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Islam; Who's in charge? (Read 31816 times)
Sprintcyclist
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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #75 - Jun 3rd, 2008 at 8:46pm
 
malik - fyi

The old test is for jews.
The new test is for christians.
There is no christian country.
There are capitalist democracys, apart from in any islamic country.


Jesus did not abolish the law, he fulfilled it.
Christian are no longer held by it, as it is repaid. It is fulfilled.
There was a debt, it is repaid.
Look at what Jesus did with women , his actions with them are the most touching in the Bible, imho.


I'm surprised you would say something Jesus said was "primitive and sexist", given your earlier comments of support and that weird word - "pbuh" after saying mohammad or jesus.



Again, thank you for coming here.  I hope you continue here.
I do appreciate your input and fully support your right of speech.
Which would not happen to a jew/christian in an islamic country.
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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #76 - Jun 3rd, 2008 at 9:49pm
 
NorthOfNorth wrote on Jun 3rd, 2008 at 3:41pm:
I think there's enough that can be sourced on the history of Linus and his (possible) mention in Paul's second letter to Timothy.


Can you give an example?

Sprint, I think it means peace be upon him, not poobah or something like that.
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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #77 - Jun 3rd, 2008 at 9:54pm
 
how insulting, fancy saying pbuh instead of peace be upon him !!!!!!!
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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #78 - Jun 3rd, 2008 at 9:58pm
 
Sprint, like it or not, you have made yourself a bit of an ambassador for Christianity on these boards. How do you think this reflects on Christianity?
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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #79 - Jun 3rd, 2008 at 10:03pm
 
Sprintcyclist wrote on Jun 3rd, 2008 at 8:46pm:
I'm surprised you would say something Jesus said was "primitive and sexist", given your earlier comments of support and that weird word - "pbuh" after saying mohammad or jesus.

Again, thank you for coming here.  I hope you continue here.
I do appreciate your input and fully support your right of speech.
Which would not happen to a jew/christian in an islamic country.


Insult them, then thank them for coming here... You're acting like a screwball. Yes, FD pbuh does mean 'peace be upon him' and it is a sign of respect Sprint... Respect for different faiths is the way towards reconciliation not half-pissed rants against another faith's holy book.

Jews, Christians and Muslims have lived peacefully for centuries in many parts of the world including the Middle East.

Here's what we should be working towards

Quote:
Damascus (ENI). Atop the historic Omayyad Mosque in Damascus is the Jesus minaret which honours the founder of Christianity. Inside the great mosque is the Shrine of St John the Baptist. It is a small, beautiful jewel of a church which is said to contain the head of St John who is revered by both Islam and Christianity.

I recently visited the mosque with a Syrian Christian friend. As we knelt in prayer before the Shrine of St John, trying to get a sense of the religious history of that ancient holy place, I noticed several men wearing sunglasses who were also kneeling in prayer next to the shrine.

"These are blind sheikhs," my friend told me quietly. "They offer blessings to children and people with special needs." Indeed, as I watched, I noticed several children kneeling around one of the sheikhs and receiving his blessing.

How remarkable, I thought: here is a Christian shrine inside a mosque with a minaret honouring Jesus, and Muslim holy men have chosen this small church as a place of healing to offer their blessings to children and sick people. The next day I asked Sheikh Salah Kuftaro of the Abou Al Nour Mosque in Damascus about this remarkable co-incidence of Islam and Christianity. As the son of the late Grand Mufti of Syria, Sheikh Ahmad Kuftaro, he is one of the key spiritual leaders of Syria. He and his staff gave a warm welcome.

"St John the Baptist is one of the prophets of God whom we venerate," said Sheikh Kuftaro. "If a woman is not feeling well she will ask God, through the sanctity of St John, that she be cured. Women who are childless seek the help of God so that they can conceive and have children." Through the nearly hour-long discussion Sheikh Kuftaro emphasised the close relationship between Christianity and Islam in Syria both in theology and in practice. "Religiously, we are an ideal society in Syria," he said. "We Christians and Muslims live as one family."

That relationship was demonstrated by the friendship between Sheikh Kuftaro and Mahat Farah El-Khoury, my Syrian Christian friend who had arranged the interview with the Sheikh and accompanied me to the meeting. They were old friends who had worked together for many years. They comfortably exchanged jokes between my serious questions.

Close friendships between Christian Arabs and Muslims are common in the Middle East. How much better it would be, I thought, if Christians in the West knew at least one Muslim as a personal friend, rather than getting their impression of Islam from the distorted images they receive from television.

Sheikh Kuftaro said the Canadian ambassador had visited his late father, the Grand Mufti of Syria. The ambassador asked how many Christians there were in Syria. The Grand Mufti replied that there were 17 million. The diplomat thought that perhaps there had been a problem with the translation since 17 million is roughly the total number of people in Syria, and Christians are only a minority. The Grand Mufti repeated that there were 17 million Christians in Syria "and I am a Christian. I have to be a genuine Christian," he explained, "in order for me to be an accepted Muslim." There is an "urgency" to have interreligious dialogue, Sheikh Kuftaro believes, and he and his foundation are reaching out to have dialogue with the West. "This is our duty," he said, "we have to work, to act and to meet so that we can know each other. We are all passengers on the same boat, this planet, which God ordered us to take care of."

Mahat Farah El-Khoury said: "Christians and Muslims have more in common than we have differences." She worked for the Middle East Council of Churches for many years and she has a deep knowledge of the spiritual life of her Muslim neighbours. "Every morning I wake up to the chanting of muezzin calling people to prayer from the minarets, followed by the sound of church bells and hymns."

In a lifetime of work building understanding between Christians and Muslims, Khoury has won many honours, including a medal from Pope John Paul II and state honours in France and Poland. Her work advocating for peace and justice has taken her to Europe and America and everywhere she goes, she talks about the cooperation between religions in Syria. During a recent trip to North America as part of a Mennonite Central Committee Peace Storytelling Tour, she reminded Christians they need to do more than just talk about Jesus; they need to advocate for policies that support peace and justice for all peoples in the Middle East....


The full article http://www.eni.ch/articles/display.shtml?05-0596
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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #80 - Jun 3rd, 2008 at 10:07pm
 
freediver wrote on Jun 3rd, 2008 at 9:58pm:
Sprint, like it or not, you have made yourself a bit of an ambassador for Christianity on these boards. How do you think this reflects on Christianity?


Ambassador? Diplomacy is the mark of an Ambassador... even a bit of an Ambassador.

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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #81 - Jun 3rd, 2008 at 11:22pm
 
helian - where was my insult ?

is it an insult to question the koran?
it is ok to question the bible and laugh at me.

An ambassador of christianity !! thanks guys.
I hope I show that christians are flawed and err.
That'ld be perfect.
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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #82 - Jun 3rd, 2008 at 11:28pm
 
helian - you want me to "accept" muslims.
sure, soon as every nonmuslim person can do whatever they want in every muslim country and the koran does not demand world domination and to make war on nonmuslims.

Till then, I'll quote the koran.
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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #83 - Jun 3rd, 2008 at 11:33pm
 
Sprintcyclist wrote on Jun 3rd, 2008 at 8:46pm:
malik - fyi

The old test is for jews.
The new test is for christians.
There is no christian country.
There are capitalist democracys, apart from in any islamic country.

The Vatican is a Christian country guided by Christian laws. There is no proper Islamic State at the moment.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Jun 3rd, 2008 at 8:46pm:
Jesus did not abolish the law, he fulfilled it.
Christian are no longer held by it, as it is repaid. It is fulfilled.
There was a debt, it is repaid.
Look at what Jesus did with women , his actions with them are the most touching in the Bible, imho.

Jesus pbuh had never changed the laws of Moses. Thus the law that states that daughters get no share of the inheritance unless there are no sons. That IS Christian law, unless of course you can show me a Christian law stating otherwise?

Do not forget that you believe that Jesus pbuh is God gbtH, God TOLD Moses pbuh that daughters don't get an inheritance from her father unless there is no sons in the family, Thus you are saying that at one stage God was sexist. But then God changed His mind and somehow according to you and changed the laws  (which would be fine, because God gbtH can change whichever laws He wants with times. But you see that doesn't make sense in this particular case considering that the verse I pasted showed that Jesus pbuh said he WASN'T there to change the laws of Moses pbuh. I don't believe that he would have lied about that.)

Sprintcyclist wrote on Jun 3rd, 2008 at 8:46pm:
I'm surprised you would say something Jesus said was "primitive and sexist", given your earlier comments of support and that weird word - "pbuh" after saying mohammad or jesus.

I'm not stating that Jesus pbuh was primitive or sexist at all. I believe there are reasons for such laws, and in fact It proves that Islam is the finality and perfection of God's message for us. I gave you a complete explanation as to why a daughter receives half of the inheritance that a man does. Let's go over it again.

According to Islam, it is my responsibility as a man to provide the financial source to my wife, kids, parents (when they get old), and my sisters (if they become widows).  And if I refuse to support my widow sister for instance, then if she decides to take me to court and sue me, and prove that I make enough money to be able to support my wife, kids and my widow sister, then the court will force me to pay her money every month to support her.   This law in Islam is called the law of "Nafaqa".

The woman according to islam does not have to provide a single dollar, nor her husband has the right to ask her or force her to use her money to support her husband and kids.  In fact, just to show you how fair and respectful Islam is to women, a woman even has the right to ask her husband for money for breast feeding her their child.  

Furthermore, according to the Islamic laws, the husband does not have the right to force his wife to work if she doesn't want to.  It is the man's primary responsibility to support his family financially, and not the woman.  Also, in Islam, the wife has all the right to ask her husband to pay for her education if she wishes to go to school.  Women in Islam have the right to be educated, and it is their parents' responsibilities (if the women are single), or their husband's responsibility to pay for their education.

It is you who believes that such a law is sexist.. I simply used your own prejudiced logic and reasoning abilities to show you that if we apply the same standards of testing to the Bible it shows that the Bible is far more sexist than the Qur'an. Thus the fact is that it is YOU who is saying the Bible and Jesus pbuh are sexist.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Jun 3rd, 2008 at 8:46pm:
Again, thank you for coming here.  I hope you continue here.
I do appreciate your input and fully support your right of speech.
Which would not happen to a jew/christian in an islamic country.


LOL there are no Islamic State's at the moment so you don't know what would happen. Historically it's been proven that Jews and Christians under a proper Islamic State get far better treatment than those Muslims and Jews in Christian
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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #84 - Jun 3rd, 2008 at 11:41pm
 
Sprintcyclist wrote on Jun 3rd, 2008 at 11:22pm:
helian - where was my insult ?

is it an insult to question the koran?
it is ok to question the bible and laugh at me.

An ambassador of christianity !! thanks guys.
I hope I show that christians are flawed and err.
That'ld be perfect.


"given your earlier comments of support and that weird word - "pbuh"'

how insulting, fancy saying pbuh instead of peace be upon him !!!!!!!

That is how Muslims show respect for their prophets (pbuh)... it's a bit like St for Saint.

Your remarks above says more about what you're really on about. You're not just questioning Islam. You want to denigrate Islam.

You pretend to be interested in understanding Koranic text but really you're just a hate filled ranter who hasn't got the balls to just come out with it.

How are you going with Pat Robertson quotes?
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« Last Edit: Jun 3rd, 2008 at 11:47pm by NorthOfNorth »  

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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #85 - Jun 3rd, 2008 at 11:45pm
 
malik - i've alreay answered your queries.

answer me, who wrote the  koran?
Who put pencil to papyrus for it ?
it was not mohammad, he was illiterate.
did it just materalise out of the air ??

Who penned it ??

If you don't know that, ..............
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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #86 - Jun 3rd, 2008 at 11:48pm
 
God did not write the koran. Not as he wrote the ten commandments.
According to the koran, an angel (at times) gave the idea to mohammad.

Is that right malik?
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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #87 - Jun 3rd, 2008 at 11:50pm
 
Sprintcyclist wrote on Jun 3rd, 2008 at 11:45pm:
malik - i've alreay answered your queries.

answer me, who wrote the  koran?
Who put pencil to papyrus for it ?
it was not mohammad, he was illiterate.
did it just materalise out of the air ??

Who penned it ??

If you don't know that, ..............


You're a hate filled ranter Sprint. Have the balls to call it.
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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #88 - Jun 3rd, 2008 at 11:55pm
 
thanks helain,
you've always disliked me.
it does not bug me. I love you.

just answer the question. Is that the muslim line ?

sure ok to grill us xians, not pc to query muslims though
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Re: Islam; Who's in charge?
Reply #89 - Jun 4th, 2008 at 12:05am
 
Sprintcyclist wrote on Jun 3rd, 2008 at 11:55pm:
thanks helain,
you've always disliked me.
it does not bug me. I love you.

just answer the question. Is that the muslim line ?

sure ok to grill us xians, not pc to query muslims though


Sprint, no doubt you could discuss Islam with thousands of Muslims if you were genuine about what you're trying to achieve. But you're not and, Muslim or not, we can see it for what it is. Hectoring a Muslim with Who wrote the Koran... c'mon, c'mon who wrote the Koran is an indication that you might be slightly unhinged. When you discuss matters of faith you must respect that you are discussing faith - there can be little or no criteria for falsification, you take it on faith or you walk away. No Muslim here yet has monstered you about proving the divinity of Jesus yet you demand of them proofs about matters of faith or badger them to explain Koranic verse which you then reject.

Let's see you prove your 'Christian love' by showing respect... and a bit of honesty about what you're really trying to do.

What did you think of the article I posted here above?

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