BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Jan 5^th, 2008 at 12:44pm:


Then they never will be able to.  Interest rates hit a 30 year record low under Johnny.  If people can not afford finance at record interest rate lows then they will never be able to borrow.  Johnny made it possible for anyone with the capacity to make the payments easy with such astonishingly low interest rates, and what's more he made it possible for more people to have jobs than had had them in 40 years.

The conditions were right.  But you have missed your chance and you will not get it under Little Kevvy's Tyranny as interest rates rise without central bank action under Kevvy.  We knew that though which is why wise people made sure they were insulated against the horror of Liebor.

I voted Liberal.

Aussie wrote on Jan 5^th, 2008 at 5:46pm:


Either you could attempt a rebuttal or you could launch into a personal attack.

Oh that's right, you did the latter.  I expect that means your weapon is not loaded Sir.

Aussie wrote on Jan 5^th, 2008 at 9:17pm:


Everything I have said about the horror of Liebor is happening now - not in the future dude.

And you could bellow "It would have been much worse had hayseed won".  However you would be wrong.  History contains the proof you need.  You only need look over your shoulder.

Interest rates had been steadily creeping up long before the election and long before it was obvious the coalition would lose.

Acid Monkey wrote on Jan 6^th, 2008 at 11:54am:


No history did not record that "we had the highest interest rates under JWH's tenure as treasurer".  Though Fraser certainly did get rates up there Johnny threatened to resign as Treasurer due to Fraser's awful leadership which resulted in disastrous economic conditions.  But Cheating still wins for the highest mortgage rates.  Of that there is no question.

But Cheating's punishing interest rates followed Cheating's clumsy fiscal policy.  After which he was also directly responsible for plunging Australia into an engineered recession to get the rates down.  There are no excuses for the horror of the previous Liebor Government.  This Liebor Government is aiming to repeat it all too.

The 'mining boom' which Kevvy blabs about does not exist in my opinion - but if, according to Kevvy, it does then why is the economy turning if the basis for the prosperity was always the alleged 'mining boom'?  He can't have it both ways.  He lies a lot.

deepthought wrote on Jan 6^th, 2008 at 2:29pm:


I have already said that is because Keating removed the cap which then immediately raised the mortgage rate even higher to its true rate. The true rate which the cap restricted. The highest mortgage rate which you attributed to Keating should in fact be Fraser/Howard's.


deepthought wrote on Jan 6^th, 2008 at 2:29pm:


The mining boom doesn't exist? How did you derive this opinion? So what has been happening in WA? Why has prices there risen considerably more than say QLD which has a smaller share in the mining industry? Why do you think that WA miners are paid a lot more than say QLD miners? Why has WA houses risen tenfold than houses elsewhere in the country? Are they an economy all to themselves? Of course not, but they have one thing which the rest of us don't - the largest share in the mining pie. If there is no boom then we should all be having the same inflationary effects as WA.

"He can't have it both ways" doesn't work in economics. You CAN have a mining boom and also an economic downturn. Any highschool economics student can tell you that it is multi-faceted. There are many variables involved, not just mining - primary production, technological innovations, manufacturing, consumer spending (which is higher in WA), credit debt, import debts, skill worker shortages, skill bleeding etc. The economy is not just about mining. Currently it has a lot of influence in our economy but we cannot rely on a mining boom to carry Australia forever. Now, we have other factors coming into play which is offsetting the benefits of the mining sector - US dollar downturn therefore, rising our dollar making it less attractive to overseas currency exchanges, drop in tourism due to the dollar, our exports become more expensive; US ecocnomy is on a verge of a crash due to Sub-Prime which will affact the world. All of these lead to an economic downturn. You are comparing one fact to another fact and then alledging that he is lying because the facts contradite. Yes, they contradite but that is economic chaos - and there is a whole science dedicate to that subject. You forget that even Costello said that an economic downturn is on the way. Is he lying as well?


deepthought wrote on Jan 6^th, 2008 at 2:34pm:


You haven't answered my question about Labor policy causing banks to raise interest rates. So, I guess that your only and best answer is that the banks must be lying. But why would the banks lie? Please give me reasons why they would.

And while we are on the subject of lack of proof/answers = lying, what records showed that Howard threatened to quit as treasurer? I don't remember hearing/reading this in the media at the time. As far as I know this revelation came to light only when Howard himself "confessed" years later. Could he be "lying" to save his own economic reputation blaming it instead on Fraser holding him back? Are there proof beyond one man's word about a private conversation that was never recorded? One can play the same game as you.

Acid Monkey wrote on Jan 6^th, 2008 at 3:47pm:


Income from the alleged 'mining boom' is a pretty small part of GDP.  In fact it is about the same as it has been for over two decades - about 5% of GDP.  This has been remarkably consistent since the 80s.  It is way less than it has been though.

In real dollar terms it is growing - but so is every other sector so it keeps pace with all segments of our Australian industry.  A 'mining boom' does not exist.

Banks are not reactive.  They spend a lot of money researching the future.  

Consider this.  Following the introduction of WorkChoices at the start of 2006 employment grew at a remarkable rate and unemployment hit lows not seen since the explosive 60s.  And most jobs created were full time - around 90% from memory.  

In November as Liebor wrested control from the coalition unemployment hit a high not seen since the beginning of 2007.  In November as Liebor wrested control from the coalition 80% of new jobs created were part time (compare this with 90% full time under the coalition).   Industry is not willing to take on full time workers with the threat of industrial action, a new industrial regime and the return of the 'unfair dismissal' penalty.

Banks act accordingly.  They don't wait until it is too late to protect themselves.  If I can see the writing on the wall don't you reckon the banks can too?

And there is ample evidence John Howard threatened to resign as Treasurer.  He and Big Mal disagreed on many things.  Perhaps you did not see it but it happened.  Only when John Howard made it in 1996 could he implement the things he always wanted to.  The results speak for themselves.