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Karnal

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Re: Afghanistan
Reply #165 - Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:17pm

Avram Horowitz wrote on Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:11pm:

Karnal wrote on Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:08pm:

Avram Horowitz wrote on Sep 6^th, 2012 at 2:41pm:

There was no ground invasion of mainland Japan.

That battle was won by the USAF.

Japan is no mainland, friend. Perhaps you are confuse with Pakistan.

You know what I am talking.

The main inhabited islands of Japan. No Americans invaded before the air assault on Nagasaki and Hiroshima.
Then Japan surrendered.

Why do you keep mentioning Pakistan? I don't understand what an Aussie has so an interest in a random country like Pakistan!

Pakistan is not just a country, my friend. It is a spiritual homeland for many. Old boys, fundamentalists, denialists, knuckleheads, all.

You haven't heard of Okinawa? It is in Japan.

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Grey

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Re: Afghanistan
Reply #166 - Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:18pm

Avram Horowitz wrote on Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:11pm:

Karnal wrote on Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:08pm:

Avram Horowitz wrote on Sep 6^th, 2012 at 2:41pm:

There was no ground invasion of mainland Japan.

That battle was won by the USAF.

Japan is no mainland, friend. Perhaps you are confuse with Pakistan.

You know what I am talking.

The main inhabited islands of Japan. No Americans invaded before the air assault on Nagasaki and Hiroshima.
Then Japan surrendered.

Why do you keep mentioning Pakistan? I don't understand what an Aussie has so an interest in a random country like Pakistan!

Irony - alive and well in Israel it seems.

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"It is in the shelter of each other that the people live" - Irish Proverb

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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 96716	Re: Afghanistan Reply #167 - Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:22pm Israelis are a great source of black humour, Grey. Their falafel isn't too bad either.
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Avram Horowitz

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Re: Afghanistan
Reply #168 - Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:24pm

Karnal wrote on Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:17pm:

Avram Horowitz wrote on Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:11pm:

Karnal wrote on Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:08pm:

Avram Horowitz wrote on Sep 6^th, 2012 at 2:41pm:

There was no ground invasion of mainland Japan.

That battle was won by the USAF.

Japan is no mainland, friend. Perhaps you are confuse with Pakistan.

You know what I am talking.

The main inhabited islands of Japan. No Americans invaded before the air assault on Nagasaki and Hiroshima.
Then Japan surrendered.

Why do you keep mentioning Pakistan? I don't understand what an Aussie has so an interest in a random country like Pakistan!

Pakistan is not just a country, my friend. It is a spiritual homeland for many. Old boys, fundamentalists, denialists, knuckleheads, all.

You haven't heard of Okinawa? It is in Japan.

I am not sure why you are arguing on this point. It is standard history.

The Americans used ground force to win Okinawa - the loss of soldiers life and the numbers of men needed to win this convinced the US Generals that to invaded the main part of the Japanese islands would be suicide.

They would lose hundreds of thousands of lives.

The Japanese would fight to the death and they have soldiers there ready.

So the plan was to weaken Japan from the sky to drop the bomb and then drop again.

It worked - the USA did not need to invade and Japan surrendered.

My point is you could do so technically with Afghanistan and use overwhelming power from the sky to weaken the Afghans. But you would also need to be prepared to lose civilian life too - which western countries dont do anymore.

I dont understand how this is even in dispute

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Karnal

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Re: Afghanistan
Reply #169 - Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:34pm

It's not in dispute. I agree with you.

But your idea that Amerika and its allies could win a war in Afghanistan through air strikes alone is untested.

The US couldn't win the war in Vietnam, despite dropping more high-tech TNT than WWII.

Western powers do not have an aversion to carpet-bombing. They do so all the time - they call it "surgical strikes." Civilian deaths are called "collateral damage."

Mind you, Israel is most fond of carpet-bombing civilian populations. Apart from buying some time, what good has it done?

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Avram Horowitz Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 3153 Australia Gender:	Re: Afghanistan Reply #170 - Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:37pm This is a different subject but we do not carpet bomb civilian areas. F-16 strikes on a rocket installation is not 'carpet bombing'. You know this though I think.
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Karnal

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Re: Afghanistan
Reply #171 - Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:39pm

Avram Horowitz wrote on Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:37pm:

This is a different subject but we do not carpet bomb civilian areas.

F-16 strikes on a rocket installation is not 'carpet bombing'.

You know this though I think.

Yes, my friend, you are correct. Bombing apartment block is surgical strike on rocket installation.

You see? You are learning. I think you could have some Pakistani too, no?

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Grey Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 5341 Gender:	Re: Afghanistan Reply #172 - Sep 6^th, 2012 at 6:50pm Pakistan - it aint all bad
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Soren

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Re: Afghanistan
Reply #173 - Sep 7^th, 2012 at 11:25am

Karnal wrote on Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:39pm:

Avram Horowitz wrote on Sep 6^th, 2012 at 3:37pm:

This is a different subject but we do not carpet bomb civilian areas.

F-16 strikes on a rocket installation is not 'carpet bombing'.

You know this though I think.

Yes, my friend, you are correct. Bombing apartment block is surgical strike on rocket installation.

You are a fan and devotee of the insertion of massive rockets into civilian areas, aren't you, Paki Bvgger.

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Soren Gold Member Offline Posts: 25654 Gender:	Re: Afghanistan Reply #174 - Sep 7^th, 2012 at 11:27am Grey wrote on Sep 6^th, 2012 at 6:50pm: Pakistan - it aint all bad The are fixated on the booty, the dirty PBs.
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Grey Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 5341 Gender:	Re: Afghanistan Reply #175 - Sep 7^th, 2012 at 12:02pm It's worth noting the Talibs would behead the lot of them.
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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 96716	Re: Afghanistan Reply #176 - Sep 7^th, 2012 at 12:09pm My friend, they cannot! It would put civil rights in Afghanistan back many many years.
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Avram Horowitz Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 3153 Australia Gender:	Re: Afghanistan Reply #177 - Sep 7^th, 2012 at 2:24pm I think a policy of containment is better for Afghanistan. Keep the training camps under control by satellite surveillance and then targeted strike from the air bombing the camps? That is much better and more likely to be successful. Then use intelligence agencies on the ground - CIA, MOSSAD etc
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Karnal

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Re: Afghanistan
Reply #178 - Sep 7^th, 2012 at 2:28pm

Avram Horowitz wrote on Sep 7^th, 2012 at 2:24pm:

I think a policy of containment is better for Afghanistan.

Keep the training camps under control by satellite surveillance and then targeted strike from the air bombing the camps?

That is much better and more likely to be successful.

Then use intelligence agencies on the ground - CIA, MOSSAD etc

What's wrong with training camps? Don't we want them to get an education?

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Avram Horowitz

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Re: Afghanistan
Reply #179 - Sep 7^th, 2012 at 2:32pm

Karnal wrote on Sep 7^th, 2012 at 2:28pm:

Avram Horowitz wrote on Sep 7^th, 2012 at 2:24pm:

I think a policy of containment is better for Afghanistan.

Keep the training camps under control by satellite surveillance and then targeted strike from the air bombing the camps?

That is much better and more likely to be successful.

Then use intelligence agencies on the ground - CIA, MOSSAD etc

What's wrong with training camps? Don't we want them to get an education?

Terrorist training camps.
The 9/11 hijackers, the London and Madrid bombers were all received training in Afghanistan under Taliban controlled zones.

It is the biggest problem we face but satellites can pick them up and if we use intelligence services we can pin-point then strike them.

Can be cruise missile or drones.

Then there is no loss of life for we in the west and deaths in the camps.

I like this.

In Israel we have always preferred air strike response to ground force.

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