Grey wrote on Aug 18^th, 2011 at 2:16am:



Have you just woken from an endless slumber or something? All those free trade agreements were the toll for the death of most of our occupations. Did you not hear those bells tolling for our past?

It's too late now to throw up barriers as no one would be interested. Howard tore the doors down and the horse has bolted.

Try isolationism now and we're dead meat in a very short time. We'd be excuded from everything and shunned by all.

What are you going to do about refugees? Throw them back in the water? And what of those on aircraft? Will you selectivelt put some of them back on the next plane out?

You must have nodded off while Menzies was still in charge. That's what is obvious fro your words.

boogieman wrote on Aug 18^th, 2011 at 6:17am:


Boogie a lot has changed in the short time since Howard left the stage. Confidence has dropped out of the Euro/USA zone. I think we need to isolate ourselves from the gangrene. I'm not suggesting we stop exporting to Asia our mining product. I do think we should rebuild our manufacturing base; just because you gave something away doesn't mean you can't buy it again. I think tarriffs should come close to erasing the gap created by cheap labour.

If we don't then the alternative is labour and conditions go into a downward spiral here. That's not good for either Chinese or Australian workers.  Strangely during the time Australia didn't have enough population to sustain its own car maker or washing machine it did just that. Now it does have a big enough population it's importing everything.

It doesn't matter what has happened in the past we ahve to deal with now, and what IS, isn't working. Running an isolationist policy didn't stop the USA taking immigrants. It doesn't mean haveing a commandment. THOU SHALT NOT HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH ANYBODY ELSE, you can tailor it to suit.

Grey wrote on Aug 18^th, 2011 at 2:16am:


Don't worry, a pile of minerals,  aussie rules , home renovations, word smiths and property bubbles will keep us going forever No need to go to school or manufacture anything

An actual LEVEL playing field would be good.

I remember years ago when the price of imported frozen OJ concentrate (FCOJ) was equivalent to $20 tonne gate price to the grower for Valencia oranges. The growing/harvesting costs were app’ $110t back then. Brazil’s import tariff was 36% ours 5%. Brazilian (US owned) giant Citrosuco could produce in a day what we could in a season.

The citrus industry has been so decimated that 2 years ago we had to source Lemon juice concentrate……from Cuba, how smacking sad is that.

People have only wanted a fair go, while Europe and the US have heavily subsidized their farmers.

Now we have people hating greens in the power balance 

Templar wrote on Aug 19^th, 2011 at 1:29pm:


That's the official mantra, but it's way off reality. What our manufacturing and agricultural competitors are best at is getting workers to slave for a bowl of rice a day. I say fix tarriffs to take that into account. If they raise wages we should lower tarriffs. What are these 'specialised industries' that will take up the slack? Once Switzerland could set itself up as the bank on the mountain. Those days are long gone. China is manufacturing but its financial sector is growing just as fast.

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Wrong, what keeps Africa poor is the ability of wealth to exploit poverty along with crippling insecurity. What might work and also alleviate refugee problems is for rich countries to lease land from the poor and provide security and jobs. Would be refugees could work in these autonomous zones and prove their suitability for citizenship. Connective tissue between the host and autonomous zone would grow along with rent for the host nation. It would in effect be an engine for growth. The model is Hong Kong.

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Guess what, there is no 'WE'. There are multinational corporations, a week ago Apple could put its hand on more cash than the US government. They've grown big by using Asian sweat shop labour. What you're saying is that when workers in Australia have learn't to work for a bowl of rice they'll come back. Well whoopy do.

Outsourcing is a criminal enterprise. Workers are sold an idea that they will grow with the company. That they ARE the company. An arrangement that goes quite often through generations. Then they get dumped by the fat cats on top, (after buiding the company into a multi national) That's fraud.

Same thing applies to the agricultural sector. Farmers invest their lives, as only farmers no how. They do that with an understanding of the rules. Then as FriYAY has pointed out, the rules get changed. For a hundred years Australia has protected farmers from exotic pests and diseases, just for this generation to throw out the baby? To suit the city suits? Give over, that's not a fair go.

freediver wrote on Aug 19^th, 2011 at 8:41pm:


Nothing you say has any substance. It is not harder to attack a point of view that is ridiculously wrong rather than one that's a bit wrong. The suggestion is absurd, put up or shut up.

freediver wrote on Aug 20^th, 2011 at 9:14am:


And you have the affrontery to call me lazy? Post #9 gives you plenty of points to rebutt. Let me remind you how effusive the learned were at the wonderful idea of dumping the gold standard. Now they have the wonderful idea of returning to the gold standard. Everything old is new again.