Australian Politics Forum - Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing

mellie

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Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Reply #105 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:00pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:49pm:

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Come on Skippy...What IS the current Liberal policy in dealing with an orphaned child??

As far as I know, this is the first time the question has come up while Tony Abbott and the current front bench was in the position to make comments...

Don't judge the current Lib team on Howard's team.....because the question never came up then either..Did it???

Unless you want us judging Gillard on Mark Lathams or Rudds team...

given she did aferall say...

"My judgement is that Mark Latham is the leadership candidate who is best positioned to develop and articulate a bold vision of Labor policy for the 21st century and I think that is what the electorate want from us."
- Ms Gillard 2003

Perhaps Mark Latham should be leading the party then?

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mellie

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Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Reply #106 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:08pm

Julia Gillard locking up more children in detention than John Howard
JULIA Gillard is locking up more than 1000 children in immigration facilities, beating the Howard Government's own "cruel" record.

And rising numbers of boatpeople are locking out thousands of asylum seekers waiting in overseas refugee camps.

The Coalition will move to guarantee places for asylum seekers who are languishing in overseas refugee camps when Parliament resumes, accusing the Prime Minister of allowing people smugglers to run Australia's refugee intake.

New figures obtained by The Sunday Mail confirm 1046 minors are being held in detention. The previous high-water mark was nearly 10 years ago when 842 children where held in detention in September, 2001, according to the Human Rights Commission.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/national/julia-gillard-locking-up-more-childr...

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Reply #107 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:11pm

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:00pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:49pm:

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Come on Skippy...What IS the current Liberal policy in dealing with an orphaned child??

As far as I know, this is the first time the question has come up while Tony Abbott and the current front bench was in the position to make comments...

Don't judge the current Lib team on Howard's team.....because the question never came up then either..Did it???

Unless you want us judging Gillard on Mark Lathams or Rudds team...

given she did aferall say...

"My judgement is that Mark Latham is the leadership candidate who is best positioned to develop and articulate a bold vision of Labor policy for the 21st century and I think that is what the electorate want from us."
- Ms Gillard 2003

Perhaps Mark Latham should be leading the party then?

Perhaps Turnbull should be leading the party?

Don't forget that thats it's only until the very last few moments of a leadership spill where everyone will still declare their loyalty to the current leader.

So please, spare us.

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chicken_lipsforme

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Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Reply #108 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:11pm

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:00pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:49pm:

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Come on Skippy...What IS the current Liberal policy in dealing with an orphaned child??

As far as I know, this is the first time the question has come up while Tony Abbott and the current front bench was in the position to make comments...

Don't judge the current Lib team on Howard's team.....because the question never came up then either..Did it???

Unless you want us judging Gillard on Mark Lathams or Rudds team...

given she did aferall say...

"My judgement is that Mark Latham is the leadership candidate who is best positioned to develop and articulate a bold vision of Labor policy for the 21st century and I think that is what the electorate want from us."
- Ms Gillard 2003

Perhaps Mark Latham should be leading the party then?

Such vision that red haired souless barren athiest witch has. Grin

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"Another boat, another policy failure from the Howard government"

Julia Gillard
Shadow Health Minister
2003.

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chicken_lipsforme

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Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Reply #109 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:21pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Thinking about it, I have only ever been to two funerals in my life.

One of them, bizarrely enough, was for a bloke I have never met.

We arrived in Townsville for a holiday and my wife's great uncle died. I ended up at his funeral. Until we got there and I saw the pic on the front, I didn't even know what he looked like.

It's a sorry state of affairs all around.

I feel sorry for these people but at the end of the day we cannot allow soft factors (as we call them in Finance management) to drive through policies which should be dictated by harder factors and economic argument.

Such is life you know. We can't have everyone in Australia.
These people need to play the hand they were dealt - not move to another table.

If you get my drift.

Good points Andrei.

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"Another boat, another policy failure from the Howard government"

Julia Gillard
Shadow Health Minister
2003.

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Reply #110 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:23pm

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:21pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Thinking about it, I have only ever been to two funerals in my life.

One of them, bizarrely enough, was for a bloke I have never met.

We arrived in Townsville for a holiday and my wife's great uncle died. I ended up at his funeral. Until we got there and I saw the pic on the front, I didn't even know what he looked like.

It's a sorry state of affairs all around.

I feel sorry for these people but at the end of the day we cannot allow soft factors (as we call them in Finance management) to drive through policies which should be dictated by harder factors and economic argument.

Such is life you know. We can't have everyone in Australia.
These people need to play the hand they were dealt - not move to another table.

If you get my drift.

Good points Andrei.

refugee convention disagrees with you.

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mellie

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Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Reply #111 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:25pm

Quote:

The Coalition will move to guarantee places for asylum seekers who are languishing in overseas refugee camps when Parliament resumes, accusing the Prime Minister of allowing people smugglers to run Australia's refugee intake..

But then the floods came, so perhaps they are busy with this right now.

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chicken_lipsforme

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Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Reply #112 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:31pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:23pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:21pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Thinking about it, I have only ever been to two funerals in my life.

One of them, bizarrely enough, was for a bloke I have never met.

We arrived in Townsville for a holiday and my wife's great uncle died. I ended up at his funeral. Until we got there and I saw the pic on the front, I didn't even know what he looked like.

It's a sorry state of affairs all around.

I feel sorry for these people but at the end of the day we cannot allow soft factors (as we call them in Finance management) to drive through policies which should be dictated by harder factors and economic argument.

Such is life you know. We can't have everyone in Australia.
These people need to play the hand they were dealt - not move to another table.

If you get my drift.

Good points Andrei.

refugee convention disagrees with you.

Well I don't know how much that really matters.
Countries don't have to abide by conventions, but do comply for other reasons, and not because they must.
And no-one says that we have to be nice to people that engage criminals to smuggle them into our country.
We could just as easy in the blink of an eye lower our refugee intake to match say NZ annual amount, and still comply with the convention.

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"Another boat, another policy failure from the Howard government"

Julia Gillard
Shadow Health Minister
2003.

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mellie

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Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Reply #113 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:32pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:23pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:21pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Thinking about it, I have only ever been to two funerals in my life.

One of them, bizarrely enough, was for a bloke I have never met.

We arrived in Townsville for a holiday and my wife's great uncle died. I ended up at his funeral. Until we got there and I saw the pic on the front, I didn't even know what he looked like.

It's a sorry state of affairs all around.

I feel sorry for these people but at the end of the day we cannot allow soft factors (as we call them in Finance management) to drive through policies which should be dictated by harder factors and economic argument.

Such is life you know. We can't have everyone in Australia.
These people need to play the hand they were dealt - not move to another table.

If you get my drift.

Good points Andrei.

refugee convention disagrees with you.

Some wonder if the Convention is still relevant in the 21st century, given it was initially drafted after WWII.

We have grown much since then, in case you hadn't noticed.
Cool

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mellie

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Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Reply #114 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:36pm

Abbott is the right man for the Job, Turnbull sat on his hands and refused to challenge anything Labor said...he was useless as a leader.

But I suppose we could get him to run errands between channel 7 and Labors press secretary if he'd like?

Given he appears to have a talent/flair for ratting on both sides of government.

He should have been a channel 7 reporter.

Grin

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Reply #115 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:38pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:23pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:21pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Thinking about it, I have only ever been to two funerals in my life.

One of them, bizarrely enough, was for a bloke I have never met.

We arrived in Townsville for a holiday and my wife's great uncle died. I ended up at his funeral. Until we got there and I saw the pic on the front, I didn't even know what he looked like.

It's a sorry state of affairs all around.

I feel sorry for these people but at the end of the day we cannot allow soft factors (as we call them in Finance management) to drive through policies which should be dictated by harder factors and economic argument.

Such is life you know. We can't have everyone in Australia.
These people need to play the hand they were dealt - not move to another table.

If you get my drift.

Good points Andrei.

refugee convention disagrees with you.

Sorry remind us again what legal obligations the UN Convention on Refugees places on the signatories?

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Vanessa Senior Member Offline Ranga Rock Chick Posts: 301 Somewhere In The Real World Gender:	Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing Reply #116 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:40pm The child is welcome in my country, and so are all the other asylum seekers.
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skippy.

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Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Reply #117 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:41pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:49pm:

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Come on Skippy...What IS the current Liberal policy in dealing with an orphaned child??

As far as I know, this is the first time the question has come up while Tony Abbott and the current front bench was in the position to make comments...

Don't judge the current Lib team on Howard's team.....because the question never came up then either..Did it???

Liberal party policy is to detain ALL REFUGEES AND PROCESS THEM OFF SHORE, they do not make allowances for children of any kind orphaned or not.

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Reply #118 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:46pm

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:32pm:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:23pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:21pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Thinking about it, I have only ever been to two funerals in my life.

One of them, bizarrely enough, was for a bloke I have never met.

We arrived in Townsville for a holiday and my wife's great uncle died. I ended up at his funeral. Until we got there and I saw the pic on the front, I didn't even know what he looked like.

It's a sorry state of affairs all around.

I feel sorry for these people but at the end of the day we cannot allow soft factors (as we call them in Finance management) to drive through policies which should be dictated by harder factors and economic argument.

Such is life you know. We can't have everyone in Australia.
These people need to play the hand they were dealt - not move to another table.

If you get my drift.

Good points Andrei.

refugee convention disagrees with you.

Some wonder if the Convention is still relevant in the 21st century, given it was initially drafted after WWII.

We have grown much since then, in case you hadn't noticed.
Cool

Oh I agree!! Don't get me wrong, had you bothered to read my opinion in the other forum (unlike your just complete utterance of newspaper cut outs) you would've noticed I called for a change to to the convention!

I should say though, I must admit I got it wrong: Not only doesn't the convention disagree with Hickory, but international law does too. See, international law prohibits a country from resending a person back to a place they are trying to escape due to a situtation that would deem them to be a refuge. Hence, Andrei's idea that you work with the hand you are dealt with isn't supported, because international law allows people to leave an area they deem dangerous.

Try again.

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Reply #119 - Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:53pm

skippy. wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:41pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:49pm:

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Come on Skippy...What IS the current Liberal policy in dealing with an orphaned child??

As far as I know, this is the first time the question has come up while Tony Abbott and the current front bench was in the position to make comments...

Don't judge the current Lib team on Howard's team.....because the question never came up then either..Did it???

Liberal party policy is to detain ALL REFUGEES AND PROCESS THEM OFF SHORE, they do not make allowances for children of any kind orphaned or not.

Agreed.
And I support it.

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