Australian Politics Forum - Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD

Andrei.Hicks Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 23818 Carlsbad, CA Gender:	Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD Reply #105 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 8:47am Italians. Like rats and water. You board the place up and they'll still find their way in....
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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 74520 Gender:	Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD Reply #106 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 8:51am Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 5^th, 2013 at 8:47am: Italians. Like rats and water. You board the place up and they'll still find their way in.... Your the expert on rats .......
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49016 At my desk.	Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD Reply #107 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 9:13am You will both be banned if you carry on with this crap.
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BigOl64

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Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD
Reply #108 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 10:49am

freediver wrote on Jan 5^th, 2013 at 8:28am:

Quote:

If the political parties miss out of a few votes then welcome to a a true democracy, just like they have in nearly every other first world country.

Bigol would you mind giving a definition of a 'true' democracy?

Quote:

i've never seen any non-dodgy argument for compulsory voting for any of its do-gooder boosters, ever.

Perhaps you should read before commenting then Denton.

Quote:

Take the time to look back at this post and you will see the type of country that forces its citizens to the polls and you decide if that company is acceptable.

Bigol, argumentum ad populum is a logical fallacy. Are you actually going to address the logical flaws in your argument, or just repeat yourself ad nauseum?

Quote:

BTW it is up to you to support your own statements.

Bit rich that you demand I argue my case when you are too friggen lazy to come up with these supposed western democracies (35 in total) that utilise compulsory voting, the reason you cannot is they don't friggen exist.

BTW using "argumentum ad populum" ad nauseum doesn't make it so without the underlying proof that the majority of first world democracies are wrong to believe in basic human rights are the cornerstone of a solid democracy, ya tool.

I know you have found a new latin phrase that you want to use until it is a worn out hackneyed old phrase (now) but you need to have some foundation for your argument to have any sort of credibility.

I'm fine using the UN Human Rights charter as the basis for mine.

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freediver

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Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD
Reply #109 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 11:40am

Quote:

Bit rich that you demand I argue my case when you are too friggen lazy to come up with these supposed western democracies (35 in total) that utilise compulsory voting

You are confused bigol.

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BTW using "argumentum ad populum" ad nauseum doesn't make it so without the underlying proof that the majority of first world democracies are wrong to believe in basic human rights are the cornerstone of a solid democracy, ya tool.

Argumentum ad populum is a logical fallacy. No amount of evidence can overcome the logical flaw in your argument, because both the evidence and your argument are meaningless.

Quote:

I know you have found a new latin phrase that you want to use until it is a worn out

Actually I just get sick of explaining the same concept to you over and over again, to no avail.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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BigOl64

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Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD
Reply #110 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 12:07pm

freediver wrote on Jan 5^th, 2013 at 11:40am:

Quote:

Bit rich that you demand I argue my case when you are too friggen lazy to come up with these supposed western democracies (35 in total) that utilise compulsory voting

You are confused bigol.

Quote:

BTW using "argumentum ad populum" ad nauseum doesn't make it so without the underlying proof that the majority of first world democracies are wrong to believe in basic human rights are the cornerstone of a solid democracy, ya tool.

Argumentum ad populum is a logical fallacy. No amount of evidence can overcome the logical flaw in your argument, because both the evidence and your argument are meaningless.

Quote:

I know you have found a new latin phrase that you want to use until it is a worn out

Actually I just get sick of explaining the same concept to you over and over again, to no avail.

You're a fvcken dill with a dictionary.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49016 At my desk.	Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD Reply #111 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 12:37pm Here is an article I put together about these common logical fallacies a few years ago. http://www.ozpolitic.com/articles/logical-fallacies.html#argumentum%20ad%20popul...
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Dnarever

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Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD
Reply #112 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 12:50pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 5^th, 2013 at 8:27am:

Dnarever wrote on Jan 5^th, 2013 at 8:25am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 5^th, 2013 at 8:09am:

A bit rich to be lectured on patriotism by a Southern European Aussie whose family cleared out from their country for the easy life.

That's all.

Isn't that exactly how your family got here except that maybe it wasn't from southern Europe?

No it wasn't.
They transferred for work.
This before your useless pr1ck Hawke caused us to leave by selling workers out.

They took a pay cut and moved for a tougher life?

They cleared out of Europe for an economic advantageous position? (the easy life).

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Dnarever

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Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD
Reply #113 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 12:56pm

BigOl64 wrote on Jan 5^th, 2013 at 5:45am:

Dnarever wrote on Jan 4^th, 2013 at 6:52pm:

BigOl64 wrote on Jan 4^th, 2013 at 6:11pm:

Dnarever wrote on Jan 4^th, 2013 at 5:59pm:

KJT1981 wrote on Jan 4^th, 2013 at 9:03am:

It is not compulsory in any other Western country - not the US or Canada or Britain or, across the ditch, in New Zealand. Why are adult Australians treated like children?

It is not compulsory in any other Western country

I think you will find that actually it is in about 35 of them.

Care to provide some sort of evidence for that statement.

here is a start, Luxembourg and Belgium, only 33 to go

Good luck with that

It has been posted many times - go look it up and correct me if my memory is incorrect.

Yes that information has been posted many times by myself, pity you didn't retain the information I posted instead of just making sh1t up.

We are very much alone when it comes to not having codified human rights and attempting to be a first world democracy, see they pretty much go hand in hand. Take the time to look back at this post and you will see the type of country that forces its citizens to the polls and you decide if that company is acceptable.

BTW it is up to you to support your own statements.

Yes that information has been posted many times by myself

Do you always ask people provide proof to statmets which you know to be correct?

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BigOl64

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Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD
Reply #114 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 1:21pm

Dnarever wrote on Jan 5^th, 2013 at 12:56pm:

BigOl64 wrote on Jan 5^th, 2013 at 5:45am:

Dnarever wrote on Jan 4^th, 2013 at 6:52pm:

BigOl64 wrote on Jan 4^th, 2013 at 6:11pm:

Dnarever wrote on Jan 4^th, 2013 at 5:59pm:

KJT1981 wrote on Jan 4^th, 2013 at 9:03am:

It is not compulsory in any other Western country - not the US or Canada or Britain or, across the ditch, in New Zealand. Why are adult Australians treated like children?

It is not compulsory in any other Western country

I think you will find that actually it is in about 35 of them.

Care to provide some sort of evidence for that statement.

here is a start, Luxembourg and Belgium, only 33 to go

Good luck with that

It has been posted many times - go look it up and correct me if my memory is incorrect.

Yes that information has been posted many times by myself, pity you didn't retain the information I posted instead of just making sh1t up.

We are very much alone when it comes to not having codified human rights and attempting to be a first world democracy, see they pretty much go hand in hand. Take the time to look back at this post and you will see the type of country that forces its citizens to the polls and you decide if that company is acceptable.

BTW it is up to you to support your own statements.

Yes that information has been posted many times by myself

Do you always ask people provide proof to statmets which you know to be correct?

WTF stupid post is that?

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perceptions_now

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Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD
Reply #115 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 1:36pm

IMO scraping compulsory voting, would promote a US style system, where Politicians would end up being voted in a small % of the population.

This would also promote "interest groups", to "PUSH" certain select candidates & party's, who will back the wishes of those "interest groups".

So, IF you want a US style system & the increased levels of corruption that would go with, then that is what you will get.

BUT, as the saying goes, BE VERY CAREFUL WHAT YOU ASK FOR, BECAUSE YOU JUST MAY GET IT!

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Ex Dame Pansi

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Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD
Reply #116 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 2:10pm

We should have a "none of the above" option on the ballet paper so that those who are dissatisfied with all candidates can still have a say. That would be even better than a spoiled or invalid paper.

If the majority of the people are not happy with the candidates then the party has to go out and find new candidates. Majority rules.

At the moment all we are getting is long term staff members who are being put forward as candidates. We want real people from our community, not public servant puppets that are only in it for their own benefit.

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andrei said: Great isn't it? Seeing boatloads of what is nothing more than human garbage turn up.....

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muso

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Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD
Reply #117 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 2:35pm

perceptions_now wrote on Jan 5^th, 2013 at 1:36pm:

IMO scraping compulsory voting, would promote a US style system, where Politicians would end up being voted in a small % of the population.

This would also promote "interest groups", to "PUSH" certain select candidates & party's, who will back the wishes of those "interest groups".

So, IF you want a US style system & the increased levels of corruption that would go with, then that is what you will get.

BUT, as the saying goes, BE VERY CAREFUL WHAT YOU ASK FOR, BECAUSE YOU JUST MAY GET IT!

Be honest and ask yourself if that's the situation in the UK, because they have never had compulsory voting. Australia is the anomaly.

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freediver

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Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD
Reply #118 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 2:53pm

Voter turnout in the UK is about 65% of registered voters. This figure obviously excludes unregistered voters, but also spoilt votes.

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Jan 5^th, 2013 at 2:10pm:

We should have a "none of the above" option on the ballet paper so that those who are dissatisfied with all candidates can still have a say. That would be even better than a spoiled or invalid paper.

If the majority of the people are not happy with the candidates then the party has to go out and find new candidates. Majority rules.

At the moment all we are getting is long term staff members who are being put forward as candidates. We want real people from our community, not public servant puppets that are only in it for their own benefit.

I think that would encourage intellectual laziness and protest voting. Voting is always going to be a tough choice. A lot of people who 'don't like politics' Would prefer an easy option that avoids the tough choice, even though they would prefer one outcome over another.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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muso

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Re: Campbell Newman to scrap compulsory voting in QLD
Reply #119 - Jan 5^th, 2013 at 2:55pm

BigOl64 wrote on Jan 5^th, 2013 at 10:49am:

Bit rich that you demand I argue my case when you are too friggen lazy to come up with these supposed western democracies (35 in total) that utilise compulsory voting, the reason you cannot is they don't friggen exist.

Let's get the facts-

There are only 10 countries in the world where compulsory voting is enforced. These are:

Argentina, Australia, Brazil, Democratic Republic of the Congo, Ecuador, Luxembourg, Nauru, Peru, Singapore and Uruguay.

Countries with compulsory voting and with a democracy index of 8 or greater:

Australia and Luxembourg.

http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CDsQFjAB&url=htt...

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Poll
Question: Do you think that compulsory voting
* This poll has now closed *
makes the system more democratic 6 (30.0%) makes the system less democratic 8 (40.0%) has no effect on democracy 6 (30.0%) Total votes: 20 « Created by: muso on: Jan 5^th, 2013 at 3:45pm »