I am going to have to do a backflip. I don't think there is any point of us staying there any longer.
We went there in the aftermath of 9/11 for the reasons everybody knows.
And we all are still there because it has been recognised that this is a primeval state full of primeval people who have to be helped to change.
But they are not going to. We will have to abandon the women to their fate. We will have to let the Taliban come back as they surely will. We will have to let the opium trade flourish again (has it ever reduced?)
And we will have to let it become a base for terrorism again which it might well do.
What other choice is there? Stay there for a hundred years? Would it change in a hundred years?
I doubt it.
You can't win them all.

PS whatever you do afterwards, don't go to Bali.

bogarde73 wrote on Jun 1^st, 2011 at 3:28pm:


Actually the Taliban virtually wiped out the opium trade.
Anyone found growing poppies was executed because drugs are against the "Prophets" teachings.
The conspricacy nut in me half thinks that's why the Yanks went in, the CIA needed its fields of gold again to fund their operations.

bogarde73 wrote on Jun 1^st, 2011 at 3:28pm:


Bullshit, we cannot afford to give Al Quaeda a safe haven. We cannot afford to give Islamofascists a huge moral boost, especially at a time when their resolve around the world is wavering. We cannot allow these guys to have died in vain.

This is not what the soldiers want, to be let down by the woosies at home when they're risking their all doing a job they love doing and are doing well.

The Russians weren't fighting a ramshackle taliban caught between a rock and a hard place. They were fighting a mujahadeen augmented by a huge influx of wahabists from Arabia and fighting a proxy war between the USA and Russia. What needs to happen is to get the USA out of command and fight the war with European and Russians, the latter are more than willing.  Connect the dots.

http://www.eurasianet.org/node/63421

Ive fast lost patience in Afghanistan.

The Yanks tanked that operation they day they pull troops to send them to Iraq for oil.

From that point it was NEVER going to be even remotely viable.

WASHINGTON -- As Americans breathe a sigh of relief over finally filing the returns on what they owe (or are owed from) Uncle Sam this Tax Day, the progressive group Rethink Afghanistan wants them to consider how much of their money is funding the war in Afghanistan, now in its 10th year.   

The group, a project of the Brave New Foundation, has created a Cost of War calculator, allowing Americans to figure out how much of their tax dollars are going toward the war, based on their income and filing status.

For example, a single person making $40,000 in 2010 essentially paid $1,694 for the war. A married couple filing jointly and earning a combined $100,000 has $4,757 of their tax dollars going toward the effort.

The United States is spending more than $100 billion a year in Afghanistan, amounting to about $2 billion a week.   

The Defense Department received $513 billion in funding in the FY 2011 continuing resolution, approximately $5 billion above last year's level. Another $158 billion is provided for overseas contingency operations (emergency funding). The war in Afghanistan will receive $108 billion of that funding, while the war in Iraq will receive $50 billion.

Last week, a bipartisan group of lawmakers, along with groups like the Liberty Coalition and Sojourners, participated in an event hosted by Rethink Afghanistan on Capitol Hill highlighting the cost of war.

"We can't pay our bills here, yet we're spending $8 billion a month in Afghanistan," Rep. Walter Jones (R-N.C.), one of the event's panelists, recently told The New York Times. "I don't know what our country is trying to accomplish. History says Afghanistan will never be a nation. It will be a country of tribes. We're wearing out the troops and spending money we don't have."   

The question is where are the Taliban getting there seemingly bottomless pit of money from. The answer must be Pakistan. We need to take out Pakistan before any real progress in Afghanistan can be made. Screw Pakistan, I honestly wouldn't lose a second of sleep if India nuked that terrorist cesspit into ash.

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 1^st, 2011 at 4:25pm:



If drugs are against the prophets teaching why does the leader(s) of Iran the Ayatollah Ali Khameni have an opium addiction?

http://kabulpress.org/my/spip.php?article3733

Have a look at Kabul Press you might learn how corrupt Karzai is.

The Quran says alcohol is alright if you know so much about Islam tell us why it is haram
http://quran.com/16/67
Click on Pickthall,Yusef Ali and Shakir and read all 3

I want to say two more things about this. Three in fact.

First, I don't like quitting cods, but I don't think these people can be helped and it will never end. Why sacrifice lives in a futile cause.
And why waste more money on them . . .$5 billion so far.
Maybe they have been taught at least not to make trouble for us again by hosting mischief makers.
Second, I sympathise with Tony Bradshaw's views. Pakistan is at the root of a lot of the trouble. But we can't "take them out". We can sever all relations with them though.
Third, If we can't bring these people into the modern world - and I think that;s clear now - at least we can refuse to have any more of them here. If they won't change at home, what makes anybody think they will change their outlook when they're here and not just be trouble for us. They already have been.
Where will we find a govt with the guts to round these people up and pack them off back where they came from. Give me the power and I'd do it.