Australian Politics Forum - Avoiding Climate Extremism

astro_surf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 2981	Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism Reply #315 - Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:07pm Maqqa wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 8:20pm: That was a minute error wasn't it? progressiveslol wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 8:48pm: lol die hards hey. What can you do lol minor. You funny guy (accented sounds better). But no specific examples? Thought as much...
Back to top	Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 11:23am: So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&& IP Logged

Cliff Richard Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 558	Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism Reply #316 - Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:08pm long weekends favourite band is spinal tap
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progressiveslol

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Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism
Reply #317 - Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:21pm

Anybody interested in climate change may want to see why the deniers/skeptics may win out in the end. A perfect example why science, even old, thought to be well understood, can still be far off base. The climate change models about our suns impact on climate MAY have to be re-written.

http://www.suite101.com/content/vast-solar-eruption-shocks-nasa-and-raises-doubt...

This monumental solar eruption may finally challenge the accepted theories about how the key driver of Earth’s climate actually works. Manuel sagely observes, “Although NASA seems to be catching up, after decades of ‘group-think’ it will be very difficult for NASA scientists to comprehend the Sun.”

Indeed, this latest evidence is unsettling not just for accepted ideas about how our Sun works but it also impacts assumptions of how the Sun effects Earth’s climate. Oliver insists “ Science is a continuous process of ‘truthing’ without ever claiming that you have the ‘whole truth.’”

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism
Reply #318 - Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:28pm

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:21pm:

Anybody interested in climate change may want to see why the deniers/skeptics may win out in the end. A perfect example why science, even old, thought to be well understood, can still be far off base. The climate change models about our suns impact on climate MAY have to be re-written.

http://www.suite101.com/content/vast-solar-eruption-shocks-nasa-and-raises-doubt...

This monumental solar eruption may finally challenge the accepted theories about how the key driver of Earth’s climate actually works. Manuel sagely observes, “Although NASA seems to be catching up, after decades of ‘group-think’ it will be very difficult for NASA scientists to comprehend the Sun.”

Indeed, this latest evidence is unsettling not just for accepted ideas about how our Sun works but it also impacts assumptions of how the Sun effects Earth’s climate. Oliver insists “ Science is a continuous process of ‘truthing’ without ever claiming that you have the ‘whole truth.’”

Agreed. Which is why I have said that we don't know the ultimate truth, but based on what we currently know is it better to sit back and do business as usual, or is it better to put in measures?

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Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.

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astro_surf

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Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism
Reply #319 - Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:35pm

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:21pm:

Anybody interested in climate change may want to see why the deniers/skeptics may win out in the end. A perfect example why science, even old, thought to be well understood, can still be far off base. The climate change models about our suns impact on climate MAY have to be re-written.

http://www.suite101.com/content/vast-solar-eruption-shocks-nasa-and-raises-doubt...

This monumental solar eruption may finally challenge the accepted theories about how the key driver of Earth’s climate actually works. Manuel sagely observes, “Although NASA seems to be catching up, after decades of ‘group-think’ it will be very difficult for NASA scientists to comprehend the Sun.”

Indeed, this latest evidence is unsettling not just for accepted ideas about how our Sun works but it also impacts assumptions of how the Sun effects Earth’s climate. Oliver insists “ Science is a continuous process of ‘truthing’ without ever claiming that you have the ‘whole truth.’”

It MAY not too. This is essentially solar weather anyway, if you want to make comparisons, the suns climate would be based on it's 30-plus year cycles, not erratic one-off events. If ou want to use it to attack models, use it to attack the weather models that provide you with you day to day forecasts.

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Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 11:23am:

So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&&

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progressiveslol

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Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism
Reply #320 - Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:44pm

astro_surf wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:35pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:21pm:

Anybody interested in climate change may want to see why the deniers/skeptics may win out in the end. A perfect example why science, even old, thought to be well understood, can still be far off base. The climate change models about our suns impact on climate MAY have to be re-written.

http://www.suite101.com/content/vast-solar-eruption-shocks-nasa-and-raises-doubt...

This monumental solar eruption may finally challenge the accepted theories about how the key driver of Earth’s climate actually works. Manuel sagely observes, “Although NASA seems to be catching up, after decades of ‘group-think’ it will be very difficult for NASA scientists to comprehend the Sun.”

Indeed, this latest evidence is unsettling not just for accepted ideas about how our Sun works but it also impacts assumptions of how the Sun effects Earth’s climate. Oliver insists “ Science is a continuous process of ‘truthing’ without ever claiming that you have the ‘whole truth.’”

It MAY not too. This is essentially solar weather anyway, if you want to make comparisons, the suns climate would be based on it's 30-plus year cycles, not erratic one-off events. If ou want to use it to attack models, use it to attack the weather models that provide you with you day to day forecasts.

Firstly, you know what MAY means. The solar weather and energy, I would imagine would be an area that is to be re-written. The impact of solar irradiance may be part of that.

I dont know, just like I doubt you know. But one thing is sure. It is going to change our understanding of the impact from our main climate driver on the climate.

Weather forecasting is hardly on the money but they do well on predictions from observations from highs and lows, the jet streams and time of year ect.

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astro_surf

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Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism
Reply #321 - Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:58pm

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:44pm:

Firstly, you know what MAY means. The solar weather and energy, I would imagine would be an area that is to be re-written. The impact of solar irradiance may be part of that.

I dont know, just like I doubt you know. But one thing is sure. It is going to change our understanding of the impact from our main climate driver on the climate.

.

Even if it DID have to be re-written, which there is ZERO evidence that it did, just a wild-eyed blog entry, it wouldn't change a damn thing about what we KNOW about the physics of CO2. Come back when your blog post has passed peer review and been published in a scientific journal. It's happened before.

Quote:

Weather forecasting is hardly on the money but they do well on predictions from observations from highs and lows, the jet streams and time of year ect

And climate models have done well on predictions from observations of albedo, insolation, greenhouse gasses and feedback mechanisms.

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Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 11:23am:

So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&&

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progressiveslol

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Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism
Reply #322 - Jun 9^th, 2011 at 10:00pm

astro_surf wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:58pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:44pm:

Firstly, you know what MAY means. The solar weather and energy, I would imagine would be an area that is to be re-written. The impact of solar irradiance may be part of that.

I dont know, just like I doubt you know. But one thing is sure. It is going to change our understanding of the impact from our main climate driver on the climate.

.

Even if it DID have to be re-written, it wouldn't change a damn thing about what we KNOW about the physics of CO2

Quote:

Weather forecasting is hardly on the money but they do well on predictions from observations from highs and lows, the jet streams and time of year ect

And climate models have done well on predictions from observations of albedo, insolation, greenhouse gasses and feedback mechanisms.

Funny enough, just not on climate.

As for the CO2, history tells us they you are way off base as well.

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astro_surf

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Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism
Reply #323 - Jun 9^th, 2011 at 10:03pm

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 10:00pm:

Funny enough, just not on climate.

As for the CO2, history tells us they you are way off base as well.

Um, yes on climate. Climate models have been very successful, the only way they have been unsuccessful is by being too conservative and underestimating the rate of change.

And, no, history very much supports AGW. Please explain how the planet can warm from an ice age in the way that it does from the change in solar energy alone. Go on! I bet you can't! You knob jockey! Grin

Explain how the planet retains heat if not for greenhouse gasses? Explain how CO2 ISN'T a greenhouse gas? Grin

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Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 11:23am:

So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&&

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progressiveslol

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Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism
Reply #324 - Jun 9^th, 2011 at 10:15pm

astro_surf wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 10:03pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 10:00pm:

Funny enough, just not on climate.

As for the CO2, history tells us they you are way off base as well.

Um, yes on climate. Climate models have been very successful, the only way they have been unsuccessful is by being too conservative and underestimating the rate of change.

And, no, history very much supports AGW. Please explain how the planet can warm from an ice age in the way that it does from the change in solar energy alone. Go on! I bet you can't! You knob jockey! Grin

Explain how the planet retains heat if not for greenhouse gasses? Explain how CO2 ISN'T a greenhouse gas? Grin

I would rather wait for the findings of the iron core sun first. You can have your ideas which go with the scientists. My original intent was to give information, so go for it. Have your CO2 theory. Ok.

There is going to be many factors change because of the one thing that actually drives climate. Dont be suprised if that alters earths main greenhouse gas calculations. It isnt CO2 by the way.

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astro_surf

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Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism
Reply #325 - Jun 9^th, 2011 at 10:36pm

You avoidance of actually addressing my questions is duly noted! i'll accept that as an admission that I am right and you are wrong.

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 10:15pm:

I would rather wait for the findings of the iron core sun first.

For your sake, I sincerely hope you are being sarcastic here Shocked

Quote:

You can have your ideas which go with the scientists. My original intent was to give information, so go for it. Have your CO2 theory. Ok.

Give misinformation, more like it.

Quote:

There is going to be many factors change because of the one thing that actually drives climate. Dont be suprised if that alters earths main greenhouse gas calculations. It isnt CO2 by the way.

'

Water vapor is a function of temperature, not a cause. Unlike CO2, water condenses and evaporates at very low temperatures. H2O levels will only increase if it gets warmer. It is strictly regulated by the Clausius-Clapeyron relationship.

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Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 11:23am:

So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&&

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progressiveslol

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Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism
Reply #326 - Jun 10^th, 2011 at 10:27am

There may be hope in getting away from the ideology of climate change and get real facts. Hope.

New Topical Group on Climate Actively Seeks Members
Organizing committee members emphasized the need to keep the focus on unbiased science rather than politics and partisanship. Council member Robert Austin of Princeton has pushed hard to get the group established, and to keep ideology from dictating the direction of the group’s work.

“You’ll get an unbiased viewpoint,” Austin said, “where you can find clearly written articles that bring the physics out in a major way.”

http://www.aps.org/publications/apsnews/201106/climategroup.cfm

Groups Areas of Interest
http://www.aps.org/units/gpc/index.cfm

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cods

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Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism
Reply #327 - Jun 10^th, 2011 at 10:58am

Read what you wrote wthout the blinkers. The EU are not afraid to keep going down this path. Fine. But keep in mind that it still DOESNT work and probably wont work without 3-4 times the imposts they currently have. That would be economic suicide but in case you havent noticed, the EU is commmitting slow economic suicide anyhow. If not for Germany and France and to a lesser extent UK, the EU would already be bacnkrupt from coast to coast instead of simply MOSTLY bankrupt.

the point of the post which you fail to understand is that Phase 1 with a carbon cost HIGHER than the one we wil have is already known to have been totally ineffective. And so we push ahead to replicate a failed scheme. Why should I not call it ideologically-driven extremism? Would you prefer I call it utter foolishness? coz i wont cal it good policy when it has zero chance of sucess.
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what I dont understand is our fixation with the EU.. UK.. Germany.... what does what they do have to do with us???... after all do they buy our COAL or our ORE?... n o they dont its CHINA that is the concumer of our minerals...even though they are evil and destroying the globe.

I would thinks its Brazil we should be concentrating on.. after all they are not shy about selling the evil money making minerals anymore that we are... so if we price ourselves out of this market.. ???????

now we have done the live cattle market in.???

we will only be exporting humans wont we?

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longweekend58

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Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism
Reply #328 - Jun 10^th, 2011 at 11:46am

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 9:21pm:

Anybody interested in climate change may want to see why the deniers/skeptics may win out in the end. A perfect example why science, even old, thought to be well understood, can still be far off base. The climate change models about our suns impact on climate MAY have to be re-written.

http://www.suite101.com/content/vast-solar-eruption-shocks-nasa-and-raises-doubt...

This monumental solar eruption may finally challenge the accepted theories about how the key driver of Earth’s climate actually works. Manuel sagely observes, “Although NASA seems to be catching up, after decades of ‘group-think’ it will be very difficult for NASA scientists to comprehend the Sun.”

Indeed, this latest evidence is unsettling not just for accepted ideas about how our Sun works but it also impacts assumptions of how the Sun effects Earth’s climate. Oliver insists “ Science is a continuous process of ‘truthing’ without ever claiming that you have the ‘whole truth.’”

But the science about the Sun is 'settled'!!! surely it isnt possible that we have been wrong about it, surely???

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Avoiding Climate Extremism
Reply #329 - Jun 10^th, 2011 at 11:50am

astro_surf wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 10:03pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jun 9^th, 2011 at 10:00pm:

Funny enough, just not on climate.

As for the CO2, history tells us they you are way off base as well.

Um, yes on climate. Climate models have been very successful, the only way they have been unsuccessful is by being too conservative and underestimating the rate of change.

And, no, history very much supports AGW. Please explain how the planet can warm from an ice age in the way that it does from the change in solar energy alone. Go on! I bet you can't! You knob jockey! Grin

Explain how the planet retains heat if not for greenhouse gasses? Explain how CO2 ISN'T a greenhouse gas? Grin

actually EVERY SINGLE climate model has failed the litmus test of retrospectivity. if a model is to be trusted it should be able to accurately reconstruct the past. If it cannot do this then its future predictions are unlikely to be accurate.

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« Last Edit: Jun 10^th, 2011 at 12:06pm by longweekend58 »

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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