Australian Politics Forum - Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!

longweekend58

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 45675
Gender: male

Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #150 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 2:32pm

Sir lastnail wrote on Nov 11^th, 2011 at 12:56pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 11^th, 2011 at 12:47pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Nov 11^th, 2011 at 11:02am:

Verge wrote on Nov 11^th, 2011 at 10:45am:

But these pastors you say are making millions from books etc, they dont have tax free status. So the ones you claiming are becoming rich, are actually paying tax anyway.

Ive already explained to you what a not for profit is, but your claim the millionaire pastors are getting a free ride is false.

You are obfuscating it.

Is the money put into the offering plate each sunday taxed or not ??

I'm not talking about the free loaders and parasites who pay themselves a wage from that money. I am talking about the money that comes through the door and put into the offering plate.

If I run a business and sell something then I have to pay GST to the Government. What GST does the church pay on its takings ??

no group anywhere in the country has to pay tax on DONATIONS given to it. nor should they. donations given to the church are not for a service or product. does the Red Cross pay tax on the donatoins you give them? no. so why shoudl the church?

Then how much of what they take goes to charity and how much goes into their own coffers ?? Nobody knows because it is a legalised scam.

and they are not donations. people go to church to buy a gold pass to heaven. The church could easily tell people to stay at home and pray in private which is exactly what the bible says to do. But the bible bashers want you to go there and pay them otherwise you can't get your ticket to heaven Sad

that kind of comment torpedoes everything you say because it reveals your argument as nothing more than a rant.

Back to top

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

IP Logged

longweekend58

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 45675
Gender: male

Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #151 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 2:39pm

Verge wrote on Nov 11^th, 2011 at 2:06pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Nov 11^th, 2011 at 12:36pm:

Verge wrote on Nov 11^th, 2011 at 12:30pm:

It all comes down to who owns these assets. If the church owns them, there is still a fringe benefits tax liability, they cant step around that. Any income moved to them is taxed by them.

Ultimatley, if these guys die and the church owns everything, then the church keeps it.

Tax law I know.

You need to understand the law if you want to mount a case against it, so look up the taxation law definition of not for profit and dispersing of income.

You keep missing the points though, you want them taxed because you are claiming they are corporates. Thats false because of the dispersement of income.

If you had of said you want not for profits taxed, and all not for profits taxed because you think every organisation should be taxed then thats a whole other story.

But then again you would like the local cricket club with 20 players and $1000 in the bank paying tax too

you are an apologist for bullshit artists and scammers.

The church doesn't pay GST on its takings and yet they continue to sell gold passes to heaven as well as lots of other intangible rubbish. They are a business selling rubbish and not paying any tax on their sales. It's as simple as that !!

An apoligist I am not.

I just to base my arguements on facts. If you dont bother to learn the law, how are you going to challange it?

But hey nail, letting the facts get in the way of a good story has never been your strong point.

Noticed that, did you? The hardest thing to do here is get a good fact-based debate going.

Back to top

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

IP Logged

Gist

Gold Member

Offline

I am not a sock, I am
a human being!

Posts: 5476

Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #152 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 4:51pm

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 9:38pm:

Uncle wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 9:19pm:

Gist wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 6:48pm:

Is the Sanitarium company still a tax free arm of the Adventist church? Used to be. They'd probably make the Hillsong look like tiddlers.

Now we're getting there...

this old furphy AGAIN? Sanitariium is non tax-exempt. they pay 30% tax on all profits juist as every other company does (except miners who pay more!). But the reason they pay no tax on profits is they make no profit (they pay the normal payrol taxes, GST and levies). They make no profit because at the end of the year all surpluses are given to a tax deductible charity.

You can pay no tax too. all you have to do is donate your entire salary minus deductions to charity - just as they do.

Well yes... the "tax deductible charity" is the Adventist Church. Who also happens to own them. In any other corporation, disbursement of profits to the owners would be called "paying a dividend" and would be taxed. But in this case, it's called a "donation" and so deductible and not taxed. Nice little setup, innit?

Back to top

"When our military goes to war it should be for purposes and objectives clearly in Australia’s interests, not merely because the Americans want some company" - Malcolm Fraser (2012 Whitlam Oration)

IP Logged

Gist

Gold Member

Offline

I am not a sock, I am
a human being!

Posts: 5476

Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #153 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 4:53pm

Y'know, I'm thinking I'll set up a Pastafarian Church. I'll go to work for it for nada provided it provides me food and lodgings which it'll need to provide (I'm happy to donate my house, car, etc to the Pastafarian cause so it can probably let me use that!).

The Church can send me to work for the company that I work for now provided they're willing to donate an amount equal to my current salary to the cause. The Church will go to work waking up idiot Christians to the fact that their god doesn't exist and they should convert to Pastafarianism. I'm sure I can come up with a flyer that can be handed out. We can print it on my printer. Hell! (Pastafarians are allowed to say that) Maybe even a website!!!

Tuesday will be pasta day - a bowl of pasta free to anyone who hasn't eaten for 2 weeks (we want to help the truly needy - the ones that those idiot Christian churches ignore).

I'll write a book of course. I'll sell it to you lot at a discount - just $20 for lefties, $200 for righties (because they can afford it). Can I put you down for one longy?

Back to top

"When our military goes to war it should be for purposes and objectives clearly in Australia’s interests, not merely because the Americans want some company" - Malcolm Fraser (2012 Whitlam Oration)

IP Logged

Gist Gold Member Offline I am not a sock, I am a human being! Posts: 5476	Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !! Reply #154 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 4:57pm I'm also available for speaking engagements. I can give motivational talks about creative noodle dishes. Very reasonable rates! It'll be a donation of course, so is tax deductible for you.
Back to top	"When our military goes to war it should be for purposes and objectives clearly in Australia’s interests, not merely because the Americans want some company" - Malcolm Fraser (2012 Whitlam Oration) IP Logged

Gist Gold Member Offline I am not a sock, I am a human being! Posts: 5476	Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !! Reply #155 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 5:01pm Being of an italian heritage, I am of course imbued throughout my body with the goodness of the noodle and am therefore well equipped to provide guidance, healing and spiritual comfort. I do home visits for the sick at heart or those who have eaten too much protein.
Back to top	"When our military goes to war it should be for purposes and objectives clearly in Australia’s interests, not merely because the Americans want some company" - Malcolm Fraser (2012 Whitlam Oration) IP Logged

Gist

Gold Member

Offline

I am not a sock, I am
a human being!

Posts: 5476

Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #156 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 5:06pm

We're currently taking donations towards our primary charity which is of course our Church building. I'm thinking it should look something like a large bowl of spaghetti carbonara with entrances at each of the ends of the noodle strands. Could be difficult. Which means expensive. All donations gratefully accepted and of course tax deductible!

Donations over $10,000 will earn you a small plaque by one of the many doorways and a free indulgence.

Contact me for pricing on a free pass to heaven.

Back to top

"When our military goes to war it should be for purposes and objectives clearly in Australia’s interests, not merely because the Americans want some company" - Malcolm Fraser (2012 Whitlam Oration)

IP Logged

longweekend58

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 45675
Gender: male

Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #157 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 5:19pm

Gist wrote on Nov 11^th, 2011 at 4:51pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 9:38pm:

Uncle wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 9:19pm:

Gist wrote on Nov 10^th, 2011 at 6:48pm:

Is the Sanitarium company still a tax free arm of the Adventist church? Used to be. They'd probably make the Hillsong look like tiddlers.

Now we're getting there...

this old furphy AGAIN? Sanitariium is non tax-exempt. they pay 30% tax on all profits juist as every other company does (except miners who pay more!). But the reason they pay no tax on profits is they make no profit (they pay the normal payrol taxes, GST and levies). They make no profit because at the end of the year all surpluses are given to a tax deductible charity.

You can pay no tax too. all you have to do is donate your entire salary minus deductions to charity - just as they do.

Well yes... the "tax deductible charity" is the Adventist Church. Who also happens to own them. In any other corporation, disbursement of profits to the owners would be called "paying a dividend" and would be taxed. But in this case, it's called a "donation" and so deductible and not taxed. Nice little setup, innit?

the other difference is that the charity is a no-profit that does charitable work. any way you look at it sanitarium is a pro-profit taxed company - just liek every other one.

Back to top

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

IP Logged

Gist

Gold Member

Offline

I am not a sock, I am
a human being!

Posts: 5476

Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #158 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 5:35pm

Hmm... except that the ATO's interpretation of charitable works is:

Quote:

Charitable purposes are:

the relief of poverty or sickness or the needs of the aged
the advancement of education
the advancement of religion
child care services on a non-profit basis
other purposes beneficial to the community.

http://www.ato.gov.au/content/23197.htm

So all it needs to do is "advance religion". No need to hand out anything to anyone.

Great! My Pastafarian church only needs a flyer. You can damn well buy the food on Pasta Tuesday. You'll get a free flyer though.

Back to top

"When our military goes to war it should be for purposes and objectives clearly in Australia’s interests, not merely because the Americans want some company" - Malcolm Fraser (2012 Whitlam Oration)

IP Logged

...

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 23673
WA
Gender: male

Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #159 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 5:37pm

Gist wrote on Nov 11^th, 2011 at 5:35pm:

Hmm... except that the ATO's interpretation of charitable works is:
[quote]
Charitable purposes are:

the relief of poverty or sickness or the needs of the aged
the advancement of education
the advancement of religion
child care services on a non-profit basis
other purposes beneficial to the community.

http://www.ato.gov.au/content/23197.htm
[/quote

So all it needs to do is "advance religion". No need to hand out anything to anyone.

Great! My Pastafarian church only needs a flyer. You can damn well buy the food on Pasta Tuesday. You'll get a free flyer though.

Can you see any benefits that might come from belonging to a religion? Perhaps the moral and spiritual guidance they would receive might keep 'em out of trouble?

No...no, that's just crazy talk - religion is baaaaaad mmkay?

Back to top

In the fullness of time...

IP Logged

Gist

Gold Member

Offline

I am not a sock, I am
a human being!

Posts: 5476

Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #160 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 5:41pm

... wrote on Nov 11^th, 2011 at 5:37pm:

Can you see any benefits that might come from belonging to a religion? Perhaps the moral and spiritual guidance they would receive might keep 'em out of trouble?

No...no, that's just crazy talk - religion is baaaaaad mmkay?

Well from what you said the other day I gather that it taught you to hate coons, Wesley.

Mind you, that kind of stuff is out in the Pastafarian church. You'll have to mend your ways with us mate.

Back to top

"When our military goes to war it should be for purposes and objectives clearly in Australia’s interests, not merely because the Americans want some company" - Malcolm Fraser (2012 Whitlam Oration)

IP Logged

Sir lastnail

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 30093
Gender: male

Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #161 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 5:41pm

Verge wrote on Nov 11^th, 2011 at 2:06pm:

An apoligist I am not.

I just to base my arguements on facts. If you dont bother to learn the law, how are you going to challange it?

But hey nail, letting the facts get in the way of a good story has never been your strong point.

so how much of the 100 million per year turnover of HillSux actually goes to the needy and how much of it goes into Brian Houstons pocket so he can buy himself a Harley Davidson Fatboy and a Harbour side mansion in Sydney ??

You could feed a lot of starving children for the price of a Harley Davidson Fatboy !!

Back to top

In August 2021, Newcastle Coroner Karen Dilks recorded that Lisa Shaw had died “due to complications of an AstraZeneca COVID vaccination”.

IP Logged

Soren

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 25654
Gender: male

Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #162 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 5:43pm

Most of the unchurched/irreligious/unsympathetic posters on this thread reveal rather a lot about themselves and the way they operate in the world, projecting it onto churches and priests and pastors and their congregation.

In my view, the most excellent and admirable thing about Christianity is that it sets standars that are hard to live up to. Some of the personnel fail. Easy with high standards.

Jetsetting pastors - all of you are free to write books and make speeches and presentations that people would want to pay for. Go ahead, try it if you think it is just a scam and anyone could do it.

These pastors are talking, working, energising all the time - they are not off for round the world luxury cruises for most of the year (people wouldn't pay money to read or hear what they have to say if they did). Some ride a Harley and have a gold watch and don't live in a hovel. So?

You go and speak and write in a way that inspires thousands and you shall also have a Harley and Rolex if you think that's all this is about.

Back to top

IP Logged

...

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 23673
WA
Gender: male

Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !!
Reply #163 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 5:43pm

Gist wrote on Nov 11^th, 2011 at 5:41pm:

... wrote on Nov 11^th, 2011 at 5:37pm:

Can you see any benefits that might come from belonging to a religion? Perhaps the moral and spiritual guidance they would receive might keep 'em out of trouble?

No...no, that's just crazy talk - religion is baaaaaad mmkay?

Well from what you said the other day I gather that it taught you to hate black people, Wesley.

Mind you, that kind of stuff is out in the Pastafarian church. You'll have to mend your ways with us mate.

Firstly - me no religious.
secondly - I thought I explained quite clearly that I don't 'hate black people'.

Back to top

In the fullness of time...

IP Logged

Gist Gold Member Offline I am not a sock, I am a human being! Posts: 5476	Re: Hillsong – Gods Millionaires that don't pay tax !! Reply #164 - Nov 11^th, 2011 at 5:58pm I summed up that rambling piece of intellectually hollow self-deceit for you Wesley. The statements are equivalent. And yes, I understand you don't limit yourself just to black people. But it takes time to list all the asians, blacks, jews, etc, etc. Think of it as a short cut.
Back to top	"When our military goes to war it should be for purposes and objectives clearly in Australia’s interests, not merely because the Americans want some company" - Malcolm Fraser (2012 Whitlam Oration) IP Logged

Poll
Question: Who is most like Jesus
The Pope Dalai Lama Russel Brand Stephen Fry John Lennon Christine Milne Alexander Putin Leonard Cohen « Created by: Grey on: Nov 13^th, 2011 at 2:12pm »