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Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits. (Read 15039 times)
imcrookonit
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Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Sep 12th, 2010 at 11:39am
 




VICTORIA's richest private schools made profits of up to $14 million last year, with financial reports showing taxpayers contributed more than half of some schools' gains.

The extent of taxpayers' contributions to the surpluses of schools such as Scotch College, Melbourne Grammar and Geelong Grammar is likely to intensify the debate about funding for private schools.

A review of school funding will conclude next year, but Prime Minister Julia Gillard's election pledge guaranteeing the current funding levels for private schools until 2013 means changes could not occur before then.

Ms Gillard's promise drew criticism from public education advocates and the Greens, on whose support she now relies, who want the funding formula overhauled.

Scotch College, which boasts facilities including a diving pool, 18 tennis courts and an observatory, had a profit of $14 million last year.

It received $4.7 million in yearly government grants.

Melbourne Grammar made $8.2 million above its operating costs after receiving $4.5 million in grants, while Geelong Grammar made $10.6 million after receiving $6.3 million in grants.

The schools also generated millions from donations and extra building grants.

Economist Trevor Cobbold, of Save Our Schools, said government funding was meant to keep a lid on fees, but schools were instead reinvesting in their business to drive a cycle of growth and enrichment.

''Instead of grants making schools more affordable, it's making them more elite,'' he said.

Despite large surpluses in 2009, year 12 fees were up 5 per cent at Geelong Grammar to $27,700 in 2010, 4.8 per cent at Scotch to $22,572, and 5 per cent at Melbourne Grammar to $22,380.

But principals said fee rises would be even higher without the benefit of surpluses or government income, which helped fund building, technology and maintenance costs, and kept class sizes small.

They argued their pupils would cost more to government if they were in the public system, and all students were entitled to receive some funding.

''The government has an obligation to ensure that all children obtain a school education,'' Geelong Grammar principal Stephen Meek said in an email. He said that almost all the school's yearly grants were used to fund scholarships.

Philip Grutzner, principal of Carey Baptist Grammar, which received $6 million in government grants, said parents ''made significant sacrifices to send their students here and the grants help keep the costs of educating their children down''.

Scotch College did not reply to interview requests. Melbourne Grammar principal Roy Kelley said its government funding was minimal given its 1800 students and that education costs had risen faster than its fees.

Haileybury said its yearly government contribution of $13.8 million reflected a less-wealthy student cohort, which attracts more funding.

The Sunday Age looked at six schools' financial reports, lodged with the Australian Securities and Investments Commission, as a taste of what will be available in December on the My School website to make schools more accountable for their spending.

Public school principal David Adamson, of Essendon Keilor College, said the reports showed how much was possible if funding was redistributed.

''Transfer that federal money to us for one year and we could do so much. My floors are rotten, the window frames are rotten and the floor rocks and rolls as you walk down the corridor,'' he said.

The federal government funds about 80 per cent of regular private school grants, and the state government the remainder.

Federal grants are a complicated hybrid. In 2001, the Howard government amended the system to fund private schools based on the socio-economic status (SES) of students, rather than a school's resources.

But the formula applied only to schools it advantaged, and not those for whom it would reduce funding, a loophole worth $800 million a year.

In 2007, Labor promised to change the system if elected, but instead has guaranteed funding.

''The government is extending privilege to the already privileged,'' said Australian Education Union head Angelo Gavrielatos. ''It is indefensible.''
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Binary Ninja
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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #1 - Sep 12th, 2010 at 12:06pm
 
If you look at this funding for Elite Private Schools which labor did they cant change it till the next review in 2013 or when ever it is up .. Howard put this in place with the next review date of 2013 ... i think it would be sensible to leave it in place as much as possible till then even though the Elites schools rort it ..

This was all brought up when Howard was in and why certain schools got these sorts of amounts Kings College $14 million  , Geelong Grammer $9 million .. this is in 2005 / 2006
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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #2 - Sep 12th, 2010 at 12:28pm
 
Jealous ???

People pay big fees to send their children to private schools, so that their children have the best education.

They pay tax, so their school should recieve funding the same as every one else.

The school doesn't make a profit, the money goes back into facilities
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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #3 - Sep 12th, 2010 at 12:35pm
 
I am certainly not a fan of the private school system, and I would much rather see the money going to public schools.
The disparity between the public and private in regards to resources and facilities is obscene, and all these elite schools should receive zero government funding.
The simple fact is that the few grand per student is neither here nor there for the people who CHOOSE to send their kids to these schools, but if redirected to the public system, it would deliver a marked improvement in facilities for them.

Elite schools are a choice, like elite cars, and we should not subsidise them out of a misguided ideal of fairness, as it is really just high class welfare, and makes as much sense as handing out the equivalent of the dole payment, or pension, to everybody, to be fair, when it should only go to those who need it.

The argument that these schools save us money, is a complete furphy, because the simple fact is that the people that choose to send their kids to private schools, will continue to do so, and if the fees rise from 20k to 22k, then they may need to decide whether to install a few less tennis courts, or manage to curb fee rises, by investing in less elitist infrastructure spending.
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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #4 - Sep 12th, 2010 at 1:29pm
 
If you take note of the wording of the OP, you`ll see slanted individual cases portrayed as average for their group, there are quite a few examples of propaganda like deceptions in this document, if you care to look.  This slanted type of "journalism" was branded by my Father as a "coward`s lie"
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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #5 - Sep 12th, 2010 at 2:52pm
 
mozzaok wrote on Sep 12th, 2010 at 12:35pm:
I am certainly not a fan of the private school system, and I would much rather see the money going to public schools.
The disparity between the public and private in regards to resources and facilities is obscene, and all these elite schools should receive zero government funding.
The simple fact is that the few grand per student is neither here nor there for the people who CHOOSE to send their kids to these schools, but if redirected to the public system, it would deliver a marked improvement in facilities for them.

Elite schools are a choice, like elite cars, and we should not subsidise them out of a misguided ideal of fairness, as it is really just high class welfare, and makes as much sense as handing out the equivalent of the dole payment, or pension, to everybody, to be fair, when it should only go to those who need it.

The argument that these schools save us money, is a complete furphy, because the simple fact is that the people that choose to send their kids to private schools, will continue to do so, and if the fees rise from 20k to 22k, then they may need to decide whether to install a few less tennis courts, or manage to curb fee rises, by investing in less elitist infrastructure spending.


It is the usual garbage reporting that states a handful of schools at the top elitist level ad then hopes the reader will make the absurd assumption that this applies to all private schools. the actual FACTS - something many people actively avoid - is that most private schools are low-fee catholic or christian schools for whom govt sponsorship is ESSENTIAL. parents at these schools are generally not rich at all but rather the people who want to send their kids to a private school and so choose the low-fee ones because that is all; they can afford.

And despite Mozza's protestations, the collapse of the private schooling sector would generate a huge flood of students into the public sector where the govt can spend 50% MORE per student than they currently do. The argument is quite simple and quite clear and using the handful of elite, megarich and uber-exclusive schools to make a point is disingenuous.
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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #6 - Sep 12th, 2010 at 4:03pm
 
Cockney Doll wrote on Sep 12th, 2010 at 12:28pm:
They pay tax, so their school
should recieve funding the same as every one else.



When this was investigated in 2005 / 2006 under Howard / Costello the same question was asked ...but their is no state school , no independent or catholic school that receives even $1 million in funding under this scheme they get about $200,000 - $300,000 per school ...

So the discrepancy of same funding is very clear because these ELITE schools got 9$ million or $14 million per school all the while charging each of their students $20,000 per year ... When a state school would get next to nothing in fee's let alone multi million handouts it is a disgrace but as said cant be stopped until 2013

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longweekend58
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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #7 - Sep 12th, 2010 at 4:14pm
 
Binary Ninja wrote on Sep 12th, 2010 at 4:03pm:
Cockney Doll wrote on Sep 12th, 2010 at 12:28pm:
They pay tax, so their school
should recieve funding the same as every one else.



When this was investigated in 2005 / 2006 under Howard / Costello the same question was asked ...but their is no state school , no independent or catholic school that receives even $1 million in funding under this scheme they get about $200,000 - $300,000 per school ...

So the discrepancy of same funding is very clear because these ELITE schools got 9$ million or $14 million per school all the while charging each of their students $20,000 per year ... When a state school would get next to nothing in fee's let alone multi million handouts it is a disgrace but as said cant be stopped until 2013



The govt funding for private schools is around $7000 per student compared to $10,000 per public school student.  do the maths. if a private school has 200 students then it wil get around $1.4M in govt money. It really IS that simple.

and dont cry poverty on public schools. they get MORE than private schools to do the same job
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #8 - Sep 12th, 2010 at 4:19pm
 
longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12th, 2010 at 4:14pm:
Binary Ninja wrote on Sep 12th, 2010 at 4:03pm:
Cockney Doll wrote on Sep 12th, 2010 at 12:28pm:
They pay tax, so their school
should recieve funding the same as every one else.



When this was investigated in 2005 / 2006 under Howard / Costello the same question was asked ...but their is no state school , no independent or catholic school that receives even $1 million in funding under this scheme they get about $200,000 - $300,000 per school ...

So the discrepancy of same funding is very clear because these ELITE schools got 9$ million or $14 million per school all the while charging each of their students $20,000 per year ... When a state school would get next to nothing in fee's let alone multi million handouts it is a disgrace but as said cant be stopped until 2013



The govt funding for private schools is around $7000 per student compared to $10,000 per public school student.  do the maths. if a private school has 200 students then it wil get around $1.4M in govt money. It really IS that simple.

and dont cry poverty on public schools. they get MORE than private schools to do the same job


longy why do you bother     they dont want too understand  Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #9 - Sep 12th, 2010 at 4:22pm
 
bwood1946 wrote on Sep 12th, 2010 at 4:19pm:
longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12th, 2010 at 4:14pm:
Binary Ninja wrote on Sep 12th, 2010 at 4:03pm:
Cockney Doll wrote on Sep 12th, 2010 at 12:28pm:
They pay tax, so their school
should recieve funding the same as every one else.



When this was investigated in 2005 / 2006 under Howard / Costello the same question was asked ...but their is no state school , no independent or catholic school that receives even $1 million in funding under this scheme they get about $200,000 - $300,000 per school ...

So the discrepancy of same funding is very clear because these ELITE schools got 9$ million or $14 million per school all the while charging each of their students $20,000 per year ... When a state school would get next to nothing in fee's let alone multi million handouts it is a disgrace but as said cant be stopped until 2013



The govt funding for private schools is around $7000 per student compared to $10,000 per public school student.  do the maths. if a private school has 200 students then it wil get around $1.4M in govt money. It really IS that simple.

and dont cry poverty on public schools. they get MORE than private schools to do the same job


longy why do you bother     they dont want too understand  Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy


or just as likely, they went to public schools where they learned bike maintenance, political correctness and how to care for their dog while the private schools learned reading, writing, maths and science.
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #10 - Sep 12th, 2010 at 5:43pm
 
Long it is not the private schools that is the problem it is the
ELITE
no other schools under the SES scheme received $9 million or $14 million .. this is not the same funding or equal funding it is actually atrociously biased.. Their are plenty of site on the internet if you do not understand why ... just google Elite school funding John Howard...

Quote:
Many elite schools in Sydney and Melbourne now charge fees in excess of $20 000 per year and many have increased their fees by over $10 000 since 2001. Yet these schools continue to receive increasing funding from the Commonwealth Government while levying higher and higher fees. Many get over $4 million a year, with two receiving $12 million and $9 million a year. Geelong Grammar, the most expensive school in Australia, gets nearly $4.5 million. Several get over $3000 a student, despite fees of over $20000.


and this was supposed to be funded on a needs based system what a crock..

Quote:
Schools charging $20 000 and more per student are the preserve of the wealthiest families in Australia. The large fee increases have put elite private schools further beyond the reach of most families, despite claims that the SES funding scheme would put downward pressure on fees. Affordability of these schools has declined significantly for all other households. On average, it declined by 30% in NSW and by 17% in Victoria between 2001 and 2009.

These huge fee and government funding increases have delivered a massive resource advantage over government schools. Funding per student available to elite private schools is generally at least double government school expenditure. In the case of Geelong Grammar it is three times as high.

The resources available to elite private schools appear to be about double those available to government schools. In NSW, many elite private schools had total funding of $24 000 to over $26 000 per Year 12 student compared in 2009 to $12 035 for government secondary students in 2007-08. In Victoria, many had total funding of between about $22 000 and $24 000 per Year 12 student compared to $10 817 for government secondary students. Geelong Grammar with total funding of $29 993 per Year 12 student had nearly three times the resources of Victorian government schools.

Government schools are further disadvantaged because they enrol higher proportions of students with complex learning needs that incur higher costs. Students from low SES families, Indigenous students and students with disabilities comprise a much higher proportion of government school enrolments than they do in elite private schools. As a result, government schools face much higher costs than the elite private schools in meeting student needs. They have far more to do with fewer resources.
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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #11 - Sep 12th, 2010 at 6:15pm
 
Binary Ninja wrote on Sep 12th, 2010 at 5:43pm:
Long it is not the private schools that is the problem it is the
ELITE
no other schools under the SES scheme received $9 million or $14 million .. this is not the same funding or equal funding it is actually atrociously biased.. Their are plenty of site on the internet if you do not understand why ... just google Elite school funding John Howard...

Quote:
Many elite schools in Sydney and Melbourne now charge fees in excess of $20 000 per year and many have increased their fees by over $10 000 since 2001. Yet these schools continue to receive increasing funding from the Commonwealth Government while levying higher and higher fees. Many get over $4 million a year, with two receiving $12 million and $9 million a year. Geelong Grammar, the most expensive school in Australia, gets nearly $4.5 million. Several get over $3000 a student, despite fees of over $20000.


and this was supposed to be funded on a needs based system what a crock..

Quote:
Schools charging $20 000 and more per student are the preserve of the wealthiest families in Australia. The large fee increases have put elite private schools further beyond the reach of most families, despite claims that the SES funding scheme would put downward pressure on fees. Affordability of these schools has declined significantly for all other households. On average, it declined by 30% in NSW and by 17% in Victoria between 2001 and 2009.

These huge fee and government funding increases have delivered a massive resource advantage over government schools. Funding per student available to elite private schools is generally at least double government school expenditure. In the case of Geelong Grammar it is three times as high.

The resources available to elite private schools appear to be about double those available to government schools. In NSW, many elite private schools had total funding of $24 000 to over $26 000 per Year 12 student compared in 2009 to $12 035 for government secondary students in 2007-08. In Victoria, many had total funding of between about $22 000 and $24 000 per Year 12 student compared to $10 817 for government secondary students. Geelong Grammar with total funding of $29 993 per Year 12 student had nearly three times the resources of Victorian government schools.

Government schools are further disadvantaged because they enrol higher proportions of students with complex learning needs that incur higher costs. Students from low SES families, Indigenous students and students with disabilities comprise a much higher proportion of government school enrolments than they do in elite private schools. As a result, government schools face much higher costs than the elite private schools in meeting student needs. They have far more to do with fewer resources.


If you believe it is about ELITE schools - about 20 in the country then make the thread about them - not include all private schools in the argument. And even then the argument will be - and fairly so - that wealth or lack of it shoudl not qualify or disqualify ANY student from govt funding.
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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #12 - Sep 12th, 2010 at 6:26pm
 
i had written ELITE in all posts if i have to bold make it size 16 font so people understand i cant help that ... and yes these schools should not be allowed any funding from the government at all under the needs based scheme like the SES..

They charge 20,000 per year , per student  which is more then enough to cover costs this was supposed to help keep costs down but they have doubled....on top of fees they get very generous funding from the private sector that state schools do not ... they do not need or want for anything yet the state schools are falling apart...

This isn't fair , this isn't equal  but not much can be doe tillthe next review in 2013
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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #13 - Sep 12th, 2010 at 6:43pm
 
Binary Ninja wrote on Sep 12th, 2010 at 6:26pm:
i had written ELITE in all posts if i have to bold make it size 16 font so people understand i cant help that ... and yes these schools should not be allowed any funding from the government at all under the needs based scheme like the SES..

They charge 20,000 per year , per student  which is more then enough to cover costs this was supposed to help keep costs down but they have doubled....on top of fees they get very generous funding from the private sector that state schools do not ... they do not need or want for anything yet the state schools are falling apart...

This isn't fair , this isn't equal  but not much can be doe tillthe next review in 2013


The argument goes that govt support for education should exist for ALL schools on apro-rata basis. it is equitable and fair. Means-testing has its place, but not for fundamentals or for everything. effectively penalising people for the temerity to be wealthy are the actions of a mean-spirited, spiteful and intrinsically poverty-minded government. Like it or not, the wealthy pay far more in taxes than the rest of us while receiving vastly less in benefits. in a country as rich as ours, penalising them further seems particularly nasty.
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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #14 - Sep 12th, 2010 at 8:24pm
 
Quote:
it is equitable and fair.
-longy

Ever noticed that right wingers only ever use the terms, "equitable and fair", when referring to middle and high class government welfare?

The ridiculous argument that taking funding away from the richest schools would cause a flood of Sebastians, and Samanthas into the public system is the most preposterous idea that these defenders of high class welfare call upon, and if any of them really believe that the parents who send their kids to these schools would send them to the local high school if Geelong Grammar raised its fees, you can tell "em they're dreamin'.

The fact that they believe that entrenching wealth to a minority by propping up institutions of elitist privilege is fair and equitable shows just how little concept they hold of the real meaning of those terms.
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