Australian Politics Forum - The capricious nature of muslims

salad in

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The capricious nature of muslims
Mar 14^th, 2012 at 10:57am

Quote:

Daughter disputes Muslim will that gave brothers twice as much

by: Caroline Overington
From: The Australian
March 14, 2012 12:00AM

THE Supreme Court of the ACT has stepped into a bitter dispute over whether a devout Muslim's three sons should each inherit twice as much as her daughters on the grounds that "one boy is equal to two girls". The case, known as Omari v Omari, involves Mustapha and Mohamed Omari, who want their mother's estate divided according to Islamic law, under which they would inherit one full share for every half-share given to their sisters.

One of those sisters, Fatma Omari, objects, saying it is Australian law, not Islamic law, that must apply, meaning all the children would get the same amount from their mother's estate regardless of gender.

[...]

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/legal-affairs/daughter-disputes-muslim-will-that-gave-brothers-twice-as-much/story-e6frg97x-1226298689720

Muslims usually apply Islamic law first then the host country's law second. Now all of a sudden it's Australian law that matters.

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Yadda

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Re: The capricious nature of muslims
Reply #1 - Mar 14^th, 2012 at 11:12am

salad in wrote on Mar 14^th, 2012 at 10:57am:

Quote:

Daughter disputes Muslim will that gave brothers twice as much

by: Caroline Overington
From: The Australian
March 14, 2012 12:00AM

THE Supreme Court of the ACT has stepped into a bitter dispute over whether a devout Muslim's three sons should each inherit twice as much as her daughters on the grounds that "one boy is equal to two girls". The case, known as Omari v Omari, involves Mustapha and Mohamed Omari, who want their mother's estate divided according to Islamic law, under which they would inherit one full share for every half-share given to their sisters.

One of those sisters, Fatma Omari, objects, saying it is Australian law, not Islamic law, that must apply, meaning all the children would get the same amount from their mother's estate regardless of gender.

[...]

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/legal-affairs/daughter-disputes-muslim-will-that-gave-brothers-twice-as-much/story-e6frg97x-1226298689720

Muslims usually apply Islamic law first then the host country's law second. Now all of a sudden it's Australian law that matters.

This question should be easy to resolve/answer, depending upon how any particular individual answers this question;

If Fatma Omari lives in Australia, is she protected by Australian law, OR, [because she is, presumably, a moslem living in Australia] is she protected by ISLAMIC law ???

If she is protected [in Australia] by ISLAMIC law, then ISLAMIC law must apply.

And vice-versa.

Surely ???

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« Last Edit: Mar 14^th, 2012 at 11:19am by Yadda »

"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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... Gold Member Offline Posts: 23673 WA Gender:	Re: The capricious nature of muslims Reply #2 - Mar 14^th, 2012 at 11:58am I would hope that Australian law will tell her that it's none of her dam business how much her mother left her in comparison to her brothers. A persons dying wishes should be respected, and not subject to contest by money-grubbing ingrates.
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Yadda Gold Member Online Posts: 21503 A cat with a view	Re: The capricious nature of muslims Reply #3 - Mar 14^th, 2012 at 12:03pm ... wrote on Mar 14^th, 2012 at 11:58am: I would hope that Australian law will tell her that it's none of her dam business how much her mother left her in comparison to her brothers. A persons dying wishes should be respected, and not subject to contest by money-grubbing ingrates. Exactly so.
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falah

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Re: The capricious nature of muslims
Reply #4 - Mar 14^th, 2012 at 12:37pm

salad in wrote on Mar 14^th, 2012 at 10:57am:

Quote:

THE Supreme Court of the ACT has stepped into a bitter dispute over whether a devout Muslim's three sons should each inherit twice as much as her daughters on the grounds that "one boy is equal to two girls".

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/legal-affairs/daughter-disputes-muslim-will-that-gave-brothers-twice-as-much/story-e6frg97x-1226298689720

This statement is incorrect. A son is not equal to two girls. Islam gives men a larger inheritance because it has give men greatwer responsibilities. Men are required by islamic law to provide financially for their wives and children women. Women do not have this obligation under Islamic law.

salad in wrote on Mar 14^th, 2012 at 10:57am:

Muslims usually apply Islamic law first then the host country's law second. Now all of a sudden it's Australian law that matters.

Yadda you would conmplain if a Muslim wanted to use Islamic law. It is a bit hypiocritical of you to complain when someone doesn't want to use it.

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Annie Anthrax Gold Member Offline Take the plan, spin it sideways Posts: 7057 Gender:	Re: The capricious nature of muslims Reply #5 - Mar 14^th, 2012 at 12:40pm ... wrote on Mar 14^th, 2012 at 11:58am: I would hope that Australian law will tell her that it's none of her dam business how much her mother left her in comparison to her brothers. A persons dying wishes should be respected, and not subject to contest by money-grubbing ingrates. Yep.
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Baronvonrort

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Re: The capricious nature of muslims
Reply #6 - Mar 14^th, 2012 at 1:24pm

My view is a will was made so its game over.

We should look at a verse in the Quran to see if this nonsense is justified.

It is a little confusing so that must be the eloquence of the Quran.
http://quran.com/4/11
Read all translations by ticking boxes.

Falah-
Did Allah make a mathematical error wth this verse?
http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Contra/i001.html
It appears he did,so much for perfection in the Quran.

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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

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falah

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Re: The capricious nature of muslims
Reply #7 - Mar 14^th, 2012 at 2:17pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 14^th, 2012 at 1:24pm:

My view is a will was made so its game over.

We should look at a verse in the Quran to see if this nonsense is justified.

It is a little confusing so that must be the eloquence of the Quran.
http://quran.com/4/11
Read all translations by ticking boxes.

Falah-
Did Allah make a mathematical error wth this verse?
http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Contra/i001.html
It appears he did,so much for perfection in the Quran.

Not sure why you persist with translations which I already said contain mistakes or lack a proper understanding of the nuances of the Arabic language.

Even if you have competent translators you will often find that they will come up with different translations.

Why are all these Bible translations different?

[/quote]
English Standard Version (©2001)
For just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
for just as JONAH WAS THREE DAYS AND THREE NIGHTS IN THE BELLY OF THE SEA MONSTER, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

International Standard Version (©2008)
because just as Jonah was in the stomach of the sea creature for three days and three nights, so the Son of Man will be in the heart of the earth for three days and three nights.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English (©2010)
For just as Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights, thus The Son of Man will be in the heart of the earth three days and three nights.

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
Just as Jonah was in the belly of a huge fish for three days and three nights, so the Son of Man will be in the heart of the earth for three days and three nights.

http://bible.cc/matthew/12-40.htm
[/quote]

So what was it a fish, a huge fish, a great fish, sea creature, a sea monster, or a whale?

Here is the verse of the Quran translated in a clear manner:

11. God commands you as regards your children's (inheritance); to the male, a portion equal to that of two females; if (there are) only daughters, two or more, their share is two thirds of the inheritance; if only one, her share is half. For parents, a sixth share of inheritance to each if the deceased left children; if no children, and the parents are the (only) heirs, the mother has a third; if the deceased left brothers or (sisters), the mother has a sixth. (The distribution in all cases is) after the payment of legacies he may have bequeathed or debts. You know not which of them, whether your parents or your children, are nearest to you in benefit, (these fixed shares) are ordained by God. And God is Ever All-Knower, All-Wise.

12. In that which your wives leave, your share is a half if they have no child; but if they leave a child, you get a fourth of that which they leave after payment of legacies that they may have bequeathed or debts. In that which you leave, their (your wives) share is a fourth if you leave no child; but if you leave a child, they get an eighth of that which you leave after payment of legacies that you may have bequeathed or debts. If the man or woman whose inheritance is in question has left neither ascendants nor descendants, but has left a brother or a sister, each one of the two gets a sixth; but if more than two, they share in a third; after payment of lagacies he (or she) may have bequeathed or debts, so that no loss is caused (to anyone). This is a Commandment from God; and God is Ever All-Knowing, Most-Forbearing.

An-Nisa' v.11-12

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Baronvonrort

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Re: The capricious nature of muslims
Reply #8 - Mar 14^th, 2012 at 2:33pm

falah wrote on Mar 14^th, 2012 at 2:17pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 14^th, 2012 at 1:24pm:

My view is a will was made so its game over.

We should look at a verse in the Quran to see if this nonsense is justified.

It is a little confusing so that must be the eloquence of the Quran.
http://quran.com/4/11
Read all translations by ticking boxes.

Falah-
Did Allah make a mathematical error wth this verse?
http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Contra/i001.html
It appears he did,so much for perfection in the Quran.

Not sure why you persist with translations which I already said contain mistakes or lack a proper understanding of the nuances of the Arabic language.

Even if you have competent translators you will often find that they will come up with different translations.

Here is the verse of the Quran translated

11. God commands you as regards your children's (inheritance); to the male, a portion equal to that of two females; if (there are) only daughters, two or more, their share is two thirds of the inheritance; if only one, her share is half. For parents, a sixth share of inheritance to each if the deceased left children; if no children, and the parents are the (only) heirs, the mother has a third; if the deceased left brothers or (sisters), the mother has a sixth. (The distribution in all cases is) after the payment of legacies he may have bequeathed or debts. You know not which of them, whether your parents or your children, are nearest to you in benefit, (these fixed shares) are ordained by God. And God is Ever All-Knower, All-Wise.

12. In that which your wives leave, your share is a half if they have no child; but if they leave a child, you get a fourth of that which they leave after payment of legacies that they may have bequeathed or debts. In that which you leave, their (your wives) share is a fourth if you leave no child; but if you leave a child, they get an eighth of that which you leave after payment of legacies that you may have bequeathed or debts. If the man or woman whose inheritance is in question has left neither ascendants nor descendants, but has left a brother or a sister, each one of the two gets a sixth; but if more than two, they share in a third; after payment of lagacies he (or she) may have bequeathed or debts, so that no loss is caused (to anyone). This is a Commandment from God; and God is Ever All-Knowing, Most-Forbearing.

An-Nisa' v.11-12

Do you expect us to believe Pickthal-Yusef Ali-Shakir-Muhsin Khan -etc all got the translation wrong with every verse and you with Arabic as a second language are the only one to get it right?

Why dont you contact Quran.com and point out their many errors?

I suppose this verse would be OK in your opinion -
http://quran.com/39/28

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falah

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Re: The capricious nature of muslims
Reply #9 - Mar 15^th, 2012 at 4:25pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 14^th, 2012 at 2:33pm:

Do you expect us to believe Pickthal-Yusef Ali-Shakir-Muhsin Khan -etc all got the translation wrong with every verse and you with Arabic as a second language are the only one to get it right?

Do you realise that all the translators that you mention also have Arabic as a second language? Those translators are Anglish, Afghani and Indians. Do you think that somehow because I am Australian, I could not learn Arabic as well or better than them? Sad to see that you have such a poor opinion of Australians.

I have a university degree in Arabic, they do not. I am an English native-speaker, only Pickthall can lay also lay claim to that.

Of all the tranlsaters you mentioned, non have Arabic as their first language, none have university degrees in Arabic. Only Pickthall has English as his first language.

Therefore, I am just as qualified, if not more so, than any of the translators you mentioned.

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... Gold Member Offline Posts: 23673 WA Gender:	Re: The capricious nature of muslims Reply #10 - Mar 15^th, 2012 at 4:28pm university degrees in arabic? Really? Looks like gender studies and surf science have some competition for the title of "worlds most useless qualification".
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Annie Anthrax

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Re: The capricious nature of muslims
Reply #11 - Mar 15^th, 2012 at 5:48pm

... wrote on Mar 15^th, 2012 at 4:28pm:

university degrees in arabic? Really?

Looks like gender studies and surf science have some competition for the title of "worlds most useless qualification".

What a stupid thing to say, Wesley. A degree in Arabic is hardly worthless. Neither is a degree in gender studies.

Just because they don't interest you, doesn't make them irrelevant.

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...

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Re: The capricious nature of muslims
Reply #12 - Mar 15^th, 2012 at 6:01pm

Annie Anthrax wrote on Mar 15^th, 2012 at 5:48pm:

... wrote on Mar 15^th, 2012 at 4:28pm:

university degrees in arabic? Really?

Looks like gender studies and surf science have some competition for the title of "worlds most useless qualification".

What a stupid thing to say, Wesley. A degree in Arabic is hardly worthless. Neither is a degree in gender studies.

Just because they don't interest you, doesn't make them irrelevant.

I note you didn't say why they are useful.

I think we both know why.

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In the fullness of time...

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bobbythefap1

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Re: The capricious nature of muslims
Reply #13 - Mar 15^th, 2012 at 6:06pm

Annie Anthrax wrote on Mar 15^th, 2012 at 5:48pm:

... wrote on Mar 15^th, 2012 at 4:28pm:

university degrees in arabic? Really?

Looks like gender studies and surf science have some competition for the title of "worlds most useless qualification".

What a stupid thing to say, Wesley. A degree in Arabic is hardly worthless. Neither is a degree in gender studies.

Just because they don't interest you, doesn't make them irrelevant.

Boy-Penis, Girl-Vagina. Congratulations you now have a PhD

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Annie Anthrax

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Re: The capricious nature of muslims
Reply #14 - Mar 15^th, 2012 at 9:11pm

bobbythefap1 wrote on Mar 15^th, 2012 at 6:06pm:

Annie Anthrax wrote on Mar 15^th, 2012 at 5:48pm:

... wrote on Mar 15^th, 2012 at 4:28pm:

university degrees in arabic? Really?

Looks like gender studies and surf science have some competition for the title of "worlds most useless qualification".

What a stupid thing to say, Wesley. A degree in Arabic is hardly worthless. Neither is a degree in gender studies.

Just because they don't interest you, doesn't make them irrelevant.

Boy-Penis, Girl-Vagina. Congratulations you now have a PhD

That's sex not gender. Perhaps you need to return to high school.

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