Australian Politics Forum - Death Sentence in Tenn.

jame-e

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Re: Death Sentence in Tenn.
Reply #15 - Jun 13^th, 2011 at 5:07pm

Yadda wrote on Jun 13^th, 2011 at 3:50pm:

jame-e wrote on Jun 12^th, 2011 at 11:13pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jun 12^th, 2011 at 11:09pm:

And I DO, and WILL support the Death penalty under appropriate circumstances..

Nobody has the right to take a life.

Leftist, PC shite, imo.

"Nobody has the right to take a life."

So, in your reality;

Nobody has the right to defend someone who is being murdered, by killing the murderer ???

Nobody has the right to prevent a murderer from murdering AGAIN, by killing [executing] a convicted murderer ???

Murderers [even in Australia] who have been released from prison have often murdered again.

The blood of their victims is on the hands of people like yourself, imo.

'Leftist, pc shite, imo'

leaving the statement as it is, there are going to be many different opinions, that is why i thought I’d throw it in.

We are talking about the state taking a life, killing. Not somebody killing in defence of being killed, which is arguable in court.

As soon as the threat has ceased, so has the right to kill.

The state can not have a 'do as i say, not as i do' approach. It must lead by example.

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Yadda

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Re: Death Sentence in Tenn.
Reply #16 - Jun 14^th, 2011 at 7:48am

jame-e wrote on Jun 13^th, 2011 at 5:07pm:

Yadda wrote on Jun 13^th, 2011 at 3:50pm:

jame-e wrote on Jun 12^th, 2011 at 11:13pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jun 12^th, 2011 at 11:09pm:

And I DO, and WILL support the Death penalty under appropriate circumstances..

Nobody has the right to take a life.

Leftist, PC shite, imo.

"Nobody has the right to take a life."

So, in your reality;

Nobody has the right to defend someone who is being murdered, by killing the murderer ???

Nobody has the right to prevent a murderer from murdering AGAIN, by killing [executing] a convicted murderer ???

Murderers [even in Australia] who have been released from prison have often murdered again.

The blood of their victims is on the hands of people like yourself, imo.

'Leftist, pc shite, imo'

leaving the statement as it is, there are going to be many different opinions, that is why i thought I’d throw it in.

We are talking about the state taking a life, killing. Not somebody killing in defence of being killed, which is arguable in court.

As soon as the threat has ceased, so has the right to kill.

The state can not have a 'do as i say, not as i do' approach. It must lead by example.

If you are correct, then what is the example the state is setting, by releasing convicted murderers into the community [after 4-6 years] ???
[IMO, ideally, a convicted murderer would never again be released.]

IMO, if a person inadvertently causes the death of another person, but that person had no intent to cause such a consequence, that person should be forgiven by our courts.

But imo, if a person causes the death of another, which is clearly a consequence of their own reckless behaviour, then that person should be held accountable for his/her actions, by our courts.
And imo, such a death should have the same 'consequence' in sentencing, as murder.

[e.g. perpetrators of so called, 'one punch deaths', or, a drink driver, whose driving causes the death of another person [however 'unintended' ], or, 'joy riders' in stolen vehicles, who's driving which [even indirectly] causes the death of another person [however 'unintended' ] ]

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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longweekend58

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Re: Death Sentence in Tenn.
Reply #17 - Jun 14^th, 2011 at 8:53am

Yadda wrote on Jun 14^th, 2011 at 7:48am:

jame-e wrote on Jun 13^th, 2011 at 5:07pm:

Yadda wrote on Jun 13^th, 2011 at 3:50pm:

jame-e wrote on Jun 12^th, 2011 at 11:13pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jun 12^th, 2011 at 11:09pm:

And I DO, and WILL support the Death penalty under appropriate circumstances..

Nobody has the right to take a life.

Leftist, PC shite, imo.

"Nobody has the right to take a life."

So, in your reality;

Nobody has the right to defend someone who is being murdered, by killing the murderer ???

Nobody has the right to prevent a murderer from murdering AGAIN, by killing [executing] a convicted murderer ???

Murderers [even in Australia] who have been released from prison have often murdered again.

The blood of their victims is on the hands of people like yourself, imo.

'Leftist, pc shite, imo'

leaving the statement as it is, there are going to be many different opinions, that is why i thought I’d throw it in.

We are talking about the state taking a life, killing. Not somebody killing in defence of being killed, which is arguable in court.

As soon as the threat has ceased, so has the right to kill.

The state can not have a 'do as i say, not as i do' approach. It must lead by example.

If you are correct, then what is the example the state is setting, by releasing convicted murderers into the community [after 4-6 years] ???
[IMO, ideally, a convicted murderer would never again be released.]

IMO, if a person inadvertently causes the death of another person, but that person had no intent to cause such a consequence, that person should be forgiven by our courts.

But imo, if a person causes the death of another, which is clearly a consequence of their own reckless behaviour, then that person should be held accountable for his/her actions, by our courts.
And imo, such a death should have the same 'consequence' in sentencing, as murder.

[e.g. perpetrators of so called, 'one punch deaths', or, a drink driver, whose driving causes the death of another person [however 'unintended' ], or, 'joy riders' in stolen vehicles, who's driving which [even indirectly] causes the death of another person [however 'unintended' ] ]

yadd, you often quote the Bible and clearly have read it. But just as clearly, you really dont understand it. You seem to have missed one of the primary messages of the Bible which is forgiveness. Maybe if you read an english translation it might help.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Yadda

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Re: Death Sentence in Tenn.
Reply #18 - Jun 14^th, 2011 at 9:14am

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 14^th, 2011 at 8:53am:

yadd, you often quote the Bible and clearly have read it. But just as clearly, you really dont understand it. You seem to have missed one of the primary messages of the Bible which is forgiveness. Maybe if you read an english translation it might help.

Thank you.

I take your comment as a challenge, and as an invitation. Wink

more to come...

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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longweekend58

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Re: Death Sentence in Tenn.
Reply #19 - Jun 14^th, 2011 at 9:26am

Yadda wrote on Jun 14^th, 2011 at 9:14am:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 14^th, 2011 at 8:53am:

yadd, you often quote the Bible and clearly have read it. But just as clearly, you really dont understand it. You seem to have missed one of the primary messages of the Bible which is forgiveness. Maybe if you read an english translation it might help.

Thank you.

I take your comment as a challenge, and as an invitation. Wink

more to come...

If it is a challenge to interpret the bible correctly then go for it. but your lack of forgiveness and a desire to punish anyone and everybody for everything is very Old Covenant.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Yadda

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Re: Death Sentence in Tenn.
Reply #20 - Jun 14^th, 2011 at 10:44am

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 14^th, 2011 at 8:53am:

yadd, you often quote the Bible and clearly have read it. But just as clearly, you really dont understand it. You seem to have missed one of the primary messages of the Bible which is forgiveness. Maybe if you read an english translation it might help.

longweekend58,

Not at all.

I know the place which forgiveness plays, in God's plan.

The man Jesus, was Jewish, and was Torah observant,
i.e. as a man, Jesus considered himself bound by the law of Moses.

And Jesus was a Torah [law] teacher.

e.g.
Jesus rebuked the Pharisees for not obeying the law [given by God] in not putting certain criminals [according to God's law] to death.

Matthew 15:3
But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?
4 For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.
5 But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me;
6 And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.
7 Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,
8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.
9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

Jesus also said;

Matthew 5:17
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Which commandments ???

"Thou shalt do no murder,
Thou shalt not commit adultery,
Thou shalt not steal,
Thou shalt not bear false witness,
Honour thy father and thy mother."
Matthew 19:16-19

All of those commandments, above, were quoted by Jesus, directly from the book(s) of the law, the Torah,
Exodus 20:12-16
Deuteronomy 5:16-20

+++

And the argument can be made that Jesus himself, was the lawgiver to Moses.;

Though Jesus did not manifest himself as a man, to Moses, to the children of Israel, Jesus is and was the lawgiver to Moses.

The Law of Moses was given to Moses, by God [i.e. by Jesus].

That is what Jesus himself implied, and what the Bible says.

John 8:56
Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.
57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?
58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
59 Then took they up stones to cast at him:...

1 Corinthians 10:1
Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat;
4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

John 10:30
I and my Father are one.

John 4:24
God is a Spirit:...

John 14:8
Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

Jesus said....

John 14:15
If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Revelation 22:13
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

+++

Psalms 11:4
The LORD is in his holy temple, the LORD'S throne is in heaven: his eyes behold, his eyelids try, the children of men.
5 The LORD trieth the righteous: but the wicked and him that loveth violence his soul hateth.

Revelation 21:7
He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Yadda

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Re: Death Sentence in Tenn.
Reply #21 - Jun 14^th, 2011 at 10:45am

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 14^th, 2011 at 9:26am:

If it is a challenge to interpret the bible correctly then go for it. but your lack of forgiveness and a desire to punish anyone and everybody for everything is very Old Covenant.

longweekend58,

Even in the 'Old Covenant', God's mercy was always extended to us, always offered to us.

Isaiah 55:6
Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:
7 Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.

As it was also, in the new covenant....

Luke 17:3
Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.
4 And if he trespass against thee seven times in a day, and seven times in a day turn again to thee, saying, I repent; thou shalt forgive him.

John 8:10
When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?
11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.

But God's forgiveness and mercy, was never a 'blank cheque', as many Christians today believe, and as many Christians today dearly 'wish' to believe.

Those who believe that God's forgiveness and mercy will fall on all of mankind are sadly mistaken, imo.

God's forgiveness and mercy, is, and always was, joined with a requirement for ongoing repentance and remorse on our part, for our bad behaviour.

That 'message' is there, throughout the Bible

Matthew 3:7
But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
8 Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:

Ezekiel 18:4
Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.

The message that i get from studying the Bible is that there will be mercy for the repentant,
....but a 'stick' for the 'foolish', the unrepentant.

And the underlying message throughout the Bible too, is that if we join ourselves to God, that we should condemn and separate ourselves from oppressors and criminals.
.....and not be tolerant of oppressors and criminals.

Proverbs 8:13
The fear of the LORD is to hate evil:...

Proverbs 9:10
The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

Amos 5:14
Seek good, and not evil, that ye may live: and so the LORD, the God of hosts, shall be with you, as ye have spoken.
15 Hate the evil, and love the good, and establish judgment in the gate: it may be that the LORD God of hosts will be gracious unto the remnant of Joseph.

Hosea 12:6
Therefore turn thou to thy God: keep mercy and judgment, and wait on thy God continually.

Romans 12:9
Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.

In Isaiah, God rebukes the people of Jerusalem, and clearly identifies the sin of the people of that city, as a clear absence of proper judgement against wrongdoers, and criminals.

Speaking of Jerusalem [which was meant to be a holy city, for a holy people.] as an example of where there is no judgement [against criminals]...

Isaiah 1:21
How is the faithful city become an harlot! it was full of judgment; righteousness lodged in it; but now murderers.
22 Thy silver is become dross, thy wine mixed with water:
23 Thy princes are rebellious, and companions of thieves: every one loveth gifts, and followeth after rewards: they judge not the fatherless, neither doth the cause of the widow come unto them.

Jeremiah 9:23
Thus saith the LORD, Let not the wise man glory in his wisdom, neither let the mighty man glory in his might, let not the rich man glory in his riches:
24 But let him that glorieth glory in this, that he understandeth and knoweth me, that I am the LORD which exercise lovingkindness, judgment, and righteousness, in the earth: for in these things I delight, saith the LORD.

If we join ourselves with the wicked, that is, if we ourselves, tolerate what is wicked, we will be judged with the wicked.

Leviticus 20:26
And ye shall be holy unto me: for I the LORD am holy, and have severed you from other people, that ye should be mine.

2 Corinthians 6:17
Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

Revelation 18:4
And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

"Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil."

Thomas Mann

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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longweekend58

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Re: Death Sentence in Tenn.
Reply #22 - Jun 14^th, 2011 at 5:31pm

Yadda wrote on Jun 14^th, 2011 at 10:45am:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 14^th, 2011 at 9:26am:

If it is a challenge to interpret the bible correctly then go for it. but your lack of forgiveness and a desire to punish anyone and everybody for everything is very Old Covenant.

longweekend58,

Even in the 'Old Covenant', God's mercy was always extended to us, always offered to us.

Isaiah 55:6
Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:
7 Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.

As it was also, in the new covenant....

Luke 17:3
Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.
4 And if he trespass against thee seven times in a day, and seven times in a day turn again to thee, saying, I repent; thou shalt forgive him.

John 8:10
When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?
11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.

But God's forgiveness and mercy, was never a 'blank cheque', as many Christians today believe, and as many Christians today dearly 'wish' to believe.

Those who believe that God's forgiveness and mercy will fall on all of mankind are sadly mistaken, imo.

God's forgiveness and mercy, is, and always was, joined with a requirement for ongoing repentance and remorse on our part, for our bad behaviour.

That 'message' is there, throughout the Bible

Matthew 3:7
But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
8 Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:

Ezekiel 18:4
Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.

The message that i get from studying the Bible is that there will be mercy for the repentant,
....but a 'stick' for the 'foolish', the unrepentant.

And the underlying message throughout the Bible too, is that if we join ourselves to God, that we should condemn and separate ourselves from oppressors and criminals.
.....and not be tolerant of oppressors and criminals.

Proverbs 8:13
The fear of the LORD is to hate evil:...

Proverbs 9:10
The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

Amos 5:14
Seek good, and not evil, that ye may live: and so the LORD, the God of hosts, shall be with you, as ye have spoken.
15 Hate the evil, and love the good, and establish judgment in the gate: it may be that the LORD God of hosts will be gracious unto the remnant of Joseph.

Hosea 12:6
Therefore turn thou to thy God: keep mercy and judgment, and wait on thy God continually.

Romans 12:9
Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.

In Isaiah, God rebukes the people of Jerusalem, and clearly identifies the sin of the people of that city, as a clear absence of proper judgement against wrongdoers, and criminals.

Speaking of Jerusalem [which was meant to be a holy city, for a holy people.] as an example of where there is no judgement [against criminals]...

Isaiah 1:21
How is the faithful city become an harlot! it was full of judgment; righteousness lodged in it; but now murderers.
22 Thy silver is become dross, thy wine mixed with water:
23 Thy princes are rebellious, and companions of thieves: every one loveth gifts, and followeth after rewards: they judge not the fatherless, neither doth the cause of the widow come unto them.

Jeremiah 9:23
Thus saith the LORD, Let not the wise man glory in his wisdom, neither let the mighty man glory in his might, let not the rich man glory in his riches:
24 But let him that glorieth glory in this, that he understandeth and knoweth me, that I am the LORD which exercise lovingkindness, judgment, and righteousness, in the earth: for in these things I delight, saith the LORD.

If we join ourselves with the wicked, that is, if we ourselves, tolerate what is wicked, we will be judged with the wicked.

Leviticus 20:26
And ye shall be holy unto me: for I the LORD am holy, and have severed you from other people, that ye should be mine.

Revelation 18:4
And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

"Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil."

Thomas Mann

And despite all your lengthy King James quotes ( you do know there are modern english translations that are more accurate, right?) you have not yet addressed forgiveness or how Jesus fulfilled the law and replaced the death penalty for sin with LIFE.

I stay with my comment that you havent really understood the atonement for sins that was Jesus' death and resurrection.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Andrei.Hicks Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 23818 Carlsbad, CA Gender:	Re: Death Sentence in Tenn. Reply #23 - Jun 14^th, 2011 at 7:24pm "I will take fierce revenge on them and punish them with fury. I will take revenge on them, and then they will know that I am the LORD" Ezekiel, 25:17 Pick whichever translation you like - King James or otherwise. The message is the same.
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longweekend58

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Re: Death Sentence in Tenn.
Reply #24 - Jun 14^th, 2011 at 8:15pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jun 14^th, 2011 at 7:24pm:

"I will take fierce revenge on them and punish them with fury. I will take revenge on them, and then they will know that I am the LORD"

Ezekiel, 25:17

Pick whichever translation you like - King James or otherwise.
The message is the same.

yes but I am pretty sure you dont know what it is!

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Yadda

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Re: Death Sentence in Tenn.
Reply #25 - Jun 15^th, 2011 at 10:11am

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 14^th, 2011 at 5:31pm:

And despite all your lengthy King James quotes ( you do know there are modern english translations that are more accurate, right?)

If that is what you want to believe.

I prefer the KJV.

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 14^th, 2011 at 5:31pm:

....you have not yet addressed forgiveness or how Jesus fulfilled the law and replaced the death penalty for sin with LIFE.

I stay with my comment that you havent really understood the atonement for sins that was Jesus' death and resurrection.

So we will all have God's gift of spiritual LIFE, if we accept Jesus' death as atonement for our own sin ?

OK.

But, what is God calling us from ?

What is God redeeming us from ?

+++

Matthew 5:43
Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

longweekend58,

Do you believe, that what Jesus taught, was some 'new' teaching from God ???

That what Jesus taught was a new doctrine from God ?

And that God's law [the law given to Moses], is now of no effect ???

Leviticus 19:18
Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

Exodus 23:4
If thou meet thine enemy's ox or his ass going astray, thou shalt surely bring it back to him again.
5 If thou see the ass of him that hateth thee lying under his burden, and wouldest forbear to help him, thou shalt surely help with him.

And Jesus ?

Matthew 22:36
Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

longweekend58,

And because all things are forgiven us, by the blood of Jesus, do you believe that we should join ourselves to the wicked [be tolerant of wickedness], because Jesus has made atonement for us ???

What did Jesus himself say ?

Matthew 5:17
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Is it ok to join ourselves to those who murder, to those who commit adultery, to those who steal, to those who bear false witness [those who are liars and deceivers], and to those who abuse their parents,
....because we are safe under the atonement blood of Jesus sacrifice ?

Those are all choices which we have to come to, for ourselves.

IMO, we should preach God's kingdom, but as far as is possible, not join ourselves to this world.

John 8:23
And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.

John 3:6
That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Romans 8:5
For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

Again, what was Jesus final word on the matter ?

Revelation 21:7
He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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gizmo_2655

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Australian Politics

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South West NSW
Gender: male

Re: Death Sentence in Tenn.
Reply #26 - Jun 15^th, 2011 at 4:07pm

adelcrow wrote on Jun 13^th, 2011 at 10:43am:

Did the US soldiers who gang raped the young girl in Iraq and then murdered her and her family to cover up the crime get the death penalty?

Except for ALL the press coverage...they probably would have.....AND should have...

The US military uses the death penalty a lot more than civil courts do....

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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat

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Cliff Richard

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Australian Politics

Posts: 558

Re: Death Sentence in Tenn.
Reply #27 - Jun 15^th, 2011 at 4:10pm

Quote:

The state can not have a 'do as i say, not as i do' approach. It must lead by example.

i agree. i'm going to lock you in my laundry for five years only letting you out into my garden for exercise once a day while raping you in the shower every night the entire time.

also im going to put a gun to your head and tell you to give me a portion of your income every year or i will dispossess your sh!t or and lock you in said laundry for even longer.

governments do it so it must be ok

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Life_goes_on

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400kms south of Yobsville, Qld
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Re: Death Sentence in Tenn.
Reply #28 - Jun 15^th, 2011 at 4:20pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jun 15^th, 2011 at 4:07pm:

adelcrow wrote on Jun 13^th, 2011 at 10:43am:

Did the US soldiers who gang raped the young girl in Iraq and then murdered her and her family to cover up the crime get the death penalty?

Except for ALL the press coverage...they probably would have.....AND should have...

The US military uses the death penalty a lot more than civil courts do....

I'm pretty sure the US military hasn't carried out a death sentence since the 1950s.

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"You're just one lucky motherf-cker" - Someone, 5th February 2013

Num num num num.

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gizmo_2655

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Australian Politics

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South West NSW
Gender: male

Re: Death Sentence in Tenn.
Reply #29 - Jun 15^th, 2011 at 4:23pm

Life_goes_on wrote on Jun 15^th, 2011 at 4:20pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jun 15^th, 2011 at 4:07pm:

adelcrow wrote on Jun 13^th, 2011 at 10:43am:

Did the US soldiers who gang raped the young girl in Iraq and then murdered her and her family to cover up the crime get the death penalty?

Except for ALL the press coverage...they probably would have.....AND should have...

The US military uses the death penalty a lot more than civil courts do....

I'm pretty sure the US military hasn't carried out a death sentence since the 1950s.

"The death penalty under the Uniform Code of Military Justice was reinstated in 1984. The military death row is located at the U.S. Disciplinary Barracks in Fort Leavenworth, Kansas. There are currently seven death row inmates awaiting execution"
As of November 2010...

And the 'last' execution actually carried out was 1961...

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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat

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