Australian Politics Forum - Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool

tallowood Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 6048	Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool Reply #180 - Dec 5^th, 2008 at 7:42pm
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49572 At my desk.	Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool Reply #181 - Dec 5^th, 2008 at 7:56pm I've done a fair bit of spearing around Newcastle and the central coast. The closer you get to Sydney, the fewer fish there are. Brisbane is similar, though the bay prevents shore based spearing near the city anyway.
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tallowood Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 6048	Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool Reply #182 - Dec 5^th, 2008 at 8:08pm Too many people is the problem.
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49572 At my desk.	Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool Reply #183 - Dec 5^th, 2008 at 10:41pm Conveniently, marine aprks are the solution.
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tallowood Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 6048	Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool Reply #184 - Dec 5^th, 2008 at 10:48pm freediver wrote on Dec 5^th, 2008 at 10:41pm: Conveniently, marine aprks are the solution. I believe so too but they should leave shore or non powered boats anglers out of the fishing ban.
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49572 At my desk.	Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool Reply #185 - Dec 5^th, 2008 at 10:55pm I'm all for that, though I'm not sure about the non-powered boats. they can go a long way.
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tallowood Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 6048	Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool Reply #186 - Dec 5^th, 2008 at 11:14pm freediver wrote on Dec 5^th, 2008 at 10:55pm: I'm all for that, though I'm not sure about the non-powered boats. they can go a long way. You can't take too much when you use oars and sail is not good during fishing. Been there done that.
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pjb05 Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 1403 Gender:	Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool Reply #187 - Dec 6^th, 2008 at 11:12am freediver wrote on Dec 5^th, 2008 at 10:41pm: Conveniently, marine aprks are the solution. Not very convenient for the fishermen kicked out of their spots. Oh, but you mean that marine parks are a convenient way of discouraging fishing.
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pjb05

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Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool
Reply #188 - Dec 6^th, 2008 at 1:19pm

Perhaps you should pay some heed to our local experts FD, instead of reciting overseas consensus statements:

The proposal by the National Parks Association (NPA) for yet more marine parks in NSW warrants strong comment, particularly as Minister Tebbutt will be referring their report to the NSW Marine Park Authority (MPA) for advice. The MPA has consistently made fallacious claims about the so-called harmful effects of fishing to justify the exclusion of recreational fishing from 20% of marine park areas in NSW. Recreational fishing has been unfairly singled out as a major threat to biodiversity, despite there being no substantiated evidence to support this claim.

The bulk of evidence used to denigrate fishing is derived from overseas studies on destructive commercial fishing practices and on over-exploited fisheries. The press release from the NPA states that "No-take marine sanctuaries can double fish and invertebrate densities, triple biomass, increase mean fish sizes by 20 to 30 per cent, boost the number of species by 23 per cent, quadruple catch-per unit efforts in nearby waters, and make marine ecosystems 21 per cent less vulnerable to environmental changes?. Such claims amount to scientific fraud and demonstrate the spin-doctoring emanating from the NPA. Good science is certainly not about the selective use of information, in this case used by the NPA and MPA to advance their dodgy hypothesis that recreational fishing is impacting on biodiversity.

As a fisheries scientist I have searched the scientific literature for peer-reviewed papers demonstrating that recreational line fishing in NSW estuarine and coastal waters has had an adverse, or any, impact on biodiversity. No such hard published evidence exists. The real threats to marine biodiversity are coastal development and associated pollutants, not fishing. The many millions spent on creating and policing the meaningless no-take zones along the NSW coast would be far better spent combating such threats, rather than being wasted on green placebos.

Richard Tilzey
Central Tilba

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freediver

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Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool
Reply #189 - Dec 6^th, 2008 at 9:56pm

Quote:

Recreational fishing has been unfairly singled out as a major threat to biodiversity

Talk about paranoid BS. Recreational fishing is the least restricted type with the current marine park networks.

Quote:

Good science is certainly not about the selective use of information, in this case used by the NPA and MPA to advance their dodgy hypothesis that recreational fishing is impacting on biodiversity.

Funny that the quote he was responding to did not mention rectreaional fishing at all.

Quote:

As a fisheries scientist I have searched the scientific literature for peer-reviewed papers demonstrating that recreational line fishing in NSW estuarine and coastal waters has had an adverse, or any, impact on biodiversity.

What's the point of doing that? If you don't know what to even look for, you're not going to find anything. No user group has a right to expect that they be trated as if they are the only ones using the water. It is the contribution to the total catch and the impact of the total catch that matters, not one part of the catch viewed in isolation.

I don't care what qualifications this guy has. He is an idiot.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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tallowood Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 6048	Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool Reply #190 - Dec 6^th, 2008 at 10:11pm IMHO, people who can not catch legal size fish on single hook within half hour in an area they claim is not overfished should not claim any authority in the matter.
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pjb05

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Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool
Reply #191 - Dec 7^th, 2008 at 7:21am

tallowood wrote on Dec 6^th, 2008 at 10:11pm:

IMHO, people who can not catch legal size fish on single hook within half hour in an area they claim is not overfished should not claim any authority in the matter.

I think your in the wrong sport Tallowood, if you want that sort of instant gratification. Even the first settlers struggled to catch fish at times. Were we overfished in 1770?

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pjb05 Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 1403 Gender:	Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool Reply #192 - Dec 7^th, 2008 at 7:32am double post
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pjb05

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Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool
Reply #193 - Dec 7^th, 2008 at 7:34am

Quote:

Recreational fishing has been unfairly singled out as a major threat to biodiversity

Talk about paranoid BS. Recreational fishing is the least restricted type with the current marine park networks.

Nothing paranoid about it - all you have to do is look at the NPA's proposals which are between 20 and 30% green zones. Green zones exclude ALL fishing, ie recreational and commercial.

Quote:

Good science is certainly not about the selective use of information, in this case used by the NPA and MPA to advance their dodgy hypothesis that recreational fishing is impacting on biodiversity.

Funny that the quote he was responding to did not mention rectreaional fishing at all.

Duh FD. Are you really that thick? The quote is frauduently being used to promote a marine park for Sydney (and others in NSW), which includes rec fishing bans in 20-30% of the park!

Quote:

As a fisheries scientist I have searched the scientific literature for peer-reviewed papers demonstrating that recreational line fishing in NSW estuarine and coastal waters has had an adverse, or any, impact on biodiversity.

What's the point of doing that? If you don't know what to even look for, you're not going to find anything. No user group has a right to expect that they be trated as if they are the only ones using the water. It is the contribution to the total catch and the impact of the total catch that matters, not one part of the catch viewed in isolation.

Duh FD. Marine parks are being foisted on us to 'preserve biodiversity'. Although anglers take a significant amount of fish this can be easily and more equitably managed as part of the total catch with bag and size limits, gear limits, closed seasons etc.

I don't care what qualifications this guy has. He is an idiot. [/quote]

Your the idiot.
[/quote]

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« Last Edit: Dec 7^th, 2008 at 8:13am by pjb05 »

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tallowood

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Re: Marine Parks as a Fisheries Management Tool
Reply #194 - Dec 7^th, 2008 at 9:17am

pjb05 wrote on Dec 7^th, 2008 at 7:21am:

tallowood wrote on Dec 6^th, 2008 at 10:11pm:

IMHO, people who can not catch legal size fish on single hook within half hour in an area they claim is not overfished should not claim any authority in the matter.

I think your in the wrong sport Tallowood, if you want that sort of instant gratification. Even the first settlers struggled to catch fish at times. Were we overfished in 1770?

They didn't claim an authority in the matter.

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