Australian Politics Forum - Ferguson serious about nuclear

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Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear
Reply #30 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 3:07pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 2:42pm:

Please delete wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 1:15pm:

mavisdavis wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 1:05pm:

Energy generation is an issue affecting all Australians. Why not discuss all potential systems? Not to do so is reminiscent of the method of presentation of ACC, anyone who isn`t a faithful believer is howled down like a medieval witch.

Al Gore isn`t the Messiah.

I simply don't understand - who is stopping anyone from discussing, arguing, or even proposing to build, any sort of power station?

The best thing that could happen re Nuclear is that some proponent put forward a concrete proposal, for Australia to discuss.

Ernie, didn't we have this discussion before???

The Australian Federal Government/s has a "NO Nuclear Policy"...

Gizmo, can you point me to the legislation, again.

Sorry to trouble ...

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gizmo_2655 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 16010 South West NSW Gender:	Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear Reply #31 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 3:09pm I'll try to find it again... Might take a few minutes..
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Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear
Reply #32 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 3:41pm

Please delete wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 3:07pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 2:42pm:

Please delete wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 1:15pm:

mavisdavis wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 1:05pm:

Energy generation is an issue affecting all Australians. Why not discuss all potential systems? Not to do so is reminiscent of the method of presentation of ACC, anyone who isn`t a faithful believer is howled down like a medieval witch.

Al Gore isn`t the Messiah.

I simply don't understand - who is stopping anyone from discussing, arguing, or even proposing to build, any sort of power station?

The best thing that could happen re Nuclear is that some proponent put forward a concrete proposal, for Australia to discuss.

Ernie, didn't we have this discussion before???

The Australian Federal Government/s has a "NO Nuclear Policy"...

Gizmo, can you point me to the legislation, again.

Sorry to trouble ...

Found it ernie...

It was in http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1291150760/all, post 168...

And is http://www.oecd-nea.org/law/legislation/australia.pdf

First section...

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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat

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Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear
Reply #33 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:03pm

Gizmo

I think I said this at the time - there is nothing specifically stopping the licensing of a NPP.

There are many restrictions on the operations of Commonwealth entities, but nothing specifically preventing the issue of a licence.

States, who are more logical entitites to think about building new Power plants, have only their own policies, which, of course, can be reversed by the government of the day.

Correct me if I'm wrong?

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Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear
Reply #34 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:33pm

bogarde73 wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 8:21am:

Martin Ferguson is demonstrating a very un-Labor like trait . . .he's talking common sense.

"Mr Ferguson said the government's own clean energy strategy was his first priority, but he was also "very much focused on what is happening outside Australia". "Other countries are making the progress in nuclear opportunities that we have to make in terms of our own clean energy," he said.

"If those clean-energy options are not proven to be viable commercially . . . there will be a far more seriously focused nuclear debate in Australia.

"If we don't make the breakthrough in the period 2015-2020, then what is the alternative for Australia?

"It doesn't matter if it's carbon capture and storage being viable, geothermal, solar thermal or whatever."

Mr Ferguson backed the right of Labor members to debate the nuclear power issue at the party's national conference in December. "Open discussion is good for the party."

Whether there are enough intelligent people in his party to have an open discussion is questionable. Still, hopefully they won't be around for too long.

The terrorists are here!!!!!

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Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear
Reply #35 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:39pm

Please delete wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:03pm:

Gizmo

I think I said this at the time - there is nothing specifically stopping the licensing of a NPP.

There are many restrictions on the operations of Commonwealth entities, but nothing specifically preventing the issue of a licence.

States, who are more logical entitites to think about building new Power plants, have only their own policies, which, of course, can be reversed by the government of the day.

Correct me if I'm wrong?

the politics is what will hoild it back and you can absolutely bet the politics of this would be HUGE. THAT is what is holding it back. First the ALP is anti-nuke, the union movement is anti-nuke, the Greens make the ALP look PRO-nuke and the liberals are lukewarm - mainly because of alack of a convincing economic argument AND the possible politicla backlash.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear
Reply #36 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:41pm

Please delete wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 10:04am:

longweekend58 wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 9:09am:

Good to see Ferguson thinking outside his labor 'box'.

Except he talks the talk, but doesn't walk the walk.

Some people want the debate - so bring it on, start, raise the issues, make some proposals, answer some questions.

Stop talking as if there was someone or something stopping a putative debate, because there isn't.

Where is the debate on why solar thermal isn't being pushed?!!?

Lots of people don't believe in 'democracy'!

More roads, anyone?!!?

Jevons Paradox anyone?!!?

There's a billion people out there without electricity and the born-lucky-hardcore-crackheads argue over a pissant flood levy!

The terrorists are here for a reason!!!!!

Harden the f*&%-up Australia!

Look at how energy inefficent the food system has become: too many middlemen!

Philosophically you could argue it's a population problem but you'd be missing a whole lot of inbetween moves there!

The dismal science doesn't care for energy efficiency: THAT LITTLE CONUNDRUM IS THE VERY HEART OF JEVONS PARADOX!

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear
Reply #37 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:42pm

longweekend58 wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:39pm:

Please delete wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:03pm:

Gizmo

I think I said this at the time - there is nothing specifically stopping the licensing of a NPP.

There are many restrictions on the operations of Commonwealth entities, but nothing specifically preventing the issue of a licence.

States, who are more logical entitites to think about building new Power plants, have only their own policies, which, of course, can be reversed by the government of the day.

Correct me if I'm wrong?

the politics is what will hoild it back and you can absolutely bet the politics of this would be HUGE. THAT is what is holding it back. First the ALP is anti-nuke, the union movement is anti-nuke, the Greens make the ALP look PRO-nuke and the liberals are lukewarm - mainly because of alack of a convincing economic argument AND the possible politicla backlash.

And still nothing stopping a debate, nor proposals by proponents.

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Andrei.Hicks Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 23818 Carlsbad, CA Gender:	Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear Reply #38 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:44pm To be fair, if there is still over 130 years worth of coal and gas left - why not keep using that? I don't see the hurry for Australia to change if it doesn't need to.
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Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear
Reply #39 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:49pm

Verge wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 10:28am:

Please delete wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 10:04am:

longweekend58 wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 9:09am:

Good to see Ferguson thinking outside his labor 'box'.

Except he talks the talk, but doesn't walk the walk.

Some people want the debate - so bring it on, start, raise the issues, make some proposals, answer some questions.

Stop talking as if there was someone or something stopping a putative debate, because there isn't.

Sadly debates are only set up to keep the minions happy. Look at the one of Afghanistan, talk about WOFTAM. Decision was made long before any debate happened.

Also, a debate on gay marriage. Whats the point in having it as the agenda is already set for a "no" with no conscious vote option on the table.

I used to think parlimentary debate was a good thing. Sadly my views have changed. I reckon we could do away with question time. No one answers the questions asked of them unless its one from their own party, and it makes us as a nation look childish and petty.

i THINK YOU ARE SAYING YOU DO NOT BELIEVE IN DEMOCRACY!

Wink

I do, but it is obviously corruptible! GO Foreign INVESTMENT and IMMIGRATION and Greed!

Oh, and metrosexuality and its hardecoredness! GO CRACK!!!! yay!! Cheesy

gO SOUR REAL ESTATE AGENTS AND THEIR PROGENY WHO GET THE GREEN LIGHT TO SELL CRACK FROM LOTS OF DIFFERENT PLACES! WHATEVER PAYS THE RENT GOES!

YAY!!!!!

SHOVE A GLASS IN YOUR MATES FACE TODAY! YOU'LL WAKE UP BETTER IN TWO DAYS! ......................................NOT!

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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BatteriesNotIncluded Gold Member Offline MediocrityNET: because people died for this! Posts: 26966	Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear Reply #40 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:51pm Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:44pm: To be fair, if there is still over 130 years worth of coal and gas left - why not keep using that? I don't see the hurry for Australia to change if it doesn't need to. dOES the Devil pay your wage?!!? (....Do you actually say this stuff in public?!!?)
Back to top	Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) IP Logged

Andrei.Hicks Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 23818 Carlsbad, CA Gender:	Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear Reply #41 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:52pm some greenies and hippies probably do think my overall employer is the devil.
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Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear
Reply #42 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:54pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 1:33pm:

Nuclear to me has always been the prime highlight of how far behind the rest of the world Australia can be at times.

We have had nuclear since I was a kid in England.

We had Oldbury, Hinckley Point A, B and now C all within distance of my hometown - completely safe, completely accident free and producing emissions-free power for the country.

But you ask Aussies, who admittedly suffer from cabin fever of being the other side of the world to everyone else, and they conjure up thoughts of Mad Max and Chernobyl.

Nuclear is safe, low emissions and sensible.

Get involved.

How much do you get paid?

How much do you get paid?
How much do you get paid?

How much do you get paid?

Seriously, we all want to know:

How much do you get paid?

How much do you get paid?
How much do you get paid?

How much do you get paid?

Cool

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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BatteriesNotIncluded Gold Member Offline MediocrityNET: because people died for this! Posts: 26966	Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear Reply #43 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:57pm Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 1:38pm: There is nothing to discuss. It should be decided to go ahead and pushed through. End. Where are you from, tosshead?
Back to top	Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) IP Logged

BatteriesNotIncluded Gold Member Offline MediocrityNET: because people died for this! Posts: 26966	Re: Ferguson serious about nuclear Reply #44 - Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 6:58pm Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 1:39pm: Sometimes I really wonder why it seems to be only me that has Australia's future interests at heart. Nuclear will move Australia into the future for goodness sake. Sorry, where?????
Back to top	Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) IP Logged