Australian Politics Forum - Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.

longweekend58

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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #60 - Sep 12^th, 2010 at 11:46pm

This argument is always the same and I repeat that those who complain about the successes of others are essentially condeming themseves to failure and poverty. Rather than criticising, I want to be successful and prosperous and I will see what they do that is right and emulate it. That is why I am successful. The self-made successes are those that didnt whinge or complain about the wealth of others but worked hard and did something about their situations. You can complain, whinge and moan and create all these arguments that you think are truly amazing but when it is all finished, success comes to those that strive hard. The rest look for excuses.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Equitist

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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #61 - Sep 12^th, 2010 at 11:52pm

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 11:35pm:

Equitist wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 11:32pm:

Surely, folks, the primary role of governments in education, ought to be to: overcome the relative socio-economic advantages and disadvantages experienced by children by accident of birth - rather than to reinforce or exacerbate the polarisation!?

Silly me... I thought the purpose of education was... AN EDUCATION.

kind of explains a lot, dont it!

Stop being so obtuse, Bates - you know what I'm getting at! Moreover, if you were half as good a Xtian as you purport to be, then you would admit that such is the fair and proper thing to do!

How ironic, that the overseeing architect, of the present elitist private funding scheme (and one of your heroes), once gave lip service to the phrase: "Little Children are sacred", eh!? Especially since he was personally responsible for the grossly disproportionate neglect of the education of the very same children that he was referring to as "sacred"...

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Lamenting the shift in the Australian psyche, away from the egalitarian ideal of the fair-go - and the rise of short-sighted pollies, who worship the 'Growth Fairy' and seek to divide and conquer!

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Equitist

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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #62 - Sep 12^th, 2010 at 11:56pm

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 11:46pm:

This argument is always the same and I repeat that those who complain about the successes of others are essentially condeming themseves to failure and poverty. Rather than criticising, I want to be successful and prosperous and I will see what they do that is right and emulate it. That is why I am successful. The self-made successes are those that didnt whinge or complain about the wealth of others but worked hard and did something about their situations. You can complain, whinge and moan and create all these arguments that you think are truly amazing but when it is all finished, success comes to those that strive hard. The rest look for excuses.

FFS, Bates, where do you get off...advocating a grossly-unlevel lifetime playing field and then blaming the systemically-under-privileged and neglected for failing to overcome compounding disadvantages and barriers from early childhood onwards!?

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Lamenting the shift in the Australian psyche, away from the egalitarian ideal of the fair-go - and the rise of short-sighted pollies, who worship the 'Growth Fairy' and seek to divide and conquer!

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BobH Full Member Offline Posts: 174	Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits. Reply #63 - Sep 13^th, 2010 at 3:37am I don't think government funding should go directly to the schools but rather to parents in the form of vouchers. That way it's more like a real market where one school competes with another for the parents' vouchers, and theoretically the better school wins.
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deepthought

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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #64 - Sep 13^th, 2010 at 5:27am

Equitist wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 11:32pm:

Surely, folks, the primary role of governments in education, ought to be to: overcome the relative socio-economic advantages and disadvantages experienced by children by accident of birth - rather than to reinforce or exacerbate the polarisation!?

Governments do not, nor should not engage in social engineering, at least not in a democratic country like our own.

The primary role of government in education is to ensure every child has access to one.

And the current model does exactly that.

The only correct and proper argument regarding the education of Australia's children is outcomes.

On average, throughout the country, private schools have a better academic record.

On average throughout the country, private school students cost taxpayers about half what a state school student costs.

That private schools offer different facilities, or different length swimming pools is irrelevant as far as your argument about education is concerned.

What is best for a child should be a decision for a parent to make. Not a decision that should be made by the bitter and envious peering over the school fence shouting 'obscene' while attempting to drag everyone down to their level.

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deepthought

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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #65 - Sep 13^th, 2010 at 5:43am

Binary Ninja wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 11:21pm:

no i propose if the school is elitist and does not require funding for the 18th oval they are not funded ,, other schools cant even afford air conditioning in hot summers of QLD

State school funding for 2006 / 2007 for all of Australia totaled $22 odd million plus the $300,000 or so from federal doesn't even come close

QLD : 4.3 Million
NSW : 7.5 Million
VIC : 4.7 Million

It is many billions of dollars.

Over 36 billion dollars in 2007/8 with nearly 80% of that going to state schools.

In terms of cost private school students do not get anywhere near the taxpayer contribution that a state school student receives.

That is indisputable fact so the only argument here seems to be that of the envy of those who have greater resources to top up the taxpayers contribution because they choose to for the sake of their child.

There is an awful lot of misinformation in this thread.

I hope it is not intentional.

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mantra

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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #66 - Sep 13^th, 2010 at 5:52am

Quote:

Over 36 billion dollars in 2007/8 with nearly 80% of that going to state schools.

Where did you get that rubbery percentage from? If this was the true then the private schools wouldn't be throwing such a tantrum. Private schools receive $27 billion pa in funding.

It has nothing to do with bitterness and envy - only fairness. Considering government schools are teaching two-thirds of all students nationwide, by 2012 it will receive just 36 per cent of federal education funds.

There is no equity in this and unfortunately the Labor government has committed itself to continue this funding.

Quote:

This system is so flawed that private schools are given huge increases every year regardless of their wealth or income while public schools are being denied the chance to expand the educational opportunities of student," he said.

"True equity in education can only exist when government schools set the standard for high quality education

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« Last Edit: Sep 13^th, 2010 at 6:15am by mantra »

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Binary Ninja

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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #67 - Sep 13^th, 2010 at 7:38am

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 11:46pm:

This argument is always the same and I repeat that those who complain about the successes of others are essentially condeming themseves to failure and poverty. .

No one is complaining about the success of others and you do not even know the status of other here , work wise or financial wise ... We are just pointing out the Liberal elitist mentality when it comes to funding of our schools ...

If you think 66% of the funding compared to 36% of the school funding share is fair when we have some state schools needing new buildings , repairing of the old buildings , air con , halls or libraries , computers plus other resources .... alongside the elitist schools that can only spend the government money on a 18th oval because they want for nothing you are the one who needs a slap back into reality..

When they have everything you can think of and need for nothing at all plus some get huge private sector funding on top of the exorbitant school fee's of 20,000 + per year .. They do not deserve this level or any level of funds .. We really need to get the other schools up to modern day standards both building and resources wise before these elitist schools get their 18th oval

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Suck it up Princess's Labor are in

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deepthought

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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #68 - Sep 13^th, 2010 at 9:08am

mantra wrote on Sep 13^th, 2010 at 5:52am:

Quote:

Over 36 billion dollars in 2007/8 with nearly 80% of that going to state schools.

Where did you get that rubbery percentage from? If this was the true then the private schools wouldn't be throwing such a tantrum. Private schools receive $27 billion pa in funding.

It has nothing to do with bitterness and envy - only fairness. Considering government schools are teaching two-thirds of all students nationwide, by 2012 it will receive just 36 per cent of federal education funds.

There is no equity in this and unfortunately the Labor government has committed itself to continue this funding.

Quote:

This system is so flawed that private schools are given huge increases every year regardless of their wealth or income while public schools are being denied the chance to expand the educational opportunities of student," he said.

"True equity in education can only exist when government schools set the standard for high quality education

The figures come direct from the source.

The Federal Government's 2010 Report on Government Services.

Quote:

Australian, State and Territory government recurrent expenditure on school education was $36.4 billion in 2007-08 (table 4.1). Expenditure on government schools was $28.8 billion, or 79.0 per cent of the total.

And as there is such a massive discrepancy you may care to reveal the source of your rubbery figure.

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deepthought

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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #69 - Sep 13^th, 2010 at 9:12am

mantra wrote on Sep 13^th, 2010 at 5:52am:

[quote]

It has nothing to do with bitterness and envy - only fairness. Considering government schools are teaching two-thirds of all students nationwide, by 2012 it will receive just 36 per cent of federal education funds.

There is no equity in this and unfortunately the Labor government has committed itself to continue this funding.

Is it fair that some students, according to the decision of their parents to send them to a particular school, receive about half what other students receive in taxpayer support?

How would it be that if you decided to drive a particular kind of car you had to pay twice as much for petrol (as an example)? Fairness? Or discrimination?

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deepthought

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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #70 - Sep 13^th, 2010 at 9:14am

Binary Ninja wrote on Sep 13^th, 2010 at 7:38am:

No one is complaining about the success of others and you do not even know the status of other here , work wise or financial wise ... We are just pointing out the Liberal elitist mentality when it comes to funding of our schools ...

If you think 66% of the funding compared to 36% of the school funding share is fair when we have some state schools needing new buildings , repairing of the old buildings , air con , halls or libraries , computers plus other resources .... alongside the elitist schools that can only spend the government money on a 18th oval because they want for nothing you are the one who needs a slap back into reality..

When they have everything you can think of and need for nothing at all plus some get huge private sector funding on top of the exorbitant school fee's of 20,000 + per year .. They do not deserve this level or any level of funds .. We really need to get the other schools up to modern day standards both building and resources wise before these elitist schools get their 18th oval

Are you suggesting that some taxpayers receive nothing at all for their contribution and why do you actively discriminate against their children so?

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Binary Ninja

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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #71 - Sep 13^th, 2010 at 9:49am

deepthought wrote on Sep 13^th, 2010 at 9:14am:

Are you suggesting that some taxpayers receive nothing at all for their contribution and why do you actively discriminate against their children so?

Their tax dollars you say if some even pay taxes ... I mean some of these can be earning 10 x more then me yet pay the same amount of tax what a crock .. They can see their tax dollars in road , rail and other areas ..

It is Socio Economic based setup eg...needs based and was supposed to bring down the high fee's which haven't happened .. RORT at the best by these schools and these elite schools do not require these funds which is clearly evident by the private funding they get on top of the fee's they charge and alongside the 10 swimming pools , the 18 ovals etc... As pointed out in a post some of these schools make profit 4.7 million in a year ..

Is it right for these schools to get this massive funding when other schools cant even afford to build a school hall , or a class room ..

It is a needs based system they do not need for anything as they have it all plus more so therefore by definition they do not qualify

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Suck it up Princess's Labor are in

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longweekend58

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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #72 - Sep 13^th, 2010 at 6:14pm

Equitist wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 11:56pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 12^th, 2010 at 11:46pm:

This argument is always the same and I repeat that those who complain about the successes of others are essentially condeming themseves to failure and poverty. Rather than criticising, I want to be successful and prosperous and I will see what they do that is right and emulate it. That is why I am successful. The self-made successes are those that didnt whinge or complain about the wealth of others but worked hard and did something about their situations. You can complain, whinge and moan and create all these arguments that you think are truly amazing but when it is all finished, success comes to those that strive hard. The rest look for excuses.

FFS, Bates, where do you get off...advocating a grossly-unlevel lifetime playing field and then blaming the systemically-under-privileged and neglected for failing to overcome compounding disadvantages and barriers from early childhood onwards!?

Like it or not, most failure to succeed in life can be directed at the person themselves. Some people get a better head start in life that is true and it will always be true. But the successful in life are successful because of what they DO - not their privilged or non-priviledged backgrounds. You are falling for the con that success is about what you are GIVEN. Success in life is about what YOU do about it. Thats why sucessful people come from all walks of life - because they worked at it.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #73 - Sep 13^th, 2010 at 6:18pm

mantra wrote on Sep 13^th, 2010 at 5:52am:

Quote:

Over 36 billion dollars in 2007/8 with nearly 80% of that going to state schools.

Where did you get that rubbery percentage from? If this was the true then the private schools wouldn't be throwing such a tantrum. Private schools receive $27 billion pa in funding.

It has nothing to do with bitterness and envy - only fairness. Considering government schools are teaching two-thirds of all students nationwide, by 2012 it will receive just 36 per cent of federal education funds.

There is no equity in this and unfortunately the Labor government has committed itself to continue this funding.

Quote:

This system is so flawed that private schools are given huge increases every year regardless of their wealth or income while public schools are being denied the chance to expand the educational opportunities of student," he said.

"True equity in education can only exist when government schools set the standard for high quality education

Wow are you inthe education union because you are pretty good at using statistics perversely and unethically. Yes 36% of federal funding goes to public shools BUT about 99% of state funding goes to public schools as well. any fair, rational and ethical statistic would count both sources of govt income. And the worst thing about it is that you would consider your single 'fact' trumps the truth because it is better to support your argument than to expound the truth.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Elite Private Schools Rake In The Profits.
Reply #74 - Sep 13^th, 2010 at 6:25pm

Binary Ninja wrote on Sep 13^th, 2010 at 9:49am:

deepthought wrote on Sep 13^th, 2010 at 9:14am:

Are you suggesting that some taxpayers receive nothing at all for their contribution and why do you actively discriminate against their children so?

Their tax dollars you say if some even pay taxes ... I mean some of these can be earning 10 x more then me yet pay the same amount of tax what a crock .. They can see their tax dollars in road , rail and other areas ..

It is Socio Economic based setup eg...needs based and was supposed to bring down the high fee's which haven't happened .. RORT at the best by these schools and these elite schools do not require these funds which is clearly evident by the private funding they get on top of the fee's they charge and alongside the 10 swimming pools , the 18 ovals etc... As pointed out in a post some of these schools make profit 4.7 million in a year ..

Is it right for these schools to get this massive funding when other schools cant even afford to build a school hall , or a class room ..

It is a needs based system they do not need for anything as they have it all plus more so therefore by definition they do not qualify

earn 10 times and pay the same tax?? on what plaent do you live coz it aint the same one the rest of us life. That is pure rubbish.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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