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Hitchens in Australia (Read 9745 times)
NorthOfNorth
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Hitchens in Australia
Oct 4th, 2009 at 4:40pm
 
Christopher Hitchens was recently in Australia and was a panelist on ABC's Q&A. Not exactly a stellar Australian cast appearing alongside him. They seemed either intimidated by him or a little irrationally hostile. Father Frank Brennan SJ sounded more like an agnostic, apologetic Anglican Bishop and Waleed Aly came across as rather evasive. The audience questioners weren't much chop either.

As for Hitchens, he was clearly aware he was not among peers and went a little easy (for him, that is).

Who would have been a better Australian choice as a panel member? I would've liked to have seen a theological pugilist like Cardinal Pell take Hitchens on (not that I think he'd have accepted an invitation, but).

http://www.abc.net.au/tv/qanda/txt/s2695716.htm?clip=rtmp://cp44823.edgefcs.net/...
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« Last Edit: Oct 4th, 2009 at 4:50pm by NorthOfNorth »  

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muso
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Re: Hitchens in Australia
Reply #1 - Oct 5th, 2009 at 8:15am
 
Christopher Hitchens is the face of ugly adversarial atheism. Apart from being a drunken lout, his politics suck bigtime. Maybe he has a place in the USA, but he has no place in Australia, where we're generally too laid-back to give a damn what religion other people have (apart from the reaction to Islam, which is seen as a threat to our easygoing lifestyle)

I'm sure that Hitchens' very existence has boosted the numbers of fundamentalist religionites.

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NorthOfNorth
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Re: Hitchens in Australia
Reply #2 - Oct 5th, 2009 at 9:37am
 
muso wrote on Oct 5th, 2009 at 8:15am:
Christopher Hitchens is the face of ugly adversarial atheism. Apart from being a drunken lout, his politics suck bigtime. Maybe he has a place in the USA, but he has no place in Australia, where we're generally too laid-back to give a damn what religion other people have (apart from the reaction to Islam, which is seen as a threat to our easygoing lifestyle)

I'm sure that Hitchens' very existence has boosted the numbers of fundamentalist religionites.

Yep, he's heavy artillery, that's for sure, having declared himself not merely an atheist but a militant anti-theist.

Having gone from Trotskyite to neocon, there's no doubt the man likes to get around (although again it may suggest that a continuum is best represented by an arc).

He has no place in Australia? Did the thought of Christians, Muslims and 'religionites' of all degrees and persuasion coming together to take on this 'Yankee-Pom drunken lout' not appeal to your sense of irony? Grin Maybe Australia needs a six-pack of Hitchens'. Grin

And if all it took was a Hitchens to drive up the numbers of fundamentalist religionites in Australia, then what would it suggest about our tendency towards a laid-back lifestyle? If it were true, it might even suggest that we're not so much laid-back as bogged down in a swamp of existential malaise being extricated from it only when propelled by strident external forces.

But, in the end, if we’re not up for the debate, why even have one?
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« Last Edit: Oct 5th, 2009 at 9:44am by NorthOfNorth »  

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abu_rashid
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Re: Hitchens in Australia
Reply #3 - Oct 5th, 2009 at 10:07am
 
Quote:
Having gone from Trotskyite to neocon, there's no doubt the man likes to get around (although again it may suggest that a continuum is best represented by an arc).


That's quite a conversion.

Quote:
and Waleed Aly came across as rather evasive


The best they could bring on was Waleed Aly??

It surprises me that he gets so much media attention, I guess he presents the face of Islam that they'd like to present.
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Re: Hitchens in Australia
Reply #4 - Oct 5th, 2009 at 11:04am
 
YOU MEAN HE'S AN UNABASHED MODERATE iSLAMIC APOLOGIST?
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NorthOfNorth
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Re: Hitchens in Australia
Reply #5 - Oct 5th, 2009 at 12:01pm
 
abu_rashid wrote on Oct 5th, 2009 at 10:07am:
Quote:
and Waleed Aly came across as rather evasive


The best they could bring on was Waleed Aly??

Apparently so. And the Catholics could only manage Frank Brennan who appears to be a nice go-along-get-along Jesuit (the supposed tempestuous intellectual storm troopers of Catholicism). Brennan looked more like a muddled religious Uncle Arthur.

Where were the giants of the Australian religious community, such as the likes of Pell. He likes to ride media bandwagon when he's beating up on a victim of child rape or condemning the evils of prophylactic contraception or declaring his unwavering loyalty to 'Vaticanism' or his undying love for Joey the rat (platonic, of course  Wink ).

Laid-back, Muso? Gutless, more like.
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Re: Hitchens in Australia
Reply #6 - Oct 5th, 2009 at 1:38pm
 
Pell is an; ignorant, discourteous, arrogant, coward...  been there done that...  he should stick to being a priest running a church.
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NorthOfNorth
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Re: Hitchens in Australia
Reply #7 - Oct 5th, 2009 at 1:45pm
 
Grendel wrote on Oct 5th, 2009 at 1:38pm:
Pell is an; ignorant, discourteous, arrogant, coward...  been there done that...  he should stick to being a priest running a church.

And he gets away with it because Australia does not have its own erudite, intellectual, uncompromising, anti-theistic 'drunken lout' to keep these bastards honest.

Being a Vatican Prince, I think the church he's fixing to run is the Roman Catholic Church.
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abu_rashid
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Re: Hitchens in Australia
Reply #8 - Oct 5th, 2009 at 1:51pm
 
Now now Grendel, that's no way to speak to your Christian brother. Is that how you imagine Christ (pbuh) would've spoken to others? Other Christians no less??
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Re: Hitchens in Australia
Reply #9 - Oct 5th, 2009 at 2:49pm
 
Thou shalt not bear false witness... having dealt with Pell b4 and his minions and minders I can tell you what I said is completely true.

Unlike Muslims we do not seek to profer lies to support or defend a fellow Christian.
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Re: Hitchens in Australia
Reply #10 - Oct 5th, 2009 at 3:00pm
 
NorthOfNorth wrote on Oct 5th, 2009 at 9:37am:
But, in the end, if we’re not up for the debate, why even have one?


Suits me fine. If it ain't broken, don't try and fix it.  The vast majority of Australians are either moderately supernaturalist or moderately non-religious'. We don't have a kulturkampf here. We don't have patriotism and religion sold as a bundled lot, and we don't need it. (I'll try to keep the Muslim issue separate.)

That moderacy in society is very fragile as you implied, and  Hitchens is an expert nasal dislocator.  
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NorthOfNorth
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Re: Hitchens in Australia
Reply #11 - Oct 5th, 2009 at 4:11pm
 
muso wrote on Oct 5th, 2009 at 3:00pm:
NorthOfNorth wrote on Oct 5th, 2009 at 9:37am:
But, in the end, if we’re not up for the debate, why even have one?


Suits me fine. If it ain't broken, don't try and fix it.  The vast majority of Australians are either moderately supernaturalist or moderately non-religious'. We don't have a kulturkampf here. We don't have patriotism and religion sold as a bundled lot, and we don't need it. (I'll try to keep the Muslim issue separate.)

That moderacy in society is very fragile as you implied, and  Hitchens is an expert nasal dislocator.  

I don't believe political and religious moderation is all that fragile in Australian society because nothing irritates us more, I believe, than a religio/political zealot. What we do have are pompous religious arschlochs like Pell and clowns like Hilali and it would have been a pleasure to see these characters excoriated with extreme prejudice by an anti-theistic warlord like Hitchens, (never mind his neocon dogma).

And I support his solidarity with the Kurdish people.
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Re: Hitchens in Australia
Reply #12 - Oct 5th, 2009 at 4:17pm
 
I agree with some things Hitchen's says but his anti-religion rants are just mindless ignorance.
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NorthOfNorth
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Re: Hitchens in Australia
Reply #13 - Oct 5th, 2009 at 5:31pm
 
Grendel wrote on Oct 5th, 2009 at 4:17pm:
I agree with some things Hitchen's says but his anti-religion rants are just mindless ignorance.

Dunno about it all being mindless ignorance, but I got a laugh from the guys at the Hitchens Watch website who have tagged him 'The Incredible Bullshitting Man' Grin

The Incredible Bullshitting Man
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Re: Hitchens in Australia
Reply #14 - Oct 5th, 2009 at 9:12pm
 
Hitchens is great. He is a gadfly in the best tradition. He is articulate, he is smart and means good (you know he would not murder you if he found out that you are religious) ). He is passionately anti-religious and that is a great service as a corrective. He and his like are absolutely essential to avoid dogmatic stupor.

The great things about people like him is that group think is not required. You can disagree with him as long as you are intelligent about it. That's the challenge.

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