanese rioter should have got longer prison sentences.

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I think assisting in attempted murder and assault are slightly different things, JJJ.

In fact, the Australian who was punished for assault was given 11 months.

Whereas this Muslim was given 9 months for assisted murder. As well as breaking the law by covering up for the attacker (And yes, I am aware that he claimed he was high on ice so he couldn't remember). Oh... and let's not forget drug-use then.

So... to summarise...

Assault= 11 months

This is DEFINITELY a politically correct statement and a victory for Islam and multiculturalism in Australia.

skeptic wrote on Apr 17^th, 2007 at 5:09pm:


Assault is not a form of attempted murder. To be convicted of murder, it must be proved you formed an INTENT to kill. Attempted murder must have elements of intent and (usually) physicalilty. Absence of physicality is conspiracy to murder.

Aggravated assault / GBH is quite different to murder. There is no intent to kill, only maim. If a person dies as a result of their injuries, it would be manslaughter.

So in this case, without capturing the murderer, or determining motive, the police would be unable to determine the intention of the attacker. Therefore they would have to rule out murder. Effectively, the accomplice has been charged with accessory to aggravated assault (i.e. assisted evasion, not assisting the crime). They should receive a lesser sentence than someone actually carried out an assault. 9 months is less than 11 months, so it seems the sentence is fair.

Regardless of the law, it sounds like from what DT says, the perpetrator is a maniac, and should be locked up indefinitely. I would imagine the coppers are watching him right now, just waiting for him to make a mistake. Morons like this always do.

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i can say the same thing about you since u are so adament that this guy knows who the attacker is.

but do u know that covering up a crime or concealing evidence from the police is also a crime? so considering that he wasn't charged with those crimes indicates that the police didn't have any evidence that he knows who the attacker is.

remember to be charged with something, the police need evidence, otherwise ur just wasting the courts time.  

Quote:


my point is u don't need a weapon or specialist fighting training to kill someone, it is possible for an amateur to beat someone to death using his fists.

and just because he didn't cause serious damage to the victim doesn't make it any less of an "attempt". put it this way, using ur logic, then one can argue that the Lebs committed assault since they didn't kill the guy they stabbed.

ex-member DonaldTrump wrote on Apr 18^th, 2007 at 8:29pm:


actually, based on what the court was saying they can only prove that he was the getaway driver and that was the crime he was charged with.

u say he covering up for the attacker, well prove it? he claims he was high on drugs and can't remember the incident, do u have evidence that his lying and really knows who did it? and don't bother coming back and saying "well proof he really doesn't know the attacker", since the onus is on the court to prove it, not on him.

like i said before, u need evidence, otherwise ur just wasting the courts time.  

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If it involves a death of a person, does the choice of weapon really matter? No, u need to look at the intention of the attacker, i.e. did he intent to kill or just cause bodily harm.

and in this case, the Leb guy wasn't the attacker anyway, he was just the driver.

He has. he can say he is a muslim who follows the koran correctly.
Check with hilali, they are in complete agreeance.

If I believed in evil, then Binnie would be no.1 on my list.

AusNat - he ain't dead. Death is to good for the likes of him...

Islamic council stripped of housing control

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,22688983-5006784,00.html

A POWERFUL Islamic organisation has been stripped of its community housing after being caught placing friends in state-owned properties intended for refugees.

An independent audit commissioned by the NSW Housing Department found the NSW Islamic Council, which manages 10 government-owned units in Sydney's southwest, had mismanaged the properties and breached its leasing agreement.

The inquiry into the NSW Islamic Council was sparked in August after The Australian revealed the body's vice-president, Ali Roude, let a two-bedroom flat in Belmore to Muslim community radio broadcaster Abraham Zoabi, who did not qualify for public housing.

They are for refugees sprint, regardless of religion. From the article:

...the NSW Islamic Council, which manages 10 government-owned units

The Housing Department owns and manages public housing.

It also delegates the management of 13,000 community houses to non-government and not-for-profit organisations such as the Islamic Council.

I hoped you would notice. They were only given control over 10 units, out of 13000 homes.

I am not sure whether you are asking why we are giving free housing at all, or why Islamics specifically. Obviously the housing commission should not be discriminating against any religion.

I'm not sure about that. Plenty of Christian organisations also manage government funds for needy people. I think in this case it's more about choice. Where practical, the government gives people the option of going through a number of different organisations. This makes sense to me. I can imagine that a refugee would feel far more comfortable working with a group with a similar ethnic or religious background than a facelss bureaucrat. They are in a far better position to help the refugees ease into Australian society because they ahve far more knowledge of their situation.

Perth Muslim school raided and boss charged  Print EXCLUSIVE: Paul Lampathakis and Nicole Cox

December 08, 2007 05:00pm
A MUSLIM school in Kenwick has been raided by police and shut down by WA Education Minister Mark McGowan. The school's head faces a stealing charge.

Mr McGowan said he had taken the extraordinary step of closing Muslim Ladies' College in Kenwick because of allegations, including fraud and the use of unregistered teachers who were focusing mainly on religion, rather than the WA curriculum.

The school's acting director, Zubair Sayed, appeared in East Perth Magistrates Court on Saturday charged with stealing.

The court was told the charge related to an alleged theft offence -- of $355,934 -- in April, when Mr Sayed, of Sarah Close, Canning Vale, was a company director of Muslim Links Australia Ltd.

It is alleged the school was overclaiming for state and federal government funds for students. Police prosecutor Sgt Scott McCormick told the court that detectives had discovered the money had been sent to Pakistan.

"This is a matter which is of extreme seriousness, whereby Mr Sayed obtained public money from the commonwealth by deceit,'' Sgt McCormick said. "The state wishes to put on the record that this is a very serious charge.''

The court was told that Mr Sayed wrote a Commonwealth Bank cheque for money from the Federal Government that was meant for the Muslim Ladies' College to educate students.

At the time, Mr Sayed's brother was principal of the college.

Magistrate Vicki Stewart granted Mr Sayed bail, with conditions he surrender his passport, not be within 1km of international sea or air ports, report to Cannington police station each Wednesday and reside at his home address.

He was released on $100,000 bail and a $100,000 surety to reappear in Perth Magistrates Court on January 2 next year.

On Friday, Mr McGowan told The Sunday Times: "I want to make it clear that this decision (to close the school) has not been made because this is a Muslim school.

"This decision has been made because this is a school that is not educating students properly.

"An investigation into the operations of the college by the Department of Educational Services began in December 2006 -- following complaints about the conduct of the principal-administrator, staffing of the college and the educational program.''

Key areas investigated included whether teachers were registered, the appropriateness of qualifications of teachers, inadequate educational leadership and standard of education, and the sufficiency of the school's resources.

Mr McGowan said other concerns were about the college's governance structure, the condition of buildings, and facilities and enrolment, and attendance procedures.

He said it was found that teachers were inexperienced in teaching and understanding the curriculum framework, and students weren't being taught all required subjects.

"The college has employed a number of unregistered teachers and many with limited authority to teach,'' he said. ``Teachers are not spending 50 per cent of the school day on literacy and numeracy, as required.

"Instead (they) spend a large amount of time on religious studies. This is clearly unacceptable and seriously damaging to the student's academic well-being.

"The school is not being properly led because the director of the college (Anwar Sayed) is in Afghanistan and has been for most of the year.''

Mr McGowan wrote to the school's governing body to notify them of his decision, which took effect from Friday.

He said enrolments had declined in the past year, from about 90 students at the beginning of 2007 to about 50 or 60 students currently.



http://www.news.com.au/perthnow/story/0,21598,22892651-948,00.html

http://news.smh.com.au/fears-over-another-cronullastyle-riot/20071223-1io9.html

There are fears a Cronulla-style riot may be brewing as tensions grow over plans to build an Islamic school in south-west Sydney.

Police are believed to be investigating a series of mobile phone text messages circulating Sydney, purportedly inciting violence.

"We have come together to call for calm after becoming aware of text messages being sent around targeting young Australian Muslims," Independent Centre of Research Australia Youth Centre president Fadi Abdul-Rahman told The Sunday Telegraph.

Dr Millikan launched an attack on Christian Democrats leader Fred Nile, whose comments in the past week may be seen as having added fuel to the fire.

Tensions escalated at Camden on Wednesday night at a public meeting to discuss the proposed 1,200 student Islamic school.

Iran war?

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I find the comment about the catholic school very hard to believe. If it isn't a racial thing, why even bring up the number of muslims?

School opponent denies being anti-Muslim

http://news.smh.com.au/school-opponent-denies-being-antimuslim/20080108-1krc.html

The leader of a residents group which opposes plans for an Islamic school on Sydney's southwestern fringe says the issue is not one of religious intolerance.

Spokesman Emil Sremchevich said hundreds of Camden residents had attended heated public gatherings because they felt their democratic rights were not being observed.

"We're a community of 30,000 people and the majority so far has expressed a negative sentiment towards this proposal.

"Therefore, we seek a referendum on this issue and for council to give us polling rights to say 'yay or nay,'" Mr Sremchevich told the Nine Network.

"Camden residents need to be given the rights to chose what type of development they want in their area."

Mr Sremchevich said census data showed there were fewer than 200 muslims living in Camden and the area had two public high schools which were half full.

The community would be equally concerned about plans to place a Catholic school on the proposed rural site, he said.

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Govt rejects call for Islamic courts

http://news.smh.com.au/govt-rejects-call-for-islamic-courts/20080208-1r0s.html

The federal government has ruled out the introduction of Islamic courts in Australia, following debate triggered by the global head of the Anglican Church.

Archbishop of Canterbury Dr Rowan Williams said Muslims should to be able to resolve marital and financial disputes under Islamic courts, rather than the mainstream judicial system.

Dr Williams said in a radio interview in Britain that allowing Islamic Sharia law to operate in some circumstances could help improve social cohesion.

A similar proposal was put forward by Australian Muslim leaders to Howard government minister Peter McGauran in April 2005, but was rejected.

Australia's new attorney-general Robert McClelland also ruled out the introduction of Sharia law in Australia.

Yasser Soliman, who sits on the Victorian Multicultural Commission and is president of the Victorian Islamic Family and Childcare Agency, said there could be a role for Islamic courts, but Sharia law had to be clearly defined.

"It needs to be clarified and put down clearly on paper how it would run because everyone walking around has a different understanding of what Sharia means," Mr Soliman said.

He said, for example, that Shi'ite and Sunni Muslims would interpret Sharia law differently.

"It would have to be accepted by the wider community, as well as the Muslim community, because there has been quite a lot of injustice happening in recent times under the name of Sharia," he said.

Mr Soliman said Sharia law was not written in stone but extracted and deduced from teachings in the Koran and what people agreed with amongst themselves.

"The idea is worth exploring but it is not worth adopting the first suggestion by one group which may be pushing for it - you have got to consult quite widely and it has to be optional for individuals," Mr Soliman said.

"I can see some potential applications in matters of family disputes, inheritance law and so on - that would be a win/win for the Muslim community and the wider community."

Melbourne and Sydney have Jewish courts, or Beth Din, which rule on divorce, conversions and adoptions.

Bishop Robert Forsyth, spokesman for the Sydney Anglican diocese, said the move would lead to the "ghettoisation" of the law in Australia.

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Terror group urged to kill 1,000: court

http://news.smh.com.au/terror-group-urged-to-kill-1000-court/20080213-1rvk.html

The leader of a Melbourne-based terrorist group told his members they should kill 1,000 non-believers to try to force the withdrawal of Australian troops from Iraq, a court has heard.

Among targets discussed to inflict maximum casualties were railway stations or football grounds, the Victorian Supreme Court was told on Wednesday.

In its opening address in Australia's biggest terrorist trial, the prosecution said the group regarded Australia as a country at war and that indiscriminate murder of innocent citizens was justified by the teachings of Islam.

On trial are Abdul Nacer Benbrika, 47, Aimen Joud, 23, Shane Kent, 31, Hany Taha, 23, Ezzit Raad, 26, Abdullah Merhi, 22, Bassam Raad, 26, Shoue Hammoud, 28, Majed Raad, 23, and Amer Haddara, 28.

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Documents glorified Sept 11: court told

http://news.smh.com.au/documents-glorified-sept-11-court-told/20080214-1s87.html

Documents seized from some of the 12 Melbourne men on trial on terrorism charges glorified the September 11 attacks on the United States, a court has been told.

Crown prosecutor Richard Maidment told the Victorian Supreme Court material seized during ASIO raids on the homes of the men in 2005 included videos of Osama bin Laden and bomb making manuals.

:/ I always thought Islam was a type of ham...

Classic Liberal wrote on Mar 4^th, 2008 at 10:50am:


Is lamb? Is good?

from crikey:

Ned O'Sama: the resonance of transgenerational anxiety
Jeff Sparrow writes:

Stop me if any of this sounds familiar.

A small group of bearded young men commit an outrageous multiple murder. The youths belong to an immigrant community that perceives itself under siege from the police; they practice a minority religion regarded with suspicion by much of the population. In self-justification, they talk about the persecution inflicted on their co-religionists overseas; eventually, they commit themselves to the creation of a homeland here in Australia.

In the midst of a full-blown panic, the Victorian parliament passes draconian laws drastically curtailing civil liberties, and the police launch indiscriminate raids on ethnic minorities. The bearded men make a suicidal final stand; most of them are killed, without a chance to surrender, by a special police squad, and the leader is taken into custody and executed after a dubious trial.

Ned Kelly has been a Rorschach test for so many generations that, with the news that his bones may (or may not) have been located at Pentridge, it seems appropriate to remix his story for the Age of Terror.

Kelly, of course, identified as Irish and Catholic rather than, say, Arab and Muslim but the relationship of those identities to the mainstream was not so dissimilar. Rather than an inner city posse, Ned belonged to the "Greta Mob", a gang of flash youths who stole horses rather than cars and signalled their identity by wearing their hat straps under their noses in a nineteenth century equivalent of the reversed baseball cap.

His outlawry might have been sparked by clashes between police and his family but he also saw himself as fighting for something much bigger. Ian Jones, the pre-eminent Kelly historian, claims that the gang planned, after the Glenrowan confrontation, to declare a Republic of North-Eastern Victoria. Not quite the Caliphate but not so very different, either.

"It will pay the government," Kelly explained in his Jerilderie Letter, "to give those people who are suffering innocence justice and liberty if not I will be compelled to show some colonial stratagem which will open the eyes of not only the Victorian Police and inhabitants but also the whole British army."

It’s the kind of message that these days features on Al Jazeera.

The government response sounds equally familiar. New laws allowed the Kellys to be shot on sight, and gave the police the power raid houses without warrants and prosecute anyone withholding information. In January 1879, some twenty men went to jail for "having given information to an outlaw and his accomplices, contrary to the fifth section of the Outlawry Act" and for "withholding information relative to the Kelly gang".

As for Kelly’s trial, it might not have been a military commission but nor was it full and fair: Kelly’s barrister lacked experience; key witnesses were never presented; Redmond Barry was clearly biased.

Of course, historical parallels are never identical. Kelly was neither Osama bin Laden nor Che Guevara nor Chopper Read; his story needs, ultimately, to be understood on its own terms. But the comparison still bears thinking about.

In the wake of 9/11, we were told the world had changed for ever, that this was a situation with no antecedents, and thus we couldn’t even debate the extraordinary measures put in place.

It rather changes matters to consider an Australian icon as a terrorist of the 1870s.

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Accused 'wanted to make bombs'

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,,23332867-31477,00.html?from=public_rss

THE alleged leader of a Melbourne Muslim terror group was caught on a secret listening device asking an undercover intelligence agent to show him how to make explosives using fertiliser.

"Can you show me, as soon as possible, how to do it?" Abdul Nacer Benbrika is heard asking the agent during the recording played to a Victorian Supreme Court jury yesterday.

"I need to learn ... need to learn myself."

Earlier in the meeting at Mr Benbrika's home in Melbourne on September 22, 2004, the undercover agent explained how he had learned to make explosives from ammonium nitrate while working on farms in Tasmania and had used it to blow tree stumps out of the ground.

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Terror accused deserve better: judge

http://news.smh.com.au/terror-accused-deserve-better-judge/20080320-20pn.html

The judge in Australia's largest terrorism trial has ordered sweeping changes be made in the conditions under which the 12 men standing trial are imprisoned.

The order follows concerns expressed by lawyers for the 12, who are on trial in the Supreme Court in Melbourne on charges including being members of a terrorist organisation, and that they planned to commit a terrorist act.

The court has been told the accused have been held in Victoria's highest security prison from more than two years while awaiting trial in conditions likely to lead to them suffering psychiatric problems.

Their trial began last month and is expected to continue until at least the end of the year.

Justice Bernard Bongiorno on Thursday ordered the accused men be given extra time out of their cells and that they should not be strip-searched when going to and from court.