Australian Politics Forum - Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault

longweekend58

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Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault
Reply #30 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 9:19am

Equitist wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 10:36pm:

Soren wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 10:22pm:

Dnarever wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 9:28pm:

Luke Fowler wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 9:20pm:

I think it is marvellous that Abbott and Gillard's ridiculous race to the bottom on asylum seekers, and their desperate attempts to play politics over the issue, will actually lead to the end of off-shore processing for a long time to come.

If the Liberals don't support the Labor amendments while they are in opposition, they sure as hell won't get their own amendments passed through when they are in Government. The Greens won't be supporting the legislation and its highly likely they will still have the balance of power in the Senate come 2013.

The two majors cut off their noses to spite their face and we get onshore processing for at least another electoral cycle.

Every cloud does have a silver lining.

Hope you are right.

If Abbott gets a big enough majority at the next election (which is very likely), stand by for a double dissolution at the first sign of Senate (ie Green) obscurantism. If the electorate gives Abbott a big majority, it will still support him if he can show that the Greens are acting against his pre-election policies that got him elected.

So if Abbott wins big, the Greens will be wiped out soon after as Abbott will still get over 50% of the vote in a double dissolution. The Greens will be out in the cold for 8 years - a very long time for a minor party. Brown will be gone and the green and red factions will tear the party apart.

Even if Tony Abbott manages to force a DD, methinks you are overestimating the popularity of an incumbent who would mess with our democracy thus!

Abbott has already demonstrated a flagrant disregard for both parliamentary and judicial processes - and a willingness to dispense with his own party's principles in the process...

Don't bet on the general public putting up with Abbott's incessant crap on an indefinite basis!

I'd still wager that Abbott's Tropposition is the most popular opposition never to be elected!

Why is a DD a breach of democracy? it is part of the constitution and has (ironically for you) been used by LABOR in the past. Rudd had the opportunity but didnt use it because he was a vacillating fool.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Soren

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Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault
Reply #31 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 9:21am

Dnarever wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 8:45pm:

Quote:

The Prime Minister today accused Mr Abbott of neglecting the national interest by refusing to back Labor's Malaysian Solution, saying he was “terrified Malaysia would work”.

“His political opposition will see more boats come to this country - that's how reckless he's being,”

Ms Gillard told ABC radio.

Sums it up nicely.

This is what you are saying:

Gillard makes an absolute dog's breakfast of asylum-seeker policy, proposes measures that large swaths of her own party find reprehensible and suddenly it's Abbott's responsibility to fix it.

Stupidity is unmistakable unifying marker of the green/left pillockracy.

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Dnarever

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Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault
Reply #32 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 9:36am

Soren wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 9:21am:

Dnarever wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 8:45pm:

Quote:

The Prime Minister today accused Mr Abbott of neglecting the national interest by refusing to back Labor's Malaysian Solution, saying he was “terrified Malaysia would work”.

“His political opposition will see more boats come to this country - that's how reckless he's being,”

Ms Gillard told ABC radio.

Sums it up nicely.

This is what you are saying:

Gillard makes an absolute dog's breakfast of asylum-seeker policy, proposes measures that large swaths of her own party find reprehensible and suddenly it's Abbott's responsibility to fix it.

Stupidity is unmistakable unifying marker of the green/left pillockracy.

No not at all - he has no say in fixing anything - in fact he would be incapable of fixing it.

But if he is going to block the legislation which would fix it he needs to take responsibility for his negative wreaking actions and for not acting in Australias interests.

His own actions in this also block his recomended policy Nauru and this method is what he had originally suggested and offered to support.

He has clearly taken both sides of this discussion in being

Both:

For and Against changing the Legislation.

For and against Offshore Processing.

For and against stopping the boats.

Tony Abbott is blowing in the wind.

He has no credability and can not even support his own commitments.

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Dsmithy70

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Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault
Reply #33 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 9:40am

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 6:54am:

Luke Fowler wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 9:20pm:

I think it is marvellous that Abbott and Gillard's ridiculous race to the bottom on asylum seekers, and their desperate attempts to play politics over the issue, will actually lead to the end of off-shore processing for a long time to come.

If the Liberals don't support the Labor amendments while they are in opposition, they sure as hell won't get their own amendments passed through when they are in Government. The Greens won't be supporting the legislation and its highly likely they will still have the balance of power in the Senate come 2013.

The two majors cut off their noses to spite their face and we get onshore processing for at least another electoral cycle.

Every cloud does have a silver lining.

Will you also think it wonderful when a few more boats are lost at sea with all hands, or more boats end up on the rocks at Christmas Island?
Some silver lining that is.

Funny, when Siev X happened it was
"take the risk suffer the consequences"
Now it's all "think of the children"
FFS
Hypocrisy thy name is Liberal

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REBELLION is not what most people think it is.
REBELLION is when you turn off the TV & start educating & thinking for yourself.
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Dnarever

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Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault
Reply #34 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 9:46am

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 8:46am:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 8:59pm:

Watch cspan from capitial hill and you'll know Tony's next move.
His playing from the exact same playbook as the repugs over there.
Power at all costs, never mind the damage, we'll try and clean it up once we are in power.

i think you are referring to labor there. the party with less seats, less votes but formed a govt. 'POWER AT ALL COSTS' (J Gillard 2010)

Labor got the same number of seats and had more votes.

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cods

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Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault
Reply #35 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 10:20am

Dsmithy70 wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 9:40am:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 6:54am:

Luke Fowler wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 9:20pm:

I think it is marvellous that Abbott and Gillard's ridiculous race to the bottom on asylum seekers, and their desperate attempts to play politics over the issue, will actually lead to the end of off-shore processing for a long time to come.

If the Liberals don't support the Labor amendments while they are in opposition, they sure as hell won't get their own amendments passed through when they are in Government. The Greens won't be supporting the legislation and its highly likely they will still have the balance of power in the Senate come 2013.

The two majors cut off their noses to spite their face and we get onshore processing for at least another electoral cycle.

Every cloud does have a silver lining.

Will you also think it wonderful when a few more boats are lost at sea with all hands, or more boats end up on the rocks at Christmas Island?
Some silver lining that is.

Funny, when Siev X happened it was
"take the risk suffer the consequences"
Now it's all "think of the children"
FFS
Hypocrisy thy name is Liberal

hey we didnt open the borders remember???..its your mob thats now claiming they are all heart and soul trying to stop people taking their lives in their hands and paying people smugglers.. what a bloody awful hypocracy is that???

she was there she was right there when they dropped the pacific solution... when we told her the boats would come she laughed...

not at all let me say this?????....you Libs dont know what you are talking about..

now almost 4 years later... how many deaths we will never know as a boat disappeared in 2009 with over 100 on board..and no one knows anything about it..???????especially this govt... even though our Navy reported it..

its amazing how blind you are to what is happening RIGHT NOW..its like very convenient memory loss..

how many people lost their lives during the Pacific Solution???????

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Soren

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Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault
Reply #36 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 10:33am

Dnarever wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 9:36am:

Soren wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 9:21am:

Dnarever wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 8:45pm:

Quote:

The Prime Minister today accused Mr Abbott of neglecting the national interest by refusing to back Labor's Malaysian Solution, saying he was “terrified Malaysia would work”.

“His political opposition will see more boats come to this country - that's how reckless he's being,”

Ms Gillard told ABC radio.

Sums it up nicely.

This is what you are saying:

Gillard makes an absolute dog's breakfast of asylum-seeker policy, proposes measures that large swaths of her own party find reprehensible and suddenly it's Abbott's responsibility to fix it.

Stupidity is unmistakable unifying marker of the green/left pillockracy.

No not at all - he has no say in fixing anything - in fact he would be incapable of fixing it.

But if he is going to block the legislation which would fix it he needs to take responsibility for his negative wreaking actions and for not acting in Australias interests.

His own actions in this also block his recomended policy Nauru and this method is what he had originally suggested and offered to support.

He has clearly taken both sides of this discussion in being

Both:

For and Against changing the Legislation.

For and against Offshore Processing.

For and against stopping the boats.

Tony Abbott is blowing in the wind.

He has no credability and can not even support his own commitments.

Pre 2007 policy that worked = Nauru + TPVs.

Easy fixed.

The Malaysia option has no merit. Why support it?

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gizmo_2655

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Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault
Reply #37 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 10:35am

Maqqa wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 12:59am:

Luke Fowler wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 9:20pm:

I think it is marvellous that Abbott and Gillard's ridiculous race to the bottom on asylum seekers, and their desperate attempts to play politics over the issue, will actually lead to the end of off-shore processing for a long time to come.

If the Liberals don't support the Labor amendments while they are in opposition, they sure as hell won't get their own amendments passed through when they are in Government. The Greens won't be supporting the legislation and its highly likely they will still have the balance of power in the Senate come 2013.

The two majors cut off their noses to spite their face and we get onshore processing for at least another electoral cycle.

Every cloud does have a silver lining.

How many seats will the ALP and/or Greens win with those numbers?

How many seats are up for re-election in 2013

In the Senate??.....Half of the seats ar up for re-election in 2013..(or at the next election)

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Dsmithy70

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Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault
Reply #38 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 1:17pm

cods wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 10:20am:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 9:40am:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 6:54am:

Luke Fowler wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 9:20pm:

I think it is marvellous that Abbott and Gillard's ridiculous race to the bottom on asylum seekers, and their desperate attempts to play politics over the issue, will actually lead to the end of off-shore processing for a long time to come.

If the Liberals don't support the Labor amendments while they are in opposition, they sure as hell won't get their own amendments passed through when they are in Government. The Greens won't be supporting the legislation and its highly likely they will still have the balance of power in the Senate come 2013.

The two majors cut off their noses to spite their face and we get onshore processing for at least another electoral cycle.

Every cloud does have a silver lining.

Will you also think it wonderful when a few more boats are lost at sea with all hands, or more boats end up on the rocks at Christmas Island?
Some silver lining that is.

Funny, when Siev X happened it was
"take the risk suffer the consequences"
Now it's all "think of the children"
FFS
Hypocrisy thy name is Liberal

hey we didnt open the borders remember???..its your mob thats now claiming they are all heart and soul trying to stop people taking their lives in their hands and paying people smugglers.. what a bloody awful hypocracy is that???

she was there she was right there when they dropped the pacific solution... when we told her the boats would come she laughed...

not at all let me say this?????....you Libs dont know what you are talking about..

now almost 4 years later... how many deaths we will never know as a boat disappeared in 2009 with over 100 on board..and no one knows anything about it..???????especially this govt... even though our Navy reported it..

its amazing how blind you are to what is happening RIGHT NOW..its like very convenient memory loss..

how many people lost their lives during the Pacific Solution???????

Actually I think you'll find I have been consistent in my attitude to refugee's.
Onshore processing, maximum 6 months detention, deportation of those found wanting.
I also stick by my thoughts that we should tie Indo funding to allowing AFP officers to operate within Indo to arrest & deport smugglers, who then face lengthy gaol stays and assets stripped.

Why don't you try a bit of consistency instead of cheap dis-ingenious crocodile tears.

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REBELLION is not what most people think it is.
REBELLION is when you turn off the TV & start educating & thinking for yourself.
Gavin Nascimento

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Maqqa Gold Member Offline 14% - that low?! Posts: 16000	Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault Reply #39 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 1:30pm but dsmithy you've not expressed any comment about ILLEGALS
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chicken_lipsforme

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Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault
Reply #40 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 1:30pm

Dsmithy70 wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 9:40am:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 6:54am:

Luke Fowler wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 9:20pm:

I think it is marvellous that Abbott and Gillard's ridiculous race to the bottom on asylum seekers, and their desperate attempts to play politics over the issue, will actually lead to the end of off-shore processing for a long time to come.

If the Liberals don't support the Labor amendments while they are in opposition, they sure as hell won't get their own amendments passed through when they are in Government. The Greens won't be supporting the legislation and its highly likely they will still have the balance of power in the Senate come 2013.

The two majors cut off their noses to spite their face and we get onshore processing for at least another electoral cycle.

Every cloud does have a silver lining.

Will you also think it wonderful when a few more boats are lost at sea with all hands, or more boats end up on the rocks at Christmas Island?
Some silver lining that is.

Funny, when Siev X happened it was
"take the risk suffer the consequences"
Now it's all "think of the children"
FFS
Hypocrisy thy name is Liberal

Oh smithy, they are the new gay lesbian whale family friendly party.
Cmon, we can change.

Well, maybe not this week. Undecided

But I think we can all agree that a few more episodes of smugglers boats being smashed to pieces on the rocks with a bloodsucking media showing live video of woman and children drowning right on our screens is bad for business. Cry

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"Another boat, another policy failure from the Howard government"

Julia Gillard
Shadow Health Minister
2003.

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chicken_lipsforme

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Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault
Reply #41 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 1:34pm

Soren wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 10:33am:

Dnarever wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 9:36am:

Soren wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 9:21am:

Dnarever wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 8:45pm:

Quote:

The Prime Minister today accused Mr Abbott of neglecting the national interest by refusing to back Labor's Malaysian Solution, saying he was “terrified Malaysia would work”.

“His political opposition will see more boats come to this country - that's how reckless he's being,”

Ms Gillard told ABC radio.

Sums it up nicely.

This is what you are saying:

Gillard makes an absolute dog's breakfast of asylum-seeker policy, proposes measures that large swaths of her own party find reprehensible and suddenly it's Abbott's responsibility to fix it.

Stupidity is unmistakable unifying marker of the green/left pillockracy.

No not at all - he has no say in fixing anything - in fact he would be incapable of fixing it.

But if he is going to block the legislation which would fix it he needs to take responsibility for his negative wreaking actions and for not acting in Australias interests.

His own actions in this also block his recomended policy Nauru and this method is what he had originally suggested and offered to support.

He has clearly taken both sides of this discussion in being

Both:

For and Against changing the Legislation.

For and against Offshore Processing.

For and against stopping the boats.

Tony Abbott is blowing in the wind.

He has no credability and can not even support his own commitments.

Pre 2007 policy that worked = Nauru + TPVs.

Easy fixed.

The Malaysia option has no merit. Why support it?

Abbott is totally correct in not sponsoring bad policy from a bad government, and would win very few friends if he did so.
Oddly enough, Labor aren't wailing at their 'partners in incompetence', the Greens for not supporting them.

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"Another boat, another policy failure from the Howard government"

Julia Gillard
Shadow Health Minister
2003.

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Armchair_Politician

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Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault
Reply #42 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 1:41pm

Dnarever wrote on Sep 20^th, 2011 at 8:45pm:

Quote:

The Prime Minister today accused Mr Abbott of neglecting the national interest by refusing to back Labor's Malaysian Solution, saying he was “terrified Malaysia would work”.

“His political opposition will see more boats come to this country - that's how reckless he's being,”

Ms Gillard told ABC radio.

Sums it up nicely.

LABOR negotiated the Malaysia deal with the Malaysians, with the Coalition playing no part in that debacle whatsoever other than to assert their opposition to the deal. It was LABOR that was defeated in the High Court in a majority decision of six judges to one. It was a LABOR Immigration Minister who was given an almighty smack-down by the High Court for over-extending his authority. It amuses me that this entire farce is of Labor's own making and that the Coalition played no part in it whatsoever, yet they somehow think they can tie Abbott to it and blame him for it. What a joke!

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Dsmithy70

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Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault
Reply #43 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 2:30pm

Maqqa wrote on Sep 21^st, 2011 at 1:30pm:

but dsmithy

you've not expressed any comment about ILLEGALS

Because I believe everyone has the right to seek asylum.
Therefore they only become "illegal" after processing & found to be non genuine refugee's.
However if you wish to discuss true "illegals" i.e the visa overstayers who come via plane, well we need more immgration officer's to hunt them down & deport them on the NPO (next plane out)

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REBELLION is not what most people think it is.
REBELLION is when you turn off the TV & start educating & thinking for yourself.
Gavin Nascimento

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Soren Gold Member Offline Posts: 25654 Gender:	Re: Gillard: my incompetence is Abbott's fault Reply #44 - Sep 21^st, 2011 at 2:36pm How would you deport illegal boat arrivals who come without passports?
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