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What's the Real truth? (Read 29114 times)
perceptions_now
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #150 - Jun 20th, 2011 at 8:13pm
 
I think now may be an appropriate time, to re-post an article, I original wrote in late 2006. The basics are still the same, although with a few refinements in the latest version, back in February, 2011.  
========================================
What is the Motor of the World and why is it stopping?

Let me say from the start, that the world and its financial system are now more interlocked than any other time in history and that the butterfly effect is very real. We have also stepped into the unknown, into a new paradigm and there is no going back!

What is the Motor of the World?
There will be many opinions, some will say China is now the motor of the world, some will say modern computers, some the US, some Oil, some this and some that. The truth is there are nearly 7 Billion opinions and most opinions would be at least partially true, given their particular time frame & perspective.

It would be correct to say that China has been a very significant force in global economics, certainly in the last 10-15 years. Certainly, the impact of computers and related electronics, over the last 50 years, has truly moved the world.

And, over 150 years, the US and Oil have been inseparable, as the driving forces of the global economy. Such a large part of the global economy today can be traced back to the US and it’s partnership with Oil.

But, in back of everything over the last 200 years particularly, has been the steady and un-relenting growth in population that has always been the major Driver or the engine of economic growth, at national and global levels.

However, that motor is stopping!

How did we get here?
Population Growth & Aging -
It took all of history, up to the year 1800 AD, for humanity to reach one Billion people. Baby Boomers had their origins in the population explosion that started during the Great Depression; they were a large part of our 3rd Billion and also part of the 4th Billion.

The population explosion really took off in 1945, it Peaked in 1956, reaching a Total Fertility Rate (TFR) of just under 5 children per woman, then levelled out to 1964, before slowing ever since, to a TFR of about 2.5.
Now, closing in on 7 Billion people, we are starting to exhaust the earth’s capacity to support human species and many others.

A continuation of past growth would have seen the global population increase to 10 Billion by 2050 and 20 Billion by 2150. Clearly, that is not likely to happen, as the TFR approaches the replacement level of 2.1 and the Global population growth continues to slow, the indications are that the global population will actually start to fall, within the next 20-30 years.

Why, because in addition to the already declining Fertility rate, we are now bumping into immovable objects, such as Peak Oil, Climate Change and Peak Food Production & fresh Water restrictions, all driven by the Global population and because most of the largest generation in history, the Baby Boomers, will die within the next 20-30 years.

With a few relatively minor interruptions, the period 1945 to 2005 was the greatest Global economic BOOM in history. In particular, the period 1995-2005 was a Growth Tsunami, driven by the Peak earning and spending capacity of US & other Global Baby Boomer consumers and the Peak Supply of Cheap & easily accessible Energy (Oil).

In addition, around the same time, technology drove massive gains in productivity; financial leverage multiplied tremendously from the historical 10/1 to 30/1 & above and interest rates in the US remained artificially low, for far too long, following the events of 9/11.
This was a perfect storm, for making money.

Link (Dr. Albert A. Bartlett - Arithmetic, Population, and Energy) –
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=9B70AC68E1D2AA54&search_query=Dr.+Albert...
Link (The Crash Course – Chris Martenson) -
http://www.chrismartenson.com/crashcourse
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perceptions_now
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #151 - Jun 20th, 2011 at 8:14pm
 
What is the Motor of the World and why is it stopping? (Cont)


Peak Oil -
To make life more interesting, our number one Global Energy source (Oil) Oil also went from $10 a barrel, to nearly $150, in just a few short years. Whilst there may have been some external influences, the main reason for this huge increase was Supply & Demand.

And, while there are arguments for Abiotic Oil, Coal & Gas, there are drawbacks for these "replacements" and in some cases the source may not even exist (Abiotic), whilst other sources may actually create more problems than they solve, including that the future EROEI (Energy Return On Energy Invested) will continue to shrink and Energy costs (as a % of the National & Global Economy) continue to increase, both of which lessen the likelihood of the Economy staying in a positive growth mode.

Oil prices then retreated to levels lower than $40 a barrel, in expectation of a substantial fall in oil usage, arising from a slowing economy and the Oil price now seeks a new balance, between declining Oil production and the level of Economic Activity, with prices fluctuating in the $70-$80 range.

Transport, Plastics, Medicines, Chemicals, the list is almost endless, that are dependent on oil, no wonder the US has had such a long lasting love affair.

When historians look back, they really will say, "did they just burn all that oil".

Link – (The Inevitable Peaking of World Oil Production by Robert L. Hirsch)
http://www.acus.org/docs/051007-Hirsch_World_Oil_Production.pdf
Link (Dr. Albert A. Bartlett - Arithmetic, Population, and Energy) –
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=9B70AC68E1D2AA54&search_query=Dr.+Albert...
Link (The Crash Course – Chris Martenson) -
http://www.chrismartenson.com/crashcourse
Link (The Converging Crisis Ecology, Energy & Economics by Paul Cehurka) -
http://www.paulchefurka.ca/ConvergingCrisis.pdf
Link (PEAK OIL: The Eventual End of the Oil Age by Jonah J. Ralston -
https://www.msu.edu/~ralsto11/PeakOil.pdf
Other Links -
http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/cfapps/ipdbproject/iedindex3.cfm?tid=5&pid=53&aid=1&cid...
https://www.msu.edu/~ralsto11/PeakOil.pdf

Climate Change -
Climate is our greatest asset, but Climate changes are also starting to impact us now, as can be seen in the lack of water in some parts of the planet, increased storm severity in others and the melting of Glaciers and possibly the Polar Ice Caps.

Despite recent furores about some scientists, there is general agreement amongst the great bulk of scientists That Climate Change is indeed happening & to some extent it is “Caused by Man”, which begs the question, do we have the right to play Russian Roulette, with the survival of future generations and indeed the human species.

We have already passed major climate tipping points, the planets climate is set to get very difficult for humanity, including a possible new ice age. Sure, we can take the chance that the scientists have it wrong, but then if their correct, this could be a massive Extinction Event.
NOAA Link –
http://www.climate.gov/#climateWatch
NOAA Mauna Loa CO2 Link –
http://www.esrl.noaa.gov/gmd/ccgg/trends/
NASA Link –
http://www.giss.nasa.gov/research/briefs/

Peak Food Production –
With the total global population still bursting at the seams, for the time being, we must make sure everything possible is done to ensure food production is provided for the increasing population, right?

Wrong, instead we are diverting large parts of agricultural production away from food production and into the production of fuels, as a replacement for Oil.

Even if we wanted to boost Food production, Climate Change is and will continue to, raise serious questions on our present and future capacity, to deliver enough food, to keep the surging global population fed.  
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #152 - Jun 20th, 2011 at 8:15pm
 
What is the Motor of the World and why is it stopping? (Cont)


Where are we now and where to next?
Whilst the sub-prime debacle in the US has its own distinct origins, including NINJA mortgages (Greed), it has highlighted falling Real Estate values and New Housing starts, which has separate Demographic origins and had been declining for some time.

In economic terms, the primary driver of the real global economy is consumer demand. The largest demand driver is the 45-55 age group, primarily in the USA, due their large earning and spending capacity.

Demographic levels are already being re-shaped, as nearly two Billion Baby Boomers have commenced a 20 year transition from being big spenders, to big Retirement savers, to thrifty Retirees, before leaving us forever, in increasing numbers.

This massive aging of the global population is changing the dynamics of the world economy, with the bulk of Boomer wealth likely to pass on before they do and as the generations following behind the Baby Boomers, are relatively less in numbers.

In particular, Real Estate and New Housing markets, particularly in the US & Europe have already fallen and continue to do so, arising from a lowering in demand, led by thrifty and retiring Boomers.
Link to Aging Population issues -
http://ezinearticles.com/?The-Economys-Greatest-Depression-Downturn-Ever-Is-Now-...

As if housing issues were not enough, the aging process will also introduce some $50 Trillion in unfunded Health and Social Security costs, in the USA.

So, in the short to medium term, we will see:
1) Constraints, both in the Supply of & Demand for, Oil.
2) A massive de-leveraging of financial markets, including some $800 Trillion in the Derivatives markets.
3) Government Budget deficits are set to continue to expand, due to the Global Debt crisis.
4) Massive increases Health and Social Security Costs, again expanding deficits.
5) Problems arising from Climate Change and Food production.

You can guess what awaits with Taxes, in the near future, to pay for past indulgences. This will happen, irrespective of what side of politics is in power.

And, with Debt levels already at historical highs, we will see past fixes, either not able to be used or possibly set to cause more harm, than help.

Now, we are just past the Peak of a once in history Population Growth Mega Cycle.
Now, the reality looms of a slowing economic future, as reflected in stock markets and oil prices, next the Economic Growth Fairy dies.

Now, the perfect storm will reappear, this time as a Cat 5 in financial demolition!


What Futures await?
The very basis of modern life will be shaken, the magnitude of the quake, will be 9.9.
Whether we arrived at this situation, by accident or design, we are never likely to know, although events suggest a mixture of both, seems probable.
So, the design has now been set in motion and we now enter the 2nd quarter, of the highest stakes game, ever played!

Unlike the Great Depression, we are now truly between a rock and a really hard place.

The truth is, there is no magical, Hollywood, easy fix.
The truth is, there is no pot of gold at the end of the Kansas rainbow.
The truth is, we are in DEAP Sh!t –
Debt (Global) –
Debt is going into unknown territory, in many countries, heading north towards 100% of GDP & beyond!
Energy Decline (Global) – All the easy to get, cheap Energy has already gone, what’s left is the other side of the Hubert’s Curve.
Aging Population (Global) – The Employment Participation ratio has commenced declining, as Boomers first retire, then die, 2 Billion of them.
Population Decline (Global) – the rate of growth is slowing & the total will actually start to decline, within 20-30 years.

Had corrective decisions been made earlier, then it may have been possible to reduce some of the worst side effects, regrettably, that did not happen.

Regrettably, if we opt for a better now, then future generations will pay for our mistakes and indulgence.
That reasoning is not acceptable and can not be allowed to succeed!

As we look to the future, we need to look thru different eyes, thru different thought processes.
The days of Smoke & Mirrors, of Shock & Awe, of the Desire to Acquire & Retain Power, of Self interest, at the expense of societal interest, must end.

Can we make those changes, the answer is YES!
Will the required changes be made? Now there, is a $64 Trillion question!

The answers will come on these boards and others, in other forums, in politics, in business and the answers will need to come quickly.    

There are discussions that must take place and Mindsets that must change; the time has come to look beyond borders and elections.

Good luck & watch the Debt!

=====================================
I can see it now, LW's response is, I'm right (which he definitely is, of centre) & your wrong.
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #153 - Jul 1st, 2011 at 8:03pm
 
What Insurance Companies Know About Climate Change That You Don’t


While climate zombies in Congress are lurching in lockstep toward environmental catastrophe, the insurance industry has been scrambling to act. It’s well past time we listened to what they have to say. Insofar as the Republican party is the party of business, they might want to lend an ear as well.

Insurance companies have a vested interest in reducing the risks of climate change. Like scientists and the military, they’re used to dealing with and planning for uncertainty. As scientists have made clear, climate change is cranking up the dial on extreme weather. Over the last 30 years, catastrophic economic losses have been rising (pdf) with the global temperature, which chops into insurance firms’ profits. With landscapes and livelihoods being sucked into the extreme weather vortex, insurance firm executives – especially in Europe – are getting the message.

The insurance industry is all about risk assessment and capital accumulation. Katrina-like catastrophes lurk on the discernibly warmer horizon, giving insurance companies a real deal incentive to slice against the zeitgeist of denial. As Frank Nutter, president of the Reinsurance Association of America, told the select committee on energy independence and global warming in 2007, “The insurance industry’s financial interest is inter-dependent with climate and weather.”

Over the last five years, the insurance industry has become increasingly proactive on climate change, in terms of both underwriting and investment. Reinsurance companies – essentially firms that insure the insurers to manage and defray risk – have taken the lead. In September 2007, insurance firms formed ClimateWise in order to reduce economic risk associated with climate change.

That same year, Andrew Castaldi, head of the catastrophe risk unit for the Swiss Re America Corp, testified to the Senate’s homeland security and governmental affairs committee, “We believe unequivocally that climate change presents an increasing risk to the world economy and social welfare.”

In 2008, Ernst & Young – not known for having to peel bark from their sweater vests after intensive treehugging sessions – named climate change the number one risk to the insurance industry. In a 2009 report, Lloyd’s of London warned of climate change contributing to “resource-driven conflicts; economic damage and risk to coastal cities and infrastructure; loss of territory and resultant border disputes; environmentally induced migration; government fragility; political radicalisation; tensions over energy supplies and pressures on international governance”.

And this month, while US media fail to consistently connect the dots between weather patterns and climate change, Munich Re – the world’s biggest reinsurer – stated plainly, “weather extremes such as the massive floods experienced by China since early June are due to the advance of climate change.” While acknowledging factors like population growth and rising property values – especially in risk-prone areas – Munich Re wrote, “it would seem that the growing number of weather-related catastrophes can only be explained by climate change.”

Unlike the “poisonous polluters and rightwing ideologues” Al Gore recently skewered in Rolling Stone, the insurance industry is perfectly willing to rely on the scientific consensus as put forth by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change. Citing the IPCC, Munich Re noted, “The view that weather extremes are more frequent and intense due to global warming is in keeping with current scientific findings.” Meanwhile, on the investment side, Munich Re is jacking up its investments in renewable energy assets and operations, while assigning SunPower Corp to develop a massive, 2.5 megawatt solar power system for its offices in New Jersey.

Let’s be clear: insurance firms aren’t altruists; they’re capitalists. A rise in extreme weather means a fall in their profits. This is hardball economics based on risk analysis, not save-the-polar-bears stuff.


European reinsurers have taken the lead in this outburst of rational behaviour, with their counterparts in the US lagging in their wake. In Europe, insurance companies have pressured their governments to push policies that mitigate the human role in climate change, while in the US, insurance firms have tended to focus more on extreme weather events and how to adapt to them.

Quite logically, property insurance companies are taking the lead, with life and health insurance firms trailing behind. Reuters recently reported the spate of tornadoes in the US midwest will cost insurers more than bn, while the twister in Joplin, Missouri alone will spawn a bn bill. Insurance companies are perfectly willing to pass along premium hikes to consumers, but they’re also up for concerted CO2 regulation that could eventually assuage the pocks on their profits.

The insurance industry can only take us so far. We need political leadership – and a vibrant, fully-mobilised social movement pushing that leadership – to make it the rest of the way. With climate change perilously approaching irreversibility, our time is running out.

Link -
http://www.psfk.com/2011/06/why-the-insurance-industry-gets-climate-change.html
=========================
After some 40 years in the insurance sector, I agree with the trust of the article!
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #154 - Jul 1st, 2011 at 9:46pm
 
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #155 - Jul 1st, 2011 at 10:25pm
 
Here is a reply to the PDF linked to by Progressiveslol.
The person addressing the claims accuses D'aleo, the PDF's author, as posting irrelevant, contradictory, and plain wrong, information, in his work, and is classified by his critic as a "pseudo-skeptic", presenting yet more of the same denialist flotsam we have come to expect.

Posting graphs, and making bold statements in scientific language is very much the stuff of this whole issue, but the difference between a solitary skeptic just putting all his ideas and opinions down in an anti-warming manifesto, does not earn the same need for serious consideration, as work that is peer reviewed, where the data is checked and tested by other scientists, and deemed as credible.

It goes back to trust, and the skeptics still keep asking that we believe the unfounded and unverified opinions of lone opponents to the AGW debate, yet continue to dismiss as false, and unreliable, all the highly scrutinised, and commonly accepted results of the serious climate scientists.

Do they not recognise how perverse that makes their claims of seeking the truth look?

Work that is highly scrutinised, and thoroughly checked, and then accepted by the scientific community, is not to be trusted, but a collection of unsupported, and untested, or if tested, proven false, objections from an individual skeptic, is accepted by them as obvious truth.

These psuedo skeptics are not really looking for truth at all, are they?
No, they are just looking for validation for their opinions, and the bar they set so high for legitimate scientists, is removed completely for any they hope can provide some of that validation for them.

Truth?
They can't handle the truth.(apologies to Jack Nicholson)
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OOPS!!! My Karma, ran over your Dogma!
 
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #156 - Jul 1st, 2011 at 10:54pm
 
mozzaok wrote on Jul 1st, 2011 at 10:25pm:
Here is a reply to the PDF linked to by Progressiveslol.
The person addressing the claims accuses D'aleo, the PDF's author, as posting irrelevant, contradictory, and plain wrong, information, in his work, and is classified by his critic as a "pseudo-skeptic", presenting yet more of the same denialist flotsam we have come to expect.

Posting graphs, and making bold statements in scientific language is very much the stuff of this whole issue, but the difference between a solitary skeptic just putting all his ideas and opinions down in an anti-warming manifesto, does not earn the same need for serious consideration, as work that is peer reviewed, where the data is checked and tested by other scientists, and deemed as credible.

It goes back to trust, and the skeptics still keep asking that we believe the unfounded and unverified opinions of lone opponents to the AGW debate, yet continue to dismiss as false, and unreliable, all the highly scrutinised, and commonly accepted results of the serious climate scientists.

Do they not recognise how perverse that makes their claims of seeking the truth look?

Work that is highly scrutinised, and thoroughly checked, and then accepted by the scientific community, is not to be trusted, but a collection of unsupported, and untested, or if tested, proven false, objections from an individual skeptic, is accepted by them as obvious truth.

These psuedo skeptics are not really looking for truth at all, are they?
No, they are just looking for validation for their opinions, and the bar they set so high for legitimate scientists, is removed completely for any they hope can provide some of that validation for them.

Truth?
They can't handle the truth.(apologies to Jack Nicholson)

I dont ask anything of you. Take it as you will and have.
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #157 - Jul 1st, 2011 at 11:28pm
 
progressiveslol wrote on Jul 1st, 2011 at 9:46pm:


I wonder why doesn't Mr. D'Aleo submit his critique for review in a science journal, and not by a free market think tank?

Oh, that's right, because it's a hodge-podge of long discredited denier talking points and hasn't been published to convince scientists rather to convince ignorant plebes like proglulz!
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Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11th, 2011 at 11:23am:
So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&&
 
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #158 - Jul 2nd, 2011 at 1:23am
 
stryder wrote on Jun 1st, 2011 at 11:52pm:
Quote:
What if what if. What are the costs to our children.


You see the Climate Change nazis CANT WIN THE CARBON TAX DEBATE BECAUSE AFTER MONTHS OF PROPAGANDA USING DUBIOUS AND VAGUE SCIENCE, THE MAJORITY OF THE AUSTRALIAN PEOPLE STILL DONT WANT THE CARBON TAX

So what do they do, use the last resort and scaremonger people into submission which looks like it will never work,

THANK GOD, PEOPLE ARE MORE INTELIGIENT THAN THESE CLIMATE CHANGE NAZIS.


It's only vague because you refuse to believe it. To hell with Queenslanders who right now haven't got a home let alone a chance to tell you you're a tool.
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #159 - Jul 2nd, 2011 at 1:54am
 
GoddyofOz wrote on Jul 2nd, 2011 at 1:23am:
stryder wrote on Jun 1st, 2011 at 11:52pm:
Quote:
What if what if. What are the costs to our children.


You see the Climate Change nazis CANT WIN THE CARBON TAX DEBATE BECAUSE AFTER MONTHS OF PROPAGANDA USING DUBIOUS AND VAGUE SCIENCE, THE MAJORITY OF THE AUSTRALIAN PEOPLE STILL DONT WANT THE CARBON TAX

So what do they do, use the last resort and scaremonger people into submission which looks like it will never work,

THANK GOD, PEOPLE ARE MORE INTELIGIENT THAN THESE CLIMATE CHANGE NAZIS.


It's only vague because you refuse to believe it. To hell with Queenslanders who right now haven't got a home let alone a chance to tell you you're a tool.

Pleeeeaase. QLD have nothing to do with CO2
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #160 - Jul 2nd, 2011 at 2:04am
 
progressiveslol wrote on Jul 2nd, 2011 at 1:54am:
GoddyofOz wrote on Jul 2nd, 2011 at 1:23am:
stryder wrote on Jun 1st, 2011 at 11:52pm:
Quote:
What if what if. What are the costs to our children.


You see the Climate Change nazis CANT WIN THE CARBON TAX DEBATE BECAUSE AFTER MONTHS OF PROPAGANDA USING DUBIOUS AND VAGUE SCIENCE, THE MAJORITY OF THE AUSTRALIAN PEOPLE STILL DONT WANT THE CARBON TAX

So what do they do, use the last resort and scaremonger people into submission which looks like it will never work,

THANK GOD, PEOPLE ARE MORE INTELIGIENT THAN THESE CLIMATE CHANGE NAZIS.


It's only vague because you refuse to believe it. To hell with Queenslanders who right now haven't got a home let alone a chance to tell you you're a tool.

Pleeeeaase. QLD have nothing to do with CO2


If those who you despise so much are to be believed, QLD has everything to do with CO2.
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"A Conservative is a man who just sits and thinks, mostly just sits." - Woodrow Wilson.

True Patriotism is serving your country all the time, and serving your Politicians when they deserve it.
 
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #161 - Jul 2nd, 2011 at 2:06am
 
GoddyofOz wrote on Jul 2nd, 2011 at 2:04am:
progressiveslol wrote on Jul 2nd, 2011 at 1:54am:
GoddyofOz wrote on Jul 2nd, 2011 at 1:23am:
stryder wrote on Jun 1st, 2011 at 11:52pm:
Quote:
What if what if. What are the costs to our children.


You see the Climate Change nazis CANT WIN THE CARBON TAX DEBATE BECAUSE AFTER MONTHS OF PROPAGANDA USING DUBIOUS AND VAGUE SCIENCE, THE MAJORITY OF THE AUSTRALIAN PEOPLE STILL DONT WANT THE CARBON TAX

So what do they do, use the last resort and scaremonger people into submission which looks like it will never work,

THANK GOD, PEOPLE ARE MORE INTELIGIENT THAN THESE CLIMATE CHANGE NAZIS.


It's only vague because you refuse to believe it. To hell with Queenslanders who right now haven't got a home let alone a chance to tell you you're a tool.

Pleeeeaase. QLD have nothing to do with CO2


If those who you despise so much are to be believed, QLD has everything to do with CO2.

Well they are not to be believed on their doom and gloom scaremongering. Even the idiots all faithful IPCC says the weather events have nothing to do with CO2, so far. The guy at weatheraction even predicted the events.
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #162 - Jul 2nd, 2011 at 2:15pm
 
progressiveslol wrote on Jul 2nd, 2011 at 2:06am:
GoddyofOz wrote on Jul 2nd, 2011 at 2:04am:
progressiveslol wrote on Jul 2nd, 2011 at 1:54am:
GoddyofOz wrote on Jul 2nd, 2011 at 1:23am:
stryder wrote on Jun 1st, 2011 at 11:52pm:
Quote:
What if what if. What are the costs to our children.


You see the Climate Change nazis CANT WIN THE CARBON TAX DEBATE BECAUSE AFTER MONTHS OF PROPAGANDA USING DUBIOUS AND VAGUE SCIENCE, THE MAJORITY OF THE AUSTRALIAN PEOPLE STILL DONT WANT THE CARBON TAX

So what do they do, use the last resort and scaremonger people into submission which looks like it will never work,

THANK GOD, PEOPLE ARE MORE INTELIGIENT THAN THESE CLIMATE CHANGE NAZIS.


It's only vague because you refuse to believe it. To hell with Queenslanders who right now haven't got a home let alone a chance to tell you you're a tool.

Pleeeeaase. QLD have nothing to do with CO2


If those who you despise so much are to be believed, QLD has everything to do with CO2.

Well they are not to be believed on their doom and gloom scaremongering. Even the idiots all faithful IPCC says the weather events have nothing to do with CO2, so far. The guy at weatheraction even predicted the events.


You and Monckton would be good mates, but both of you, don't know Jack Schitt!
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #163 - Jul 8th, 2011 at 6:16pm
 
Jobs, not climate change, priority for Latrobe Valley


AS PRIME Minister Julia Gillard ponders where to kick off her carbon tax spruiking tour of the nation next week, it's possible she'll consider visiting Victoria's coalmining heartland, the Latrobe Valley. She can be sure its largely unimpressed citizens will be waiting for her.

''I'd love for Julia to commence her campaign on Sunday here in the valley,'' Morwell furniture store owner Jerry Van Dyke said. ''It'd be terrific. She'd get a rousing reception for sure.''

There is plenty of fear and loathing of the carbon tax in the Latrobe Valley, which is unsurprising given most of its 74,000 citizens earn a living either directly or indirectly through the coal industry.

Mr Van Dyke said yesterday that he was ''definitely not'' in favour of a carbon tax: ''Not if you live in the valley, I don't think many people would be.''

The Gillard government promises to compensate about seven out of every 10 households to ease the transition to a low-carbon economy. But Mr Van Dyke said cash handouts would never fully compensate for lost jobs.

''The majority of our customers would work in electricity generation in one way or another, they're the biggest customer here, so we're very reliant on them,'' said Mr Van Dyke, who described himself as ''a little bit of a sceptic'' about climate change.

Audiologist Vijay Packery said he supported the majority scientific view that climate change was real and a threat to future generations, but many of his patients were much more fearful about the tax's perceived threat to their jobs.

''Jobs will be in jeopardy,'' Mr Packery said.

''I get a lot of clients from the power stations. They are concerned about rising prices in general. The carbon tax just adds to it.''

The full details of the carbon tax will be released on Sunday in Canberra, after which Ms Gillard promises to wear out her shoes travelling around Australia explaining it to people.

Bookshop manager Luke Dearlove offered a lone vote of confidence in Ms Gillard among the people The Age spoke to in Morwell, although he said the Prime Minister was ''probably committing political suicide'' over the issue.

''Maybe later we'll say she's a good person to stand up and make this happen rather than looking to the short-term political advantage the way [Opposition Leader] Tony Abbott seems to be,'' Mr Dearlove, who favours a price on carbon, said.

He was less convinced about the merits of compensation.

''I don't understand what compensation is for if the whole point is to put pain on people so they change,'' he said.

''If you're going to compensate big business or polluters for polluting then it's pointless.''

Mother Kayelene Rundle, who is on a pension, said she believed in climate change but feared the ''stupid'' tax would increase living costs for people already struggling to pay bills.

''I'd like to ask [Ms Gillard] why she lied and took back what she said she'd do,'' Ms Rundle said.

Link -
http://www.smh.com.au/environment/climate-change/jobs-not-climate-change-priorit...
=========================
There are two major factors that motivate most people, more than other factors -
1) Self interest
2) Now, not later.

That said, let me make a couple of obeservations -
1) The Carbon Tax, is primarily a TAX.
2) The Carbon Tax has zero chance of substantially impacting Australia's trend, in terms of Climate impact, let alone making any difference on a Global Scale.
3) Taxes, under any guise/name & no matter which Political Party is in power, will need to increase substantially, as a percentage of GDP, over the next 10-20 years, to try to cope with the costs of an Aging Population, the increased costs that are inherent as the Australian & Global Economy transition away from Fossil Fuel Energy and as the Global Economy transitions away from an Economy deeply mired in Debt!
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perceptions_now
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Re: What's the Real truth?
Reply #164 - Jul 8th, 2011 at 7:35pm
 
The Great Recession, Part II


The world could be headed for another economic disaster if we continue to listen to free-market ideologues.
By Joseph E. Stiglitz

Just a few years ago, a powerful ideology—the belief in free and unfettered markets—brought the world to the brink of ruin.
Even in its heyday, from the early 1980s until 2007, American-style deregulated capitalism brought greater material well-being only to the very richest of the richest country of the world. Indeed, over the course of this ideology's 30-year ascendance, most Americans saw their incomes decline or stagnate.

Moreover, output growth in the United States was not economically sustainable. With so much of U.S. national income going to so few, growth could continue only through consumption financed by a mounting pile of debt.

I was among those who hoped that, somehow, the financial crisis would teach Americans (and others) a lesson about the need for greater equality, stronger regulation, and a better balance between the market and government. Alas, that has not been the case. On the contrary, a resurgence of right-wing economics, driven by ideology and special interests, once again threatens the global economy—or at least the economies of Europe and North America, where these ideas continue to flourish.

In the United States, this right-wing resurgence, whose adherents evidently seek to repeal the basic laws of math and economics, is threatening to force a default on the national debt. If Congress mandates expenditures that exceed revenues, there will be a deficit, and that deficit has to be financed. Rather than balancing the benefits of each government expenditure program with the costs of raising taxes to finance those benefits, the right seeks to use a sledgehammer—not allowing the national debt to increase forces expenditures to be limited to taxes.

This leaves open the question of which expenditures get priority. If expenditures to pay interest on the national debt are not prioritized, a default is inevitable. Moreover, to cut back expenditures now, in the midst of a crisis brought on by free-market ideology, would inevitably prolong the downturn.

A decade ago, in the midst of an economic boom, the United States faced a surplus so large that it threatened to eliminate the national debt.
Unaffordable tax cuts and wars, a major recession, and soaring health care costs
—fueled in part by the commitment of George W. Bush's administration to giving drug companies free rein in setting prices, even with government money at stake—quickly transformed a huge surplus into record peacetime deficits.


The remedies to the U.S. deficit follow immediately from this diagnosis: Put America back to work by stimulating the economy; end the mindless wars; rein in military and drug costs; and raise taxes, at least on the very rich. But the right will have none of this, and instead is pushing for even more tax cuts for corporations and the wealthy, together with expenditure cuts in investments and social protection that put the future of the U.S. economy in peril and that shred what remains of the social contract. Meanwhile, the U.S. financial sector has been lobbying hard to free itself of regulations, so that it can return to its previous, disastrously carefree, ways.

But matters are little better in Europe. As Greece and other countries face crises, the medicine du jour is simply timeworn austerity packages and privatization, which will merely leave the countries that embrace them poorer and more vulnerable. This medicine failed in East Asia, Latin America, and elsewhere, and it will fail in Europe, too. Indeed, it has already failed in Ireland, Latvia, and Greece.

There is an alternative: an economic-growth strategy supported by the European Union and the International Monetary Fund. Growth would restore confidence that Greece could repay its debts, causing interest rates to fall and leaving more fiscal room for further growth-enhancing investments. Growth itself increases tax revenues and reduces the need for social expenditures, such as unemployment benefits. And the confidence that this engenders leads to still further growth.

Regrettably, the financial markets and right-wing economists have gotten the problem exactly backward: They believe that austerity produces confidence, and that confidence will produce growth. But austerity undermines growth, worsening the government's fiscal position, or at least yielding less improvement than austerity's advocates promise. On both counts, confidence is undermined, and a downward spiral is set in motion.


Do we really need another costly experiment with ideas that have repeatedly failed? We shouldn't, but increasingly it appears that we will have to endure another one nonetheless. A failure of either Europe or the United States to return to robust growth would be bad for the global economy. The failure of both would be disastrous—even if the major emerging-market countries have attained self-sustaining growth. Unfortunately, unless wiser heads prevail, that is the way the world is heading.

Link -
http://www.slate.com/id/2298580/
==============================
There MAY have been, in times past, periods where right wing Aus-terity ideology may have looked like it worked.

However, in the period ahead, even that appearance, will not be possible!  
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