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Feminism (Read 13658 times)
JC Denton
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Feminism
Feb 15th, 2011 at 10:11am
 
it's retarded

The only thing you can say about it that remotely comes close to being good is that explicit feminists are rare and in between. This is probably because feminism is unattractive to men and is associated with ugly women so women tend to avoid becoming all out explicit feminists, but implicit feminism is everywhere.
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Re: Feminism
Reply #1 - Feb 15th, 2011 at 10:33am
 
Yes, and it's spreading.

If I see one more sports team adopt a pink shirt/ribbon/hat/socks in support of womens health, I'm gonna scream. 

I know they like to put out bogus surveys which claim things like '52% of all AFL/NRL fans are women' but we all know it's not true.
But, it's more about tapping a new demographic, to maximise profits rather than any real feminist ideals...but still, it's annoying.
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In the fullness of time...
 
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mantra
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Re: Feminism
Reply #2 - Feb 16th, 2011 at 6:07am
 
JC Denton wrote on Feb 15th, 2011 at 10:11am:
it's retarded

The only thing you can say about it that remotely comes close to being good is that explicit feminists are rare and in between. This is probably because feminism is unattractive to men and is associated with ugly women so women tend to avoid becoming all out explicit feminists, but implicit feminism is everywhere.


What's implicit feminism? I know when I first started working in the 70's - females were treated as drudges and lackeys in the workplace (and often at home also). Males were paid more (and still are), but by the 80's the results of the feminist movement were starting to infiltrate and females were gaining a more equal footing.

Of course extreme feminism is unattractive to males - it challenges their DNA, but some good things have come out of the movement. Women have a voice now - although it often drowns out that of the male.

Perhaps putting women back in the kitchen would be appealing for the male - but would it be appealing to the female who for centuries led a closeted life?

It's hard to find a compromise. What's good for the gander - should be good enough for the goose but one sex always wants to take the dominant stance.
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Amadd
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Re: Feminism
Reply #3 - Feb 16th, 2011 at 7:15am
 
It's not just females who put up with somebody taking the "dominant stance" mantra.. it happens regardless of sex.

It's easy to say "What's good for the goose is good for the gander", but realistically, that statement is not correct at all.
What's good for the goose is very often not good for the gander.

Putting a woman back in the kitchen might not be so appealing to men as one who likes to be there.
A man cannot dictate what is appealing to a woman, and visa versa (I hope).
So, if you want to demand that powerful successful women will generally appeal to men, then your barking up the wrong tree.
Most times, they're just full of crap anyway.



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Dnarever
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Re: Feminism
Reply #4 - Feb 16th, 2011 at 9:34am
 
mantra wrote on Feb 16th, 2011 at 6:07am:
I know when I first started working in the 70's - females were treated as drudges and lackeys in the workplace (and often at home also). Males were paid more (and still are), but by the 80's the results of the feminist movement were starting to infiltrate and females were gaining a more equal footing.


I would like to say that as a male I do support equality - I hope to one day be the equal of a women.

What you say about the 70's is correct and I would agree that it needed to be addressed but feel that to this point the losses to women’s position has greatly outweighed the benefits especially in terms of families.

A lot of the wage parity has come not in terms of a wage catch up but as reduction in male wages to compensate which means that the family total income has remained about the same just a different contribution mix.

(i.e. if women had stayed out of the workforce the result would have been higher male wages which would have been adequate to supported the family).

This change has led to the position where the female who previously had the choice of working or not no longer has that option (the employer basically is getting two employees for the price of one). This we now see in the dropping numbers of stay at home mothers etc.

For many mothers this is not the preferred option it is an economic necessity.

I am not against equality in the workplace it is just that I identify that we have all been ripped off by the strategy to achieve the pretence of change.

Women stomped around and burned bra’s (great decade) and the employer groups have laughed all the way to the bank.
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Dnarever
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Re: Feminism
Reply #5 - Feb 16th, 2011 at 9:40am
 
mantra wrote on Feb 16th, 2011 at 6:07am:
Perhaps putting women back in the kitchen would be appealing for the male - but would it be appealing to the female who for centuries led a closeted life?


I have no sympathy for that view but do feel for the Children who need to have their mother in their life in the early years and for the mothers who would prefer to be with their children at that time but have an economic reality to contend with.

A lot of Women have paid a high price to get about 3% in boardrooms often not on merit.
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gizmo_2655
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Re: Feminism
Reply #6 - Feb 16th, 2011 at 2:49pm
 
Didn't the actual Feminism Movement pretty much die in the 90's????
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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
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mantra
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Re: Feminism
Reply #7 - Feb 16th, 2011 at 10:12pm
 
Dnarever wrote on Feb 16th, 2011 at 9:40am:
I would like to say that as a male I do support equality - I hope to one day be the equal of a women.


Grin. You were probably born a couple of decades too late.
 
Dnarever wrote on Feb 16th, 2011 at 9:40am:
I have no sympathy for that view but do feel for the Children who need to have their mother in their life in the early years and for the mothers who would prefer to be with their children at that time but have an economic reality to contend with.

A lot of Women have paid a high price to get about 3% in boardrooms often not on merit.


I have sympathy for them as well - I returned to work when my first child was 6 months and my second 3 months. The guilt stays with you - especially when they get sick. I downsized my work to be closer to home - that was preferable to a higher wage. Many women don't get a choice.

gizmo_2655 wrote on Feb 16th, 2011 at 2:49pm:
Didn't the actual Feminism Movement pretty much die in the 90's????


I think it was over and done with by the end of the 60's - early 70's - at least the bra burning and protests were from memory. I could be wrong.

Amadd wrote on Feb 16th, 2011 at 7:15am:
So, if you want to demand that powerful successful women will generally appeal to men, then your barking up the wrong tree.
Most times, they're just full of crap anyway.


I agree to an extent Amadd, but successful women can be extremely lonely - the same can be said for a beautiful woman. Not all of course, but a good proportion of them remain untouched not through choice, but because males are scared of them.

Perhaps those females who are full of crap just want others to think they're successful. Insecurity can be a turnoff.




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Amadd
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Re: Feminism
Reply #8 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 7:21am
 
Quote:
I think it was over and done with by the end of the 60's - early 70's - at least the bra burning and protests were from memory. I could be wrong.


Oh I wish I were old enough to appreciate that era. There's no better way to judge a good set  Wink
It's a pity that it enhanced gravity and women used the free choice that they didn't think they had to wear them if they so desired. Should've shuffled through some anti-bra legislation there.

Quote:
I agree to an extent Amadd, but successful women can be extremely lonely - the same can be said for a beautiful woman. Not all of course, but a good proportion of them remain untouched not through choice, but because males are scared of them.


Could you point out to me some of those beautiful women who remain untouched?

Successful women may fall into that category I suppose, but the intimidation factor may be more to do with an attitude such as: "Oh my God, get me away from this control freak".
Most men aren't generally attracted to that type of attribute. You'd have to blame God for that.

I agree that women have their careers interrupted through having kids much moreso than men.
Nomatter what laws are in place to not discriminate against women who are likely to be starting a family, employers will always get around them somehow.
So, if it reverts back to the age old reality for women of marrying rich, then they can have their cake and eat it too.
The earning capacity of the husband is automatically assumed of the wife regardless of her actual earning capacity.
You would then assume that this wealth is passed down to the children...the most important part of the equation, and I'd question whether it's such a good thing to be promising kids future wealth without cultivating their own ability to stand on their own two feet.

A case in point:
A friend of mine settled a few years back for $1.4 million. Now he lives like a pleb. His mansion that he built for his wife and two kids tipped the scale of greed when housing prices increased dramatically.
His wife found little requirement for him to be around when her independence was settled.
Although he still had plenty of cash (less than half), he was a man shattered. He talked of suicide because of losing his dream for his family.

He came out the other side with a different attitude. Now he bangs every woman that he can. They come fluttering around with the promise of money.
He cheats, lies, and gets lots of gorgeous women, even though he's only about 5' 4" and not particularly good looking or apparently wealthy.

His monetary lifestyle is controlled by how much maintenance he is obliged to pay. Therefore, he ties up all of his money in future investment and leaves himself very little to live on.
"If $1.4 million isn't enough of a kick start for my kids, then nothing will be. I don't want them to be hand fed", he said.

It's a fair business acumen by him I suppose, but I'd sway towards not even being involved in these bs laws.ii


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« Last Edit: Feb 18th, 2011 at 2:38am by Amadd »  
 
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mantra
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Re: Feminism
Reply #9 - Feb 18th, 2011 at 4:34am
 
Quote:
Could you point out to me some of those beautiful women who remain untouched?


You see it all the time and it's even more problematic for them if they're intelligent. Saying they're untouched is an exaggeration, but there are plenty of beautiful women who remain single or just have brief, unsuccessful relationships. Males find them good to look at or have a fling with, but seem to assume that's all they're useful for. Perhaps it's just man's insecurity and they believe that the less attractive woman has more to offer in a long term relationship. She's safe because no-one will look at her.

It's assumed that less attractive women are just grateful to have found someone to love or perhaps they don't expect that much from a relationship.

You rarely see 2 beautiful people together. The beautiful man doesn't have a problem finding someone, but even they generally choose plain partners. Maybe these women cater to their egos more, demand and expect less.

Quote:
His wife found little requirement for him to be around when her independence was settled.
Although he still had plenty of cash (less than half), he was a man shattered. He talked of suicide because of losing his dream for his family.


I've seen this scenario repeated many times but the female is the loser - often traded in for a younger model. She can devote years to her family and then suddenly she wakes up finding the home she's so lovingly cared for is on the market and her partner gone.

It's far easier for a man to find solace in the opposite sex than a woman. Fortunately God made women stronger to bear these traumas.  Cheesy

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Amadd
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Re: Feminism
Reply #10 - Feb 18th, 2011 at 4:54am
 
Quote:
You see it all the time and it's even more problematic for them if they're intelligent.


No, I'd like to see some examples of these "beautiful" women who remain untouched. I'm wondering if I can touch them  Grin

Yes, I think you got it right by saying that they have brief meaningless encounters.....because that's what they want, and that's what independence is all about.

Quote:
You rarely see 2 beautiful people together. The beautiful man doesn't have a problem finding someone, but even they generally choose plain partners. Maybe these women cater to their egos more, demand and expect less.



I think you are talking crap there Mantra.
Brad pitt- Angelina Jollie? Tom Cruise- Nicole Kidman, Penelope Cruse?
Richard Burton - Liz Taylor?
Etc..etc... the list goes on.

Wtf are you talking about?i
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mantra
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Re: Feminism
Reply #11 - Feb 18th, 2011 at 5:00am
 
Amadd wrote on Feb 18th, 2011 at 4:54am:
I think you are talking crap there Mantra.
Brad pitt- Angelina Jollie? Tom Cruise- Nicole Kidman, Penelope Cruse?
Richard Burton - Liz Taylor?
Etc..etc... the list goes on.

Wtf are you talking about?


I wasn't thinking of the narcissists in Hollywood when I posted that Amadd - just your basic street people.

How many times do you hear comments from both sexes - what's he/she doing with that thing?





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Amadd
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Re: Feminism
Reply #12 - Feb 18th, 2011 at 5:19am
 
That opinion of "what's he/she doing with that thing?" abounds.

Maybe you should ask them.  Wink

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Re: Feminism
Reply #13 - Feb 19th, 2011 at 5:19pm
 
Feminism has achieved what it set out to do: voting rights, equality in the workplace, equal right to enter establishments, right to choose what's in their interest.
Because it's achieved what it set out to achieve, it now has to "invent" forms of patriarchy. Just check out the feminist Melinda Tankard Reist who claims every bad decision a woman makes is because of men. Why are women in porn she asks? Because men forced them. According this "logic" women are too weak to make their own decisions.

Check out her rants here:  http://melindatankardreist.com/
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« Last Edit: Feb 19th, 2011 at 5:26pm by Postmodern Trendoid III »  
 
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Lisa Jones
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Re: Feminism
Reply #14 - Feb 19th, 2011 at 6:42pm
 
A case in point:
A friend of mine settled a few years back for $1.4 million. Now he lives like a pleb. His mansion that he built for his wife and two kids tipped the scale of greed when housing prices increased dramatically.
His wife found little requirement for him to be around when her independence was settled.
Although he still had plenty of cash (less than half), he was a man shattered. He talked of suicide because of losing his dream for his family.

He came out the other side with a different attitude. Now he bangs every woman that he can. They come fluttering around with the promise of money.
He cheats, lies, and gets lots of gorgeous women, even though he's only about 5' 4" and not particularly good looking or apparently wealthy.


- Amadd

You do realise your friend is a dwarf.

Speaking of short men .. why is it that all the short men I've ever known (professionally and personally) appear to be afflicted by deep seated insecurity and poor self image issues?
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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

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