freediver wrote on Dec 24^th, 2009 at 10:14pm:


The whole mathematics is based on:

1. A cripple syllogism or axiom because of only one statement and one conclusion:
If  a=b (statement)
then b=a (conclusion)

2. Full syllogism:
If a=b (statement 1)
If b=c (Statement 2)
Then a=c (Conclusion)

Before introduction of zero Mathematics was just an accounting. 
With zero mathematics was lifted on level of Philosophy
First concept of zero was introduced by Indian Philosophers thousand years ago before adopted in Middle East and then much later brought to Europe by students who studded at Medina University. Once when you have zero you have to deal with infinity and then philosophically (not mathematically) ask yourself what is nothing and what is everything and so on and so on.
The point here is that Indian philosophers didn’t use western rational way of thinking or syllogism to come up with such genius thing they applied intuition, inspiration, spiritual intelligence and all other human capacities, unrecognized by the West.
It’s nothing new, thousand years ago India had similar rationalist and skeptic philosophers (like for example Charvaca) who were scorned both by Hindu and Buddhist philosophers as the lowest of the low.   
To study western knowledge you can just go to the library grab the book regardless of spiritual state of your soul and mind. You cold be overweight, greedy, liar, immoral it does not matter all of this can be rationally justified as Dostoyevski’s Grand Inquisitor (”Brothers Karamazov”) did. On the other hand t study eastern wisdom by initiating intuition and inspiration you also have to perform meditation, fasting and so on. Because of this it is very difficult and unnecessary to distinguish eastern philosophy and science from religion.
The problem is that West took for granted and copied ancient Greek science without developing own fundamental and original approach which anyway would be considered as a waste of time  in capitalist environment.   
Some of the great scientists like Nikola Tesla were aware about limitations of strictly rational western way of thinking that unnecessary slow human progress.
He was not burned like Giordano Bruno but pronounced as extremely odd and eccentric by dogmatic western scientific establishment.

freediver wrote on Dec 26^th, 2009 at 10:09am:


Quantum Mechanics is an example of a branch of science that is largely based on mathematics. In common with most branches of science, it uses mathematics to describe reality.

However similar the two disciplines are in some respects, they are not the same. Mathematics is a tool  for reasoning, and, in common with science, it represents a collection of the results of collective thought and reasoning over the years.  

By using mathematics it is possible to connect one statement to another. For rexample, I can say that the gravtitational force is directed towards the sun. I can also tell you that the Earth moves so that if I draw a line from the sun to the planet, and draw another line at some definite period, like three weeks, later, then the area that is swung out by the planet is exactly the same as it will be in the next three weeks, and the next three weeks, and so on as it goes around the sun. In that way, I can use mathematics as an accurate prediction of orbital parameters at some future time.

freediver wrote on Dec 26^th, 2009 at 10:09am:


I thought that the first REAL scientist was Galileo Galilei. He was the first to use a methodical observational process that gave verifiable results.

freediver wrote on Dec 26^th, 2009 at 10:09am:


You know what, with you it’s getting nowhere. To continue communication, first, we have to answer very important philosophical question: What is older your ignorance or your arrogance because you always keep them together?

“To study western knowledge you can just go to the library grab the book regardless of spiritual state of your soul and mind. You cold be overweight, greedy, liar, immoral and ignorant not having respect for others it does not matter all of this can be rationally justified as Dostoyevski’s Grand Inquisitor (”Brothers Karamazov”) did. On the other hand t study eastern wisdom by initiating intuition and inspiration you also have to perform meditation, fasting and so on. Because of this it is very difficult and unnecessary to distinguish eastern philosophy and science from religion.”
Simply saying you are still incomplete.

freediver wrote on Dec 28^th, 2009 at 6:07pm:


Aristotle's Syllogism is basically deductive reasoning. Deductive reasoning forms an intrinsic part of science. In the scientific method, it's point 3, and that can be as simple or as complex as you like.

In a nutshell:

1. Gather data
2. Hypothesize an explanation for the observations.
3. Deduce a consequence of that explanation (a prediction). Formulate an experiment to see if the predicted consequence is observed.
4. Wait for corroboration. If there is corroboration, go to step 3. If not, the hypothesis is falsified. Go to step 2.

muso wrote on Dec 29^th, 2009 at 9:14am:


Very well done rationalised comprehensive explanation Musso.

I tried to explain to him on more simplified level but even then didn’t work.
It’s difficult to deal with someone’s perfect mixture of ignorance and arrogance.
People who know something quickly realise how knowledge is infinite and naturally become modest.
People who know nothing still think they know everything and always remain arrogant.
Maybe it could be due wrong corporate Social Darwinistic education that teaches them that arrogance is strength and modesty is a weakness.

Let's ask ChatGPT

Ask: Are maths and science the same thing?

Response:
No, math and science are not the same thing. Math is a branch of study that deals with numbers, quantities, and shapes, while science is a systematic and logical approach to discovering how things in the universe work. While math is used in many areas of science, it is not the same as science.

Ask: expand on explaination

Response:
Math is a field of study that deals with numbers, quantities, and shapes. It includes branches such as algebra, geometry, and calculus. Math is used to describe and understand patterns and relationships in the physical world, such as the motion of objects, the growth of populations, and the behavior of systems.

Science, on the other hand, is a systematic and logical approach to discovering how things in the universe work. It is divided into several branches, such as physics, chemistry, biology, and earth science. Science aims to understand the natural world through observation and experimentation. It is used to explain phenomena such as the origins of the universe, the behavior of subatomic particles, and the functioning of living organisms.

While math is used in many areas of science, it is not the same as science. Science relies on the use of mathematical concepts and tools to make predictions, analyze data and make conclusions. However, science also involves the use of other methodologies such as observation, experimentation, and logical reasoning to understand and explain the natural world.

Yep - the Blacks taught the Brownies who taught the Europeans all about Mathematics.
Black is the colour of Maths.
Just ask NASA how their Black employee's saved their arses on many occassions with Mathematics.

Black: The Land, Maths
Yellow: The City, Sports
Blue: Medicine, Food
Brown: Religion, Spirituality (Fashion)
White: Politics, Underwater
Green: Military, Animal Conservation
Red: The Sky (Aero), Art
Grey: Music, Science

...that's why a olive-skinned Military Emperor rules over the little Brown Religious people in the Middle-East (A Brown Spiritualist will rule over the little green men of South America in reverse).

Black is the colour of Money and it will one day grow on trees again. PNG should be charging the world for keeping the air clean and oxygenated.