MW wrote on Jun 28^th, 2008 at 7:58pm:

No, the time when a girl is considered a woman is the age of menstruation. That is simply because she is now physically capable of bearing children. That is how it has been defined for thousands of years. It's only been within the last 2 hundred years or so that we have introduced the concept of adolescence etc.

I might also add that Mary pbuh was 12 years old when God made her pregnant. Are you saying that God made someone pregnant who wasn't ready for it? Surely such a thing would be unjust would it not?

I might also add that in some states of the US you can get married at the age of 14 with your parents permission.

The fact remains that while yes we do go through more neurological development at that time, it doesn't limit us from being an adult. We are just young adults who are still learning. Even according to the article you posted it says:

Quote:


Should we all be considered minors until our brain has fully developed at the age of 25? That would be highly illogical because the path to adulthood and maturity is through experience. If you have good guidance during that time period and can learn from mistakes, hopefully you will be getting help making the right decisions from those arounde you, but you will still make stupid decisions and mistakes. That's what growing up is.

Your ideas are unrealistic MW.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Jun 28^th, 2008 at 9:44pm:

the catholic encyclopedia quotes the apocraphyc writings as saying she was between 12-14 years old and that joseph was 90, peace be upon them.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Jun 28^th, 2008 at 10:52pm:

She was married off to him and he would sleep with her after the birth of Christ pbut. There's no doubt about that.

Sprint it's clear you're a bigot.. VERY CLEAR

Bigot - hhmmm, not been called that one for a while !!
Often sexist or racist, but not a bigot !!
Thanks, another feather in my cap.

I don't follow Joseph or Mary. Only Jesus.
btw, Joseph seemed a pretty ok sort of guy to me.
He did not try to imopse a new idea onto anyone by violence, nor assassainate others.


90 years old you reckon ?? I doubt he could get it up.
Perhaps it was more a marriage to give mary some social dignity when she was pregnant ?
An unwed pregnant woman/girl would be unfavourably looked upon I would think.

Come on malik, you can pull out MUCH better invective against me than that !
That's limp


There you go Mozzaok, I deleted the ditty.
You're a tough but fair poster.

Malik is distorting something I used as a guide to show that if the teenage brain is not mature, how can we expect a nine year old brain to be even close?
Yes, help/guidance from those around youis important when you are a child, not marriage to a paedophile.

Malik said: 'That is how it has been defined for thousands of years. It's only been within the last 2 hundred years or so that we have introduced the concept of adolescence etc.'

That is because science has advanced in the last 200 years and we are now able to look at things more critically.  

Lets have a little perspective here:

In Australia and any other decent country sex with a minor is a felony crime called statutory rape. This is to protect our children, to allow them to develop mentally, morally, physically and emotionally; away from the pressures of politics and sleaze.

Does this mean Australia is perfect. No. It means there are laws and processes in place to promote a safe environment for all. This is regardless of race and religion.

Malik. The responses in this forum are not actually anti-islam; they are simply parts of Islam that are unacceptable in society; regardless of if it is Islam, Hindu, Christian, or Jedi.

The central idea of Australia is that we are all equal. Males and Females can choose the life they wish to live within the bounds of our laws and ideals that promote a safe environment for all.

MW wrote on Jun 28^th, 2008 at 11:29pm:

No my point was very valid. The article states that the mind is not mature until roughly the age of 25. That means that prior to that, the people aren't able to properly comprehend the consequences of their actions. Yet we let them drive, drink, join the army, get married etc before that time.

Why?

The fact remains that even though the mind has still not matured, it is a process that requires people to learn from life. That is why I said they need people around them that can provide good examples and guidance to show them the right path to go down to keep them safe from harming themselves, but the fact remains that the people still have the RIGHT to do that harm to themselves.

So clearly waiting until 25 is out of the question? When do we wait until? Well these days in the West I certainly agree that marrying at 14 years old is not right, because we don't raise kids like we used to. We don't teach boys to be men nor girls to be women, instead we let them try and find all of that out for themselves which takes a greater amount of time. In addition to that, we tend to treat them like they are children and expect them to supress any natural feelings they have until the age of 18 (or 16). Unless of course you are in certain states of the US where you can marry at 14.

You become a woman physically when you go through puberty and start menstruating. Barbara Richardson wrote an article in the American Journal of Epidemiology where she states that the earlier a woman's breasts become "fully developed" through pregnancy and lactation, the less susceptible her cells are to damage that can result in cancerous growths. Making them less likely to get breast cancer.

So there are many benefits to having children young, the problem is that these we don't raise our youth with the tools necessary to be ready for marriage at that age, nor do we actually help them with those tools when they are older. We just expect them to find out for themselves.

MW wrote on Jun 29^th, 2008 at 12:03am:

So would you make cheating illegal? I have no problem with polygeny being illegal in this country but find it hypocritical that we don't criminalize cheating in this country too.

Women aren't obligated to marry at all in Islam. But it's their choice. I was referring to the situation that DOES occur, where there are more women that WANT to get married and not enough men to marry them.

What happens in that situation? When they have no one to love her, care for her, look after her, provide for her? Are you going to deny her the right to have those things?