Australian Politics Forum - Can quantum physics explain the perception of self

Bobby.

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Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self
Reply #30 - Nov 1^st, 2012 at 9:29pm

I did a google search -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_gravity

Quote:

Quantum effects are usually important only for the "very small", that is, for objects no larger than typical molecules. General relativistic effects, on the other hand, show up mainly for the "very large" bodies such as collapsed stars.

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Bobby.

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Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self
Reply #31 - Nov 1^st, 2012 at 9:30pm

muso wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 9:14pm:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 9:05pm:

Quantum physics is about the world of the very small - e.g.
a single photon or electron -
it doesn't apply to massive objects such as person's body.

You're right... but then again Google Quantum Gravity.

That model is on Wikipedia too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calabi-Yau_manifold

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muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self Reply #32 - Nov 1^st, 2012 at 10:02pm It's an interesting field. I wonder if they will ever come up with a Unified Field Theory that fits with observations.
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NorthOfNorth Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 17258 Gender:	Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self Reply #33 - Nov 1^st, 2012 at 10:22pm Quantum... Ain't nothing easy or Einstein that'll answer the.... Why... No matter what the how, why and when. Why? The deepest question... Being, in itself, the source of the deepest existential angst.... Which is, its turn, (of course) the source of all Religious enquiry
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Yadda

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Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self
Reply #34 - Nov 1^st, 2012 at 10:25pm

muso wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 8:57pm:

Yadda wrote on Oct 31^st, 2012 at 9:28pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Oct 31^st, 2012 at 9:21pm:

Can quantum physics explain the perception of self??

Surely...

you're joking!

And, who can understand 'quantum physics' ??

Its something to do with the existence and action of neutrinos, isn't it ??? Tongue

You should Google Quantum Probability.

muso,

That sounds like something you might find in an entry, in the HHGTG.

But then i suspect that the HHGTTG is at about my intellectual level too.

42 makes total sense to me. Tongue

At least it is comprehensible! Grin

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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NorthOfNorth Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 17258 Gender:	Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self Reply #35 - Nov 1^st, 2012 at 10:33pm Why can't we answer the... Why? Because we are, all of us, a part of the... That.
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muso

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Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self
Reply #36 - Nov 1^st, 2012 at 10:38pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 10:33pm:

Why can't we answer the... Why?

Because we are, all of us, a part of the... That.

How can you be sure that there is a why? Maybe we can't answer the Why because there is no why. When we reach the end of the whys, we approach a certain nexus that's getting close to Blake's "countenance divine". (Yadda will like that)

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« Last Edit: Nov 1^st, 2012 at 10:49pm by muso »

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Yadda

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Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self
Reply #37 - Nov 1^st, 2012 at 10:45pm

muso wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 9:04pm:

Reason is not species specific, but it has its limits in chimpanzees, and even certain homo sapiens individuals.

You're right in saying that Quantum Science is in the head, as is absolutely everything else we perceive or conceive.

That doesn't make anything less real.

muso,

But if something [physical, or some mental concept] is not 'in our head', that merely suggests that that 'something', has not yet caught our attention, or come within our perceptory range.

So in a sense, our universe [i.e. our personal 'reality'], [according to the 'scientific' principle] can only consist of those things which we have the ability to perceive.

I am reminded of how Europeans [i.e. some Europeans] reacted, when Columbus returned and announced that a new world existed across the ocean, beyond the horizon.

Some Europeans could not mentally grasp such a concept.

Because, for millennia, weren't Europe, Africa, and the vast expanse of Asia to the east, the only constituent parts of the whole of the world, as perceived by man, up unitl that age/time ???

Another vast land, beyond the horizon to the west ???

Ridiculous!!!

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self Reply #38 - Nov 1^st, 2012 at 10:51pm Yadda wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 10:45pm: [Another vast land, beyond the horizon to the west ??? Ridiculous!!! Reminds me of Numenor. We posted at the same time I think.
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Bobby.

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Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self
Reply #39 - Nov 1^st, 2012 at 11:05pm

I like Carl Sagan:

http://atheism.about.com/library/quotes/bl_q_CSagan.htm

Quote:

19.
I would love to believe that when I die I will live again, that some thinking, feeling, remembering part of me will continue. But much as I want to believe that, and despite the ancient and worldwide cultural traditions that assert an afterlife, I know of nothing to suggest that it is more than wishful thinking. The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides. [Carl Sagan, 1996 in his article In the Valley of the Shadow Parade Magazine Also, Billions and Billions p. 215]

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Yadda

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Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self
Reply #40 - Nov 1^st, 2012 at 11:08pm

Bobby. wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 11:05pm:

I like Carl Sagan:

http://atheism.about.com/library/quotes/bl_q_CSagan.htm

Quote:

19.
I would love to believe that when I die I will live again, that some thinking, feeling, remembering part of me will continue. But much as I want to believe that, and despite the ancient and worldwide cultural traditions that assert an afterlife, I know of nothing to suggest that it is more than wishful thinking. The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides. [Carl Sagan, 1996 in his article In the Valley of the Shadow Parade Magazine Also, Billions and Billions p. 215]

He, Sagan, didn't have much vision, imo.

And, he was an avowed atheist.

A double strike against him. Tongue

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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NorthOfNorth

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Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self
Reply #41 - Nov 1^st, 2012 at 11:09pm

muso wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 10:38pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 10:33pm:

Why can't we answer the... Why?

Because we are, all of us, a part of the... That.

How can you be sure that there is a why? Maybe we can't answer the Why because there is no why. When we reach the end of the whys, we approach a certain nexus that's getting close to Blake's "countenance divine". (Yadda will like that)

There is no end of whys because they have no beginning to all of us of the that.

We are the that from which the why ascends

And to be part of the that
Is to have no purchase to explain
or even comprehend
the why of the that.

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Conviction is the art of being certain

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Bobby.

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Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self
Reply #42 - Nov 1^st, 2012 at 11:15pm

Yadda wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 11:08pm:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 11:05pm:

I like Carl Sagan:

http://atheism.about.com/library/quotes/bl_q_CSagan.htm

Quote:

19.
I would love to believe that when I die I will live again, that some thinking, feeling, remembering part of me will continue. But much as I want to believe that, and despite the ancient and worldwide cultural traditions that assert an afterlife, I know of nothing to suggest that it is more than wishful thinking. The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides. [Carl Sagan, 1996 in his article In the Valley of the Shadow Parade Magazine Also, Billions and Billions p. 215]

He, Sagan, didn't have much vision, imo.

And, he was an avowed atheist.

A double strike against him. Tongue

Read his quotes & you will see that he was an amazing visionary.
No study on philosophy is complete without referring to him.

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Yadda

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Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self
Reply #43 - Nov 2^nd, 2012 at 12:11am

Yadda wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 11:08pm:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 11:05pm:

I like Carl Sagan:

http://atheism.about.com/library/quotes/bl_q_CSagan.htm

Quote:

19.
I would love to believe that when I die I will live again, that some thinking, feeling, remembering part of me will continue. But much as I want to believe that, and despite the ancient and worldwide cultural traditions that assert an afterlife, I know of nothing to suggest that it is more than wishful thinking. The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides. [Carl Sagan, 1996 in his article In the Valley of the Shadow Parade Magazine Also, Billions and Billions p. 215]

He, Sagan, didn't have much vision, imo.

And, he was an avowed atheist.

A double strike against him. Tongue

Quote:

7.
The idea that God is an oversized white male with a flowing beard who sits in the sky and tallies the fall of every sparrow is ludicrous. But if by God one means the set of physical laws that govern the universe, then clearly there is such a God. This God is emotionally unsatisfying... it does not make much sense to pray to the law of gravity. [Carl Sagan]

What a novel perception that man has.
/sarc off

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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magpie

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Re: Can quantum physics explain the perception of self
Reply #44 - Nov 2^nd, 2012 at 9:15am

Yadda wrote on Nov 2^nd, 2012 at 12:11am:

Yadda wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 11:08pm:

Bobby. wrote on Nov 1^st, 2012 at 11:05pm:

I like Carl Sagan:

http://atheism.about.com/library/quotes/bl_q_CSagan.htm

Quote:

19.
I would love to believe that when I die I will live again, that some thinking, feeling, remembering part of me will continue. But much as I want to believe that, and despite the ancient and worldwide cultural traditions that assert an afterlife, I know of nothing to suggest that it is more than wishful thinking. The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides. [Carl Sagan, 1996 in his article In the Valley of the Shadow Parade Magazine Also, Billions and Billions p. 215]

He, Sagan, didn't have much vision, imo.

And, he was an avowed atheist.

A double strike against him. Tongue

Quote:

7.
The idea that God is an oversized white male with a flowing beard who sits in the sky and tallies the fall of every sparrow is ludicrous. But if by God one means the set of physical laws that govern the universe, then clearly there is such a God. This God is emotionally unsatisfying... it does not make much sense to pray to the law of gravity. [Carl Sagan]

What a novel perception that man has.
/sarc off

someone's being a very good boy, isn't someone..
*pats Yadda on the head*
if only I could understand what it is you are saying, then we could have friendly exchanges like you do with your other friends (who are as 'special' as you are).

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