Muso, I love Taoism.

Before enlightenment, gathering water chopping wood.
After enlightenment, gathering water chopping wood.

There is too much talking and noise. (not to be confused with good conversation). I love sitting on the verandah at 3am in the dark. Its all so beautiful and quiet. The dog going up the road to visit his girlfriend. the possums with the kids on the back, a resiliant city frog from somewhere down the corner of the yard.

Yadda, I think muso was talking about something being missing in the translation from feeling to writting about it. I could be wrong. To me there is nothing missing in the witnessing.

Yes Yadda, Mozz explained the clips very well, and it's not really worth downloading them with dialup.
The purpose was only to display some different perceptions of essentially the same event.
..and I could've found a better one for the Christianity perception.

Obviously the bible has been of great service to you, and I'm happy that it has achieved it's aim for you.

It's always a bit hard to discuss matters like religions, because one the one hand, I don't want to give the impression that I'm trying to say to stop believing in what you're believing in if it's important to you and works for you, but on the other hand, my God forces me to say what I think.

I think (or believe) that religious opinions quite often say pretty much the same thing as non-religious opinions, but in a different way.
I don't believe in a "one sock fits all" religion, and I'm more in agreeance that words alone cannot explain a personal human experience without also explaing all other previous experiences, which would put it into a better perspective.
If a picture paints a thousand words, then an experience must paint at least a trillion.
It's not for me to tell anybody what thier opinions and experiences mean to them, and I get pretty pissed when anybody tries to do the same to me.
But I suppose it's just human nature (for survival purposes) to try to make people believe that we know the path to some holy kingdom, when in fact, nobody does.
Professing this knowledge and usurping control of people's personal Gods may make life easier on earth for some.

muso wrote on Dec 3^rd, 2008 at 2:56pm:


.....or out of a 'can of beans'.


muso,

Are you suggesting that it is so, so, much more difficult, to find a 'spirituality' by meditating upon concepts, stated within a book,
.....rather than contemplating a beautiful sunset?


Should we all leave our books on shelves, and just look at sunsets each evening?





++++++


Ecclesiastes 2:12
And I turned myself to behold wisdom, and madness, and folly: for what can the man do that cometh after the king? even that which hath been already done.
13  Then I saw that wisdom excelleth folly, as far as light excelleth darkness.
14  The wise man's eyes are in his head; but the fool walketh in darkness: and I myself perceived also that one event happeneth to them all.
15  Then said I in my heart, As it happeneth to the fool, so it happeneth even to me; and why was I then more wise? Then I said in my heart, that this also is vanity.
16  For there is no remembrance of the wise more than of the fool for ever; seeing that which now is in the days to come shall all be forgotten. And how dieth the wise man? as the fool.
17  Therefore I hated life; because the work that is wrought under the sun is grievous unto me: for all is vanity and vexation of spirit.

Yadda wrote on Dec 4^th, 2008 at 9:54am:


You can look at sunsets, stars, contemplate your navel, or whatever works for you.

In the end if you want to find spirituality, you'll find it within your brain - or as you might say - within your heart.

The second might be more poetic, but the first is more anatomically correct.

muso wrote on Dec 4^th, 2008 at 11:40am:





Hi muso,

I think we may have explored this point previously....

'ARE THERE SPIRITS IN YOUR HEART?'
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1225068179/0#0

Yadda wrote on Dec 4^th, 2008 at 5:14pm:


You might have expounded it, but I chose not to comment at the time because I didn't want to be drawn into a meaningless faith based conversation. It was too loaded with a pseudoscientific religious agenda.

Quote:


Well yes, but there are nerve cells all over the body. The cognitive centre of the body is in the brain. Let's not reinvent neuroscience.

The article itself is more like a National Enquirer "here there be monsters" sensationalist piece designed to sell newspapers. I don't see the value in discussing it any further.

Let's keep science and religion separate. The Bible isn't exactly a scientific publication, and it was never intended to be.

The use of the term heart is just poetic. You can relax. It's not a central tenet of your religion. It's just misinterpreted. The more you latch on to unimportant aspects like that, the less credibility you'll end up with.

Yadda wrote on Dec 6^th, 2008 at 2:07pm:


LOL. Science has acknowledged that people who have neurological disorders often claim to be Napolean.

That is a fact.

If as you suggest,  Napolean is dead, how can you explain these scientifically based claims?  

Yadda - Let's make a deal - you stick to the "my God is better than your God" Biblical quotations and others will do the science and logical arguments. When you're stuck fast in the swamp, it's better not to go further into it.  

"Faith must trample under foot all reason, sense, and understanding. " Martin Luther.

Yadda wrote on Dec 7^th, 2008 at 3:41pm:


The problem with the chronically religious is that they never let the facts get in the way of a good story.

From your original link:

But most medical professionals - and even many organ- transplant recipients - find such accounts somewhat fantastical.

"The heart is a pump and no more - it is not capable of emotional transfer," said Patti Cook, 68, who got her donor heart at UMC in 1989, and is president of the New Heart Society, a statewide support group. "I've seen this stuff on TV, but I think some people need their 15 minutes of fame. I don't think the idea holds credibility."

About 5 years ago, I was told that unless I started exercising and eating correctly, I'd have a high risk of contracting Cardio vascular disease in the following 5 years.

I was never interested in sport or healthy eating until that particular Nexus in my life.

Now do you suppose that a heart transplant is a rather traumatic life changing experience? - and do you suppose that most people would resign themselves to changing their lifestyles significantly as a result?