Australian Politics Forum - Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!

longweekend58

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Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #90 - Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:44pm

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:38pm:

You're confusing outlay with profits paid to fund the lifestyles of millionaire pastors.

i'm not saying that christian workers shouldnt be able to buy food , buy trucks to deliver that food etc.

It's the driving around in mercedes , the extravagant house and lifestyle sthat people like the hillsong (and catholic churches) enjoy.

Tax all self proclaimed "churches" and give tax deductions for any charitable works (including having to buy trucks to deliver food etc)

and if these things are all earned by their own efforts - eg speaking and books then why is this wrong? do u think no one should be allowed to earn a good income? are you channeling equitist tonight?

so its ok to be rich as long as you dont go to church as well. correct?

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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darkhall67

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Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #91 - Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:46pm

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:42pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:40pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:34pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:29pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:22pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:18pm:

[quote author=lon

you wouldnt be surprised because if you were told that 50% went to the poor you'd only say it wasnt true. See, you arent really interested in truth - hence your 0.1% stupidity - it it was stupidity, not hyperbole. If the church gave 99% of its income you'd still complain. If they gave 100% youd find something to argue that they should be giving 150% of income - all while you did nothing.

You criticise imperfect effort while sitting back and doing nothing yourself. Who do you really think is thanking you for that? the starving in Zimbabwe?

No.

If they gave 100 percent I would say that they are doing christs teachings.

And by the way , you have NO idea what I do

actually I do. it is almost always the same. the loudest voices in complaint are usually those who do the least. its true in every aspect of life. They give $20 occasionally to a charity and think they are doing well while criticsing people who give 10% of their salaries and their free time and skills to help the poor.

Ive seen it all before. You MAY be one of the few exceptions, but statistics are overwhelmingly on my side.

But they are NOT giving it to the poor are they?

They are giving it to the rich.

now you just sound stupid and nail-like. in the Bible - since you want to quote it - the donations were brought to the house of God (the church) and the leaders distributed it from there INCLUDING to the running of the church and to its leaders. Funny, the biblical command sounds awefully like what teh Church actually does.

Does that biblical command say that the church leaders should travel by gold plated chariot, live in the biggest mansions, wear the best and most expensive silk togas, eat the best food and drink the best wines?

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longweekend58

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Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #92 - Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:53pm

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:46pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:42pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:40pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:34pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:29pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:22pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:18pm:

[quote author=lon

you wouldnt be surprised because if you were told that 50% went to the poor you'd only say it wasnt true. See, you arent really interested in truth - hence your 0.1% stupidity - it it was stupidity, not hyperbole. If the church gave 99% of its income you'd still complain. If they gave 100% youd find something to argue that they should be giving 150% of income - all while you did nothing.

You criticise imperfect effort while sitting back and doing nothing yourself. Who do you really think is thanking you for that? the starving in Zimbabwe?

No.

If they gave 100 percent I would say that they are doing christs teachings.

And by the way , you have NO idea what I do

actually I do. it is almost always the same. the loudest voices in complaint are usually those who do the least. its true in every aspect of life. They give $20 occasionally to a charity and think they are doing well while criticsing people who give 10% of their salaries and their free time and skills to help the poor.

Ive seen it all before. You MAY be one of the few exceptions, but statistics are overwhelmingly on my side.

But they are NOT giving it to the poor are they?

They are giving it to the rich.

now you just sound stupid and nail-like. in the Bible - since you want to quote it - the donations were brought to the house of God (the church) and the leaders distributed it from there INCLUDING to the running of the church and to its leaders. Funny, the biblical command sounds awefully like what teh Church actually does.

Does that biblical command say that the church leaders should travel by gold plated chariot, live in the biggest mansions, wear the best and most expensive silk togas, eat the best food and drink the best wines?

and now we get right down to it. lets not care one iota about feeding the poor or helping the sick. this is about a handful of pastors who are good enough authors to make enough money to buy a nice house and a good car. so when this entire rant is boiled down it is done to ENVY? how disappointing. I wish I could say I was surprised. but these threads ALL boil down to this.

You dont care for the poor yourself but you do at least abuse those that do. How altruistic of you.

BTW one of Gods favoured people in history was David - a very rich king follwed by his son who was much loved by God and the richest person in all of history. both were made this way by God.

your biblical theology is as bad as your disinterest in the poor.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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darkhall67

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Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #93 - Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:53pm

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:44pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:38pm:

You're confusing outlay with profits paid to fund the lifestyles of millionaire pastors.

i'm not saying that christian workers shouldnt be able to buy food , buy trucks to deliver that food etc.

It's the driving around in mercedes , the extravagant house and lifestyle sthat people like the hillsong (and catholic churches) enjoy.

Tax all self proclaimed "churches" and give tax deductions for any charitable works (including having to buy trucks to deliver food etc)

and if these things are all earned by their own efforts - eg speaking and books then why is this wrong? do u think no one should be allowed to earn a good income? are you channeling equitist tonight?

so its ok to be rich as long as you dont go to church as well. correct?

If you are claiming to be an expert in the teachings of jesus christ then YES.

YES YES YES YES YES.

That's EXACTLY what I am saying.

If you are just some poor pleb trying to get by , who happens to believe in jesus (by family inheritance usually) then I wouldnt expect the same diligence to adhering to gods word.

But if you claim to SPEAK FOR JESUS and you claim some higher authority and knowledge then YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES
you CANNOT be rich.

You CANNOT live that extravagant lifestyle.
YOu CANNOT ask hundreds of thousands of peope to give their money to you so you can live that extravagant lifestyle NO MATTER THAT YOU MIGHT GIVE .1 percent , 1 percent , 50 percent and more to the poor.

Thank you for helping me make that clear.

good night

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longweekend58

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Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #94 - Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:54pm

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:46pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:42pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:40pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:34pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:29pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:22pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:18pm:

[quote author=lon

you wouldnt be surprised because if you were told that 50% went to the poor you'd only say it wasnt true. See, you arent really interested in truth - hence your 0.1% stupidity - it it was stupidity, not hyperbole. If the church gave 99% of its income you'd still complain. If they gave 100% youd find something to argue that they should be giving 150% of income - all while you did nothing.

You criticise imperfect effort while sitting back and doing nothing yourself. Who do you really think is thanking you for that? the starving in Zimbabwe?

No.

If they gave 100 percent I would say that they are doing christs teachings.

And by the way , you have NO idea what I do

actually I do. it is almost always the same. the loudest voices in complaint are usually those who do the least. its true in every aspect of life. They give $20 occasionally to a charity and think they are doing well while criticsing people who give 10% of their salaries and their free time and skills to help the poor.

Ive seen it all before. You MAY be one of the few exceptions, but statistics are overwhelmingly on my side.

But they are NOT giving it to the poor are they?

They are giving it to the rich.

now you just sound stupid and nail-like. in the Bible - since you want to quote it - the donations were brought to the house of God (the church) and the leaders distributed it from there INCLUDING to the running of the church and to its leaders. Funny, the biblical command sounds awefully like what teh Church actually does.

Does that biblical command say that the church leaders should travel by gold plated chariot, live in the biggest mansions, wear the best and most expensive silk togas, eat the best food and drink the best wines?

youve obviously not driven in a mercedes. they are over-rated and over-priced.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #95 - Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:58pm

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:53pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:44pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:38pm:

You're confusing outlay with profits paid to fund the lifestyles of millionaire pastors.

i'm not saying that christian workers shouldnt be able to buy food , buy trucks to deliver that food etc.

It's the driving around in mercedes , the extravagant house and lifestyle sthat people like the hillsong (and catholic churches) enjoy.

Tax all self proclaimed "churches" and give tax deductions for any charitable works (including having to buy trucks to deliver food etc)

and if these things are all earned by their own efforts - eg speaking and books then why is this wrong? do u think no one should be allowed to earn a good income? are you channeling equitist tonight?

so its ok to be rich as long as you dont go to church as well. correct?

If you are claiming to be an expert in the teachings of jesus christ then YES.

YES YES YES YES YES.

That's EXACTLY what I am saying.

If you are just some poor pleb trying to get by , who happens to believe in jesus (by family inheritance usually) then I wouldnt expect the same diligence to adhering to gods word.

But if you claim to SPEAK FOR JESUS and you claim some higher authority and knowledge then YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES
you CANNOT be rich.

You CANNOT live that extravagant lifestyle.
YOu CANNOT ask hundreds of thousands of peope to give their money to you so you can live that extravagant lifestyle NO MATTER THAT YOU MIGHT GIVE .1 percent , 1 percent , 50 percent and more to the poor.

Thank you for helping me make that clear.

good night

you may now return to that safe place of self-interest and self-belief where there are no poor people and you dont need to care about them. as for the Church, we will take our flawed selves out into the community and feed the hungry and carae for the sick.

yep some will rort and some will also steal. we are not immune from that.

But when you drill a well for a village that has no water do you think that even matters? do you think ANYONE cares if Brian Houston drives a merc if he leads a church that feeds 10,000 people or runs a home that save 600 cambodian preteens from prostitution?

you have a funny set of priorities.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Sir lastnail

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Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #96 - Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:58pm

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:44pm:

darkhall67 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:38pm:

You're confusing outlay with profits paid to fund the lifestyles of millionaire pastors.

i'm not saying that christian workers shouldnt be able to buy food , buy trucks to deliver that food etc.

It's the driving around in mercedes , the extravagant house and lifestyle sthat people like the hillsong (and catholic churches) enjoy.

Tax all self proclaimed "churches" and give tax deductions for any charitable works (including having to buy trucks to deliver food etc)

and if these things are all earned by their own efforts - eg speaking and books then why is this wrong? do u think no one should be allowed to earn a good income? are you channeling equitist tonight?

so its ok to be rich as long as you dont go to church as well. correct?

selling gold passes to heaven Cheesy

LOL

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In August 2021, Newcastle Coroner Karen Dilks recorded that Lisa Shaw had died “due to complications of an AstraZeneca COVID vaccination”.

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Uncle Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 688	Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !! Reply #97 - Nov 10^th, 2011 at 11:14pm Jesus Christ was a socialist
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Sprintcyclist

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Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #98 - Nov 10^th, 2011 at 11:50pm

Uncle wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 11:14pm:

Jesus Christ was a socialist

http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m242/axiemeluv/Smiley/nod.gif

hahahha - try reading the NT

imho, all religions should be subject to taxes set by the govt.
they may be permitted to offsets due to donations of the needy, but if they are profitable (which is good), they should pay tax on the net profit.
Which is fine.

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Modern Classic Right Wing

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Sprintcyclist Moderator Offline OzPolitic Posts: 40755 Gender:	Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !! Reply #99 - Nov 10^th, 2011 at 11:52pm there is a church by me that gives away 20 Ton of food each and every week to the poor and needy. They should pay taxes on their profit, minus some consideration for that ongoing deed.
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Grey

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Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #100 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 1:10am

Sprintcyclist wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 11:52pm:

there is a church by me that gives away 20 Ton of food each and every week to the poor and needy.

They should pay taxes on their profit, minus some consideration for that ongoing deed.

What church is that? Where do they get the food from? The 20 ton figure is just the excrement of steers isn't it? The food they 'give' is food donated by bakeries and supermarkets isn't it?

Quote:

LW -
the christian church currently feeds 40% zimbabwe. now red that again... FORTY PERCENT OF A COUNTRY.

More excrement of steers. ICRC mounts a huge effort in Zim as does OXFAM, churches give away biscuits for sunday school attendance and run around telling people they'll burn in hell for wearing condoms. Missionaries should get out of the road and let the proffessionals get on with the job.

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"It is in the shelter of each other that the people live" - Irish Proverb

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Ex Dame Pansi

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Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #101 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 6:40am

The bottom line is that if the churches were doing their job efficiently they would be scraping the bottom of the barrel.

There are still too many hungry and homeless and the church still has too much money.

If the church wants to make a profit, it should pay tax on it.

It seems that the church uses the same 10% tithe as the parishioners. Not good enough, 10% for the sheep, 100% for the shepherd.

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andrei said: Great isn't it? Seeing boatloads of what is nothing more than human garbage turn up.....

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Uncle Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 688	Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !! Reply #102 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 7:16am Sprintcyclist wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 11:50pm: Uncle wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 11:14pm: Jesus Christ was a socialist http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m242/axiemeluv/Smiley/nod.gif hahahha - try reading the NT I have
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Verge

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Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #103 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 8:31am

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 3:44pm:

Verge wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 3:19pm:

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 1:48pm:

... wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 1:39pm:

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 1:33pm:

Yes churches should pay tax, but they never will. They will create safe havens and tax breaks to get around it. I've seen how they operate. They develop a business and claim that it is an arm of the church so they operate tax free. They can have 20 or 30 businesses all making big profits and all running tax free.

Religion is part of the 1% that don't contribute to the country.

Ahh but do religious based charities do unpaid work that benefits society?

They do and so do non religious charities which are usually not for profit organisations.

Some religious organisations could be not for profit, but I know a lot that are not and they make huge profits without paying tax. Now if the huge profits went back into charity, good thing, but it usually goes into hoarding real estate and other investment schemes.

You do realise that not for profit doesnt mean they dont make a profit, it means the profits are not distributed and retained by the organisation soley.

Might be worth learning that.

OK. So let them pay tax on their profit, that's fair.

Churches are supposed to be charities, isn't that the whole following Jesus idea. They pay tax like everyone else and they help the needy like they are supposed to do.

You miss the point though. You can only disperse profits to owners/shareholders, they receive an dividend.

If they pay tax, who are they able to disperse the income to by way of dividend, and pass on any imputation credit as well to, like any other business you say?

For example, ANZ pays tax, disperses income to my wife and those dividends have already had the tax paid on them at the corporate rate. My wife then gets a refund on them.

Who does the church do that with if they dont have anyone to disperse the income to?

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Sir lastnail

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Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #104 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 8:32am

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 10:53pm:

and now we get right down to it. lets not care one iota about feeding the poor or helping the sick. this is about a handful of pastors who are good enough authors to make enough money to buy a nice house and a good car. so when this entire rant is boiled down it is done to ENVY? how disappointing. I wish I could say I was surprised. but these threads ALL boil down to this.

You dont care for the poor yourself but you do at least abuse those that do. How altruistic of you.

BTW one of Gods favoured people in history was David - a very rich king follwed by his son who was much loved by God and the richest person in all of history. both were made this way by God.

your biblical theology is as bad as your disinterest in the poor.

yes but you should read ALL of your bible. Where does Jesus charge people money to listen to him ??

Why are these scammers charging money to spread the word of god ?? surely it would be minimal overhead to setup a website and offer all of the music, video and literature as free downloads or just enough to cover the website !!

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In August 2021, Newcastle Coroner Karen Dilks recorded that Lisa Shaw had died “due to complications of an AstraZeneca COVID vaccination”.

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