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The tobacco industry and plain packaging (Read 6566 times)
muso
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Re: The tobacco industry and plain packaging
Reply #45 - Jul 30th, 2011 at 11:40am
 
The_Barnacle wrote on Jul 30th, 2011 at 10:44am:
revheadross wrote on Jul 30th, 2011 at 10:26am:
I note your unsubstantiated statement regarding % of smoking . Am I to assume you mean in Oz?  


Yes I mean Australia. I got the figures from here

http://www.quit.org.au/article.asp?ContentID=7240

But this is an issue which doesn't need statistics. Anyone over 40 years old knows that the number of smokers has dropped vastly since the 1970s.

Quote:
Australian adult smoking rates are at an all-time low of around 17 per cent, down from 34 per cent in 1980, making our success in tobacco reform the envy of the world.


Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/national/australian-smoking-rates-are-down-to-an-all-time-low-so-who-is-still-lighting-up-20110130-1a96j.html#ixzz1TXpxxdYG

Clearly the campaign against smoking has been a spectacular success in Australia and the new plan packaging laws will build on that success




The figures are right enough, and I agree that the number of smokers has dropped enormously. I think one major factor has been the banning of smoking in pubs and clubs.

I remember in Africa (Mali in particular) almost everybody smoked and it was a real nuisance trying to find a restaurant seat away from the smoke.  In France, it was pretty bad too, but last year, they also introduced legislation banning smoking in public areas. It seems inconceivable. It was so commonplace.
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revheadross
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Re: The tobacco industry and plain packaging
Reply #46 - Jul 30th, 2011 at 4:03pm
 
Published results from any source with a vested interest must always be viewed with some scepticism.  This applies whether it's this Quit body or indeed the dreaded tobacco industry !  You must know that and acknowledge that , or do you still believe in Santa Claus as well ?
I also hope for your sake that you don't believe all media intent (such as The Age )is honourable , and also that of self serving politicians .   If we don't need statistics , why do you keep quoting them ? What you  need are facts which to date are thin on the ground . There is a vast difference .  I an 64 years of age , and yes, to deny that there has been a reduction in Oz smoking , would be demonstrably wrong .As  I do not have my head in the sand , logic indicates that a whole raft of initiatives other than packaging have probably done this .These include the plethora of horriffic taxpayer funded ads on TV we are assaulted with ad nauseum , mental bludgeoning of smokers by legal segregation & banning  everywhere .    I see Muso also agrees with this . This is designed cleverly to make them feel like second class citizens , along with many other cunning ploys .The desired end result of this is of course to rally all non smokers against their social enemy and wipe them out .Not happening . This sort of social conditioning has been used thru history by people with particular axes to grind . I 'll leave it to you to figure out .     My observation as I move around this great country is that there are still large numbers of smokers obediently going to their alloted areas to indulge and their numbers or percentage is GREATLY underplayed by those with this barrow to push . Surely not even you would purport to know what they get up to in their own homes . Oh , what the hell , make up some "statistics "  Let's not forget here the argument is NOT whether smoking is good or bad .  It should be about EFFECTIVE and efficient means of reducing it if that is your intent .  Again I cite education as , in my opinion , the most effective way of acheiving your end .   I take it that from your non response to that , but only to your current obsessive tack , you dissagree .  Surely it is the way to go instead of a humungous financial impost on ALL Australians based on nothing .Don't forget the politicians would be spending billions of your money on this hi roller gamble at the longest odds imaginable .
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« Last Edit: Jul 30th, 2011 at 4:14pm by revheadross »  

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The_Barnacle
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Re: The tobacco industry and plain packaging
Reply #47 - Jul 31st, 2011 at 9:55am
 
revheadross wrote on Jul 30th, 2011 at 4:03pm:
 Again I cite education as , in my opinion , the most effective way of acheiving your end .   I take it that from your non response to that , but only to your current obsessive tack , you dissagree .


Not at all. Education has been part of the campaign against smoking since it began and I just assumed it was a given. It doesn't have to be either/or. We can have education as well as plain packaging.

Your post was highly amusing with its "us v them" conspiracy theories. The truth is that I don't have a problem with other people smoking, just as long as their smoke doesn't interfere with non smokers. Passive smoking is accepted as just as dangerous as regular smoking (remember, there is no safe level of smoking) so it is every persons right to not be exposed to cigarette smoke if they do not wish to be.
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revheadross
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Re: The tobacco industry and plain packaging
Reply #48 - Jul 31st, 2011 at 3:12pm
 
One of the many things I've learnt in my long life is NEVER to assume anything , particularly in exchanges where there is a difference of opinion . Usually when a verbal protagonist does not prefer to include something in the mix , it means it does not fit their particular stance . That's human nature . Conversely , the human psyche allows us to rabbit on with glee on aspects which we feel will aid our cause .  Speaking of that , I think it is accepted that there is no safe level of smoking for Christ's sake !! Anyway , it's a form of education , so maybe refine your presentation , and it may work for you .Once you reach saturation point , your audience turns off & your message is lost . Do you have to include that quote in almost every post ?   It's rather sad that you found reference to divisive social conditioning techniques "amusing" . They have been used throughout history , very effectively , with results from bad to catostrophic .  That the topic here is tobacco use is inconsequential .  The laws already in place prevent smoke interfering with non smokers!   How the hell will green packs remove something that is not there ?  If you seriously wish to reduce the incidence of smoking put your effort into advocacy for BETTER & MORE EFFECTIVE EDUCATION .  Head butting always indicates strong resolve & ALWAYS produces casualties .     Let's not forget , either , (close your ears kiddies ) , it's also everyone's right to smoke , within the bounds of the law , if they choose. And those laws have become more restrictive many times .     Let's assume the leper packaging push was successful , what would the next one be for ? (and there would be a next one with the " More Might be better " mentality )  .  A black exploding paint ball (with random placebo) could be the go . you know , to mark all the sinners so all the "decent" Aussies will know who they are .   Chop chop sales should go up .
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« Last Edit: Jul 31st, 2011 at 3:21pm by revheadross »  

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