Australian Politics Forum - Israel and the Palestinians

Sir Spot of Borg Gold Member Offline WE ARE BORG Posts: 26509 Australia	Re: Israel and the Palestinians Reply #135 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 10:34am Quote: What has no excuse is shooting civilians that you know are being used as shields. I agree SOB
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Gist

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Re: Israel and the Palestinians
Reply #136 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 11:20am

freediver wrote on Jun 10^th, 2012 at 10:29am:

Gist wrote on Jun 10^th, 2012 at 10:06am:

freediver wrote on Jun 10^th, 2012 at 9:04am:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Jun 9^th, 2012 at 3:38pm:

freediver wrote on Jun 9^th, 2012 at 3:19pm:

Quote:

So what? You asked why rockets? You go to gaza to blow up apartment buildings you must know who is there?

Spot, they blow them up because rockets are being launched from them. They are hardly going to go in and do a census first. Then you would complain even louder.

The Palestinians could of course choose not to launch rockets from residential buildings.

Pretty sure avram said earlier that the rockets were launched form
mobile launchers" (meaning utes) which then would drive off.

So now they are coming from apartment buildings? Was avram lying? I tend to believe him over you freeliar. He has @ least been mostly honest about it.

Even if they were launched form the apartment buildings that doesnt excuse killing all those innocent ppl in the rest of the buildings.

SOB

The utes would probably be an adaptation to Israel's very sophisticated responses these days. They can land their return fire right on the Jihadi's head in less than a minute. Check out the videos on youtube.

What has no excuse is using civilians as shields for military action and blaming the people you are shooting at when the civilians die..

What has no excuse is shooting civilians that you know are being used as shields. You're condoning blowing up apartment buildings knowing that the rockets were launched from utes long gone? That's known as genocide.

No Gist, try sticking to what I actually say. I realise this is not as convenient as making it up as you go along, but it is much simpler in the long run.

Fine. Rockets are launched from apartment buildings so you blow up the buildings knowing that there are innocent civilians in there. Why stop there? Angry

It's still completely unacceptable.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49042 At my desk.	Re: Israel and the Palestinians Reply #137 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 11:49am So what is your alternative? Let them fire rockets into Israeli cities? What about the Israeli civilians in those buildings?
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Sir Spot of Borg Gold Member Offline WE ARE BORG Posts: 26509 Australia	Re: Israel and the Palestinians Reply #138 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 11:57am freediver wrote on Jun 10^th, 2012 at 11:49am: So what is your alternative? Let them fire rockets into Israeli cities? What about the Israeli civilians in those buildings? cooperate in the peace process. SOB
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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Israel and the Palestinians
Reply #139 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 12:05pm

Yadda wrote on Jun 9^th, 2012 at 3:34pm:

Incessant rockets from Gaza, being fired at Israeli civilian targets ?

Regular declarations from Hamas that they intend to slaughter the Jewish people in Israel ?

Personally i would like to see the Israelis raze every building in Gaza city to the ground.

And then, push Hamas [i.e. all of the 'Palestinians' in Gaza], into the sea.

That day is coming.

The sooner the better, imo.

Along with the jews? Perhaps iran will get a nuke and blow the whole area to smithereens. Wouldn't that be better? No more palestinians and no more jews. Yes this is what should happen.

We have gillard as a prime minster. Do you think you are responsible for her being in office if you didnt vote for her? So all palestinians voted for hamas? I certainly didnt vote for howard and yet there he was committing war crimes.

SOB

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Gist

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Re: Israel and the Palestinians
Reply #140 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 12:10pm

freediver wrote on Jun 10^th, 2012 at 11:49am:

So what is your alternative? Let them fire rockets into Israeli cities? What about the Israeli civilians in those buildings?

I don't see how you can propose that the best way to stop murderers is to murder someone else. All that does is turn you into what you are trying to overcome. If the Jews really want to do that, why don't they go the whole hog (so to speak), get someone with a funny moustache to lead them and they can set up extermination camps for the Palestinians. They may as well become completely what it is they hate.

The first step to an answer is to admit that there is no defense from murderers using civilians as shields.

Then engage them around a table. TALK! While they're talking - really talking - they won't be firing rockets. Which is what you want.

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Avram Horowitz

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Re: Israel and the Palestinians
Reply #141 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 12:27pm

Gist wrote on Jun 10^th, 2012 at 11:20am:

freediver wrote on Jun 10^th, 2012 at 10:29am:

Gist wrote on Jun 10^th, 2012 at 10:06am:

freediver wrote on Jun 10^th, 2012 at 9:04am:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Jun 9^th, 2012 at 3:38pm:

freediver wrote on Jun 9^th, 2012 at 3:19pm:

Quote:

So what? You asked why rockets? You go to gaza to blow up apartment buildings you must know who is there?

Spot, they blow them up because rockets are being launched from them. They are hardly going to go in and do a census first. Then you would complain even louder.

The Palestinians could of course choose not to launch rockets from residential buildings.

Pretty sure avram said earlier that the rockets were launched form
mobile launchers" (meaning utes) which then would drive off.

So now they are coming from apartment buildings? Was avram lying? I tend to believe him over you freeliar. He has @ least been mostly honest about it.

Even if they were launched form the apartment buildings that doesnt excuse killing all those innocent ppl in the rest of the buildings.

SOB

The utes would probably be an adaptation to Israel's very sophisticated responses these days. They can land their return fire right on the Jihadi's head in less than a minute. Check out the videos on youtube.

What has no excuse is using civilians as shields for military action and blaming the people you are shooting at when the civilians die..

What has no excuse is shooting civilians that you know are being used as shields. You're condoning blowing up apartment buildings knowing that the rockets were launched from utes long gone? That's known as genocide.

No Gist, try sticking to what I actually say. I realise this is not as convenient as making it up as you go along, but it is much simpler in the long run.

Fine. Rockets are launched from apartment buildings so you blow up the buildings knowing that there are innocent civilians in there. Why stop there? Angry

It's still completely unacceptable.

How do we know there are civilians in there?
Unless we conduct door to door investigation we do not know.

This is in Gaza - we have pulled out of Gaza, we do not have door knock capability.

What we do know is co-ordinates of the launch, which landed in Ashdod - sometimes on schools, sometimes in market places.
The response is to raise F-16 responses to the fire and return strike to the position exactly where launched.

If there are civilians there - who is to blame?
Us for response or the people hire people from there?

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Israel and the Palestinians
Reply #142 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 12:39pm

Quote:

How do we know there are civilians in there?
Unless we conduct door to door investigation we do not know.

EXACTLY! And yet you blow them up. It is reasonable to expect there are families and children in there because they are apartment buildings and thats where families and children live. However you dont check you just blast away not caring.

SOB

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Soren

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Re: Israel and the Palestinians
Reply #143 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 1:18pm

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Jun 10^th, 2012 at 12:39pm:

Quote:

How do we know there are civilians in there?
Unless we conduct door to door investigation we do not know.

EXACTLY! And yet you blow them up. It is reasonable to expect there are families and children in there because they are apartment buildings and thats where families and children live. However you dont check you just blast away not caring.

SOB

They are firing from those civilian building. Why is that? Because they know that the IDF will shoot back and the useful idiots like you will say just what you have said.

You never once ask - why do the pallos shoot from behind their women and children? Why don't you ask that? Because it has never crossed your mind to notice: the IDF is not shooting from civilian buildings, the IDF is not hiding behind women and children. The Pallos do. That's why they are called terrorists.

But you are, of course, too bloody thick to notice any of that. This is why I believe that you actually actively work on being such a god-awful idiot. No reasonable grown up could be as stupid as you, Git and the rest of the international useful idiot brigade without all the extra effort you all put into being idiots.

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Sir Spot of Borg Gold Member Offline WE ARE BORG Posts: 26509 Australia	Re: Israel and the Palestinians Reply #144 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 1:31pm And still nobody answers the question. Why is israel trying to build more settlements? Why dont they want peace? SOB
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Soren

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Re: Israel and the Palestinians
Reply #145 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 1:49pm

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Jun 10^th, 2012 at 1:31pm:

And still nobody answers the question. Why is israel trying to build more settlements? Why dont they want peace?

SOB

Why shouldn't they build settlements? There are over a million Arabs in Israel. Don't they build houses? They do. Nobody bats an eyelid.

The West Bank settlements are not in anyone else's country, the West Bank has been occupied territory since demise of the ottoman Empire. Arabs can build there, Jews can build there.

The Arabs had lots of opportunities to make peace and start a country. They have rejected every single one.
Israel accepted the first offer that was made. Because they want peace.

But I know you don't understand any of this and want to go on asking the same thing as if you haven't had an answer.

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Yadda

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Re: Israel and the Palestinians
Reply #146 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 1:58pm

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Jun 9^th, 2012 at 4:17pm:

Quote:

Personally i would like to see the Israelis raze every building in Gaza city to the ground.

And then, push Hamas [i.e. all of the 'Palestinians' in Gaza], into the sea.

That day is coming.

The sooner the better, imo.

So. Is yadda going to be banned like PP? Or is it only 1 side of the argument that gets banned for saying that kind of thing?

SOB

1st....
Quote:

Incessant rockets from Gaza, being fired at Israeli civilian targets ?

Regular declarations from Hamas that they intend to slaughter the Jewish people in Israel ?

2nd....
Quote:

Personally i would like to see the Israelis raze every building in Gaza city to the ground.

And then, push Hamas [i.e. all of the 'Palestinians' in Gaza], into the sea.

That day is coming.

The sooner the better, imo.

SOB,

The 2nd, is a consequence of the 1st.

97%-99% of the 'Palestinians' in Gaza are moslems.

And 100% of the persons resident in Gaza are moslems, or, their sympathizers.

And EVERY SINGLE PERSON who says "I am a moslem."
, is a person who has chosen to embrace ISLAM and its tenets.

And ISLAM's tenets and laws call for the slaughter of all Jewish people.

I say again, ISLAM's tenets and laws call for the slaughter of all Jewish people.

Google;
muslims, slaughter the jews!

To me, that is provocation enough, ALONG WITH THE INCESSANT ROCKETS FROM GAZA, AND THE REGULAR THREATS OF SLAUGHTER MADE BY 'PALESTINIANS' IN GAZA, AGAINST THE JEWISH PEOPLE OF ISRAEL........to warrant the total destruction of Gaza, and its people.

If the moslems in Gaza want mercy, THEN,.....

Stop the rocketing, and stop the threats of genocide against the people of Israel, OR, 'on your own head be it', bear the consequences of YOUR attacks and of YOUR threats, being made against Israel and the Jewish people.

Do the moslems in Gaza want mercy, OR, do the moslems in Gaza want blood, and slaughter ???

It is a simple choice.

AND I PROMISE YOU, THAT THE MOSLEMS IN GAZA, WILL GET, EXACTLY, WHAT THEIR HEARTS DESIRE.

Wink

Ezekiel 35:5
Because thou hast had a perpetual hatred, and hast shed the blood of the children of Israel by the force of the sword in the time of their calamity, in the time that their iniquity had an end:
6 Therefore, as I live, saith the Lord GOD, I will prepare thee unto blood, and blood shall pursue thee: sith thou hast not hated blood, even blood shall pursue thee.

".....in the time that their iniquity had an end:"

.....refers to, and signifies that 'the time of the gentiles' [having control of Jerusalem] is ended.

'The time of the gentiles' ended in 1967, when the Jewish people took back control of Jerusalem.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Israel and the Palestinians
Reply #147 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 2:14pm

Why did the palestinians reject the peace agreement? Could it be because it was unfair? And how long ago was that? Wasnt recently was it. Recently israel has rejected a peace deal because they didnt like it. Israel is not looking for peace or they would abide by ceasefires. They would stop the settling and the bulldozing. They would let the prisoners go.

Killing innocents is not right. Even if they are shields. In any other country the innocent would not be fired upon if they were used as a shield. Can you imagine the police in australia shooting a bikie that was holding a person in front of them? Wouldn't happen. Yet the israelis dont care they kill children and whole families.

SOB

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muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: Israel and the Palestinians Reply #148 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 2:15pm Fortunately I don't have to make a call on that one. Probably the two state solution if it can somehow be made to work.
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Yadda

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Re: Israel and the Palestinians
Reply #149 - Jun 10^th, 2012 at 2:20pm

Gist wrote on Jun 10^th, 2012 at 11:20am:

Fine. Rockets are launched from apartment buildings so you blow up the buildings knowing that there are innocent civilians in there.

Why stop there? Angry

It's still completely unacceptable.

Exactly so.

I say; Raze Gaza city to the ground, if it will stop the rockets emanating from Gaza.

If Hamas [which claims to be the governing authority in Gaza], can not stop the rockets, emanating from Gaza [rockets that target and kill Israeli civilians], then imo, it is completely acceptable that the Israelis should do the job for them.

Completely acceptable.

And we all know how efficient the Israelis can be, at permanently 'solving' a problem, when they put their minds to a problem.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Poll
Question: What should be done about Israel/Palestinians?
Commit genocide on the Palestinians Give Israel back to the British Stop all support for Israel's atrocities Keep going how we are Let Iran Nuke Israel (and Gaza will go to) Two State Solution « Last Modified by: Sir Spot of Borg on: Jun 12^th, 2012 at 9:37am »