Australian Politics Forum - Australia Day Disgrace

Grendel

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Re: Australia Day Disgrace
Reply #105 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:06pm

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One Nation, were and are idiots.

Apparently not since many of their policies are now copied and adopted by the major parties at both state and federal levels.

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They seemed to handpick the stupidest people for leadership positions and to speak for them.

Originally they were disorganised. Hanson was a poor spokesperson, but not all candidates were. The 2 Davids saw to it that they held power within the party and unfortunately they kept many good people from rising to positions where they could be more effective in the party. Whether this was to build an empire or paranoia I'm not sure.

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With one exception - Oldfield - he is a very canny operator, but not much good at presenting himself. He needs to be in the background.

He's doing fine on radio at the moment. Many listeners who disliked him have actually apologised and come around. He didn't want to be in the background.

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There needs to be a new party, with sensible policies and without the idiocy.

True. But the 2 major parties will do to it what they did to ON. Unless there is a monster pile of cash behind them.

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Also, the way the media ganged up on 3 16 year olds who painted 'F** OFF WE'RE FULL" on their stomachs at the beach was outrageous. They called them racists. Being against ALL immigration is a sensible policy, and most of the peope that come here are backpackers. But to post pics of them with headlines like Racist Outrage! etc is just so pitiful. Do it to me if you want, I can take it. But 2 teenage girls and a teenage guy, just kids - and what they were saying, wasnt racist at all. It had nothing to do with race.

ON the Dems and the Greens have all had policies that called for a moritorium of immigration. All based on sustainability.

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Lestat

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Re: Australia Day Disgrace
Reply #106 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:15pm

Swathe wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 11:42am:

That piece of cloth is a symbol of our nation. I know people who have fought for our country under the flag and all it represents.

Thats just it, its just a symbol. Colours to distinguish Australia from other contries.

Those people you know fought for our country, not a piece of cloth which is, as you said, just symbolic.

The flag does not represent anything, you should not be clinging to it as some sort of badge of identity.

If the Australian flag is changed in the next decade (as has been suggested), what does this mean. Has 'What this country stands for' been changed, if the flag has changed?

Would the new flag stir in you the same emotions as the old flag.

Would you show the same anger if the old flag was burnt, or alternatively if the new flag was burnt?

Swathe wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 11:42am:

How does me not agreeing with the burning of our flag equate to not having any identity or self esteem issues?

The fact that you would feel such anger if someone burnt a peice of cloth tells me that you have issues. Whether they are self esteem, or identity, I don't know.

Swathe wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 11:42am:

Not agreeing with an action does not reflect on the person in disagreement.

Not agreeing with an issue is a bit different to what you described. I also don't agree with burning flags, any flags. I think its silly, and really, just a symbolic gesture by people who also perhaps have self esteem issues, with the aim to anger others.

But really, it is silly and a rather pointless and futile excersise. So I disagree with it, do I feel anger. Definately not...why should I feel anger?

Like I said, it is just a symbolic piece of cloth...something to identify a country during the olympics.

Swathe wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 11:42am:

That is like me saying people who accept unrestricted immigration are cowards because they are too scared to say no.

Sorry, but I don't see the analogy.

Swathe wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 11:42am:

At least it took a few days for the personal insults to start coming, I am rather surprised.

lol..you really think that this was a personal insult?

Swathe wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 11:42am:

Note that insulting me in an attempt to invalidate my opinion has no effect on me. I don't succumb to ham handed mind games.

I haven't invalidated your opinion at all. Your entitled to it, I just believe its silly to be angry over the burning of a piece of cloth. Don't get me wrong....its not an attack on you, its a common theme all over the world.

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Grendel Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 28080 Gender:	Re: Australia Day Disgrace Reply #107 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:17pm The flag represents Australia and the Australian people... you know that all Muslims know that Arabs know that that's why they burn it... symbolic burning/destruction of Australia and all Australians. Standard form of hatred and protest in the ME. Go and lie to someone who'll believe you.
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Lestat

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Re: Australia Day Disgrace
Reply #108 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:18pm

DILLIGAF wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:06pm:

Lestat wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 11:30am:

Swathe wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 10:49am:

Burning the flag of your own country should be considered a traitorous act. If citizens of other countries who live here burn our flag, they should be removed as they obviously do not like it here.

Imagine the uproar if I went around burning their flags. Of course, it's only white people who racially discriminate Roll Eyes

A flag is a peice of cloth, no more, no less. If you feel so much offence and uproar over the burning of a cloth, then I suggest that perhaps you suffer from some low self esteem issues, or maybe even a lack of identity.

You need to be shot for treason Lestat.

hahahaha...good one.

You should be proud of your country Phil...and not need to resort to a piece of cloth to express that pride.

heck, why do you need to express it anyway. An alias like 'Aussie Nationalist'...why the need to share with the rest of us that you are a proud Australian?

Isn't it enough to know this yourself. Does somehow announcing it to the world make you feel more 'patriotic'.

Why the need for acceptance?

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Lestat

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Re: Australia Day Disgrace
Reply #109 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:23pm

Grendel wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:17pm:

The flag represents Australia and the Australian people... you know that all Muslims know that Arabs know that that's why they burn it... symbolic burning of Australia and all Australians.

Standard form of hatred and protest in the ME.

No, the Australian people represent Australia, the flag is just a symbolic cloth used to identify Australia. It has nothing to do with representation.

I already stated that I think people that burn flags are silly, and those that find offence are also silly. (yes thats you).

Actually plenty of non-muslim protests (remember s11) have involved burning flags...so though you try to once again equate this to 'muslims' it is just not the case.

Then again...I guess you would be the expert when it comes to standard forms of hate.

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Grendel

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Re: Australia Day Disgrace
Reply #110 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:25pm

No need to lie Les... we all know why Muslim Arabs burn efigies and flags... we all can read the hatred on their faces when they do it... tell your lies to someone else.

You are an idiot... pride for/of a country is obviously displayed through display and feelings for its symbols.

You need to find a country you can be proud of and leave this one.

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DILLIGAF

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Re: Australia Day Disgrace
Reply #111 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:34pm

Lestat wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:18pm:

DILLIGAF wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:06pm:

Lestat wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 11:30am:

Swathe wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 10:49am:

Burning the flag of your own country should be considered a traitorous act. If citizens of other countries who live here burn our flag, they should be removed as they obviously do not like it here.

Imagine the uproar if I went around burning their flags. Of course, it's only white people who racially discriminate Roll Eyes

A flag is a peice of cloth, no more, no less. If you feel so much offence and uproar over the burning of a cloth, then I suggest that perhaps you suffer from some low self esteem issues, or maybe even a lack of identity.

You need to be shot for treason Lestat.

hahahaha...good one.

You should be proud of your country Phil...and not need to resort to a piece of cloth to express that pride.

heck, why do you need to express it anyway. An alias like 'Aussie Nationalist'...why the need to share with the rest of us that you are a proud Australian?

Isn't it enough to know this yourself. Does somehow announcing it to the world make you feel more 'patriotic'.

Why the need for acceptance?

Aussie Pride/patriotism and Nationalism are two different things Lestat.
A patriot loves and believes in his country no matter who rules it and what the national policy is. Currently the policy is Multiracialism under the guise of Multiculturism which is intended by the ruling government to disunify and alienate the people to serve the governments own needs. The current government also believes in becoming part of a 'global villiage' where different nations are reliant apon eachother for goods and services.

A Nationalist loves his nation, but is at war with the current policy and those who impliment it. The Nationalist wishes to change the system to better suit the people as a whole and not the welfare of the traitor government. Unity, intergration and self sustainability is the policy of the Nationalist. Once this is achieved, the Nationalist reverts to being a patriot.

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Total anti-marxist and anti-left wing. The Right is Right.&&&&&&

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locutius

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Re: Australia Day Disgrace
Reply #112 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:47pm

Grendel wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:06pm:

Quote:

There needs to be a new party, with sensible policies and without the idiocy.

True. But the 2 major parties will do to it what they did to ON. Unless there is a monster pile of cash behind them.

Absolutely, the staged indignation and deliberate vilification and misrepresentation of ON would have been amusing if they weren't just serving their own political existence. Which was basically the seasonal sharing of power between two parties. It suited the media mogels agendas and the public lapped it up. Democracy was hijacked, whether you like ON or not.

Grendel wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:06pm:

Quote:

Also, the way the media ganged up on 3 16 year olds who painted 'F** OFF WE'RE FULL" on their stomachs at the beach was outrageous. They called them racists. Being against ALL immigration is a sensible policy, and most of the peope that come here are backpackers. But to post pics of them with headlines like Racist Outrage! etc is just so pitiful. Do it to me if you want, I can take it. But 2 teenage girls and a teenage guy, just kids - and what they were saying, wasnt racist at all. It had nothing to do with race.

ON the Dems and the Greens have all had policies that called for a moritorium of immigration. All based on sustainability.

Your not suggesting that these three little Einsteins would have been able to put forward that argument are you Grendale. My ability to believe is just not that elastic.

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I dream of a better tomorrow, where chickens can cross the road and not be questioned about their motives.

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locutius

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Re: Australia Day Disgrace
Reply #113 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:51pm

DILLIGAF wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:34pm:

Lestat wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:18pm:

DILLIGAF wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 12:06pm:

Lestat wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 11:30am:

Swathe wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 10:49am:

Burning the flag of your own country should be considered a traitorous act. If citizens of other countries who live here burn our flag, they should be removed as they obviously do not like it here.

Imagine the uproar if I went around burning their flags. Of course, it's only white people who racially discriminate Roll Eyes

A flag is a peice of cloth, no more, no less. If you feel so much offence and uproar over the burning of a cloth, then I suggest that perhaps you suffer from some low self esteem issues, or maybe even a lack of identity.

You need to be shot for treason Lestat.

hahahaha...good one.

You should be proud of your country Phil...and not need to resort to a piece of cloth to express that pride.

heck, why do you need to express it anyway. An alias like 'Aussie Nationalist'...why the need to share with the rest of us that you are a proud Australian?

Isn't it enough to know this yourself. Does somehow announcing it to the world make you feel more 'patriotic'.

Why the need for acceptance?

Aussie Pride/patriotism and Nationalism are two different things Lestat.
A patriot loves and believes in his country no matter who rules it and what the national policy is. Currently the policy is Multiracialism under the guise of Multiculturism which is intended by the ruling government to disunify and alienate the people to serve the governments own needs. The current government also believes in becoming part of a 'global villiage' where different nations are reliant apon eachother for goods and services.

A Nationalist loves his nation, but is at war with the current policy and those who impliment it. The Nationalist wishes to change the system to better suit the people as a whole and not the welfare of the traitor government. Unity, intergration and self sustainability is the policy of the Nationalist. Once this is achieved, the Nationalist reverts to being a patriot.

A patriot is someone prepared to defend his country from his government.

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I dream of a better tomorrow, where chickens can cross the road and not be questioned about their motives.

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Swathe Junior Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 79	Re: Australia Day Disgrace Reply #114 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 1:17pm Quote: A patriot is someone prepared to defend his country from his government. Which I am.
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NorthOfNorth Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 17258 Gender:	Re: Australia Day Disgrace Reply #115 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 1:22pm Swathe wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 1:17pm: Quote: A patriot is someone prepared to defend his country from his government. Which I am. Careful there, swathe. Certain forms of defiance of the nation's government is in fact treason, which would make you a... traitor.
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Lestat

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Re: Australia Day Disgrace
Reply #116 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 1:27pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 1:22pm:

Swathe wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 1:17pm:

Quote:

A patriot is someone prepared to defend his country from his government.

Which I am.

Careful there, swathe. Certain forms of defiance of the nation's government is in fact treason, which would make you a... traitor.

Its only treason if this form of defiance is expressed by a muslim,.....cause even though they maybe born and bred here, they aren't real 'aussies'.

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Swathe

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Re: Australia Day Disgrace
Reply #117 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 1:59pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 1:22pm:

Swathe wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 1:17pm:

Quote:

A patriot is someone prepared to defend his country from his government.

Which I am.

Careful there, swathe. Certain forms of defiance of the nation's government is in fact treason, which would make you a... traitor.

Yes, certain forms. If you think I would lower myself to commit terrorist acts or burn our flag, you are way off. Resistance is not all about violence. Again you jump to conclusions on my character which as previous, are inaccurate.

Being born and bred in Australia only comes into effect if they were "raised" Australian.

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" The stronger must dominate and not blend with the weak, thus sacrificing his own greatness. Only the born weakling can view this as cruel."

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NorthOfNorth

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Re: Australia Day Disgrace
Reply #118 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 2:13pm

Swathe wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 1:59pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 1:22pm:

Swathe wrote on Jan 29^th, 2009 at 1:17pm:

Quote:

A patriot is someone prepared to defend his country from his government.

Which I am.

Careful there, swathe. Certain forms of defiance of the nation's government is in fact treason, which would make you a... traitor.

Yes, certain forms. If you think I would lower myself to commit terrorist acts or burn our flag, you are way off. Resistance is not all about violence. Again you jump to conclusions on my character which as previous, are inaccurate.

Being born and bred in Australia only comes into effect if they were "raised" Australian.

It was a little tongue-in-cheek actually. Sorry, I don't often use emoticons. I feel its a dumbed-down way to convey meaning.

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Conviction is the art of being certain

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Swathe Junior Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 79	Re: Australia Day Disgrace Reply #119 - Jan 29^th, 2009 at 2:18pm I agree with you there. It is hard to interpret context and tone at times with text. No need to apologize.
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