Forum

 
  Back to OzPolitic.com   Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
  Forum Home Album HelpSearch Recent Rules LoginRegister  
 

Pages: 1 2 3 4 
Send Topic Print
Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty (Read 3845 times)
chicken_lipsforme
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 7090
Townsville NQ
Gender: male
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #30 - Jun 17th, 2011 at 11:34am
 
buzzanddidj wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 8:41am:
cods wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 8:31am:
I am not sure how anyone can do such a barbaric thing to be honest,what sort of people are they??



The Cruelty of Wounding

Birds suffer pain and stress when they are wounded by shotgun pellets. Computer simulation estimates and the observations of ‘rescuers’ on the wetlands indicates that duck shooters wound at least as many birds as they kill outright. Even shooting groups acknowledge that at least one in every four birds targeted will be wounded—amounting to tens of thousands each duck shooting season.

The physical action of a shotgun involves a spray of pellets, and a flying bird can be wounded by even a single pellet. Other birds flying with the target bird can also be wounded.  Depending on the distance between gun and bird it may take a number of pellets to kill a bird outright.  Those downed birds who are not recovered may suffer over long period before recovery or death from their wounds or through predation by foxes


http://www.animalsaustralia.org/factsheets/duck_shooting.php




I'm sure you could find many many more examples Buzz, however the one thing they all have in common is they are all examples of mans inhumanity to animals.
I would suggest that had the example you gave showing the birds suffering from shotgun pellets was aired on a four corners program in living colour, the public outcry would have been just the same.
Back to top
 

"Another boat, another policy failure from the Howard government"

Julia Gillard
Shadow Health Minister
2003.
 
IP Logged
 
gizmo_2655
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 16010
South West NSW
Gender: male
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #31 - Jun 17th, 2011 at 11:34am
 
cods wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 9:06am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 8:50am:
cods wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 8:31am:
I am not sure how anyone can do such a barbaric thing to be honest,what sort of people are they??


Cods, IF the halaal/kosher method is done correctly, the animal doesn't even notice the incisions...and simply passes out from lose of blood...no stress, no fear.



have you seem them do it giz?.. we dont do it like that anymore there must be a reason for that?. I know there is no nice way of killing a beast ,but we can put a man on the moon.... we can do better than this I feel.


The reason we 'don't do it' like that anymore is SPEED cods, not humanitarian concerns.....just dollars.
The Halaal/Kosher method (and they're pretty much the same) takes at least four times as long, due to only one animal in the killing room, and giving the beast water, calming it etc..

Non Halaal slaughtering is done like a production line....in mass numbers
Back to top
 

"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat
 
IP Logged
 
chicken_lipsforme
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 7090
Townsville NQ
Gender: male
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #32 - Jun 17th, 2011 at 12:19pm
 
Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 10:41am:
buzzanddidj wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 8:30am:
Continued ...



"We are against any form of stunning because it's against our religion," Yusuf Altuntas, president of the CMO -- an organisation that links the Muslim community with the Dutch government -- told a parliamentary commission.

"One of the first measures taken during the occupation (during World War II) was the closing of kosher abattoirs," Dutch Chief Rabbi Binyomin Jacobs added during the debate in The Hague.


Dutch law required animals to be stunned before being slaughtered but made an exception for ritual halaal and kosher slaughters.

The country's Party for Animals (PvdD) which holds two seats in the 150-seat Dutch parliament, has submitted a proposal, if implemented, would see this exception abolished.

Dutch media widely reported that the PvdD's proposal was expected to get a majority nod from parliamentarians.

"It will cause an irreversable fracture in our society," said Ronnie Eisenmann, who leads Amsterdam's Jewish community.

"Changes in the law will do nothing to ease the suffering of animals," he added.

Jewish and Muslim representatives Thursday insisted the ritual slaughter respected the animals' welfare, notably restriction methods used to limit suffering and those slaughtering received expert training.

They did however offer to implement some measures which they said would ease the animals' suffering, especially better controls in abattoirs where ritual slaughters were performed and an improvement in conditions under which animals were being transported.



http://www.middle-east-online.com/ENGLISH/?id=46766



Love how they have to throw a bit of WWII war guilt in there just to bolster the argument.
It seems those 6 million didn't die in vein, their deaths have allowed Jews for the rest of time to get away with what ever they see fit from illegal land grabs, formation of ghetto's, starving of the afore mentioned ghetto's & now ritual slaughter.
Is there anything they won't attach this "Guilt" too to get their way?


What ghetto's, there are no ghetto's.
"Show me the ghetto's" we all cry.
Where are the starving people?
Why no photos on the front page of Time magazine, showing kids with bare distended bellies and the blowflies hanging off the runny snotty noses that we used to see from Africa?
Where are all the photo's of the starving people taken by the concerned 'impartial' NGO's, or even the Palestinian media which are controlled by the terrorists.
There are none is why.
Not a one.
This is just absolute crap made up by the terrorists to garner Western sympathy from gullable left wingers.
Why can we only see photos of the beautiful fresh food markets in Gaza, the brand new water theme park or the new multi story shopping mall, and the chubby people in them.
Check our the websites of the restaurants advertised on the internet.
They even have a five star for christs sake.
Starving my ass, their last census conducted by the Hamas terrorists in 2006 shows a growing population, and not one consistent with living in a ghetto.
Where are the bodies, or do you think they are making Soylent Green patties out of them and eating them.
As for illegal land grabs, you might care to remember the 4 wars Israel fought to the knife to defend itself from rampaging Arab armies in 1948, 1956, 1967 & 1973.
Do you imagine for one second if Israel had lost any of those wars that Israel would even exist as a nation today?
Or whether those four or five countries invading Israel all those times would not have carved up the entire region for themselves had they won, or do you imagine somewhere in a wet dream that they were going to establish a 'Palestinian' state.
Because the Ottoman's had 1200 long years to do just that very thing, and it never happened.
Do you think the Lebanese keep thousands of these people locked up for stamps behind razor and recently introduced draconian employment laws for Palestinians that make Workchoices look great, or the Jordanians slaughtered thousands upon thousands of them during the Black September massacre of 1970 for something to do.
Or why the Saudi's treat them today as low paid coolies, or the Egyptians until not so long ago would rather aid Israel in keeping the Palestinians locked in their box called Gaza.
Or why the Iraqi's deported the lot of them only a couple of years ago, or the Jordanians tore up all the dual Jordanian/Palestinian passports to keep them out despite the fact that the Jordanian population is right now 60% Palestinian.
Even the King's wife is Palestinian.
So you might want to think again about these 'poor' downtrodden people, because their own Muslim brothers don't want a bar of them with the exception of Iran & Syria who are quite happy to arm these nutters as long as they kill Jews, and of course keep out of their territory.
And if you have a gutful of hearing about the 6 million people sent to their deaths in a systematic and brutal way, empty your stomach because the world will never be allowed to forget so it never ever happens again to another people.
Back to top
 

"Another boat, another policy failure from the Howard government"

Julia Gillard
Shadow Health Minister
2003.
 
IP Logged
 
Dsmithy70
Gold Member
*****
Offline


ire futuis vobismetipsis

Posts: 13147
Newy
Gender: male
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #33 - Jun 17th, 2011 at 12:33pm
 
Quote:
And if you have a gutful of hearing about the 6 million people sent to their deaths in a systematic and brutal way, empty your stomach because the world will never be allowed to forget so it never ever happens again to another people.


I knew someone would come back with this sort of rant.
I never said we should forget
I never said it should be ignored
But what has WWII got to do with the ritual slaughter of animals other than to either
A) invoke a sense of guilt & therefore sympathy
or
B) to infur any decision against the ritual slaughter makes those charged with that decision as bad as NAZI'S.

Yes I know all the arguments about the Arabs etc etc etc we hear about them on a weekly basis, & yes they ask for alot of what they get.
But why is everytime someone dares question Israel about new settlements, excessive force,blockades etc etc are they labeled a Jew hater, anti-semite.
Its about time people were allowed to question without guilt being thrown in their faces.
Back to top
 

REBELLION is not what most people think it is.
REBELLION is when you turn off the TV & start educating & thinking for yourself.
Gavin Nascimento
 
IP Logged
 
culldav
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 2020
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #34 - Jun 17th, 2011 at 1:29pm
 
Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 12:33pm:
Quote:
And if you have a gutful of hearing about the 6 million people sent to their deaths in a systematic and brutal way, empty your stomach because the world will never be allowed to forget so it never ever happens again to another people.


I knew someone would come back with this sort of rant.
I never said we should forget
I never said it should be ignored
But what has WWII got to do with the ritual slaughter of animals other than to either
A) invoke a sense of guilt & therefore sympathy
or
B) to infur any decision against the ritual slaughter makes those charged with that decision as bad as NAZI'S.

Yes I know all the arguments about the Arabs etc etc etc we hear about them on a weekly basis, & yes they ask for alot of what they get.
But why is everytime someone dares question Israel about new settlements, excessive force,blockades etc etc are they labeled a Jew hater, anti-semite.
Its about time people were allowed to question without guilt being thrown in their faces.




HEAR HEAR !!
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Wimmera
Full Member
***
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 118
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #35 - Jun 17th, 2011 at 1:50pm
 
I believe we are supposed to think the jews are a protected species.

Not in this camp, they aren't.  No creed is.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
chicken_lipsforme
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 7090
Townsville NQ
Gender: male
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #36 - Jun 17th, 2011 at 2:05pm
 
Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 12:33pm:
But why is everytime someone dares question Israel about new settlements, excessive force,blockades etc etc are they labeled a Jew hater, anti-semite.
Its about time people were allowed to question without guilt being thrown in their faces.


Possibly because in many cases they are a Jew hater or anti semite smithy, and believe me I'm not referring to you.
But I'm glad you liked the rant though, it's one of my better ones.
Back to top
 

"Another boat, another policy failure from the Howard government"

Julia Gillard
Shadow Health Minister
2003.
 
IP Logged
 
gizmo_2655
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 16010
South West NSW
Gender: male
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #37 - Jun 17th, 2011 at 2:08pm
 
I think the reference to WW2 was simply made as a timeline...

To show that the current exemption is a long standing one..
Back to top
 

"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat
 
IP Logged
 
sir prince duke alevine
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 23619
Gender: male
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #38 - Jun 17th, 2011 at 2:10pm
 
chicken_lipsforme wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 2:05pm:
Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 12:33pm:
But why is everytime someone dares question Israel about new settlements, excessive force,blockades etc etc are they labeled a Jew hater, anti-semite.
Its about time people were allowed to question without guilt being thrown in their faces.


Possibly because in many cases they are a Jew hater or anti semite smithy, and believe me I'm not referring to you.
But I'm glad you liked the rant though, it's one of my better ones.


Yes, anti-semites exist.  It doesn't mean that most who speak out against Israel's actions are, and it doesn't mean that the main defence is calling someone anti-semitic or reminding them about WW2.
Back to top
 

Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.
 
IP Logged
 
astro_surf
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 2981
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #39 - Jun 17th, 2011 at 2:30pm
 
gizmo_2655 wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 8:50am:
cods wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 8:31am:
I am not sure how anyone can do such a barbaric thing to be honest,what sort of people are they??


Cods, IF the halaal/kosher method is done correctly, the animal doesn't even notice the incisions...and simply passes out from lose of blood...no stress, no fear.


Yeah, I can't see why people think a bolt in the head is more humane than being bled out.
Back to top
 

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 11th, 2011 at 11:23am:
So tell me, you'd like to see more and more craphouse coloured people in Australia right?&&Yeah good idea moron.&&
 
IP Logged
 
Maeve
Senior Member
****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 304
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #40 - Jun 18th, 2011 at 3:54pm
 
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Soren
Gold Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 25654
Gender: male
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #41 - Jun 18th, 2011 at 7:36pm
 
sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 2:10pm:
Yes, anti-semites exist.  It doesn't mean that most who speak out against Israel's actions are, and it doesn't mean that the main defence is calling someone anti-semitic or reminding them about WW2.



Yeah, when you speak out against terrorists attacking the jews (not just in Israel),  you can speak out against Israel's treatement of terrorists.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
sir prince duke alevine
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 23619
Gender: male
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #42 - Jun 18th, 2011 at 7:50pm
 
Soren wrote on Jun 18th, 2011 at 7:36pm:
sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jun 17th, 2011 at 2:10pm:
Yes, anti-semites exist.  It doesn't mean that most who speak out against Israel's actions are, and it doesn't mean that the main defence is calling someone anti-semitic or reminding them about WW2.



Yeah, when you speak out against terrorists attacking the jews (not just in Israel),  you can speak out against Israel's treatement of terrorists.


I'll speak out against terrorist attacks on jews as I'll speak out against Israel's unproportionate attacks on Palestine.  The calls of anti-semitism doesn't excuse their actions just like it wouldn't excuse the actions of any one here murdering another person because of past atrocities.  And in the end, the slaughter of innocent lives only serves to prolong the dispute.  But it seems you can continue to view every palestinian as a terrorist, if you like.
Back to top
 

Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.
 
IP Logged
 
Soren
Gold Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 25654
Gender: male
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #43 - Jun 18th, 2011 at 7:57pm
 
sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jun 18th, 2011 at 7:50pm:
unproportionate



Please explain.

WHat would you accept as a "proportionate" response to 4 open wars and countless terrorsist attacks around the world?

Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
sir prince duke alevine
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 23619
Gender: male
Re: Jewish, Muslims and animal Cruelty
Reply #44 - Jun 18th, 2011 at 8:03pm
 
Soren wrote on Jun 18th, 2011 at 7:57pm:
sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jun 18th, 2011 at 7:50pm:
unproportionate



Please explain.

WHat would you accept as a "proportionate" response to 4 open wars and countless terrorsist attacks around the world?



International law defines it as: The incidental (i.e., unintended) harm caused to civilians or civilian property must be proportionate and not excessive in relation to the concrete and direct military advantage anticipated by an attack on a military objective.

Furthermore, you are more than welcome to check out episode 3, season 1 of West Wing, which gives you a great dialogue on Proportionality. I know it's pretty amateur to bring up a fictional dialogue, but nonetheless it was fantastic and well worth a watch.
Back to top
« Last Edit: Jun 18th, 2011 at 8:10pm by sir prince duke alevine »  

Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.
 
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 2 3 4 
Send Topic Print