Australian Politics Forum - Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms?

matty

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Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms?
Nov 16^th, 2011 at 10:20pm

Now, I do believe that the man has good intentions. I don't question that. I do, however, also believe that these "reforms" will do nothing whatsoever to help problem gamblers. The fact is, that there are so many alternatives out there these days. Who is to say that these problem gamblers won't find another outlet? You can gamble all day and all night long these days without even setting foot outside, simply by going on the internet. Not to mention dog races, horse races, sports gambling, the list goes on... How is making someone put a limit on the amount that they gamble at a pokie machine going to do anything to help these people and their families? Also, what about those people who are not problem gamblers, and simply want to have a little bit of fun on a weekend afternoon? Why should they have to tell someone how much of their own hard-earned money they are prepared to lose on that very day?

Now I do believe that gambling is a very serious issue, and appreciate that many a family are torn apart from problem gambling. This, however, in my opinion, is not going to do anything to help these people.

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matty Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 11055 East Sydney Gender:	Re: Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms? Reply #1 - Nov 16^th, 2011 at 10:20pm Poll added.
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sir prince duke alevine Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 23619 Gender:	Re: Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms? Reply #2 - Nov 16^th, 2011 at 10:21pm Allen believes the pokie reforms are bad. Surprise surprise, so do you.
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sir prince duke alevine Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 23619 Gender:	Re: Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms? Reply #3 - Nov 16^th, 2011 at 10:22pm tell me, oh great mind of our time, if the reforms aren't going to work why are clubs so afraid of losing 40% of their revenue?
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Re: Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms?
Reply #4 - Nov 16^th, 2011 at 10:33pm

matty wrote on Nov 16^th, 2011 at 10:20pm:

Now, I do believe that the man has good intentions. I don't question that. I do, however, also believe that these "reforms" will do nothing whatsoever to help problem gamblers. The fact is, that there are so many alternatives out there these days. Who is to say that these problem gamblers won't find another outlet? You can gamble all day and all night long these days without even setting foot outside, simply by going on the internet. Not to mention dog races, horse races, sports gambling, the list goes on... How is making someone put a limit on the amount that they gamble at a pokie machine going to do anything to help these people and their families? Also, what about those people who are not problem gamblers, and simply want to have a little bit of fun on a weekend afternoon? Why should they have to tell someone how much of their own hard-earned money they are prepared to lose on that very day?

Now I do believe that gambling is a very serious issue, and appreciate that many a family are torn apart from problem gambling. This, however, in my opinion, is not going to do anything to help these people.

The Gillard Government yesterday announced that it would extend the intervention's income management provisions to cover school attendance, withholding welfare payments from the parents of chronic truants. Tony Abbott's Opposition, meanwhile, wants to extend the principles of income management more broadly across other welfare recipients. In a political system where points of consensus are presently hard to find, this area is an unlikely oasis of agreement.

But there are exceptions.

Tony Abbott, for instance, wants the Government to be more involved in the household expenditure of welfare recipients, but also wants it to keep its grubby mitts away from anyone pouring their pay down the pokies.

How can The Liberal party support such intimate interventionism on one hand, and yet - on the other - preserve its customary suspicion of the nanny state?

How do the rights and freedoms of a problem gambler outweigh the rights and freedoms of an alcoholic person on the dole?

That IS the real question matty. Above is quoted from Annabel Crabbs new article on the abc site the drum.

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olde.sault

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Re: Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms?
Reply #5 - Nov 17^th, 2011 at 6:00am

matty wrote on Nov 16^th, 2011 at 10:20pm:

Now, I do believe that the man has good intentions. I don't question that. I do, however, also believe that these "reforms" will do nothing whatsoever to help problem gamblers. The fact is, that there are so many alternatives out there these days. Who is to say that these problem gamblers won't find another outlet? You can gamble all day and all night long these days without even setting foot outside, simply by going on the internet. Not to mention dog races, horse races, sports gambling, the list goes on... How is making someone put a limit on the amount that they gamble at a pokie machine going to do anything to help these people and their families? Also, what about those people who are not problem gamblers, and simply want to have a little bit of fun on a weekend afternoon? Why should they have to tell someone how much of their own hard-earned money they are prepared to lose on that very day?

Now I do believe that gambling is a very serious issue, and appreciate that many a family are torn apart from problem gambling. This, however, in my opinion, is not going to do anything to help these people.

I agree with you and the alternative of one dollar machines seem more practical.

To avoid dramatic cost increases these cheaper bandits could be replaced over a few years - that would help the club and pub industries.

That is the problem with our brick-headed politicians, they want everything to be done yesterday and bugger the costs!
OS

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Ex Dame Pansi Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 24168	Re: Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms? Reply #6 - Nov 17^th, 2011 at 6:18am I support him 100%, the research is in. Pokie addicts are not interested in the TAB or golden casket, or online betting. The club, the outing, the people, the noise, the machine, the flashing lights. Now where else can you get that?
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cods

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Re: Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms?
Reply #7 - Nov 17^th, 2011 at 7:50am

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Nov 17^th, 2011 at 6:18am:

I support him 100%, the research is in. Pokie addicts are not interested in the TAB or golden casket, or online betting. The club, the outing, the people, the noise, the machine, the flashing lights. Now where else can you get that?

it could work for a few pansi..but a hard and fast gambler will look elsewhere..its the challenge thats the main ingrediant the thrill of the win/lose.. highs and lows..I am under the impression being on a machine they shut out all other distractions..even their kids going hungry.

we have to listen to the people that actually live with this and deal with this year in year out.. not a bloody politician..

sorry old girl but this govt in particular havent got anything right so far... so yes I do have little faith in this cobbled together gimmick.

to me its like giving an alcoholic a licence to drink as long as he says he will only drink so much.

I would think just like an alcoholic or drug addict...stop altogether is the road to take..its hard but what the hell worthwhile isnt..

I knew a woman who put her own son in jail.. in Goulburn because she had spent years giving in to him and the thanks she got was more of the same..so when she could have stepped in and saved him going into Goulburn she didnt..she did visit him every Sunday though..

sometimes you need to be cruel to be kind... and pussy footing around with this... sorry I shake my head..

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FRED.

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Re: Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms?
Reply #8 - Nov 17^th, 2011 at 7:51am

Quote:

matty wrote on Nov 16^th, 2011 at 10:20pm:

Now, I do believe that the man has good intentions. I don't question that. I do, however, also believe that these "reforms" will do nothing whatsoever to help problem gamblers. The fact is, that there are so many alternatives out there these days. Who is to say that these problem gamblers won't find another outlet? You can gamble all day and all night long these days without even setting foot outside, simply by going on the internet. Not to mention dog races, horse races, sports gambling, the list goes on... How is making someone put a limit on the amount that they gamble at a pokie machine going to do anything to help these people and their families? Also, what about those people who are not problem gamblers, and simply want to have a little bit of fun on a weekend afternoon? Why should they have to tell someone how much of their own hard-earned money they are prepared to lose on that very day?

Now I do believe that gambling is a very serious issue, and appreciate that many a family are torn apart from problem gambling. This, however, in my opinion, is not going to do anything to help these people.

The Gillard Government yesterday announced that it would extend the intervention's income management provisions to cover school attendance, withholding welfare payments from the parents of chronic truants. Tony Abbott's Opposition, meanwhile, wants to extend the principles of income management more broadly across other welfare recipients. In a political system where points of consensus are presently hard to find, this area is an unlikely oasis of agreement.

But there are exceptions.

Tony Abbott, for instance, wants the Government to be more involved in the household expenditure of welfare recipients, but also wants it to keep its grubby mitts away from anyone pouring their pay down the pokies.

How can The Liberal party support such intimate interventionism on one hand, and yet - on the other - preserve its customary suspicion of the nanny state?

How do the rights and freedoms of a problem gambler outweigh the rights and freedoms of an alcoholic person on the dole?

That IS the real question matty. Above is quoted from Annabel Crabbs new article on the abc site the drum.

AS USUAL NUM NUTS OFF TOPIC Grin

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cods

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Re: Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms?
Reply #9 - Nov 17^th, 2011 at 7:54am

FRED. wrote on Nov 17^th, 2011 at 7:51am:

Quote:

matty wrote on Nov 16^th, 2011 at 10:20pm:

Now, I do believe that the man has good intentions. I don't question that. I do, however, also believe that these "reforms" will do nothing whatsoever to help problem gamblers. The fact is, that there are so many alternatives out there these days. Who is to say that these problem gamblers won't find another outlet? You can gamble all day and all night long these days without even setting foot outside, simply by going on the internet. Not to mention dog races, horse races, sports gambling, the list goes on... How is making someone put a limit on the amount that they gamble at a pokie machine going to do anything to help these people and their families? Also, what about those people who are not problem gamblers, and simply want to have a little bit of fun on a weekend afternoon? Why should they have to tell someone how much of their own hard-earned money they are prepared to lose on that very day?

Now I do believe that gambling is a very serious issue, and appreciate that many a family are torn apart from problem gambling. This, however, in my opinion, is not going to do anything to help these people.

The Gillard Government yesterday announced that it would extend the intervention's income management provisions to cover school attendance, withholding welfare payments from the parents of chronic truants. Tony Abbott's Opposition, meanwhile, wants to extend the principles of income management more broadly across other welfare recipients. In a political system where points of consensus are presently hard to find, this area is an unlikely oasis of agreement.

But there are exceptions.

Tony Abbott, for instance, wants the Government to be more involved in the household expenditure of welfare recipients, but also wants it to keep its grubby mitts away from anyone pouring their pay down the pokies.

How can The Liberal party support such intimate interventionism on one hand, and yet - on the other - preserve its customary suspicion of the nanny state?

How do the rights and freedoms of a problem gambler outweigh the rights and freedoms of an alcoholic person on the dole?

That IS the real question matty. Above is quoted from Annabel Crabbs new article on the abc site the drum.

AS USUAL NUM NUTS OFF TOPIC Grin

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Dnarever

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Re: Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms?
Reply #10 - Nov 17^th, 2011 at 8:14am

matty wrote on Nov 16^th, 2011 at 10:20pm:

Now, I do believe that the man has good intentions. I don't question that. I do, however, also believe that these "reforms" will do nothing whatsoever to help problem gamblers. The fact is, that there are so many alternatives out there these days. Who is to say that these problem gamblers won't find another outlet? You can gamble all day and all night long these days without even setting foot outside, simply by going on the internet.

There is a very high probability that it will work. The vast majority of problem poker machine players typically have no interest in gambling at all.

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cods

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Re: Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms?
Reply #11 - Nov 17^th, 2011 at 8:17am

Dnarever wrote on Nov 17^th, 2011 at 8:14am:

matty wrote on Nov 16^th, 2011 at 10:20pm:

Now, I do believe that the man has good intentions. I don't question that. I do, however, also believe that these "reforms" will do nothing whatsoever to help problem gamblers. The fact is, that there are so many alternatives out there these days. Who is to say that these problem gamblers won't find another outlet? You can gamble all day and all night long these days without even setting foot outside, simply by going on the internet.

There is a very high probability that it will work. The vast majority of problem poker machine players typically have no interest in gambling at all.

so whats the attraction??? in that case I could put one in my front room and say feel free to feed the monster..

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matty

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Re: Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms?
Reply #12 - Nov 17^th, 2011 at 7:57pm

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Nov 17^th, 2011 at 6:18am:

I support him 100%, the research is in. Pokie addicts are not interested in the TAB or golden casket, or online betting. The club, the outing, the people, the noise, the machine, the flashing lights. Now where else can you get that?

The thing is though, once they are unable to gamble in a casino, who or what is to say that they won't just find another outlet. Sure, for some the atmosphere may have a lot to do with it, but it's foolish to suggest that the thrill-seeking doesn't factor into it, as well.

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BILL SHORTEN WILL NEVER BE PM!!!!

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matty

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Re: Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms?
Reply #13 - Nov 17^th, 2011 at 7:57pm

cods wrote on Nov 17^th, 2011 at 7:50am:

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Nov 17^th, 2011 at 6:18am:

I support him 100%, the research is in. Pokie addicts are not interested in the TAB or golden casket, or online betting. The club, the outing, the people, the noise, the machine, the flashing lights. Now where else can you get that?

it could work for a few pansi..but a hard and fast gambler will look elsewhere..its the challenge thats the main ingrediant the thrill of the win/lose.. highs and lows..I am under the impression being on a machine they shut out all other distractions..even their kids going hungry.

we have to listen to the people that actually live with this and deal with this year in year out.. not a bloody politician..

sorry old girl but this govt in particular havent got anything right so far... so yes I do have little faith in this cobbled together gimmick.

to me its like giving an alcoholic a licence to drink as long as he says he will only drink so much.

I would think just like an alcoholic or drug addict...stop altogether is the road to take..its hard but what the hell worthwhile isnt..

I knew a woman who put her own son in jail.. in Goulburn because she had spent years giving in to him and the thanks she got was more of the same..so when she could have stepped in and saved him going into Goulburn she didnt..she did visit him every Sunday though..

sometimes you need to be cruel to be kind... and pussy footing around with this... sorry I shake my head..

I completely agree cods. Well said.

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BILL SHORTEN WILL NEVER BE PM!!!!

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Ex Dame Pansi Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 24168	Re: Do you support Wilkie's pokie-reforms? Reply #14 - Nov 18^th, 2011 at 6:28am They are poker machine addicts NOT gambling addicts.
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Poll
Question: Do you support the pokie reforms?
Yes. 6 (50.0%) No. 6 (50.0%) Undecided. 0 (0.0%) Total votes: 12 « Created by: matty on: Nov 16^th, 2011 at 10:20pm »